We reckon with the Pittsburgh massacre on today's podcast. Give a listen.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Some guy welcome the commentary magazine. Podcast today is Monday October. Twenty nine I'm John path towards the error of commentary with me, as always Sociedad Rossman, I know John Senor either a green wild high Abe, I jump and cigarettes are of a very high sort of hygiene.
Obviously a terrible day terrible weekend terrible week, we sit here in the aftermath of the massacre at the tree of life, synagogue in Pittsburgh. Eleven dead, six injured for cops injured. Robert Bowers, charged with twenty nine separate crimes, apparently told the Swat officer who arrested that all the Jews needed to die, and I have many thoughts about this, but I what you guys, if you land, sense of things. Geologists has, as I was saying right before right before the makes one on that when they were released, the names the victims. Yesterday I had to but I was reading them through- and I started ten
to concern myself with the idea that they were there are many of them were significantly older than than I would have thought people their and well into their nineties, and but I mean we ve been found myself sort of saddened in another way struck by thinking about a different kind of fragility in these victims and what they had lived through only to die at that point. In that most off away. I am do remember, telling my wife, because we had heard that this was a abreast that I didn't want to look up the list, because I was at this horror. This was early in the hours where they had said eleven or ten dead they hadn't released in them and from which they were. I was horrified to think that, God forbid something had happened to the baby, but thank God so work work, work. Obviously, gonna go into the broader societal implications. Here, that's
twitter! What we do, but I remember a bit of the confessions I remember around late, two thousand and fourteen early, two thousand and fifteen, having a conversation with my father about. Sort of the end of history. I had never experienced anti Semitism, really not the real thing, just kind of like chiding elbows in the ribs kind of mock racial consciousness in high school and dumb that you know we will we really pass that and he gave me a pretty stern lecture about a growing. Up with people with the numbers on their arms and how you'd have this sort of thing never really goes away, and it wasn't months later until I started experiencing the real thing, which I'm sure we're gonna talk about and now seeing it manifested in synagogues and my naivete was was striking a bit of a confession. Here you can take, that is
as you want, but you take me seriously on the subject or not, but it was. There was a world I grew up and which was a much felt like a much more safer place. I received a letter this morning from a Psychoanalyst now living in Israel may Miriam Wolf. In response to a blog posts. I recalled the slaughter in Pittsburgh. I wonder we this letter, because its striking in ten thousand different ways Dear John pot, the massacre of Jews at the synagogue in Pittsburgh was indeed very disturbing to me and my family for a number of reasons, not least of which is that We have a son who lives on squirrel hell, that's the neighborhood in Pittsburgh, where the tree of life is located, be were Jews, see and on Erev shabbos Shabazz Second July. Ninety. Ninety nine, a massacre of Jews, was attempted in our Chicago neighborhood. That's West Rogers Park where my brother in law lives, where most of the city's orthodox Jews reside
many. Jews were shot at in the sugar mist with several of our neighbours. Were shot and wounded just feet from our house, our youngest son fry em was fifteen at the time, was walking to show with a free and when he was shot by the hateful NEO Nazi, who was hunting for Jews, blacks and Asians, all of whom his crowd referred to as mud people's many me circles happened for the jewish community in that many injuries were inflicted, but no one was build. However, in neighbouring Evanston North Western, universally basketball, coach, Ricky Birdsong was not so fortunate, as he strolled with his young children. The shooting three continued over the weekend in and through Illinois and into in the end of the last victim was a korean graduate student at the university at blooming one Jus young was shot dead on the steps of his church following the Sunday service its now nineteen years later, and there are still anti Semites in America who are so driven by their irrational, analyse that they would murder and maimed Jews at prayer. While these events
grip us, it is because the size and scope of the event seizes the media's attention for a while. In the intervening years in America, numerous anti semitic tax of occurred salmon desecrations bonds, here's a Jason season to his parochial schools and arson attempts on tools and then there's Europe where the attacks on jobs in France driven the tremendous rise in french Ali out to Israel unfortunate. The attacks are not limited to France. Noble notable attacks have occurred in Belgium in England as well this cursory remove infamies is offered as a counterpoint to your conclusion that the heightened rhetoric on both sides creates an atmosphere, spate of weird you, mail bombs to politicians and the synagogue massacre are predictable outcome. While deeply saddened and disturbed by the political rhetoric, Enough so that my husband I made earlier a year ago, I dont think the facts about violence in America generally in about an anti semitic attacks, particularly share a correlation to the nasty political rhetoric so ubiquitous at present.
Correlation, is not causation. I empathize with the intense human need to find an explanation for the immense, a terrifying vex us, because the explanation offers us the delusional hope that we have more conscious control over our lives than we actually do. So I completely forgotten this incident in West Rogers Park in nineteen. Eighty nine in July. Mary will son was shot. The north western, universally basketball coach was killed and a korean kid was all by one shooter. Think about what the says I mean everybody says we're inured to school shootings in all this, but the truth is that Anti semitic behave. There are enough anti semitic attacks in the IT states happening and regular.
You know at regular intervals for one to become relatively inured to their existence such thus. It was startling for people to discover this weekend when they looked that in- and you know, I'm not a great believer in the categories nation of crimes and hate crimes and separating the two. If you use this characterisation, thee overwhelming majority of hate crimes aimed at religious people or peoples for their religion is toward Jews and Muslims by a factor of ten over the last twenty years. So what does this tell us? Well, so we can start talk a little bit about Trump and ready. All of that and Mary Morph has offered her extra, really valuable and personal perspective here. It tells us that none
notwithstanding all this, there is something qualitatively different about anti some anti semitic attacks in the IT states and anti semitic attacks in the world from time immemorial. The acts here are committed by loan evil people them there. Buttons may be pushed by we'll world realities like the caravan or statements by the hebrew immigrant aid society, as in the case of Robert Bowers or or by something or by nine eleven or by whatever, but they are not systematic. They are not group design. They are not an effort to advance a political agenda by a group with a agenda. They are alone acts anti Semitism where it is dangerous and existentialist life threatening and threatening to the history of a future of the jewish people.
As always, organ is often at state level, though not exclusively right. That's no England. In the twelfth century, the Crusaders, Spain and Portugal in the fifteenth century, Poland, in the seventeenth century, Russia, in the nineteenth century, Germany, in the twentieth century, the pillow Al Qaeda. These are not necessarily state actors, but they are organised. Semi states, players, Jew, are threatened by over organizations that can overpower them in the United States remains next real, the greatest refuge the jewish people have ever known, and today of all days, as I say today in the new post, it is a moment to remember that America
has been a home to Jews, some from a home to Jews there it it it. No one has the very experienced that, as described his, this seems on slightly that somebody could commit barbaric anti semitic act aiming his an inside inside the sanctuary of a synagogue, because it doesn't happen. It happened. You know casual acts of violence and hostility toward Jews in countries where Judaism as either. You know us back considered second class, or you know that's just for the course, and everybody expected I think I mean what's interesting. Is that so it Anti Semitism is, is, I think, different from all other prejudice? It is in that it is not.
It is it's it's a hatred of of the people, but it's also sort of a theory about how the world works its. You know you you it's. It's anti Semites believe that their Jews are are controlling things in secret in you know huge, extensive networks that are keeping them in and everyone else out of out of power and that are rendering non Jews eyes reserve impotent. I think the danger now with that in mind: it's not it's, not the the tone or the the heated of the rhetoric. Now I think it's that that that you could site in India is a as in car as correlating factor, but it's it's something about populism that that that that shares
this very idea and it's it's there, that's the inherent danger in populism cause it's it's. It's also a similar idea about how the world works and about why you why one is powerless. Oh, let me say at the outset here that I think that people who blame Donald Trump for everything that happens in our deranged, but we all experience the kind of rise of anti Semitism violent, vicious, Anti Semitism correlated directly with Donald Trump campaign, and he didn't deserve how it will raise the matter with you, sir. I would wish for which we need to describe what we're talking shores allans. It was all through social media, mostly almost entirely from annex I started Williamson emails from some really right, yeah psychotic people. For me it was around Ox July, twenty four July July and August twenty. Fifty that's that's when I noticed a little did indelibly burned into the hippocampus here, because it was
such a shock. It was nothing like I'd ever experienced before and we ve all heard about it now because it's been pretty well documented, but it was skin on people sending caricature versions of cartoonists, Jews getting executed, shot in the back of the head and gear on face being Photoshop into somebody in it, ass chamber, be other than that. The sort of anti semitic right that had been in the shadows fell very comfortable, coming out and Dumb Donald Trump sort of forgot about it and kind of ignored it. He would send signals that seemed to rat ratify these sentiments like when he addressed in December of twenty fifty when he addressed the Republican this conference, where he talked about how I'm a negotiator, like you, guys and you're, not going to support me, because I don't want your money and that sort of thing triggers something makes sense to people and then when he would refuse to say I
disavowed the k, K, K for example and sandy to learn more about this grew to be created. Daily did David evidently was an explicitly about the kick: a cave, bye, bye, Jake, Tapir and and David do both. Independently and by the way when he, when he did it, he It is a very interesting way. He said I I disavow. Ok, I disavow disavow, he did not say surely he did not say I disavowed David Duke he did not disavow the support. Of racist or the support the cooks, land he's he he would pay the phrase I disavow, so he did not create a sound bite in which he said that the name of the people that he was disavowing. I read that as you will, it was clearly conscious. It was a coup, just choices. It sounded weird didn't flow correctly.
The idea in his head, if I were psychoanalyze em, don't like web like trying to speculate was he wasn't turning down any, but he wasn't really going turn down anybody who was willing to go the mattresses for him? I mean it. I gum they get their disgusting. But you know he wasn't gonna, throw it in their face. That was the way he was going to conduct himself, and here Now you can draw straight line between man and will happen, draw he did what he did right, so The question then go to what: how do we deal with the fact that, in the aftermath of every horrible mass crime in the United States, the instant approach of. Arm chair liberals, in my view, although I suppose conserves due to but let less and less to remove agency for
the person who did it as quickly as possible and then to say that they were acting essentially as some kind of a programmed robot. Of a larger force that was directly their actions, even though they didn't know it right so the first time we heard this in them in the most despicable, where thank was when John I'd Lacheneur shot, Gabrielle, Giffords and five other people in a parking odd in Arizona and the instant blame was laid the feet of Sarah Palin because she had their ships. She had published her. He did a we a map with targets on it. One of them being Gabriel difference. It then, are the jar. Locker was a very, very disturbed. Paranoid gets a frantic with complete
Lee, unclear mental processes and that his obsession was with the idea that grammar was doing something to destroy everybody's brain and that he would not motivated by the tea party or her pale and or anything like that. He was clearly this with some weird that of horrible signals that had crossed his head. When we go down the list that you know, it's not the fault of the shooter, it's the fault of the gun, it's not the fault of so the M fault. If the owner a war in trying to do whatever is the error is trying to do that? No one would get guns in the known would shoot anybody in their everything would be wonderful. That's in a country in which there are extend four hundred million pieces of weaponry, whatever the energy says about had sales from here on in that weapon
ray exists, it's part of its exists in the United States. It's not going somehow to be met ethically teleport it. You know, by the push of a button, to have spacecraft floating in space, but in general it's the wish to assign blame to the person you don't the people, the forces, the people you don't like in the culture for events like this and when you get to Anti Semitism, MRS words very striking, so there is clearly a role being played. Why played by the caravan story and the role of high us that add to Robert Bowers leaving his home Saturday morning and shooting up the tree of life. But as Miriam Wolf's letter reminds us no Sir
thing Drawer, the shooter and West Rogers Park in July nineteen, ninety nine were fortunately no Jews were killed, but a great many might have been, or at this shooting up of the J C C in San Francisco or in Seattle, or you know, various other places, those worm islamist attacks, which was it which were an effort to make sure that as many Jews as possible would die. Kate Hopkins is a pretty much a racist and none in the UK has a pretty big footprint and concern me to go over there so that you don't have to look any further than this particular synagogue's rabbi in his endorsement for open borders, immigration policies, that's what animated the shooter, that's what anime anti Semitism all over the world trade only
you also have, on the other end of the political spectrum in the UK, Jenny Tongue, who's. This lived M kook. Basically, who represents more the far left, who said immediately on Facebook. This attack is terrible but sometimes I wonder in I'm paraphrasing, but but really it was the centre. Sometimes I wonder if you realize how much there is support for israeli policies against the Palestinians, bring the sun. So to answer you question about why we have an idea. One answer might be that we don't have a good account of evil and of sheet of these two sheer existence of evil. Whether demonic forces, you know, or some some account. That explains why people do hateful things on its one terms, rather than in terms of kind of book,
odd, sociological developments that we try to. I call on too much. I think, Socio lot Giles too much and dumb. Let us I so much in other words, that the answer to everything is what happens at the level of political decision making, but a tool to go back to a point. You may John about the day the difference it of the? U S: is this exceptional refuge for the jewish people? I think one measure of that is the fact that, when this sort of thing happens set aside the craziness on Twitter, the react and uniformly as a kind of absolute horror, absolute confrontation, Absolute resolved to confront and no sort of funny business about about casting blames on victims, which is not the case. As I was saying, the free show in in are often oftentimes Europe, where s sake, is certain kind of high handed Anti Semitism.
A beds for excuses or justifies the low street level thuggery style, Anti Semitism. So, for example, Mr On in the eighties, famously one there had been a shooting at a at world. Restaurant restaurant said you know Ex many, it is anti was a do it was. It was over the names of Attica, very said. The attack on he said Ex many p all died. Innocent people died, plus some Jews, anything at mentality which receives many tongue and which see, maybe in Katy Hopkins in her own way. Is this idea that use, unlike other innocent civilians, are somehow combatants in some x Y, see cultural war, whether that said a dispute, but the Arabs or whether that's there, role in politics that somehow makes them more likely yet victimized mention they really explore why that is in a sort of turns back to the victim, largely
so that's absent in the? U S, political dynamic, we really mainstream was why? Why would that be? This gets back to my my my my point about the jewish life in America B, as Jews, are others in almost every other country in the world. Aside from Israel. Even in liberal democracies, like France, like Britain, do feel themselves to be other at times of political strife or political confrontation were observer. Direct political aggression towards them on the part say of bird meaning arab and muslim populations. The impulse of a lot of people, not even an idiot logical impulse, but more a kind of political logic. Rotarian impulse, is to say well give everyone so mad at them there, but they probably have haven't. Aren't they probably have a case? You know
If, if it you known, if there are ten times as many Muslims Jews in my district, I should probably pay attention to what the Muslims are saying and try to. You now serve like. Listen to that cause representative of a community, and you know that have there they have their greater in number. Joseph never numbered more than four percent of the population, the United States. We now number about two percent of the population, the United States- and Obviously, life is not he's been beautiful and there were quotas and the ivy leagues? And you know the law, firms wooden hired you all of that stuff, but taken as a whole, in the course of human history, vessel last fifty years have been paradoxical for Jews. But you know, even if you take the hundred and fifty years before, that there is never. A car three a regime, a political system that was excepting and I would even say as open
follow Semitic. As the United States, and so Jews, even whose feel themselves have felt themselves to be others, culturally in a giant. You know world of non Jews. You know four per se, and two percent whatever, but politically Jews have not felt themselves to be other and that you Know- and I quoted in my blog post, this astounding letter, written by George Washington, to the congregants of the, tourists synagogues in August, seventeen eight. This is one of these things that people You know studied more. They would know something extraordinary about door. I'm just looking up as I'm talking to you, because I'm having trouble typing on my Iphone finding this sir.
Letter, but so I will add briefly when you do that been rather hard on Donald Trump and I think he deserves it. But so too does the Obama administration fur in policy terms, but also in a sort of a kind of rhetorical or periodic matic approach to what you said was this european idea of Jews as combatants in a global war? I think that was a evinced in his comments. The president's comments last president and two of boxes medically CS and twenty fifteen in which he addressed the attack on hyper cashier, which is a jewish jelly in Paris. He said quote it's entirely legitimate for the american people to be deeply concerned. When you ve got a bunch of violent vicious zealots will be headed people or who
Emily shot a bunch of folks in Delhi in Paris. Now the charitable interpretation of those remarks was that he was just talking about terrorism, broadly a slightly less charitable, but all altogether Necessary parsing of those remarks, was to criticise them. For calling this attack random. It was not random and the sort of bizarre effort by the White House to serve it, take those sentiments and run with them. The White House spoke people who were quoted when, when asked for comment on that affirmed that this was a random terrorist attack and then eventually had to walk back and say, ok, yeah, well, an attack on a coach or store was a bit unit units you not so interesting about. That is that it points at that there that there can be a problem at the opposite end of the rhetorical spectrum, which is too little
to write to you know and and that their criminal things the right man that was that was that was so symptomatic of the Obama, which nothing is that people aren't don't hate each other, that much there's the debt is not that much terrorism or you dont want when flame people the wrong way right and and trigger anti muslim sentiment, which were is constant re, which was the response to the pulse disk pack shooting where we were told for two weeks that the killer, oh Mamma, teens Mamma, had been right, had been motivated by self hating homophobia when he called up, said Oliver BAR about ten times two nine one, one as he was going through his massacre and that, like the Sarah Palin Map, persists, you I mean it very difficult for us to live in a bubble that secure that you can maintain these delusions forth for setting the point here, point here. Is that no is that as Miriam was set in her letter law
Roger forces are at work here then what happened? Yes, today and what others you in the current new cycle, Anti Semitism of all forces is a larger force, millennia old, I peace. I reference if he's today and Louise Weiss, who runs Arbed Store in Pittsburgh was a wonderful piece, Austria journal today. Both reference, I'm like a moloch was, historical enemy of the Jews, the Armada kites where they were the hebrews historical enemies and what anomaly? Due to on during the exodus in the strait excess he went around in the back. You know, orders of the exodus, and there were six hundred thousand people according to the according to the story on the access killing the old in the infirm. Killing the old the infirm because they were the easiest to pick off right.
Eerie parallel right away, happened with raw rub rose mounds or ninety seven years old the rose and tall brothers who were both developmentally disabled. Fifty nine fifty four years old, picked off by an You know the notion of saying, while this is about the array or it's about Tromp or Tibet, someone like that when it is about the oldest hatred honour, the oldest continuing hatred on earth. What has been called John just more because I know you every that George Washington adjusted to two two Noah's point twenty one more example, which ties in things that Noah and EVA said Obama, administration, pulling anti Semitism, which, again, why am I am a little bit the hesitant a credit or take you seriously. This attempts to adjust blame singularly trump. Is
his Obama's famous interview with Jeff Goldberg. I know I've I've references in this part Kasparov before, but it bears repeating that he's the Obama told Jeff gold. Organ the Atlantic, long interview that The iranian regime says some hateful things about Jews, but it practises anti Semitism at the margins. And called out is a direct. What would he meant, but at the margins is that you know as they say these things, but their policy or their interests. Central. Thrust of the regime is about hating Jews at such a result of small, community and around that is probably the most photographed people in IRAN, whoever they are very a prominent measured in an argument, if you believe, as the iranian regime efficiently does, that the Holocaust was a hoax or that you know that the word Pepsi actual is a conspiratorial acronym that stands for pay? Each penny save Israel
which is things that happen broadcast on the on iranian Stay TV or that Mickey Mouse was good looking mouse or positive, looking mouse and he was depicted as a positive mouse in order. By Jews in order to restore themselves our former image as as rats or have you believe, the juice of this heads of apes and pigs that Walt Disney that care. The issue was an educated right aims, but that can be at the margins. Ones as I said, the Anti Semitism is not like other bigotry, because it's a theory of the world. So if you believe that it determines all sorts of other things. It determines your culture policy or foreign policy. The way you think is just conspiratorial, and and stop it? I mean the the problem is you're, going into you're going leg into deepens, attacks like there's. No, no, not even a reason to go into text about IRAN. Its you know,
for two thirds of its foreign policy, are dedicated to the idea that, as that that eight million Jews living a thousand miles away from the main tonight, why and need to be why an end it would be a it would be, a blessing to the earth. If they could develop the weaponry and safely deploy it in such a way that all those Jews were killed. That is the that he theological conviction that other regimes doesn't stay at the margins. That, opposite the margins, it's at the cart and core of the regimes. You know, global philosophy? So I just wanted to read the sea. Parts of the why it's a short letter but the parts of washing letter because as people are gonna, be saying it's no longer safe in America and America's narrowing blah blah blah why it is that America, has been what America has been to the Jews. This is written in one thousand, seven hundred and ninety think about one thousand, seven hundred and ninety okay Lay in the eighteenth century,
lightened views of the jewish people are not much of a a mile legible feature of admittedly high civilization throughout Europe. Right I mean Jews are depicted in horrifying ways. Jews are still eat out. User are not allowed to have last names in much of the much much of Europe on the grass that they need to be kept. You know still. Christians and Catholics believe that Jews need to live among christian as a as a so brutalized people to remind everybody of what happens when you reject Christ teachings. That was a very big thing. Then ok, there's George Washington and these guys over ass, the ocean who had been studying and learning Hebrew like Jefferson and atoms, we're both conversing than hebrew reading. He protects believing that Erica might be
a kind of vision of a new Zion of of the of the will of the whole land, to which unfair. People had made their exodus so the the Dignitaries of the tourism wrote George Washington, a letter congratulating him on his election and hoping for be no great things. America and here's what he wrote back in seventeen. Ninety gentlemen, while I received with much satisfaction you redress, replete with dread, expressions of esteem, I rejoice in the opportunity I assure you that I shall always retain grateful remembrance of the cordial welcome. I received on my visit to Newport from all classes of citizens the reflect on the days of difficulty in danger, which are past, meaning the revolutionary war is rendered the more sweet from a consciousness that they are succeeded by days of uncommon prosperity and security. We have risen to make the best use of the advantages with which we are now favoured. We cannot fail
With the just administration of a good government to become a great and happy people, there, citizens of the United States of America have a right to applaud themselves for having given to mankind examples of an enlarged and liberal policy. Policy worthy of imitation Oh possess alike, liberty of conscience and immunities of citizenship. It is now no more toleration. It is now no more the toleration spoken of ass if it were the indulgence of one class of people than another enjoy the exercise of their inherent natural rights were happily the government of the United States, which gives too bigotry no sanction to pay The commission, no assistance required. Only that they who live under its protection should demean themselves as good citizens in giving it on all occasions there effectual support made the children of the stock of Abraham who dwell in this land contain to merit and enjoy the goodwill of the other inhabitants. While every
shall sit in safety under his own vine and fig tree and she'll, be none to make him afraid, may the file of all mercies, scatter light and darkness upon our paths and make all in our several locations useful here and in his own due time and way ever lastingly happy G, Washington, privilege, rich white man, whatever I'm it doesn't it make you sick, doesn't make you sick to read this letter, this man rights this letter which, a statement of. The beauty of common citizenship being extended toy peoples who had received no citizen ship in the course of their entire history, it to two hundred and thirty years ago now write it
it of its a letter that could be written by it. I couldn't be because no one was as literate as this known as lyricists there, but you know by a mayor of veto Hartford in ninety ninety three right not as literate, because, of course, the sentence where he says Everyone says certain safety under his own vine and fig tree and there should be done to make I'm afraid that as a quotation from the prophet Mica, which you now, I wonder, you know, has doubled from ever heard of the prophet Mica, I don't novo bombers ever heard of the prophet Mica by the way, but you know so. This kind of cultural literacy. Shall we say that he assumed that he as a skin and that the juice of torone, shared alike in understanding and think of the concept also of the the violence, big tree so the problem, of the union It states that everyone has the profit, MIKE envisions in in there
restoration of the Jews design shall reside under their own vine and, Big tree, meaning they will have sweetness from wine. They will have sucker from figs and their own, it's not somebody else's and its filter and its separate Soho. Sir oh Jews, live in the United States as full citizens and can live under their own vine and victory, meaning it's not sobs catholic violent fig tree. It's not you know Europe's prior Islamic, Violent figure, Fido Farsi, violent victory whenever you want to call it it is the jewish mine victory at its fully planted in american soil, but it is also fully jewish that but we need to remember when people are gonna start trashing America. In light of what just happened here. This is
weight into the country's dna now can we we should stop for a second and talk a little bit about cause. I'm gettin will heated, so we might want to talk a little bit about com do, you have trouble sleeping. I did this. We do you struggle putting your kids to banish night? Yes, when you a poorly. How does this impacts recipe dates, not good right? Ok, so that why we commentary excited to partner with calm the number one after asleep meditation and relaxation named apathy your last year by Apple and if you had to calm dotcom, slash commentary you'll get ninety five percent off of calm premium subscription which on hundreds of hours of premium programmes, including sleep stories, bedtime tails were grown ups, designed to quite reminder: relax your body whereby soothing narrators, like Clark Peters from the wire and Jerome Flint from Game of thrones guided adaptation than topos like anxiety, stress and sleep soothing, music and more aid,
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Ok, so we keep saying people blaming trompe bubbling. Frumpy labelling from so so what are house? What are they blaming trot? How are they women trump? Alright, let's do this, so there is a distinct there's, a difference between the violence in America that in really exacerbated and revived over the course of the last two years. There was violence in America before, as a political force has been kind of dormant for a generation, but in the last decade I think we ve seen it river the vine and there's a definitely a difference between visuals who are motivated by ideology or racial tensions, or what have you committing violence and people in a more
acting like a mop there's something that happens to the human brain in a crowded, become something more reptilian and it behaves as Elias Kinetic describe crowds behaving, and there is a difference there. But I don't know if it is a distinction, and I will explain that by suggesting that populism we understand it right and left is tethered. I believe in a way that is the sort of inseparable from racial tension from group dynamics and groups, tread the two are so concomitant that I think we can say they are related and I'm not exactly sure of Donald Trump bears no responsibility. For that. I thank you very quite a bit and I think it's also on the left as well and predates Trump by quite quite a few years, but not a ton. I think he is a response to that sort of dynamic that has reemerged over the course of the last decade, but he's also responsible for advancing and creating the
since that were at now. So while I don't believe that Donald Trump can be blamed for this attack and should not be. I also think that the kind of return of two street violence that we have seen over the course of the last decade is in part. His fault is in part the fault of political action. Left irresponsible actors on the left and all of us are responsible for taking the temperature down. I do think that's completely reasonable. You just two m d At your point about it, proceeding trump dominance. Touch, us, I'm sure you'll get into a bit the occupy it was what it was a populist gathering of people. Coming together and swimming against the banks it was it was about how you know It was then, that this this, this horrible system of the bank's keeping keeping the ninety nine percent and Democrats believe that their disgrace.
Re state of we discuss them last podcast embraced. It said that national, as you said, it was useful and vibrant, effective Brok Obama at the christening of J of came our undoing of k and I'll Cape Junior Moral said. This movement had been vilified erroneously. Just liken. Women are Luther King Gos, drawing an explicit link between this movement and and Martin Luther King, and this was a violent movement anyone's Ex our act out and widely anti semitic. Tumor wrote about at the time the word there were two hans of anti semitic protesters out there with their placards in theirs. Conspiracy area, the blue. We published so long piece about this by Jonathan Norman about about the anti Semitism walking on Wall Street, and at that I meant, of course, the lying fake media ads. You know the one, the media that you're not allowed to attack as their so wonderful and do nothing but praise of truth and beauty. In time magazine named Occupy Wall Street, the man of the air and twenty eleven right now The early right so
arguments elevator scarce Angela brand described, Linda source or as the one of the new suffragists days, where they don't. They don't make distinction. This was the suffragists for what of over four liberal clause, rises. Why Hillary Clinton embraced the anti civility movement now, because you should seriously reptile as it worth. It was some so demonstration of liberal enthusiasm in the Streets street violence always has its romantic defenders right. So when the LOS Angeles riots happen, you will recall when Reginald Danny the guy in the truck was pulled out of his truck after the after the Rodney King shooting and beaten nearly two death at the core, performance in Normandy, in LOS Angeles, the ideal this was an uprising. This was not rising like ITALY? Mr Rob, this wasn't due note. This wasn't just sort of liquid session of looting and crazed you now out of control, vial,
and spent an uprising, and similarly you know when the g with which were the G20 meeting in ninety nine in Andalusia, right of war. That deputy, oh excuse me. I keep because that, because there were, there were more. There were follow on to analyse yet of the battle of Seattle, where there were, by dint of five thousand arrests him. Hunt really unable to examine a billion dollars damage because before because this this was the beginning of a some anti globalization movement the glow, the terrible heart, how you know trumpet so hard because uses the word globalist. The use of good the eternal abuse. Turning the word globalist into a bad word. Started on the far left, not on the right now. There's someone is on alert. Easy was right yet, but it was no, but it was revivify. Referenda lie. Those of us who are sceptical of Donald Trump from the beginning were scattered goes out to those issues with you in that out of language. Liberal democratic right left worse that reaches the start of harp on trumpet, because we too
began to enumerate the worst of his of his kind of mutations one was the Miami that each in Miami that we mention it. Or was it had Miami or somewhere in Florida? We're Trump said vary with the international bankers and her friend, yes overthwart. I decided I m so tat. We can be met. In this book, when the pressure that I but he would govern as an anti semite at TAT point where so stories complicated. It's just we're just saying, basically, that the aid, the notion that people take matters into their own hands, because the lawn civility and society won't handle it. Has no ideological, you know no one, everyone on every side of in the ideological debate,
has comrades who have flipped over into madness and an psychopathy and murderous and violence are, I guess, ok, I guess so that's the reason that we go back. It's not to do what about as omits to say this idea that is now being pedal that somehow and believe me its peddled on twitter. Every five minutes that demo have no responsibility for anything, that's going on or liberals, don't everything is conservatives everything and they said in two thousand and nine: The Obama was home, insecurity said there was a threat from right wing, extremism and the right to veto, screamed and yelled and carried on, and then they stopped there Up saying it be, They were worried about the right and see they were right, all along all that stuff. So you know it. You can source a certain type of. I hate to one side or the other. You no good luck to you,
that's just fantasy. That's just your own ideological bubble. There are a lot of right wingers who think that it's beyond the pale to criticise the president that it states point Blank period, but also seen specifics when he goes up on stage and says that congressmen, Buffy slammed a reporter man that was really cool. That is that, as incitement can inspire p. Ok, so thou art, yes, but Donald Trump, is very much a product of a solitary on the left, which blames right wingers for every act of violence that occurred over the course of dub broke upon the first four years and Brok bomber could describe Republicans as a spanish enemies and Joe Biden could say that they want to reinstating black slavery and repeal the thirteenth amendment and think there would be no risk local response to that. Among Republicans who are tired of being blamed for every pathological schizophrenia who shoot somebody, then? Yes
they're, going to act as an important put off disarming unilaterally and engage on the terms that are set by the enemy. But let me clarify your point here, because I think what you're trying to say is that Donald Trump the rise of Donald Trump, is a reaction or the popularity of Donald Trump and in many quarters of the right. It was a reaction to libels committed against people on the right by liberals and Democrats and people in the media in the year, this prior, such that the the idea that you were supposed to engage in niceties and be polite, didn't go a good boy like like worker Rubio, like a good, solid boy, as opposed being just like a slash and burn screw. You screw all of you, you all sock, Barack Obama's, a Muslim, the media, all your ear, you're, the enemy of the people and then that this get a willing ear because people sat there
Wilkins assented to middle Omni becoming the nominee in twenty twelve, even though they kind of thought he was a panty waste and like a guy who wouldn't fuck. Very much and then because he seemed nice and maybe people would like him and then he is accused of giving people cancer killing dogs be horrible to yet being horrible, kids when he was fifteen years old and Abiden Biden, as you allude to saying that publicans are all gonna put you back in chains, the vice president of the United States accused the their party of wanting to put black people back in chains and that is Suitable rhetoric, so basically ethic would know saying, is alive. Republican, said the hell with this This system is not right. You to say anything. We say anything. You cut our heads off, we're not less.
Thank you, anyway. What's more we're going to embrace listening to us yet we're gonna embrace the id we're gonna embrace the at you, you say we're villains, working to act like villains, you, how fine you don't you eat out! We try to. We try to play honestly by your work at working to take all the pleasure that we can pass, We take out of being your worst nightmare right. That's hot! Now, we warned against this here? Yet our magazine respectable quarters on the right from the moment the Trump rose who said was dangerous. We said it was. You know he was attacking John Mccain, offering you now for having, captured dead, he were played footsie with the clan He did all this stuff and that in and a lot of it was- and you know said that disgusting but Megan Kelly, you know, said disgusting still said:
dead, Ben Carson was a ambulatory skits frantic said the TED Cruises Father had killed. Kennedy in his wife was ugly were at all that And we said so, what do we say? And what do we say about trumpet Charles? I am more substantially senator. We should track every Muslim and where it had been named them in number them and have a database and which were and make sure I mean there are ten. Morale of reticence, yes are under. Our surveillance will mean that in that get absolutely resulted in a reciprocal rise intentions among the racists right. So here's my problem, like I said You cannot blame Donald Trump for the fact that a man goes a building and shoots eleven people, but people have said the mildest thing that you can say about tromp if you're not and if you're not a tempest but you're not like you know, arm old friend, MAX food or site. You know like where every word the comes out of trumps mouth is an act of evil. He is he's irresponsible right here.
But he should stop saying these things about Gregg, Jim, for a guy who body slammed the guardians Ben Jacobs, he should stop saying that the press of the urban appeals irresponsible. Well, let's, arse the use of the word irresponsible because it does mean he should stop, say because I don't like it and it's you know it's dickie right its irresponsible because it may have on tended consequences, like I'm sure, trump doesnt want anyone to go out and journalists at his rallies, but is it syncable. That's something I am, and I don't know what the securities like. So maybe it's impossible cuz! No one could get him with a gun. Impossible. Given him, as he said this morning with the press, is the enemy of the people that somebody who supports him. What's what do you do with an enemy you, kill them
if this is a ward river, where war, Brad PAR scale. The campaign manager of from twenty twenty said he as the leader of trumps Army from as an army according to the trump campaign- and enemies out there The stands reporting on the could someone someone changes are already here Trump supporters listeners in saying this is nonsense here in your name, the enemy, you attack the enemy. These are Marshall, references that have been used in power, take some time immemorial. You're. Over blowing this, What would you say to the to the other end of the spectrum, which is the quorum quote? Resist suppose nominal homage to all insurgency that has been warning that Donald Trump as a fascist organised, the take over of America due to some sort of a totalitarian system.
And then about six months in after this process somebody got a gun and tried to kill us many Republicans as it possibly could, and you know that there is some sort of link there. You can't really put your finger on it, but you know: there's one So what's the link in the in the Pittsburgh K, so the Lincoln the Pittsburgh cases as follows:. The caravan is coming up from South America right Central America. Excuse me, the heat The emigrant aid society is supporting efforts to help people in the caravan and as a believer in he really Society is a resettlement, is an agency that has existed for a hundred twenty years. Was there for the purpose of reach battling helping resettle Jews in the United States. We see old Soviet Jews resettled, holocaust survivor, settle, ok, so highest supports the people in the caravan
Trumpet the Republicans area starts making like hey out of the caravan and on Saturday morning. What did what did bowers say? He said I can't and by and watch these people destroyed, my country screw the dicks, I'm going in is what he said so does fact that the caravan story was publicized. Trigger him yet who is responsible for that? Well, it's that's a cow, located story is the idea now. Is that its fox? Did it fox? Did it because, they got hysterical about the caravan that so terrible and its foxes fault. But the people realize the caravan include, eat out people, orders the caravan and supported the caravan and were pumping the caravan to go north also wanted attention on the caravan. That's the purpose of sending seven thousand people unmixed where the? U S, border its,
so they weren't themselves. Creating a you, know, giants news event that lots of mainstream organizations reported it is sympathetic. That is why Republicans pounds phenomenon, which is the story, is not the story. It's the notice the story right. This story well but thou to shift to Republicans pounds phenomenon there, sir, thing to the Republicans pounds phenomenon I mean the We said when the started remember, think couple weeks ago we were like, or what is this this is like trumped should be paying for the caravan. This is like such good Mattel, real for him to get too to rise up the base and get them to turn out to vote. While this is, probably throwing up the bam, sorry, but Reilly the base year. I let you while people up? U turn up the temperature, so the water boils- and you know
You put your hand over the lobster tank where the water is boiling. It may be the lobsters slices. Your finger off with its ducking dying, move with its pin. Sir, I mean you: don't these things This is why you're not supposed to outline a lobster if it can, presumably reside, or they can actually several really. Yes, some grows London, I how you eat it. I'm delicious disgusting, God anyway, anyway,. Forget it so forget the lobster. What I'm did something I'm just saying like so, this is why presidents from time immemorial don't create. Political division because you don't know where it's gonna go. You don't know what you you don't know where it's gonna buy bite. You don't know what the unintended consequences are. Gonna, be
the polarization reign, the administration could take a hard line on the on the Mai Still I mean the caravan of course, and their about two or apparently so they are groups to the noble track crumble ass. We complained that the bomber the fake pipe bomber, whatever was took, media's attention off the caravan where he wanted it. He wanted on the caravan cause that helps them. The bomber doesn't help him. So you know the so the media, focusing on the fact that fourteen bombs that may or may not have been acts act in an active and acts of act available Shouldn't have been as big a story because it didn't help him. Ok, my point here is that he does. He not responsible for that. For the deaths or the injuries in Pittsburgh, he's
responsible for the evil that Robert Bowers did. Is he responsible for the day gradation of its he partially responsible for the degradation of our political life and the the buttons that are being, pushed all over the place that will have consequences because of their irresponsibility. Nor not nor is Fox news responsible for this, just as Rachel Matter was not responsible for the assassination attempts right, Alexandria Virginia. They the, though that person was a fan of her right now not fox, is not responsible. Rachel magazine, responsible twitter is not responsible. The world in which all of these the world in which this crate incivility not only allowed to fester, but in which people are perversely rewarded, for their service to the incivility.
This is where the reasons that I got off twitter, because I felt myself becoming a servant of larger cause that I deeply don't believe in, and it because not sure I was thinking I put the sun Facebook over the weekend, see what people would say, after nine eleven. If there had been twitter, how how much people in the country would have believed, forty eight hours after nine eleven that it was a false flag that Bush had done it right, because there was no such thing, this big it. Obviously, this became a theme right in this disgusting subculture. The whole thing you know was it that this can't mouth dad or steel can't write, glass or glass can't milt steel. I can remember we ain't right, all of that, but there
no way for it to sort of like ignite into a mass revolt against the reality of what happened and I don't know what would have happened. I mean it's just chilling to be nine. Eleven conspiracy theories were extremely popular there were, but lilies was but note there well television travel, but he took the does he may arrive? Who was? It was eight? The tail was very long. I'm talking about at them of origin when we had it when we had national unity on the horror of what had happened in the idea that the United States been attacked and that the attack on one was an attack on all that would have been I remember. When start things started to turn, it was Susan Sonntag riding in the new Yorker that we deserved it and Michael more saying that if George Bush benefited from it, it had to be something that he did on her purple purpose and that world came down in them like a ton of bricks, because the country was not the case.
Tree and large in its large majority, was not ready to listen to such talk, but by the weight, as we were in national grief, but to the extent that that day, Fine purchase it was. It was aided and abetted by the sir precursors of social media, which is that the internet and you to law and people e merrily ran are there there are these these amateur documentaries about an yourself You don't know what I'm saying but but Twitter is that that's worms like twitter, Twitter is a was a was a advance on everything that came before I write and Facebook Obviously, but twitter is a different kind of ecosystem because of the direct conversational involvement of people and people at all stay and the kind of cultural flattening that leads you now famous people to interact with. Nobody is
stuff funding. With the exception of this most recent atrocity, just about every event that results in some sort of terror or mass murder has been called a false flag by the people who think it's very inconvenient right. There's some sort of hidden motivation, There's something just can't just human there and that we have to make will or totally has right, but Abbe look everybody had this thing. But he had this thing when the when the, but when the bomb started. Turning up, which is I mean this is pie, finally, because we live in how we live in an age where, where, where we all were set by narratives and stories and movies and like he'll, be like it could ever be as uncomplicated as like an idiot in a Trump Van sends bomb sense, fake bombs to fourteen people. The trump doesn't like like. If this were a tv show, there would have to pay a twist clause. Go on the nose right, except two on the nose is razor. That's the way
the real world is. If something looks like a duck, it's probably a duck, and it's not at the horse someone made up to look like a duck that actually, at that fear which is that it's a horseman up to look back to get us back to our original is source of all conspiracy theory right, which is now which you see that which, the obvious, which is that the Jews are a tiny people. You know just trying to get, through history, aren't back the mode of actors in history and our and by the way, even if juice themselves believe We are the motive actors in history that that that that that God has assigned us. This chose role to fulfil mankind's destiny. Just because we believe it doesn't mean you should believe. Like you know, I mean go ahead and believe it. If you really believe it you should probably convert in. But if you don't believe like you know,
the history tells the miracle the juice peoples of the jewish people have survived that is the only sign that we have. As you know, kind of supernatural divine destiny, because every other tribe that was alive in the Middle EAST at the time is gone and we survive, but not every I've been there. Also there's this oral austrian religion, which is still going, but mostly ever but in the end and has survived repeated What's to extirpate us from the earth so and once again, I think I want to conclude not to filibuster, but I want to conclude by saying that Jews are on this earth and will be on this earth for about thirty five hundred years. Then, on this earth. The first was Abraham Abraham with thirty five hundred years ago, that core apportion that we read last week by era. Is
it tells the story of the binding of of Isaac Tor, apportion this week tell which is called highest raw tells of the death of Abraham, so Abraham dies at the age of a hundred and seventy five acquiring the love well contented with his life, even though he lost his wife, he his an Ishmael returns and they have a reconciliation as well. Of course, being the father of the Arabs. Justice Isaac is the Father of the Jews.
And he is buried in the tomb that he bought from came a knight to put his wife wife's there and that's the first jus died according to you now, as we read this week, thirty five hundred years ago, its thirty five hundred years later, the Jews are still here and if the Jews are still here, thirty five hundred years from now in large measure, it will have been because the United States existed and brought us in and kept us from extermination. One final word final file. I swear. I was in the same as the hebrew emigrant aid society, which was the motive cause of bowers, is Sir MA massacre. So highs has existed for a hundred and two hundred forty years and by four years ago it announced that its mission was largely done because there were no more Jews to resell, particularly the United States? No one:
the juice of the Jews, Russia had left most of the jewish populations that needed resettling or what once come to. America did not need the help of the sort where they were penniless and needed apartments, and you now social services and things like that. It was a, but no oh and wonderful undertaking and helped hundreds of thousands of people, including holocaust survivors and but it had basically run through its mandate and so was announcing that it was becoming a larger, was becoming a sort of like a general refugee resettlement Agency and there are many of them. There's the IRA either to rescue committee and others. He thought and said privately at the time. I thought this was a was a bad thing that higher was continuing, not bad, but it was like you know: one of the things about an organization whose mandate is fulfilled is it should take we ve done. What we set out to do. We can now close upshot.
In which leave you know and and celebrate the fact that we are no longer needed. We did what we were here to do, but it said profit organization has a staff. It has a belief system whatever, so so they kept on as I say I was like off, this is just an existing returns. Liberal organization that does liberal things and all that. Well because a what Albert Bowers that I just want a thousand dollars. They re and we're going in society, and I hope that it exists for another three five hundred years, because it cannot be allowed not flourish if, if it is the cause of an anti semites murderous spree. Then it should be raised on the shoulders of every Jew in the world and is paraded around until we can no longer carry and so forth nor Rossman Agreement, Sarve Amorium John Ports, keep the candle burning
Transcript generated on 2019-12-12.