Discrimination can't explain why women earn so much less than men. If only it were that easy.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
This podcast dynamically inserts audio advertisements of varying lengths for each download. As a result, the transcription time indexes may be inaccurate.
If you'd like to listen to free economic radio without ads the place to do that is sticker premium five dollars a month and you can get a free month trial by going to stick your premium dot com and use a promo code freak. You also get access to all our bonus. Episodes and you'll be supporting our show to that sticker premium. Dot, com, promo code freak banks, innovation, resilience agility. It's. How Michigan businesses continue to build the future, our expertise, talented workforce and Reuben. Adaptability are making a dick and now and shaping the future joined US and make your mark where it matters, visit Michigan business, DOT, Org slash radio, to put your plans and motion. That's me again: business dot, Org, slash, radio? Oh hi, I'm Sarah Silverman Writer, comedian and vagina honor
women make up almost half the working population, yet we typically earn just seventy eight cents to every dollar. A man makes in almost every professions. I'm pretty sure. You ve heard this kind of statistics before maybe in a political error. The gender wage gap is real and women still about seventy seven says for every dollar, a man earns for working the same job, maybe even in a state of the union, address women make up about our workforce, but they stole my seventy seven cents for every dollar matters that is at an end, fourteen it's an embarrassment. Women deserve equal pay for equal work. The implication is that women are being discriminated against. True, they earn less but
Does that mean that women are receiving lower pay for equal work? That is possibly the case in certain places, but by and large it's not that it's something else something else like what that's the question of the day and for economic radio, as we try to figure out the true story of the gender pay gap, I'm happy from W and why see studios this is freakin mix. Radio the pod cast at explores the hidden side of every thing. Here's your host, Stephen Governor, if you're. Looking for someone to explain the gender pay gap, you can do much better than today's guest.
Claudia Golden Professor of Economics at Harvard University Golden has working on gender economics for years and has personally done some. The most influential research find my role by thinking about the issues of today and putting them in historical perspective and standing what their roots are, because you see more distant. Past. You really don't know whether you're looking at something that said a little ephemeral, transitory blip or something that's important, and how important is it for you, too hold of good data. In order to reach those conclusions, it sort of essential I always say that I do not live in a data vacuum. I find it very hard to breathe and data vacuum one. Ninety Claudia Golden became the first woman to get tenure in the Harvard Economics Department in two thousand fourteen. She served as president of the American Economic Association a her lecture at,
annual eighty a meeting was called a grand gender convergence. Its last chapter you have argued at our quote you to yourself. The converging roles of men and women are among the grandest at since in the last century. Would you in by that and why is it so grand very merchant instead, the end converging roles having to do with the productive capacities of men and women. So that would be there education, their professional degrees, their lifecycle, labour force, petition, patient, meaning how many years have they been proven, two members of the workforce, and so there are Virgin roles in these arenas, and they have meant men, and women are sick, arrogantly more alike in terms of how firms and employers would look then how they look at themselves. Now we hear,
about the gender pay gap. A lot were told repeat: the including by the present United States, in this way, the union that women earn? less than men for doing the same work as one of the phrases that we hear seventy some cents on the dollar. So first off, can you clarify what that really means. How true is that, when we hear a statement like that, especially in the political arena? Oh, it is true that a few took individuals in the labour force and took those who working time for a year, took all women the median annual earnings of those women and took the same thing for men and divided the too. It would be point seven, seven or a round that ok and that's enough that has increased in the nineteenth and early nineteen. Seventy two as point five nine, and there was a mantra. Fifty nine cents on a dollar. That's not enough.
Hey. We are equal to men. We deserve more, so is this: for equal work is equal individuals. What economists do is they? use data to figure out whether the individuals or the same they try to make them as comparable as possible. They squeeze out these differences and productive attributes. They look for individual Also have the same education, the same labour force, participation rates over their lifecycle, etc, and they squeeze out. We still get a number that less than one so does that mean that women are receiving lower pay for equal work? That is possibly the case in certain places, but by and large it's not that it's something else. If we are talking about a gender pay gap of whatever size somewhere between twenty three cents and three cents: zero cents less per dollar there
a man. Let's look at what factors might contribute to that so number one. What about discrimination What is the evidence that women earn less, because discriminated against on some dimension or another. It's hard to find the smoking guns. Ok, the smoking guns existed in the past I have found many a smoking gone where you find an actual evidence of firms say: free ample. I do not higher negroes or do not higher women. I mean you actually find these in nineteen, thirty nine. We don't find it smoking guns now, but what we who try to do is hold everything constant that we can hold get the best data that we can and what remains we don't call discrimination. We call wage discrimination discrimination as such. A loaded word that we don't
when you use that so we use quotes around we, discrimination? And so the first thing is what of data? Do you need to do that and it would be incredibly rich data and a couple of people have put together data using administrative records that are phenomenally good data that can hold lots of things. Constant could track individuals over their lifetimes and get to the answer, and the answer is that it's a pre. These small number, this number for wage discrimination points. You hold lots of things constant, it's probably there, but we not quite certain whether these differences are due to the fact that women, even those without kids have more our responsibility is to take more responsibilities in our own families taking care of their parents, for example,
Oh, the answer is that we don't have tons evidence that its true discrimination talk for a moment about potential categorical differences, between men and women that have shown up and in some research the differing appetite for competition- is I'm a label debt or in another instance the willingness to bargain on salary or flexibility. How much might those contribute to the pay gap? I think that there is no doubt that they contribute to some degree but let me tell you why I don't think that they go the real distance, some of the best studies that we have of the gender pay gap following individuals longitudinal. I showed that when they show up right out of college or out of law school or after get their mba. All the studies that we have indicated that wages are pretty similar, then
so of men were better bargainers. They would have been better right then, and it does look as if their beds, bargainers to a degree that shows up as a very large number but further down the in their lives by ten to fifteen. Sl? We see very large differences in there but we also see large differences in they are in their job titles and a lot of that occurs you're too. After a kid is born and it occurs from men and not for a man of anything men tend to work somewhat harder, and I I know that there are many who are done experiments on the fact that one and don't necessarily like competition,
much as men. Do they value temporal flexibility, men value income, growth that there are various differences but in terms of bargaining in common in it doesn't look like it showing up that much at the very beginning. Let me about one more contributory factor: the parent penalty? What's often mommy tax. But how significant is that as a contributory factor? Well, it seems as if it's, a large factor that anything that leads you to want to have or time is going to be a large factor. The noted public policy scholar, Anne Marie Slaughter in a book called unfinished business singled. What she calls the care penalty as the main driver of gender inequity, peers slaughter sees it. If you take then, who don't have caregiving obligations there?
almost equal with men it somewhere in the ninety five percent range. But where women, then have children, or again are caring for their own parents or other sick family members who need care, then they need to work differently. They need to work flexibly and then go part time. They often get less good assignments, because their bosses think that they're, not gonna want work that a well them to travel or they're, not gonna be able to stay up all night or whatever it is. And so then you start. You know if you're working part time you don't get the same races and if you're working flexibly your boss very typically thinks you're, not that committed dear career, so you don't get promoted. It is this pursuit of Claudia Golden calls, temporal flexibility. Golden sees, as perhaps the most powerful explanation for the gender pay gap, as she told us
It doesn't seem as though outright discrimination or differences in competitive driver bargaining ability can count for much of the difference, but that need or desire for? accessibility in the workplace, leads to a split, it's very clear in the data, a split that has to do with job selection. Women often take jobs that have different characteristics, different humanity when golden refers to amenities, she's in just talking out free lunch at the office or free massages story about the We need to work flexible hours or may be work at home. Some days, maybe complete a project outside the typical corporate schedule, all of which can be extremely valuable if you are helping care for your family members. In addition to working, I like to think bout, an individual who gets a degree- let's say a large degree at Seville.
And now I have an individual, a man who gets the lot of green. They graduate from law school. They both Lee brilliant and they both jobs in approximately the same kind of firm. By and large, they're going to earn approximately the same amount when they start things, Wolf, continue in their lives. There both perhaps find partners get married, have kids. It's often the case that women will leave the very large law firms that put a lot of time, demands on them and go to Our firms or become corporate council become part time. Corporate council, perhaps for a while. They will go to small firms where the workload is somewhat different. They may work in fact the same number of hours, but they may hours that are their hours rather than the hours imposed on them by the firm, the woman
Wolf then begin to make if she's the one who did this, she will make considerably less than than the man and the law What we see not all of it, but a lot of what we see is this choice to go in to occupations that have less expensive. Temporal flexibility that allow individuals to do their work, work on their own time. So do you find that their bigger differ doesn't pay between men and women between different occupation, In other words, what would be a more typical story, a man and a woman that say who were observation the equivalent in terms of aptitude in education and so on? What would be more typical that the fee El would go into a profession where the average salary is lower than the man, or that the female would go into the same profession as the man, but choose a particular type of occupation within that prefer
that might provide more latitude and therefore come who salary right too. We have both things going on so We know that there is what many people call occupational segregation. Nurses are female doctors. Are they disproportionately mail in some specialities, they still are. We know that Ursus, burned less than doctors in general, so one might think that all the difference in air earnings is going to be the difference because women select more and to occupations that look like their pain. Last big occupational group set or pay less and then select entire occupations in which they pay more, but they really lion's share of the difference is due to the fact that in
free occupationally just about women, receive less men and their receiving less than men for a host of reasons, one of which is that they are not working the same amount of time and in many occupations, became more hours or be there when the firm she'll be there earns you lot more. So in fact, something like three quarters of the difference. If you look at that, four hundred and sixty nine occupations in the Sensus and you look at how much is due to the fact that women are disproportionately in certain occupations and how much is due to the fact that, with the in each occupation, there are differences. Seventy five percent is due. The within each occupation, thus way of putting it is. You could hypothetically, give women
the male distribution of occupations, and you would. Why bout only about a quarter of the difference in Earnings between men and women can you talk for a moment about where you see the largest in sector differences engender paying? So what I did was I took all the occupations in the Sensus, and then I looked at the top p hundred and five occupation so the point then am drawing is about sixty thousand a year,
so the occupations than divide into those in the corporate and finance sector, those in health, those in science and technology which I can croup together and then there is this other group. It's just very hard to put in one or the other lawyers, for example, would be in that one and one I find it's very clear- is at the gender wage gaps. When you correct for this stuff, you can correct for in the census, you find that the biggest wage gap are in the corporate that financial sectors, also of law and the health mutations in which there is a high fraction of ownership of self employment said the podiatrist, for example the chiropractors, so the ones that have the smallest
difference between male and female earnings. With these corrections are the technology. Occupation it's in the science occupations and the health quotations where there is a small degree of self employment, as is true today, for, for example, pharmacists, so is best is you can figure the wine out where the gap within the profession, is so large? Why is it so large? By and large, it appears that there is just a very high cost of temporal flexibility in certain occupations and part of this is that people don't have good substitutes for themselves. In certain cases, so you are doing a merger and in acquisition you're a lawyer. You are a consultant whenever it is during the client might say I
you there. I want you there all the time. Ok, I won call. You two in the morning I weren't you be there on Sunday on holidays. I want you to go to Japan whenever I say that you should well that's a tremendous demand so individual who values they are fair, only time will tell him not doing bad. So, therefore, if a woman points to law, for example, is a good example if a woman wants to practice law. She has a large degree. She enjoys practising law. Being a corporate council would give her more flexibility that doesn't mean that she's working fewer, hours, then she would forked otherwise, but she can work her hours and she gets paid somewhat less. The big question of gender pay gap has to be broken down into a set of smaller questions, and then, if you find the data to answer them,
when suddenly Claudia Golden does that it's pretty obvious that the statistics cited by everyone from Sarah Silverman to President Obama isn't quite right, because women aren't you paid twenty, some percent less than men for doing the same work. They are, however, often doing different work or work that affords more flexibility, which tends to pay less. Now it may be that if you put a dollar value on the flexibility, it could offset a lot of the actual salary dollars. In any case there seem to be some kind of sorted good news here, which is that discrimination, doesn't seem to be the main culprit in the gender pay gap, or at least it's hard to find smoking gun, has quadrupled and says, but not impossible, a heck of only pictures emails showed that the actors, Jennifer Lawrence and Amy Adams got fewer back and rights than their male counterparts in the film american hustle interesting?
when Lawrence later wrote about this revelation, she largely blamed herself. I fail as a negotiator, because I gave up early, she wrote, I didn't want it fighting over millions of dollars that, frankly, due to two franchises, I dont need. But if I'm honest with me, I would be lying. If I didn't say there was an element of wanting to be liked, the influenced my dear vision to close the deal without a real fight. I didn't want to seem difficult or spiled so at another component to consider when you talk about the gender pay gap that even in the air sense of outright discrimination? The playing fields are not necessarily equal. Some of the most compelling evidence for this fact comes from the light.
Nineteen nineties, a study that Claudia Golden did with Cecy rouse. The paper was called orchestrating impartiality we found out, that the best orchestras in the United States most of them use a blind when they do or additions they didn't in the past and each one of them adopted this technique, her having or additions blind means that the individuals who are making decision on the sound of the individuals performance, do not get to see the endeavour sure that there is a screen in front of the individual, and so we decided that since the various orchestras adopted this screen, we could figure out whether the huge increase in
women in the great orchestras the United States was in perhaps due to the use of the screen so yes, one theory might be if orchestras got a lot more female over time. It may have just been that the pool of female applicants grown a lotta, the pool of male applicants and shrunk alot riper, you wondered isolate the effect of the. And auditions correct, and what did you find? We found that blind ambitions matter. Tremendous amount, our best s, was that it was about twenty five percent of an increase which is pretty large and why if the ways that we did it- and this, I will say- was cc's brilliance was that because had the names of individuals we actually
track, individuals who auditioned not blind and then blind for different orchestras, I'm trying to tell I may be in putting the strong, but are you saying that the use of or blind auditions also had an effect of simply encouraging more females to audition. For those topped your orchestras pets rang, it appears to have led to an explosion of auditions so it suggests that gender beside which were talking about that. What you might more broadly and much more importantly, call an opportunity gap in the gender sphere is something that's not only omnipresent in certain into he's but also really hard to get at right. They try. I think that this is it very good example of where, indeed, twelve might not come out to interview its expensive to do that. In some sense, you have to do
I've got to do it, you have to put you pride on the line and So now there was a just a much larger group of individuals doing these interviews Coming up on economics, radio, now that we know some actual facts about the gender pay gap, what should be done about it and just important. What probably shouldn't be done? No one saying that we want a world in which men and women are identical language. You look out new to see androgynous individuals walking around and mouse suits missed any of our previous episodes like one related to today's conversation, called women are not men from back and twenty thirteen or are longer conversation with Anne Marie Slaughter, which was called meet. The woman who said women can't have it all
won't you check out our podcast archives. You can find every episode ever made over free economics, dot com. You can also subscribe at Itunes which, by the way recently named for economics, radio, one of the best of twenty. Fifty thanks. I tunes. I'm Stephen Dub nerve, MRS Reconnects radio. Today we are talking with Claudia Golden about the infamous gender pay gap, so you're a Harvard economist, your partner in life. Larry cats is also harboured economist. How fair would you consider your pay in relation to his their exactly the same practical
I think I always make slightly more because some more senior, then he in terms of the years, and I think that the administration always thinks that a faggot five dollars more, that that makes it better and it sort of sure does, gives you braggin rates at least rate. Absolutely golden and cats would both show in the census data as post secondary teachers and in this case the female teacher earns a few more dollars and her male counterparts, but what? If golden had decided some years back to find some are less demanding to work, then Harvard maybe she needed to care for some family members may be trying to study opera singing on the side whatever. So perhaps she opted out of the ivy. He'd tenure track for a different teaching job. The dim pay as much well that were the case, she and Larry cats would still both show up in the census data as post secondary teachers, but now the female worker
is earning a lot less than their male counterparts multiplied. Story by a few million, and you have a huge pay gap between men and women. In some ways it's a self inflicted wound. Women make choices. Led to smaller monetary returns. On the other hand, Society is set up in such a way that those choices are often not really very optional, so what's to be about some people taking matters into their own hands. A record low from Portland Oregon, called maladies records decide to give female customer Twenty three percent discount on male orders to account for the pay gap
they were the only ones to think of this strategy. A bar brooklands charging women, just seventy seven percent of their bar bells all night to highlight the wage gap between working men and women, but getting a discount and drinks or records isn't going to accomplish much. What would Claudia Golden do? So? Let me ask you this you point two examples of countries or cultures, or maybe firms that, in your view, have success. Fully addressed the real root causes of the gender pay gap in some ways, certain occupations that seem to have successfully addressed them may not have given it any thought. My favorite example is our embassy, in which there is virtually no part time penalty in which, earth very little owner Now, in terms of, pendant pharmacies we may lament that. I would certainly lament if I lost the one
full independent pharmacy in Cambridge, but in fact women, ten to shy away from ownership in part, because it involves a fair amount of responsibility that is unpredictable so there have been changes in pharmacy that have led pharmacists to be better substitutes for each other, then use of highly standardized drugs, for example, less compounding less individual, less need for a particular pharmacists to deal with you. Information technologies have been absolutely essential. When you go to the pharmacist, it could be any as a pharmacist working there who are. Hell agent and professional on, can read the information about you. So some of what has happened that has been good for women,
comes from changes that I call organic and they simply happen because the various technological advances that make each pharmacists a perfect puzzle, peace for another pharmacist and also I mean God of Silicon Valley, and they don't talk about family, time they talk about play time and its work life. Alan shrugged then just work family balance, but the more and more people our society, who value that the more for I'm going to be searching for methods to reduce the cost of this mandate. If the costs is expensive, then it's going to the case that India The tools who Shiloh way from those jobs are going to be paid disproportionately less and the more people who want those jobs, the more
firms are going to find it costly to provide them and they're going to come with ways using information technology to create these puzzle pieces. It may be natural impulse. When you hear that women earn less than men, find someone to blame one we are still is men, presumably for being discriminatory, but is Claudia Golden told us. There isn't much evidence to support the discrimination argument Another obvious villain is our. Instead, national set up? If we could change, may be modernized lot of our institutions and the incentives they offer? Wouldn't that lead to more equality. The sumac true the question and become which institution should be changed, and how and Should we assume that governments should take the lead In two thousand nine President Obama signed into law the lily led better, Fair pay act which expands the
rate to sue in cases of unequal pay? But that's it. A narrow advance, President Obama and others want more legislation to try to close the gender pay gap. I asked but a golden if she thinks this is a good idea and if so, what kind of legislation makes sense the best legit, nation that we can have is change, certain aspects of our school system if family matters are important here, and I believe they are it's not just baby care simply doing something for infants. Isn't the big deal most people. I know who have kids will say that life was relatively easy until their kids went to the local public school, which syn them out at two o clock which sends them here
in June and the problems that they have or try you then, to fill in time to six o clock, which used to be filled in in day care and Phil in the summer, which used to be filled in India cure so for the children alone. It would be worth extending the day extending the year. This is not cheap, but it simply an extension of a pub good that we are already producing we'll do a world of good for working families interesting, but you, calling for advocating at least as your first choice, legislation that would change the way. Let's say, firms work to create more equal opportunities, are more temporal flexibility, let's say for women. If I can find
The way out, a way of doing that, I would have told you, but I don't think it's easy to ten mandate. How can you mandate that firms all figure out ways of reducing the costs of temper flexibility and reducing the costs of having people be puzzle. Pieces were simply not going to do that. It sky Are you to happen organically? There are some places where men are required increasingly to take family leave when they have a child. So do does that kind of legislation that happens governmental, but then at the firmly does that suitably level the playing field by lowering the cost of temporal flexibility? But doesnt lower the cost of temporal flexibility that could change now the time than each parents spends with with kids. So there are sort of Toulouse
for ways of dealing with this one is changing the cost of The amended in the other. One is changing. The supply of the individuals who demand the immunity and that my teams, the latter- it's not necessarily going to change the former at all. Anne Marie Slaughter, whom we have also spoken with about. This topic, argues that a lot of the solution for gender equality in the workplace as with men, that that men need essentially to be sort of research, lies to better understood their role in women's role in family care, and so on. I'm curious what your thoughts on that that's a strong social norm in our culture, that women are the core primary caregiver and so on. I I'm curious whether you think that necessary and or likely change in, and that might produce some benefit to everybody, this certainly related to the previous point that you made about paternity
leave that if we mandate that men. Take paternity leave were give them paternity leave that parental leave that only the could take that you can't mandate they take it. You can simply say that a few don't take it evaporates, one of them reasons for doing that in the various countries that have done. It is true sort of change their social norm and have fathers. Bond more with their kids and take more, Flexibility when their kids are young and then I call on you to do more later and there some studies warning come back, for example, then indicates that it does have some want of an impact so,
that's going along the lines of what Anna Maria Slaughter says, and I couldn't agree with her more that if, in fact, men leaned out more, the world would be a better place, for women how you accomplish. That is more difficult. I think that it would be easier to accomplish getting the price of of the immense being down. Then huge is said: reprogramming all the men in the United States. So I'd think of these choose as these solutions in buckets as fixed the women. That is make them more competitive, better Can you skills better math, ok, fixed and women fix the infants taken the intense that will do it, ok fix the men, which is the the point
that where we were just talking about or fix the organ, patients in the jobs and and I'm thinking more about the ladder. What costs come with me, convergence of the roles of men and women, especially hidden costs, having considered. In other words, we set this up as a goal of equity especial in the workplace. Can you point twenty examples where there are costs, however, to the pursuit of that equity? But there are always going to be different, since there is no question, no one's ain't that that we want a world in which men and women are identical. Language look out new to see and individuals walking around and mouse suits. So I'm not certain what actual costs there are made. Men kinder and gentler and more interested in their kids. How can there be any cost to that King women more respected in their job.
Second, there be any cost to that. Making women fiercer earn better bargainers and more competitive ere. I can see cause to that. I'm just curious. What's it like for you to hear the kind of stock political assertion? about the size of the gender gap, knowing that it missus all the nuances at you, ve just described. It makes me feel that I have to get back in my office and to better work and write it up better and stated with more force. But I recognise that there are facts. There are truths and there's political action, so one simply has to recognise that there are good people out there who want to make the world a better place and they will push what they want even in the absence of hard evidence
Claudia Golden admits that her careers turned up pretty well. If you want to be Academic landing, economics Department, harboured, isn't bad golden is considered a true expert in her field. She's gonna wards been celebrated, but she has also been reminded now and then, but simply being female, can carry costs of its own. Our story is interesting because I was asked- and I do not do consult and I was asked to evaluating projects It was done by leading international agency that will remain unnamed and the project was TAT in the organization it was deemed that women were being treated twelve than men. They didn't internal study, eternal study concluded that women we're doing just as well as men and that there were no problems at all that whatever problems were in the organisation where some other things you know, maybe there was
hoping maybe they were harassment, but that didn't look like it showed up in terms of their job, his and their pay? Ok, so this person, all we up and says we need external people to review it, and he asked me and to other people were men who work worked a lot as consultants and the person said to me how about two thousand hours for this job, and I thought that's interesting because what I was doing it as a favor. That's fine, two thousand dollars, so the Three of us evaluated. The internal review found tat. It looked pretty good and I received my payment. A couple months go buying. I receive a call. It said by the way and remember that The project we were working on was waging promotion discrimination against women
and I receive a call and was told that the other two men had a rate that they asked for, and so there was about one and a half times or two times mine. So someone at that organization actually approved three consultants, the woman receiving about half of what the men received. So there Is evidence that, though, endeavour sure who didn't ask for anything, because I didn't have a rate got then the guys who did ask for it so my one piece advice for you Claudie, would be that you need to find out the previously agreed upon mail rate and quote that, instead of letting them tell you what you're going to get all right
Thank you very much. Well. What I'm going to do is to call you up and his cue to bargain form to deal I'll. Do it for economics radio is produced by w when my C studios and Dublin productions, this episode was produced by Gregory Zawoiski. Our staff also includes ervic Gunjay Jake, how it merit Jacob Christopher Kashmir highly, which Alison Hockenberry end? Caroline English, you want more or for economics, radio. You can subscribe to our progress on Itunes or whether you get your podcast. You can also go to free economics, dot com, we'll find our entire podcast archived the books, the blog and more. Time on for economic radio, how to become a political super forecaster, it is not a street.
Where do you think there are plenty of reasons why very smart people don't ever become super forecasters and plenty reasons people, are not turn about. Politics never become super. Forecasters gets next time for economic, three hey there, Stephen dubbing again, one more thing. If you liked the episode you just heard, we think you like something else in the freedom of radio network. Look for this interview on the new pod cast people. I mostly admire with host Steve, let it but my guest today super it. She collects championships she's for W Nba championships, five euro, the best about championships to end she ate championships,
for international basketball, federation, world cups and four olympic Gold medal. I would think that, in order to be the player you are, you would have to be a person who acted gets better under pressure rather than worth. Well. Obviously, there are people who are known for heating. Big shots are known for playing, while in big gangs that exists for sure, but I think we kind of frame it the wrong way. It's not that you're gonna make nine at it. It's that you might make three at a ten, but somebody else's making zero it's on whose most Successful it's like who's. The most successful the least successful. That is people mostly admire you can find it on your favorite podcast app subscribe now, so that you don't miss single episode.
Hey there, Stephen dubbing again, one more thing. If you like for economics, radio, I think you'll also like the latest episode of people, I mostly admire the podcast hosted by my free economic, spreading co, author, Steve Levin, here's what it sounds like a guest today, Sue bird. She collects championships she's for W Nba championships, five euro, the best, while championships too, and see a championships for International Basketball Federation, world cups, and four limpid gold medals? I'd love to talk about the economics of professional basketball, so the average player in the NBA made eight point three million dollars into that nineteen and in the W Nba the average with eighty thousand is frustrating just now. I think. Actually, if you look at
twenty twenty? Our minimum is now higher, but we all put in the same amount of work. So is it hard to swallow, knowing that somebody else's work is being rewarded at times by I live in reality, I understand business and economics. Some people look at us as like charity. They go will will help them out like an it in a terrible what sense, not unlike this business vestment way and we think do look at us as an investment immediately. Its talked about how we don't make money- and it's like fifty years ago in the nba- did either, but people are willing to make that investment get behind it and growing people. I mostly admire you can find on your favorite podcast app.
Transcript generated on 2021-01-29.