« ID10T with Chris Hardwick

John Chester - The Biggest Little Farm

2021-02-03

John Chester (The Biggest Little Farm) talks to Chris about what inspired him and his wife to start a farm, how they turned it into an incredible documentary, and the many life lessons that came from it. Topics range from sustainability and soil science to existentialism and the Circle of Life. Even if farming isn't in your interest wheelhouse there is plenty to take away from this conversation! "The Biggest Little Farm" is available to watch on several platforms including Apple, Hulu, and Amazon Prime Video.

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
And now we briefly paused to think- are sponsor for this episode of the eighty twenty podcast better help. So is there something that's interfering with your happiness right now? Is there something that's preventing you from achieving your goals, whether there you know big calls, or maybe just the goals of just feeling better, more grounded in focusing on your mental health. Well, better full assessor needs and match you with your own licence, professional therapist, its professional counselling done curly online. You can send a message to your accounts or any time you'll get a timely and thoughtful response. Plus you can schedule weekly, video or phone session You can do it from wherever you are better help is committed, celebrating great therapeutic matches, so they make it easy Frida change councillors if needed, more affordable than traditional offline counselling and financial aid is available, licence professional counters special. As in a variety of areas ranging from depression, to stress, anxiety, relationships, sleeping issues, trauma, grief, self esteem
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Alonzo, who has done this this thing during the pandemic. So Alonzo has all these old movies that he liked to watch and watched him with his son movies. There were that came out for his son was born and now his son is grown and though they watched these movies together and they made a pod cast about. It's called the back Look Cinema, podcast with Zack and so in Alonzo. So we ve done twelve episodes. We're having a great time together, shows Bilbo. Most pack has apps and at back look Mamma dont come in. So I just went to the website to look at. It is a great man is you know, like Alonzo Iron, the exact same demographic clearly, because its Beverly Hills top raising the stone Rambo First blood part two on four October Conner. die hard to gremlins raiders last dark. You know just like basic
Just a father to son, watching movies together and its end. It sounds like just cut like TAT can through. So this is what a great idea and what a great thing to do with the time during the pandemic, to not only revisit some class, expert also make a thing and make a thing well bonding with your son. This is this is a fantastic thing that you're doing. Thank you so much Alonzo for sharing and events at eighty for anyone else who wants to share the thing that they made. This episode is job Chester who may an amazing documentary called the biggest little farm which Sir turn around John and his wife Molly, who are they equally city folk, they live in Santa Monica and a tiny apartment and they decide. You know we ve had it with the hustle and bustle of city life. We want to go, make a farm. We want to make a farm bill, the sustainable farm from scratch live
the land, and so they do and I commend every is essentially their seven year journey from turning what, Basically it unusable pile of dirt into this wash, sustainable farm- this incredible ecosystem that they built with the help of this amazing man who is essentially like of a farming jedi and they do, and it is in its provocative, beautifully shot. John is a nature documentarily, so it's beautifully shot in the story incredibly laid out- and it's it's a stunning movie- it's about living sustainably, it's about farming, ethically, it's it's about life and death and nature. Yes, there are things that you could take away. that are literally about farming, but but the overall, like large, metaphorical life, lessons that they learn and you learn from watching. Their journey are just incredible. They had
recommended to me by several people and then what I We saw it, I was my lydia I would blown away by it. So I had our wonderful pine camp. There's a reach out to John and he greeted the podcast, and but we regret this like, so the movie like a year and a half ago, and then I recorded this podcast literally, calendar year ago, a full calendar year. As a matter of fact, I believe we did this yet the middle or end of February. I think this Bible it was the last in person podcast that I was the deal before locked out and we switched everything over to zoom in we didn't do it and our normal pakistani or actually went to the farm. That is the center of. movie apricots lane farms and got to see them in the landscape, its. It was incredible and got to meet there Pig named about whose, in the documentaries, very famous pig, that's got to meet
and that was really exciting, and so it was just incredible. The girl was incredible to talk to John and and also just extrapolate all these incredibly felicity go live thing. So even if you have no interest in farming or sister noble farming. You will definitely be able to, I believe, things away from this podcast John is incredibly insightful. He's very open he's very earnest. He very honest about mistakes that he's made through the learning process, he's really it open book and This is why I think the documentary so great, but I do want to give you a full of heads up before you listen the pod customer, and there are spoilers we talk about things that happened in the movie in the podcast. If you are not afraid of spoilers even like a documentary and by the way it's you still worth the journey. I think, even if you know stuff, it happens the movie, but if you want any spoilers, definitely Does this go watch? A documentary second thing that I want to make you aware of. You know there is a lot that happens in the movie their triumphant moments. There are happy
since there are fun funny moments, and there are sad parts of the movie there. They they do lose animals in the process. There is this: through line of circle of life, life and death, you know life leading to death, death, be getting life and, while respectfully handled. It still involves animals on the farm. If that is pretend Lee, triggering or upsetting to you, then maybe they die memory might not be. You know I mean it. You know it does I'll come back around in a very existential in a very beautiful tapestry of life kind of way, but a feudal. If you don't like to- get near anything like that. Then I just wanted to give you fair excellent, to give you fair warning about that uptown
I still think by the way that, even if you don't feel like you can watch the documentary, I still think the podcast is listening, and I just cannot think John, for doing the podcast and by the way I do I want to apologize to John and Africa in funds for holding onto it for a year when this, when we recorded it the lock down but a couple weeks later, and so I thought well eminence- hang onto it for like a month or so because you don't we. one of the things they do as you can get tours of apricots lane, farms and also they sell at a lot of farmers. Markets are in California, so I thought well, there's not better that's going on right now, so I ll just wait and then you know later in the spring. Things up and back up and then I'll release it and then in the spring, things did not open back up, and then I thought well, maybe the summer in the summer things didn't open up and then in the fall we were still not then holidays, you know, and so, as things are starting to open up now, I don't
know exactly where there at with the form, but if you go to apricots lame farms, dot com, you can get it asian about what they're doing. Maybe you can contact them. If you go to their instagram apricots lane, farms in keep up with there, and so I do apologise for sitting on it for a year, but I just I was just waiting but don't want to sit on it any more because it such a wonderful. Episode that I'm, I really just want to put it out there in the world. So thank you again to John, for opening up the firemen and letting us common and see it and for being such a phenomenal podcast, guest and conversationalist, and this is very educational and in a very insightful episode that are thoroughly enjoyed, and I you enjoy to here is the
oh and by the way, because little farm is available on all that, I'm pretty sure its most it most of. If not all the platforms, have you just search the biggest little farm you'll find it. Maybe we watch and on whom I think it's also an apple so it's it's out there. So thank you again for your time. Thank you for listening. It's the eighty. Twenty episode number eleven O eight with John Chester. I can't even
Let's talk about it several times and of how just because a guess about a month or so ago, my friend Mary, Monaghan came on. And she has mentioned it- obviously biggest little farm. No, because we are talking about a mile, my wife's family is their largely remain. They work in publishing, but they also our ranchers, and she always says, like I'd, be so great to just who have a farm. Some Dane. She wants goats and she wants you know and so machine I will listen. She said we have to see biggest little farm and we will
at last night and we were just riveted, so it was really exciting that you agreed to come on. I'm really happy too, to be here in its exciting to be having farming be talked about in the way that it is especially last couple years. So it's fun to be a part of this well any in its also because I think it so couple things before we get into this like. I knew usually, if I'm talking to someone about a movie, we can. I don't wanna talk about it too much because almost anything but there's no, I have to talk about something happened in it. And so what I would say of yours if you know this isn't like this move is not like an episode of breaking bad like you, you can have some, spoiled, but if you really don't wanna know anything to see it and now your chance to turn this up go watch the movie come back, but honestly, I think you could listen because it's the journey of it is this. The store, there's so much unexpected stuff,
does happen that, even if you give away spoilers theirs- and it does not take away from the experience- because I think it's one essentially unexpected perspective flip after another- yes, it is and what I keep telling people is. Even if you do, give a shit about farming, there's so much amazing life metaphor, because- and this is kind of one of the areas that I want to talk about so just so. People you were not you and Molly were not farmers at all. You lived in Santa Monica and you were a do. You weren't you shot documentary basically beautifully by the way, which other reason them if we works, because you know about visually, tell a story- I mean the footage stunning. Thank you
you through a series of circumstances, decide ok, we're just gonna. I mean that that was obviously there's only so much time in the document like about. But what was really the process from you guys going. Let's just start a farm: why not, let's just go, do it, I mean what how long was that process? What went into that and how to do? How did you make the final decision like this? What we're gonna do this to the deeper there's, a couple of things one? Yes, we didn't have any real experience in farming, so to speak speak up. I did work on two conventionally run. Very industrial corn soy farms as a kid opening up and on the Eastern Shore of Maryland knew nothing about soil. Factored the the system and a farm were not things that were connected together. You were battling the ecosystem to get the ecosystem off your farm, but we consider ourselves people who lived in nature yeah right, so I didn't come to this with any real understanding about what it means to bring an ecosystem into the farming equation. Ok, the way we got this
several things one Molly was like this really in listed in how food Granada Nutrient Dense way and prepared in certain ways that traditional cultures prepared food, automatically effected and individuals, health and vitality. So borrowing from all these, like traditional understandings of like ferments and some food select in like What am I going to say? Ferments, sorry, most maternity, that's ok, like New since in the soil, or denies that the food is yeah like out just a different food for pet preparation techniques that ultimately maximize digestion of the nutrients available that is not putting a bunch of preservatives and things will it's also, but it's also sourcing food that is being grown and soil that informs the nutrient profile of the food. Ok, you know were eating.
changes that are, you now say, seventy five percent, less vitamin c say than arches of the that our grandparents eight you know, because, as the just there did, not you're, not valuing the nutrient mineral innovation through the same where these two areas, so we were interested in food. That is one thing, but we both also were deeply. We were people who everything we did had have purpose in meaning that's just how we aligned as a couple and There is a bit of an end to the road of that pursued in both of our careers me as a filmmaker. Hers is private chef because there wasn't a real, true reconnection to nature in any of the things that we did and ultimately we found was that you can pursue, meaning you can pursue purpose, but without a reconnection to life, giving forces of nature, you're not actually having the human experience and well.
farming kind around that out and farming in a way that is requiring one to actually utilise the forces of an ecosystem and bring them back into the equation. Not only forces you into a in connection with nature, but a very vulnerable and humble reconnection to where you are becoming too and upon the life, giving forces that we thought we controlled and you understand the more deeply and from all that meaning and purpose becomes more profound well in it that, and that, I think, is also the secret sauce of the movie, because, as when you guys it's so amazing tat were actually add applicant from sounded so amazing to see it because you guys get here, it's fuckin sand lot like it. Doesn't it's a dirt, pile it and of of dirt. That's like what do you do with this right? I mean was that in its wake? where'd acres, we didn't know it yeah I was about to an it was less we act. added some on, but it was about a hundred through
we started, but it was. We didn't know how bad it was because they were trees sitting on top of this soil. That was dead, so the soil with essentially dirt with which was a medium with which to hold the trio. So when you so when we ve been- you guys right go. This is look so there were some grass there was grass, but there was no grass. There is nothing growing under the trees right. That was anything Next, you were under a crop was considered competition, but I pastures and there were as grass in it. But when you actually walk out, you will notice that there is about eleven to twelve to fourteen inch spacing between the pieces of grass, which is the beginning of desertification. Ok, right because now that day dense is the beginning of the erosion process and the destruction of the diversity of soil. Ok, rikers plants build soil plants, feats of plants, protect soil without plants. All that starts to die right right, so is beginning to happen. Even in the pastures that were considered, you know, their entire worth was based on
grass in, but you didn't really know that in the beginning opens. I didn't understand how to see any. What? How did you know? That's the whole thing if you don't know how to see this stuff, you don't even know what's missing one button, but then how did because I know you- to raise money jump to purchase the farm. So how do you convinced? But how do you go? Okay, so we're gonna start a farm war, are you, kids did unique. Let me just as we have a partnership with our investor, and they are you know they are in the end the progress, and we are partners very unique way, like most farmers are owned by the bank like right now, it's actually interesting, Big farmers in America right now carry on annual four hundred billion dollars worth of dough. My regard right raises an that's with a twenty plus billion dollars a year subsidy from the federal government, and on top of all that this past year has been an increase in farmers for farm foreclosures, up
twenty four percent, oh my god and suicide rates. I think you will find we will find that suicide rates for farmers this year have been higher than they ve ever been before. That is that's heartbreaking, so, what's the I mean it hung about a broken system, so the method with which we look at the economics of the entire farming industry have to change, because everything that we're doing right now subsidizing such not only destructive, economically Nunneley does destructive spiritually to people's lives. We're talking about environmental destruction. We have calculated forty four billion dollars in topsoil lost every year to the extractive methods of farming that have been designed to be able to grow. Food is cheap,
it is possible for you what that super short sighted, yes, but but with, but you know that the population of our country is more than its ever been so and it just seems to go up and there's not a food shortage. So there's does it so. So what is the? What is the reason is its soil, or is it just the soil erosion or like? What's the missing piece? That's not connecting the farmers with the people who will consume the food I mean, and what will we take trillions of dollars and healthcare of years or as a as a direct relationship to the inferior food product that we leave traded? The essentially sweet tasting high carbohydrate food for food that used to have high minerals, asian and flavour, ok right and those that would then can
the nutrients to ultimately inform your did. The best version of your got micro biome, which is european system, is that is it because of cheap mass production, its yet started back in a world war, two one with their food shortages. You now, and it was like you know, from victory, gardens too, like right now, industrial agriculture came in sight grow as much of one thing is possible: feed the world in our food. This nation is a net. National security is always directly linked to soil health, ironically enough and the ability of a nation to feed its food, so it basically the cheap food movement it just. It is here that the active backup I gotta tell you a little bit of a storm, clearly got here. So if you take, if you take the Euro X, billions you say you how many billions yours, you think Europe around me. Just seven, ok oldest get everybody has their number but arrived at eleven years around five US billions of years. If you take that five to seven billion years, the planet's been alive and you spread that across a want one calendar year. Ok here
homo sapiens didn't show up on that calendar year, yoletta. Second, last, twenty three minutes. Ok, last twenty three minutes! On December thirty, first we show up the industrial revolution which less has been two and sixty years ago. The industrial revolution on that calendar year reflects the last two seconds on December. Thirty. First, in that two seconds, we ve destroyed a third of the world's topsoil wiped out eighty five percent of the wetlands we ve deforested forty six percent of the trees and we ve taken carbon numbers from two hundred carbon atmospheric carbon numbers. From about two hundred, four million to over four hundred parts per million in just two seconds in just two hundred and sixty years, but we ve done that completely unconscious of the consequences and the consequences are this. We were aware
truly aware that we were completely reliant upon the finite natural resources of this planet that go away if we don't regenerate them with, We were like resource billionaires right. We thought it's like take out. Well, if you need more Peter, you disorder Fort, there's, not another planet. That's ever going to deliver food to us. Everything that we have given that we know of, has come from soil and pass through the soil fur
and we're allowing a very valuable resource to leave us and we have not connected- are dependency on it too. You know our future and our children's future. It's the ideology of cancer, which is why dont think humans are cancer, because cancers unconscious of the fact that it eventually kills the host with which its dependent upon right humans are no longer unconscious at that, and that's what's changing so all of these questions we ve been taught to as well as regenerative agriculture, even financially viable or how you can feed the world without way of farming. All these things can be flipped very quickly if you truly understand that that kind of questioning has gotten us to this point, because we ve become completely ignorant on the most basic
simple forms of our existence. Is it possible that is it? Is it I mean obviously possible, but you know I I sort of think of it, like you know, everyone's become so reliant on the in our culture on the internet. Now it do eat like. Is there a point where there's just some sort of apocalyptic event where nature just like screw? You guys we're starting over and then you'll, then you'll have to learn from previous mistakes: like is it- is going to have to be somewhat catastrophic event for the people have the right now right now, if I had sixty five cows scram together on a piece of ground that had no snow live soil, it was, I say, like a feed lot where there is nothing to process the urine. Nor coming out of the backside of the cow taking down breaking down and putting it back into the nutrient cycle of the plants beneath it and all of a sudden one of those cows got the corona virus? My point is that we're
being an epidemic right now, right, that's based on you know, stocking density of human beings and unhealthy conditions right where things are going to be you're gonna, experienced, Amano crop past and disease outbreak on farms were experiencing. That organ experience, that with people that, if we don't look at this whole entire thing, is the ecosystem itself as an immune system and its based on two things. So health and biodiversity and farms play an enormous role in the regeneration or destruction of biodiversity and or the regeneration and destruction of topsoil. That is the pump that actually regulates the entire planet. So if I'm sprang my crop of corn, that I only grow one type of corn and I spray something to kill, the bug is attacked that corn and in the process, I kill all the bees and all the humming bird and all the other things around it. Those things have a consequential force or a consequential
sing effect to the rest of my euro system. But I dont understand that cause. I don't see it on my farm, but it begins to stick together as a fabric of destruction right right and we're not seeing how our immune system is tied to our biodiversity, so yeah. I think we're ultimately going to see more plagues, we're going to see these epidemics of disease, both in crop and in humans, and you know we run out of solutions to try to fight nature and beat it over the head with a hammer. We have to forget all how to work alongside of it and try to understand why the bad things exist here, because you in the in the film how all the other and more and more per californian others a blot of farmland around here- and you said they all it's. It's sort of like big farm. They from on one thing and they weren't doing very well at the time, and you had this what's funny do here, just to hear you describe like this revolutionary idea of creating diversity in this sort of fruit basket model of of of trees, and
different animals that are creating the the the ecosystem and at the time, when you was this idea? Did you talk The people, Mary with alike, will good luck with that. Of course they felt we're in they thought we were insane. But let's let me be clear, like I didn't know what we were going to was gonna work. All I know is that it made sense to me, because I had been through some, how things too, with now both Molly and I both where they got microbe biome, addressing the issue of our got actually changed my health condition and started to learn how soil in the gut microbiology. This are the same thing. They operate off same principles of diversity and in an abyss. Need to assimilate and process nutrients and converted into energy and the forces of life, and once you start to connect, those things just starts to me and so essentially, what I'm saying is light the MIKE the the fractal understanding of my stomach was relegated replicated again as a microcosm of the farm, which is a microcosm of
of the planet, and so that was all I knew, and so, when you try to explain that kind of thing to another farmer who has been growing say, one type of crop gathered, it looks like a crazy and they should, because this is not the they ve been taught to see the world right. You know in the vote. I think the only thing we had working to our advantage was our ignorance was it wasn't, you didn't know what you couldn't do. It was a willingness to come in and so differently, because if I come with a baggage of like me, no unfortunate ocean farmer and all my grand poppies and Graham get my daddy's grandpas I'll, tell me look at it. This way will then I'm than always feel shame whenever I deviate from the way to look at the world who and what I didn't have as anyone shaming me on look not looking at it with a more open and accepting view so zones what a discover connections with my wife in the process of this farm, because I was open to discovering them because, had an already put into my mind that they were not possible and so the the gentlemen who came in
Alan, your Island York, who it so funny because he's almost dislike Ben Kenobi He is the only one he s the only one he sort of comes in and he's got this ponytail, and is this like this any dresses and linen just like a dog and he's got these quote crazy ideas about how, and so he was our concern and our mentor, and he turned view is the only one that believes in what we are trying to do. I mean he's like he's basely like a land whisperer like he understood he understood and it's funny, because he kind of tells you like. Well, it's gonna, take you. I think he maven says: like a seven years for this too, like really get up and running, and the documentary is a period of about seven years and he was seems like he was right and so process of watching you turn this dirt
I'll into like the way it's mapped out and watching you, the life stuff, that its fast adding to me that I think will resonate with anybody, is we'll tell ourselves these stories about how you know if it's the, if then thing will, if I get to this point of success, then then I will be happy and that everything will be easy and then my life will be a piece of cake and what You find when you watch this movie, is that at every phase you like break through another barrier, your lives actually get harder, because it's a whole see you unlock a whole new series of problems, issues responsible he's stresses so it's like your constantly cresting this little mountain and then- Oh shit, the skies, but you know, and then it's a whole other series of problems that you have to solve and it feels like and obviously
no we're watching an hour and a half or whatever over seven. You know that's set from Eurostat, its compressed, but did it did you ever get to celebrate? the wind along the way with that sort of immediate, like you, ash. Yet, oh god, what true? If we talk till, I come to this finish line so the moment where you can on a fire life as either like it worked or didn't, and people say is it? Is it better now I can still do and with all those issues, and, unlike you know what this is, what we learned its not actually about and this is going to sound- maybe he's going to sound a little bit overly idealistic, but it's the absolute truth. It wasn't about winning. It was about seeing it differently and knowing that all of your fear can be flipped as soon as you turn on the the the antidote to which his curiosity and have hope,
so. It's about curiosity and hope and knowing that, if you're willing to be curious about while every why every bad thing is in your life is or why why a bad thing in life is happening. You have the opportunity to find within that bad thing. The opportunity for growth and a more beautiful life than you ever could have imagined. That, I think, is the magic of this stuff free and why I say like, even if you don't understand or even care about farming, which I think you should. But if you don't do that It is not about farming unravelling farming as far as a film about life in that's exactly what happens, to take place on a farm and in the eyes that, every time you fight nature or you fight the barriers, you get knocked on your ass, and so then you have to start asking better questions like like with the coyotes that keep killing everything. Why ok, ok? How can we implement? How can we make this a part of the ecosystem and work with it? The first? Why does the Cairo exist
that's the first question: why does the bad thing even exists? We can try to figure. We tried all that organ. How do we stop the clarity right or should the courage to put more fences up? We do this. We do that, but first the most important thing. Is it wise the kite? Even here? Oh ok, the currency does a couple of things: the custody. Actually, it's gophers, that's one of our past Kennedy actually eats rabbits, that's another one of our past. The coyote. Actually is a pollinator: it moves pollen through ecosystems, as it brushes pass one Bush to the next. It eats seeds from one plant and cross pollination to another part of a biome. And it's doing all these things that no other animal does just like that coyote. So there's a value for the coyotes. So it's it's! Suddenly you look at the coyotes like oh, it's kind of got a roll, and if I kill it, I'm probably going to have more rabbits and I'll probably go more and then there's always other, like eco effects that I may not
Please it's like sprang the core Nu Yok you're, just killing one thing: we're not solving my value, the coyote now so it's a little different, I'm not just trying to stop an annoying past. I've fallen a little bit in love with this creature in hopefully not an overly reckless way, but in our case I think it got very reckless I'll leave it up to the viewer surely I think we we went too far and we lost a lot of animals over our trying to understand the clarity. But that was our journey. We were honest about it, but but then you suddenly start to see now solving that problem has a purpose and intent fulness behind it. That's not that's not just one dimensional in its just the same with with Monsanto, everyone hates Monsanto and bear item two, but guess what we invented them, because we wanted our food cheap, and so they think the people that work for those companies think they're saving the world. They think they're provided
service and we're trying to fight against them, but we don't understand where the reason they exist. So we have to create a reason for them not to exist. Innovating around them with turned our innovative brains off well, because we want everything solved in a half, a second we will not? Actually we have oil patients Fernand patients which like? Why can't I just spring? something on then fix it or make it go away like no and you when it when you you see your journey it. It seems like time and time again. You learn that lesson to finally get to a place for you like. Ok, I get now, you know and it but it, but you guys get knocked down a lot for there is a lot to acceptance finances to anyone who's in whose in recovering added theirs
to the serenity player know me round. I am, I am a Rick, I more recovering drinker, I totally with there you go again having you change the things that you keep, can and accept. The things you cannot change with its Athens part is hard because really hard, because we live in a while, our culture, basically and and I believe, the sort of like it all doubt of. Like these sort of post war era of, like you know, we as a culture have suffered a lot. We went there pressure with through war, we went through a be no toxic industrial revolution. So now you know we have some space and are too I'm. So, let's get comfortable, you know, and but comfort is also an addiction and we seek it out at any cost now and even when it actually works against us or keeps us from evolving or keeps growing as we never. Want to feel uncomfortable at any given moment. Instead of accepting like life is kind of discomfort and just navigating through it
it's very hard to do so it so right. I don't feel like all addiction is really almost like has spawned from like an abyss. to connect well, it is that, in my view, needs a lot of things, but it's also like what he said like we. What why do we have the addiction there's physiological reasons we have. there's provision areas that we have it by what but its. But if you find connection, that's what that's! What aid you know, that's what sure a provides is like a connection to community and it's like it's actually part of the healing process, but I think well, we're all seeking is a form of reconnection. So like this, I mean just go back to some these early and say that we want, here now real quick fix it. You know the real quick fix society. The beauty of life to me comes in the time that it takes to understand these things that ultimately drives a much deeper connection
to understanding these things. There are areas of purposefulness in a meaningful ness right to life, and so that impatience, unfortunately, is the thing that gets in the way of experiencing a more beautiful human existence which, which is part of that is pain and Lawson, and and it's not just, I feel, happy all the time so arriving too numb. You know because it did not right in the same things, for she would like with drinking a drugs or sex addiction or work addiction wherever it is get a lot of people when they, when they quit drinking ago one or feel better. It's like! No, you! U dont! Yet, because now you ve removed the obstacle you remove. The blinders
you have to do their work to figure out. Why? Right now, you can ask those questions. Why are we doing this? Limiting our plant works, because this is really tell me if the slight resin leave you like how plant. So we looked at our plants that they were completely dependent. We got here. They were dependent upon the farmer for everything, ok, sort of like an attic. They were dependent on them, a quick fix of nitrogen, potassium phosphorus, very basic ingredients right, not a very healthy sort of mineral concussion, just the basics right and everything that they were getting was they were getting from a quick from the farmer. There are not having to search for any of those things as soon as we turn the soil system back on. We create all these different. We re populate, essentially the soil with bacteria micro organisms, and you know different fungi, specially MIKE arising fungi right, which is this fungus. It actually develops a relationship with the root of the plant. That's now in search of something it needs that it can't get because the farmers not just giving it to it,
the route Tipp of the plant is actually searching and now having to create this relationship with this fungus that want something from the plan called carbohydrates, sugar that the plant makes to the process of photosynthesis, but the platte once something from the fungus that the fungus can get in its cause. ass for and micro organisms. Arc are micro, icy so to connect to the route it sends out these my celia sort of strands in search of phosphorus too then feed it back to the route Tipp of the plant in exchange for sugar, just by the fact that the plant has to figure out life on itself now reaches out. Four connections, define mutual logistic and symbiotic relationships that are done official to both sides and that too, and then see on others around them creates a community of a million yet and if you could talk to the plants, they would probably say yes, this process of having to find that fast
This is not an enjoyable process right by it, but the same thing it was hard to grow new new. You know it was uncomfortable yet by like an arrow plasticity, its physically hard to grow regularly, and I- and I think that's that's a really apt comparison, because you know especially with addiction- I think most attics probably agree? I'm not trying to speak for everyone that much like the plague. Much like the plant in the beginning of that story is that we can have issues live in connecting in the world, and so we tend to isolate and just- I do not mean just get what we need to just survive rather than than being a part of the of the system, and I think that's, hopefully what sobriety does its? Hopefully, what's you know like this sort of ecological sustainable farming does, but it it, but you have to accept the discomfort is part of it and be ok with it, which
was hard, but it's like you say in the movie, you you have to search after risk. The plant has to put some routes out. It has to do some work to find and it may not be received right and I think when anybody go something bad and life, it's a lot more difficult when you're alone, totally it's really really hard to be vulnerable. To ask for help. Yes, really vulnerable. Yes, especially if you live in a especially if you're hurt, your soil or the people in your life herb toxic right and then in. So how do you? How do you do that? It is neither the one good thing about the internet is the does connect people in that way, but it's also the acceptance of because our producer, Katy, I said, are you see the filmy chagos? I'm scared because she loves animals so much, she knows that she's gonna, watch, animal like there there's loss and that's very hard and you come to that place- It's it's it's. There was a light in there that completely floored me where you say you know it's something to the effective and I'm sorry, I'm watching this. The fact
the ecosystem relies on impermanence it it'll its fuel. by impermanence, and so we are sad as it is. We have to accept the decay, because without the decay there's no, regenerated life, it just doesn't work every part of who you are. through the soil. First like you, are nothing. We are nothing more than a yellow or a leather bag. Leather bag of nutrients, all right borrowed from the soil, weird we're the we are, the make up of things that used to be woolly. Mammas little cute white kittens right right and pieces of fruit, everything that we our passed through the soil and people often time that one of the little look at his leg, discus people oftentimes, say it's a circle of life right speaking about impermanence the importance of it
it's not actually a circle. In my opinion, it's an eight and if you look at and ate and as you sort of come from the Centre Cross point of the eight and you come up, that's the birth stage and, as you crossed over to the top part of the eight and start to come down back towards the cross point, that's the deaths stage. Now you're going through the cross stage of life, your passing into the soil. That's the decomposition stage, and you're coming back around the bottom. You ve been fully decomposed or whatever it is plants. Animals have been fully decomposed comes back up through the next cross section, that's the real animation stage, that's where everything that was la alive before has been broken down report. Some becomes literally the minerals and nutrients that fuel all future life and as it crosses through this acts.
you realize now. The x factor of our existence is soil need some pump. It turns everything that was once alive back into something. That's now broken apart, become fuel and energy for all fuel, all future life, so we are fuelled by impermanence and until you understand value impermanence as a law, you can't quantifying your head why loss and end exists, but it exists in infinity and that's why I think a lot of religions have adopted this philosophy, that life is forever, that we live on an internal forms and the truth is we: do I buried a dog? from the film Todd. My favorite dark drills. This entire journey from zero, Katy erosion, what and and buried him next to a mulberry tree because
that relationship with the microphone I in the route of that plan it's gone through and it's broken down. Todd and re purpose taught in those MA berries and when I need that mulberry. I e Tosh o my God, biologically speaking, that's what it is and if you don't, if you turn your head away from your fear over the acceptance of death, you miss this incredible beautiful process that drives life well and because I think again, as we ve got, As we see comfort, as we see you know, we're we're in this sort of stage now of like terminal per cynicism where its everything it's me me me me me me me me me with this sort of fake idea that were a part of something but the thing We seem to be largely a part of you know. The sort of digital culture is not entirely real, like it's made up, but we're not really reconnected right. Right. Remember
connected, but less vulnerable connected than ever before in in a sort of a human way. In terms of I mean I owed again: sitting on it again, as we talked about before their people who it connect with people that help them thing, mother, it's definitely benefits to a, but don't mistaken it for true vulnerable connection like we're have I know a little more nerve, racking, obviously you're, looking at you and, having being then let me talk to you over the internet through email. Of course, I'm saying, but it's also the difference between like you know, everything is how use it. You know like some people can drink one ass of wine every couple days and it helps their heart, other people have to drink ten bottles. It's like the level at which we can sue right, but also the level at which were conditioned to only focus on ourselves and be so afraid of the impermanence, because what? If I'm not here anymore, like rather than I'm a part of this process, it's a natural process. If
if I live forever. I wouldn't really appreciate everything, because nothing would really have a value if there wasn't impermanence like the impermanence is what creates devalue if everything was permanent than if it's like. You know when you, when you, when you are young, you don't give a shit about time, cause you just you have it forever and if Europe a billionaire you don't really value stuff cause you're like well stuff, I can get more stuff. I Carolyn Judo values, you don't value things until they're scared or until they go away, so it's it, it is like I love that part of the messaging of it, because it's the sort of beautiful arc, that's like that almost justifies, or at least it gives all the pain, a purpose not just like we lost our dog or the coyotes eight. This are we lost this animal that we love or all these trees died or you don't think you coming and just finding a field of dead chickens because something got in
when something does die imminent, doesn't make it easier and the loss of the connection to the spirit of anymore. That thing, but I know that, going back into the ground to to become part of the next forms of life, and that's not fake. That's not I mean that's not cartoons that's real right and one for me, I've become less afraid of death because it seems to have more. This now, as I understand the cycle, the truth cycle of life and the magic of that cycle, that that we have on this planet a ten to twelve in soil structure. That is the outcome, miser of death back in the life and that's not something you can say about any other planet that we discuss to date: rape and we're trying to reinvent out on the moon and Mars. With these billionaires, you wanna go up there and try to colonise these places before they understand how the engine of the very system it gave them life even works mean, relatively speaking, to most things that we know of the planet. I think we only know the sole sciences of really only been studied heavily for the last you're so years, right right, willing,
oh, that's a very limited amount about how fungus works and soil, and that's only been since, like this late seventies, or something like that, and that's really crazy to me that we have this incredible thing right in front of us. That explained so much about the life death process. But we don't really understand why and how it works and we're trying to go, find someplace else to do it better and also because to most people they probably just think of it is like a flashy. You know it's it. It relies on patients because the cycle relies on relations, and so it's not enough to talk about on its head. Meaning underground. Yet, if I go, I can't I don't forget. You know how to I am today: that's. Why may the film too, because I felt that to a lot of times when I would speak with sale scientists, eyes role on the back of my head late, it's the most most of us. I just know that they cannot make something means digestible to the average person of which I am in was rowed getting into this. But I realise that there is a way to show the store,
of soil without really talking about soil and the importance of life and death process through this story of farming. That was digestible that made people, I hope, fall back in love with the interconnectedness of nature, but- really understanding in afore dimensional away like really having a visualization of what that interconnectedness looks like right and did did the film came out last year. they gave me came up May of last year, and I imagine you are our people asking speak at conferences. Is there is there more into every? Have you noticed and uptake an entrance are people starting to take notice? I mean I, I did I mean like I'm, I'm so credibly enthralled by it that and also its. It also is a testament to how we, as creatures, love a good story,
and you could have you know. Someone very flatly came up and said so to make use of the scientists what's really important, because the soil is like you know, we have to create them, They will go I'll. What are you said? Oh, but you give people in emotional reason which you did and a visual reason, which is its gorgeous, and all the sudden, like we're emotionally invested now we're listening sword. Have you found that you're speaking, are our companies into state and what you have to say it has happened, and I still am a farmer with my wife and it's been challenging too to take up but take advantage of these opportunities to go talk, but we ve done I've done a few and yes happening more, but also its happening is I'm hearing from other farms have done this for years, even longer than I say, man, people finally understand what the hell we ve been doing a thank you, and I really respect that, because you know our methodology is not prescriptive. You know it's not meant to be prescriptive in how we ve
arm? It's meant just sort of illuminates some sort of basic truths about what it means to be: a regenerative farmer and the importance of bias city and farms that are doing those things. are now finding it way easier for people to understand the value of the food that they grow. And you know it does cost more and but there's this trade off of ecology impact and health that regular starting to value, and when you sort of look when you look back at the seven years, seems like a lot really happened in those seven years. Do you think of it in phases? Do you feel like? Oh this was that phase, and then we got to this day. I definitely how do you? How do you so so, if you're mapping out like the EPA, does I as well this, namely that we sort of map out like epochs in history, like you know, look how do you kind of map out in the first two? This is funny cause. Alan told us is what was going to happen and Alan Boiler alert passes away and found them it's
but when he passes away, I think, is still very, very whatever, and your left like what Would we left it? I do not believe that the worst time so the first two years is about to map out the first two years is about the the item and ideology and your full of this excitement and belief and hope impossibility. Somewhere around years, three and four, smile will leave your face. You realise that all the things that you are now fighting or because of the ideology created all of these problems that were not here, because you brought nature back and so you're wondering why in the hell, would anybody ever do this and just as you're about to give up around your five begin to see the return of nature that has a direct effect on the balancing the rebalancing of these epidemics of and disease, and then you start to see that increase with, with with intensity from your five to your seven
now you're? Finding that you understand the rhythms of your farm, which are like the rhythms of life and that their Not really. A new problem is just sort of the same issue with a different face and you have the lenses with which to view problems now, which make problems seem a whole lot less scary right, because you understand that your greatest strength is your curiosity and that's what continues to get you through and by year, ten According to Alan, you wonder why, in the hell? No one else is doing it like this. I'm gone there yet I don't really were fairly way better than we used to do. That's really funny, because if it does so like, even here and you describe it, sort of that just sounds like a relationship. You start a new relate. You know, like you start any relation So I didn't mention the couples: therapists, unheeded and Molly. I got ourselves a hell of a couples because around here three and four Alan passed away, first time when everything went sideways.
Literally like the day. Things went wrong. Alan passed away and Molly, and I were fighting over the direction of It is neither of us had any experience right to say. We Who was right or wrong? So we found ourselves on the brink of like maybe not making it as a couple and we found a couples therapist which require the same humility and vulnerability that farming does and it has been in incredible parallel exploration into what its root watch required to would be not only reconnect to the land but to be reconnected. Two years your spouse will yes anything that you I mean I. I do believe that at a base level, we are agrican, draw creatures, even if we are not all we are yes, we're not all like soil farmers. We all farm to a degree and anything that we tend to tends to grow, whether riots, positive emotions, negative emotion
addictions. If you ignore your relationship, it will wither, lay out whatever you are tending to have you tried or maintain being an individual and not be dependent upon anyone. It will destroy you and that I feel like it You you got a great deal of what our culture tells people to do is that you know we came out of this error in the early part of our country is like. Oh, you can be and we should be. We should be individual course celebrate. Individuality, ponytail related kit, just be that you still have to be an individual, but, I think be a part of used to be a part of the world- and you know that is an interesting lesson to learn that oh, I was ten The farmer from that tending to my relationship, that's gonna! Whither, like the farm, would whether, if I didn't pay attention to it, hard to leave here once a week to go, see a couples, therapists, one. We got a bunch of me, no physic, literally sometimes fires on this Of course you know if it feels like. Why am I doing this and you know
I think for man- maybe model men, but four minutes Morse. It feels more like a shameful experience to say that you need help with your relationship and, ultimately, I think, to be honest, What what problems more present in your mind is that you maybe you're the arm the problem out. You know, and fortunately, archival therapists arena was quick to inform you that Molly was ninety percent of it. Ok, now, that's not true. I know that you really do learn. That is a two way street. Any of your bringing all your baggage of your childhood experiences to equation right. You know just like farming like if I brought all my baggage of like the way a farm shouldn't shouldn't be to this farm, I would have never die. Covered the amazing opportunities to find interconnected. You no purpose and the other thing. Being able to say with a relationship, absolutely absorbs yard interrupted. I just think that every time you say something like ten things pop into my mind, I love it you're fantastic. I learned
talk to you all day. If I guess it's great because it because basically what you're talking about, I think what you're talking about is being present radio if you bring in baggage, are living in the past if you fast forward and catastrophes you're living in the future, if you're, not, if you're not paying, if you're paying attention to all of the big ticket, stuff you're kind of living at that street level and being present. So I really it's about you're, trying to create a system that allows you to live in this moment of pure presents where you can like once every the infrastructure. Is, old, then you can sort of stand in the middle of it and see everything in like bullet time, because your fully present with it and you realize that every situation in your life that you want to thrive, you kind of have to do that with or it's. So it is it's weird sort of juggling act. So how do you know
like. What's the trade off, because I'm sure a lot of people are in the situation where the like, I want to focus on my relationship, I want to focus on my mental health. I also have this thing that I'm trying to build that requires an enormous amount of attention how Do I know how to divide my time like there's the there this farming on the actual farm. There's your relationship, farming, there's! You know your mental health farming who, how do I operate? The met, a farm overseas. All of those things, and ultimately is you. I only know how answer for my own personal experience- and I don't know if it applies to everyone. But for me I had a childhood where I was not very happy and rather than maybe given the real true connection and support that I needed as a child, I turned inward and became a filmmaker at night in my room and focused Exe
solely on my work and found happiness in that, and while it gifted me with this, like trade and a life as a filmmaker, and I feel like I became a better filmmaker because of that challenge it. It ultimately meant that any time I was not having success people. I just turned away from people and focused on my work, and I think a lot of people would relate to that. As we know, work a holocaust tend to find happiness in the level of control and sort of feedback. Loop happens in the workplace, but not so much in the family situation and I found that as I've learned that that's something that I've done and- and I and I find joy in the connection to my family- that I find that there might be the possibility for more balance in my life where work is not literally what I need to survive, because I I will say that a lot, because my survival is based the dopamine that I'm getting skirting through my brain as I work out
I feel that same feeling somewhat too, with my family connection right, so that's been my personal journey and I gotta tell ya, know nowhere done, but that journey bananas kind of where I am well. That's the thing is that it. I don't think that every ends at me like now, just that it's something I'm realizing it. Forty eight and maybe it's late or maybe it's early- I don't know, but I'm really wow. That's incredible. I thought that it was so important to be that I was a good filmmaker for other reasons, not because it was actually cause. I was at a really hard time connecting people yeah, but in a lot of that too, and and I've been through that too, with work where I sort of felt like why don't have value. Unless my career has value, which is course, riches crazy, because their identity, you can't control that, that's just all about
trying to control the external world and trying to cram external things into you to feel whole. But that's not at present. It doesn't work that way, and so now, at this place, where I feel like I enjoy work, it's fun, it's ok to do it find to make money. It's other things are fine, but it's also like it doesn't mean everything you know like I'm fine than I am, be the happiest when I'm connecting with friends, I'm having experiences I'm somewhere with my wife or we're just hang out. You know like, and maybe that comes with it- maybe when we're young, we don't have the wisdom and experienced enough to under in that, and so we seek it an artificial ways. Court and we have to get you know- we have to go through life in canada- kicked around with Like? Ok, I'll? That's not that's not gonna work! It's like the point that pesticide, like that's, sprang the pesticide on the corn. You know like how to why
really be a part of the world, and how do I really connect? And so, but I think that just comes what I mean you told me that when I was you know to ten, years ago, fifteen years I wouldn't want stood. What you were talking back as I did you ask you just have to live life too hard. You understand that, but I think Why point of it? Yeah? That's why we're here and that that's? Why thinks so? Many older people seem crazy when they're like to hear that stuff. If I could go back, I would spend more time with my kids. I would spend more time Secondly, the arts in all these older guys will tell me that men don't miss system, miss this and you you think it's free, there's they're trying to signal from the view you're saying go back yet that if you only seek value and little things that it doesn't led to a place because then there's that sort of constant Dick like? Will that didn't work so more? Will that didn't work so more that didn't work and then then you're that plant that can't survive
on its own article that hasn't diversified that hasn't diversified end? It is, and it hasn't become vulnerable dependent upon other things for its existence. The idea of biodiversity is AIDS is a necessary part of life, and you see it like you know put you U seed and dog breeds who'd. It's like you know. There was a certain dog breeds. They get so inbred that it it it like they're worth while he's get strengthens yet again. Prettily here are ease, they arrive there too. There are provided Jerry, heavy and so like absolutely Teresa. time and time again why diversity is so important, like diversification of genes, diversification of environment, you know in, and so it's interesting just like the idea of diversity no, we talk about an entertainment business. We talk about an hour well like how important it is to be diverse and in your film is basically like it. Not only was
important for our farm to be diverse, but it is necessary and vital for the world to adopt a diversification mentality. Absolutely I think it's Millie what makes like look at New York City. I feel like New York City. Has this been forced to live within that diversity, that it sees the power of beauty and culture to cultural differences? Right from that all this amazing are is born right. All this creation and innovation from business in art is born from that rights are not a lot, a really great artists and innovators and thinkers in the corn field that I was growing up in pretty much a bunch of blue eyed white guys. Well it, and it's also about like called the sex to like. If you, if you and and also, I think this is why it's really important to not just surround yourself with your own ideas, all the time, because any time you do that you are you basically pain yourself into this called the sack and you're not being
challenge you're, not growing you're, not to think- and you know like- I grew up in the south and I've talked to people who are like whatever new to leave. For what do I need to leave home? It's like! Well, you should travel, want or need to travel. You know it's like, but you do because that's how you understand and appreciate the world as a whole, and you realize that You know we are not everything and our own ideas on everything and why it's important to cross pollinate and too, even if you dont necessary, early agree with all of the stuff that you're seeing at least you can get an understanding in your part of the human experience, and it is that the these all of these ideas are why I think it's important for people to escape its thick. As there's like, there's like and a near infinite number of life, lessons that that that bloom out of it- and I think the beauty of it- is that so many people could watch it and take a completely different idea away and at the core. It's just. This is a cop
it's a complex, but just the simplest idea of just you- know creating this biodiverse ecosystem and am preserving it and, let me just say two things: the mediator and only this off, but a lot of times. I think we feel people feel a tremendous amount of guilt and they want to do something that they get expire. They see the movie, maybe they can go on from a farmer that what can I do, how can it be a part of like actually regenerating the world and making it a healthier place and I'd say and then often times it look at what method of your agriculture should be applied to every other farm around the world. And I would say, that's not the way to look at it, because there are only two within this story that can be applied to any place in the world on the planet and should be. If we want to see a healthier planet become
of our future, and that is every decision we make about. Farming should be look through the lens of how it will regenerate biodiversity and how it will reach regenerate healthy topsoil and then that begins to inform the methods you're allowed to or decide to use, because you can barely see can very easily see how methods of agriculture will destroy one end or both of those two things and then the way to look at your own personal sort of contribution to this would be. I am a user of food and what I do with the food that I waste is very important because it is a finite resource and so composting. If you live in the city composting be apart. Composting programmes composting your backyard. If you can advocate for government policies around supporting composting and cities, not throwing
these finite nutrients into landfills, where they deserve anything. Yet, while we're trying to figure out the bigger problems of fossil fuels and what are the alternative forms of energy? Literally people saying like while not gonna, write drive my card a moment a ride, my bike, they all do that for like five years and then their driving cars again, and I don't blame them, it's impossible. We haven't figured out the big question on where we're going. At the energy to sort of driver and move people, but what we can do. What what is right in front of us is that we continue to throw away these nutrients in landfills, and so composting is something that this generation should do. While the next generation discovers how to use coal, fusion research point energy or some other alternative fuel source that literally wipe out the problem like New York, had no hunter years ago, when they thought there can be buried in horse nor in horse pissed, because there is no such thing as a car and everybody had horses, all of a sudden summit invented the combustible engine and that price was gone over night. You look at old pictures of New York right like the turn of the century, and it's crazy. You see kids playing near horse. Carcasses like horses were just die.
ST, maybe just fuckin leaving exactly it and it was bury their several feet of manure. It was a major problem that, like the world's going to end, and then someone invented the combustion right for it or who I was and then overnight the problem of sub. That's what it's going to take to solve. The problem, of course caused a new problem, ready right exactly calls the new proud. Every solution, unfortunately, creates a new problem, but that is the end, but I think the acceptance of no solution is why not? You know like no solution fixes everything right? If you can accept that, then I think you can live a happier and healthy. Because you just know like you, every solution creates is: does there's gonna be new they'll be new and innovative problems right, but then you know absolutely right. It is so true, but like there is some something is on the horizon for us, but we can't see it and if you have in your apartment, New York City, your private,
the one. That's gonna invented if it's like, not your job in the world, to do that. Your passion, but you can at least not throw your cut a year. You we're food waste in the damp, and so what do you do with the compost like why So, once you start composting and you get to all of you if you're someone who has a guard, if you're someone as a gardener, porch gardening, you can buy a little composting unit. You can do yourself. That does require some. We know inspiration and you need and want to do that or you could look at what year. Local community, is doing to support you, contributing your compost, ways to other roadside cans or accomplice drop off spot. The gets then used by community gardens or literally gets export it out of the city back to farms to be the night natural resource in fertilisation needs of farms. I'm absolutely gonna. Do this veto we as a huge arenas, NL. I called kissed the ground that does a lot with community composting and a lot of teaching around different ways answers
It is a good round, yeah, really great organization, and they ve got a lotta online videos, sort of teach you about the importance of soil, but that's really what this generation should be about, because I think we get very caught up in trying to solve. massive issues that neither your I have the ability to solve, but our greatest contribution is what we do or don't fall. Away every single day, and I also think people you know big again, because we want. We want to have big solutions that are immediate. Each person feels like why not significant enough. To cause any change, and I would argue that you know if we accept the idea of incremental change. You know like even just doing a little piece of it. It is worth So it has to be our guide. Whatever you do, it has two: it has to trigger dopamine skirting in your brain. I'm serious, so you how you have to find reason.
why you're? If it makes you happier to ride your bike, to work every day than it? Does the compost gb the one that ride your bike? Every work related work every day if it makes you happy or to pick up a piece of travelling noticed, the euphoria follow the path of euphoria and curiosity- and you will build a life of integrated purpose on this planet- yes, because, ultimately I buildings enough and people don't they beat themselves up. Why feel good about this? But is it enough knoweth enough? If you feel good about it and its contributing in a positive which is great art there ditches, which is great because that fights against the idea of you know, the sort of resolution syndrome, which course everyone just went through with the new year, where it's like, oh my god, first of the year, help me seven days, we can we go to the gym five times. Are we going to this and people set these crazy The goals are, they think I'm rich up in my entire life and you're setting itself up for failure because you'll try for weak its. Your miserable right and then you fuck go fuck this December, but if you accept the idea of like little bits at a time, ok
I can make one change in my life. I can. I can compost or I can do that. I can write a bike or I can do this right can and also asking the right questions and being a part. I think we are all meant to contribute. I think how we survived this species is that we're we're genetically programme, need to contribute to one another, which is why wiser people always say like donate your time, do something for other people and every time you do. You feel good and you can act because you're can and you're getting outside yourself. So, even if that's the reason you know like that's a good enough reason, I had a where the podcast studio is theirs a friend of mine came in and he is also an earth whisper he's an actress names. Logan harmonies, like greatest guy in the world. He's from Indiana he's young guys in the thirties, and but he just he just now. Was how the soil works, and he built this vegetable guard. and the literally like built the
tools to make he's a guy like all our This down, I put a leather, strap on here and turned it into a wholly. He behaved like now. There was an average community somewhere in his orbit, and so he understood- and he built this incredible vegetable garden and then his wife's started working out of town, and so he went with her and I didn't know what it just when it. Basically all these vet incredible vegetables, grew and corn. All this amazing stuff and a basics became a snack bar for all of the local fauna, and so at first I like what am I going to do. That'S- why connected immediately with youth when you're in your first couple years later, what the fuck I just created a cafeteria for like gophers end the deer coyotes and there's a bobcat and it just they fuckin eight everything and as our planet like well, you know I, I guess I made their lives better for like rats couple weeks, but if you are dependent upon that and you were a vague and yes and you are too
and upon that you weren't willing to buy any food from any any store, ripe and there's nothing. I have begins at work on the farm and the other was a vegetarian fifteen years. But it is interesting that if you are dependent upon that garden for your food yeah you're, saying all these animals are eating it. What you gonna do just! I ve, daily, but I think it's something too big tears. If you are, if you enough, if you may be that's fine, I don T mean any. This is something we should talk about great, but I get this question a lot like how you, how are you able to do this and in no actually eat animals and audits, bring the question of Samir listers, maybe even thinking it, and I might well I Definitely not four cases can find out feeding operations and the inhumane, bit of animals and I think we ve price meat so cheap that farmers very
the excuse in their mind the inhumane treatment of animals as the weighted, develop cheap food for people to eat, and that's inexcusable. But I do see a very biological important connected need to having animal input and animals be a part of the process of building healthy ecosystems and soil, and they should be a far higher the farming process or you are required to use, and, thirdly, derive chemical fertilizers right, which are also very bad and damaging for the climate, especially nitrogen, which oxidize into the atmosphere is as nitrogen oxide right in his equally bad and maybe even orderly, worse than carbon right and even methane, and all these other things, but having a natural sites. we're living in amongst animals is very important to have to understand that, if you're being, if interesting, have soil worked for you point fingers to prematurely. The other thing to understand is that for me to grow, avocado owes an April carts, and all these other vegetables
requires me on this farm and I'll admit something that no other farm will admit requires me to kill thirty five to fifty thousand gophers ear, tens of thousands of ground squirrels and then inadvertently accidentally even sprang biologically appropriate organic sprays. I killed bees by accident. Humming bird lady bugs life is being destroyed so that you can eat. We all have blood on our hands, so be very, very careful to point very simplistically that there is a right and a wrong, because that's not how nature works. It's all based on one thing, consequences and understand consequences. You need time. You need to understand how what you do affects your life and other lives. Overtime consequences, lead you to a more truthful understanding, but maybe not right or wrong right. So, as we get into this debate, regardless of your eating choices and I believe
need weakens. We need vegetarians, Emily mediators, but we need them to be conscious of the consequences of their action and be careful not to single out any one or other as right or wrong, because polarization is exactly what what has gotten us to this point and we need people who are less about confrontation and more about innovation and polarisation of ideals creates confrontation, because we think that the only way to fight it. But right now we need to do, is come together around innovation and have conversation and have conversation. Well, that's the thing is that we we do we are able to create these? These rapid holes online that just surround our own ideas and any end and we're sort of fat algorithmic. We like hey you're right, you're, right, you're, right, you're, right cause, it's engaging right and we are. We are at least- and I don't believe you,
present everything. I really do believe that in real life, people do have conversations and they target it doesn't seem, is represented on online sometimes, but we are surrounded by our own. He isn't so anyone who does not a hundred percent align with that, because we're able carved these places online that a hundred percent agree with its. If someone even ninety percent, agrees, others that two percent is like, for you know what the fuck you fuck you for not agreeing with me. You piece of shit how the rhythms, algorithms, even a Netflix, develop understanding of your taste and basically create a dashboard viewing experience that pertain specific to your work.
We know that if you were not aware of it, you would think that the rest of the world sees and thinks the way you do absolutely. The reality is is that advertising everything else has been developed. The same way right. Yes, I like we're in a mistakenly thinking that everybody should think like us, because we have all this supported entertainment data to say that we are right. It is, it is a danger. It is yes because it is. It is killing intellectual diversity, of course, because its cutting us off from each other and it's making us all intolerant to people on a hundred percent aligned with our ideas and its across all sectors. Like even entertainment, you know think someone's he's a trailer for a movie and they kind of don't like it's like
Look there's someone. You know, I'm gonna wanna kill this movie. What you're saying you know like and why can it be for other people do enjoy you'll have to like everything so hard for me to read the when someone is critical of the film and my wife is. What do you do that, and am I ain't, how it so painful, but I really do after I get mad and I I write the artificial email to them right and where I say a bunch of horrible things cause I'm hurt. I then start to realize their pay. Active and how they may be. Asking are assuming something about me or my intent that others may share, and that's my opportunity as a storyteller to be out in front of that to actually give an opportunity in a way in that, maybe I didn't see there needed to be a door for well and that's the way I made the film. I really made it not attempting to polarize any belief system about climate.
Farming methodology. I don't point the finger at industrial Agonal point the finger at climate deniers, climate believers- I really just threaded a needle through the important things that most people were unable to see No one can take away from you. Your experience like you're, telling your experience masses. I experienced right, I'm not saying the world should believe it and in the world should do it. You're not like it, but not this one after another, and this is what we learned and when you, when people come at you, you either have the choice to just ignore it and go. I did what I did you don't have to like. It meant everything s before everyone or, like you, said it's an opportunity to go. You know what maybe, instead of like writing that toxic email back african dairy, where you're differentials go right. It's the opportune to say you know what my talk to this person see. If we can understand each other and at least at if, if the, if the only result is that we still come away not agreeing with one another
The satisfaction of knowing that we communicated in a civil way and connected even that's where innovation analyze innovation lies at that guy. A gene bower came out whose, like the head of farm sanctuary- and he came up to me after watching the move, any said, I'm really fascinated understand how soil works, because I dont think I had the full picture, and I like that, A big deal for the citizen to reality. That's incuriously willing you we're Talkin, unlike absolutely come on out, and we had an incredible experience. You know I wasn't looking to change him. He wasn't looking to change me, but we actually, amongst that conversation, develop some real, innovate, innovative ways and care of the specifics now around thinking about these issues, and that's that's butte. That to me still stands out as one of the great moments of my experience after the film is being able to come into alignment with people who used to just write. Like me, hate letters not really knowing mind tat who I was or how I saw the world and- and I think that's that's the stuff
remember as stuff that I'll go to my death bed with yeah and also it's the way that we evolve and it's the way that we move forward the exchange of ideas We are just inbreeding our own ideas it we're going going to strengthen. We were we know like will strengthen some good stuff. It will strengthen a lot of bad stuff too, and when we won't be as open- and you know I I- I hope- that what people the other thing people take away from this is that sort of like, let's start the conversation, because when someone does come at you in a harsh way number one, then the inner common social media would ever have basic has become an extension of our emotional brain. It's like the second. You have an impulse, it becomes permanent text or you know like that. Permanent permanent,
but basically your cementing is very dangerous and its dangers, and so, but if you can sort of step back from that, ok, this person, their brain fired in. They immediately wrote this, maybe there's something else going on. Sometimes when you talk to people and then they open up, then their defences come down, they go. You know what I just haven't a weird day or you know I had this experience. That sort of this triggered that- and I felt weird and you know but now that we ve talked about it. I feel a lot better and of course, there are gonna, be some people who are just chaotic, able they're, just gonna wanna fuck up your life in your day, because that Bulgaria impulsiveness as that is the most terrible part of I think the internet, because you can't take it back once its printed. In that way, it's sort of like we know it's sort of like the fire that kind of frames the move and you ve been. Fortunately, you ve been very you ve been very lucky here of drinking afire with actually had a really bad starts the fire season, and then it we re, ended, but we ve actually have some of the worst fires even closer to us.
Sheer than even the ones in the film, and while we are making the film editing the film. That's when that far happened, so we were literally evacuating the barn with the drives. We edited the fuck velamir and why at the same time moving animals around, but that's it part of life like we have no next jumpsuits for the guy's. Now myself in the others, were out trying to move animals in case we get caught in a basically a wall, fire whom we have invested in Wildlife fire truck, you know it's a new reality, that really is quite scary. Like the peoples, it was the biggest difference in the last like eight years- and I would say, the winds beats the dryness. Yes drought, we all know about, but the wind species to be thirty to fifty miles an hour during those events and then in the last two years they ve been sixty to eighty miles an hour you have sustained winds resisted eighty miles an hour for like twelve hour periods and like you put fire on that's a blow torch. I don't care how good of a farmer you are
how much moisture is in your soil, it's eventually going to burn through you know this is an overstatement but concrete it's going to burn through stuff, so it is a little different and am I still hopeful yeah. I just see. Does it it's a symptom of imbalance and we as the human stores? If we ve done this much destruction of the last two and sixty years without consciousness, two incredibly naive and still naive. People, John and Molly, did with seven years with just a consciousness for the effects that we have on the planet. In seven years we returned a farm to better it was that took forty five years of extractive farming to destroy, and I think the human species has far more powerful than it ever could imagine just by being conscious of its existence and its consequences to nature, and I think we're going to reverse this problem in a far short a period of time and it took us to destroy which is so. beautiful and hopeful. It's true of its effect is whether or not we wanted whether or not we want to put in the time, because the
you could always moved: the moon even just hearing it in that context of like forty five years to destroy it in seven years. turn it into this matter than what a lot better than what it was and let's argued, let me say that we shouldn't even be farming here, nor should only be in the debt like practically the desert, scald Chaparral, but it's like the desert shouldn't be living here, let alone farming here, but now that we are, how do we do it in a regenerative way and when you are not solely focused on yourself as an individual, and my needs are always first kind of a thing. You sort of look at you and when you embrace the impermanence I think- and you say you know what, because what what what one point of view is like well we're all gonna die Sundays. Why? For can do anything? You know what you might come back and you might come back, but the
side is like in various forms. Wouldn't you were half her be when you rather be part of the regenerative process. Like you know, if you have kids that that notion starts to go away, Oda essentially have a kid. You start to realise that this is about me it's about leaving him something better than what I had and that does change and I get how something can feel very selfish why I'm dyin cares, but you have a kid. You look in the eyes: accumulate man really gonna, leave them with something more the new started with. I don't, and also not a moral imperative, just the idea that you know that during fires season everything could go up and then you would have to make a decision which I assume you would probably start over, but rather then what answer to an eye exactly and rather than rather than catastrophes in that and being immobilized by it? I imagine you go. You know what we do, what we can, while we're here
when that maybe it doesn't happen, we ve survived a lot of problems and if it comes up, we maybe figure it out or maybe it's not as bad as we think maybe set as bad as you think, but also because you put yourselves because you risk related before we get to the point- we innovate something they get passed on to one individual one, individual who goes on to change the entire world because of one little thing we inspired in them in the way that we do something like I was able to go. Well, do you think you're film will change the world and I have no idea, but I would love to have been the thing that inspired Einstein to think differently, to have the courage to think differently could look at the effect that one person had. So we have no idea like even this podcast how many people listen to it. Thousands of people there may be person that here's one thing on this podcast. It goes on to change the entire world as we know it, because your cross pollinating ideas. We did something good
that is about feel worth it that is now being process oriented. Instead of result, oriented no rapid, you have a farm in their. Its results are important because the farm house I see myself as a small part of it, and I just hope that I'm contributing in a way that's going to have some effect on future generations to build an add on to the intelligence that we were still trying to collect. You now, and I think it's it's be very defeating to sort of thing that it doesn't matter right. It does, and I think if you dont have a kid and look into the eyes another child and say that to them that it doesn't matter what I do right doesn't matter highly this earth. For you like this, no idea what they are about to face, while also we would not have felt cool, as kids of some was like. Hey fuck. You can't. I don't care. What have you like that feels bad? You know as we're winding down. First of all, you get do give tours. We do ok, so you got that not that often once a month and it, People are interested in the best thing to do is sign up on our mailing less because we
been very overwhelmed, so we don't know on social media anymore? We just send it out to a mailing list because literally they crashed it crashes, our are what little those only knows and the chickens are in charge of our website, a terrible at it at something we sign up for an hour, a proclaim, farms, dot com and it's a great weight interact with the farm. But I guess it we don't do that often, but and we don't dernburg viruses and bright will start in back up. I think in March and the spring summer and then Pa Fall Winter Rihanna chill out, and my other delegations are win. Where is where's all of your stuff available like It felt her out into the zero farmers markets done Santa Monica were like the Wednesday market, Santa Monica Sunday market wearing calabash us. I know namely to others My chamber, the names will now just lost my tray thought it were an airway, and other sort of artisan type shops carrier stuff, and we also
EL some things online, not mostly not fresh produce but other other things. Like jams and olive oils and things like that intolerant of a top to bottom. Can you sort of list off like these? Are all the things that we growl yeah two hundred and fifty oh, my gosh lot of stone from Africa. Lots of different varieties of avocado instead of just maybe one right. We do peaches, plums, nectarines apples Orange is all different types of citrus come clots, then we have a vegetable garden, which is a much smaller operation than we have. Eggs were known for We don't do a lot of them because we focus on quality and the ecological restorative effects that chickens can have on land. So we don't overdo it we sell broilers, lamb, beef and some pork no lot, that's pretty much! That can caution, but the olive
It was something that people can order. Online great has a super high smoke point: who are people into that grilling with oils? and other olive oil is coming out soon. That's pretty much yeah! It's it again! When people watch this movie like a couple of the couple of Epiphany moments that I had watching or the the thing about impermanence feeling that it is fuelled by permanent scare the situation with the coyotes. That is heartbreaking for you, and then you figure out how to work with it and then also how the snail problem get solitary, shocking, amazing and those of the moment like. Oh my god, if I can just figure out, you know, instead of like destroying my problems, if I can ask better question entirely in our life, there's somebody who is not credit
got it. I don't think that there are constantly making your ecosystem hell, but there's some quality in them that probably of direct in the right way is incredibly powerful. I get that question a lot from people who try to apply this way of thinking to businesses starting with the tires and nails in your life and their account. Israel, I put it's all part of it and even if I were a great way to look at life and then what is the sort of you know as you are ever learning, as you said it, what is sort of like the big for you? What was the big? What was the big take away because it must have you ever see lived through it But when you watch the film- and you see this highlights real of the seven years of all the big moments. What is your personal take away like? What do you think? Besides the sort of literal like that, you know the soil is busy is what where the life is like. What is what kind of the philosophical thing that you take away from it? We think for a second, I sort of touched on it
think that you know we live in an infinite cycle of eggs. They know existence in different forms. That is based on this whole biology of of of soil life. And that you know, there's not very simple, right or wrong. Clear answers to things in our existence, specially that I've learned through the farm that it really is based on these key the quences and sometimes a consequences, don't show show the way until several years beyond what you think is even possible to I'm sustain or wait for an answer, and something beautiful comforting in that and that whenever I am afraid. The antidote, like I said to that fear, is my abilities, stay curious and we
We are living in a culture where the polarization and anger that's calls from that has a squint our eyes and turn away rather than stay curious about asking questions differently or understanding why things exist in some incredibly freeing about that and I fear less about what's happening with the planet Because of my understanding about the infinite possibilities that exist within ecosystem to help it he'll itself- and I I have a lot of hope from for future generations, because I see how engaged and interested they are in this problem. It makes me feel like guy. What was I going for the first twenty five years of my life because they're asking questions and are curious about things that make me feel incredibly hopeful indebted to them ass? Well, I, the biggest little farm is we watch it
Think we watched on Hulu or Amazon, but every Epps on everything now Lou Amazon, giving its on an apple apple, tv, yeah, it's everywhere, and I I I just I encourage you. It's just one movie: it's not a whole. It's not like it part series, it's one movie and it I fast and its. I it's one of my favorite things that I've. Why? just remember. I was really excited my wife with super excited, and you know my wife, someone who s the kind of bringing back around you know when we watched, whereas, like you still want to farm, I mean you know cause it is like it's. It's a life's like it's your life to make it to make it work. I did she wanted a goat. We can't have goats where we live, but there's a dairy farm in Central California, this wonderful dairy farm and so they
me too, basically like by a goat and they're gonna win its born. We're gonna go up and name it they're going to take care of it. They could take six squeeze it care of these, like little Spanish, La Mancha, goats and re, and So in a way we do have a goat ear, but all the time just like can we get bees? No, we can, because we we had on a structure on our property. There was an infestation obese, and I didn't want to kill them. So I had beekeeper come out. We take those bees by the West Shit, the next time that have EVA re given to young people. We we by bees from people who have taken them out of people's attics and of tyres and fences and stuff. Well, what was so amazing is, you know, like we kind of bring out the honeycomb and the honey is the best honey I've ever had, and my wife said: well, you know it's because I planted and
named off like three or four things and she's. Like you know that combination, it's like how my run Logan ass. We have the best cherry tomatoes because he planted them with basil, Believin dithers, there's, like you, know three sister planting where they think that certain new planting concoctions to create the best sort of the folly of roaming Armani, maybe maybe even flavour profiles, because they may be used different nutrients in a way that I've put ivory. I really every every week I have to talk or out of bees, because, unlike its not as easy as you think, it's gonna be no like someone could just they could keep the bees here and the naked Tiggle. I know, but I dont you know, and so I do. I guess this is ultimately my. I also want to be careful about not introducing something into our and of immediate ecosystem of like been. Inevitably it wasn't me. So I heard was somebody famous that that some of the greatest damage to the environment has been done by people with the best of it
It is a story. Still question logo or put another, is still debatable about whether or not my wife and I are that those people right right. Only time will really tell right of I'd like to get stuff just about not getting stuck in my neck, and you can only get actually you can actually farm stingless bees joke it. Won't these with bees. You know it's like their little over visitors like rip out when they see but a wasp adjusting you a thousand times, did I like the one? That's. Why said like what cause I I I I took video of everything like removing the bees. It was incredible. The beekeeper got stuck in the eye which is like if he gets stuck in the eye like what chance you I have, but but baby. No bones about it. Like I say these bees if they were wasps, I would have reigned fire on these in the same way about rattlesnakes desire a five year old, have guardian dogs and a general standards throughout a snake by us, not dogs. They have been bit but I've lost sheep because they don't tell you and they ve been bit lecturer does right
but yeah, there are some things like that that I know I have not. Sometimes I will. We will grab a rattlesnake and turn them over to somebody uses them to train Adam be afraid, arouse interesting. It put like a box or on their head and then they have this whole method of of training, but then other times we have two to kill them, because one minute, he's taken him put em on another farmers right right right are sometimes you have to get. Sometimes you have to look at. It lesser two evils here too rigid. I just want to throw one term at you, moon snakes. We send him to the moon that we can move. We let that we lay. Let's angle, I don't. Maybe they go up and test out. There is an egg worlds, terrestrial yeah yeah yeah. So we give anyone you on gets Mars. The snakes get the moon yeah see how they work it out. John, I can't thank you enough, as has been so great, and I got to meet amateur. Big bang goes very excited about. Thank you. Thank you. I really can encourage people enough to go watch biggest little farm wherever you can and lives.
Finally be a part of the world's ass good questions tend to your soil. Think you know some goods and stay incredibly cure. Steve Authority, things are different than you feel about stuff. You know perfect place to end the end or is it or is it the beginning of a new thing. Was eighty Andy's gaining complete hey, it's Chris, with a quick little request for help. From you, the identity community to take a short survey, very short of just one of them. little more about the eighty twenty audience and make sure that we get advertise there's that are the most relevant to you in your interests so visit pod, listen, dot com, Slash idee, ten t, that's pod listener, dotcom slush idea, one zero duty to take the floor. Quick surveyed is completely anonymous and to show. Not always that help us. You know
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Transcript generated on 2021-07-06.