Hear S6 co-host Titi and Cole in conversation about their experience traveling together to the Louisiana sugar plantations seen throughout the visuals of Lemonade. We’ll also learn more about Titi, her educational background, and both Cole and Titi’s history with Beyoncé’s music.
Listen to Titi’s podcast Dope Labs: https://open.spotify.com/show/3pCF6hcNsAHKlKAillCOuZ?si=DZ-hYwjPQ0OS5oW39bjODQ.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
From Spotify Studios, this is dissect long for
physical analysis broken into short digestible episodes. I'm cool, commissioner, and
this idea, I walk into a special episode of the dissect broadcast
here in New Orleans, with the co host of season, six of dissect TT showed their identity
you a little we're just talking my voice. A little strange. We went unto her dinner last night that flow allowed really busy. So
they are no less how old we are as they were. Our voices are tired from just having a dinner, not Marty. Morally accidentally talking of
so we get into. Why were here in New Orleans magnetic needle
your I live here, but we ve kind of travelled here to meet together and kind
lemonade and beyond, say bring us together in that respect, but yeah,
just wanted to do a more of a conversational podcast with you to kind of introduce you to the audience of dissect. By this point, they've heard you on a probably a few episodes. We haven't launched this season as a recording this, but yeah likely. I've heard you a couple episodes now
and that's all great, but also wanted it kind of showcase who you are a little bit more, so people can really get to
you beyond just your voice on the podcast yellow, yes, we're gonna cut
just talk over who you are in your background, how we met them, talk a little
more generally, about Bianca
We'll get into. Why were here in New Orleans and kind of describe our experience in what we ve been doing the last couple days.
say. I'll just talk to you, I guess to disable
so you are give us a little bit about your background, because I think most people are going to really be familiar with cut your extensive background,
no DR go over how we met, but yet so tell us a little about yourself. Ok! Well, I'm tt showed the idea, and I am first generation African American. My parents are from West Africa mothers from Ghana, my father, some Nigeria. Ah my
educational background is that I got a bachelors and material science and engineering and minor in mathematics for pension.
And then I went onto grad school, where I got a phd in a mechanical engineering, a material science and also a masters in electrical income
Peter Engineering, ok, ok!
So I so item
Any other of that means there's a little bit a context of our kind of what that means. Like material signs against producers, specialities
What's that yeah detail, so
growing up. I always that I wanted to be a chemists, because I was really interested in like the composition of things, but I think material sign
it takes a kind of a step further into practical applications of chemistry so like. If you think of
really anything that you interact with their
probably a material scientist, I was involved in it. So even something like these microphones that we're talking into there is proper
We and acoustics engineer that worked on it, but a materials engineer would probably design like kind of like the metal grating and what its Meda to make sure that it works optimally arm. I worked with nanomaterials, so you can eat you, don't find a lot of nanomaterials now a lot of things, but in everyday things you can find it in lotion and me
up and things like that and choosing the correct materials so that things work at their at the highest level, for whatever application that you are using it for you. So I even things like
keep out how its woven together in the material that they use so that, if you are in an accident, doesn't just like snapper break it stays like together. Those are materials. Engineering deletes the oddest. If you'd, like people like me, would probably never think about, but I guess I would imagine your view of the world
what is much different than mine or most people is cuz. You're kind of I would assume like your kind of yeah. You take a different perspective, I'm like what
equally is throwing out the way I listen to music is aware there like objects and stuff, absolutely like, wouldn't even in our short conversations that we have about music. Like oh wow leg. You are definitely a scientist when it comes to that and an engineer when it comes to that, because I mean you think of it on level set out, never thought of it
yeah and those kind of interesting thing about
kind of why I want to work with you like. I really like that different perspective, like we're gonna talk about yesterday
like for me dissect as an approach? It's like it's specifically approach to music, but the dissect process is really a universal process of like here's. This one thing and let's like really dig into it by flip,
Go back. Two layers looks like find the materials you know that are making up this piece that we kind of know someone like you just kind of it will it will listen to and enjoy.
at. If someone like me is able to come, decomposed lyrics and tell people why you enjoy it wise reasonings of much years. Is that the specific technique
that was really interested in like trying you Nike.
you could have got another musician to work with on dissect, but that doesn't really interest makers. I wanted the kind of the type dynamic and diverse perspective even outside the gender and the racial stuff. It was like more about
now, you know just really adjusting to meet us to have also dislikes more scientific approach to two. Yes, so we can talk a little
about how we member, maybe let's talk about your pod cast first. So really I found you in the beginning. Was your great pod costs called dope? Lubs? Yes, dope lives is pike ass. It I have with one of my best friends or name as a key lightly.
We met when we were in grad school when we were both struggling, and
although our friendship, definitely brought us a lot of joy and
We had a lot of fun in one of the things that we really love doing was explaining our research to each other, because she has a phd in genetics, which I know nothing about like the biological sciences
and she doesn't really know much about engineering, and so we loved,
talking to each other about our work, and then we also of talking to people like at the bar about our work and when we would go out
We would find that people when they found out that we were Phd students that they really wanted to ask a lot of the questions that they have
by what felt like their whole lives that did they didn't get answers for, and they would ask questions. I think you know what is buoyant.
The anomaly get bad way and things like that, your man
we could talk about, and we would find like really
on ways to take sometimes very complex. Scientific idea
and communicated to them in a way that they can understand, and so
at one point. We said all you know we should this. We could do a you know. This was before you know all the pact, as you have everything you say they wanted a party azure.
Then we ended up applying for sound up, which is a Spotify Sponsor programme and eighteen thousand people applied. We were chosen
I listen, then we were one of the three one as at the end, so we got some money to start and then Dope labs was born
I think that's another thing that interest me too is like think that is the kind of a kindred spirits in terms of like what dope labs
is doing and what dissect is doing, which is essentially the same thing taking you gotTA taking scientific topics, finding a common entry point, usually pop culture reference to like get into this
new educational aspect of the show, but doing it in a way that applies to everyone that everyone can understand me like. That's really what I'm trying to do it. I sectors like here's, music, that
lovely to all the time. Here's why you love it. Here's a technical here, some of the technical things of why you love it and how all these pieces centrally fit together to create this.
larger thing. So I think that was also another kind of reason. Like you have to be honest, I don't
really know. The moment like when I thought,
because, as you looking for someone to bring in a new, I wonder,
how's the season. It was kind of just the next step continent.
Evolution of the show like last season, we had Femi as the corridor with did amazing job, and I thought
how to do something similar for this season. I love what family brought to the table, but I also wanted to take that a step further and get another voice on the show and lemonade as we're going to talk about is so obviously
who did an experience. That is not mine that I thought is equally important to get another voice on the show specifically for the season.
See I was like. I was trying to think about like the moment that I thought of you, but
really. Well, I guess we we met first, so I listen to dope labs since the first episode really- and I was always a fan-
love that as with spot, if I get also Spotify,
not to me pretty briefly, but we met in or was it
palm spring on spanish react spot if I had like. Oh that's what they call it an officer. Yes, there's like this kind of meeting
central meaning place where a lot of the employees and our department came in and did some active
these and you guys Dope labs was a unique here, were like the featured
speakers Yemen out of an anti. I hear you're so as it goes
they're here, like a definite got, introduce myself. So I introduce myself at lunch briefly, and then you said that you had listened to dissect before so that was cool.
Yeah then like making it seem like I was cool about it, I'm out of such a vague, the others
you're wearing dissect adder, remember given out Dyson as but BS
when I was like kind of
and around four brief pupil to bring in the city,
thought of yours, like so perfect
Can I didn't really know why? But like I just knew it was gonna work, and I think we can talk about this yesterday, but
when you listen to someone's podcast, like the kind of feel like you
show them a little bit. I've been listening to you guys for so long that I just kind of like trusses
from the get go, and I got a new your approach in your tone and and everything like that, so
Yeah. That's really! Why reached out and unlike that's why, how fast forward a few months and that's how we are here, but I am so ya, think
we're gonna go in to get it to be answered
little bit. I want to start with them, just like your relationship with beyond, say like one
start listening to her. What you're kind of general thoughts are about her and her kind of evolution over the years. That kind of thing yeah, I mean, I think,
maybe answer as someone who I do
even remember life without beyond saying it's hard to, even by conceptualize that there was a time in my life that beyond say was not out and making music. I feel like she's been ever present. Omber destinies child was like huge fur for me, and my sisters and my friend group growing up, because you know there are black
female group and they were really kind of like breaking a lotta barriers. It felt like they were not just doing armed.
They were also doing. There are also being featured with wrapper as things like that, and they were just taking performing two annexed to the next level, where I think, prior to
two destinies child a lot of black female groups. They were really dancing and singing, but they took like performance to like a neck. The next level, which I really enjoyed,
when beyond say split off from destinies child. It didn't even feel like a break up like some man's. If you feel like it's, it's like awful, I feel I everybody knew that beyond say would eventually branch off, but I don't think anybody could have
anticipated that beyond say would have become b. I like oh, she is now our beyond say it's like. No one can name their job here
over and then it's o her first and I give you name. It shall be made up of both came that match out would probably not live up to that new and that's gonna be sad on its eye. Naming your child Madonna something around like she's an icon and I feel like every alum that comes out. I'm never disappointed and there's always so much range and you could see like her growing eat with each stage idea of her life from going from being
teenager to being a woman being a married woman and having children like she incorporates every stage of her life into her music, like there's, no huge disconnect that you can see what it with some artists, where they have different stages of their life, but they have people that are riding their music for them, and so they just sing the lyrics that are they are but Beyonce. I think she makes a very conscious effort to show the progression and her music music, even like you know when she got married.
Became like Don T talk more about like her sexuality and things like that in them. That's not really cool to see ya, think that slick
I mean, I would say, a similar experience, but I've listened to destinies child. I used to like this kind of always guilty pleasure mine, even like a rumour that song was. That was the theme
It's not know about me ass. We had Sancho irreplaceable. I never had this s with her veil. I added I carry over the year that came out, but it was known as one of my most played songs
I think I know for sure that here and it was such a contrast from everything else I listen to- but I
like soldier, I love that the songs like I just it was even those
a bit outside of what I normally listen to for whatever reason I just really gravitated towards her, but I will say that I was like a super fast at all:
not really until, like, I guess, the self like forest
of title lemonade, really kind of
sealed it for me outset lemonade specifically because for me like, I always try to lie just naturally guess, like the people, from like historical perspective and beyond, say has used up. I want to know
call it a formula but socially every artist. I really really admire. Do the same thing. They get incredibly popular with more traditional pop music of this that era and then one state they have a massive following. They flip it and they used their their voice,
in their platform, to expand on the genre to innovate, to express things that haven't been expressed in that style before, like Bob Dylan did the same thing, he got popular with folk music, they turn to electric, and I was a big controversy at the time, but it also push boundaries,
that John or music, you say the same thing about the Beatles they came in as centrally boy ban pop music and then flip that right,
you had did the same thing where they had neither the grunge alternative rockers. That then became this real experimental, innovative electronic music so
the answer to me has done that she's, I would say the music has stayed relative,
lease safe or just more- it's not as experimental as people that I just name, but I would say, dislike lemonade
film, for instance, is such an innovation to the gene raw and I really think it's unmatched in contemporary history. All that is in compassed in this film and to me that is like that gets. My ultimate respect is some one that is willing to use their platform, take risks and ultimately, like expand boundaries. Kendrick, MRI is another great example of that
and so that's kind of how I viewed beyond see- that's really. Why was interested in doing lemonade really since it the day premier?
fortunately on Spotify for a few years, so I was like not anyone told me not to do it, but I just didn't think it would make sense for a Spotify podcast to do a to an album. That's not on Spotify. Just logically didn't you know make a lot of sense.
The second came on Spotify. It was the next season,
hands down. It is so easy to choose nowadays
as I done. She has introduced the the surprise album
the measure and now folks think that they can do it. But not everyone can do that because we are less she's been
say so she can say. I'm coming out with an album today and it'll go platinum, but then you know a lot of people who were not beyond say are trying their and is not working.
yeah. She deadly enervated, yeah, and that view lies
I think she saw teams team saw ever saw like it's the way more exciting.
now that information travel so fast, yet like especially with the
rolling out and out for a month, verses, dropping it and getting everyone excited hype, we're just talking about like trying to get new easy this morning they hit can save dig it's like you like sit on
computer like the moment comes out. You try, giddy and like like people, just love the hype and excitement. The rush of the essence
Oh shit, new beyond, say like that's it. So genius said they kind of fear that our yeah I mean this is years ago. Now,
but yes, oh, I don't like it
like. We can talk a little bit
about lemonade. Specifically, I guess I'm interested to hear your kind
First experience with it, if you watched it on HBO that night or if he didn't like what was your first expire
what was that whole lemonade experience like in the beginning when I first came out, so I think I'm strange
when it comes to how our consume music, because I like to wait till stuff dies down there
been so that I am not influenced by you know all the hype around it. So when it came out-
Ok, I know I have to see this year, but I went away a little bit and not be just a part like feel like I'm. A part of the hype
and so I waited in my sisters, I watched and they were just die,
So I think I waited like a couple weeks and even a couple weeks later, it was still like. The biggest thing is on the tip of everybody's tongue, but I watched it and I just thought: oh, my gosh. This is
unlike anything, I've ever seen in my life,
It almost made me feel, like you know, in LA when did Michael Jackson's thoroughly com.
I've born, but the first time I saw thriller,
and how it was kind of like this whole long story. I thought that was so so good and it felt kind of like that where I was like this is. This is something
No one has done before, and it just really shows her not just heard her vocal range and her and her ability to act.
which we know that she can do, but it also showed her vulnerability and it really humanize beyond say for me where, before it was psych biopsies untouchable ceased, not someone that you feel like
you know you can't be around cuz. She seems like a fun person, but it was just like wow Beyonce really went through a lot and she's, just like the rest of us, like she showed a very, very soft and vulnerable side in in lemonade. So I thought it was really special and it is kind of like how your talk about with podcasting, where you just feel like you know the per
and I, like, I know her a lot better after eliminate the those of you know. It's gonna how we touched on in the interests of the season was like and there's Elvis
Your video which, in retrospect a scene
so trivial, because the way that she flipped that narrative and like was like. Oh you guys wanted to be this slave stupid gossip thing like here's, what it acts
Here's what my experience.
was, and I'm gonna share to you in a very powerful expressive way, but also be
supervision or about about it and then make make the people that were really tried. It just kind of spin that gossip wielders like
really insensitive and like just petty you know,
these are a kind of real. I talk a lot about this,
over the years about like having empathy generally speaking, but are a lot of the time. Having empathy for these figures, we kind of put on these pedestals only to kind of like
them fall like we learn how to see as a public we'd like to see the beloved a lift people up, and we equally love like to tear
down to emulate.
The elevator video like Bianti was pretty flawless punch.
tended up until that point kind of I mean like there is here- and there are rumours but like that- really solidified this moment, where
you could deftly see some people trying to like start that spin, wife and like it took her two years to do but like she came and lemonade and dismantled it completely. You know yet it almost made. You fell foolish like if you are trying to become a part of that, like the rumours in trying to make its something way, bigger
when it wise in gossipy young maid. I think all those people look really silly. Yeah of his idea
There like, I would think, are smart
sperience of lemonade is probably a lot different. I would say I lied.
And this is me- I guess, if by two components here one I just look at things.
historically analytically like what does this mean for the music John Resin near those kind of questions, but also like I may well,
mail from the suburbs. So, like my experience of seeing lemonade, I would think as much different than yours
So I'm wondering like what, if you could touch on, maybe that they forget the egg said at the identity aspect of lemonade help your black females are the
of their future throughout the entire thing, obviously, for the majority of the time I just
areas that are really serious about seeing that representation like what you thought about that yeah, I think it was really powerful what she did with the entire while the visuals in lemonade. I think that, of course, it was deliberate, showing black women and pre civil war attire, and you know in slave quarters, and things like that, I think to show the resilience of black women and that too kind of juxtaposed. These really be
for black women in these really beautiful, then there's really beautiful, attire, I'm in front of a slave quarter to kind of show how even
through a lot of pain that they can still survive.
And then just to remind us of where we came from a to b, where we
are now and the effects of slavery on us as a people. I think that she wanted to show that the resilience that we have now in our day to day is something that is not new. It's not something that we are just learning at something that is kind of ingrained in us and in our in our dna and in every fibre of us.
You to persevere and to be strong on an to come out on the other and better than we were before and to pass that strength on generation to generation? Ah, I think that one of the another major thing is black pain and it's how its perceived by white coat
There are like the rest by the rest of the world, because I mean there's been a lot of studies that have come out that have said that from lay people to people in the medical profession, all perceive black people in general to have a higher tolerance for pain that they can endure more and that they think that is just a part of who we are when really it's not a part of who we are it is. It is a product of our exposure to brutality, and I think that that was something that she really China re bright light on where it site. We are not immune to pain. We experienced the same pain that everyone else does, but we have developed ways to get through it, and those are the things that we were taught by. Our mothers are grandmothers, unreal grandmother.
I'm all the way back to our african ancestors that were enslaved and brought to the? U S: yeah yeah. She does in a wave of just thinking about my own experience with the away, that's both specific,
universal, like I've learned so much through this album about other people's experiences, specifically black female, but also just like.
I've, learn more about the history of slavery, the more about you all the things that, if you'd just
We reached a little bit of research on all these allusions throughout the album when you're gonna. This is really a blueprint for an education so, but also like
So that's like on this specific aspect. With the universal aspect like shit,
in such a way that, like the other, is this kind of.
Never saw triumph of the human spirit
almost he now and it's like. Of course we can. We have to give specific about about who it affected
And the types of people are affected, but also like I look at it is like the triumph of the human spirit you know and the resilience of the end. So that's again like one,
the film resonates so much with me on a personal level, because there is all these that the issue is like this. Do our duty,
sperience on the specific and the universal. Does she. I thought she did incredibly well.
next tv- and I talk about her experience visiting the sugar plantations in Louisiana, but first a quick word from our sponsors.
I guess that kind of gets us into like. Why were here in New Orleans as we talk about on the episodes.
Louisiana specifically, as featured I guess, in the majority of the film I dunno percentage, but it's it's pretty much almost all
So we are here too.
specifically, we travelled to the plantations of the
Rosanna. The sugar plantations
that run along the Mississippi River that are featured in
we need. So yesterday we went to the old Valley plantation
does not feature in lemonade film, but it's
then along the same path that all these plantations lay out side by side, basically with each other
I went to the Evergreen Plantation, which is featured in the slave quarters of lemonade. That's where their film
sleep, and then we went to destroy hand plantation, which are where they climbed, where their pictured. In
in the trees. There's some sleep quarters there's! Well, yes,
took some tours. We explored just the sites and
yeah! You like, I guess we can just get into like the experience of it, because we can just just talk generally about
to some of the feelings that you had when we first stepped onto the plantations. I don't think you've had been on a plantation before so just kind of curious about what was kind of going through your mind.
you're walking around yeah was really for me
I really heavy because as a black person, you can't help but think about the hundreds or thousands of people who were enslaved on those plantations and the lives that were lost in the blood that was spilled and the tears at work
and I'm just all of the awful experiences so walking in the slave quarters and is trying to imagine what that life is like work
I'm really sad at some of the places they wore at all. All the way
station I think they try and lists the names of all of the enslaved out over there. I think they try and be their trial. They try to be deliberate about how they refer to the enslaved as the enslaved, because I think now we ve come to this new this new stage. When we talk about the history of slavery in America, where we don't referred to people s slaves, we ve fer to them as the enslaved, so that it puts the it puts. The onus on the the the colonizers adapters area and
which I really appreciated that and that those little things like that. But I think taking the tours all its origin,
Firstly, why people? I think that that was interesting, because you, while I
kind of China Digest all of these things. I'm also list
to some of the south. It they're saying an arm. We wanted to one slave quarter, which is like an actual slave quarter that had
that was still standing in that they try and keep altogether so that people can experience in was as soon as we walked in one white woman said about LISA.
had a fireplace- and I was the psych. Oh my guys like white guilt is
Real can really wanted to make. It seem like I guess in her mind, she feels guilty about slavery and you want to make it seem like it wasn't that bad, but it was just psych, so first trading cause you're looking at this this this home, that at any dead at some points in the year, probably had about what they said upwards of fourteen people living in exile, and it was how big would you say that place was wasn't very big is probably the size of a large bedroom and as a site, you know who cares if they had a fire
placed, as also you know, the beatings, the wings, the separation from their family thee, nonstop working all year round, but so those types of things were were frustrating and its two psych it. When you think about the children,
who were born and that were born enslaved and then the children that they have and things like that. You you can absolutely see how it affects the the mindset of a people and how they view life and
how they view themselves and on it it puts into perspective
like even present day how black people moving shake in society and how and why we beat why, and I dont want to speak. As you know, the the voice of all black people are like black. You are not a monolith, but it definitely makes sense.
why we feel the way that we feel about certain situations and why we behave certain sentenced certain ways. I could code switching and things like that. Why we do those things, because it's just a part of us, and I think that that is another thing- that
I'd say was trying to do with lemonade, but it's not even just like a social point where it's like philosophical, where oh yeah, you would you would think they know of your great grandmother, said this to your grandmother in its past
from generation to generation, but now there is actual science that is coming out. That is showing that there is
Socio environmental effects,
on the dna level from generation.
Essentially what beyond say a saying is also being supplemented with actual science to show its. What they're calling in the scientific community is
weathering, and they did. This study that went over went from like one thousand nine hundred and eighty five to twenty, sixteen, where they studied people from multiple cities, white and black, to see their their biological age and then they're their dna age or how how it affects their body and so how social, environmental and then racial discrimination how it affects them.
Black people are upwards of six years older than their white counterparts, and so, when you think about that- and you think about things like women when they have a child and we know that
when you get to your mid thirty's, that's when it's like a little bit more risky riskin of pregnancy
so imagine what a black woman that is, my age, thirty to thinking about having a child in her body. Because of this weathering the fact is: actually thirty, eight o! You saw them. So that's why we see that the mortality rate for black women who are having a baby is la higher than white women of the exact same age and those things can be overladen, indifferent categories. So it's just. It's really phenomenal when you think about it. Young imbrians even touches on like infidelity user
what we're looking for now. Infidelity now I don't know the worst and mister
our visit Yemen Infertility yet so that, like that's it it's a topic, that is
woven throughout lemonade, but, as is never specifically kind of blatantly sad, but once you gonna dig into the details,
their banana about all that is really interesting and again it's exactly why I love your perspective because you bring
thanks to the table that I would never have known that scientific aspect and when I hear that makes sense, when you know I mean, but to know that their science now that a start in a ship prove these things we ve caught of no north, hypothesized or thought or not about, are being shown on a scientific
It was pretty fascinating. The army note the experience for me. I guess lake. It was chiefly heavy. It was. You know your. I obviously thought about the enslaves experience, but you're just being human mechanics can't help it think about yourselves fino and it's like
is the Isle of Wight? Like a white male like you'd, like I just kept picturing myself the? What if I was born here, this color this this gender in this time period? What would I be like- and I was like party wants to say no,
I'd be that person that, like I mean, be going against the grain and I would be like, but then part of you is status.
That's, not true, actually lay brand as like, I think about that was like, even when I think about like Nazi Germany, like one of us,
in that area as a german and Nazi Germany, what I mean that small percentage that was-
rebelling, or would I be like the ninety nine percent of people that kind of, even if they disagree, they're going along with it, because if you fear for their life or whatever was like
those are the kinds of things that I was trying to grapple with and like many
this whole like
To my mind, it becomes it's more like existential thing like who are you at the core like how much of your environment affects you? You were to what extent does how long did you know, history time time and place your parents, all that, like how does has at all I kind of work into the fabric of who you are in
yeah could. Would you be different or would be the environment, be so strong that you just kind of fell in line like, and I still really haven't even been kind of thinking this out loud as I'm talking like, I haven't, really came to any conclusion about that, but that's kind of the things that was going along in my mind and just yeah, I guess like being victim of circumstance at some point like the bad luck of being black in that era, like all that stuff was, I was just kind of thinking about that. There was some like really like I teared up when I saw the the the restraints for children like Jesus that was like
Could I have kids and you just can't help, but think of like again going that same train of thought, like one of my kid was black in born into this, the same you're, seeing them like putting restraints. Those restraints were like two inches across lines like there for these, like three year old children, using Jesus
but the ESA was like having then there's like this whole Jackson.
position thing now is happening like there is, is huge, like so much of like
there is all these status symbols of wealth that we kept seeing across all three plantation right. All the big houses were these like just giant symbols of of wealth. There an authority- and it was like.
There's so much posturing, because one of them was like from the outside looks very good.
And then, when you got inside it was like
really small and euro, like there was,
such a weird contrast as I guess this, apparently this owner didn't have as much money as some people did, so he won't,
Facade of of status and wealth, but
wasn't actually all the way there yet. But then it's like the obvious contrast of like the big houses to the slave quarters. Issues like that with such a visual yo dislike just a very potent image of like the contrast between
the experiences in this place, and also like just even like the weather and the surroundings, were so beautiful, open spaces he's beautiful trees, but then like, despite all that environmental beauty. You know this place was just like living here.
For some people honestly, and it was because people, I think, a lot of people loved the Virginia alive oaks with
spanish moss. In their view,
yeah Quintessential Louisiana gas and
as I'm looking at them and I'm watching people kind of like taking pictures in front of them and smiling. I'm like how many people were hung from these trees like and that's really, all I could think of when I was when I when I see the spanish MOSS cuz, it's so beautiful, but it's almost like the the branches of the trees,
like crying and so decide- is just like a symbol of a lot of pain. I even even though it it's beautiful, there's a lot of pain like in the in the roots of that tree, and so it was. It was really really.
yeah sobering here, and I think that's why those trees are like featured in lemonade, so prominently. I think they're, this great representation of that really. What she's trying to convey the how she said bruised but beautiful. It's like these are the those trees are witnesses, basically like their living witnesses, of what happened here. They can encompass both sides, the story. You know they persist on through time.
But also their places, a great tragedy. So the Armenian there's, a number of the symbols that I feel it beyond saint or team, really thought about the landscape and custom of the objects of these times and really, I thought, used him and very powerful and beautiful ways. Re representative in us really cool just be here and just I just thought that was kind of important for us to do, but I mean, like I said like me, I guess I approach each season as I go as a
opportunity for education. You know, like I don't know a lot about these artists are like not or this speech these specific albums. I kind of like no they're good bye know that they have some things like that: our interests
but like until you really follow each thread.
yeah. You really can use great works of art like lemonade as like a blueprint for an education and like to me coming here was like one of the biggest things we could do to like tests. That idea saying like what hat what happens if we actually go to these places at her feature that are so prominent and what are the types of things that we can learn
an otter about you, but I probably would have never been here if it weren't for lemonade re ass, I M one had the experience that we
yesterday, but you have you, follow these threads enough like did they really offer a really great education to things, at least that deftly from my experience that are so different from my experience, I can really at least help you understand the experience of some one else
yeah yeah, I mean. Did you have anything like reading also came to mind yesterday, as we were like walking through everything that comes to mind, and I think I think one of the things that
stood out to me was what am to go back to the spanish MOSS one of our targets. He was. He was saying that Spanish MOSS doesn't like naturally grow on the
I worked there, not a parasite there. She, I don't remember the word,
so the legal living breathing down there in the area is in the air and then they attach to the trees and then they grow from there, and I was like what a beautiful metaphor for you know: racism where it is not something that is growing from the tree of our.
Culture, but it's in the air and it affects all of us here and sounds like that. I thought it was. I really poetic and in that moment
when I was this idea that that makes a lot of sense here. The other think that's something that the answer is really trying to do in the court that we have talked about a lot almost pray area.
So really be quote the other saying that she wanted to show that the ongoing
thanks of slavery on black love, like relationships and just like the invisible thing that,
just in the air? Not seen but felt that has very real consequences and effects, but not
She was sick, virtuosity racist reality. Like knows exactly how to say something without actually
She was a racist reality like knows exactly how to say something without actually saying it ran villages as great metaphor for like how racism cunning works today, because the old,
as a full partner say why? Yes, like generally speakers,
obviously happens, but is more a foe potter say
something races now, but that's like this weird reverse version
could switch very like a year. They have these code dislike, there's a completely oh yeah, but yeah thing. I didn't think about that metaphor, but deftly makes sense. Yeah that, like the
I didn't actually like even put together, like all three tour tour, guys were why
well yeah, I will tell you said it, but now I thought about it. That seems a little bit weird. I know. Maybe there's nobody
for that to him on other days. Every day, but then there is also this one black women who she worked at the plant at one of the plantations and she was kind of like doing kind of like on this.
For some people and a white woman comes up says: are you the tour God she says no appeal
only I'm not qualified by that she had also just previously just prior to that
mentioned that her ancestors were from. Where
slave on a plantation not too far for aware in your lover, and so I can tell that she fell offended that she had to kind of like proof, qualifications to be able to tell you to our guide.
When she is a direct descendants of the enslaved and white people, get to give the Torres so yeah aside, I I feel you grew. I feel I feel your frustration and your anger in that yeah yeah, suggesting the think, though, like your, how would the tour be different if it was led by someone who was black, like I feel like they did? There was a conscious effort to very clearly address the enslaved. I thought they made it a point to do that, which I think we both appreciated, but if it could have been a place from a place like that woman, I think it would have came off more authentic and more yet.
our third dick in nineteen. You have been a more powerful expression of what their they seem to be trying to express yeah, but the deadly wasn't as whitewashed as I was. Maybe assuming that it was gonna, be the add, as I do. I thought that the Destr in tour was the
interesting is the woman was like older issues addressed in the like plenty
but the formal plantation yeah garments and she has had a theatrical
performance to her presentation of an. But let me
He did mention like the one thousand eight hundred and eleven slave revolt, which I was really wondering if they're going to mention that, because that the Destrehan that's where they had to revolt or that's a large part where it took place and like that's, where slaves, the once they overthrew the enslaved, were decapitated in their heads were strung along the Mississippi River as a warning to like future revolts and like I was really
I said to see, if that's such a dark, I mean, I would say, that's among the darkest you know experiences and to hear that her address of I thought I was surprised that she did but also appreciative that they are at least acknowledging. Does the brutality of it really go,
all right. Well, does anything else you wanted to cover their ridden cover nothing.
Yeah, been it's been amazing, working on the show I feel very lucky to have been given the up
to sound. Thank you for trusting me
to be able to do this, because I know your fans are very used to your voice and the for worthy and having in inject
my voice in their sixties, and then I hope everybody enjoys the work that I do, and I hope that you are happy with the workers
will the jail yeah you're doing a great job has been, I think, has been a great experience so far. I mean we're not even half way through the seasonal thinking that
yeah really excited to get keep keep progressing
be more going on with you. It's been for me. I ve been a great experience of far too and I've been learn a lot from you and yet the grouping together something really good the season, so yeah
then shot out to Maggie inaccuracy. There may be less vagaries at this point,
broader on about a month ago and she's, helping writing subscription she's doing
more jobs devilish out to her
shut up. My cue put together. Some really good
analysis outlines for us to use. There has been great to get your dissect started
just me and my my garage basically and is now to have
season, I'm trying to grow and do something different. Having all these different voices perspective experiences all talking about the same work as really cool to kind
A similar into these episodes in its hopefully making show more dynamic and better, and not just mean you know the idea that I never thought
doing, dissect was easy like listening to. I can tell how much work went into it, but being a part of it it. It makes me realize like how much work it is to do this show and how lucky we are to have you, steering this ship and being able to consume your work. It's been I'm a huge fan of the show and will continue to be a huge fan of the show and
really loved the work that you do. It's really important appreciate the and shut out dope labs. Every goddamn labs yet definitely subscribe on site,
if I were every listened but yeah. Well, I guess it's a good start placed
and we will try to another one of these towards the end of the season. Just a kind of recap, our experience Antonov we can go to
raising again but less seriously. We have to take you