Hello, I'm Christi Young and this is a podcast from the Desert Island Discs Archive. Reasons we've had to shorten the music. The programme was originally broadcast in 1987 and the presenter was Michael Parkinson. To list the shows our castaways appeared in is to catalog the great Western musical hits of the past 20 years. She made her debut in the chorus of Hair, followed it with Jesus Christ Superstar, and played her first leading role in Grease. She scored a great personal success in Billy, opposite Michael Crawford. Followed this with the role that made her an international star, Eva Perron in Evita. Then came Cats, followed by the lead in the current hit musical, Chess, and she is Elaine Page.

I said in the introduction there, I mean all those are parts that any other actress would die for has it been Got good management you think? I think I have to say luck probably. And a lot of hard work and just a matter of persevering really because very early on in my career I found that I would go up for auditions and I always managed somehow or other to get down to the last two or three. I would then get the big elbow and somehow didn't seem to quite get... Job. I mean a lot of those that you've mentioned, the early ones anyway, were very much chorus. Yes, but nonetheless you're in them and nonetheless they had a significant part in the development of musical theatre in this country. Oh absolutely, yes, you can't start at the top, I mean you've got to... Learn and that's how I learnt really through being in the shows rather than at drama.

Although I was at drama school for three years. Well, let's go through your history in a moment. First of all, let me ask you, how do you think you'd react to this new role? which is living on a desert island. Are you going to be any good at it, do you think? Well, I don't know. I've kind of been thinking about it and uh... Like to be alone quite a lot so I think in that sense I'd be alright. I don't know for how long though, I mean it's all very well to say that but... We live in an age where one can pick up the phone and go and see some friends or whatever. I think in that sense I might quite like it. I'm a fairly practical kind of person, so I... I would quite like the idea of trying to, I don't know, build myself somewhere to live. Yes, exactly. So, I don't know, yes I think I might be quite good at it. And what about the music that you've chosen to accompany on this island? Are they all memories or...? Yes, memories from different, various times in my life, yes.

What about the first choice then? What's that a memory of? Well, the Hallelujah Chorus reminds me of my school days, and in fact it was... The first ever public performance that I gave with Southore Girls. Choir and it reminds me of music lessons whereby every... We had music lessons we were to go in and we'd have to learn several more bars of this what I consider to be quite a difficult piece and it just remained It's the one and only time also that I've ever sung with a lot of voices. And there's something quite gratifying about being... Able to learn your own harmony line, your own part, and hold your own when all around you is singing something totally different. It reminds me of those days.

The chorus by Handel, performed by the Choir of Christ Church Cathedral, Oxford, and the Academy of Ancient Music. Elaine Page, what kind of background did you come from? What did your parents do? Was there any showbiz in the family? Well, only in an amateur way, really. My father, still. Drums and my mother has sung. They both were involved in concert party during the war. There's theatre and music in the family, but by profession my father was an estate agent and my mother is a milliner. Where do you get your ambitions from then? Because I, one assumes looking at your career that you had an ambition from a very early age to... Well I don't know that I did really, I mean it was something that, uh... Family and I both together seemed to discover really. No, it wasn't an ambition that I had very early on. In fact, one ambition. I wanted to be a tennis player, that's what I remember quite clearly. And of course the headmistress, my...

That's hopeless, Elaine, because you're far too small, you can't see over the net. And she was actually absolutely quite right about that, but I didn't see why that should stop me being a great tennis player, but still, um... So how did stage school come into it then? Well, it was really from my... Secondary school, Southall. My music teacher would get us to perform Hallelujah chorus or we did a potted version of Mozart magic flute. I think it really came from that really, from just doing these end of term plays and musical recitals and so on, like any school child does I suppose. But I seem to remember... Wanting to do that far more than the academic studies that one was required to do at school and so I would make up all kinds of reasons. To get out of the class that I should be in, to go and, you know, sit at the piano in the assembly hall and, uh, rehearse. Another choice of record, please, Elaine.

Well, this one is a song from West Side Story, which I suppose was... My first introduction to musical theatre. It's one of those musicals where all the elements seem to come together perfectly well. The story, the music, the lyrics, the style of the piece. And so I've chosen Barbara Streisand to sing her version of Something's Coming. coming from West Side Story sung by Barbara Streisand. Elaine...

I suppose it was from, was it, from stage school that you went for your very first audition? Oh yes. And how old were you then? I should think sixteen. I hadn't been there very long, in fact, only a matter of months when I went for my first audition. I will remember that till my dying day. Why is that? Well, I'd... I sent this song I'm Just a Girl Who Can't Say No and I thought I knew the lyric perfectly well and I got to the audition and... They called my name and that was a whole hoo-ha. They tried to spell my name and explain who I was. - We shouldn't say here because your name wasn't paid at that time, right? - No, my real name is Bickerstaff and you can see why I changed it. 'Cause every time I went out, we'd go through this rigmarole of spelling it and could you say that again? It got an E on the end. Oh, it was, that used to take up five minutes of their time. And so I. I get to the audition, we go through all that business with a name, and then they ask me what I'm going to sing, and I tell them it's I'm just a girl who can't say no, and I start off...

Well, I remember about the first four lines and then there was this terrible blank in my brain It was like I suddenly didn't have a brain at all and just nothing and I found myself Just kind of going dah di dah di dah la di da and I felt a fool but I didn't stop I just kept on going la di da di da and in the end they said thank you thank you and that was the first time I ever heard that sort of chorus over the from the darkness of the theatre And of course I realised that nerves do very strange things to you and that you have to learn a song after... Learn anything really, really, even more than you think you need to. Another choice of record, please, I think. Well, this one is The Everly Brothers, and it reminds me... I have a time in my life when I suppose I was just becoming aware of pop music really and a girlfriend and I...

I tried to learn this song and again I sang the harmony part and she sang the lead line and we used to bore our friends in our... Parents with our rendition of All I Have to Do is Dream. Anytime, night or day Only trouble is, gee whiz I'm dreaming my life away I need you so That I could die, I love you so And that is why Whenever I want you, all I have to do is dream That was the Everly Brothers and all I have to do is dream. You made your West End debut in 1968 in Hair. What do you remember of that time and of that musical? Were they good days? - Oh, yes, I'd had...

Goes far to say it's probably one of the happiest times in my life. I was young, I was only 18 years old. And a hippie of course. You were a hippie, were you? Yes, very much so, to my mother's disbelief. I look back fondly... At that time because it was a time of sort of freedom and a very positive time for... Young people we all had it was a job to be had we all had money I and as you say I was in my first West And show hair and it was just, I don't know, probably I'm being a bit romantic about it but it was a wonderful time. I remember I lived in a commune in Hampstead, rather up I hastened to add enough penthouse flat actually. And then we all at one point decided that we were going to leave there and go down and live in the country and grow our own vegetables which was quite horrendous, that never worked at all. Wonderful ideals but trying to put it all into practice was really another matter altogether.

But it was a rather silly time too, wasn't it? I always think when I've seen the newsreels of that time, because I lived through it too, essentially silly it was. Yeah, I suppose it was a bit silly. I mean, looking back on it, it seemed silly, but at the time it didn't. At the time... I remember believing in the whole thing very much so, in that love and peace and to treat Fellow man with respect and care and gentleness and kindness and... and all... And everything that went along with it. I think that's admirable. I think it's a shame in a way that there isn't enough of it anymore. But I suppose it was a bit silly, yes, but it was harmless. Another choice of record, please. I couldn't go on a desert island without the Beatles and I've chosen a track from their Abbey Road album which was very much in my life during the summer.

Sixties and my hair days so this is that fantastic track Here Comes the Sun. It's been a long, cold, lonely winter. You little darling, it feels like years since it's been here. Here comes the sun, here comes the sun. I say, it's alright. That was the Beatles and here comes the sun. Elaine, you worked, as I said, for 20 years. Your work's been associated mainly with musicals on the West End stage. You've also done straight acting as well. You in fact worked for a while with Joan Littlewood's Actors Workshop at Stratford East, didn't you? I did. Yes, but I have to say that was primarily in a sort of a review type thing, so it was sort of sketchy.

...scenes from plays and things and singing and so on. In fact it was one of the maddest... ...shows I've ever been involved in. Every night there would be at either side of the Pross Arch... Different running order so it was never the same twice. She would be furious. If you went on and came off the same way. And, you know, she said, I don't care. One night we want to swing in from the-- on a road-- From the box you can do so, but I don't want you to do it the same ever, twice. So it was a great learning time for me because when you work in commercial theatre, obviously one is limited to a certain amount of... To rehearsal and a certain budget and so on and so forth. And over there it was much freer. You were allowed to experiment. More even in front of the poor paying audience. I mean that was what she wanted. She wanted you to do it different every time you performed and so it was a great learning process and

Did you though at any time, you did Hair and of course you did Jesus Christ, a superstar, then you started in Greece and then you went into Billy with Michael Crawford, had tremendous success in all of them. Was there a sense in which you find yourself being typecast? You thought, look, enough is enough of the musical theatre. Very much so. That is the problem that you start to go... From one to the other to the other and of course then you are known only as a musical performer in musical theatre. And of course I did begin my career as a straight actress Birmingham. And so yes, I did very much feel that I wanted to shake that and try and get out of what it felt really like. Rather like being in a rut. But of course, making that choice, I put myself out of work for probably about, I don't know, the longest that I'd ever been out, which was over six months. But again...

And it was through my own choice, so I didn't mind so much, but it was very difficult to try and get my foot back in to the straight side of the profession. And I don't think really I ever achieved it. I mean the doors were beginning to open up of course when Evita came along Oh, it can't be a bad thing to have happened. I couldn't say no to that could I more about it Let's have another choice of record. Well, I wanted to play a piece of... Mozart again, going back to my school days, it was my music teacher that introduced Mozart into my life and I'm very grateful to her for it and over the years I've grown to love listening to Mozart. And indeed I even still try and sing some of it. We used to do potted versions at school of, well, one potted version of the Magic Flute. Occasionally at singing lessons I attempt to sing some Mozart but I don't think this It's the most wonderful aria called Queen of the Night, and I'd never tire of listening to this.

*music* Queen of the Knights Aria from Act 2 of Mozart's The Magic Flute, sung there by Karen Ott, with the Berlin Philharmonic. Orchestra conducted by Herbert von Karajan. Elaine Evita, a huge influence on your life, a turning point, I mean, transformed you into a major international star. How great was For a bit. It was great in that I was told certainly via the press so how true it is I don't know that there's certainly I should think over 400 people were seeing. For the role and then of course the press started saying that such people as Faye Dunaway and Liza Minnelli and they started sort of you know name-dropping every woman who was sort of in her 30s or whatever to play this part. So it was fairly stiff competition.

That's true and I did, I remember four auditions for it and got down to the old four people again. And I thought, Here we go. But, er, this time I was lucky. Do you want it very badly? I mean... - Of course you did, but do you want it from the point of view that you knew that it was your part? - Yes, it was one of those things, to be honest, when my agent first suggested that I auditioned for it, I was reluctant. Because, as I was saying earlier, I was just about to open a few new doors in terms of straight acting. Meant that I would be putting myself right back where I started. But of course once I'd heard the music and read the sort of synopsis... I started to try and research a bit about her. I started to find out about her and Argentina and that whole era. And I became fascinated by the woman.

And once that had happened, yes, then I really wanted it very badly because I felt that I could serve the piece well because there were certain things in terms of my height, which is fairly obvious, was correct for the part, that I also... I felt that this was an opportunity for me to be able to put together. Thing that I had been in a dilemma about which was my acting career and my music and my singing and this was going to be able to afford me to be able to put the two things together. You became of course that classic showbiz phenomena you became the overnight success after being in the business of Years. I think you're good with that. I mean things did change for you didn't they? Well it did yes I mean we do all laugh about that but in truth it was true. That my life changed radically overnight and it was quite difficult to handle really because I was very much on my own. You know, I had an agent and that was about it. I didn't really

Personal manager or accountants or lawyers or anyone really looking after me. It was just me living. Off my own wits along with my agent basically. And of course everybody wanted a part of me. I was offered recording contracts and, you know, adverts to... Advertise this that and the other and doing interviews I could have done interviews every day of the week, I was suddenly thrown into this whole lifestyle that was totally alien to me. And, uh, looking back, I wonder how I got through it without sort of cracking up. Probably help being a bigger stuff. Another choice of records. Well, this is a song from Lena Horne and uh... Somebody that I've only sort of gotten to know about over the last two or three years actually, a friend of mine asked me...

To go and see her at the London Palladium. And I went along really obviously knowing about her, but not knowing a great deal about her work. And she-- Just blew me away, the most amazing live performance. And she just made me feel, oh, I might as well give up because she just has everything. This is a great song that she sang two or three minutes, into the opening of this act that I saw and it's called I've Got A Name. ♪ The pantry line on the wildin' road ♪ *music* I got a name I got a name

That was Lena Horne and I've got a name. Elaine, it must have seemed impossible after Evita to have followed it with an equal success, but in fact you did. I mean, you did Cats. Pure luck, I have to say. After Evita, I was out of work for over a year. I couldn't get arrested. Just nothing. I was offered every musical that I could. Anybody had ever written which were as you rightly say it couldn't better or follow Evita because that was such a stunning piece. And I just wasn't really offered anything that was worthwhile, so I just sat it out and thought, Oh, well, that's it then, you know, I'm... Here we are, start all over again. And then about, I don't know, well over a year after Evita, Cameron Mackintosh rang me up out of the blue and said that Judi Dench had injured herself and, er, Would I consider taking over her role in Cats? I mean, it was pure luck.

Me not so lucky for Judy. And that's how it came about. - And then you followed that, of course, with chess. And when you look back, you know, as I said, you've been associated with this. Very significant chapter in British theatre, which I mean Tim and Andrew Lloyd Webber have contributed to greatly. It must be... It's an extraordinary feeling looking back and thinking that you were there at a time when two writers particularly changed the face of musical theatre. Yes, that's right. I was embarking on my musical career, if you like. Around the time that Andrew and Tim were writing Joseph and Jesus Christ Superstar. And of course musical theatre has changed very much since that period to date in that It is a lot of new stuff anyway that is being written by Tim or Andrew or whoever seems to... Be much more now based on opera in terms that it's nearly all sung as opposed to the old format which was you'd have a

and then a nice song and then another dialogue scene. Yes, I've been very lucky over my career so far in that I've been involved in some very innovative theatre, starting of course with Hair. Very lucky. But what about now? Because you've just lately come out of chess. What are you doing? Resting or what? Well, yes, I'm having a well-earned rest and... Of course there's always lots to do. I'm at the moment trying to find some new material to make a new album and November/December time I'm hoping to go out on tour so I'm putting That together it'll be a new a new concert tour so I'm very busy there's always lots to do another record please Elaine Well, this song is from Paul Simon, someone that I've admired over the years since Bridge Over Trouble. Water really back in the 70s. I just like this song. It's a great album and I play it all the time in the car, very loudly. And this is one of my favorite tracks from the album. It's called Diamonds on the soles of her shoes.

Paul Simon and diamonds on the soles of her shoes. Elaine Paige, what about... What about the future though? I mean you're gonna make the record as you say and you're gonna tour. But what about Broadway? You must have that in your sights as well. It's something you've not done, isn't it? That's correct. It's still... To be achieved. Yes, I would like to work there very much. It's always fun performing To audiences other than the British because their reactions are very different and it's just good fun. I want to make sure that it's the right piece of work that I do. It'll be with chess, who knows. They say it's going to... We'll be going in January next year, but it's still quite a way off, so it really depends on what happens.

Happens between now and then. And what about the acting as opposed to the singing? I mean are you still that ambition as well? Absolutely that's something very much that I still keep telling everyone I want to do. Nobody takes the blind bit of notice, so I think that it's probably one of those things I should probably have to Something myself and then take it to my agent and say, Now listen, this is what I want to do. Let's do it. I think at the end of the day, that's probably what happened. Is going to happen. back on this on this career you've had with so many highs, so many Wonderful opening nights and occasions when you've been with a successful show. Can you just pick out, is there one moment, one opening night perhaps, that you'll remember Well, it has to be Evita, really, because that was so extraordinary. And it was the first time. So that will always remain in my memory as the special night.

My father always used to say to me, You know, you'll get there, you've just got to... You know, because I always wanted to moan about always being the third or fourth in the auditions and then... The elbow and he used to say to me oh you'll get there you've just got to persevere perseverance furthers and all this and Evita sort of became a family joke in that I was getting closer and closer and I said you know... I'm not going to make it down, I'm just not going to get there. So it meant a great deal for them as well because they had sort of seen... Me through all these hard, what, 12 years prior of struggle. No, I'll never forget that. David Land, the producer, made me a 45 record of the applause on the... First night and it goes on for something like, oh I think it's about nine minutes long and all it is, he sent me this record and I thought what's this and all it is is people clapping. And on the label it's Evita first night applause. So that's something that will remain in my memory forever probably I'm sure. Final choice of record please.

Another ambition of mine is to sing opera, which I'm sure I will never achieve, singing lessons only, possibly, but this is a wonderful... Of music from Madame Butterfly and it's the aria One Fine Day sung by the most wonderful voice ever, Marella Freini.

That was one fine day from Puccini's Madam Butterfly sung by Mirella Frenny with the Philharmonic Orchestra conducted by Herbert von Karajan. Elaine Page, you're now on this desert island with your eight records. You have to imagine now that a wave comes along and seven are swept away. You're left with one record. Which would you choose to pursue? Well, I think it's going to have to be the silly time. I think it's going to have to be Here Comes the Sun, cos that... Reminds me of, as I said, a very happy time in my life, so that's the one I've decided to keep. You can assume that you've got the works of Shakespeare and you've got the Bible with you. Well, I don't know if it's allowed, but I'll try it on anyway, to take the complete works of Charles Dickens. I've read quite a few of his, er... Stories and they're just such wonderful stories. I love the way he uses language, the way we don't speak today. Also...

It's rather long, thick books and as I'm a particularly slow reader, I should think that would keep me amused for some time. So all the books of Dickens in one volume? Yes, please. Okay, and then the luxury object in anime? I've chosen a piano because I've been promising myself for some time now that I will learn to play the piano and being in the That I am and having the lifestyle that I do, there isn't always a lot of time to devote to... Having piano lessons and, more important, practicing the damn thing. One's always having to rush off here, there and everywhere, so I thought, well if I was stuck on a desert island at least I could, uh... Have all the time in the world to practice the piano without annoying anybody. And I think that equally would keep me going.

Amused linden page thank you very much indeed you've been listening to a podcast from the desert islanders for more please visit bbc dot com dot u_k_ slash

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