This is Jacko podcast number number one. Fifty with ECHO Charles and me doc, a willing good evening, echo good evening. And who are the young men. We are going to go into action against such solid odds. You ve met them. You know they are the best we have, but they are not Mcnamara's sons or Bundy's out. They are yours. And they know, No, they are at the end of the pipeline that no cares. They know. And that right there is

an anonymous quote from a general in Vietnam to correspond war correspondent named Arthur Hayley, who is actually himself a decorated tank commander in world war. Two who must, in the army and there's a key word- I said There- you know volunteer, who voluntarily enlisted in the army in war too, and. In Vietnam, the Vietnam WAR. Your lot about the draft ease in Vietnam and, in fact, twenty percent of, forces that fought in Vietnam draft ease and After use accounted for thirty percent of the deaths in Vietnam on this park. Ass we ve heard from onto those volunteers, a bunch of those career soldier,

the Marines that fought in Vietnam, but. Tonight we are honoured to have someone on the pod gassed. That was not necessarily of e of the volunteer that was not necessarily looking to be in the military for career, but who nonetheless stepped up and did his job for our country and one he served a sign He came home and of his life and he had a son. And his son is also joined us on that gas to his son took a different role he was guided by his dad, but he was guided. Out to war but to the water, so We have tonight Dave Hall, Vietnam veteran tanker.

Who is also the Father of Josh Hall, whose surfer across a surfboard shaper and an entrepreneur, and I think we're look For this, at least I am so welcome your job. Both you thanks for coming all Josh Dave, Austria, honor for common out here from Hawaii. I know you know most people wanna leave Hawaii now under their own. Got we readily dragging out here now is a burden on me, but I love to see my son awesome awesome jostlers Avenant. Thank you down the stoked know we ve been seeing each other in the water for awhile and at on tests and what not so good we linked up in and have this opportunity come on It's really talk about some my favorite things war and surfing, so David

start with you and your really Medica trying take it back to the beginning in just kind of what your background was, and you know where you came from I know what you were born in are born in Boston Massachusetts Would you dad do my dad my dad did many things or to is a pilot? and be seventeen over England, and so I want to just slipped under the radar, Your dad was a bee. Seventeen violet one hour to gain and be twenty four and want to be a fighter pilot and try to go to the Pacific. I maniac that never happen so anyway married my mom, and then we ended up Lebanon, Barton for a while. I may we travel around a country. Does he was still in the service Airforce lived in Texas,

live in Colorado, lived in words. Your career army, Guy Army, AIR Force Guy forward, ass for a little while ago. I dont know exactly when he got out when you dig it out. Me start fine for United, and I know in the fifties and some even want to. I don't think he went to career I'm lost right now, but I hear he did a multitude of things. He was a teacher, a lawyer, a farmer farm, the brow gay news warring Nebraska haven't we had a big ranch back there. He taught school in Nebraska and then We had been living in San atta till I was nine years old. I went to visit my grandfather Nebraska, and then that summer, at the end of the summer, my folks ended up coming out with all the kids and then the whole house. So you decided not

LIVE United Airlines anymore and become a farmer again now it's kind of different. So anyway, that's like I said, I lived and allow different stays in step because during this because of the service, but Nebraska was gonna. Like my favorite place from there now user. You did you work on the farm. I ask as every kid that goes up on a farm is like slave labour. Exactly at all absolutely ten hours in the field ploughing in Ali, we had a Now we had milk every day now we call her six o clock six o clock in the morning clock admire The fuel. Cattle and we had bags, and I raise three chicken and I and my brothers and sisters and scupper there too late they all.

And is it when you? What like ten eleven twelve eleven yeah? I want it back. There can and miles back there for like forty three honours and also as twelve, I think, ended up. The back to Connecticut half an hour. We are therefore a year in Connecticut, and then I then my dad. He bought a business eurozone, all personnel, and so back out here. He found a place and lived out the Spring Valley and me were downtown- has on office down there. So I was gonna That's it! Then you spend your high school years here in San Diego your day. I start ninth grade sandy. I want amount Miguel, high school and then.

I graduated meant to ask on college for a while and then as drafted, did you did you start surfing in high school actually, Milon Santa an inside and serve with me had mats me mad mad up there I marvel earlier. I saw allows young, then we'd always go down to take me every day down me in the kitchen and two Laguna Beach per head down that China Cove down there and broke my your drummed out, our letter back here, but anyways yeah in their eyes, I saw a servant, no tenth grade, ninth grade and better Yeah we we first came out here and stuff. I loved. I thought we ve moved to the beach. We stated San Diego Motel re down there on the cross from

and we stayed there until my dad found a house I live in now, so you know I go to the beach, then they don't boxes beach. It was fun, that's what everyone says: well, people I don't live in California. Think all of California is like Baywatch. The better realise that there is no massive. I've been obviously this massive Swaziland, but agriculture huge know: you'd go up the you just drive by farm after farm after farm after farm, so much a California for ad and Bob but think everything in California just baywatch smart. They can come close, sometimes with sir you will. You went to go here and you you did serve, but you won't you weren't able to get to the water that much

actually I had a. I had a my dad bought me, a fifty three Chevy four hundred and fifty four chevy two door and stuff, so I ripped out the back seat. So I get my boards in there and then I got my sister's Garfield a station wagon them was fifty seven four two door deluxe scene? I was on the whole, they now serve wagon. I also mean the boys now so I was You actually got to the water a lot better. Why will you do You irresolute you and I Oh yeah lament over rustling, mostly on the nose and swim tee, my dove and I swam and my fault. You know somebody said Nick they may do the butterfly ending, oh yeah. I can on early so near the butterfly

and in so during this time period, when you pay attention, I mean I wish your dad reasoning was you know out the military, but you had that connection to the military. Will you attention in those years, because now we're talking this is there The mid sixties are you attention were to happen in Vietnam. Is that you're just phone is not just the of this life. And right now kid, but not that I can really recall there wasn't really on my radar, it Then you graduate near figure. You gonna go to college for a bit earlier, went at grassland, junior what you graduate article. Sixty six, ok so Vietnam was still rare tat? We was in the air, I mean they started when we I the Bobby I drink Valley was in nineteen sixty five and that was kind of like the big first spike in activity when I want to say that, but it was deafening highlighted.

Started hidden, the news more and I was in sixty five zero graduate and sixty six There is talk it over the draft and the draft and stuff like that, but it wasn't like you know, like I said it wasn't. I didn't really pay touched his servant. Yeah yeah surfing distracted from all kinds of the world's privacy which, as it was, then your role to growth. God you're there. Now and now are you Are you start to become more aware of the draft at this point? no cuz! I I snow skied a lot, so I know there's a lot of activity and I belong to the ski clubs are Grossmont and then also we go. La Valley, Heavenly N, N, N, Ski Alonso nice. It's still really think of I am thinking about all I saw my mom

hello, emblem about an hour she's a day, yet something from a government whose reactor that I can Amazon on certain. So he hit you that it was that unexpected for you, when you got that when you got your draft notice, did you know any other guys? It have been drafted our class before me and stuff. Like tat? John, it's a great guy made twenty fifth infantry over there and they came back at our borders or it's ok, I take that back. I was aware of it and because all these guys are coming back and talk about it, but I never thought you know me. I didn't worry about non. Some man So then, when you got it, what does your reaction when you got it I'm gonna go. I guess it was you that then our rod and hide and life

Well, you know if we make the muzzle on as a bad place the bail out I survived stuff, they heard, and then I said now I gotta do it. There was little scary. What am I was like for two things and I may I didn't look forward gone over there, but I mean- can it different, and why not traffic? So who is a shock to your system like this going from? the surfing skiing in miles long life checking the boot camp we had to go through the process of getting. You know to go up the draft for now lay so it did that and then came back and then had to go run second time for something, and then that was when we ended up getting on a bus and go on a four door and it was like whoa you just let you lock in

you dont no place to go and announce it now. This is sixty eight to now we're we're talkin I mean it's. Things have inflamed in Vietnam. In its I mean, there's a lot of casualties happening in you know free from your perspective. You must ve been thinking hey, you might not have been thinking about it as much before, but all of a sudden you're wearing a uniform and there's people coming home. You know people getting killed every day, Why are the rounds here? mall or didn't go home and all that they told me about it, and you know other friends and stuff, but I'm it was like when you get in basic and stuff they got. They got you they pretty much Gaia. And you to go along with the programme where they make it along the programme. Yet I'd gone along the programme, Mrs, did you see guys that? Were you that don't you that realised what they got into and would act crazy, you're. My d had all I'll sort of people

one thing about the draft you had. Every walk alive. When you have every walk of life in the military. Anyone if you know they come from all over, but the draft pick some out of the bushes. I'm here to age in and all you got bigger, small guys got older guys. Now. I was lucky because I little bit older and most guys likewise in Vietnam or allow younger than I was, I mean I mean the guys that worried me by older you're. I was twenty one year old man, Certainly, Sir back there, you know whenever I go down to Coronado? And I see that the ceo of the Dc And- and you don't feel I'm being with my wife- will go to court on Washington on the beach or whatever, and you can't help My wife can't help herself from saying they look so young a little kids. That's the same with me when I was nineteen, you know that's where that's where I was

so yeah when you're nineteen years old, when you're eighteen years old and you're. Looking at someone, that's twenty one! yeah they're, like this personally cordial Catherine, several, our older and end you did you have any choice in what you're Emma less was going to be asked good question. Now we made its rebate basic training. Sergeant Patterson was my girl in great guy and then when they came out. They had this chart their boys name on it. Eleven eleven. Bravo, eleven, bravo level! Bravo, and they saw me and Bob Ziegler was eleven echo and we asked one of the sergeants is walking by

eleven echo what is proving eleven bravoes the infantry, because all you re tanker cool, DR trucks? You know I've farm background tracker every because now, because I figure Dankert yeah my mind? Shoots? and they go now you on a tank. Still in quite get out there. So in that respect. I go. Ok, fine, only others. I'd like two hundred ten guys or someone had eleven echo. Some guys want to lay pc schools where I forget what they call. It was eleven echo S or something like that. I would we, like you talked about the Gaza What you through basic these guys, were guys come back from Vietnam was.

Tone of basic training like hey, you guys are going to Vietnam. You need to be ready. Yes, you yeah, we knew were someone's gonna happen now and I'm in a light and towards the end of a racing, training and stuff. They send us to see this film and it was John Wayne Movie rose name, I don't know you're good at that happened. I was Jimmy John Wayne Molly, you guys never thought, I'm sure housing. The alarm is generally a good guy anyway, I think that's what they did. They sent J C degenerated, see a movie. It was the only got, go, have a couple of beers and I see the movie in them back

and then, after that we came home after basically, so that that movie was their way of kind. You know: what's gonna gonna happen, Julia I can, I think, of do Was it we did. You feel like the training that they put you through. So I mean obviously boo camp is boot camp and you're gonna get yell bad you're gonna do push up soon when you got done with blue camp and they were put you through today, the army they go through Equally, I t so, did you go through something like eighty? I did what's yours, a key in Fort Knox Network, the tank scholars, and then they put me through and CO school, which is because they need a lot of dancing. I guess you get it like meritorious the advanced to become an anti our son

to say I guess it's whatever your attitude is to do so was. Was that advance school they put you through was that was a good meeting. Were you no actual drain air, so you're worst hard. They were. You know teaching. You use all the weapons systems. Teach you how to react in firefights and all that stuff right again and I'll mentally prepare yourself. Provides gone irony, radio operations in AL commanded controls and things like that, these things I had no idea what I'm doing the work ethic.

No, it is it's always interested to hear the way they prepare guys for combat biogas. Wee wee wee glad and became like if wars, and then they won't. You graduating thirty. Five show your sergeant right oil and then after you graduate from that school. Ah, I started training now and tanks. I get different different guys. Like me, I got the natural our guys from California on my tank. Witches gave me always avoided from calibrating painters guys. I saw a well founded it pretty good guys in the end you come home and then they give you leave after you get done with all that, yeah We went through a more advanced training stuff. I anyway. I felt it

I fell asleep in class one day and on an earlier, yet it's gettin towards fight Christmas time suffer resenting yet go home, and this one lieutenant I guessing Could I just nodded off and we ve been over this drill boom boom boom, and so he went to one of his classes, and I am not at the guy got on far you you're not gonna, go home get out of my class, I went I thought through my sergeant major and then he went in practice on colonel. And then they went did. I guess it went all the way up Italian or something like that, and they said no he's going to go home and finish the class and the Let me back in the class and I finish it up and it's going to like. Oh good, I get to go home for Christmas. And was at Christmas, your pre deployment leave or is it just? no rivers a two week, Bert too weak break. And then I came home desk.

In February or March. I know I offer my birthday He's got a hard for me right it, I'm not sure, but I know I left here. Like April fifteen I was I was to go to Vietnam yeah. It was I was jealous of light, you re bs a fly out of San Diego so they held the plane form but what I wasn't I sat on where you are you came home was that what was the mood like when you run over Vietnam, you're saying goodbye to your family and you're saying your mom and and and while I was Alice. We had pretty good party. Night and the next door. Neighbor had this bill rose gardens in his whole garden stuff. You know, there's guys sleeping out there. I went through a couple kegs and, and also it turned out pretty good. And so there is a little bit moments: Vienna, where you ll anxious and staffing

my mom and he's an army nourish. She gonna neither is going on I bet that had to be way harder on your mom was on you yeah. I didn't know that What was happening I mean I know when I was young, and even when I was older. I was always like day. You know work out of it, the indestructible and especially when you're young, I'm sure you're, like a hominid over there when a kick ass, that's what's gonna happen. Can be a little le, but but for especially if your mom was an army nurse, and so she seen all kinds of stuff. She took care out of the wooden soldiers. Yeah, so that had to be way order for her, and it's always, I think, always harder fleet with families didn't show it. Though you know

She gave me a little book. You still have the book I do someplace otherwise was a little saying, as is at and said before, The answer is not the problem, so I kept, it was me Well, that's that's him. That's an unbelievable, What vice right? There is great advice for any situation. Sorry, it's all good, let alone, So when you fly the young lose clash angel is a mighty gnomon. Airlines are both have a glass of wine and was our bunch I don't know when airlines are both of those across the plain and was our bunch,

other guys, gonna be on it as all Vietnam nausea. From love for a scholar Travis whenever it is up there, and to Japan, lantern them soccer, Japan and pilots really nice, even around not fool genes suffers on both sides of the plane and then from their went to the continuity urban. And again I mean just point out everyone: this is now Nineteen sixty is sixty nine, yet No, no, it is sixty in order to sixty nine to the height of the war in Vietnam and allows one high every day. Every battle and an bow, wasn't you been there done here I haven't. I have been in the heights of the Vietnam WAR or the Heights war now, and I know what I mean,

your attitude when you show up you get there was that welcome to Vietnam. You show me a picture earlier and you're like hey. This is me I just got dared you got to sit there and object with you get some kind of an in brief late payers. Going on? It was kind of a kind strange. You know four thing you land on the ground in such as word my weapon cause you're. Obviously, in a forum three and in a hostile countries hook, and Nikolai don't worry about it, you get it, you get it. I know I'm going okay. So then, the day after that had little gathering there and they should ok, Buddy jump on. Is it actually Bob and I got split up one with another company I witness the company out, I might live and most can I see you

so he threw them back and reduce and a half, and then we went to name it. I should get the name places right. Anyway, to visit another staging area and are you driving through these? delays in staff in its like. Well, things: don't remember: why don't headway here, one guy up there, Out of these lease apteryx in the Nucynta answers he's up there, where the m16 and stuff- and I kind like wars, are and so you go into a staging area in and you spend a couple weeks there and they take you through what they snake training muttered is the gives you familiar with the area and in other ants in those farms. In know the water in the rain and alone.

In eight days they just introduces two allotted different things, nibs interesting, because I was a buck sergeant. This will include one class one day there also known the bleachers frightened and that in some lieutenant governor some says he won't. You sit here and in this manner the radio and nicely assure that day the bleachers collapsed with all the guys on and they had broken legs. Arms and it was terrible pool. Luck was how why was it before when you get them with snake training? and the day one was before you actually went the field and connected with your unit just like two weeks. We we can to it like that, and then I get up to her

area called along the top of the highway their game, and I asked the first sergeant I'd. I asked my civil humming text. We have, as we know, have any tanks idle momentum commander, because now don't worry about it, because I'm out there's gotta turn on and gone out, fraud at all Ok and then I get energies of the fine drag and that's is that a modified one one three? a thousand eight panting your legs. So I was it, it was different and in hindsight. It I'm running late. I wasn't gonna take possess where my friend Bob he was only the in country three weeks and get hit. Let me put the new guy to lead Tang and I'll. Take an rpg through the cupola and he got trapped in the legs and stuff and got sent home.

I broke, I wrote in country to him numerous times. I'm goin I never get back and get back. Finally is monitored. More non Bob's in Washington on recovering from wounds. The young, when you, when you showed up there- and you know. Certainly sir Meet near the leadership What what what were they like were that's sergeant several uneasy sex. He was farther than the flame, the term in our and read the Red Make Bee colonies from, I think was from Virginia or something like that exactly the guy that taught me how to use a flame packages at chemical mos. I didn't know anything about napalm or anything like that, so that instead of learning process

So I rode Gunnar on the track for my own talent, my first firefight and certain knives aside, gonna run out and So we learn and it was really it was kind of nice and are you go out in the first? three weeks I was there and now it was like the country's noodles. Don't get me wrong? we are the highlands in outsiders. It was pretty cool, and so these villages, and we take the medics an end. They help to secure Jordan, whoever need help and stuff you know in a village chief and dry. Off the track and Billina Handle tee with them in staff in his own dirt, and also it was his interpreting the Magyar people not yards over their nice people, I don't think they. I didn t, go they like the viewed, not enemies announcing it like does either, but we may get along with this good

and so there are tat boy. I know you did me data a bunch of different ways. Submissions, while you were there like in terms of you did I look at what let us you, what you would do, the various types of missions that you guys we're doing so. One was what you just talked about your going out into the just write your made friends your hand out, you know me: nickel supplies Erika had better be out there. We put a lot of road security and staffing, and that was my first firefight. We wanted to help some convoy left tanker trucks. It's a few drops of actual tat. It was the dangers and Are they getting ambushed and stuff so we went out and- and I refused you try to suppress that or we were chasing these guys down and stuff.

That's your first! That's your first firefight elegant at her side! How'd! You take tat in the reason I ask this because we get a lot of guys. It are in the military, are going in the military, and I will I always ask the boy would only what were you thinking in your first firefights in that way when there, in that situation, they have another little perspective of of how to think about it, so they can be it's hard to get somebody prepared for that because everyone takes a little bit differently. Absolutely so I think the more different perspectives, can hear the better. It is for let some so we are changing these guys. How many there were through the day after this, they ambush the compliance application and down to the uncle and pray. They're gonNa John was evidence need all high brush and trees, and so he broke out in the

try to keep this lame track on it in the centre of things so chronic semi, protected and whatever I ended up on the flank on the left, came out of the jungle. How did you get in Eu Law You're looking around in the tracks could power through the jungle, because there is a lot of tree and high brush right. Ok, then, I had higher now track. I brush laboratories, We broke out in those opening now on the flank and we're looking across. It was a big rice, Paddy Ngos and other sexually jungle. Beyond that. And read my kind of look at each other about all they couldn't made across her that fast, and just like that, we turn the track back towards the jungle pride in our region.

My drag rate may ass, an and then come on guys got off the top red bestow. On the fifty I was on a sixty and is just instant training jumps in manner. I saw the three guys that shot garbage e mail and train of fifty or sixty autumn and read page fifty over there in and then by that time. Nobody else turn back towards the young on start levelling the recon outfit that I ran with. We had like five tracks. Each track had three fifties on it. When a man at one time, One hour track had three fifties honouring us now:

my dragged the track. I was on have one fifty to sixty ease off of either side, one sixty off either side, so it will be like the six tracks would be like a lion company opening fire, an airline companies making tracks or whatever it. I dont know how many tracks were in London, We have a lot of fire and a lot of higher power, and so did you feel. Like you said, the training kicked in Seattle was goin out exactly what is going on is that when we got here didn't happen, and then I ripped the sick, the outer the mountain jumped off the back and still fire and towards the guys and said so, Did you use your fine through our yeah shot justice just to encompass Denali I shot weigh up over the top of the jungle and big circle, just make sure. So

that's it! That's a scary weapon air. The out is, is its devastating butter, a man's always been afraid of fire. Yeah there's a definite instinct with that, no doubt about it. Now Would you guys, would you guys return back to a base when you guys got on with these operations? Are you come back to a basin now ain't a base camp? I am all in all year underground bunker stuff, you not to reach a lotta jewelry at night rocket fire and everything. So we'll run aground bankers, and that's that was neither am. I was place. I was only for I knew at the time, so I had to be a good place, which is a good place good in terms of the fact that you had a build up of were fry creature, comfort, Sir well, not holistic, creature cover was bunker yeah that was comfortable, ass well in Ireland we have time to go out

we are areas limit further away from a parameter. Anything also The town analogue itself was rated next door. So as we go through the village every day, There was a reaction from the folks live the local populist living among others, mountain yards. You know, I don't know, I don't think they were, but I could be wrong. Coffee on that. So I friendly we didn't get and contact them too much. We would. We are ready at that point after that that first fire, I mean there is. There is a multitude of other ones, how long? How long can do how long have you been on the ground before you got that first firefight three weeks ago? couple weeks is landed on the land of the fifteenth and then I think we may second neighbour April fifteenth. I landed in May second version

and then I note some of the noted that you sent over was like you. Basically, after that first one it was just, it's. The way was that was just life life afterwards How would you guess would you go take casualties? Often, when you were you when you engagements, because you had no armor Sir, was your casually rate lower? You think in a regular now have definitely yet here we are, matter of a lot of folks around the ground and so on. One thing about: if you take a casually they're out of feel pretty fast, so you're busy doing S Jimmy's guy? Johnny's gardener you don't know until you get back to base camp withered made or not so yeah, they were pretty. I was thinking about that they alone. I you know I was going.

Worry. Remember I mean I've seen a lot of guys get hit? In only doing Joint operations is, unlike that I said by the Surrey, my guys, but I never lost anybody off my drag and the other tracks, maybe maybe one maybe too, is very low. And how much is the enemy using mines on your tracks and how effective whether there really effective Depending on where you were, I mean we had mine, sweepers and stuff is a sweet. Thirteen and I have a thirteen and it all depends on the fire. Baser Ratan and David did Sweden. We didn't run my track, not my track, the track I had. Then I get a new one eyed given the frontline dog Dodge and he hit a mine actually today I gave it to you and submission he had the other, the other flame drag, and what did he do?

did they lose our just lose track of your? I was ass. I sit near China's. I got forty pounders like a threefold yassum, sinner trying to think about because the enemy in Iraq, which is what would you where I warrior they were really good. Ideas and they would take out vehicles not just on these data. Out on these, they take out tanks, Tags and Brad lesson and even the even the mine resistant vehicles. They would take those things out, put these big bombs, but. How often were you guys at the? I am thinking in my own head that three, it is because we are on roads, and so we in general is you're going through a city. You're gonna go down the road, there's, no, you can't drive through the building correct, and so it sounds like if you guys were rule or just driving through the jungle drive

through the rice parties do not do that. You didn't have to be in a channel ized area, so there was that it would be harder for the enemy to put the bombs in the report, the minds in the right place, because they can predict as well, where you gonna being right. Allow the rose and staff were. We did run the roads and in some areas and stuff I mean I saw em sixty tank. You know Buta five hundred pounder, who Hernandez knighted and I'll split in half like that through enough like us to know, if you guys live, but it was pretty devastating, and that was in front of us in front of our calling but yeah that sir I saw em forty seven tat. We call it a doctor and had the forty millimeter pomp on guns on a side of atoms, a mean machine. And he pulled out of our base camp down under three and before they swept

and never even HOLLAND Ass needing a herd blue tracks off, but he had a mine You know it's another thing that might have been just a technology advances for insurgents in Iraq until they had they had radio command, needed, so you don't have to run wires. It was easier for them to to put minds out there. We we ran into a lot of places like bunker distant stuff. They had wires and offer dealt for communications and things in all, but dad the mines. I was in a situation where two tracks in front of me: we will we take us another fire fighting, and so, if we had been we The new fund around. Let me know the outside it we had. I guess they were the elite forces, the such enemies, tiger, grouper of water, what kind of their commanders and softly through my tracks and so

We want this one area and we get washed and there is another matter Fiji's flying through the air and no machine gun, fired and stuff, and we support Is that all these guys, all retired river, they jump off the track? We're goin on all, don't don't jump off, you know we're gonna move, we repeat capability, move back and then read in advance in I mean you think about that, but they just jumped often they getting cross fires and shoot themselves. But anyways you talk about the the mines we had captured this. This one can he was on the captain's track, and so we were advancing were moving through pass the area worth the monkish war and the captains track it. A mine and more distant calmed down cracks here that we get the ammunition tracks, the second one. Then my track, and so he had a mine,

blue, the guy off Eastern on aside and stuff you now on anyways, so the track in front of me we're going all shit. Were they succour to cinema minefield what they did for they had these mines behind the banker system, and we shall we got in there track in front of me, I did was traversed, is a little bit get em went off, so I had a guy got down off the track and ground got it my track through its tracks. In others, we all went through a college. I was pretty hairy, so I guess I was wrong. The mines were a big today. I now that I think about it, because I think get that the vast majority of the casualties in Iraq or from. For my these words, I bombs cause there. They just there were good at it. Then they it's it's a weapon that you can. You can

You ask her out of the idea that was that was what I thought was scary them. Answer the for sure. That's the thing that there's no there's very. A limited amount you can do to. Rent it. Now we did everything we could and ensure actually My guys never hit a mine in never hidden de in in Romania, and that was just It was amazing. You knows a lot of luck cheerful. You know, that's great God look out for us, but We are. We also were very proactive in how we planned to do you no harm since we would, we would go after right after the minds. Weeping team would dry would go clear. We go down immediately after them in that way. Anyway, get to where we want to be, and if we had to wait a couple hours that we find we are, but we we would try to mitigate their risks to the best of our ability. Because a minds were poor or such a big threatened, and it's one of those things that yeah what

You can think that's what you that's. What does it say, people the most, because you have so little control over nothing like a if it happens year, you can do everything right. You can follow the minesweeper minesweeper. Everything and you can follow minesweeper. You can still get blown up, go outside the rodya, let It's it's a deaf, Leah, scary thing and you you talk to me, the salary enemies guys getting in a deal? shooting themselves, which is I believe. That's gonna happen a lot less when you're in armour, because obviously it's pretty clear its pre. Oh it's a lot easier to identify, hey, that's a friendly: because there are no one one: three like we ride, whereas as I'm Yasser Arafat and an end, we did have a situation. Wasn't it was not put, it happened and that's I usually uses in it as an example of how easy Blue blue you, no one friendly fire and can happen

in your body. Were a humvee shouted another humvee which again the the. Surgeons did not have home these out all right and to think of what the mindset is of a kid to look, see another YO see movement. That's a humble! and take her take some fire, some shots at it. That shows you. How this guy's get your. How perception at night is different and how you're mine starts playing tricks on you and you lived, thinks confusing and it can be it pretty young that will do confusing a war yeah I times occur. In our usual we hunker down at night. You want me set out here, you're trip, flares and claymores and an all out in one night. We did that and when it was drifters went off. We thought her body back a base camp back with us now and

we start virus and, as these guys, hundreds have behind the tree in the yelled and they got more waters and almost like, ok, I mean flare went off, I mean yes, you need a brief people. When you got a parameter lesson learned when I was on a training I was trying to make it would, I would inject all that confusion, because I wanted the guys to have firmly incidents while there and training, so they recognize what the things that the type of things that causes, now we heard about things like that, but I mean I was never involved. That is a good way to do guys. Necessarily. Luckily, your marksmanship was a little bit off that day. They caught as a by surprise, what about the year about the the arc light the beef,

Fifty two bombing? I know your town one story about our atmospheric escape we're Jason, these guys and got a collar. The radio says hey, I restart they were. There will be more innocent strikes on somebody. May it strikes the Abbe fifty two. And they said everybody hunker down and get behind the track and how it's coming and then boom boom, and you could see a movie look up in the sky is gone and there was like five b 52s and you could see all these there, five hundred thousand pounds they're coming down and I didn't get off the track. I mean it's a sixteen to interact now it was gonna, do and sure enough Lloyd shockwave, came in that tractor rattling around and we're going God. We saw the smoke first and then shockwave hit.

The brilliant out. How long would not one of those missions? Last one cow one with those bombs, be going off for this particular time money, and I was like one plain after another, and now I have our twenty minutes, set myself for a knowledge the end, I'm not Jerry and all its reserves tended period does not like then you go in sweep the area we found some guys and area, namely someone tributor was talking to him and stuff and he's blind his nose in his ears and his eyes and in all the guys me so alive, and he said I interpret saw you do it. Everytime. I hurried balls in the air. They come back down a thousand Erika solved that was intense. We weren't that close like he was yeah. Who would we coordinate and that would you guys be coordinated? Those no way no idea

now it was in a certain area or areas like that. You know them. Obviously we got the word now my best friend I mean Don't get me wrong? I mean that the beef to strike they did their thing and, and we, which you know, we lost a track. One time on greater arena that was overgrown and in a lively flippin inside and so, like I said earlier on, Vietnam is a beautiful place in other, wasn't for the war be great and there is a lot of bomb of palm craters. The cobra I got says our power I know you guys like always over there, the other. What a black, the passion attaches in that idea, that the colored pilots and stuff they are pretty cool equal. We ve had a cobra pie. On the part gas area he got shot down Gary your shower down twice

Debbie. I gathered oh yeah, braves guys I now hit me they go indoors, pretty close quarters. They come in basic. Right behind us, we'd be unified. They come in NATO. Fifty four over your head and rockets fired intense. Interestingly, not only do we have still have progress, but you know in in remedy we had one one through the same vehicles You guys drove, we still had it and it primarily for casualty. Evacuation, ok, but still I was in the back of some one, one threes over Romani. What's that thirty years, something later four years later now these same vehicles, new Saint helicopters, why not at work? my track. Didn't have much room inside is because of napalm tanks and stuff. You know the other one on threes. They had plenty of room that you days to die

carry like twenty one on arousal. Fifty on my tracking. Oh, they had six thousand rounds of their answer how serious it when you got your track filled with napalm, I didn't think you Who are you? I think that would have been back my head a little bit. It is. It is, and I was too weak to play with their rights and allows funny. Imagine that, because at the end of shooting it, good because its gas and you having nighters and they have Rog Ass lean, and so I used a blow out these. I might have a picture in a big billy of flay used a roll out, an accusation pop it and then let off

and we had a chemical guy, come up to check out the tracks and serve a charming. I do any goes each hut I play with your after after empties and stuff. You know you grow others. Big giants in the biggest Rome and ball of fire, and he goes don't ever do that again. I know why, because it the pressuring, because I didn't know that much about die drawbacks impressed, I learn- will quickly it'll set the flame back in a blue thanks a low. So after that I was like the track last for like if using powder on like thirty seconds of broad like that flying out, and then you just get rid of the gather, the air

training is twenty seven hundred ps I or some like that, you're, virtually a bomb near ready to happen like I said. I think that would have been in the back of my bag a little bit and you're going to get our bee g yonder. And how did that not do more? damage both the tractor aluminum right. So once our beaches ignited yeah that rod come down and one through the back in an hour so did through over there. For some They must not regulated or somethin o detonated, o roon yeah, so shrapnel in. I can show you a picture of it all day. I know that I had the back, there's all blown up and it started the tank. And went out over the top of the track and, on the right hand, right rear side and now we just lucky rather be lucky the good here and and about the way. How well

the things work in the jungle as far as like once it was wet once the rainy season comes and tanks, yet a little or or even the triangulate the mud and stuff was kind of tough. It was too, it was tat. They took our I'm a neutral steer. We didn't have that they just had a ladder roles and stuff too. Because in it just dear you got one track on land contract on the other and an they throw tracks for easing the mine. So I was just right or left are back. And then I see you, you got you, get wounded when or how do you wondered? I dont knowledge of shrapnel from the rpg or we open the breach of the fifty fifty Cal blue up in my face and others

we're in fire, and so many rouses seven you cook ass in all just cooked often we thought it was done. Abundant boom boom, he off the track, so it wasn't it. I went to the matter and I had a little got hit me. I was it wasn't like I got shot through, says shroud rat relatively minor reality, absolutely no absolutely or will say it will be. All about that was alive? We numb You would stay out. How long would you go stay on the field, for as long as we did was probably about I'd, say six weeks I thought you say, like you know a few days, Reform is six weeks that's what we're moving in do you guys would live out your tracks years. Most got good living out of your tracks. Everything

everything on. Would you gotta get at night? Would you see them tracks luxuriously legos reigners? Unlike that I drove popular lower than the track and tied down there lived sleep stretchers that we care and also how many guys, when attract would it was do you and your track. We had most of the blue country I said five guys on it. Had a driver main got her two other guys had four guys and at first mine was like that, and so we had for you know when you looked at it from like the big picture, what you guys we're doing over there did you feel like a woman in progress. Did you feel like hey we're? Just trying to get by did you did

get any strategic guidance from up the chain of command like hey. This is our purpose for being here and let the question each day was different. We would have missions that we go on and sometimes we get hit wooden. And those missions we just be going into an area and checking it out as far's accomplishing things in it was an individual thing. I mean it was not individual, like my myself or anything, but a mean as a group, you just me and I'll go where they told you do and What good it was. Sir you're talking about. Is there an end result that we saw? Are you I mean?

I guess I'm just asking, especially from like a leadership perspective. You know. I always talk about the fact that if You're frontline troops, don't really know what they're doing Why they're doing it then? Eventually there they don't see any purpose what they're doing and that's where you start getting negative reactions. Are you know, whereas least, if you say, hey, look this. What we're trying to get done today, we're trying to get this area cleared were China this, contribute to this law Rigel S or something. I bow in that respect. Yes, but I may, as a big picture like the whole country is now I didn't. We didn't think too much but our individual, the things now. Ok, we can be noted a complex over here waiting to go into it, and I also plan that strategically Amy. You have people out there, whatever works and stuff. You know that but alert us of certain areas hotspots

intelligence. Come down, ok, there's a thousand troops come down through the Michelin or there's a thousand troops. Come now the highlands or there's a hundred troops over here in all that, get your your blood pamper because Moroni six tracks, while we had other. We worked with a lot of cod and first twenty age or Sun Moon worked with us in several we worked with other companies too. They were utilised to go. Help Tamar will they would help. Ah, sir, we're That's when we were like a real ready, reactionary force. You know you go out and then a bass cat got hit, and you know what the middle of the night so you're up at two in the morning, trying to gather all your troops and stuff out of there, bonkers to run a road down to some basic anthems. Visually gonna get either overrun over honour. There blowing through the wire and their common inside. A compound of such are we going to reinforce that had to be a tough

that tough kind operation, rather Dunbar Deacon friction between You got bad guys that are in the inside the wire nasty. That's a scary thing, when you go into that. What hear what your far process going into that protection often the guys around you and tell you to do a minister. Try to figure out where you there, The coming in through you know, is a Bangalore torpedoes enough blowholes and iron, and they d run on through and is now and then I'll gave and concentrate in that area. I know of a few and get through they get through. I mean do you have it other infantry on the ground and stuff that they're dug in and now they're taking care of themselves, so they kind of know what's going on, it's you don't know everything has gone on budget see rally what's happening, so you try to defuse out did you guys we as we come back to base and you'd be involved?

there's something to feel diesel begin artillery. You know rock. Of artillery and Iraq is usually rockets. Do great When all would you ever get there? your time. There would ever let you go back to somewhere, where you could get a break and get some honor. They heading in yeah hour longer missions and surf the net. Then Doolittle stand down in Alfred three days or sent me a good drink yourself. Silly, swimming pool and When you go for that, you know, I don't know exactly where it was. It was someplace in countries like down and like hair just outside Saigon, so occasionally you gifted give you little breather,

not much, and I may I went to Thailand. I went to Australia. I was my big foreigners in about a few people got away. Never now I need not do that. They come back and see their folks and others can escape. Yeah of evolutionary from the fact that its like now, what happens easy, especially be when we communicate with our people back here and usually by letter, came in. I cassette tape and they talk. We talk and send it in the mail and staffing only and saw the guys it laughed and went to sea like their loved ones and suchlike in Hawaiian set when they came back their heads not in Not. There is currently no joy and get the gun before your eyes. It, sir. It's not a good day. Dear people react

but I would want to people what the fact that nowadays and theirs, positives and there's negatives. To guide this positive neck is nowadays with the internet. You can literally go face to face with your family every night that you're not enough jump on there, and you can talk to me. You could see him and I don't know I'm sure, that's good for some people. For me, that's not a good thing for me. You know what I was overseas. I was overseas and I I would talk to my wife and kids like once a week. I'd call em. We talk for five minutes. I'd ask him house, you know the standard. Whatever questions on how school everything going? Ok, you know daddy loves. You will want we'll talk to you. You know next week and I'll tell you even I was very emotionally detached from my family. When I was overseas and it's hard explain to people in all that time, three kids now for kids, but me

I've told the story about the fact that my kids, my wife's, send me an email. It said. Oh, can you take a picture of where you sleep at night cause, because the kids wanna see where you sleep and we had an old Saddam palace and I had one of the rooms there. When I had apply. Would you know bed with a cry be the mattress on it and the plywood you know had like up headboard on it right, but it was his blankets. I wonder, and I a picture of it on a little bit. Your camera, and I was gonna, send it to my wife and I looked at it and I realized it was that it was just there was nothing there. So I open, a folder that I hadn't drawer and I took pictures of my wife and kids up in it and I hung them up novel and then I took a picture and then welcome back down, I put him back in the folder and put him back in the drawer because

man. I didn't want to see her again, the sounds harmful to say, but it is directly related to what you're saying is. I don't want to see my wife and my kids every single day every single morning when I woke up every single my before when I do. I don't want to soon learn about them, because I got a job to do in the people that I really need to worry about. This point, were my guys, and so I totally agree with that, but you know you. You want to have some sort of emotional detachment from your family now, can you are too far with this absolutely go too far with this now the sun. You know you you you get to, dad dry. Your family doesn't mean anything to you anymore and that's gonna be a problem as well, so you'd but adding p. We're gonna pay attention to that and find that that Medium, a happy medium wherever they are still enough talk. But it's not it's not dragging him. Rise, you don't want to know focused on those other things when you address on yeah yeah,

quiet eyes of you. Listen to the Cosette release here the voice or you get a care package. Your son, you know he's got some good cookies from hard person like that. So yeah. You take time and your blogger, whatever you knowing and relaxing you do that, but now, as far as down to the MAR station, which I guess they had a are somewhere in India. Muhammad Ali, where make a phone call back to the states. I I never did, but you know a few people here, just my telephone, but now today now like like the other thing, is a daddy on a big screen the only thing that I think it happens is is If you're worried about those things you need, you start to be less aggressive and In my opinion, when you're, progressive on the back field you'll end up in more trouble. Then if you're, you're. Out of your offensive, that's

the guys that I ran with the prudent pretty tight group, I dont think as tight as you. Maybe seals guys are, but in I always had a different story enliven and but as far as getting the job done, that we are me media to bring a job. I think I'll say our work with all kinds of guys. The army marine Corps, in the calm robbery in any. Military unit, especially what you're fighting hard it's it's all. It's all awesome minutes all yes, super tight and I'm sure Your guys, we're going? on mission for six weeks living in a track? we are delighted that it could have been less than that, but it means at any time that it is a long time and spend the night just one time when we were traveling,

and that we were having supplies the hard to keep keep up with us and stuff you know. So it was no water. You know the fuel and you know bathing in bomb bomb craters, and then things like that, so you don't know where you lie as allow the map reader over there is flat no gps. Now as somebody new or thereabouts following I mean it's really the technological advance here, a very, very high tremendously only got the guys. Look at a map, a moving map and shown exactly now. We were you are, but where all your other hand, the guys are its power, impressive meeting we had another. So would you what would you have to pay attention to guys sure that You know you're not sustained, combat, making sure that guy's warrant getting to apply

where you know they they needed a break. My drivers and stuff. I went through quite a few drivers, I mean not debate. Went on to do something else only live. I was their starting point and they drove on me, but you gotta, I mean I had one driver aegis jumped out has weakened fired, adds that he jumped out the hatch and eyes back ended right and I'm a Mamma fifty and we're moving now the area around that we're getting away from what was happening is really regrouping. Go back in because I can't do it. Mr Orlov and scared scared, luggage scare now and mostly the driver to exert their chemical, fine on and recovery, we alone with the fifties and Sixtys authors

eyes and some so near you jumped out, say back in the track them smack upside ahead me get, did I get in then you'll leave, but then, maybe you got it back to base camp say. Maybe that's not the guy for for this mission, never leave missions and also you go on and do some else. Was it's an interesting dynamic? Is I mean it? I guess maybe you just a mellow gag Chateauneuf stories about doing this and do not have any aid you make it sound like you're going out to in and out burger Grandma Berger and

in reality. You got just just put it in perspective, some of the guys it your with our arms scared and throwing up from fear and so horrible need. You take care of those guys and also you can get him back a base camp. One I mean I'm, then they all come in all, but what was bothering them rose is a perfect example of this came from the mine, young kid and stuff in our, but you couldn't shoot somebody Monday in Nan also like thy grab the gun right out of his hand, shot the guy so, but that was just one incident. We we ran into some pretty heavy duty guys and they took out track right in front of me in and they were in a bunker and there are now doing damage and roses. Gus

Rose rose. You can't do that waits Adriano rose, afterlife, he moved. I love it he ended up being a pretty good driver. He got over that thing, but again that driver moved on there is another kind of misconception and that in the military that, if you're in a leadership position, you're just gonna bark orders, nor can yell and people released because you and you're, just giving these beautiful examples of the fact that, like ok, you got have the understanding the person you gotta, they're gonna people gonna, make mistakes, people gonna get scared, and doesn't matter how mad you yell at them. It doesn't make me I won't help. You have won't help to develop a relationship with them. You need to get to know him, you need to understand them and then just because they, you know you, you learn something about if they have a shortfall like that, like you said, maybe a market of put him in that position. Gara. Where can I use this individual? Absolutely

it's our people view the military. The especially firstly, when they see for mental jacket where, as you know, the drill sergeant yellin for forty five minutes in the movie or the drone shocked, remove the Ellen forth for forty five minutes in the movie. They think that's what, military leadership is in the class examples that you're talkin about of what real military leadership as I can it's really to save it. Leadership, but good. No yellow building a team figure What your mission is ensured better than they are now, and then I that was pointed out to me what's her by by colonel and deliver these guys. Eleven attract with immunity living in in in the groups, the Sarkozy or we will get together, will have meetings and staffing. Our guys would be on the tracks queen, whatever they don't. We happen to be found

ambivalent day got matured outflows handbags in on my guys. We actually want to my drivers should hold a bang of filling this girl in he was in non communications. Marian sodden, alchemy of fruits. Okay- and so I went ends is here because you see that shade over their area, he'll go sit down in what you guys, Phil sandbags waffle buying online. In all these guys, you pardon me it doesn't matter, he's sitting shade watching do it and he says if you, if you want to feel sandbox and all I can make so you can do that and he's gonna take rang from me, and I said well, nothing like, but I have to go. I explained my guide as it would not sit in the shade of a hurricane felons and bags size in our little thing.

Like that wasn't point into insane point was because I was a sergeant and their rights and they be doing the work and you you're not supposed to be a useful watching them new door. I'm going and was hard for me, but I'll tell you that you had better leadership instincts in your colonel. At that point I guarantee, because that's that's what that's our major guys, if you if your mentality is hey, guys will respect me if I sit over here in the shade when their work does is the wrong mentality and new they nearly there. Truly that's again, not just a classic example of Good leadership as a whole see what people think like I ate it all. The sergeant could be over here watching you with his hands in his pockets. While you guys do the work, I don't know I'm at to be here with you guys were to build whether on part of the team- and there are times

course. There's times when you got to go to a meeting, you know you got to go and, and your tea now looks like a you, go, do your job and we're going to do our job and it's some point you're, going to have good when you have some spare time. You'll come help us with our job and- and you know what you can come back at some point to head. You help with this plan. I need help with getting this. Getting these maps put together, getting high point figured out or whatever they're going to help it's much more about building a team than it is to that it is about I tell you what to do and I'm going to sit in the shade, while you're feeling, ten times better vektor new book. We are new book. We talked about the fact that waves. Platoon came back to her to combat post, and army guys they were filling sandbags up tax. You weren't feeling the same bag. They were already filled, but they were moving the sandbags up to the rooftop of some of the buildings on the combat outpost and lace like no migration can help out, and you know, tat the disk It's a small little, it's a small little do no indication of hay, like you said one

better than you were here were- were gonna be the same blood red. What the same, sweat and wanted to fill in the same sandbags, another stop. It gets come up some of the guys talking about Vietnam I believe- and I think it's I think it's Eighty percent, roughly of the of the service members that fought in or two it was higher. Sixty percent were draft these in Vietnam. I was twenty five percent now, there's a bunch of reasons why people focused more on Vietnam draft these rather than world war. Two draft he's got more and more to the whole country was at war The whole country was at war and It was everything from hey: we're not gonna, eat meat tonight we're not gonna get new tyres because we need that for the troops, so the whole countries or Vietnam,

as you said earlier, the Know Vietnam WAR was absent in your surfing, and so when the draft started common, it was like. Ok, it's it was a different, actions? I think that's part of it, but I have Talk with a lot of companies now and people will bring up the gun. Of millennials and You know the millennials, they don't want to work and it's really hard to work with them and I've explain to a bunch of now that in the Vietnam WAR they had sold. Prs Marines that had been drafted did Wanna go had there, had a normal job or had their life going on. The many cases didn't believe in the war didn't believe in what we're not and yet good leaders would take those, after using David, hacked, or through a guy that I've read his books and talk about a lot. He loved this draft these, and he said oh yeah, those guys they fought hard if that

I was doing something stupid. They would tell me I actually enjoyed having guys that would raise. Could they work a career guy? That's trying to kiss my ass and say: hey that sounds great boss know its aid as it actually a dumb idea and so this idea that that decision if these were, if you if the draft these wander good leadership the leaders that I've had on here. I've had, of course, you guys from Vietnam that work deal ground commanders on in Vietnam and they said oh, I can tell the draft EU from the from the because they all work Are they all did their job? whereas if you read people maybe work good leaders that would have an attitude. You know that was all the draft ease didn't want to do it did. They need didn't work hard, they do their job is to me it's not the draft is to me it's about the leaders you're a great example: they know of of a guy that not only said okay

did you want to go to Vietnam and one thousand nine hundred and sixty one thousand nine hundred and sixty eight getting pulled out of you know going to college and skiing and surfing know, but guess what okay you're Oh do your job. You not only did your job did it well, and stepped up and lead other people. That were in the same situation. You were a great leaders to, and now I'm in the people we can look up to. Then we had this one lieutenant who became the captain of our outfit and that he was with another another company and they were in a situation where almost all of them get sniped. We.

Like the commanders and studied the captain, lieutenant in the colonels aid, all right on the side of the track. Heirloom, chair form their Malone, makeshift something or other, but they re aside and they went into to maintaining a plate canoe by then, and I guess they snipe almost Oliver anyway. We got this this lieutenant from there. The use of these last survivor, but he is one of those that didn't get snipe and he became night. The leader are right, die and but There were other ones too, I mean everybody got along pretty good. I refuse to go out one time on a mission and was a mosaic S Dundee at night and.

Literally, I didn't want much wanna go because I was gonna, be rural cluster, and at any time you do run rose at night without known that is why you, where you goin away you doin now and they re gonna, go out certain fry, who are they run into and I've been there while I'm gone Bravo, that was, I did. I can overstepped this a tennis authority. Looked at night. I talk to my cabin. I am just like an I look in I'll buy book the flames actual to stay inside a compound at night. That's is somewhere, I read and, unlike that Eu Army going and so I got my gap anyways, I didn't I didn't go, I didn't have to go, they went out, they came back and

bed bunk one guy off at all on a hill someplace. You know he end up walking back into base camp and the other guy broke his arm of the tree limb. You know, you don't see it night too! Well, you can't go, through the jungle, a big lights on, and but he got back at me he goes okay, so you going to be protected at night and not necessary protect, but I mean you're inside the compound and I had to take my two 60s off my two guys that were on those 60s laugh and I was left With- was my fifty cal, the flame and my drive. So I'm all right, I'm gonna good hygiene in our, but it could have been worse. Are we gonna mission? I don't. I don't know anyway, so later on, in

my time there I became resupply sergeant in the field. This is kind after you know, we've been through quite a few fireflies and stuff, and they said okay, it's time to slow down. So I really can't became Risa buys Arden, but it was resupply feel so. I was still run over the same guys are those with except I get the flier shit back and forth to someplace else, to pick up fuel and in an food supplements delivered him to my guys, who, unfortunately, that lieutenants outfit got fuel. Alas, they get food last they got as Kite chicken shit. I shouldn't really. A thing like that, but I took weapons away from their livelihood out there. This is one of those is one of these things where again from my perspective virus charm, look at things from a leadership perspective. If I've got an-

Sperience guy! That's that's telling me that some, It is wrong or told me. I should do something to different way. Then I'm gonna listen to that's what I'm gonna do and if you tell telling me hey, this is any sense to go out and I this is not a good idea. I'm gonna say you know what ok let's reconsider, why we're doing this mission and and how we can execute this thing to me. That's that's part of leadership, and again if I took care you by saying ok tell me explain this to me and we are. Your conversation about why it is you don't think we'll go out, because maybe there's something that I could have done to mitigate that say. You know what you are in a play me will put you in tobacco will do something different and they at a minimum youth. You you, you are happy that I listened to you. I didn't just I can order. Use noticed organ, do because what is at an up turning into what then, up. Turning into his, you got a negative attitude towards me.

As a leader. I don't want you to have a negative attitude towards me because guess what you end up doing you end up in a position where you not give me from recent fly with me when I want it, which is which is again things just boil down to have respect up and down the chain of command? And if you listen to the people blow you in the chain of let what's let's ass, this, question, if I was in that our shoes I'd say: ok, I got sergeant hall, he told me doesn't want to go out. Why is he saying that? Let me list and to whom he saying it's gonna be hard to maneuver at night. He's got more experience in me. Maybe I should listen to, and on top of that, what am I going to accomplish tonight? Is it Vigo that wants to go out could sometimes just We're gonna go out, no, no are you listening? He wanted to go out. This not just becomes my ego, verses, Eureka and, of course, can I win that contest? Yes, because I am rank you, so we're gonna do what I said, but what is that What? How does that really help? It doesn't doesn't help, bring our team together. So

That's another thing to think about here. It comes to we're. Just this stuff from a leadership perspective is, is if you listen, the people below you in the chair command and you hear them out and you take two into consideration. What they're telling you it is to number one Can we improve the way you do your job, because whose smarter who just got here- or you have been here for eight months- you're going to have more information, you're gonna know more than I do it's gonna be me better. If I listen and where nor accomplish our mission better, if I listen- and on top of that, it's going to strengthen the bonds that we have because we're reciprocate between our brains and were listening to each other, and that brings us tighter together. So these little leadership. Lessons are it there was a war lcd at night after that mission, will there's a girl So so, and what did he by that? You know what my bet your captain went toward said: hey, listen! What will be a lesson lieutenant if you

I'll tell you we should be doing this I'll, let you do it tonight, you and approval a point, but that's a basically yeah, so so there you go so he the cost himself, some leadership capital that actually ended up hurting him later on in the resupply. Guys made it looked like it. It was the last I'd. Never do that anymore. The adult you took care of him, but you you made him wait for it made a point. Mr Level plantation was excited, so we're crimson one day were drawn back base camp and wrong commerce. Crews along normal, like an elite tactics. Couple sniper rounds and we're gonna wanna come from the hillside up here. So we but we will have to allow an unjust. Let goal is eighteen, fifty dollars or seventeen

wherever it is. Evidently hillside saw Michelin, rubber, violation of it and then it quite down nothing coming back were gone. Ok, I gonna get quarter my eye and down the road like see, does coming down honour and here's a red, white and blue. Four Bronco fairly new, a pretty sure it was blue, eyed, always white and red, and has underlined, comes in a Brody's raid into our little force. You there to me, gets off those old doktor, the colonel, Colonel Mckinsey, and guarantee off track and staff in disguise it and earn you doing like this. Now, just back in his goes little plantation workers were them to you. Just back in his is broncos. He takes off and I want to ask why we like I come

in the middle of it this over the five years, while we pay fifteen hundred dollars, apiece that guy for those trees in an official calibrated that, regrettably, the treat out and please a rubber out at all, GIG Seneskal Plantation or go other couple, potshots if anybody That's one way to make money off the S government, the Michelin Miss Implantation was. It was pretty good, the name They have this thing, because there is a lot of moving down through the plantation of troops and start. So they came up with this idea about ok, we'll have read zones and greens, arms, Red John anybody inside the reds I want

Flicks square, I an indian Red zone, you know that's free fire and greens are now because he had the plantation richly now stir in a partner that well dazed melt rate entity. The aid and we get workers have been seen before Erin Red Sox, go without saying that these may some good advice and second, to said, that's one way to make money on US government for sure unfortunate in so you dude. How long? How long you been up demos twenty days?

Then it was that that was shorter than a normal gnawing. An early out to go back to school company clerk one day came out in the field is delivering Jackson or money and whenever he says you know certain rallying early out, they approve something, or rather I know how do I do that? I am not just need a letter from school brought my mom by mail and sure. Now she is. She registered means that the college grandma College- and so I'll bet earlier and that was caused. Nixon was at this point drive down. Sittings are slowing down. Now things are slowing down a little bit, so they wanna get guys out. Have you ever before you before we can a rap on Vietnam, but what one worth one more note that you made was about Europe. You medic,

Oh yeah, I wonder, touch on that. One before come, hang wish. I knew his name. I wish I knew his name we're. We got in the shed a little bit and use a seal, conscientious objector and held a medic rabies. Guy irony. Then one day we gonna shit he's right on my drag and he picked up a weapon star fire and to save his ass and ours, and but he never did it again. Never let me but then the rest of the time you're saying he would now a brave NEA is insane goodbye, really good, and there's there's just mean. What cannot that's an incredible did just talking about from a leadership perspective. You got a guy, in your unit. That's a conscientious objector that doesn't wanna be a war and yet

you got him out there, that he's risk in his life and even in the moment of truth. He actually steps up and how you see what is happening. Almost no one on that. He needs to step up. That's their our situation. There puffing up bottled Bush, pretty good and and and biting Emily Joel where they were anything- and I you see guys over here- ok entire over there and there are certain hit us. For in the rear, and he happened to be there, and so he picked up sixty in sir have an added what's the rule or like, what's the whole situation with a conscientious objector, what he doesn't one it serves, and but he doesn't merge gonna kill. Anybody really does want to shoot. You wanna carry weapons or anything I mean you when you carry a forty five, emetic bag and that's just cool with everybody So it's like an understood thing like hey, I dig it you're views on this whole thing come do

job, we don't expect you right or whatever write her is that small on my lady Oh yeah, I'm colonel! Yes, yes in any was good at that. Minister, it is not very not very nothing very calm, and I it might have been more common in world war. Two only because I- and this is a complete speculation on my part in vietnam- so I didn't want to fight was more apt to just run away to Canada or something or get a deferment for whatever you know medical or when it seems like world war to again, because the whole country was at work that they, would be like well, you know, I'm just gonna, be a country and there's a there's. There movie about that's the guy that one, though, was awarded them Slovakia, is a conscientious objector he saved, but while examined I were hundred yeah great and massive risks to to make it happen. Is that good I'm gone now?

nowadays we can no longer anything. I I have ever met a conscientious objector myself. No, Oh, I don't know I haven't heard of it lately, something that was now he's a great guy. May I just didn't know: that's ok, he's I guess you, I guess really wouldn't go on now, because there's no draft, there's no draft, you don't need to girls, you don't need around here, just you're just not go, whereas Vietnam the draft you must yet and the fishermen of people there their principles. Were there like? Hey, I wanna go, make a difference, but you you know up until the very though maybe that person will go the peace corps instead of them ring in the energy supply had never options. Now more make sense. I can do

eyes only they won T run on Medica it'll look set and though I was on a mission, we're through error tailing, some guys that were surveyors or something like that. Poland, security forms ever come back now on potassium radio and after we get traded, we get around on the thunder three a few days later and So crews cruising down road, and I see this guy and we had what they called true boy back, they meant that they give on open arms yeah and saw his joy and he's got an hour across his chest and staffing eyes. Lion cloth and use part of the thirty that hit our base camp three do nicely. For that, and so at last, in the com on battalion radio and are trying to get all my guys on company in an amount battalion guys on an open mama, how bout area. Also anyway, we pull over in the mud

outside the Rony signals a little saddle on this hill, and so I got down and went up to the mental your office that he said something is talking, is yelling and back fruits. Be somebody else back there, and so I had was totally in the eyes of the Cuban IONA sky. Hurrying on they had him in. So I'm looking level. I go up over the years this guy lay on the ground, a k, forty seven I am like this: on the ground and I'm gone. You don't get up and I was gone. He's gone whatever the guy said was good because I didn't shoot that guy you're, the guy he goes on cable the push he stood.

I made it. I made him stand up and his calf was blown off from his knee to his ankle with only is born in an actual ha now, so he left. It is a key on on the ground of such I one or two, and I put my back- came up to the road none on thirteen. By that time the medics should come out and spoken than my got cut my guys contracts and suffer out. Do I put him on an on my back my care and through in a vacuum? Jeep, and other medic grabbing by the hair, stuck a forty five in the side of his head. What what? What? What are you doing? Man? I just carry on fifty yards across the street in across the mud, I'm gonna do anything. Well you never know. I'm gonna learn lays oblong daddy.

It was on full automatic and he was gonna. Go for an interpreter. Talk to him and he says pointed the sky, the right that the attack happened, puff came by then, and he powerless Larry and stuff. You know it's beautiful sight on big ribbon unread and boom boom boom. While around a compound must he got hit by there's something I use out of one of the cobras or something like that. But it's me I did damage. It was funny that you interpret came back and and and told me he says you know doc. I wish me did you have to but that's all gale weathers mentality is that guy was a sergeant. It was a two half surgeon. I think in Vienna, in the areas that I use it uses up there?

in the early guy was like a captain. Ursula's like that gives is weird little guys and those guys and they would would you say to those guys. Word then turn to be that full light help help out or They were a lot of times with, are there reintegrated into depending on what area they were they come from and they find that out in the nude. Did you know by them back into the this society through there? I don't know, I never saw him again, That's that's another thing. There's a lot of similarities and not up there. Definite somewhere. It is between. You know what it was, for us over Iraq and and I didn't fight Afghanistan, but the guy's a fighter, I noticed that then then, an arm destroy? Adele, who is a good guy, knows a bad guy. Ass,

one of those things it, sir, there's no easy way to do it. Now. There is an error in the lot of villages stuff from provision, villages and stuff. We knew that no daytime was fine night time no longer through there. We had some some girl get and our compound what's a gauge her clothes and started, they found her inside and she's run, the village of which was a privacy violations, and I don't want it Intel on stuff from her and and all that and the next thing you know the Recon mountain up, they're going to take her back to the village and I'll go ahead. I'll go. You know how to shotgun on one hundred and fifty one and so we pulled in this village, wishbone dit it know and make sure they kicked around the back of this track throughout by issues young Alla time does not gonna me they're going to me I'm all, but the interviews now should be alright. Ok

At that moment, though, when we did leave pulled in this village and stuff, I saw this. What I thought was the head coming up over to one of the witches and stuff that they had almost fired, but but didn't and ended up being like a palm frond or something. Before that rigid. Is this huge? Those guy? I was gonna scary, you, I would think, on version of the the insurgents definitely in Iraq if they found out in remedy, if they found out that somebody was working with the commission, they did kill em they skinned alive. They did that they'd be Adam. It was pretty often we will the? U S Congress, forces were very careful not to ever indicate than any other people that will work with. An especially when I first got as as the transition happened in the insurgents got were on the defensive more and the local populous realise that we are in a stay and protect them. They got more. We think more vote.

All about, like I know, there's a bad guy down there and an in depth momentum, shifted towards the local populous, just being like hey, where good you're good Those guys are bad here and there was less fear, and that was really wanted a tipping point. So you this early release programme and how that you, just bomb, they plucky are Vietnam. Yet a letter will have that. Go down now actually colonel, flew in where I was on this other track and was one of those commander actually bubble on top five ethics color five, seven seven every I remember one one fours or something I think otherwise, and colonels Colonel came flying out there in his helicopter Cayman, where we stand agent he desired knowledge ride out air I'll eat off the hush he goes,

he'd, unlike stick an underground, loom, large man of your great great copyright, and I he goes go and I gotta duffel bag, and I start given stuff away my camera, my chamber, Carter, nothing. You now describe what I could and jump on this helicopter we're up in the air and now still trying to do that for point? But Why didn't I fly miles long before you know turned with a bottle honest. I e just reshuffling went like that and was done in Europe in the air. Treetop hadn t doubt Yang, and that was it went back and base camp got my stuff out of the locker caught a ride on a I don't lose at caribou. I don't remember anyways anyways that down. Down Saigon and stuff and it was quick most create. Like I miss the first flight.

And I don't and I was downstairs shower and shave and and sergeant came out, just hey you just Mrs champagne line was a nice one two and unite airlines at life, and this so I set off I had a way round another day and then finally, we laughed and get on this. This world airline is neither korean or japanese, or something like that They flew at home was quick. Now you you five right right back in it said now we want to San Francisco, says yeah. I want a frisk girl, but this week I d erosion in Oakland or something I think was a widow. Was honour, and so they give you all your lawyer stuff and you give them all your staff that that you this nor very wise and Mongolia engage cab out there. The airport I sulky went out there

Ps Flight back from from now we're nineteen one thousand nine February, so It is the height of teeth. The height of the Anti WAR Movement now I am now worse, What was I like not too bad airs San, Diego and stuff. He hasn t hippy guys out front when I came out, and I was really too worried, gladly homes saw my brothers and sisters have spat out in our nets. Bet on it at my feet. In our wasn't, a baby killers are needed and everybody said in amateur slight, eager ass, an this saw my brothers and stuff into hot. That was really the extent of the year of the of the war approach. Esters that you saw some jackass idea was that

You did you look at it like you, just did just now, which is likely. However, the skies and away pungent there to adapt, I'm gonna kill him with. I just you know, is a slight irritated me a little bit, but then I get in fear of my brother saw me in such weather. Janet I came back in their numb this now you're you're so this is like, appear to what, like three days for days five days or something like that level. Five days less than five days you go from the jungles of Vietnam. We often hear back in a whirl and then your back in the world did they give Did they give you any kind of now, so. Do I get a cab all that's a funny thing to workers because I went through Ngos go right ahead, so they had track of all of sardines and stuff that were in Vietnam, and so

we'll be back to the idea, and I think they had you had to go through. Bungalows buildings and staffing. I went through on and he goes let me name market is of you're one of them made it. I know what I mean Does your on on the list. Every major, ok, fine! her stamina was, but they were accounting. How many anti owes from that period made it but now there wasn't. No, there is no debriefing earth. The timer, or was you'd, do were and good job America Y know. I didn't know they didn't know until later on, one of the big things it gets pointing out. A lot is in world war, two when you finish world war to a minimum,

You got on a ship with an you dive about the ship with four five hundred other guys thousand other guys, and you rode with them for six weeks until back to America during that time. You talked about everything and you kind of got it off your chest. Now your system and then you got back and it was you. You got that decompression time we didn't even know what it was called but putting you. You know from the jungles Vietnam, two main streets, Andy Ale. They don't have to tell you about it, though, did not indifferent. Ours is also feel When I figured I haven't everybody now lower things that I had a family or do a lot of guys did, sir. I thought where, where we're glad that you had a family in Greece, major Roger came on home when you did did you did you jump

I back into college that I wasn't. I can't believe that away and I take astrology geometry and whatever you get a class is all mixed up and then we'll just wasn't for me, but I did get out and then I'm going to send me back. So uh suits we, you were still in the army, they austere yoke. They out process that year, you're good turn in, are you still in reserves and whenever it is recovered a year? This is what would you do, what you doing back and children while now and then I went to work with my dad at the unemployed, employment. I dig it. I one of her ear and anger was, six months or such like that. That's another funny story. I e the people of the unemployment and I'll ask you.

What did you do an involuntary? Nor should it nobody idea and I were built but wooden boats. While we are having now winnable billiards, but they didn't any of it. And what did you even military and mean a sarcastic little ass? I was, I kill people cutting jobs for that I'll just be a sarcastic. I don't want to say when I say I want to work for my dad and at the employment agency for a while the through that imply mangy. I got a job at eight Billy Material Warehouse in Dallas enable case products, and I work therefore quite a lot of little while, but I'm used to estimate contra there's an stuff in other came in there and they said hey you work on a week at home before you, in OZ, organ a cabinet job, and then, after that, this bill and houses

Then I work for the gas company in the eightys, as for about I never saw this little guy grow up or anything. You know it's kind of like I work at nights and days and and afternoons, and then I got the job at the guy quit that I'm doing a lot of things are in that, then I got the job at the hotel del. What what? What? What point? How old are you when you Josh I was thirty. Two thirty, three thirty two. I America, thirty two sources like three hours every three years and then I got divorced What year, did you bounce around from a lot of jobs? You were looking for, someone like you, did you what you, what you want to do there's a geneva. There was a good job on that was actually

there's just now to find in the John yeah. You know lamb people helping stuffing on because I didn't law cited may not after the old Orson staffing Eyes is wandering in my mind and early wanderings, and then I work the thunderbolt racist for a long time during the eighties and a couple of guys. You know I try to go to the the dull, for I went down early, they got. What do you do it's wrong carpenter and I had been in the past and for me for ten bucks an hour when eyes, I have less better. Nothing. Eliza was a good job as a good Guerrero, so good family down their hotel and you got being corner when I was a little bit, although the bridge

draw near near days: none and was like Hulu Disneyland. Then this kiddies VIII came along and I was hitherto diligently during his homework it three thirty in after you, then the shot our eyes, that brings us the jars. Josh off, and so do you we weren't, you guys actually live. Did you didn't bring Valentine? Ok, see you live there Spring Valley, but you worked in corners, and that men, you spend a bunch diamond corner now? Basically, what had happened? I think I was nine when he has got divorced.

Ten, so I say my mom's blazing Claremont fur two more years than the middle eighth grade, unlike this isn't a good seen so called him up and he came and got me when that was it. I lived in the rest of us. We finished out eighth grade and Clare Mountain and lived in the May set, will spring Valley and would go over the bridge together every day and it worked out. I played it, play three seasons of sports, my plate to soccer for four years, baseball, opportune and golf for two. So by time practice was over. He was off workin. We'd go home. Yes, it was cause top Reagan in you know that I think out of my graduating class. Maybe I want to say up to thirty. Kids have been in school together since kindergarten.

And so what you're trying to do the new kid on the block- and you know course had long blonde hair and was a surfer and wear hawaiian shirts. All the time he got took out six months to kind of break in and and make make friends, but it was great, I wouldn't trade anything for going. There was a great school to go to for four years couple: three or four families like really man and made me feel, welcomes whose it was a good move. So one hears you start surfing how old were you started surfing wealth ray? we started serving, I mean we ve got gonna, be my whole life. We camped itself Carlsbad State Beach. Every summer I mean my grandpa bogey into his eighties, literally like what Boogie Board down the stairs and get in the water. So I was grew up with it have an older half brother. That was a big time surfer, but at that time he wasn't the nurturing supportive type. He was the mall. We'll take it up, drowned you type. So, unfortunately missed an early window to get started, but I'd say really got a nerd around fourteen

end of eighth grade. You know it's like a buggy born whatever and then by ninth grade we got ya, got into surfing My friends from the great thing wasn't even living in Spring Valley. Every weekend my dad would drive us cuz. My friends, we all grew up in Clermont, but before high school, one of my best friends moved down to PB, so basically, all summer long, that's where we lived all week, long, that's where we live, and so frankly to this guy, he would drive me from Bring valley on a Friday afternoon while we go home and then to drive out and then he would come Sunday night pick me up and surf the entire region, yeah, just hang with paying with friends and see. I was like fourteen seem a freshman, your high school pretty much cut, which is late. Now I mean there are certain when they're like three in another. Heads are now they're held by the time the outward appearance of Poland, not a school, the home school and we have six years old. Yet so and and lets let's hear about, I mean how did you start

How did you said yourself? You know what I like riding surfboards, but I want to start making them I'm. It really started with Ding repair, and you know just I wanted to be surfer me. We're all surfers wait. A huge group recalled the felt rap and there is thirty of us every week and from Mission Bay, high Madison Claremont, you see, I you know I would show up in. Would conglomerate PV every weekend fur like four years in a row. It was. It was pretty incredible and I just I had such affinity for surfing in that neighbourhood, where a lot of people in the support industry, you know yet bird often had South Coast Skip and Hank had Harry Surf shop and than George Joe Roper used to have like his first original shot down. Elsewhere, but so these guys were around all the time. So just kind of was like pulling back as making a living

Boris, although their complete legends and different ways, but that's how it started. I would like take boards home and being repair- and you know hack on my friends boards in charge and twenty bucks. What about the fact that ok, what years is this this the ninety. So I went to high school ninety four. Ninety five, a graduated, ninety eight, so so, how did you go from being and into like what a normal nineties surfer type a sir and type of surfboard and type attitude to being lost Ok nor I'm gonna actually ride longer board. I'm gonna be more traditional. Where did that come from to be honest, what really got us sparked and, like my group of friends in a serving with endless summer, to add just come out

the glitter. They never seen the third rail watching it and he was with me and my friend Joe, and it just was that in just that kind us parked, I think the style of like that's how we want to serve. I never really, I think, the staff in a proper short bore. I just you know and then what what what he could afford to get me to you know. My first board was broken and half guy talking, I'm along worthy got fixed at island serve. You know and that's what I rode and so that that was the vehicle, and I think I got a couple swat meet scores for fifty bucks, like a read of a rocket fish, so did write a couple smaller boards, but never a proper short bore. You not maybe make us it was that you know like. I was like a big guy, but I don't. I just didn't like the flow and just the style parts of it. Then, right after the summer to our local hero, Joel Dear came out with I think, has first movie and that that was like ok yeah, that's

We want to try to serve and I'm still trying to circulate everyone. But yes, that was kind of the Congo and end again. I think it just was being able Manny down and island surf when we're in high school and I'll hook this up on a board and that's how it was that we started. Oh well, actually two, so I guess I should backtrack right after that was playing baseball, started, majors, which is eleven and twelve and went into pony league, and I played two years of high school: well: coaches, Claremont, own dining, glassing, Bob Oji. So in all the kid on. The team were like Lord shore scrip near Rusty, rippers right there, all right, they're, short boards, and so that kind of as a goal can and just been able to go to factory back then United. They wouldn't let you look in a room. You can ask a question: they do just be like it to be you know a chronic will build your board, but don't you like don't go knows in and around you know,

That's how it happened. We ordered a bar through Bob Roger bullshit me. I got two plus one high pro nineties, perfect ninety on board and then my neck for now and broke broken half and then the next board. It was pretty classic the starting sorry. I broke my leg and soccer and my board while broke the board first than my leg and soccer the next week. So I started at school year out on crutches as pretty funny but the neck. Two boards. I got word was astute Stu nineties, pro Nino Long Board and then Ozma became our Wanna nine for around ten single, and so we went back to Bob and public guy astute can shape anything and which create looking back now when I went in order that board stools hey, come in my room check this out? You should get one of these and it was the first six six karma model that he had shaped bridge all right, so it

anyway so that yeah, that's how. But we had that crazy and with with the bodies as a baseball coat, but owner of you know one of the biggest clash shops. I think in Sir, what history, the audits and, better still at some point, your brain is saying I just don't wanna ride these boards. I wanna I wanna. I wanna shape these boards yeah. What how old were you said yourself? Amateur shape aboard? No, sixteen ok, so George Morning of the earth or somethin no not know at anybody know about that. It was just. It was more like what would watch the short board videos like all the lost videos. You known that's weed, logic that the tailor steel stuff like momentum and focus like that's what we watch, but some Alec. I ended up just in the long border in the group said my friend Joe, but I think it just I wanted. You know he was a car. The I think I gonna have that in my genes and

really just wanted an excuse to be able to keep surfing as long as possible and I thought well, you know, shape on board. By the way. We he came down, drop me off on a Friday or whatever and Skip was out taken up trash and as diamond one. You know maybe maybe watch him shape. Right, and so he was ok, I'll, go ask him and he gets out like sliding down. My dad's truck gars airless tell about fusing oak. Obviously not everyone that listens. This part cast serfs and even pay even some people that serve well now, must be able to tell us about skip right, less skip fry. He is, I mean, he's he's us such a legend. It's hard to. I mean regional surfer, shaper from San Diego group and Bay Park and went to Hawaii with a wooden, see crew back in the day and really became one of the top.

Rivers in that area and still is an he I mean I my words gonna do any justice, but he sort of the kind of the one of the last guys from that say the golden era, you known that that MID, the late sixties it really designed and served and tested- and you know and would go back and redesign retesting of that era that still around is still doing a seventy seven and he's more Stoke now his chin in his veins. I didn't need. I wrote this border has been set up and I mean that's the Ten minutes of any conversation with a moloch know. How are the ways I now, but I rode the you know. He's just to see somebody Seventy seven is stoked as a fourteen year old. That's that skip, I mean like again. I can't I can't do him any, justice as far as what he means to not just me, but the sport in general, and he really is our compass, fur, YO, YO,

and its damson here as your seven years as you're sitting there try struggling to describe. How are you scribes, skip and what it means in surfing new. I I guess just the word legend like use these the legendary shaper sir he's sort of the the pinnacle of what that means in. If you say his name, everyone just goes oh yeah. Well, that's that's. Skip right, yeah and and Some points so sir, you dad you Dave. You just said: ok Woggle ask, and I will talk to me. I told him. I was just a man, they went up is MR fry

and I asked them as an aching, my son, why we favour warning us and I go I had burnt by somebody or something like that in on and took some shaved, and I don't want to do that, but he says you know why I watch him in the water jack amount, but then they went from their yeah. Really. This is an organic, thing. So as a teen San ten agar stay, I went to state on grant money caused my mama's around and he did really make that much money. You know what the time, and so I get this grant check my my freshman, its fall Sutton semester. You know we have already got books, schools paid for and have had how much money left I went down and at that point lock in Harry's Donna was at the desk Utah. About what you'd want and that she go

go to matches here, get this blanket wait for a week at the Blanco back and then need hopefully talk to skip in a lot of people. Donna would just deal with, but thankfully Skip came out here. What do you wanna go? Well, I know boards are really different from everybody that neighbourhood rides on. You know, right of fry private. Right other boards, and so want wanna introductory model. You know what would be a good representation for meta to learn you want to serve your style aboard, and so it was a nine six egg, two plus one an anyway. Everyone I dropped the blank off until the shape came. It was about three months and just organically from surfing. Again, his shop was on the street. I grew up surfing so we'd see each other in the water I don, I kind of like he struck up of amendment are released. In ship with her she caught up took me under her wing is like one of her kids quote unquote and Anne and just organically became close.

Closer with them underwear. Finally, I got the call He goes up you're up Shaper board marijuana come down and we'll go for a surf and then I'll shaper born you can watch go on. I was like a freak, an army of running across campus right to get home and like to go home and tell my dad, and so that's that's what went down. We met at the shop the next day and he pulled up of his personal nine six eggs and we walked around the corner. On the stairs. All my friends were across the street said on their tailgate, like what you didn't write it. Skips personal woman. You know- and we went answer really really fun b like for a couple hours like a really good session and we went into the room and I just sat on the toolbox and it was, I don't know it felt like it was like ten hours long, but it probably is only a couple hours, but man I was Jack. I was so jacked that driving

Almost fell asleep driving home. You know- and you know you hadn't shaped aboard at this point- we ok, so the summer after my senior year, I just was like I'm gonna go for it and he let me build a proper thy shaping room in the garage side, worked there's a wall and corn auto across the golf course that I, spent all summer workin with master by bricklayer, and I made a good money and she put it into shaping room and literally split the garage and half IDA eight by sixteen by H, Renzo Proper, even today, standards a proper room, and so I had that prior to an idea The board is coming from skip, and so that was bill. I got to watch that and I think the very next week I got a blank and went forth. You now and then course, butchered it I even think that will not last, but I actually think we Then it out with a router.

Imagine how many passes with a lot of trouble. You know I've been. Would it didn't know back. Then there was no night than all the guys are like piss, ground, like I'm, not telling you what I knew, how to do that or what tool to user like figure it out and there's no you to bananas pouring out to go up in his watch, everyone shape or gas. Are you really reduced literally on your own? And yes, we butchered that first blank and then got watch skip shape that egg. Then I went back ok out of more veto. Left over money from the from building that wall I bought a plainer, slowly started. He got me a clean and assure form right so kind of you real slowly put the pieces together like ok, I can at least then this thing out and not you know, but and so with with that that was ninety eight Follow ninety eight spring, a ninety, nine and so like the next two and a half three years like every day was servant was skip and watching him, like that's just what

went down like a stone. Hang out. Will you and him say anything to mean? I just hang out in the corner of the room, you know and I do errands for Donna, read watch the shop if they had to go to a lunch meeting or whatever and yeah. I was a real, real special time to be able to do that. Of every one, every person that would have wanted to be an opposition woody. Think it was that he saw a new. That said, you know what I'm good. With this kid. I don't know I have no idea yeah I've. I really Dont know because there's been dozens of other people that have probably try to put themselves in that same position, I don't know, I think part of it was maybe haven't Donna delay. Gas is a good kid. You know is one of my kids there's another guy right, Levinson that she can. It gave the same too. Two, and so we were around a lot and I think slowly you know I would

saw who I was in my demeanor and that type of thing and again how stoked I was. Of course, how could you not be, but so yeah I don't know, maybe I don't know, look we're right now. The blood which I welcome. Did. Did he let you take a password plainer? Well, I'd I'd. I haven't. I did it. I didn't in his room, but the way just go in and watching and talking and haven't show me this. I would go home and literally repeat that step. It also is kind of like It was until later on that we started kind of building. We felt maybe ten or twelve words together were off. The thin went out and template Neil finnish finish it or vice versa, but those early years. It just was like studying watching That is how I grew up like that. I started playing off because I'd watch golf on the on the weekend with my grandma. All the time then go out and hack dirt all over the Middle EAST,

reed, but then you know just like by watching do in watching in doing so, that's kind of how that came about The war is the growth of from you butchering blanks to you selling a blank for are selling a board that you shaped for to break even an do. I eventually make you know yeah box, thirty bucks. Fifty bucks I mean so the ice shape. The first Boris shape was a nine five long board and then the second one is a rocket fish and then that whole crew that I grew up with it, the beach. I call you I'm bored well ya, want to build you one. You know the charge of half the blank cost and so is a longboard blank for a hundred bucks charge. You fifty bucks and then thanks. Roper Joe Roper had his ding repair out down Marina Boulevard and he would blossom. In fact that was

really cool too and skipped shape that board. He goes ok, you can take it over to chose, as he would always taken to the glass or right, so that was really cool, so Joe Glass, my first fry and my first forever shaped said pretty kind of cool story there Viejo do that you ve been. He still does it still glasses. Kids, like my like like me now building their first. Second, third, tenth born and he's glass and I'm still really cool. So then that I just started escalating and you started actually where someone outside your crew says hey, I wouldn't mind one of those boards to you and now you can charge and the full price of a black and if they have half yeah yeah. I guess a kind of I mean it. So there is I went to Spain for my fourth year of school right for year more eleven months, and so I did do any shaping, of course, and then hardly any surfing. So there's a number of boards out there. I think I want to say there's about seventy five

boards at were shaped prior to that the measure in one month, maybe our maybe two month most and then that is what we call the Spring Valley, new era. Eric sees me them all men, the numbers as V1 Ride Spring Valley, which is classic, is here we are in power even of shape them in Spring Valley anyways. So then when it came back. It was s v and IE like Spring Valley, new era, that I was I care we want to do this, but I also wanted to finish school. I got a degree in spanish lead from Saint State While I was studying Spain, a friend came over and then did you have kind of plans, but do what to do anything without degree. Yeah so my best friend so at some point, you're gonna be a normal person. Yeah in my head. I think well, teachers have a hundred eighty days a year off that sit right. So that kind of thing The plan I went in for international business. They go look at seventy seven years to get out of here to my work and live in college seven years. So

I went in with a high level of spanish that I went right in upper division. And if they are so, I knew I could graduate quicker with spanish degree than trying to go, see me international business so that but when I went to span my whole world got turn into the wind business as a friend of mine graduating from what would you do you doing over here is like we travel for a month together, rooms pretty amazing, and he would be a wine importer, and so our spanish teacher from high school was like ok well, his name was Tom Tom. You put it together and I'll give you we'll be and see what happens, and so I came back from my year. The company got form you got all the license and literally a month. FR. I graduated to containers of. Why landed in San Diego so he was like. Are you ready, sell some wine? We don't know The thing about anything

do that we had wine and we had to go sell it. So I did after three years and I call it my mba in real life. He neither has. It was not everything. I'd gone through by the time is twenty three was like what most people go through corporate wise having we had corporate disillusions he now five hundred dollar in our lawyers, all that stuff- and I did learn quick books without it- take care of all the accounting and all the money and right all the Czechs, and so that's kind of what thrust me right into like the sort of a bit I mean I was a business owners for fifty percent of the business and was do this or like fail, you know, but eleven at home, righted graduating still living at home, not getting paid, so it wasn't like it was going, but it wasn't real, like the numbers. Weren't real, we're, like selling cases of wine pain rant. We might get out to her book

you know it was a- was a very brutally like difficult time to turn to be twenty, two twenty three and completely struggling and completely broke for three years and you're still shaping yeah yeah, so that this did the shaping of Miss Tilney Garage so get out, You want a month, maybe two month serving not as much as I used to, because now this this is like it sink or swim type. A deal here the white business. So a lot of my work, long hours, you know and brutal and not getting pay like or maybe paid one month in the not paid for two months. And you know that partnership with investors struggles- and you know where are you talk to him anymore? You know the bit that my own business partner, thankfully my friendship with Our teacher is still super tight, his and my best friend Nanda that survive, but the real world experience I got out of that. All the contacts

cold calling me we went from zero to two hundred. Eighty five accounts in a year are unknown added anything about why NEA and I went what I learned a lot quick, but just that daily brutal called call called, knock, hey they're, like her you see all the old guys that are banana for thirty years. Laguna fucker, you guys, but we it was unique, because we were the importer distributor, so we kind of had a position of like like. Will you guys get to go to Spain like that we're in Spain? You know my partner just went to Chile. The wine, so it was legitimate, but we're like these young kids in how pretty thousand? Is that was a gnarly three years and I came out of that pretty spun out and and then at the end of that, I just did it go under. Did it basically, my partner got married and then he got pregnant and wealth You know what I mean. They got pregnant and I dislike. Are you what how leg

I'm living at home. Not getting paid yearly, get rid of a kid, so it happened is he got? He went and got a real job workin for another importer of produce and then so he's like. I want out I'll let the two years I was ignored or I'll, unlike out like you know, and so we worked it out. Hee hee, moved on. I consolidated a distributor friend of mine, Jerry Heart save my ass. Let me put my wine and his warehouse, so I can get out of a two thousand five hundred dollars a month. Lease props to Jerry still cimorelli still in the wine business Legend of Human and then I remember is at an all time surfing from PVC club, I'm doing the coalition content. I'm walking having this last talk with my ex business partner about. I might look. I want out man, I'm dying and so we make some kind of made an agreement. I remember, as in the parking lot at Malibu, that's my decided on like I'm over this. My column done and

so Jerry helped to get out of it. Malibu help made you see the light on her and and Jerry worked with me and really be God not all the wine and do his place and he help sell it off and I did the full. Why did you go back to where and pay for the dissolution agreement, all that stuff and moved away, and I was like the end of two thousand and five, It is only about two and a half years. Almost three years and an after that I was down, I was per- I go on, go back in the restaurant. I work tables not in place and quick says which is now: what's it called Wonderland downer? Yes, I work their great crew back then and so I went back I go hey. Would you guys my now? Have some wine industry experience announce like come on in, and so they took me right

back in and and for six months, and I just did that. I just I work there and I also worked at the wide Wolpe strode down on look industry cause Chris would always taste our wines give us tasty whether hated her like that right and they had just open up restaurant a restaurant? So I went down and help them almost for about a year and a half after I started Joshua officially officially in July, two thousand six, and after the wine I sat by called skipping die. We had dinner, go look eyes like you know you obviously seen the history. The last three years working on, I wanted to billboards, go for it and they both gave me their blessing said, whatever we can do to help support you. You know you have our support and go for it, and so that's what kind of put it on full blast and then and then what did that look like when it full support from skip and on Friday, look like well just like there. They were there

You know they weren't bond on the fact that on the day, obviously, besides us first couple cost, bored skip search, shaping everything I rode and then I had access days quiver. So it were his boards shape. How I serve in my head. I go well, that's funny. Not many other people Hey boards like this might be a good idea to maybe pay attention and start so the board's our building, although bricks compared, where in that style, and they knew that so a lot of the models. It's like I'm not going to learn one thing and then going to go over here and recreate a wheel, and so I just tried to take What those initial formative years and with how I serve other influences, put together what we ve got that is used, It was good for me to know that they are my back. You know anything anything I needed a mean support, wiser, my meaning skippin. I were still serpent together. All the time is taken me here. He took a malady reversed. I'm swamis Cliff Santo Ikey. Really it wasn't just the board thing it was. Winter

whether swell direction interval this reef? That real? Because windows at school escape. I got two hours and he go. Did you do go here, and sure enough. It show up at the right place and get wave. So was more more school than just the board stuff. What was the escalation? Look, unlike in terms of go from where you are start. Josh also affords to wear you know, I was here and start off. You got gotta. Sell some of the boards. You gotta get some of one or two three and then eventually the word gets out there and Do you know how long does it take before you go before your actually have full time, job, she'll lords. Well, it's it's! It's pretty it's funny because so, when I got back from that, Spain trip skip it moved Tories out now and his neighbors prescriptions and famous super famous shaper, and so we became friends.

When I came back so my senior year. I work for him just doing shop, rat stuff, sweep monopoly in the shaping room, trash pack and boards right. Well, when this winding came about there. Is it arrived a definition whose now also super famous shaper. He came into town with the standing of state and he would work, it is Sir Shop on guard net and he grew up serving crystal periods I lay manlike, whichever one worker to surf shop and Cotonou like he is like into the board thing and yeah, and so I said, ok, we'll call Collis Guide so he's kind. It took my position at Christmas and he got really into it. He was your Chris. Let him she that night in his room and and glasses and do, and so he took it ever a bill and all these things start to finish in and that lasted up until my fault with the wine thing started. Common Jeff goes Hammond, I'm look, for a space. Would you want a room ran a room from me. I got yeah, and so we

the place over off Hancock Street two thousand six July. Fourth, we both shaped our first boards and that I started so is kind of a cool like I got him in the crash, Then he gave me the opportunity to leave Spring Valley. Rhinos livin impede the time and in that was it, but as far as gettin busy, it was until like probably two thousand ten I'm I worked it. I work at three or four different restaurants actually work. This I try to work a summer. The Dell has like a valet greeter at the beach village, but it was like a our ships till three in the morning and I'd wake up. You know from not sleep and but yeah it was. It was tough shoes, I think I'd, be busy. Nothing like and pay written in all my stuff, you're right I'd go in the whole area to get some reunited catering jobs as it was quick, big money, so I dig it took a lot of peace. And then I went to New York,

in two thousand nine for the Surf film Festival there, and I met my friend Sancho, who was big surfer in the basque country of of Spain. Also free, only owns one of the most massive wineries and real ha. So we headed off like right away. You know, speak in Spanish and he was I gotta why you try to come over and I have some friends and up small shops? Maybe you could come over and and Shapes board, so that was the fall. I left my the days of the October twenty by birth is the twenty second and I spent six weeks and I travel old found him in his family's winery did that he took me up to the basque country and introduce me a couple people I built some boards there. I went down to Portugal built like five or six boards in a factory down there. So is like ok. This has potential next summer went back for eight weeks, some after that it at ten weeks, so that that help once

that, because that was extra income, the Euro is super strong, so kind of help and as pain ran at my place here right, but I just yeah. So since two thousand ten, which has been on a slow growth pact powder, uniting come out with any marketing plans, are may the main thing was just try to shape a decent bore, an mark. Your marketing plan is to make really good boards yeah yeah and asked for the workers and the best clash opts to which helps, makes it look pretty. Man. I give money back on my first, the house- maybe I should say, but yeah still trying to figure it out Both have the what is it sentimental value yeah yeah, I still get hit, got number thirty. Eight I'm sorry. I know this was his first logo, yeah yeah, for that. So that was a real cool story there. It's like its kelp around a J age with like aka early water in the background and ass

friends? Why frozen watercolor artist and as she's it cause? I first Lotto thirty or forty boards in Avonlea logos Rehn? Has it wasn't like you could just gotta keep, those and have imprint of rice paper. However, he did it and she's, like all. I drew this logo Just thinking about you and your vibe, your energy right, and she came up with that, the first time and it you know she sits on a board nice, and so we ran with that, for, I don't know, probably twelve thirteen hundred boards as the first logo it's more sense. You know the only board you shit now I'm just about it, forty two hundred right around that that number I had I? I don't have everyone documented, you know, but I know the numbers that I did in Spring Valley, the one that did the first factory with Jeff and then I moved actually in two thousand and nine and moved to where skip with that. There's still

five other shapers in there and so had member the numbers, but I don't have it like to the actual bored. I know this. I think it's harbour harbour, has every board ever shaped, documented like you couldn't hey, I've got this seven eight, what this number and they can look it up and it allows young shaped editor. Yes, so, but Tom yeah around forty two hundred, not that many people are no people, think I've shape or less out there are just like a lock is a lot of what I do is big volume bordering on year along boards and pay for it. Yet for of another twelve foot or for short, you know one of the things where people ask a lot about mentorship right. They say: oh, what and for me I never really had like the mentorship that you get from skip, whether you ve gotten from Skype, and that you continue to get from skip. That's like them. Was pure, solid rat, well rounded, mentorship idle. Forgot, like anyone in the in the ceiling

that was just given me all that you know everything and I don't sit in a negative way means plenty guys help me out. I learned a tone, but I always had to kind of pigs fly like hey. This guy would teach me about this, and then someone else would teach me about something else, but I think just the the idea of like how you approached skip, whose you know exactly a guy that that is looking to bring on a bunch people to enter. I mean I'd, say anything, but that really, and yet you ended up in a position where you get to absorb as much knowledge as you can pass. We get from. Among you know, that's endless, you know, infinite about the information, but actually I think it was Joe Joe- was telling me that he could be like like look into whether he be like. Oh you need to go here at two. Thirty in the afternoon is going to be good for about forty eight minutes cardiac. He has had its day his knowledge of the water, the wind, the tides Zactly? That's so I

it states. Coming down my board, my car he's good, where you know I've got you know were, although here and sure enough. You know. And then just servant with a man we go down, do the cliffs runs that does relax on the most amazing sessions ever you know, we ve got a couple birthday sessions. My They had October decency, Sal swells on our ten sectional em for boards. Goin eight and three often it's amazing. It's hard. You don't see people, you don't really see many people do in that much anymore. It says: yeah upscale gets back down there. This one Yeah yeah, I think, just again ass, like all almost the advice is like what does the approach you took was hey, be humble, be persistent, you know, show up absorb run your mouth. You know you want like hey. Can you be my mentor making we monitor Hagen? We might I ask you, don't take it

mind. If I sit over here. Just watch like in you prove that overtime pay in and then he's probably watching you surf in these watching you I'm sure you important own, hey what you think it s here, probably having to choose call at some of them and they are at least be able to say hey little bit at this level that can get you here. How do we really want to be a Finn? Template, sir, where to put the Finns and all that stuff I mean I still get nervous to ask him for stuff. I mean we're like tight, and it's still I go to Europe, but anyway about you known That's the only thing he's so giving isn't. He Give it all away, you know, I mean he really is this most humble giving person, winner when I was at sea so maybe ten maybe but longer that years ago, but my certain he's here. They love surfing, he's been servants and he was a little kid. Oh, I remember. I got a story there hooker couple well

we would see. Occasionally we see scepter and arm and you're telling that's good private as eight any we don't listen, we're gonna like paddle over look at him. He had hardly begun at this time. You used to ride this red foamy it was forget is it is like a nice of reform as you could get, but you know he was eight years old and I take him out on big days and he would serve every swell, but but then you know I was still in the Navy, and you know he really wanted to skip and he wanted to get bad, and I was a dad in the navy with no money and how am I going to get my son a skip? Cuz? They cost a lot of money and eventually I got. I got a guy up and Leg Dana Point and I found it on Craigslist and he had the most abs

they destroyed skip. You ve ever seen like an eight o winner egg and they would three hundred bucks, so you know what kind of condition it was in for three and a box. It was an awful condition. I drove up there. My van I paid this three hundred bucks, and that was that was Santa Claus brought Santa was brought skip fry to my son. We still have a board and never get rid of this board yeah. Oh my gosh, pretty sweet money here, story about your son. It I'll, never forget where was north garbage and serve their lot grown up agenda a decent size day and you know you have caught a wave, going through and and- and I see you and your kid like just in my The danger zone, and that is before got really crowded with you. Don't kind of the beginner surfers is still crew then holding down and and I'm like, hey man, get your kid heard out here and like this like, like fifty five barrel,

drama sits up in just looks at me. I go as I know that look like mad with guys he's gonna get us Edison for me is that winter, like man and then in the next were taken off from your house- and here to see I'm just getting shoved in front of my dog. I again, I'm I'm sorry. You know he. I remember those eyes crack up once we became once you know we reconnected and second how's that man. I was I order. You have hassling circle, there was no. There was that people yeah you so young and I'd have mountain man. Days of my mandate, there's no they're, no kids out Jani Augener, your kid Antioch when they may be will see me out. I just analogous in baggages does classic

I'm so you kids turned into a good good boy, could get tourism serfs? I know that I remember doing it So what's the what's? You know where you guys out right now we're what's kind of what's the status of Josh all surfboards. While this moment, ok so flat, let's go from thousand ten cent. Big summer over in the basque country, just servant, shape and and and and then coming back I'd moved into the complex were skip was out about medicines in there and Michael Miller, to maintain and at the time and dumb, all Jim Guys- and I would just I would just play pokemon go on. Another trip, shape, shape, shape, go gone, another trip Slowly, building in I got website, I'm on my third website now and so that help

people get really see models and I had one guy, a japanese guide that time selling mostly customs. He would he live Here- Bodied, Solomon, ship them and then we parted ways. It's been six years ago and cause I've seen Chris Model Chris had a great distributor ship in Japan Isaac. I want that MAC as it's like consistent boards every month. Now, ten fifteen, twenty thirty. Who knows what you know numbers he was do about like that. How you make it. You know you got to get a distributor, so we parted ways. I went to Japan for the Greenroom Festival, which is like a music art, surf themed festival and had a couple contacts here in California that were japanese surfers, and so they sort of fish around like a Josh halls come to. Japan wants to get a distributor start me doing some real business. Not just here got to

ass the waters as much sweet. I don't have anything now for the next two weeks leg, something consistent and that's why I found holy smoke. Is my distributor now seo and work just September temper with six year. So that's been great, not a ton of boards but consistent, and so that once that happened, then it was ok. Breather get caught upon some dead here, so I can breathe and then and then slowly go. You know. Shop in York start selling my boards quite a bit and then just doing that, then I'd go to Europe. Summer and out. You know forty fifty boards, and so I kind of had over to get kind of a consistent base, a consistent Was there a tipping point where your boards sort of eleven into the status that they are now where they were. From like pair a surfboard. Do like our that's a Joshua Maybe maybe other people could say that better than than me, I just still try to shape a better bore

then I did yesterday and I doubt I made again I've been real fortune to work with the best glass shops in San Diego, which helps, and thankfully they worked with me and that Cotta helped, and I think that with the consumer see? I think that people seeing the consistency like woe, Josh's doing this in Japan, he's doing that in the maybe that's help create and gone, and I used to go to twice a year for the fish, the event rival may that go back in September. For the film vessels, I think just the moving around and maybe that help create a sort of that like while whose boards or New Yorker I don't know, I think somebody else might be able to put the other obvious. Huge thing is you're, like beer just quite frankly known as Skip prize protegee and that's what people think like. Oh I can't go to skip rye, because I don't have that much money or I don't have that much time or I just can't make it happen, but manner

get a Josh Hall and that's a huge part of a two hour. I mean obviously right yeah yeah. That's I guess I should say that, like that's like the first, the eyes like that. Without that goes without saying didn't go without saying, for I mean you can't just you can't just I'm Aliona shape words like like your pride us. You know you can't that just doesn't that! That's not gonna work. You got up, you gonna earned that and you know just The board looks like it might be like it now: it's gotta, it's gotta. It's gonna have a little bit more depth in that area. I think at some point, and serving only I sir very early on pasture skip told me in the beginning- goes look if you want to do this as a career, a hobby like if you want to serve is worried about shape and don't try to do everything yourself and there's craftsman out there that do at night hats. Off too I mean I think, I've built five or six boards, maybe start to finish and my whole time billboards. So the guys it do that I mean that's hard work and you might be able to force six boards a week like that. If your laminated

funding sanding. All that polishing, I mean that's tough, so I guess I just wanted to serve and incorporates yeah you gotta have all those skills sets cause. None of those things are easy. No and I tell you what well we'll get to work that position I'm out now, but there is a severe lack of talent in the pool right now, most of my crew. Now that is working for me. They ve been built. Boards longer I've been alive and if one of them goes down like we're up shit, creek and so and it's really, and that's something. That's change with the with, like you said earlier, with Youtube in the internet like a kid they want to shape a boar now can go. Did you do that? Oh I can buy, come up. Judge a swede only have to think about it. They go online and watch this guy Shaver watch ACCA shapes Now it's not. Where sort of you know you had to pay dues them like when I wanted to learn like yet again pack and boards and sweeping up the shaping,

and then maybe a little hot coat here, and then he might try to sand here, but it was like baby steps. You know cause was having to learn from the ground up and now the big shift is areas go straight to the top. I don't want to mess with resin or sand bordering it fiberglass in there. Wars, and you know it's it's a and it's so hard and that's one thing: we will: what makes a quality board it's like everything makes equality board and eat. The Sanders got a real and to my Shea, based on how good is hot coat was set up and how clean the fin cut. I mean, so I don't get for granted because I get around enough to see other boards at all. Out there, but there when I come back to our shop, it's like ok, yeah. I can see the difference in quality and is in its it's funny or even three and a half years now with the shop which more get to that story? But what were but the crew. What we try to like fixed now are like my new little things compared to three years ago, when we started and and and

any takes adjustment to the room, your end and takes the light, whatever it takes time to jail and the teams going pretty good yeah, that's right! Now, it's yeah! So three and a half years ago, again Jeff account. He left that one DR in back in two thousand, I that's when I went and shaped in a Roger that same complex, its Gibson. He goes hey man and he had the shop for five years. A hamlet get out of this and the owner, where I do not suffer and it is LISA cuz- I'm going to go, try and buy a building. So would you would you want to maybe take this over and I was like okay well

add my business partner, Dave. He and I have been talking for maybe six or seven years and how he he's obsessed with surfing, becomes MIKE the MIKE the finance world. You know and I've of her twenty years, pvc club member surfing the point burdock and all that stuff and we'd sir shores- and we had always talk about business, but I didn't we didn't know how he would fit like inside Joshua surfboards- and I told this opportunity came up- maybe to take over a small glass shop just down the street from where I sat and goes and comes back the next day. Okay, let's do that, but start a new company for fifty fifty fifty liability, everything investment. You know I go profit all that stuff. You could I go sure, but here's how it's going to be set up, I'm going to keep doing what I'm doing, which is true, around surfing in shaping. I will make it so that you guys have foam every week and he goes ok and so he's run. The shop he's he's actually he's involved in

he does all the how coating on the decks and resin loops and he pays the guy the order stuff, and he basically he runs it. I just make sure that there's phone found their organised, hopefully by Tuesday, at noon every week. That's when we start restart batches butter, that so Jabba given me a year to kind of like sauce, I guess there's no. I can't just go hire somebody many coloured tent jobs. You know I can't go so we started put we're outside with my Sander Wade, who was working at diamond glassing and whose also fry guy, and so we ve always gotten along, and he was why no one so he gonna put us on to eliminate her and then I knew a guy that could sand and also to fins, and dumb and then we had a a that that had worked with back lower bit christen, like oh three afraid still around, and so we just kind of put it together and and it's funny looking back now, it will be fifteen packs and we can barely do six back in like six was a big week, for I think we did four packs

there's a couple months so and then in that time you know, diving, glassing shut down and we picked up the glass or polisher there and also the fin Laminated Guide John. That puts offends on so it's really become dislike real tight crew at again legends beyond me. I mean these asmund billing boards for forty plus years. I just happened me the kid it's giving them for hope. So really super thankful and Dave runs a super tight ship. You know it's not no money in glassing. So if we can say we got twenty bucks, a boar, that's what we're too so we're gonna change though, but slowly everybody needs to do together right. Every shaper, every glass shop needs to work together and hey. Like eight people touch that thing and they're making ten bucks an hour come on. You know so we're trying to try to elevate me. Not everybody can a toxin. I owe my wholesale in this boards. This now. Ok, you know it stop its

in others. Is a group of us taking your quality in prices, so everybody can actually make a living or hope do other than either still guys it they give their work away and unlike we can charge more your work for Europe. You billboards forego this guy. This guide for thirty five years like come on top of their scare thing or via my price or not, and could have any orders gotta go to trust in it and we came out swinging like I remember when we started no six, it's like no. This is my minimum here. It is and it is slowly gone up from there. Yeah, it's the classic gum, coming you're doing something in America, your build something America, your building, as quality thing that you can build. What we with what we can and I were allowed to chemical, wise and stuff. It's gettin, pretty tight in California. Clearly there are, the pyramids were doing it right. So at all,

Stuff costs, money, a lot of money and that's part of what that's part of it. American dream: it's what you fought for more than five or Dave ass. To have these operators got there and in living country and proud of this guy. Here. This guy for dragging my last at the beach every weekend, come on man actually too, I think we're we're we're moving. The sweet next to us. I need a bigger shaping room in a little I've been Belgium Stock Board. Put it on the website and that's actually proved to be nice guys. It's like of you sold aboard, and you didn't you certain. Also that's been cool so could I have a nice wall front where we can at least display the board's properly in and take good pictures and that way, geyser more informed and such try to work on the blog haven't blogging in a long time, but I used to super. Do it yeah? Well, now you too busy servant in shaping

without the boy. Well, listen! We ve been out for a while, then dumb and I want it. He began to appear much longer. I think our air conditioning I may have felt on his warm early eighties out long black sea, that comfortable, As you know, so it's Josh also affords dot. Com is, where is where they can find you get on Instagram. Urim thing John also affords on Facebook your jets, Josh also reports be out. You have twitter, I don't know early have enough time to keep up with those, three things. Little butter- and you know we were talking earlier- I'm hoping to get some Josh Hall Custom Tee shirts on the Jackal store and get them out there. So maybe we can hook that like that, would be cool. I'm sure people would be stoked to support an american

craftsmen yeah on the day to day, even if they live in Iowa, were there surf, but they work hard. Like you know, like good Americans do bottom, you guys got it yet causing thoughts. Dave we gotta talk archery, Oh yeah, you're right newest upset a Europe's Alfred Archery, oh geez, Louise yeah thanks this guy, so his brother was an oak. There isn't any kind of used to be, and I got a little bo when I was ten will compound bow and a treaty target. I go blast arrows into that thing in and then they got it talked a long time and through I guess it was listener to Joe Romans podcast and then, who else- and I had some other friends and well my fiance Tories, she's grown up, shooting, boughs and and both her sisters course her dad. So he's a gun Will you know my my Fred bomb on before

its archery earlier, and I was like wait. That's the one from from Jos Podcast- and I was like ok So he just made the introduction and went up there and Bob's surfer. I just like, while how cools this now and and I went up in an kind of stuff it a gig out online there's a lot in Falada errors on Dudley, puts out insane and psychotic He can outcome and I went up and Bob just needs set me up. Man, a man, shootin heroes, everyday sense, it s. No old, Daphne I handed after that range drive and bend to the one up by Balbo. Although apply its left right under not the cabriole bridge. Yeah me dry by every day, when even know it's there, the US would open hit that man. We share We fund in in some other troops plan will hopefully going as they say, get after it yeah I'll? Do it I'll? Be fine yeah, but that anything else

No, not really I don't enjoy this, I guess pretty, but now I did it go down. No greater here, your it's an honor Abbe on and I'm Tellin, you gonna. Let you guys people. The from from what you said and from experiences, and what else? like from your perspective, its awesome it's in this matter. Here, you here is the truth. No, I mean just just to see you know what you ve taken from your dad and how turn that into a business, and you found your way, no different, people are out there in there and their due, different things and in you know, I appreciate your server sooner. Pressure. You sure in Stoke Worldwide Man slide the glad I did

say, I'd I'd. I was real fortunate. Besides him and skip I've had a lot of good mentor life coach people, my life, so that's been a big big deal. I live. Have friends, don't have that now that we're getting too close to forty, you can see it known scientist shot out to those people in that a lot more water, health to particularly to get through it all, and here we are read on and I'll, tell you what for everyone, you can see him in just the great example- and you know it like talk about earlier. If you are in a position where you can reach down, and you can give somebody a hand if you can give someone some help, and you can say hey kid, come this way or hey kid. Go that way you can a huge impact, your huge impact on their life and yet no pointed in the right direction. The others it that's! That's gonna! Do bad people keep that inside him in all share it. I know that their experience over their skills, You got gotta shares yard you to listen!

That's my grandma use like I don't care! We disagree. Gotta, listen if somebody as they might have something that you don't you they put it away, didn't think of well, I can grow from that. Yes to your point, a whereas just said: hey if you're out there and Europe more senior position reached down and help people out and if you're one of the Young box out there, then like justice, open your ears and have a listen, because people got some good information for you and I can point in the right direction. So you don't have to learn the lessons of the hard way. Awesome Aref, actually come on guys think initiated. Thank you began DA will see in the water all right at this point are guess. Dave and Josh Hall have exceeded the building and often to talk to them and but it up there. You know talking about

sharing what you know we're with other people. And I think it's a good opportunity for you, ECHO Charles, to share with us What I know. Yes, what you know I I know this was did you do? I know what kind of you were gonna get sore. Ok, Woola. We won't dilly daily about that penal daily down? I'm not gonna, make the leap quite yet how this I'll try not to do? you start talking about Jujitsu all these things. It very dearly dally prom prone areas, scenario, something better. People started to do people already, India to people doing deeds for fifteen years who's, the guy. Yet origin. Why not? Is it made for Jujitsu is made in the USA, Oliver Bomb Bessys by far many

prince elections, could origin mean dot com? You got some news too far too, by the way Denham coming. It's not well well, by the time, whoever you are in a world. Listening to this could be, it could be out. Clear voice. I saw the pitcher on online so to me, where's your in my hair. It's ours too Samaritan before its on on me, my body habit. Is this learning what gives any body habitat misused it slightly but impractical and were anyway also they got t shirts and hoodies reactors rash yes for the no Gaed Jujitsu or you know, when you not doing you just when you resting unrest days, that a kind of cold, joggers sweatsuit when people ask, can I do work? and you too, on the same day, this is Please! Yes, yes, you can. I'll, tell you this. I think you need you to everyday

You can't do Jujitsu every day, because your physically impaired from doing it because the impact of the jujitsu itself yeah yeah not trained, did you correctly yeah? What hard is what you're going to argue using too much strength through using too much muscles. If you can't change it to every day, you're going too hard I'm not saying you might not be sore. Could you probably will be you maybe If I do a bunch of whores grounds the next day, I can feel it right, but I'm not a sore like I can't work out, I'm sore like. Oh I'm definitely train our desks. A good way. Your training, to the point so hard so psycho that you can't train that means you're going to argue usin too much strength, so you should relax. Yes, I agree well unless Your train with you, which you, since you can never train with you

Tell me you don't know this, but speak from experience. Train I've been trying hard in really along time, train with you, and you know what I wouldn't even say. We were really going heart I have gone gone yea at all. Well, whatever I sat there, there were times where I sense this sense of urgency feet empty anyway, my neck, her Mccord real bad but right up until it the threshold of not being able to like work out but it is not only the he was developing soreness it was or was it hurt? I was injured of heard and is just from resisting chokes resisting the jokes is exactly what it was and I knew where it trying to resist the Turks Sorry, sir, none the less

because I was so eager driven statement- I was I was not an online use- is as little eagle creeping around me. I want you to know that I chose to you. You know that I should like to know your good job here. Your usual uses when I showed some hard result, title of good spread anyway. Nonetheless, yes, work out, and did you did? I agree with that. Actually, pissing, no people training philosophies differ, they differ, like some people, their train philosophy. Hey you get the most out of your trainers point you know, but these are typically and I tried to Kennedy, compartmentalize or kind of break it down to myself what right, where, in my opinion, and there's just from my my personal view, like I shouldn't but yeah I shouldn't be like per sore or and be like unhappy danger to you know I shouldn't be

or from Jujitsu from Digital, yet Do you know when you check steel you get sore to the point we like. Oh my god, I imagine, if you do chest day, is that you're not gonna be fired up to do justice to the next day. Correct. So that's that's! Ok, we are different, but a hard chest day is not going in fear with your Jiu Jitsu day. Never there, our time But let's say I've done much I will end on a lot of squatting and then I go squaws here my son, those my legs I'll, get the dorms cure and it won't. It won't stop my digital train. However, It is a noticeable factor that I have to contend with a view to that does happen here, but the opposite should happen which is I trained jujitsu,

and now I feel like. I can't work out because I'm so sore in this particular body part if you can, get your elbow straighten out little extra? Yes, you can't as editor fear. Sometimes, yes, it does yeah and those it s like an anomaly. That's not, and not a plan to part of training get your elbow streamed out in kind of slightly beyond. Grow injury situation or an only if that's the plan. So if you're, like eight I'm going to train Jiu Jitsu Monday, no Jiu, Jitsu Tuesday, I'm going to lift Tuesday instead, like some people have that plant. You know where you not going to do today. Scenario then scenario: Lydia, don't train, don't drink twisted or twice in a row I don't agree near now. I dig it, but you should never be and what I was thinking of you shouldn't. It should never be like this hard, like grind of point, where you're unhappy

like known, nor should be my hearty tree, never regularly. Yes, you should. You should be like you know what I don't feel like doing some do it anyway, right yeah says. If I yes eleven, with that. Every time you feel like a baby and want to train today doesn't mean you to get to not train right, no alternative, as was definitely- and you did it because in Jujitsu, if you're every time you don't necessarily feel a hundred percent like training then not a train when you should be doing the most the time you're gonna get, something out of it. If you maybe instead of doing twelve so minute rounds? You say you know what I'm gonna do some movement on get four rounds in maybe that instead Did you feel and could you do have to one thing I am aware of if you're, tired, your percentage of getting injured goes up. If you dont want to be in there. You're percentage of getting injured goes up because Europe being lazy and weaken those IP situations you you get hurt, it read,

paying attention yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking that whole being were where Europe can, when Brooklyn encircles, with the thing we're like you should never like be unhappy or not want to train. You know scenario, but I had it in and I kind of like weep, but there are those time towards like that's kind of parted. You do too that, like the adversities element here, part of it yes and but here's the thing one, you train that adversely element year like you, I know you want I do that. It's like in it's like invited adversity, kind of thing, just like how you just said, or is it okay, if you're honest or whatever situation, and you want to go tan. Twelve rounds get some movement in Gopher runs bomb. You just went to that violence. Terry! You no place in tee in your Jujitsu Susie. Oh it's you unless then on top of that it depends on who you are, I wouldn't even all winter in place. If you like a leg, here, the different scenario that, if your competitor-

you like this is MIKE. My goal is to be a competitor. Now that's a whole different scenario where, especially, if you have a coach in trading partners and all the other stuff, all there's gonna be days, were you hate it Usual literally, and do get somebody you literally would choose to not me they're literally I'm not gonna, be here today, but then you have these external elements, including your goal. Coaches, training partners, like all these things, who have the same goals or whatever so this kind of like a bigger two there, so you have to endure that like hey, I dont want to be here. I'm gonna, like Jujitsu, hear her ear that before now, I don't even like Jujitsu, but why am I doing no occasional joke about it, but I dont actually feel what else competing in a head like a competition like go like out fuel at some time to tackle this, don't like why one may this year, like loop, in our different scenarios and unless back to the sea

speaking. Scenarios are that there are no Dilly Dally scenario. Well, you know with ours. Now we get off engine like thirteen minutes. Nonetheless, back the gig orgy get origin rash guards. That's why you do not question no question also supplements. So when you are sore see, you'll have to beat that sore less you'd, be less sorry s. I noticed first George ever, do it wherefore and cruel both this. That does, with the double the double whammy. So you have to be better discipline. You can take that? Maybe if you're not feel, I will vouch for this on a day where you're like? Well, I don't know, maybe I'll only do three rounds when we can make myself go in there by the way, I'm going to drink three scoops to discipline. Before I go, how many rounds do you end up doing

and so I will vouch for that. That is a factual thing that will happen. You don't feel like it. I will mix up how you want to feel like going gone, but I'm just gonna go. I have to confess the discipline. So then, I mixed up three scoops discipline twenty minutes before I leave my house risk, I'm drink it on the way can a drink it get here and all of a sudden I get on the mat Turks second round kicks in life another not about yet another year, Celt, coincidentally, the other day when we, we have a very long time had been out there. We train that was The plan the plan was not to train users to record for me anyway. It's not like I planned not to train? I didn't plan trails, gonna record it go home. That's it! That's the routine this scenario, but I did tat

strangely enough to scoop to disregard for game it and I'm not joking. I told many dead at all. Couldn't resist knows I Gardena train or what yeah, we're fitness all like me, you know that the post recording plans Still there you and you like it, strain. It's like noon at that time. Poor here you know, there's the buzz. You know them because of training their hair, those going on the two scoops You know the buzzer that is going and you like illustrate I opening close to train by the way you want to do a good answers by a towel rush shower after bought one bar George. I went to bite shorts, but there was no anonymous says for sale and I just use the shirt that I recorded wives, kennedys shorts,

they did actually cause. I went and saw nor Oliver was there, whose is smaller. Guided me so magazine shorts. Smallest only ones available, I wore his shorts and you know he's one of these trendy guys other kind of shorter shorts and striped. Maybe like half a says, small. Whatever boom, whatever nor has really done intimidated by your shorts and nets, the whole being anyway. The point is, when you take this to scoop the discipline. Yes, it does put you into those. Either more rounds or just rounds when you didn't even plan on doing around. So I can my scenario there's also we just made disappointed, go it's a it's a go pill. It's got discipline, Sometimes you don't have time to drink the entire discipline. You have done an mix, it get hello expedient hit

the girl little hitter on the girl. I think it is perhaps some of the discipline go pills. Look lonely, Tropic action, little butter caffeine. Did you get that get that little bit go? Did you they're gone yet so that that that's out now too and then after you do did you jitsu, then? What were you gonna recovery around bookmark mocked you're right on it. Additional protein along with you, protein. You eat with your food, exactly right the stake and boom. We gotta go can be used as or should be used as a dessert and discuss it. It can be used to measure Can these analyses my whole thing on another, but the thing is what Europe failing, He remembers. It can also be used to replace whenever you were going to eat rather, like a miracle yeah breakfast Morgan dinner! When I have what I have lunch and I have launched a mock and what I'm only satiated, I'm full, and I got it

not like the happy palates you, you know I tasted something good yeah. Well, ok, all oh good, ending agree. I don't like the word satiated, you not brazilian, It means what you think I arrogant like. Why don't you know? I mean what does it mean that you don't like the word associate? It sounds kind of like weird yeah, as you know, is their arms. I will agree with you. Kind of aid is aid for recommended dessert. That's my recommendation back there. It is anyway monk. That's it how many what flavors now or Euro is coming out of the new flavour. I think the darkness actually darkness doctrine is dark chocolate, the good cause you can penetrate extra also warrior kid marks, because your kid getting fed garbage. That's trying there The world is trying to make your kid week out of shape and you

you're going to be strong and powerful, so you give them mark, what do you give em for dessert mark? Would you give em? That's it you give him there. One ice cream anymore. They know your kid knows, ice cream makes a week. They know that and if they don't know that they showed you should tell him. So let them know that warrior kid mark, it tastes delicious, and yet it's good for you. You should get some of that. The sole hollowing this recently was past or came or whatever we just finish. Hallowing rightly so. I contemplated just giving mark out. Instead, it candy cups and all the stuff, and then I don't really have any Dave Burke. We were. We were talking and he says my for next year. Is that you have Mark kid where you could mark in packets that we can you are is just and there's the only that's the only way it should be. Actually them

yeah, that's the only way it should mean. Are you like little kid you beyond the Moultrie everywhere? I agree you, I think that in others like right now, you can call upon the new, as you can see like obesity in America. If everyone just get on the more train will just be Ike America's now Yoke of America gardener yoked what happened there, tracing it back to a strange part, cast a top down a age, a formula that they called Mark and the children. They start drink it and now the church of America yoked the propaganda, did it actually good, because you say like oh yeah, that the industry is making you the weak or whatever he's trying to make your kids we, yes, but here's thing that is true: here's what they do they advertise they make little. Or to the advertising to eat this sugar, but yeah it's ino as as an informed or am I was I informed adult in you gonna give you didn't, can sit back and watch the can

I shall look ass. You did there. I wonder why they chose that commercial to market their thing you lot on their brothers question marks everywhere these these commercials, not in any way. Yet when you get a like sneakers bar, bread snickers satisfies? Do you like it? Basically, hey. If your hungry eat this knickers split, it might as well just be good for you because it has peanuts in it. I brothers, like this chocolate come on. You know like these things are not good for you but anyway. So like saying this ruling, godaddy satisfying this? Is this is what you vote when you're hungry their straight up making you it straight up. That's like you it's hard to our you even that that's their here's the deal that we can and we can't Just blame. You blame the food right. You can't not allowed nothing you have to blame yourself now

at a certain age. Your kids are eating what you put in the fridge. If you put weakness in the fridge they're going to eat weakness, if you put strength in the fridge they're going to get strong people smoke in the fridge, the act of children's rights is pretty obvious. In my opinion, also stand the path while representing get a shirt at jocose Store Douglas turn outcome? That's where it is, so we can share this link was freedom, the shirt, the Jackal all he's, whereas every single day of his life is like victory, Mme and Fitness Black one, but political from on there, in my opinion, represent the path. If you like, then get some of the cities on? There is well rash guards more rash carts for you to or anything or Sir my life back in May the comment on it: Stu, Graham on the origin, Instagram feed, sure

but a picture of people, a picture of me peat and be little in New York, city and brave, made some common, but my truckers have knew something about like you know the nine these called and wants. There happened back, eggs. He didn't even realise how this completely out of touch. In my mind, this wasn't even a topic. Like my my hat with something from the nineties, that wasn't even that Never never crossed my mind. Well it s strange, technically leaf. Babby is not correct if he was doing but I think he might have been doing. I didn't see the common side, nor did it a cliff robotic. Yet so I don't know currently, but this my guess he was referencing. The fact that Trucker hats

trucker hats and then they kind up were went out. They were really a style and then you know their whole retro phenomenon. Word like us and brought him back. Style emerges from some unifying so one distant past. You sure so one the trucker hat came back as a style. It was not in the nineties. If I'm not mistaken, it was like after two thousand, Ok, I'm pretty sure I don't open I only were tractors. Yes, he won't I've. I must say I think I had some flax fits along the way, but well good movie, both of those scenarios is. We have trucker hats on Jackal stored outcome, an flex fit represent discipline equals freedom on your head in whatever way you want retro nineties, eightys to thousands Eighteen whenever you like, however, you like you, knew the deaf quartet. Yes, you can.

That's what he was talking about: yeah, yeah cuz! I was aware that which apparently is now a 90s hat? No, you know what I think and I'm going to ask him to confirm, but I think he was just mad you had the deaf greater. He did it trying to find a friend away to be busy lashing out by his own terminology or, with his own terminology, used drinking the hatred to leave Bab busted drinking Adrian. Yes, I'm cool stuff on there again Jackal store the commission want to represent on the path also, so cried. The biogas examined already on Itunes and Stygian Gould play in all these podcast places where we listen, but guess what subscribe? If you have not? also on Youtube too. Where were you to channel We do that's where the videos are posted. You can see Dave Hall, you can Josh all you can see what everyone looks like you can see. What echo Charles looks like you get a comment:

about the size of echo. Charles is arms and about how ECHO Charles does not look like his voice. The coup at least one person on every one of our videos. That says echoes. Look! I think the only reason that echo post these videos so that he can read through all those comments and see someone's, as echo, looks, ensure marked, maybe look that anyway guilty also worried. But guess don't forget? Yes, we're your kid. The costs that is also out there and should have some more those rolling out. But your kid listen to warrior cat bark at the end. If you need to ask question for Uncle Jake, you can do it through my social media and I will pass those questions on to Uncle Jake himself and get the answers. We also the warrior. Kids soap from Irish Oaks ranch dot com, to a warrior. Kid is called worry kid sober

so these are called him shock or soap. Burma, where you kidney media, from a warrior kidney. Maybe I'm just going at warrior. Cadets called warrior, could soap well, it's kind of is out there getting after three hundred percent American made in a whole new level so from the getting Irish Oaks ranch dot com or Psychological warfare? That's the little out but with tracks where I will tell you why you should or should not carry out something that you know you should or should not carry out and we are working on. The next cycle warfare album and will let you know when it is out, so you can get some of that. And if you have suggestions recommendations You want to know how you should do something sure or not do something every free.

Refrain B. I let let me know and will see if it makes the cut me take since as a lot of among them. As some people like hey, can you can you do a track about you not putting croutons in yours out specific on hazards that specific, even less you little broader than you think, ready route on states girl, we known inaugurate for us, but you like have you were at like not if you could answer, no big deal is a little bit accoutrements women, you if you were to assemble your croutons enough on the play, you probably a slice of bread there. That's true her there and you realize I'm, I'm I'm off the path at even admitted to myself to myself a lie. Or what do I look? menu got to go, but that's like one of those specific ones I catch up to how much sugar is in ketchup a lot of people that would catch up even when you, when you go through. You know that. Replace Grass FED? Hopefully an who were like hey. Do you want the meal I needed

the logical warfare for that no think about it. No meal, slash no up size, no upset the area because, unlike you, want supervision, that year, while the supersize only comes with the meal. So can you can't supersize a burger unless he added Nightingale PAMELA Hedgerows, Gimme, three bodies on that thing, but there's nothing wrong with that. I'll. Do that too? like, if I didn't, if I'm fasting or didn't eat, though much whatever, and then I get it like a hard work of how old do that or how much better it is. Fruitcake taste after you, fasted for twenty four hours, forty eight hours and seventy two hours of the twenty five to thirty five percent, how much better does it feel to eat when you know that you ve just earned it it very well for significant fifty per cent just just to get that feeling it's worth fasting

just a few, how good it feels to be like, I told you this iron in forty eight hours a minute just get this burg alright, now here and There- and I recommend you break the fast with the Berger Cosette. Might I be smart, specially Robin fries with it? No fright, that's the thing. You don't breadth, weird that I've not eaten frozen. I like fries, oh, really, forensically hold the line on the prize. I have been for the past. One euro today, this had some rise: and while some some of us are on the path from Mozart, is all good. Brilliant men have your price, but if, you're having weakness is or moments a weakness for fries, that's another site, and that alone remained. Maybe there should be an album failure in the same category as on soon saint? Oh, nothing, no and the senior something that's a specified. I dont know if there's any, With croutons like I know, but I'm having a salad, there's a whole rationalization that takes place there fry

there's no rationalization does I'm straight up eating fries right now, you're right, you're, right or wrong, except for they taste good, really good I respect the fact that you don't eat fries for one year good job. If you want in mountain deuce. Coax I'd have more. By about you know, first things or big steps rate one step at a time I think PETE Roberts. He he's like. He's an enabler he's a food enabler offer. Yeah yeah cannot be repeated he'd, just like you know, get off its after a number of eminent like well, you know what he's the one they had, these keys, the one that is I heard the whole cake scenario that went down one thousand errors and work with the minutes like we are like not eating cake does not have

as a whole thing points promoting cake, so he orders like a son. I know you're does this! This increase. Zeb milkshake that had whipped cream quote or the table right. For there was a war, have a little back a little bit. Maxine origin Kate everywhere ICE cream. I way that's good Robert enabler yeah so now cause that probably like caught this ongoing. Listen. What do you know? I did and it's like all you know it's a gorgeous here, haven't seen Peter Talk and Business blah blah blah Here's a shake, and this is what pissed me off, because you get done with the shake like we got this shake and he was kind of like a table. You get done with it and I said no kidding would rather have drink. A milk then that thing, because not because it if we, because the monk actually tastes better than that thing, that's too

much man was less than we had like a regular like milkshake, upright prior mother, Ok, so I am a regular milkshake Anna hungry to their cause, like all these groups, and it was from Jack in the box oil. Could you shake, and while I thought to myself exactly without that's my point, though drinks on the first like two three, four five six hits you like off his gucci and then you like Well, I don't wasted. You know so you can put yourself there and then finishing like men, I camps and is like it's not. You know that what he called diminishing return. You know, after about half way down like emulating feel good but try to drink a mock, and I think the big one to double sometimes triple scoop in the big thirty out there

but you get half way you're like more. You just want more his. How do the whole thing is get yet so even the experience of it going down is better than a judge. Sugary scenario, sincere, someone color with also what failed to mention last time. Maybe ten before is one we'd by that when we get the books that we cover on the spot, Catherine and when we sometimes have the privilege having the actual in this room with us, I listed among the website, chuckle podcast, dotcom book section. Actually you did say that actual Esther but you're a goddamn listed right there bomb. So you don't have to go. Searching. Try to remember here episode was this book or what book was on? That episode got its listed right. Therefore, quick right through their ticket Amazon. One day you got it got it that's the way it works. Also to very we work up. You need some rings.

If you'll have rings for your home, Jim, not people getting their home Jim now my seat on line there, my neighbour we went to retrieve so I see his garages open gallo scenarios just like you, you know people convert their whole garage, which I think is a bold, get good. It's a good move in California to real easy to do that and other The country. You need that garage for vehicles in California not happen yeah. So I mean in that's really that's kind to the point where it's it's gonna, like that's a week, A specific decision the see someone made there like what's more important, housing my vehicles, where the family vehicles, by the way or creed Jim in California. What I'm saying is in California. That's not a big sacrifice. None this figure in Iowa! That's a big sacrifice with that that dude converts is Jim you're gonna go,

two german islands like, I guess what in February you're gonna be sitting in a freezing car. That's negative twenty degrees for at least eighteen minutes every morning they all, but you know what I'm gonna get my money. I work exactly right, so When you getting your rings, get him from on it. There the best shrinks that I've seen a grin I don't have that much rings experience. But the ones I gotta do get chemicals on their to me, the artistic ones are the best, that's my opinion in this job opinion to know it's actually are debatable ever debatable. I do have an opinion that you should, if you need to drink something, other than mark or even you dont need mark. At that time you can drink Java, Whitey Jacket,

t even get it in Cannes from Amazon Primes, you have to pay shipping or you can get the tea bags and they tastes delicious and more important most important. It guarantees it thousand, Dad left so sore. Do that also have some books go away? The warrior kid and Marks mission approve everybody getting those and giving them two kids. I get off. Back from around the world, kids, getting on the path If you read this book and you will say yourself, I guarantee you said yourself, I wish I had this book when I was a kid. Is ever single person that further progress. I wish I had this book when I was a kid you should just have a little pre. Conceived idea. That when you get on with it you're gonna say I wish I had spoken, also get so what you can do like. We just talk.

With Dave Hall and Joshua. What you can do you wanna help out a kid go on Amazon, Goody local bookseller, and get that book and give it to get bring into the classroom. What can help kids out and if you help kids out a lot. Speaking of giving If you want to give the gift of discipline to some that you know, given the discipline equals field manual, I wrote it, but you know what I wrote it and I read it. Why? Because I need to say about myself if I had had the distant because Meet freedom feel meanwhile, sitting next to me, If it was me, P Roberts and the display. Field, freedom feel manual. I might not have gotten some of that shake right there that he put in front of me. I've been like. No that's a lie that there that you just broader use brought a glass of lies to get able. Will that's good cause? You didn't know people like tat. We should unknown known because remember when we're ordinary at midnight yeah

He knows even us, like this back leviathan, all the stuff in the so we should have known, but I think you're gonna crept up, Would you like, if you wouldn't known like going to the scenario, be like I'm on the look out for your dad and be you know Peter could still sick athlete. You know ravine Legatee played football and begging. Basketball and set all kinds of let records and lacrosse three, just like an athletic guy, and he probably you know was in high school, just eating everything inside cause he's big trying to be yoke sieges, eating everything and now is whatever thirty, whatever years old and he's just got menu in his hand like a criminal year. Good times was so. If you're hanging around P Roberts or someone else, that's in a neighbour that

you feel like doing that's gonna bring you down. Does the sorrow. The path of sorrow was the swamps, slippery slope all day. Others others want to send the swamps sadness, the slippery slope of of the horror, if you're around that person, if you got the desk this freedom feel men can like deflect weakness. Will it refer requires us out their naked, naked and afraid blast just did ordered up Sundays in terra, so I just meant to two days with PETE. No nowadays, with PETE, no three nights with PETE. I should say three was a two anyways night. There's did a dessert scenario next time I've bring with it the field manual of me just to deflect actually the more these will be too

that's what I'm going to work as he's. It's not like you, some guy attache, no capability anyway. He pleases me like brown renewal in genuine reflect the smiles and we're have time and everything's fine unease. I do know. What would you do you want dessert? No one asked me that bureaucracy, only personal because you are you gonna get some deserve. No one asks me that people say Shock or you want to see the dessert many little ask me that yeah Roberts is like hey hey wait, or can we get the Germany over here for this guy right here, the mainly, so you don't have any training dealing with that kind of sinners right. You don't need psychological warfare. I'm gonna make up an album for people. Robert De La really, an AIDS where you get it from his mom is cooking Barack Obama, his wife, She puts candy out in front of him. She gets after it

he'll tell me you send me a picture of like a bucketful of a snickers, maybe like a ham on the path right now. This is what my wife goes to me. You know a whole a whole hole, situation of various watch offers that Israel's freedom feel manual. That is gonna help you in those situations and if you need the audio tracks, it's not on audible dot com, whatever its on it. On Amazon music. I dunes, Google play that's that extreme ownership. That's the book about leadership. I row with my brother lay fab, and that is the lessons learned in combat and how you can utilise those same principles for combat leadership. You can use them in Europe, This end in your life and in the follow up to that book is called the dichotomy of leadership. It will teach you the

the hardest part of leadership, which is learning how to balance between the dichotomy that appalling you in opposite directions. Biggest problem. We see we work and leaders all the time and this is the biggest on that. We see with leaders; they don't know how to balance that I economy leadership. So if you are a leader and you things aren't going the way you want them to go. Likely reason that happening is because you're out of balance, if you want to learn that balance, that will make you a much more effective leader. You want to find an ineffective leader. You go talk to you later. You find one. That's that's in balance, that's too far in one direction, the other derails them derails the team. You want to get back on track Yet the dichotomy leadership also Mikey and the dragons. Here's the deal, speaking of extreme ownership. Guess guess what I didn't do I didn't order enough books.

I didn't order enough books, I will meet. Let me let me go out and expand on that. I didn't order enough books of making the dragons at all. I didn't like it at all. As you pointed out last time, oh, I used to give my publisher a hassle and say they didn't get it is who could serve? Guess what guess? Who else didn't get it apparently well meet you well, then again, look I don't blame me. If we just found out, It's not that easy to predict. Actually. I will not make this mistake again: okay, so there it is. What, You did, I say: well it's because the printer slower. Well, we're not sure. I know you know what my fault, here's, what I'm doing we're running we're doing I've done of them, initiated to more runs more printing? and your books, this is good news. The good news is well the bad news. Is it and to take a little bit of time and

depending on when you ordered despair, might be a hesitation good news is: these are still I'm running the exact number one in the first deafness this is it we're just run in first, a dish I gonna run, for a while, so if you still want that first dish order now and let me tell you what order now order now why? Because, if every when orders right now and it's a bigger number than what I predicted, which it could possibly be. I need to know that as soon as possible. So you want to get the book making the dragons please ordered asap and we're gonna goal is that everybody has it as soon as possible I want to get it everyone by Christmas cause. I know everyone wants to get this book for their kids for Christmas. Yes, book review ECHO Charles Excellent, yes, who mentioned this before. That's like ok, it's a good and ensure get over our fears, which is goods real effective by the way of that

let it of all meaning that the theme of the book making the dragons is how to overcome. Your fiercer then get a faint, but I'll. Tell you this. That book is a fun book like fire, it's like, because their rhymes and like all this stuff wherein anal part of this is me cause. Ok, so Reading, where the warrior kid Marks mission, the second tomorrow, sick them are only read it before. You know the words I stood giddy into it turn on the Thea, tricks with the kids rate. They like that whatever so you either making the dragons one. Now you got some rhymes in there and it's like eat with marks mission are medium like a chapter, maybe two chapters and night that's kind of its a routine before bet this, when you read the whole thing up soon, it up, but I didn't want you to stop anyway, because, like one, you turn on the theatrical with the rhyming and stuff outstanding fun superfluous. To do like is is far activity like with your kids reading to them in a there. Something added there with remains the gene.

Both Zack who drew the art and he didn't, a copy, yet when I was in New York S arm, I brought a copy for him and he's got a good What I don't want, the term for this laugh is, but he's got this laugh that he does almost like us, victory laugh. I don't even know. If that's the thing, you don't like a laugh, where he's so happy that he can't they contain it. So I give the book. Still the plastic. These books are enemies Julie, wrapped in plastic, shrink rap. So I give to whom he like slowly opens up. Still, you see through the shrink wrapped, but he's doing this now. This train imitative isa, and then he's going to each individual page cause. The cholera is beautiful. He said that said that years ago, he said five years ago, it would be possible to do what we did in terms of matching the color of that

he originally drew the cause the actual use, getting it to match perfectly with the book, he said that is not possible. Five, ago. What was not hopefully we did it that fast because we did it- it came out exactly the colored supposed to be normally. If it's five years ago, you had to print one to go like okay, make this bring more indigo in or whatever I need more than friends in or whatever, and- and we have to do any, that it's been printed- oh guess what it's completely curry and the drawings are beautiful, their amazing, in fact, what we are going to do not talk to John about this, some of those pictures are so gorgeous. We're gonna make posters that have these images on them make sense. And that that that way, kids can put him in the room and that picture of the prince walking into the forest

with that I mean come on, doesn't want that. That is just say everything he's going to face the darkness he's confident he's moving forward He knows you scared, but he still going forward. You put that picture up on your kids war, up on your wall, documents. I need is that images that image right there that needs to be big and we need to get it out their self, if you want making the dragons, then please order now so that I now so that I can get it to you as quickly as possible, and I apologise that is gonna take longer that is I fought for under estimating how fired up while would be in order in that book. I am guys, and what I'm doing acted, is ordering enough to collect the tea when the time came out. We in order And so I order more than that, I wasn't enough, and I said to Emily

I said we need to order enough t that we never run out again. We have run out again, I say in never never, but but at least in a really good spot, so same thing marking the dragons. If you wanted ordered echelon front. That is my leadership. Consultancy what we do with that is we solve problems through leadership? That's what we do. Whatever problem you haven't with your team or your organization, it's a leadership problem. So it's me it's like Bob and its JP denounced Dave Burke, Flint, Cochrane, MIKE's rally and MIKE by Emma gotta echelon, front dot com for details? masters in two thousand nineteen. They are in one's commune Chicago ones, can be in Denver. It's gotta be spring in Chicago can be fallen, Denver every other muster. Has sold out. I have Friends, friends contact me and say: hey

just figured out what here come the muster. You know I just got for people and, as you know, let me know when I should arrive and unlike it's all about her yeah and I got no like you can't come there's. There's it's done, you there's no more place to go when you cannot come and so if you're saying that the people you know that's problematic so that means they sell out This is gonna, sell out, And so and I we haven't locked down the dates yet, but extreme ownership dot com is what you can look and get it F over watch if you're a business, and you need experienced, train and leaders inside your organization that your stand. The principles of extreme ownership and combat leadership, if your bid like that. Go to F over watchdog come we have are peers. People were connected to

from special operations that are from combat aviation and we are bring them into the civilian sector to help companies and businesses lead and when and if you want to keep discussing and talking about all these things with us, we are available on on the inner webs on Twitter on Instagram hand on national. First of all, Dave Hall he's off the grid, he's not you're not going to with him on social media cause he's in Hawaii cruising super hard. God bless him Josh, although Josh all Josh. Also, boards on Instagram Josh, all surfboards on Facebook check out when he post beautiful pictures of his board can see what he's doing in the world travelling surfing. Shaping. Echo is act at ECHO, Charles, and I am at Jacko willing, and thanks once again to Dave all

for his service to the country and for coming the part cast sharing his stories and his lessons from war and from life and to Josh. Also thank to him for common on thanks for spreading that. For Spain that Aloha, love on that Stoke, wherever wherever he goes, and keeping the roots of surfing planted. Deep, that's awesome and its much restated it's great to see an american company like yours, continue to grow and to the police to military too, law enforcement, firefighters, paramedics, E M, tease, correctional officers, border patrol all you all you all you first responders, all EU military personnel thanks for protecting our way of life here and abroad, thanks for protecting us and our Billy to do this podcast to do get you to go out.

Surf and live our lives. Thank you all for your service and sacrifice. And to everyone else. That is listening, no matter what it is that you choose to do the matter. What that thing is. Whether you're gonna go into the military, whether you going start a business, whether gonna work for some one. No, what you gonna, do, put everything that you ve got into it. Do it to the best, your ability, whether you're, assaulting a building on the battlefield or whether your shaping a board in the shed whatever it is. You decide to do poor your soul. Pour your soul in and get after it and until next time this is ECHO and Jacko out.