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Returns from Alcatraz on a mission to reclaim Harlem and the american dream by any means necessary Godfather of Harlem airing Sundays, only on epics get the channel or get the app. When was the this time that you heard the term stock home syndrome. It was this a sack if that got wrist, who is dead now, but he also strange guy. The term stock home syndrome was coined by psychiat. Niels Barrow. It became well known in one thousand nine hundred and seventy four. When newspaper heiress, Patty Hearst was kidding, but the Symbionese Liberation Army and instead of wanting to be rescued, she teamed up with the people who kidnapped her and began to help them rob banks, but that's where we get the term Stockholm syndrome.

One summer in one thousand, nine hundred and seventy three two men robbed a bank in Stockholm. They held four people hostage for six days. The bank robbers had met one another in prison. Their names were Jan Erik, Olson and Clark all listen, here's Clark, the main thing was: take it easy we going to, nobody is going to get killed because I was a good guy and the police what's a bad guy. This is the beginning of the Stockholm syndrome. By the time the two men met in prison, Clark robbed. A lot of banks he'd been to prison. Any time Clark became known all over Sweden when of Robbery went wrong and uh friend, shot and killed the policeman. He become a kind celebrity Bank robber clerk was twenty six John was thirty two, so you met I'm in prison. What did you think of him when you met him? I thought he was an idiot.

He was a useful idiot and he was a chicken thief. They call him small Guy Clark The young one wanted to hear all about how to rob a bank step by step, He was so interested in how to make it how to make bad. Service? How to do this and that so tended to have like a fairy tale Every evening before he went to sleep wanted to hear. Over and over again, it was taken. Hold she's in the bank and blah blah blah blah, I had I never thought that it should happen, but when it happened, I knew immediately. It was him on August 23rd, one thousand nine hundred and seventy three Clark was still prison. He'd been moved to solitary confinement, Yon had escaped you put on a wig and fake glasses walked into a bank in Stockholm. I himself and pulled out a machine gun and shot

the ceiling in a fake american accent. He said the party has just begun and proceeded to take three bank employees all women hostage. This is the bank in stock, on where the robber has barricaded himself, his equipped with a machine gun. And he has several people as ransom in there he has. I'm ready should be one policeman in the hands of all the policemen. Try to overtake him and the other ones had to escape and run for cover. As is done, nobody has really been able to see him. They have policemen in the localities. And they are trying to get hold so shoot at him. A bank employee later said. I believed I was seeing something could only happen in America. Jan made three demands.

He wanted seven hundred thousand dollars and a quote fast car. He also wanted Clark Olofsson to be released from prison and driven to the bank, where Jan was holding the hostages. So when did you hear about it? When is the Minister of Justice called me in the present What did he say? He said very soon. One man in stock on in a bank is dot com who demands you to be transported to him. What do you say? I said yes, of course, I come immediately. You knew exactly who was in that bank calling for you yeah? Did you want to go yeah? Of course I was in isolation. I was in deep shit, so everything anything else was there, so He his he's was get me to the bank. Then he

you can relax. I will fix it of all the people we've talked to on this show, I think, Clark, all of might have surprised us the most we surprised. He agreed to the interview. We were surprised but the things he said he's call one hundred and in a way, that's hard to make sense if but given what he did. Maybe we should have and surprised, I'm, Phoebe judge. This is criminal how did you get from the prison to the bank? this is called all the, but the police were instructed not to take Clark inside the bank just to bring so that young could see he was there.

The Minister of Justice absolutely forbid them to bring me inside the bank only to the bank. And use me as a bargaining chip, but you know the communication. On the policeman inside the bank was so bad. So When I came down the stairs one policeman thought I should never be able to go in the other one. He was sure as going so I jumped so. I jumped over them why did you want to get in that bank I know the sweetest system under the swedish mentality and one thousand nine hundred and seventy it was a very soft nice human country should never shoot any sausages. They should never shoot even a bank robber, one thousand nine hundred and seventy three. It was that situation and that I was playing along with so I jumped over them. When Clark got inside the bank. He saw that Jan had taken three hostages.

Divide them up? I not called the situation immediately. I was joking with them untier somebody make orders kick out of the police in the back and then start to negotiate with a terrified. What what did they look like I came. They were terrified after five minutes they were cool. I said: hey taking Jesse, see we're going to fix this. He was calling average everything down. He said you can't Have the girls tied up like this tie them loose Kristen and Mark was one of the hostages. She was twenty sold at the time. Here's what you told the pod test memory motel in two thousand, and sixteen, I think, me and and on the on the very really glad that you came becauses, situation, became totally different in her memoir.

Isn't translated into English. Kristen and Mark describes Clark. For the first time she says he was quote a mix between shake with Var and Jesus. She was very sweet She was looking anxiously and when I came- and she looks very great food when I cuts her ropes and everything, and then he became very very near she she was, she was very play sweet girls. She was twenty three years old and I like girls. Was she scared of you at first just confirmed everything, but the after one minute she felt She still thinks that I saved your life, listen writes in her book. He talked to us fix things. After untying the hostages, one of the first things Clark says he did was

walk around the main banking floor to make sure that no police had gotten inside. He didn't find any police, but he did find a bank employee hiding in a closet. His name was fenced off strim and he became their fourth hostage. Meanwhile the entire country was watching. It was Sweden's first televised crime and was being broadcast all over the country. They called it. The bank drama so Citizens called the police to offer suggestions the elderly women, who suggested things like a con sort of religious songs to soften the bank, robbers resolve someone suggested pudding bees inside bank sending them in through the air vents so that everyone would to come running outside a third caller proposed, putting soap all over the bank floor. So the robbers would say

Yep fall and be easily arrested. The hostages had asked to make phone calls to their families. They asked for Tampons Clark made these things, part of the negotiation. So I every time police did something. As I look, the best is what they do against you. I going take. So you know the sympathy came slowly. Over from my side, see you were able to take the small little things at the police, weren't doing and say: hey, I'm going to get this. For you sure this was the plan. And they had no interest to talk to the d hostage and to be nice to them or to comfort them. We did. I did Clark. Anyon took the hostages into the bank's small window. Lists of all the vote. Ceilings were low, one of the hostages who was with all

Quinn was feeling claustrophobic, Jan tighter rope around her neck and let her step outside of the vault to get some air. They divided up food equally placing pairs to make sure there was enough for everyone. Christen said You set up her bed next to the door to be near Clark you in this situation and then cancer man who says you can sit here with find me I'm going to protect you and Dan well. This now seem to loose. I can't say that that's felt safe because that's not the word, but he meant pretty much me- and I explain to this system the mentality in sweden- how the police are thinking, how the politicians absolutely them, how they were thinking. These conversations meant a lot to Kristin. She felt like Clark cared about her and that the police x and the swedish politicians were only

focused on arresting Clark and Jan and weren't, worried about the safety of the hostages, I was the one who was the victim and I think they maybe they could listen to what I wanted. The hostages were giving phone interviews to reporters all over the world. Not only say that they were okay, but that they wanted the police to back off. Kristen told the New York Times. Why can't they put boys drive off with us in the car, and I called all new papers old television stations just to be sure that nobody could say we had to because they are dangerous and they are so so so the hostage? is were being quoted in newspapers you they weren't, they were calming, they were letting the public know that they were okay, Okay, even though the only that they said we are not a to look at doing freed of the the robbers we afraid of the police and they believe the

were you manipulating them or did you care about them? I cared about them and I was meeting many of them very much because it will for the sake not for the would just for fun for the sake, and it should be much more safe. If we, what if we are playing for the same, because then you we don't need to to to watch out something they were watching out for themselves, so they were their own gods. Kristen anma spoke to the swedish Prime Minister on the telephone, the top for nearly an hour. It was recorded. She said I think, you're sitting there playing checkers with our lives. I fully trust, Clark in the Robert they haven't done a thing to us but I'm scared of is at the police, will attack and cause us to die.

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simplisafe dot. Com. Slash criminal for their support was super. Critter hiring is simple, fast and smart when cast mail tours Seo Dylan Masko it's needed to hire a director of coffee. He went to zip recruiter, posted his job and fell. Best person for the role in just a few days. Technology finds people with the right experience and invite them to apply to your job four, to five: five to post post on Ziprecruiter, get a quality candidate within first day. Right now you can try Ziprecruiter for free at zip, recruiter, dot com, slash criminal, that super critter dot com, Slash criminal, Ziprecruiter, Smartsuite high. On the morning of the third day, a police officer snuck into the bank.

And shut the vault door, locking John Clark and all of the hostages inside well I remember hearing in there. I know. That door shocked, and then I said: okay, no Rick closed in. We can't get out if the police doesn't open the door, but that's Excuse me, that's when the shit really hit the fan, the police, we're done negotiating no more food or water it began to drill holes into the walls of the vault police to drilling and and genesis and clock to the drilling Becaus. They want to put in gas the drilling was. Day and night, four

I don't know how many hours, how many days and the the line it went out. So it was dark about a sad about one thousand two hundred and thirteen hours, and then I mean dork. You know it was dark. Dark, water used to cool the drills began to flood the vault. They try to drink the water off the floor. Looking back, Kristen writes we retired both mentally and physically. We lifting something you could call the valley of death. The situation had transformed us entirely and then, on the sixth day the police began to pump tear gas into the holes they.

Drill. When that happened, Kristin members, yon telling them to get up, he said get up girls. Then I thought it was going to kill me. I rated it, but to date he said I surrender. And remember shouting his your friend is rendered, because I was so afraid that he would regret that And then the police opened the door and when I look up to see these two guys, looking I Rambo they want us to come out. First, the hostage Jahn said no. He thought that if the hostages left first that the police would kill him, he wanted to leave first with Clark. So he said let the guys, God First Jan and Clark were seen hugging and shaking hands with the hostages, the women kiss them, and then all six people walked out together with Jan and Clark

in front. They were immediately arrested. The hostages were put on stretchers, there's a video of the exit, and you can see Chris sitting upright on a stretcher. Looking around for Clark, she yelled Clark I'll see you again, the hostages spent ten days in the hospital be evaluated by psychiatrists. Young was charged with violent robbery, kidnapping and attempted murder. Clark was charged with violent robbery. He pleaded his own case and argued that he was for first into participating in the whole ordeal first by the police, then by Jan Kristen, refused to testify against Clark. She lied and said she never seemed Clark hold a gun. It was very clear to her that Clark

shouldn't be punished. She wrote had I been able to decide I should have given him a metal. Over the years, she's been both supportive and critical of him. For everything, kind. She writes about him in her book. She also writes his plan was only his and contained only his needs and wishes. The rest of us we're just bricks in his game. Jan was sentenced to ten years in prison. Clark didn't go to prison at all. People have often speculated over the years that the two men had to have planted together, Do you feel bad that he went to prison and you didn't know know know know, know no? No, no! I never feel bad. When I'm not in prison. Wait for us not! You know, I don't feel guilty at all about it because, Try to even to use me then even then

he is a really shitty ass egg list. Money hungry betrayer traitor. A year after the robbery John told the new Yorker quote, I had lives for assets What could be more valuable after he released from prison. Jan moved to Thailand and married a woman with whom would become pen pals while he was in prison Clark back to prison many times. Since one thousand nine hundred and seventy three he was just least again a few months before he spoke with him for involvement. Drug smuggling Friendly relationship between Clark and Jan in the hostages was confusing to psychiatrists in the days after they were released. They continue to speak highly of the two men who kidnapped them. Hillsboro said there

the song hi chaos. He can up with the term Stockholm Syndrome to describe some kind of unconscious to fence mechanism that bonds ha stitches to their captors is popular as the term is there still isn't much academic research on it. Some researchers have in an urban myth, Did you hear the word stock com syndrome? What do you think I left every time but- and you hear it so often- I was in Antiga my boat and met. An American there? We had some drinks, we were living in my boat for a week and it happens. His mother in Texas. What's a what's, it was one of the best experts. Don't focus it on sees when she he called her. She got crazy. She wanted to come. Then I had to leave you know, but if the people a psychiatrist in cycle of state use that

term in so many ways it was not meant and it is not, but it it's a it's a you know, it's a combination of everything in it, but it. But if you say, stock awesome, everybody knows what it is about. The hostages or connected or type will there with a rubber, and in this case Kristen in particular, did have a connection with Clark in her book. She says it's important: people know she didn't fall in love with him in the vault in the vault. She says she liked him. She trusted him and then later she writes something more. Develop between them. You had a relationship with her that was more than friends much. We had fun like him. Did you kiss her when you were in the vault? No, no, no, absolutely not, but

I said to her: hey. We take all that afterwards, it all happened after so she know what I meant and that we did. Clark and Kristen are still in touch there. Just friends. Now he calls her kiki over the years Kristen has been vocal about her frustration with journalists and take Diatrice, who presenter is too traumatized to recognize what happened to her. She sick of the term Stock Home Syndrome Syndrome is a condition of illness. She said I became stamped his ill and thus not credible. She isn't the only one who felt a connection their captors Elizabeth Old, grin accused the doctors of trying to brainwash away her regard for Jan and Clark Sven later said when Jan treated us well, we could think of him as an emergency god. The fourth has to

Birgitta Lund was the first to visit Clark in prison. What is it about? You? Do you think that makes women and makes people go to your side not be afraid of you minute, Norman NICE Guy. I if a nice guy, even if you're, holding a gun even then even then you know, I have rob banks. Half of the bank in personnel, don't even know what that something happens. I want for anyone's ever said, hey hold on stop telling everyone else. For the bad guy you're, the bad guy. No, no. I never heard one. I never heard a person say one bad word in my ears in all my life

what the judges say to you now when you get in trouble, they don't like me. This is the only place is one of the few places I should not be in because they think I'm an arrogant son of a with a bad attitude and he doesn't care that's what I know they think and we will teach him a lesson and that they do are american son of a yeah. People recognize you now yeah and they like me, and it always ends with almost kissing handshakes and, and they start now they start out my father. He was, They are in there when you wrote that to that bank in the, but he tried to take you and all kinds of stories. Everybody has a story and you want so tourists viewing the old bank come. He once saw a group of tourists viewing guys that did that

what did you do? I heard he was telling the story of what happened inside the bank and I went into the group. It was about two thousand and thirty Americans and I sort of say, hey, no, no, no! No! No! This is not what happened. He thought that was an idiot normal, not a guy. From not but the the group, a big some of the people in the group, they started to believe understand so they Google web, when they were standing there. And in the end you know he understood it was me and he was He I I even let him talk to two Kiki, the hostage in the telephone he his day was done. I promise you looking back on it all now. Clark told us He was never nervous in that bank. He says he always knew that it would all work out. He said it was a joyful period. I had fun

Criminalist by Lawrencepur, and me. Media Wilson our senior producer, audio mix by Rob, Byers, special thanks to is Mickey of the memory motel podcast for allowing Just excerpts of his two thousand and sixteen conversation with Kristen and we have a link to their full episode in the show, notes and he's got a new podcast called self help check it out it's also to Susanna Roberson Matilda Felino, an album mogensen Julian Alexander Creek, original illustrations for each episode of criminal. You can see them at this is criminal dot com, we're on Facebook and twitter at criminal show,

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