What has Donald Trump’s COVID diagnosis done to the national political landscape? Will the public respond with sympathy or does the event merely reinforce the belief that the president’s recklessness has contributed to the longevity of this pandemic?
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Welcome to the Commentary Magazine Daily podcast today is Monday October. Fifth, twenty twenty. I am John POD words, the editor of commentary. Three is always associate editor nor Rossman high. Now, how are you on jobs I'm John, your job our job hired. Apparently you are the other is Monday. I was ready to go at a country that is appropriately and writing a brick wall. I said yes another person who is John senior writer, Christine wrote them high John IDA and
executive utter a wild, high Abe hygiene. I think I know what I know it through now. after you said, how are you, as I know, argovie? I know it. I didn't just do the Yard prouder, it's gonna blame for that one. Yet we argued earlier than we believe in order and tradition. I- and I guess this- is the revolution terribly completely destabilize the commentary podcast? Yes, I am. Shame That's on brand for this week's news that yeah guess that's that's true! So speaking, we are really everything's talk about. I guess we can justify call a halt. America come back tomorrow, all right, so that there are two tracks to talk about in relation to the president's illness and am
All of the ancillary positive tests of covered that relate apparently seem to be connected to the announcement of Aimee Coney Baron as the Supreme Court Justice, the at the White House Cuz. There is theirs tromp in the White House or Trump reaction, and then there is the general reaction by the mainstream media too, to the events, and they are very much connected, I will mention one thing and see how you react: witches Brian Spelter. Somebody like that that media critic of us of CNN said a d, just first obligation is to tell the truth said the doktor can't calmly, who is row trumps doctor
is not telling the truth and therefore you know this is a violation of his hippocratic oath or something like that dog Turkey's obligation is not to tell the truth at a press event on the lawn at a microphone doctors responsibilities tell the truth to the patient. He is not the doktor of the country. He is the doktor of the President and in fact, if the president were to say to him I want you to go out and say them, I'm ok. It is his obligation to tell too to protect patient confidentiality, and do that as a result that I don't heat was kind of weird and creepy. I saw it in the way that he handled it and was very impressed with if you want to be untrustworthy,
part of the american people then go right ahead, but this vote. We got into this mindset that somehow the the the medical staff tree treating the president works. Is responsible, first and foremost to answering the presses questions, as opposed to treating the president, so that I think, is where there could be a weird slight boomerang effect. Which is that, since there are all they do now, listen to each other on Twitter all day and all night and work themselves up into a common lather that they are very perilously. Close
to taking this calamitous event and politically, I still believe calamitous event for the president and to allow jujitsu doing it against them and in his mild advantage at So I think that's it's an interesting point because it so a doctor's first obligation is. First. Do no harm right towards the patient and. There was some if you watch Connollys press conference on Saturday. I did it was. Very clear that he had some straightforward answers he could have given and he didn't about most, notably whether or not the present had needed supplemental oxygen before he got to the hospital which he later they later admitted. He did need in the White House on Friday. Suggesting is shoot him and worsened rapidly
I do think that there is an I don't blame calmly. I blame tromp because you know hippo allows for patients to tell their patients do not have to release information about themselves, but the present United States needs to keep the american people informed about whose condition so that the amount people know what's going on because Otherwise, there there, the conspiracy, theorizing that happened over the weekend on Twitter. You know they will I laughed I sent on it. protects. You guys, you that your terms than obsessed with cure non, but actually all of left Twitter was obsessed with whether or not Donald. Had sent an image of himself writing his name on a blank sheet of paper from footstoves that even the worst of endorsing what was, his hand they they photoshopped. He put his hand. I guess you could say that the reflection of his hand through the portfolio- that's like. Why would they Photoshop report for you will go. There's doubt there is doubt about the truth. When it comes to try
obviously, but that stout he soon himself for four years right, yeah and sort of these doctors I don't understand what the strategy is here. I mean beyond the fact that the president does is watching conference from his room gonna be really really mad. If you get back and tell them the extent of your condition, why would you Marshall, this person, who has no experience as a spin meister, going out before the press. Being invasive transparently, save transparent. massaging the facts, why is amiss public going to somehow sour on the president, because he had the reaction to this Iris that everybody does whether he needs this cocktail of therapies, because he needs them. I don't understand whether what the what they were to avoid here in the created an unnecessarily bad new cycle for the matter oh. I understand, but I don't I don't condone. I don't think what they did was right, but it to the extent that there was
they weren't levelling with the public, but I understand the big issue, a they'd. They didn't want to project any under any more weakness for from Trump than they had to, because he personally doesn't like end and pee wee. Rightfully understands that will potentially heard him at the polls and be the day I think they didn't. They wanted to tourists. Stop the sort of dark fantasizing on on the left up Let me by his worst of critics and detractors about how he was
certain death- I Didn'T- have the precise opposite effect. It just yielded to more conspiracy arising in this fixation with optics is the reason why he didn't. We refuse to wear masks for so long and why we're in this condition and avert back is ultimately is Europe. There is this: what is their strategy? They didn't have a strategy the president's illness through them into disarray, and the disarray was very evident, and this is what disarray looks like. So, on the one hand, there is that ship dealer national champions, Animal House, Kevin Bacon, standing there saying all is well all is well wild, while there's a riot going on your frank, driven from from the naked gun daring there, while the fireworks factory is exploding behind him, saying nothing to see here. Everybody turn away nothing to see here, which of course, all it out. So so this was a real life version of that and it happens.
when there is an unprinted, unprecedented situation, it happened one when Ronald Reagan got shot in March of of nineteen eighty one you'll remember, I hit the severity of the of the injury was downplay. Our Hague, who is secondary, say, came out and sounded like us, a psychopath, saying I'm in charge here which he wasn't and no one knew what to do, because you know this, but what had happened. Is that an unsuccessful assassination attempt had taken place. Thank God, I don't know how to respond to, and they were only in the job for a couple of anyway, and here we have the president contracting highly contagious, a virus It is the Central NEWS story of art of our time and they they had war game that they haven't played through, and he, of course, is in constant and erratic figure.
And they didn't know how he would react? So that's when you get the wasn't even the doctors, the doctors aren't the issue. This is weird focus on the doctors were not pr people, its mark meadows, chief of staff, former Congress, who comes out and says, he's fine and then and then says we're off the record he's not fine. That was That was the moment at which you said my good God. These people are its I know that their amateurs, it's that their there, they they're having a nervous breakdown in public, like you can't, if you think the press is gonna, keep you're off the beer You're on background comments on background, when you literally say what I just said to you on. The record is a lie. Now I'm gonna tell you the truth, which is. We were very concerned as oxygen level dropped and we had to get him to the hospital. Then it's like so the under what so you're
telling me this on background. Why? I'm supposed to protect you you're, the White House staff. Training very deep background. The president young I mean That is what it is It's really an interesting turn about, isn't it because there there has long been. You know there was this secret kind of handshake type relationship between the press in the presidency and even between the present and leaders in Congress about not reporting on people's health dimension sex scandals. In a week we know as the irony of the Trump Administration thinking that it can play by the rules when it ran on blowing up the whole system is. Is I mean that their kind reaping what they saw right. I mean they that if the press is the enemy, you cannot, of that kind of on background relationship, relationship and expect that trust, a whole amuses talkin work and its, I do I mean when I play matters, but ultimately this is trumps responsibility and I do think it. Our friend you ve all has a good I'll bet.
Three journal today, where he notes, if that, if that Amy Coney Barrett nomination event in the rose garden, which also had an indoor component, which is likely where the spreading occurred, that was mass close and people were not required to either be fully tested and have a negative tests and or where mass than that was Nicholas, and that is not what you want. The leader of the country in the midst of a pandemic to be doing is to endorsing reckless behaviour, and I know we ve been really. We ve tried to be pretty good about. You know calling out the hypocrisy on both sides that when it comes to mask wearing and gathering, but that's it That's where we have two trump should be called out for that: that's not how he should behave in its irresponsible and if it lead to even a single infection, he's gonna be responsible for that, regardless of whether that's where you mean he obviously might have picked it up there to we're. Not we haven't you, also the contact tracing which they should be doing.
I declare that they are for his New Jersey Rally and Dolly events were hidden, hope, picks and many unnecessary tested positive was was in contact with others. So the president is the most reckless purse in his administration and an american politics in general he is a reckless person and his recklessness as part of what made it possible for him. to survive as bankruptcies too. You know- skate this razors edge of the tax code where he ends up you know essentially becoming enormously rich through losing money as opposed to making money and the right was that led him to figure? He could maybe take this. You know we could take this, sir I'm shot shot at becoming president and then becoming president and then some of the imprudence of his policies, which have scored remark
Lee primarily, I would say the throwing up the cards in the Middle EAST and saying enough with this. You know trying to pretend like we're. you know where we're trying to be out of you know, with equal player between Israel and the Palestinians were on Israel side, we're gonna, we're gonna, move the embassy to Drouet Jerusalem and we're gonna change, though this dynamic. That was that's part of the recklessness. The prudence that ordinary politicians display in matters That was the reason that, like our friends sets, Mandela is used to say no one's ever gonna move the embassy to Jerusalem, because that the opportunity that the you can sort of game out there, easily what the concept this might be, and you could game out, what the benefits would be, so things being equal, you kind of leave things static and trump doesn't care about, leaving things static. So, all
this is the is, is central to his entire way of being. And it also meant that there was this view real and virus around. That he'd decided that he wasn't going to pay appropriate, prudent here too, and so that is the nature of the idea that somehow this has been visited upon him in a literary karmic fashion, because he can t bet on the possibility that his luck would hold and His recklessness would pay positive consequences. The way he believes it has all his life and he and the you know the train crashed not yet. He still really still heading the he's. Milking he'd get work, but yet, but he still, but he still, you know, sort of role with that he's gambling on that I mean is recommending that still explains the right about right yeah,
No she's, not chastened by this experience will work more precisely. I have to say, I think, it's very hard to presume that we know What is going on with him or inside his head, or anything like that, given the cocktail of medicines that he is on it's not a joke like being pumped full your rights. Having remedy a year and that decks of methyl zone or whatever it's called an this caught this other cocktail and sterile. You know all of this today their who knows what's going on with him, I mean people get. You know people take pride in his own, which is a kind of the routes stairway that you take. If your second, your doktor things you need to take steroids, and then they go a little, they can go a little bananas. Just from predators own, while the level yeah that's an,
The inflammatory by your thyroid, I'm in here right and people, do get running. I've seen it I've seen dino friend, go through, this people start bouncing off the ceiling from from It's one of the reasons you can't take it for very long it aids toxic and be it can have kind of deleterious consequence. Then your brain, chemistry and and trumpet a massive doses of steroids. Now, and God knows what effect it might be, having off to go by after my posts on the website when I was taking that for us. Intestinal infection and infection. Nature it completely incoherent. the implication that you're making. The really big one really strong on the notion that the president has not have sound mind is a very strong application with procedural of outcomes if we were to relieve me, you know the point is
we don't know, we don't know the presence in the hospital he is taking a course is taking courses of drugs that have in out that have contrary indications end and how You know side effects and we don't know if they're having an effect on him or not, because of who he is that's part of the problem, in other words like if Barack Obama said, I'm gonna go drive and waved to my friends It was in the hospital and all these drugs. Somebody would say maybe there's some going on with the steroids, because Obama's. You know Obama's a low Africa, not a high fat guy, and he would like wooden necessarily do something like that. Tromp. Of course he would go drive and if he well, you know so there there might be no real distinction between how Trump would behave If you were having sir kind of aid and effect from from the from the drugs he's taken or if he's not,
right you assemble. a crowd with trump signs anywhere, we once give me their cattle show up yet so big it was this was, Clever to resist so I don't know, I'm not my my implications. This is the reason that you know when president gets a common Oscar p. He will will often serve like temporarily, assign the powers of the presidency to them. president, because there is a extraordinarily small, but none the less possible risk of going into some kind of a coma from the drugs take when you add from from a routine relatively recent routine procedure, and by the way for all we know he signed that paper kid it and how do we know we didn't sign of paper? You know temper
early seeding the powers of the presidency to pence. You know on Friday, he could have they just woke outputs. I mean, that's part of the man so, but I think ultimately, this is where, where what would upset his right that trump strength trumps Modern maniacal fixation is on the idea of strength and that's why you likes students Are you air to want it's what he calls himself, those those three rolled girl singing at the rallies in twenty fifteen and twenty sixteen right, who sang the song to Trump deal. strength or get there get destroyed every time. Member like this is this is like a kind of fixation on his part of what is it? Why
Does he say sleepy Joe or low energy jabber? It's all was to be in contrast to his strength and there's nothing that could make. It could be worse than, of course, looking like he was felt by a disease, because, if that's the, if that's the message that he wants to beam into people's heads about who he is, and keep beaming it there. I don't know for Ality Trump's virility. In this case I mean there's. No, he can't he his his sense of masculinity depending so heavily on Blosser in performance is going to be the challenge for him in this last month of me with we ve talked endlessly about other poles. If the poles are correct, is toast already, but the question of whether we will be able to debate and what, since what physical If you will be in for that, I think is gonna I'm really cement. His fate permanently. Voters and me that's what two weeks away, but he
We can have awakened early baby. I'm in this. That was the easiest prediction you could have ever made. Is that democratic, freedom is those radioactivity in that's exactly what happened over this weekend. The notion that the president can be like anywhere, is a menace a threat to public health, the threat to everyone around, not just here- and there are not so good the good of the country. He just ass. The Khyber me five hundred their pain also I keep reading pens should be in an hour was location in a bunker. You know, because I'm not quite sure why, but anyway, since he keeps testing negative, or so they tell us, but yet this idea that really for the good of you know where the country and and and everyone around them, they should all just stop running for present
You know what I mean by the way I serve enjoy. There is something this kind of game is one of the things that makes politics. Your timing is to see what advantage people try to take of something ere piety is well I'm just talking about people's health. Here you know it's like the target, it's like what Tartu free are you gonna be responsible for what what machiavellian gay are you playing in the guise of being understanding, moral and and- and It's the new think about the children right same thing happened with any kind of error which was right, enjoyable because He has hacker. Presumably, antibiotics for it and tested negative on Friday day of and Judiciary Committee Democrats when I write and for
The thing is it: that's not good enough. You never know when this than Comana can take fourteen days for the better for the good of the committee. for the good of the working mechanisms of the world. Look here, she has to sell quarantine for at least fourteen days Meanwhile, at the same time, Joe Biden was getting on a plane to Michigan who also negative, but was ass exposed because he was at the debate. Recall, hearing a single word about how he was endangering their health of michiganders or his campaign staff for anybody else? Well, she's, a republican But let me just have some humility, Noah. Don't make the charge of it in the first place it so that such a naked attempt to seek advantage
out of the presidency that I've been everything has already been increased if the parties on part, though the fun part, is just seeing what people throw against the wall to see what the word what's gonna stick like this. This is this is the front part like there too- Are two sides of the Amy Coney Barrett story from here on in one? Is. she should quarantine and therefore she can't possibly have a hearing in you, whatever and then the other as well. You know there can't be a hearing There can't be votes so g. We should wait, wait until after the election or something like that one is ridiculous. The other is is, is entirely procedural and in this sense, which is you throw it
you're like well yeah. I guess there can really be hearing. I mean how can they have hearings with three senators diagnosed with covered and how could they possibly vote and all of that and then the way to look at this is the only people who are saying that are the are the Democrats who. All they want to do is not have vote like it. If there can't be votes there will now, be a vote. I mean, if that, if the rules procedures and all that make it impossible for there to be a quorum or for there to be a sufficient number of republican the vote on her nomination or something like that. Then there won't. Your vote. That vote will not take place for another two and a half or three weeks. And so daintily there happen, or it won't happen, a scurrying
asserting its necessity is ridiculous, but It seems entirely in line with its powers spot highly it it's for its superfine, its highly unlikely and because they can having remote hearings and the there. The back you know, backstop the EL safe strategy. Here is, as evidenced by the teacher geniuses at justice, Democrats and people, gentle centres that you can have a warm if there members present so democratic should boycott the hearing which would not unprecedented, but it would be really forming yield to most likely a Florida reason why you have to have a committee hearing? In fact it wasn't even common until the mid twentieth century and so we'll just push it through. The former is amiss. It's a misunderstanding of how desperately elegans need that's not want it need this
this is the fundamental proposition of the Trump presidency. The devil's bargain, and this the due to which Republicans agreed. To end the math and they will get a good one way or the other endure the consequences whenever they owned by the way? The more that the election looks like it is slipping away from Trump and the Republicans the more the idea well, let's just go out on a high here- we're gonna get. This third the on the Supreme Court and then we're gonna write the whirlwind, but at least we can go out feeling like we did this one thing this you know horror, show of a year that will happen enduring value to us and to the country, as we see it, that its law Ok, you know we made this Devils bargain and the devil's bargain has not worked out for us, but we will be able when peoples
How could you have let this happen to say you know corset. Cavenaugh Baron. and they will be able to say it's all Democrats fault. I mean it because it would be really is every recent We're precedent. Dense, have pursued his backfired on them, the first Nuclear option. They ain't it in it. Twenty seventeen, they filibuster, go research for the first time since AIM Fortis and losses court nomination, which read said Harry Reed said, would happen anyway. If further, when, in October, of twenty sixteen and look pretty much like they were gonna. Take the White House, keep the White House and take the Senate and then, after going after birth, cabin animals, grotesque fashion imaginable, in other words no group, So then procedural precedent that emerged from that, but it certainly galvanised everybody on the right to say we were not least means your ear they'll. Never there. We will never give anybody affair shake and so we're just where Europe, and so basically, if the idea is if the idea is worthless
all going down in flames. The Neil ISM pop would be fine, let it all go down and flames and we won't get the Supreme Court. You know what the hell with it, but at least please, as I say emotionally as people watch this happening and if the more. Could cold I'd among Republicans, which is what what I gather from people talking over the weekend? People are like we, we got one more thing we can do here before we bear, quickly all have to we're going into hibernation for for two years or we're gonna be basically doing in oh yeah? We're gonna be weird in doing we actions to kind prevent the worst of democratic and liberal ambitions from from taking place, How? How is I'm curious, what you guys think how
I know I have a suspicion about how Pence is gonna message- the president's illness in the debate tomorrow night. But how is Harris going to deal with it? Because it's actually kind of tricky binding can get away with saying Doktor Jill, and I wish him well- and you know he comes across as meaning at whatever she's really kind of bad. When she tries to message empathy and she was terrible in the primary debates every time she attempted to do it, it struck such a false notes. I wonder how well. I'm just I'll, be curious. What you guys think she's gonna say because its it is a challenge for any politician in that setting because he still currently ill, even if been released to the White House, be stood, cylinder treatment. So I think I think she's gonna have to be careful, so a dynamic of the president, president on the campaign trail tromp has up ended because the classic rule The thumb was the presidential
candidates gave bra grass and you know, did speed em, you know serve taught didn't mention, is rival or didn't talk about didn't mention the other party, because he was in prison and all this and the vice president was the attack The vice president was the super surrogate. It was the vice president, who said you know are all bad there, a moral there. This in the message got out through the vice president. Both this were red meat to the supporters and to get the press focused on the negative aspects of the, the rival candidate Trump, has totally thrown this to the because he is the attack dog and pence. If we remember and twenty sixteen went into debate with Biden, the or not with mine, I'm sorry with them with TIM Cain and basically invent
a trump that wasn't there Donald Trump is going to get a loves Europe, Donald drain out. He basically said that tromp was here men had all his policies, and this is what Donald Trump was gonna. Do and so he was the positive and tromp was the negative. So here s the tradition would be for Harris to be, you know, Joe Biden is too nice guy to say acts, but I'm gonna say it with Trump did and he's getting those. the great service agents, sick and he's behaving in a way that it is in of his prayers, since he doesn't care baby as he doesn't care about the children in cages, he doesn't care about the dreamers. He doesn't care about you. He doesn't care at anybody. He'll get you sacking D. He said the economy he made a mess? because it was called a guess, I'm saying it, but maybe she can't I dont know you're saying she can't, but there is
tradition of her being able, not only being I want to say it, but actually supposed to say at like skirt the bounds of of good taste as the attacked well, but let's not also must suffer get that this is a case in which the democratic presidential candidate did the number one, I told the president to shut up and called him around, but that's different. That's what I'm saying she could say he is the virus not only does have the virus, he is the virus. She could say at. The question is, are, they sing their frantically focus, grouping and testing whether or not she should. I have no idea and all what widening Why do we think she would adhere to a message she has, terrible Menobranchus she's, not the one who's determining what message she's gonna go within the debate to be. Let lets me look how
you behave in a debate. Is this? Is the key strategic tactical question of these campaigns? as eighty billion people watch the first one more, you're not going to watch this vice presidential debate now than anybody is ever watched and it is the camps strategy that she is going to work through. She is now an independent actor there? They are stable sitting since Friday, trying to figure out where she should go with this. So I think, rather thinking what her instincts are, you should serve. We should. We should watch very carefully to see what it is the camp. aim things where what that what the outer limit of the rhetoric can be when it comes to Trump having corona. And when they are, if they believe they are up ten, twelve, ten or twelve points, if those pulls the weekend are accurate whether they even need to deliver. You know like
horrible will not blow or whether she just wants to sort of like play nice and let this go because ok, we're going. That seems to me to what watch for, if there, if she's, if she's, evincing camping strategy or she's she's the hearing to the playbook then gather will probably tread water and play defence because that's all they need to do. If not then she's she's listening, your instincts and your instincts are reliably terrible there to issue implication Laden sordid allegations that she can defend in a three day new cycle, it follows the mob. She never has any sort of follow up for anything implicate. That she makes am. I She's gonna want to stick. I think I think the campaign and and heard they're gonna want to stick to this. The moral of the story of of trumps recklessness and the virus, I think
is there going to be very focused on from having caught it and being being a thrill of walking? symbol of his own recklessness, I think, that she's never gonna steer clear of the I'd end and it's going can be very finger wagging and if there's a all, but of lip service paid to you know the thoughts and prayers remade fine. But aside from that, it's gonna be its can be very massive on ok. So we need to talk a little more about this, but first I want to talk to you guys about our sponsor today keeps cause. As guys so much of our identity is wrapped up in our hair from how it feels after giving a fresh cut to the way, it's perfectly style before going out. That's why? When we get indoor twenties and theories and started noticing the first signs of hair loss, it definitely feels like panic time, because, let's face it,. Trust me no guys ever ready to go bald thankful. Now there's keeps which there wasn't
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I've by and whatever it is that they that they said how much of this is genuine and legitimate expression of honest sentiment about this unprecedented mom for the presidency, and how much of this is that is the twitter echo chamber of performative rage and upset at whatever from does anybody? You think? Well, it's hard to tease the two parts. It's a mean if, if, if, if could come up with a degree of each. That would mean that vein. They them the the people themselves were outraged, know to what extent they are driving themselves crazy and to what extent they actually have a legitimate
a grievance with what the present is doing, and I dont know that they know I mean. I think there is a default a mode in which everything that he does is, of course cause for hedge exploding. But then again it's also seem symbiotic. He feeds off that. So heap He pumps them up at every turn, so it's impossible to say Can I just point out that the decision to mention Twitter, which actually has been driving a lot of the more insane conspiracy theorizing, whether we can try Roy Rage, tweeting from his hospital bed this morning is exactly what Twitter was meant to be right. Literally, at the apotheosis of the platform I mean this is, and the ring actions, you will get for that. The comments on whether he should be doing it. All of that is how that's all engagement at all. What these platforms are meant to do It's the reason behind a lot of concern about how it how it affects people's dinner, creating echo chambers and one not, but I think that damn
we talked a few weeks ago about how the press needs Trump in some ways as much as you know that they love to hate him as an tat meant and they will miss him in a strange way if he loosed his. This election and They got thirty days to solidify their thereof, dislike it mistrust of tromp. I personally I worry about the going forward, whoever is inaugurated in January, the kind, mistrust the public has in the press and the de the can can condescension with which the press treats the american public's ability to understand. What's going on those really negative things going forward, regardless of whether it's a democratic republican and White House Miller Libby limit
Ask you, the the question is due to the press responses create a blow back, that and benefit trump work. Or is this an ecosystem in which literally everybody who involved in it has all he is already lined up And so are you? do all they're doing is enraging people who are already in a vote for Trump and they're. Not like it's. Not it's not
on the side of voter who's gonna say, I think, that's really mean I liked the way there talking about the President, who sick and and and the way they are insulting. Him were saying that he is bad for trying to get well or something like that. I'm gonna vote for the present. I just wonder. I do think that there is There is, though, a real prospect that the the ECHO chamber effect can lead, Democrats and Republicans to Democratic, says we Democrats in the media to make one or two gigantic mistakes in tone and praise. Temptation that Republicans compounds on. to say these people are just garbage. You you're always saying trumpets garbage these people are garbage, hasn't happened yet, but it could. I'd like to tease out from you what that would even look like
Republicans have been running against the press for a generation, no more, press never shows up on the ballot in November. So there is no outlet to direct your frustration public and partisan, say well, the press and the Democratic Party there. Just the same. We have almost no evidence that voters, persuadable, who make the difference in elections. Think that way and. If there was a backlash too how democratic? complex and their allies in the press. Behave probably should have manifested in twenty eighteen following the Cabman hearings, but There's two factors at work: there: one people don't vote on Supreme Court nominations like parsons do. things are animated by everybody. This really isn't and too the press is not on the ballot. The press is not are. You can vote against? So it's just it's just in it, Co hate rage that just goes into the universe without any hamlet. Imagine how it actually now in the ecosystem that the Prescott
those Ngos in those Ngos and then. truck. Shimmer goes too far that that's why or you know, richer Blumenthal Centre from Connecticut goes too far. Or one of the squad goes too far, wishes Trump dead. I get it does. I don't know what is there a circumstance in which the effect we can read down to trumps benefit words like ok, you people are just that Just wrong we I saw he saw some of that over the Friday and over the weekend from obscure twitter accounts, with blue checkmark, soaring the chief editor at American now mine. chapter whenever the publication is that you ve never heard of before I say you Know- and I note really do this, but I'm gonna wish the guide that,
and then the universe comes down around their shoulders, not because it's a sentiment, their particular frustrated by, but they know it's impolitic They still have their wits about them there I do feel like colors is camel. Harris is a ticking time bomb and I think your instincts arch in that direction. She is routinely put Democrats and her own running me in a really bad position by reaching for rhetorical access that This is the base, but just put someone absolutely have to explain themselves. The most recent example is just her going after the prospect of a vaccine being reliable thing. You should probably be afraid of it, because dongle trumps mixing enough himself in the basement so she could probably got. I could see her going there, but I don't think anybody else going there seasoned with less. She would be the worst possible person to go their base in my scenarios because she is, I run, that's it all and the
the only thing that would reduce negatively to direct the ticket. I suppose I dont think that does not exceed the Democratic Party as soon as I don't even think it would reduce, notably to the figures. I think I think you bring up a good example and in her you should have you no new. Anti Baxter angle, because that didn't were down negatively to the ticket ended it in fact had just kind of turned it was of a contributing factor and turning the public against the prospect of a man. scene. I mean no one, it did you outside of. conservatives and those who support dropper. They didn't do no one was released. Outraged by that it is because we believe that there is a common set of Cuomo built on their commonness. Either then said, New York will oversee the federal vaccine process because we can trust the federal government
yeah. I blame the present for that. This came up during the debate and in Joe Biden, flailed tried to backtrack, undermined his own running made. It was a terrible performance right up until jumped down here, you haven't spoken for thirty seconds and decided. dumping with this attack on Joe Biden alma Mater or whether it GMO modernize, though its relevant thing, could really have a national conversation about that. After, if, for once that look, I think that there is a central problem. You you you, you get you reap what you you report, you so and Trump himself to the presidency. Over the course of a year in which he said that you know ten cruises. Father killed, J, F K, TED crews was the Zodiac killer. His wife was a Harley fear. Rina was ugly this that you know Well, whatever else it was it he would say or do about other people, and then the deed
band on the part of a lot of people who are in the president base that he be treated with extraordinary empathy and personal sympathy. At this moment you don't you can't, have everything you know it. If you are if you, if you are a figure who makes your bones as an anti empathy person which is a real thing like. In other words, you know it's. Oddly enough, I mean it's sort of Randy and like I'm Randy, you know like where she says compassion, ghetto and there in the fountain had there's this whole passage where we are suddenly Howard work. The found the architect feels compassion for the man who was trying to kill him and he's he's truck. He he gets physically sick compassion makes him nauseated an ill and it becomes
it's so weak if such a it's so weakening in it so destructive of resolve that this seduction, literally make some want to vomit right? That is tromp trump. Is a figure who is like enough with all this, the you know, I'm gonna do good things for this country and the end and with all this, like performative sympathy, the hell with that, and then you get me what's like how dare you say this about data, how there is a various the people on the right? It's like out, it's disgusting, that you would question the president this and it's like he can't he doesn't get. He can't get the now by the way. This doesn't go to the whole question, whether I should prefer as recovery and David French wrote a very good piece about this, not myself being a Christian I'm saying from a christian perspective, why you're even was to pray for leaders you hate or think or are bad?
but I am saying this notion that somehow he deserves the same rest war of public support for a time of tribulation. he has. She has surrendered that than that true, but I went just just push back a little and say we have a lot of performative empathy and the other ticket to the only reason anybody's buying the Joe Biden commonly Harris performance of Empathy ACT is that Trump is so anti empathy and I'm sorry, I really need to go back to how here, where how Harris is going to deal with this on Tuesday it reaches a goodbye apologized when GMO Tuesday, Wednesday Socrates heart for Wednesday debate. She said The christian wieners rate of the of the of the race is so this is the character and mean girls who kind of an empty shell and just once to be accepted for whenever the the sort of alpha girl is at the moment and shall switcher loyalties and whenever and try to play people if she's not stupid, but she's kind of
empty, and I do feel I mean when Joe Biden does his empathy stick. There is something there he actually has suffered. A kind of the car the losses that that I think people can connect to, and you know, as we mentioned before, when he talked about his sons, drug addiction. During the last debate that was quite moving lot. Americans understood that I've never gotten adsense from hair as now pencil, it's like a robot, so I mean she's again she's playing off a great opponents and in that sense, but that the empathy thing I mean, I know a lot of moroccan say they want it, but I don't buy it when it comes from Harris any more than I buy it now, when trumps supporters claim we should have for him. Its role is performing on both sides will that's why she can go. She could go in fifteen different directions and maybe I just reiterate that we will get a sense of where the campaign thinks it is based on the direction that she goes it if they think that they pretty
Much have it in the bag. She doesn't have to be. That pointed sharp were negative and if they are still interested in either dealing and aka blow or or then they need, they think they really need to spin up their own bases. Enthusiasm, and I mean democratic Party enthusiasm writ large. I mean their bases enthusiasm then she could be really tough in a manner that will make you gasp amid the one moment of real unquestioned political success that she had. That is the reason that she's on the ticket was the moment that she went right at Joe Biden.
Forehead and- and you know something that he should have been able to anticipating- didn't that she would say you tried to deny me the right to a good education, that little girl was me and then he just didn't have anything to say to her. So you may say that she has battle instincts and she does because obviously she was thoroughly never able to have a single other muppets. After that. what's that attack? Does the reason why she's not at the top of a ticket today, because she had the most momentum of any candidate in that raises a moment and that my fizzled on her, because she had no follow through. She couldn't say that I support bus. I couldn't say that Joe Biden was raised as there was a moment that was to exist in its own self contained fashion and then a fizzled. Now I but they pull tested that that line. Do I think they pull tested Will you join me in the effort to kick Donald Trump off twitter right now that just felt really good
the disaster. Well, maybe it made her look impotent and foolish and trying to accept Are we have this event on Wednesday? We have, but some he pointed out to me, which I had realized This notion that Trump and you know there won't be any more debates because trumpets, zero, trumpet. camp in the same room is belied by the fact that the debate that inaugurated the modern presidential debate Nixon Kennedy. They were indifferent places which I I've. Actually the weird thing is, I watch that debate may somehow totally Miss that that Nixon was an airway and Johnson was in in D. and by the way Nixon was sick and Dixon had just had surgery because he had been damaged. His leg door
close that his leg and he had had some kind of surgery and he had been in the hospital, which is what explains, which is apparently, what explains his power in his his sweat, the famous sweating ass, a meeting of a shave or whatever that that you here is the reason that he he lost, that that debate final point here since. if we do talk a lot about poles. The poles are really bad for tromp, and the poles are really bad for Trump got worse for Trump after the debate, and we don't really have polling after covet. Yet after the diagnosis of any of any moment,.
So again signs to watch out for in the next two weeks, I think, are whether the democratic senators were running and are. Apparently, seeing some degradation in their own position because of degradation. The presents position which suggests a wave is forming in that they are there's a national problem facing Republicans in general. We will if they start trying to figure out how to go their own way or openly criticised the president, or do something like that. That will be a marker to watch for as to whether or not the election is out of trumps grasp. I think, can they do that because then, of course, they risk losing their own based vote at oh? No! No! What do you think.
Yeah, I don't know about answer, I don't know, I can't I don't the impression that you know what happened. The same. Basing its Wall Street Journal pulse came out over the weekend, showed a fourteen point gap in favour. The president, everything moving around favor of Joe Biden, everything moving in the wrong direction, Trump under forty percent. We had a fourteen point gap pole in October of twenty sixteen to and look what happened. Plenty of events yet to play out and there are there will be the stability of the race has been predicated on the present losing ground with a lot of the constituencies that he could pretty much rely on and twenty sixteen not just the way glass for that we note that the populist wing of the party thinks the future of the GNP is predicated on but seniors,
losing ground was seniors in the tent in the double digits and that's jerky, bread and butter right there you lose that you be lost, not just the presidency button and the. The GEO Peace political base- and I don't see that moving it did- was maybe with a blip over the summer. But it's not now it's a trend, and I don't see that changing anytime soon, so yeah
the other interesting thing about that Paul. Other lotta people objected to was the NBC News was John Paul. Is it it's a pole of registered voters rather than likely voters and the whole idea? Is that likely vote at this point? You should only be web appalling, likely voters, and when you pull registered voters or adults, those pulse will tend to skew democratic and so therefore, its they're doing it to get this more dramatic resolved at it's not right in the end, be see, news was journal. Pollsters explain that in their view, because interest in the election is so high and because they are and tissue painting record turn out the distinction that is
usually drawn between registered voters. Unlikely voters is beginning to disappear if not disappearing entirely, and that by screening for likely voters you might be missing the larger component of the election because you are, you are limiting the voter, pull that you were asking about rather than broadening at an because they, so they are seeing every piece of day. We have suggests record turn out. Return would be somewhere between a hundred and forty and one hundred and fifty million, and I think it's fair and that there is one theory of the great race that says that record turn out will help trump because he will have
old, all kinds of people who have never before to the polls in this. It's not a shy tory effect, it's a new voter on voter effect and they will make the difference in the three states in particular, but they are kind of India the ball to pollsters and the other is that that what we're gonna see is just a democratic tsunami. That, though, that the out the effect is the sixty two million Democratic voted in twenty eighteen in the largest turn out in mid term modern, mid term history adding another ten twelve million people to that? And then it's just you know they just go and get other just go out to party. We should emphasise that point. First, NBC Walter Journals, not alone in this assessment universities when putting out a lot of these like weird models that, Besides high turnout at low turn out and in a way
screen the nun screen because nobody really knows, which is you know it's good to emphasise what you dont now and provide a lot of options in the event that things don't pan out the way you're predictions pan out, because we are really no second, as you say, you know it theory of the cases that there's a lot of voters out there who don't respond, upholstery we're gonna, show up at the polls and they're gonna deliver an outcome that the poles are looking for. You should want the losers possible screen right because that'll capture, the voter that you think is out there that otherwise, Isn't he doesn't want to risk and maybe or is saying of the voter without any voting history, so they wouldn't make it through a likely loader screen and that's it. I think that the people who say the poles are all wrong: trumpets, gonna, win keep their case on right and, if that's not, that's on happening than what else is your case anyway,
in our part of the problem here, as we have, I think, we're twenty nine days from the election and their there too, and only two possibilities, one stability, is that the election has already been one by one or the other and they Biden having won the election is visible and obvious through the poles and Trump having won the election is, by definition, invisible to the poles, because it will involve something new and stark and historic and an end game changing in turn of having awakened the sleeping giant and the other is that unforeseeable events are gonna take place. That will mean that will mean that something may happen different or based shake up. The results of the race If that were the case, though, that can really only or in other words at the races, far closer, and then it's a jump
either way and that events in the next four weeks on one day will will tell. Of course, you know how many votes are gonna be cast by. Let's say two weeks from from today: in the early voting halving the number is already close to four million, which, of course, if a hundred and fifty million people vote is a pretty small number right. It's like three percent or some like a four percent mono, see how good I am at math is actually hot headed. anyway, but you don't assume that that those those gonna break either way. I'm not gonna, I have to say, like of twenty five. Thirty million people vote, let's say by the by the middle of October, and something happens at the end of August were to sorry. You know it's like this right now,
so are we gonna actually have a serious discussion about early voting when four million people voted before they found after the president had covered? We shouldn't be voting now, the hell with you, people with you're destruction of election day like today we shouldn't be voting. I just got my mail and valid actually, and I had an interesting discussions by kids because there are like will what're you gonna do because what if he dies, inverted cast your vote or one of this, or that? Where that it's just like that. The is even to children, clear about Earl, evoking in and it is something we should talk about. And being does the convenience, outweigh the potential costs too. A truly informed electorate, Cassius vote on election day. I would much rather we just make election day a national holiday so that people can discover vote on that, but or I mean if we are serious about this and they then have a serious discussion with account
just remember that makes election day to day event or something like that, like you, that that you could do and then you really don't have an excuse, you of forty eight hours, not twenty or whatever you even after twenty four hours, because you know like New York state. The poles were from six a m to nine p m. So that's fifteen hours about what have you made it for eight hours and appallingly remained open all night, and all that you know you could you can we can have a serious discussion of whether or not the polling system as it stands it, particularly in a presidential election year, Camping will not be overwhelmed by the sheer numbers of people who now vote in the United States others have made of justice god. If you made of forty eight hours than people are treated as many vacation item not unknown over, they would have to write put it. You have to put in the air in the
what did you get here? How can I get around all planes anyway, either button, so there we go. Okay well, well, will have more to say tomorrow, Sulphur Christine, maybe no jump upwards, keep the cavalry
Transcript generated on 2020-11-05.