Hello, girls, how's, everybody, everybody. I hope you're awesome. This episode it today is Wednesday December 16th, this Friday night, I'm going to be at the Bob Carr Theater in Orlando FL, with the great Ian Edwards, so almost sold out. So don't sleep next Wednesday. We got another icehouse show this time with Arisha fear and Duncan Trussell, almost a preview of what, but on New year's Eve, if Joe is in town, maybe will try to get him to do it too, but he will be doing the podcast on a twenty four wow. He excited about that. Then. The Wiltern Theatre course December 31st, which is New year's Eve Tabernacle in Atlanta on the 15th that sold out there's still some tickets available for the Tampa Theatre on the sick 18th of January, then the in theater in New York, almost sold out as well. That's the 29th,

hollow. Caveman coffee company would drinking that getting zapped out of our heads Caveman, coffee, SCO, dot com, that's caveman, coffee, co, dot, com and sponsors, Ziprecruiter, if you're, hiring and you're not sure where to find the best candidates, it's kind of a pain, the ass as a business owner, I guess I'm kind of a business owner. I could tell you that company is only as good as the Pelia higher. That's. Why that's why this company, so good 'cause Jamie, is a mother fucker. Are you not Jamie? I will vouch for him. He is a mother fucker. I can also tell you that posting your job online in one place- it's just not good enough, it's too hard to if you, if you want try to find quality candidates, you want to post him to all these different job sites in Julie is going to eat up a lot of your resources, but when you zip recruiter you can post to one hundred plus job sites with one single click and instantly be matched with candidates,

from over six million resumes just post once and we in twenty four hours watched your candidates, roll into zip recruiters, easy to use interface. Ziprecruiter has been used by over four hundred thousand businesses, and you can try it right now for free getting the right. People for your company is very important, obviously, and Zipper he's going to hook it up, use, zip recruiter, go try. It today go to ziprecruiter dot com, Slash Rogan, and you can try it for free that zip, recruiter, dot com, Slash Rogan, to try it for free, zip, recruiter, dot com forward, slash. Rogan uh. I'm never going to sing that song again. What else do have left here. Last but not least, is National Academy sports medicine right thing: that's it the last one? Ting Ting, which is

official cell phone provider of the verbal root Bruges, Ting is a cell phone provider that they do is they use the sprint and the t mobile backbone. Those are the two uh different backbones. They, the utilize sprint being the CDMA version. An team will being Csm. Gsm Gsm Cdma, GSM Gsm is the difference being is like GSM apparently is more used globally and more. Evolent internationally, but CDMA is like Verizon and Sprint, and apparently that works better inside of buildings and shit. Like that point being what team does They buy time on those networks, and then they sell it to you. They rent it to you at a very reasonable rate, with

very reasonable operating procedures. I guess would be the way to say it. What they do is they have no contracts right off the bat, no early termination fees, no hidden, bundles ride along charges or any bullshit, and you pay for what you use. That's it you don't pay for like a block like you get one hundred minutes a month. If you go over that you get overage fees, there's none of that stuff with Tang. You just pay for what you use and you'd be surprised at how much money you save Ninety something percent of people would save money with Tang. It's it's really kind of crazy, and if you go to the Rogan DOT, Ting dot com website, you can try and find out by clicking on the what would you say, but my my bill is very rarely more than thirty bucks.

And we use it for this podcast. When people call up this podcast, they want to arrange, dates and stuff. Like that these the tank phone twenty three dollars is the average monthly bill per device for ten customers. That's all you need to know. That's fucking, crazy. Specially today's day were most of the time. Are you even calling people most people are texting. People right occasionally call people, I might call two people a day Most the time I'm texting or using my phone to check twitter or something like that, they also have the best phones like if you go and check the shop you'll find all the latest greatest Android phones and iphones. So go and check it out and go to Rogan dot com. You'll save twenty five dollars off of any device or service, that's Rogan, rogandotting dot com and they got all the groovy shit folks iphone success. They got the Samsung Galaxy X, Galaxy, Galaxy S,

x, all all the cool ones go check it out and that's it. We're also brought you by on a dot com, fewer o, n n. I t you'll find out what the is up with my all time: favorite company, partly because I'm a part of it bowl we've done was on it. Was we've created what we call a total human optimization company and what that means is we sell all the things that we find that can optimize you physically, like strength and conditioning equipment or supplements that we find to be clinically proven to be effective, like alpha brain, which is our own proprietary blend, is a proprietary blowing. Us was tell people what's in it, but we make all the ingredients available or you can obviously look and read all of the different supplements that we have, including out for brain all, have like a little town

a research tab and you can, when you click on the supplements, you can show all the different. We show all the different studies that are applicable to all the different ingredients. Alpha brain is one of the ones that we have done, not one but two double blind, placebo, controlled studies on because it's just such a controversial subject off a brain is about increasing your cognitive abilities. It's called a new trope Nutro pics are not new there's something had been along for a lot around for a long time. If you, Google, Nutro PICS, you can find out more about what all about, but there's some real science behind it and alpha rain is been shown to increase your memory to in your reaction time to things and increase called all that stuff explained at priestyourreactiontimetothingsandincreasewhatscalledyourpeakalphaorflowstateallthatstuffisexplainedonit, dot, com all of our supplements. Have a one hundred percent money back guarantee you don't have to return the product. You buy thirty pills, you have ninety days, just say this stuff sucks. You get your money back, we're not try

rip you off we're trying to sell you stuff that I use whether it's every podcast that I use. I use it for for every UFC broadcast. I use it for anything that I do or my brain is required to fire at its best. I find that when I use it I can form sentences better. I can recall things better: it's just it is fuel for your neurotransmitters and again all explained at on it. Dot com if you go there, you'll be inundated with all sorts of cool shit, fitness equipment, great supplements and foods and, of course, the Onnit Academy, which, if you click on that, is there's the website, which is filled with great diet, tips and workouts and motivation videos and there's also the Onnit Academy itself, which is a physical building, a gym in Austin TX, which is my favorite gym on earth. It's just an awesome spot filled with state of the art, equipment and fantast

construction and classes, so go check that out, if you're in Austin Texas and go to Oan it and use the code, Word Rogan and you will save ten percent off any and all supplements my today is my friend Molly Crabapple, and she is a fantastic artist, a really cool person, she's a journalist and just in awe. Around unique and interesting human being she's just filled with life. Experience This is at a really young age and she's written. This book called drawing blood, which I I always knew she was cool and a great artist, but God damn she can fucking write her ass off. This is a really good book that she's poured her being into, and it's really really well done, and I'm I'm into it right now and I'm enjoying the shit out of it and I was super psyched to have ron 'cause. I just think she's she's, just really unique in a and fascinating and introspective and intelligent, and I love talking to her. So without any further ado. Please welcome my friend

Ali Crabapple, the Joe Rogan experience. How are you good to see you June so happy to be here? Dude, I'm so happy you're here I've been reading your book and it's excellent you're, a really good writer. Thank you so much. I killed myself doing that that that is the heart thing I've ever done in my life. I want to take that two years wow and when I got the deal, I had this delusional idea that it would be. Like writing. Twenty five thousand word essays and this so wrong. This is so so so so much harder than anything I'd ever done. Why was it so harder than writing essays? When you write a says, you are doing like these kind of short things. It's limited even beginning a middle and an end, no character.

No dialogue. You know simple narrative. Where is this man like keeping a plot together over three hundred pages and then that plot is your life which by definition, has no plot right? All the time turns yeah. It was it hard to recall all the moments in your life and do them justice so hard. And also for for this book 'cause I work as a journalist. I a fact checked it as best I could, and nothing is more personally painful than fact checking thing that ends of various friendships and relationships and realizing what a jerk you were at the time I can only imagine yeah, I don't to do that. Like all the man, I had a whole victimization narrative and oh, that was quite quite wrong. I think they probably did too everybody does you know everybody. I mean it's really strange when you go back and talk to people that you haven't talked to for a long time Ok, what is your you know, know all judgments aside. Let's just give me your version,

and what happened and I'll tell you what I think happened like. Oh, my god. I don't know what the but the truth is anymore yeah. I have this one thing: where there is this one girl, she recalled something and called it one way and then, when she realized that it was actually two days later. Then she thought it was which made it look like. There is an article she had written, which had contradicted it. She kept insist, it hadn't happened and I was like man, here's your twitter, here's, my twitter, here's, the twitter of the two other people who are at brunch here. Email confirming it happened on this day and finally, she was like. I just give up but I don't remember it. Yeah, it's it's very strange when people are confronted by that fact two yeah. I have a friend that I'm no longer friends with that in, did something and then, when my other friend jumped in and said, that's not what happened at all that is. It was a psychedelic drug talk, trying to beat around the Bush like among regular radio or something, but he was insisting that he

got me on this psychedelic drug. The first time in my other friend was like. Oh no, that was mine was my drugs. I was there like what you talking about man and then he just sort of stopped talking to us. Just like any of the conference we kinda sucked off and then comes back later with a new subject. What people love to you know they love somehow and uh. Get glory from the past and somehow another it it's one of those things Never works, sort of, like name dropping name dropping has never. Dev are no one's ever said. I'm really good friends with Leonardo Dicaprio and so he's gone woah. Let me give you a movie now: fucking amazing No immediately people go all this guys, a name dropper, you know- or he just happens to say it and it happens to be true, there's a fine line, but everybody knows what the difference is like when you're a name dropper comes, he gets, you can smell it in a sentence. You know it's just like it comes off in the air

so this book is it's: it's fucking super intimate like you, you, like just just cut the skin away and opened stop and just the whole world can see your soul. You you be peeled it out. I tried meant that I mean I just wanted to do something honest. You know. Well, it's definitely that I guess I mean I don't know. I wasn't there. Obviously two years- is a long time to write. Something like did you. How many times do you have to go back over it? Then God like seven drafts and there's one hundred pages of cuts from the book too. That's another word file that I might mind someday for other essays, but it was like over and over, and you know because I had never written a book before I didn't I didn't realize you know how much extra you right, I feel like. I was like building a block of marble, basically out of words, and then I had to like cut away at the horrible ugly block of marble I had made and then finally something cool emerged

and they all say that all the great writers say that, like my friend, Steve Rinella always use this quote, you have to kill your babies yeah exactly that's what they say right. That's like the common writers conversation kill. You babies, but then you can keep your babies in another document and you can devote like one essay probaby where they make sense, it's a similar to stand up comedy in a lot of ways like one of the hardest things about comedy, isn't recognizing like a bit. Sometimes it's just too fat, there's too much stuff in it, and you have to figure out what to chop off, but you have like the emotional connections to these punch lines like, but I love this part. I love saying it. This is like my favorite part, but that favorite part doesn't necessarily enhance. The whole thing, so you have to kind of chip it away and then the whole thing will be better without it. But it's hard to do right, oh god, I mean the best piece I ever of advice. I ever got

we started, writing was my friend Lori who's. That really cool journalist said to me the worst articles of ever written or the ones where I try to say everything about a subject that makes sense. Now. Well, your style is really interesting too, because one of the things is really cool is like you've got a lot of ill, stration's that go along with these stories. Are these illustrations that you added in after the fact or they illustrations that you sort of drew while you were experiencing these things? A few of them I drew at the time like there are some old illustrations like from Turkey or from Paris that I did when I was teenager some stuff from occupy, but I would say like over one hundred of them. I did new for the book oh wow, so that's a lot of extra work on top of that as well. How many days would you do this every day or how will you find the time 'cause? I know you're so busy doing journalism you busy doing are like how do you find the time to do this? I

I was a really horrible person to be around for quite a few months. I have the coolest boyfriend in the world. Thank you, Fred, for putting up with me during Fred Fred Fred is Fred is awesome. I I had a few things. First, I had friends of the house. The country, and they let me stay there for a number of weeks and they didn't have it Jennette signal in a lot of it, so I didn't bring any of my and books that I like to read. So I just stuck. It was just me in this fucking thing and we're going to beat each other. I rented a lot of hope, all rooms. I had an editor. To beat down on me and was like you can't keep going off to other countries. You actually have to write this book that I contacted you for I at one point he was like. Are you fleeing to war zone? So you don't have to look at your book contract. Is that how it's going? I just think towards the I didn't do any but work on it. I just became this ha people like troll beast that didn't wash her

Aaron would growl at anyone who came near living entirely and coffee and just made it. That was how I did it. That is a good way to Do it right if you can get somewhere without the internet yeah I used to a lot on airplanes? I so look forward to airplane flights. I'd be like ok, I'm stuck in this seat. There's no internet access and then what the fuck did? The airlines do they put internet on the God, Damn planes I know and then you're like. Oh, I need to see what someone says about me on Twitter. Oh no, someone was wrong on Twitter. I must remedy that. I'm going to go on Amazon and buy a new pair of sneakers. You know exactly it's so easy to just get distracted nowadays, it's just the word. This is becoming more and more available, and if you're up in a cabin in the woods, No internet access, yeah, yeah, here's your stock, you're you're! Confronted with your own work to do you know it's so attractive that such an attractive idea, the off the cat, was sore Manta great to be off in a cabin in the woods by yourself.

Working on your great work, except whenever I'm actually there I want to like dig holes in my arms 'cause, I'm like where is the WI fi signal? There is a guy that I tweeted about today, there's an article that we did where This guy decided he wanted to live by himself in the I think it was the NW territories who's going to do it. For a solid year, but he made it six months and then he had a satellite phone. Is I come get me? I can't fucking do this anymore, but he was just going crazy like by himself for six months and it's a fascinating story. This is the guy right here. Norwegian adventurer spent six months alone, the NW territory Modernas, and it's really cool, because the guy is is very good at describing like what he felt and what it was like when he expected versus what it was really like. One of the things that he said that I thought was really interesting. He said we are not meant to be alone, and I kind of feel that way too. I feel like

You know people bro, Mana sizes, idea of being this hermit, that's off in the woods. You know the the the marked its out meditating in the forest by himself, but that is like it's like holding your breath. It's kind of cool for a little while, but you don't you don't want to do it very long. No man, I think I mean it, makes you go crazy, like being in solitary, It makes you go crazy. I recently did a really big invest your piece of unsung long term, solitary prisoners, and these guys like were released, guys they were he. You know really strong as, in my opinion, like one of them. I I consider really a genius but he'd, been in solitary for fourteen years man fourteen years and who is this. His name is Andre Jacobs. He, I was part of this group whistle blowers called the Dallas six that

Basically, they were giving information about guards, doing, beating people up and being racist in this prison and PA and they're all in Solitarian the guards palliated and then, when one of the other guys Carrington sued the da for not protecting him from the guards the da turned around and charged with rioting, and it got really into the case 'cause just like, seem semantically interesting. How do you write if you're in Sala Terry? I consider writing a group activity like someone's riding in Sala Terry? You could just leave him there get tired, eventually and then the right would be over. You know that's whole areas, they call it rioting So I added an investigative piece and eventually I got like video and stuff but bullshit, and I really hope their trial goes well in February. But, as part of it, you know, I spent a lot of time talking to two of the guys, and I mean you suffer real mental from from doing that and like no one, even like the smartest, toughest best person who has like

a really loving mom that is really devoted to giving them. You know all the books and all the support, even that person will suffer like real real trauma, or not yeah. I've always wondered like when Bradley Manning was arrested and then later became Chelsea Manning and spent. How many years was he? She, you know whenever the transition makes sense, how many years was be in Sala. Terry, like like it was quite a long time in three years. I think I'm naked yeah naked in cold conditions like they literally tortured her like they tortured her. Like what they decided when, when you say and when is him when she decide to transition when she was in there right. She liked once the transition right after her trial, but she I mean, if you look at her child Adrian Lamo one line where she says that she's afraid of is being known to the world as a boy. So I think

I think she decided it herself along a long time ago, but she was arrested yeah before she was arrested, but that she just didn't publicly announce a for a long time. That is a crazy that the worst thing is to be known as a boy yeah, oh yeah, it was a line from the chat log and anyone who's. Listening to this, like, please fact check it. I don't want to get it wrong, but that's what I remember, but I remember thinking like who wouldn't lose their fucking mind being naked in a room by yourself for years like what they thought that she was a hazard tour, yeah their bullshit excuses was like oh you're, a suicide risk, so we have to have you naked with no glasses, nothing to read a horrible like suicide prevention, blanket that you can't, like you know, rap around. We have to like torture ' 'cause, you might be a suicide risk. True friend, is she in like regular prison now or still in Sala, Terry she's, in regular pay

and right now, actually like one of my most cherished possessions in the universe? Is she wrote me a letter once 'cause? I drew a birthday card for her. She dots her eyes with little doves. It's really cute with dove yeah. She draw little dogs on them every I yeah this isn't a long letter now. The short one is that it was a gracious when it was it was, I think it it reminded me of, like you know, the thank you card that, like someone very gracious to hate, someone is giving them a gift to help, but it would have been or set of circumstances, someone who is a soldier who transit to becoming a woman and then sends letters at all. Have the the animal that's known as a symbol of peace, yeah overall, the eyes I mean, I think, from her life you get sense that part of the reason she wants join the army, which is just like so smart, and she just wanted to go to college. I mean from what I know kind of about reading her life story like this. This was someone who her happiest time was

dating a dude who is around for like the MIT hacker scene, and I think that if she was middle class and not poor, she just would have like gone to school and go in computer science degree and that would have been the whole thing? It's incre! that someone who exposes crimes and that's That's the only way you could look at what happened with Edward Snowden end with Bradley Manning. I mean you could say that they did they did was treasonous, you get. Is it really treasonous when you're exposing crime, like isn't it supposed to be illegal to commit crime, and if your government is doing things that are illegal, isn't it your job as a patriot to expose those things like when? Is it not treason us, oh god, yeah, I mean there. Both of them are heroes. If no one is put in their own government and check, then that government will just ten to concentrating more and more power and people in it will concentrate doing worse and worse things, 'cause, there's, no sort of supervision, and there's no way that you can love your country and not call it on it's bullshit at all. I think that the opposite thing is trees and I think it

reason to say like just because it's my country, any crime, is justified, but what they're doing, though so horrible because they're making it so that no one ever does anything like this again it's so they make such a giant example. Like June. Massage is literally like going crazy. He was staying in that one house, in London, he can't leave if he leaves the arrest him. The moment he steps foot on like what a Cray easy thing like you can get out in the balcony and wave to people and get a slight amount of vitamin d, and then he has to go back inside and he's fucking trapped Snowden is hanging out with Putin and Russia, which is just bizarre to me so strange. I watched a bizarre Putin video to which food and video did you watch hooten there analyzing his gate, the way he box, this is so creepy like. Why don't they just admit that they like have a crush on him and want to have a sleepover? That is so weird I mean well, it's because

he has a very specific way of walking. That's indicative of someone who is military training. It's called the gunslingers gate is that it did it did they make turn up themselves? I guess they probably did but uh what he does. These swings his left arm, but not his right, so he could pull his gun out really quickly. That's the idea, but what's really bizarre about the Video is, I didn't know how like opulent, wherever he is palace or whatever the fuck it is like they have these fucking, ignore it. Like you look at these enormous gold doors like let's play it. Let's play at Jamie, so he could watch this. If you watch as he walks, if you note his left arm, swings noticeably while right arm stays relatively still in comparison like a huge contrast, and he always does this and that's so that he could shoot you in the fucking head quicker.

Well, someone finds out there's an untreated rotator, cuff injury and one of the other parents, but that's true right we're just like looking way too into it, but apparently it's really common amongst these guys in the russian military that get move into some form of political power, but it was kind of creepy about it back it up to the beginning again. Jamie please creepy is about is look at those fucking doors like what is that, like? What are those goddamned doors? Look at all that gold, everything is gold. I mean, I guess, that's the vestiges of being an imperial power where people used to collect Faberge eggs yeah. He is, I mean he is one of the most open dictators that you can see in modern society in which is supposed to be some sort of a democracy. I'm not entirely familiar with how the Russians run their political system, but I know that he was out and then he was you know he

put some other guy in some sort of a puppet position and now he's back run the whole show. But it's it's he's a weird case. Man. I don't know how he managed it. Seems like guys like that. Someone always wants to kill them, and just it always falls apart, but he's managed to keep it together for a long long long time no, he is I mean I can't say I'm like super familiar with russian politics. So I could, I might be talking bullshit, but I mean he. You know he was the ex head of the KGB, like he seems incredibly versed in spying on people and killing people who are threats and maintaining his position at all costs, yeah, he doesn't just kill me, kill him like openly yeah hasn't gotten down in front of their girlfriends stuff, like that, like you just sit. Massive terror attack who's that one guy that was yeah. It was walking with his girlfriend and his thought was that he had become so famous from criticizing Putin couldn't kill him, because if he did, it would be so obvious nope

he doesn't care. I mean I always think about. There is a very respected, a journalist whose name last name at one pronounce because all a butcher it but yeah. She was also just like gunned down for criticizing him yeah. Well, that's kind of happened, sort order. It's a bit. Fear of theoretically, at least in other places, but one of the weird ones in America was that Michael Hastings guy that that's uh, that's still that one really freaks me out to this day. 'cause, if you don't know the story, Michael Hastings was there's actually a Ted talk! That's available right now. It's a podcast called the TED radio Hour, which I listen to all the time that had one episode, all disruptive leadership and actually focused on this general General Mcallister, and they were kind of sympathetic to him in this TED talk, because the

idea was that he did a real leadership thing by stepping down and what it was was. Michael Hastings had gotten embedded in this military organization weather with overseas, and when the volcano erupted Remember that volcano in Iceland erupted and it up all the flights out of Europe, and you couldn't fly from that part of the world to this part of the world. So he got stuck. It was supposed to be a short trip and he got stuck over there for a month and, as he got closer and closer to people they got more and more relaxed and they started telling jokes that were inappropriate, like Al Gore and or Joseph Biden and along the lines of this. This guy, Michael Hastings, formulated this uh. Cool, publish it in rolling stone and it became this can

for national scandal and it I believe his name is Mcallister right, isn't the same. He he was forced to step down and that's what the whole focus of this TED radio hour. It's about. Was this guy taking a leadership position, a leadership pov by deciding that his position was not as important as the cause itself and he was just going to step down because he had created this environment where it was too much controversy and he was upset that President Obama didn't ask him to stay, but it is what it is and that's it. What they don't say in this thing was just Michael Hastings. Guy was in this recording who's. Talking about what it was like when he was there He committed suicide in one of these strangest most controversial ways ever he mean I don't think it was a suicide. I think it was an accident well

some people think it was a suicide. Some people think was an accident and the black helicopter crew thinks that he was murdered and that what they did is they took over the electronics in his Mercedes and they forced his car to drive run into a tree at one hundred and twenty miles an hour with no brakes and explode, and let me all this crazy all these crazy conspiracy theories that are attached to it. That say that engines don't go flying from a car like that. Unless there's a bomb involved- and you know like- why would this guy do this and It is pretty pretty trippy stuff, and then there was claims that there was crystal meth in his system and then he was high on drugs and he had a problem with drugs in the past. But then the count that was people were like? Well now he's probably doing adderall, which a lot of writers do it 'cause? It helps me right, yeah, it's like New York drug everyone's, an adderall in New York. Is it yeah

yeah? I mean I hate. I know a lot of people who are very close to to Michael Hastings and I'm I will say the people that I know that are very close to him. Think it was a tragic accident, You just happen to be going one hundred and twenty miles an hour on sunset, Blvd yeah. I mean that's for the people. I know that never hit his brakes. I I can't I can't debate it, but that's that's just what I've heard from people who I am very close to who are closing, and I would say that to files close to that dude I knew I was on sort of a list if you're close to that guy, you know you got to be on a list, well I mean probably, like fear, investigative journalist, doing a lot of stuff in a and Somalia you probability on the list. You talk about yourself, I have in Somalia, stuff no, I mean, but, like a lot of his friends were investigative journalist, so yeah, I'm sure everybody's, I'm probably on the list, probably less for having you right here. Do not know you good, I'm in California. I don't know, I'm I'm adopting adopting the native dialect. I

I'm sure we're all on lists 'cause. How could you be interesting if you're not on a list? That's true! It's sort of like a badge of courage to be on some sort of list depends on what list, though,. But yes some weird world, we live in right now. I think it's theirs, a temporary bridge right now, it's going on where, where there, the NSA, fill in the blank, whatever name of whatever organization that supposedly watching over us, but they have certain amount of power to look into people that we don't have. Yet that's temporary it going to come a time with this electronic barrier that have in between each other. It's all going to dissolve and everyone going to have the same sort of power to spy on everybody at the NSA has and we're just going to have to accept it. It's going to be very sure, it's going to be like we're all camping, how God gonna horrifying world? We already know too much about each other? We do right was that

turn when you're writing this book. 'cause you empty yourself out in this book mean you talk about. Sexual liaisons and relationships and friendships and things gone wrong and was: did you you are writing this. Did you ever say man I mean. Maybe I don't know everybody didn't know these things. I had a few things that were like that, usually with actually with friendships, but ultimately I I thought that it was more important. To be honest, though, the one thing that I did do was I felt like it would have been really unfair. If I had taken kind of personal moments I had with someone like fifteen years ago and just like put them in a book and thus on that person's Google without asking them so well. I I tried to be pretty merciless of myself with people who I'm still friends with. I got their approval on what I wrote about them. That's really cool That's a really important. That would be a real good way to destroy a friendship. You started telling crazy intimate stories

yeah, just just not cool like it's. Not it's not fair. You know. So I know that, like a lot of people, disagree with that and they're like they're my memories, but I don't know, I don't think it's right, especially if you're kind, we're famous one: it not cool the young, saying they're, my memories. If you share a moment with someone, I think it's kind of a group memory, or at least a group moment- yeah, it's kind of kind of actively owned, and I I ran the by my parents. Also, that's got to be weird. That was the most terrifying thing in there is that, because I ran the parts about my parents buy them, but then they hadn't read the whole book, and I had this really terrifying thing. When the came out where I was like. Oh my god, what are they going to think? And I mean I love my parents are really supportive relationship. I couldn't ask for like into cooler people on earth. You know my parents, but still you're, always scared right at the scary to show yourself like that, but but they liked it. They liked it mostly so

you're happy about that. Well, you must have really open minded parents. What do you? Parents do? my mama she used to be an illustrator and now she's, mostly retired. She works kind of as a babysitter, slash cats that are now Anna, my dad dad's in academic. Oh that's cool! Well! So yeah, you seem obviously have some intelligent, open minded parents, so they've got to be really proud of, because this is excellent. Thank you so much yeah. They really are an. It was cool 'cause. I got to talk about how both of them Influenced me so much in there totally totally different ways like my mom is an amazing artist. She she draws so be. Beautifully and she draws kind of like me if I was a less bitter and jagged person like like she draws like the sweet me, and I was able to say like this- is how my mom taught me how to draw you know this actually inspired me. You got some great people that are reviewed this to menu. Matty B to review this Patton Oswald reviewed this I mean this is really fucking impressive stuff. Thank you.

Imagine that awesome. He actually interviewed me for my book launch in New York, and I grew Reading that you know I was reading like the exile when I was eighteen and I love his stuff in New York Press and would love about Matt's work. Is that a lot of journalists like they're like these really like narrow, professional people that are very, very serious Matt was like this total wild man when he was young, and now he does this incredible investigative journalism on finance and politics, but he still writes like a real person. He still writes in the kind of Hunter S Thompson tone. That's exactly how it was. I was going to scrap it, The lucid hunter S Thompson, exactly less drug addled, yeah yeah best of Hunter S? Thompson, less narcissistic, but we much less narcissistic now, but he so influential in, because I was like wow, you can totally be this badass investigative journalist, and you could also be this guy who, when he was young, was having these crazies soften criminal adventures in the aftermath of the Soviet Union falling those two

we're not incompatible at all. I I always like people like I do have lives that are really really diverse, yeah. He that's a a really good way of describing him too, because- and we do have this idea- that if you're going to be an investigative journalist that your piece has to be sort of homogenized and it's going to the facts, take press. Sent over the flavor of the pros and his has a lot of flavor there's a lot of there's a lot of personality in distribute facts, but it doesn't get in the way of the facts. Oh god, no! No he's it's such like a master class on how to do it, and in fact it's really serves the fact, especially writing about financial journalism. I mean finance can be so boring and so complicated that it can really be over most peoples heads and, if you write it completely without flavor, most people will never even be able to sink into it. At all Yeah he's the guy that I got most of my information about the financial collapse about and one of the things that dissed me, the most was how

little reaction like publicly his articles caused- and I thought like it- would be one of those things where everyone would be sharing, it would go. It would be on the front page of the New York Times. Today on CNN Matty B uncovered, and everybody would like to look at the facts. This is crazy but mean why it was like this tearable terrible scenario where the whole system was hijacked by these fucking criminals and no one seemed to care it. Just I have bills to pay. I have to keep going. I have spin class at nine o'clock. I can't be, and no one no one, we gave it the attention- or I should say no one, but not publicly NASH. Only it didn't get nearly the attention that it deserves and he wrote a series of them an you know, some of the most like this guys gonna get fucking killed

these were these were intense allegations and it's backed up all of it, backed up by facts and really well written, and it's just like almost like is too much for people. This is like a it's like complicated. It deals with a lot of things kind of boring, very intellectually demanding, not necessarily partisan, and I think for a lot of people there. Like. Are you going to do yeah? It bothers me that he's not more famous it bothers Maine. I think I I hope with the next book he will because I think he's like one of the best journalists working American yeah yeah. I agree I agree he's amazed. He's amazing? Now how much time do you spend doing all this? You too, a lot of journalism mean Do you do a lot of crazy shit? You gotta, look really nutty sort of dangerous places and then to fear yeah what is like the most disturbing place that you've been to so the most dangerous place. I went

who was our last summer when I went into Syria for a day- and that was basically the reason- when I talk about how dangerous it was. The fact that I wouldn't even spend the night there. She was probably something about my tolerance levels, but at that time This coalition of islamist groups had just kicked ISIS out of this border town called as, and you could take us over to the turkish border, and then you could cross, and I did that with a close friend of mine and I spent today day with the islamic front driving around his eyes and one of the things that was happening then was it was before a James Foley was murdered, but. We all knew that there are lots and lots of kidnappings there, and at that point we thought it as for ransom and stuff. But still you know, kidnapping is terrible, terrible thing and. When the scariest thing that ever happened to me is journalist was with these three,

young media activists, slash fighter, guys really cool dude. I mean I liked them and we're in this or were driving around, as as an the car slows to a halt, just breaks down and Patrick the guy. I'm with him immediately thanks to set up for kidnapping to get get us out of the car, because that's one way that you can set things up for kidnappings. And the guys didn't have their guns, and so we had to walk to the media office through his eyes and his eyes at that point looks like something out of mad max like it was just no women on the street. Just men, a lot of a k is even if I don't have any care could be whole next, books and stuff there were well. There was a what I can only describe as like a gun bodega, which is fascinating, 'cause, it's olds. All these different guns, like

I saw a cell like a beautiful antique. You know pearl inlaid revolver that, like someone's dad, had but then also grenades and stuff and grenades grenade cf, because you know in case someone tried to kidnap, you could have a graph of you come with me yeah. I think clay. Basically, so you know we're walking through this town, and that was, I think, the scariest thing that I ever did in my life, but it all turned out fine and we got to the media office, which it was a government building that that that these young men to taking over when they kicked up the central government and the director of it had been kidnapped by ISIS and the young guys are there like watching watching soccer, 'cause that ever and ever in love soccer there, and it was just. I don't know it's like this feeling of being in this place, where uhm.

The whole world is both fucking with it and abandoned at both at once. You know and and anything could happen, so that was the most dangerous thing. I've ever done, like nothing. I've ever done was his dangerous is going to Syria, but I think the most personally disturbing thing was was in Gaza six months ago, I guess, and I went to Shaia, which is this neighborhood that was completely destroyed by Israel during protective edge like bombed it, and then they went in with tanks, and then they went in with bulldozers like so it's like flat and and it's just like gone like you know, you go there and you're like this is a neighborhood that has been wrecked and a lot of times. When you see houses that have collapsed, you can see all of the Stuff of peoples lives in it like you're, like oh there's, the cooking pots and there's the bed and

there's all this stuff, that's just trapped in, and then people, because there's a big housing shortage. Obviously, in Gaza were living in these bombed out buildings. You know where their home was and. You know with like no real like services or anything like I saw this. I was walking. It was kind of scrambling through this building take pictures, and then I just randomly walked into what I it was abandoned room and there's like an old guy there hanging out- and you know it's like really

all right at the end, they invade your home- and I just just talking to him but yeah. This hit had like a a baller gorgeous home. You know before this, and now he was just living in a little like the rack of one of the rooms. Well, wow, it's you know, mad max is the way you describe that that city and that sort of apocalyptic scenario, something that we all worry could happen to us to anything. But one of things I always try to remember is that the apocalypse is already here This is not here yeah. If you go, there is here like it was in in Gaza. It's there, that's the apocalypse needs there. I mean it might as well. Be in that guy's house I mean you are living like mad max as people in that what's in the city had a song as and as mean That is what everyone is terrified of what everyone's terrify is a reality where you walked on the street.

And everyone is carrying military weapons and you're, just chaos and it's fairly lawless yeah. I mean a lot of the. You can see that it's not it's not that they were lawless. I I would never describe him as that, but just in the sense of the extra beam falling in life situation, there is a guy. I met no in iraqi Kurdistan. Last time I was with doctors that borders there an he. You know he was this like super smart dude like he was kurdish, which meant that he was really discriminated against, but he scored so high in his math exam. He was able to go to like an elite engineering school and get an hour not x degree, and you know, because they are not extension and like this is a do that would, you know, be be on the path to like having an awesome job and now he's living in a tent with his like whole family and his mom, and everything- and you know you never x

fact that when you're living like an awesome city like Aleppo, that he was living and then you're and then the war comes and there's bombings and you're driven out of your home and your so this place that eventually you're forced to you know be living this tent with no end insight and you're not allowed to like ever improve your circumstances. 'cause you have the wrong passport Jesus Christ. It's hard for anybody living in America to rap their head around what it would be like to be there and be stuck in that position. It really is. I mean so the syrian refugee, syrian refugee thing. One thing that I. I think, perhaps isn't in the media. Enough is that the people who are coming to Europe right now or the middle class of the country, because it's cost over one thousand dollars to pay that to pay that take you over and every single one of those people could

buy a plane ticket and travel like a normal person and not have their kids risk drowning and all of that, but they're banned from it. 'cause there Syrians and the whole like taking the boat and walking from Greece to Germany and having volunteers, give out water and sleeping on the streets and like the humanitarian disaster, is just a function of not letting them by playing is that all that's all! It is well there's this big push in America now, especially among the Republicans, not allow anyone from Syria to come into the United States. It's great You're, not a single person with the syrian refugee program has ever been arrested for terrorism offence. It's like it's nuts, it's so her there. So scary bear terrorist. Oh my god! It's make one of 'em. That's an asshole I'm sure, I'm sure there's assholes, but not one of them was arrested for terrorism, offences. Acura t! If you look like a million Canadians in you, and they are the nicest people ever there be like some of guys aren't that big like riot was in Toronto Fashion cars yeah. One of those things happen. Crew are one of 'em,

the Vancouver Hockey Riot girls assholes make it through. You know it's crazy and it's some. It's really, like personally, upsetting to me 'cause, I've done so much work with Syrians over the last few years and like to see these, like amazing people that I know who or so tough and so smart and have endured so much like being defamed like this, I feel almost like someone's shit. Talking like my like my well, someone should talking my friends. You know it makes me angry on a personal level like not just a theoretical one was not just it's so short sighted, because if you consider the fact that you're talking about an entire group of people, that's fleeing variable area and you're, saying well, they've all got to be bad one of the most racist things that you never say publicly. In two thousand fifteen I get sick sort of this weird accepted racism and because of the fact that terrorism, it like when you deal with Muslims, write your deal

with one point six. Is that what is billion people like a fifth of the world and so the idea saying? Will the terrorist activities they've been run by Muslims. Why don't we kick all the white people out of America, because white people have been responsible for all the mass shootings mean, it's more logical than this, but it's so awful and like the other thing that's to me like particularly like moronic, is I I see sometimes in the media like. Why aren't the Muslims condemning the terrorists, every single group that actually on the ground like fighting ISIS with guns, you know their Muslims, yeah, yeah they're, like ninety percent muslim or ninety five percent Muslim. I mean a lot of them are war criminals to I'm not saying there good groups necessarily but their Muslim, every single, like major muslim religious leader in the world, has condemned ISIS in terms that they would even use in America. I mean it's sounding to me. I think that the only reason anyone would think that Muslims aren't condemning ISIS is 'cause. They can't use. Google do

read the news and have never spoken to a Muslim ORF the same reason why Matty B's articles never really got as popular as I thought they should people just don't have the time. Or the need. Everything is one. So you go to the supermarket. You buy food. It's really easy. You know go through the Mcdonald's drive through your mix full. You sit home, you watch Netflix you're good, like you, don't need to pay attention to Syria fuck those people keep. Wow Donald Trump is going to keep us safe, drink yourself into a coma wake up in the morning. Do it all over again drink some coffee get out the door getting fucked car. Do the same shit as long as you can get to work. I got bills as long as you can get to work. You're fine! Is this. The idea of America in the first place was supposed to be a place where people could go where they didn't like where they were and they wanted to found. They wanted to stab lish a new life. They wanted to we're going to take a joke any chance. You're going to get in a fucking, stupid boat and make it across is Jaya

body of water. We don't even know what it looks like they didn't have photos back. Then that's one of the weirdest things about traveling to America. If you really stop and think about it, it was done when people didn't even have photos laughs, the first people that came over. If you wanted a picture, something you had a fucking draw it and that's how crazy these people were there like we don't care so drawing it's pretty. Trees were fucking get in the boat, but they were there babies, that grandma and shit and they got in the boat, and they came to America because they they had an idea, and that idea was. There is a better life here we can. We can make it and the two I that to these people because they were born on the wrong patch of dirt and I'm not saying that wouldn't be checked. You shouldn't go through a criminal background check and make sure you're not letting in some mass murder or not letting in some rapist or some thieves or whatever yeah. I mean if there's a way to do that, that should be done, but

idea that you should never let anybody in this from Syria, so God many magic, your curse just 'cause you were born in the shitty patch of dirt. That's yeah! That's exactly what the thinking is. It's like, because you were born here, you carry some virus, you have to be quarantined and I'm like I'm, so I'm so fucking grateful that you're, saying like Gee audience and would like on the massive platform you have like I. I know it sounds in shape, but like thank you really well listen. Thank you for going over there if it was a for people like you, an you know the vice people and all these journalists, and all these people that go over there and show us in video form like exactly what's happening and get to watch it and see But it's like you go. Oh, this is fucking. Chaos like this is in the world right now, two thousand and fifteen, while people watching the Emmys and everybody's on the red carpet smiling this pop to the world that are like a mad max movie. Right now or like this refugee camp, I went to herb. It was a c that bunch fresh

She kept in the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon, like people don't know, it gets cold there, like kids freeze to death so every winter um in those camps 'cause. It's like your living under vinyl tarp in the mountains, Jesus Christ, who it's very strange that the world is so uneven that there are places like the Congo that are like that exist. On the same timeline as Park, ave that there's people that have died, for men that dress up like the guys that were holding open the door for Putin and only hop into Hoover Limousines and you travel around the city. You know what the the right fragrances in the in the car and it's it's of, of what we, live a really strange times, because I think, with the disparity that existed, that that's kind of always existed, there's always been disparity, there's always been, you know the haves and the have nots and in some places on a much more grants.

But it's never been so obvious, especially People are online now, like. I think, a lot of people, maybe don't realize. Especially in the Middle EAST Lee how internet connected people are, when I didn't do me is which is the sat refuge. It was a refugee camp in Iraq that that I was at one of most pop stores was the store that was selling personal Wi Fi hotspots, and you have people we're living in like a tent. You know with tarpon like nothing, but they have like a wi fi hotspot and that's 'cause I had a family that was scattered all around the world and the only way to communicate them with them with Whatsapp or with texting, serve is like this or with Skype, and so, like the most important thing you were going to get was internet access so that you could like talk to your brother. That was in one country in your daughter that was in another like that was more important than anything he's a daughter. I

heard your New York fuck it's coming out man, I tried so hard yeah, then yeah, it's true! It's true, I'm from Queens originally! Well, you know it's kind of crazy. Is I guarantee you there's a high possibility that someone in one of those camps is listening right now. Well, absolutely cast that I've downloaded from the internet. No, it's absolutely Absolutely true, I wonder I feel like if you're like someone who's listening, is listening. You know from a camper is listening in a refugee situation like I hadn't. How cool would it be to get someone like that on your show as a guest? If there is like a way with Skype or something that'd be amazing, I have to clear it with Donald Trump make sure you think it's okay, it's a are, are syrian voice is allowed in the country or that, because ISIS devices come from your invoice. Only it's a disease of the mind. He wants to stop the

internet to the Middle EAST. Have you heard this? This is the latest Donald Trump thing I had assigning last night, so I unfortunately I miss the intellectual glory. That was the republican debate, so to fill me in on this. I didn't see it, but he was talking about. This that one of the things that they would do, or he would do- is knock off the internet to certain parts of the Middle EAST. Why? Why, like how's that? Well because that's how they are plotting against us, Molly Crabapple, while you sit in your wonderful New York apartment writing books about Saks that aired the terrorists. The terrorists are winning oh god I mean so in ISIS territories that those fuckers are occupying. They got rid of private internet access, and those homes. 'cause they're really scared of the internet too. They are super. There are all these citizen activists and journalists that are revealing. Did about them on the internet right now like if you're in

The only way to even get on line is to be on these internet cafes, that are kind of run by dudes, with ISIS connections an and That's 'cause. Isis is also really fucking scared to the internet. They really don't like it really yeah. Why isn't well because a lot of Syrians living and Iraqis living in their territories, fucking hate them and they give Intel on to two journalists, I'm saying so the internet acts as a way that they communicate and it's I was plans, but it also acts as something that's plotting against them exactly same as the internet. Does it everywhere else? No, it's just too many patients, as people yeah when you're a

group of Cunts that the whole world hates and your online guarantee you're going to get some haters yeah, I mean there's, there's one group of journalists there that became very famous, that's called braka. Is being silently slaughtered that I mean they did tons of work documenting ISIS Shit, an ISIS mean beheaded, two of their members that were were in Turkey and there are plenty of citizen journalists there and yeah ISIS is dead scared of normal of normal people who are living under their fucking occupation using the internet. They hate it. You know another thing: they're scared of their scared of being killed by women, so it's kind of uh. I think I think this is my theory that the Kurdish they don't go to Heaven if the kurdish girl kills them thing. I think like

one person said that and then install how much play got in the media and they were like. Oh man, this is good pr. Let's keep that! Let's keep milking this one, I think so I think so. Yeah does it make sense ideologically like within their religion? Is that something that they believe in? If you get killed by a woman, you don't get all the vergence now I think that's bullshit. I think they did I think there's like a macho thing. You know where they're like well, fuck a girl. You know girl, but my leg, but I it's not a theological thing damn. It seems so good though I know really it seemed. I was thinking of like some crazy Amazon scenario, just like armies of chicks with guns chasing ISIS, and they just run away 'cause they're scared of being killed by chicks. I mean like but the women who are fighting ISIS like in the ypj or you know for zero just soldiers but either ISIS is scared of getting they're scared of getting killed by soul, if we really allocator. If that was true, though- and we really allocated our resources correctly, I think there's

probably enough, really mean bitches in the world. We could put together a hell of a fucking army. I think so I think so too. With tons of motivation, could you imagine just jets and bombers and missiles all being piloted by women like that's it? Only women only women going after ISIS, because if they get killed by these women, their fox and they don't get to go to Heaven, I think it. I think you would have to do like a more. The bombings, aren't doing shit against ISIS. I think the why PG is doing is, you know, think, would have to be more on the grill. On the ground. Yeah. Well, especially Afghanistan right, that's one of the things that people have, we had a problem with invading Afghanistan. It's essentially a series of mountain ranges occupied by warlords, there's not like

service in is not allowed to access is not so easy to get to. The thing with ISIS is what they do is they, I mean the move, and you know they occupy cities like a military occupation, the try to marry people and build families, and they tried to insert themselves as much as possible into the fabric of a city and that's partially in part, it's them making it so that, if, if you, you know bombs rock, I you'd be murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians who were just too poor to get out to the duty, strategically yeah and bad themselves as a human shield. Yeah exactly and like there are so I mean the majority of rock a is they're like farmers who couldn't afford to get out it's expensive to even get out of Syria what a mess! What a crazy chaotic psychotic mess is. Really bizarre that member that Obama speech that he down on television. Was it a year or so ago, where he

talking about eminent military action against Syria and the whole country went. What are you fucking crazy and then it just stopped. Literally like silence like you, didn't hear anything more about it. They just completely backed off just because Republicans and Democrats everyone was like. Are you out of your fucking mind, like what could happen in Iraq. Look what happened in Afghanistan! Look at the massive negative reaction. The american public has had all these military actions you're going to start up a new one in Syria. For what reason somebody got gassed, 'cause! People asked people like what's going on that, we need to Sacrifice- american lives over there. Exactly like. What's the cause of all this, I mean that's really sort of so tragic about Syria. Is that Obama? This this is me saying an opinion. That's not necessarily mine but opinion that I've gotten from speaking to refugees. It uhm a lot of people, I think felt very led on by what Obama said and they felt like

Oh there's going to be. You know some support, or I don't know some action against Assad because I mean whatever one thinks about american intervention or non intervention. What I said did is a crime against humanity on a massive scale. What whatever we think you thinking, we should have done what he did was fucking traffic in anyone who is in syria- and you know who was at the receiving end of that- would very often once someone else to watch me and explain to people what he did do he ran like an industrial scale, arrest, torture, killing program. He does something called barrel bombings which are taking like basically like dumpsters, full of TNT and shrapnel and dropping them in populated areas, target schools, targets, hospitals, destroyed large swathes of Aleppo, and this isn't this isn't me saying.

This isn't me saying that I think the US should have intervened, because I I I still don't know, but I am very against the US intervening in general and anything else. I think we was up, but he also factually to do those things it's hard to imagine. The sum is capable of doing like that. This. Where people can get to where people can get to in their minds the dead that allows them to do like that, I think what it was was his one of the things that was quite influential was his father put down on sort of incipient insurgency. Opposition thing in a city called Hama by killing twenty thousand people and like bombing the out of the city and it that put put it down, and I think that perhaps in his mind he thought that he could do the same when there is an uprising against him, but obviously that unit was and what happened. Well, that some I mean that's a story,

Sodam Hussein, his sons as well imagine being the son of a an evil, brutal dictator. Well, those sons always end up like these fucking Nero figures. Don't they I mean it's like the father is very often like a thuggish military guy and then the sun is this princeling who whose got whatever he wanted in his life and that's when it gets so, did, you say was like Kim Jong IL also exactly yeah and Uday and Qusay is that his name yeah, those mother, fuckers gotta, read some horrible store,

but what they would do. They would find women that we're getting married and they would take them from their husband, raped them and then feed them to dogs. They had dogs that they had their basement, that they just didn't feed. It would throw people that they didn't like to their dogs in the dogs a term apart whoa at the end, and they would watch of course, but the it did the fact that a person can get to that place that a person can get to that place where they eat. What what is in the weirdest way more flexible in a beautiful way in which you can see someone who can create beautiful songs and art, and they can touch people with their words and their thoughts and their deeds. And you know they can. They can be something inspirational amazing, but we're also flexible in this horrific way were they could

play up on the worst fears in the worst, the worst emotions that people are capable of manifesting and they could just just attack and torture and mame and brutalize and murder, and and they could do it wantonly and do it. No for no real reason. They could do it sadistically for fun for recreation, the fact that that's the same beast, but it's just their human beings and it's like I mean there could obviously be some anomalies in the brain itself, but essentially a good portion of what makes a person who they are. Is there environment and their life experiences and the new featuring and like how they're raised and what they're exposed to, and we get we're so flexible and pliable because we want to survive that we're capable the same species do

same time period were not talking like cave people that cannibalise, because they didn't have books, they didn't understand. It was bad. They had invented language. Yet we're talking about people with the internet, there are capable of doing these horrific things. At the same time, there's someone like you fill in the blank there's a lot of beautiful people out there that do things, but my friend Justin Wren who's from these photo. Over here who goes to the Congo. We lose with the pygmies for six months a year and he he need bills wells for them and he malaria and almost dies and You know he's an American from Texas went over there and saw how incredible these people or any dedicates his life to it is like to me is like one of my favorite people, because it is like this beautiful manifest like experiencing, like friendship and love from these people and then just becoming incredibly dedicated to try to take care of them, but these people exist at the same time. This is so hard to understand. Like a parrot is a talking parrot, you know some parrots, you can tame a Milli,

so your hand and other ones. They live in the trees, but they're parents and we're like everything all at once, we're so weird we're so weird. You know I mean I'm a fan of people. Don't get me wrong, your your pro people, I'm a huge fan of people. I love people, I think, were amazing, but we're also horrible. You know it's a What we're capable of is so strong 'cause. You know like you or I are not capable of those things so for us to see that, like what we consider, a horrible person in America is like someone who's set something horrible on Twitter, about race or something like that. Or someone who's. You know disparaging about Pres Obama are you know, there's like so minor in a lot of ways: But we shame people for here. You know you didn't use. The can. Gender pronoun, you piece of shit. You know, meanwhile, there's terrable terrable things that are going on at the same.

Part of the world in the same time, in other parts of the world I mean, I don't believe in a race to the bottom. Shouldn't, be like no. You haven't like thrown someone to the dogs, you're cool! No, but I I I I definitely I I definitely hear you come in from the moon. That is funny right. You can We look at like Saddam Hussein's kids and, like I'm fine feel like all I did was punch a baby. I didn't have dogs eat it. Why do you have to shame me for my baby punching shaming, sharing the new thing right? When did she come around I mean public, shaming. Like the term, I don't you feel, like public shame, he's sort of an old american tradition. We have a book called the Scarlet letter about public, shaming yeah, but not as a phrase. You know like cat shaming, you know what you mean when it became man, yeah slut, shaming, like these term it's a very new. These like these are like new concepts. I mean. I think that there are new coin which is to describe to describe. You know old behave.

And the truth is I do think people should be criticized for, like I don't know I feel like if We're going on Twitter and you're writing you're, a dumb whore to random women like that is Jerkass behavior, and people should tell you that you're being a fucking jerk for and she's really into it. That's her thing, it's just previous. They expressed agencies previously expressed day. I desire for that yeah. They have like an established relationship, you're, a dumb whore. Oh you fucker over here and like yeah yeah, no pre previous consent, but you have to random random women who don't have that in their twitter bio that that's their into, I think like you're, being a jerk ass, and if someone is like fuck you dot, calling random women on twitter. You know, I think I think that's fine. I think that what we're talking about before about having no that one day we're gonna come a time where there's no boundaries between people, I'm I'm really absolutely convinced us. I kind of of I've had these weird trips in the set, a sensory depravation tank or of of sort of seen. This take place,

slow acceptance of what is the ultimate inevitable reality and it it kinda freaks me out. Sometimes I have to get out of the tank. 'cause, I just can't handle it 'cause. I really, I think, like life as a person, We have this idea, they're going to put our sa Lon and we're good. I got Michelle on. Is going to be? No shells were going to just have to somehow another, like you know how you have friends, I have friends that I'm almost too close to them. I know everything they do you know like. Would you do you? Fuck Why did you do that? Oh my god. What are you doing? Ha just fucking lost my mind, and but you know everything like going to know that about everybody. It's just a matter of time, but the thing is I don't it's going to make us nicer to each other or make us like each other better. I think that one of the things that Twitter has done- I mean I love Twitter, like I'm addicted to Twitter. I love it. I think it really cool, but in addition to having a speak to all sorts of amazing people that we never would have spoken to before. It also like really revealed what other people, we're thinking and made us like really dislike them. For it.

We need a lot of ways right, yeah, yeah, what's also ' the anonymity, the ability to reach out to Molly and just play some mean shit anonymously. You know you're just this little egg, I'm a little egg. You know that's all your icon is, and you know you have a series of letters or represent your egg and then like fuck, you might crab So you fucking bitch already your bullshit honey, believe, that's how it went down. I think your fucking attention whore yeah, and then you read that you like aw, you know you've fucked. Anonymous. Person is searing, my soul. With your hey, I mean I don't like I. I get a lot of like but, as I'm sure you do, I think ok. So this is the thing. Sometimes the thing that helps me put it in perspective is: I got seventy thousand twitter followers and I think if I ever had

the other grouping, like any real life group of seventy thousand people like what would be the jack ratio that I would expect in that. It's always one in a hundred. That's what I thought my thought is it's one, because it's the real one percent. We should be concerned with the jackass one percent yeah the mean people it is, I think, they're the was so there so calm like the the idea of the one percent being like the real problem, America being successful people, I think if you got the one percent of all the successful people together, only one some of them would be evil cunts. I really believe that I think percent like. I think you keep going with the one percent like how many of those out of those people that, evil. How many of them are true sociopaths, probably one percent of them to like it keeps going. But if you have three hundred million people you're dealing with three million assholes like if there's one hundred people, one of 'em is going to suck and if you have three, three hundred million, you have three million people that suck and if they all get ahold of your twitter account you're going to think the world has ended,

you think my god and you won't see the other. Ninety nine. You won't see them because the hateful words of the one will just be over whelming every now and then Molly your books, amazing, or are you like retweet? God is clean to that's yeah you'll try to find, I mean I've watched people in like I had like we're talking about Lance Armstrong, and I looked at the mentions that Lance Armstrong, it's on Twitter. Like anything, he writes like anything here. I had a great time. You know but doing these this race was it the times when you're running away from drug tests. Like sake, I think he can't help it. It's like people just love to dig. They just love to fuck and reach out rib cage pull out your heart. They can't help it. They know they can and it's also a new ability that human beings have sort of debated over the last couple decades really didn't exist before well before, like you would have had to have like

written a letter left your mom's basement walked all the way down to the block with all these other human basement. Is the amazing? Why don't I say, like your dad's basement, girlfriends basement, there's so many other basement these people could be in like. Why do I have to put them all in their mom's basement? This is somehow another from an the most pathetic thing like my I'm down here. Mom stop yelling, I'm down here telling people they ran on the internet, typing up a fucking storm. No, I'm trying to hurt when some chance feelings cycling, renting lying. I like I like that that was that was a. That was a good, a good personification of that. It's like this feeling of it's wanting to just somehow another get a reaction, and it's all losers, that's unfortunate! I mean I hate to say that those people right now look no! No I'm a I'm a winner in our yeah yeah yeah. I think you did what he did was just horrible okay. Well, then, you might think it, but if you

actually are sitting around trying to attack him. I guarantee you that is enerji and focus that you could have best spent on your own life. One hundred or like. Maybe if you're just like a mean critical person, who is a winner, you could have written really great essay about like juicing in the sport that like really took him down and then and then you could challenge your like meanness in a positive and winning direction. But if you really looked at the essay honestly, you would have to takedown the whole sport itself. I mean you really wouldn't if you want to take down Lance Armstrong, you'd, have to take him down by his individual acts. Actions in defending his actions in the sport yeah that that's that's. He admits that he and is pretty open about the fact, so he fucked up and then he made some pretty horrible choices. That's it the sport itself. If you really wanted to write an essay you'd right, what the FUCK steroid using bike riders, that's what you got yeah need right, like probably about the

sonic impetus and all the ways that, like top people, were able to kind of condone it then get out with their hands clean, and you write something like that. Really channeled, I mean listen to a positive direction that really tore shit down. Yeah. That's a weird thing about blogs too, though. There's a lot of I've read some really mean blogs. People write about folks- and I'm like what's interesting about this- is like blogs, are not a conversations like your you have this attack. This focused attack of of an end, visual, but if that individual was there and they could respond to this and you could have a communicate, it would be a different thing like what is like it's like. A mess which tide to the claw raven you're sending out like it's it's. So what such a one way thing it's it's, not it's not really an effective way to can indicate 'cause you're not really trying to communicate. We try to do is hurt. Somebody like when you see attack blogs

first yeah, there's some that deserve it like. If you could write an expose on some one who run some horrible business that is using slave labor or fill in the blank on some terrible scenario that you could expose. The world should like okay here, Matt Taibbi's exposes on the financial call brilliant yeah perfect, and you know that those are legitimate and important, but ever had some things that people written or just about like random, celebrity yes, sir. You know and you're just like why it. Why are you that invested in Tyler Swift, like how do you have so much opinion? Then it's Taylor. Thank I'm gonna fucking dork. I don't know anything: I'm a fucking dork to haters gonna hate hate hate that fucking song. I like that Song God Dammit have daughters and have a wife that God Damn songs, play. All the time they played in the car. When I'm with him, ok, you could play that one. I like that one That's awesome, but I'm embarrassed that I, like

which is it. It shows a diverse musical tastes that song. I definitely have that. Sometimes too diverse you know, but I don't know how we got on that. But it's like yeah, I like mean take downs of like a some singer. Come on really this terrible person really info affecting your life in some strange way, but like the comments that people will make to people, I believe on Twitter and Facebook. All these are not my facebook, it's like slightly less anonymous, but all these anonymous methods of communicating they're going to dissolve slowly but surely the boundaries between people. It's not just to be the NSA that can find out exactly what you're doing and who sang what to who is going to be the whole fucking world everyone's going to be able to do that, and it's going to be very, very weird, very where the other thing is like people will find out the people who are doing that. I remember there was this. The gas

who made a bunch of twitter accounts too right that women who worked intact, but then just Brandon women. He didn't like we're cunts and he really fixated on this one woman who is a programmer at tour which is an anon. Best web browser and he like made seven twitter accounts at one point to like tell her. She was a cunt and so Finally, she was like she was like this. This has gone on long enough and when he was visiting our website, presumably to find more proof that she was a cunt. She got his ip address, track down where he worked and posted his name and his work place an with the line. It was like this classic she wrote used to our Fargo. I was like you know. If you went up to a bunch of women or if you want a bunch of women at bars and just scream like, hunt in their face like eventually either them or their boyfriend, or someone was going to hit you, but because we're doing this online. You thought like wow. I can just go to people in scream content. Nothing is ever going to happen and it did

and there's no one is going to be sympathetic to anyone is going to get seven twitter accounts just to call some woman account yeah. Now, no one badthatitthathegot dot org, I got Tauchst well, he was just expressing himself and exercising his first amendment rights. Now I think I really think we're we're, may maybe a few years away from that, just not being around anymore from it being some strange new world. Will I'm going to know exactly what I think. I really believe that we may be ten years away from being read each others thoughts. Oh god, you imagine yeah it's going to be very strange, but it's good to all the romance and things going to be gone because so much of like so much of like really exciting things in life is like anticipating and not knowing, and then you know it. It's like the unwrapping of Christmas presents like when someone text you hey Woody doing and you like. Yes, it's her full girl. You know.

Is that that moment, where you didn't know, someone likes you or not like what's going on, and then you come back and forth with each other is sending each other emails or you get that phone call out of the so from someone who didn't know they really were in the you know like yeah, but when you know everyone's thoughts going to be like all the room, your enemy fucker. Why you playing there's going to be no playing cool, there's going to be no no, you will you be when you go to apply for a job you like well you to like me, so I just get out of here. Thank you. You think I'm a Lou, you're, so you're not going to hire me. There's not going to be any illusions so, although a lot of romance is going to be on a lot of the fun of things is in not knowing you know, we don't like that. No I'm and I'm an artist. I I I I I like. I like the not knowing I like the mystery, sometimes so it's fun as long as it works out. Obviously it's worked out for you, here a young woman you're already you already have a book published

many many many many art pieces published journal. Some things that you've done is like. It's worked out for you all this romance, but for some people this is not happening for them and then, like God, damn it. I just think it would be better if there was no secrets, but if you're that person- and it wasn't working- for you probably if there are no secrets, you would just have the crushing disappointment of realizing either known was thinking of you or they were thinking bad things about. You know just making more unhappy, maybe, but is what we are as human beings, currently is that a static state and is the the state that we can expect to exist in in sort of this form. Speaking with our mouths making noises with our faces, interpretating it into bring it in our own minds and listening do other people say things in sort of establishing what their meaning is that it that this is going to be forever, which is going to be how he would no no fucking way just like a monkey claw

enough of a tree, and you know eventually name of person uh two hundred plus one thousand years later, or whatever the fuck it was whatever has led us to improve, to become we are today is a continuous cycle. It's not going to stop. I think that this idea that we've got right now like oh this, the I have not knowing- and you know it's amazing and it all works out well so fucking temporary. This is a little when we look back in time to the amount of time that we've spent in this state. Currently, the internet state is prince. So brief, but so transcendent. Absolutely like the most transcendent thing. I think as much or more than like the printing press, probably more my God, one

They look really good articles I was reading about on the refugee stuff is by this rocky journalist, but I always plug sees so brilliant place up to what I had, and he did this piece about. You know people making the trip in one of the things he talked about. Is that This was a trip that, when he was a young man in Iraq, had tried to pay a smuggler to do in the smuggler like defrauded him, and he didn't get to do it, but it was all under the control smuggler's. Where is na if you have cell phone, like once you get from turkey degrees once you do, that little four hour boat ride you just put on the GPS maps on your cell phone and you walk wow. You don't need smuggler's after that. In that crazy, it completely upended the into the entire, like really like disgusting nasty business well similar in a lot of ways to the business of sneaking people over from Mexico? You know I have a friend who, he's been living in America for more than two years 'cause. I've known him for I've known him for eighteen years, so

I think, he's been living in America for like two thousand seven hundred and twenty eight years and that's how he came over. He came over in a fucking man in the middle of the night and they got out and there was a guy behind them that had a stick like a they do, take like a giant branch from a tree with all the leaves and as they walked one guy behind them, would waive the branch back and forth to cover up their foot steps. He says yeah yeah and they they did it through the middle of the night and they eventually got to some sort of border town weather is in Arizona or whatever, and they made their way and infiltrate into cities and eventually found jobs and barely survived, barely fed them selves and fuck man. You just imagine that life and then there's all these people. We've got to tighten up our borders. Fuck man like that. That's high enough that the border shit trump.

Like idiot idea of that wall, that's not even like physically possible to build, would have to go through all these, like rivers and take over peoples, land and his like. How do we get presidential candidates who not that they're stupid out there crazy, but who, like fundamentally deny physical reality like this is. This is where we are right now, yeah. I don't think he necessarily as a presidential candidate. I don't buy it, you think you think, to make the other ones look moderate and reasonable. No, I don't think it's some grand conspiracy. I think its him riding this crazy way of of attention and trying to think in his own mind that it's justified because he's shining light on these important issues in a way that only he can because he's independently wealthy and he's not bound to know the the though the wishes of his constituents. He can just kind of go out there and say I want to put a giant wall up and

but the Trump wall and we're going to keep up the Mexicans yeah and anyway, everybody wants to fucking, kill him and his face is falling off. His bones is just so bizarre. It's so Cohen brothers ask that, like he really does seem like satire, I mean he's like the ultimate american satire president candidate. Did you ever interview him like back before this? I've never met him nothing. I I once I confronted him at a press conference in to buy it's like when I put my finest moments. I I was really scared because you buy is its police state? You know, there's no free speech, there's real real. You know the lock. You up and there are rich enough? They don't really care about your american passport that much and so so this press conference, where he had these golf courses, that he was licensing his name too, and I had some intel that the guys that were building the golf courses were getting two hundred bucks a month to do construction work, an

like the Emirates, the average salary of Emirati, is, I think it's like six thousand and sixty thousand a year, I think and see is200 a month. You know to do like hard ass construction and so I get up during the press conference. Where he's getting his ass kissed and I wave my hand around- and I say you mister- you have been saying how you know this all stands for luxury and your construction guys are going two hundred dollars a month and you satisfied with that and his mouth fucking shriveled. I've never seen it like shriveled this tiny rosebud of hate, and I got so yelled at but yelled at you. He didn't yell at me that the underlying yelled at me he's under the underlying from the MRI APR firm. That was there. What do they say? That's not appropriate question. How is not appropriate, I know, and then the next question was mister Trump. You stand for luxury and Dubai stands for luxury. Is that why you Dubai like each other.

So did the answer. You know he didn't. He didn't answer me just like me, now travel and like if bonkers mouth, when all small everyone's mouth, when really small, with anger long because this a long time ago right is that the drawing yeah yeah, that's the drawing, and he was so angry at me because I guess I took like a little serve to just picture of him but yeah. He was like they're talking to how New York should be more like Dubai, cousin, Dubai everything was perfect. Yeah yeah, do you like the ass kissing. He said that he built the greatest architectural buildings in New York. I beg to differ, wow I only said that you know my friend, Joey Diaz grew up in New York and he said one of the things that people forget about Donald Trump is all the disputes that he had with small local construction companies that used they used for prom Jects, and now these people like wind, up going out of business and they you know they couldn't they couldn't battle hymn. And actually in like like this wave of people that hate him in there

whole construction business. I don't know who's right and who's wrong about those disputes, but the idea that you could take that mod, which is already problematic in America and then take it right, rap it up in a giant weigh in Dubai that fucking piece that vice did on those people that Arum in Dubai that are trapped where they take their passports. I think that I think, did it big piece on that? Did you yeah yeah? There was a um um, how long It was my last summer no. This was a few years ago, like maybe six or seven years ago, nice there was a uh, a camp that they went to in these men were crowd just openly weeping. They were showing this hole in the ground where they have to shit and they were showing how where the water is, and they had promised them a sub, initial amount of money per month, and they were coming over from India and the Philippines, a lot of third world countries an once. They got there. They would take their passports away

and then reduce their salary dramatically. You know and they couldn't leave and they were forcing them to build these structures. Exactly it's totally like that, and then the other really fucked up thing. Is that like these guys, they are not passive like they try to strike and stuff, especially very often, not only do they reduce their salaries? They just don't pay him like, and can you imagine, like you, like, a wife and kids at home? You know who are like depending on like go to another country and you know make make money for the family, and then you don't get paid for three months like it's like you know, breaking the whole family, and so these guys will do strikes, will do sit downs in front of the buses and then they hold to jail and deport them when they do that. It's it's scary, so scary that it's again we're talking about the spectrum of human behavior. That I mean,

like a few steps away from being serial killer. But it's just this. This is sort of pathological detachment from compassion. Now that you, don't you don't care what these people that are risking their lives to make these giant buildings that are these royal people are gonna, walk on roses of you, throw at their feet and step into these things and go skiing in the middle of summer on these gigantic buildings they make they make these crazy fucking structures. In there 'cause he they almost have an unlimited budget. It's almost like they have like idea in their head. You know I would to fly indoors and they're like ok, we're going to build you a mile, high fucking gigantic building where you could fly inside, and then you have planes that you could fly indoors I shouldn't have said that 'cause someone in Dubai is listening. From their head, yes and in indoor flight course, and it's with so

strange is like I was prepared to like hate do. But how do you buy a look like I hate how Dubai is, but I mean I was prepared to aesthetically hated as well as ethically hate it. It's weird when you go there, it's beautiful, that's thing. It's like I remember. I was looking at that building like the shard in the world, the world's tallest, I'm building Al Burj. Did you go in it? I went down to the ground floor and I bought a twenty dollars cup of coffee twenty dollars twenty dollars. Oh my god, how's it taste like a fucking cup of iced coffee There was that was just sort of a veblen object, but so I was like going into. I was going into it like prepared to like really like aesthetically judge it too and, like the thing is it's like so beautiful, and then I was remembering I was like for

Why is also beautiful and look at how that was made? And it was this weird thing: 'cause, you think about how splendor is always made and how, like the most beautiful things in the world, you know always are constructed and you definitely go there and you're like this is the city of the future, and this is the new aristocrats, and this is beautiful and it's all being built by slaves who are dying to build it. Well, I don't know it's if it's, the future is seven the future of that area. They just have this to strange world where it was incredibly poor up until just a few decades ago, and then all the sudden they start pumping oil out of that place and the money is astronomical and that change in the amount of money. That area has the few that have it. The disparity of wealth is just unimaginable what other kind of interesting things that they did in who which actually I kind of admire it- is that in a lot of country

when they get oil money. Like someone steals it, you know up top, but in Abu Dhabi, what they did was. They gave citizens a lot of entitlements to stuff. Like you get free education, if you're in a Marathi, you get free healthcare housing get a stipend emirati women are super super educated, most most of the Ph Ds are emirati women, like that's awesome, but the thing is the flip side of that is, like citizens are only ten percent of the population and its like nine thousand and ninety percent of the people. The people who do everything like the engineers, the shop, the shop workers, the maids, the construction dudes, like the people who do every manner of work, are not citizens and have no rights to anything. Wow, that's a trip where looking on the outside at that place I mean I I've. I've talked to people that I've been I've been there to buy, and I've been to Abu Dhabi. I was there for you, see event and you know without getting into anything political

beautiful. You know you like wow. These people have done a great job in constructing these things, but the guy guys that I was with some of them went to. They went to Dubai because we had the night off and I was tired, decided to stay home. They want to do by the guy we're going to go to bar, and you know how it just some places you can go to drink like you have to drink in certain places. It's illegal to have alcohol, but there's some sort of weird loophole and He said it was all russian prostitutes. They said it's just like these predatory, coyote women. Like a crossed over just like looking to do is just pocket cash from banging all these rich dudes. I was like whoa look at the my friend went to a bar and he said: I'm not bullshit in his bar might have been a percent hookers

go over there to make to make some serious money, but you can. I bet you could fucking clean it up, but it's probably really dangerous too right. You know I never did. I never really did research on like sex work in Dubai. Like my oregon uh I'll, be like. I know mostly about construction work and something about the maids and not so much, but I think for anyone who's, not a citizen, it's dangerous because you like don't have any real rates. If you're, not a citizen yeah. I remember. I think we the british couple that were making out on the beach and they were arrested. They were just kissing their just, but they were openly showing affection on the beach and they were thrown in jail like wow. This is another one. This is the craziest one. There was a british man who he had eating, poppy seed, bagel and poppy seeds, will you will test positive for heroin if you eat, like it's trace amounts, but obviously it's not enough to be psychoactive, but it's enough to show.

Up in a really comprehensive blood examination. So the test of this guy and he tested positive for her one and they put him in a cell there like he, had a poppy seed bagel at Heathrow Airport and that bagel got him a locked in a jail cell. I wo there's another woman who is an executive at Brillstein Grey, which is a very prominent LOS Angeles, entertainment and she had was that shit that people take it's a natural thing or you take it. When you want to go to bed malaria known it wasn't that it was a melatonin, yeah, yeah sure melatonin, fucking melatonin yes, you can have melatonin, they arrest her locked. Her up, took her passport, put her in a jail cell for fucking melatonin, and then you know somehow somehow got word of it and they got her out eventually. But what a terrified

moment, it must have been for her. There was another guy who had a marijuana seed, Igora, Stamour piece of marijuana that was wedged in between the tread of his shoes. That was it that was enough to put him in jail and he was going to be sentence for some fucking astronomical amount of time, and I don't know what happened in that poor guy, but unfortunately, for him he was a black guy with dreadlocks from England, and they were like dude forever cage forever yeah. It's really really really racist, some of the heart he would go over here. Some of the horror stories have been reported by the BBC four year, jail term for possession of zero dot, three grams of cannabis stuck to the bottom of issue. That's the guy, that's Keith Brown, Robert Dalton on trial for alleged possession of zero dot, three grams of cannabis, zero point

three unnamed twenty year old on trial for alleged cannabis. Mostly I had this one dude cannabis mostly. He's a he's, a Marathi, and he was interesting as names of Midland Sore, and he I mean, like he's so brave, I could have so many privileges like as an emirati, especially came from a good family and ever thing. You can really just coast it if you're emirati and your from a well off family, and he made a web forum that let people discuss. Basically discuss the royal family frankly, and it also it let people discuss religion kind of frankly, and if you were an atheist, you could talk about it on the web forum and they fuckin they locked him up for was he in jail for to have to check that I want to say was around nine months and they infected him with scabies when he was in jail and then when they let him out affected and purposely, but yeah. That's what he said. He said that they like gave him a blanket that had scabies on it and then He was out here this

series of unfortunate events that happened over one hundred thousand dollars accidentally disappeared from bank account and no one knows how it got, how it got missing and then, like onto occasions, are guys just sort of jumped out and beat the shit out of him. No one knows who they were. You know it's a mystery and his car just gets stole in all the time and the tires keep getting error taken out of it and magical mystery. No one knows who's behind that fuck yeah. Could you imagine if you like piss off some royal family and they just hired some dude. They pay me your job is to fuck with this guy forever. Like that's it that's your job or you know. If you're like some sort of a rich billionaire character, you could hire a bunch people you, the whole team, you know, and their job is just to fuck with people. Is this one I don't like 'em. Let's go get him that would to be hard like if you like, some trump guy and you've got billions.

Dollars and something like Molly Crabapple makes you feel like shit at some Dubai press event, you like fuck this, This is what we're going to do. Mahira team and I'm going to fuck with Molly Crabapple's life mean that's. In reality? Like someone? Is that wealthy? They could do something like that. That's scary, shit yeah. They definitely definitely definitely good. Look at higher. Somebody is every time you got your car. Your tires are flat like what the fuck tacos at a certain point, though We probably put up like a little cam on your car and you know, or you'd hire some people to yeah exactly like war of the proxies war of the proxies. That's it I don't know What have you gone to any places that were positive and your journalism

ask opinions. I love Istanbul assembles like one of my favorite cities ever it's just so gorgeous and it's so exciting and you walk down the e ecclesia desi, which is sort of the main street in a neighborhood called Bio, Lou Ann. It's like there's like lights and all these couples, hand in hand and everyone's playing music. There's like kids selling flower crowns. It's just like. It feels like the sort of Blvd that every other blvd in the world was trying to be. It's so magic, and I mean I could I could just walk around- is stumble like anytime of day or night, and I would never not like have my heart fast for that city. Why? Now? So? That's your favorite spot! That's my favorite spot, you think you'd ever be an ex pat moved is tumble in their resting on it. They they have a bad record and forcefully for arresting journalists. They're one of the when I got yeah one of my colleagues advice this brilliant kurdish dude, Mohammed Rasool. He is like

currently in jail right now for doing journalism in Turkey and vices like trying really hard to get him out, but he is like rotting in gel cell and they claim that he is this, because he used encryption, he is a kurdish dude. He's a kurdish dude that lie covers all of the Anti ISIS stuff he's not he's not ISIS. This is so embarrassing and a man yeah he's he's rotting in a jail cell there. How long you been there? Oh god, it's over. I think it's going to be on three months now and they, I don't think they even really charged him. Yet. Just like leaked statements to the press, but that aside. I, you know the political repression aside. I real! Do you find the symbol of marvelous city? No place is perfect. They charge it with.

What is his actual the what what is their grievance with them? What is the actual issue? He was going with these two british vice journalists and they were covering clashes between the turkish government and Kurds in the south in the pick them up doing that, so they just decided they didn't like MIKE buddies, doing causing trouble well. They then actually like deporting and fucking with a lot of journalists have been doing this, but I think I think it's like the two british guys got out. You know the British, whereas fear an iraqi Kurd like who's going. This is gonna, be the person putting pressure on Turkey for you, Moon, I'm sure, where the saudi arabian blogger that's been beaten repeatedly that right, the yeah. That's that's a horrible story too. That's one of the weirdest aspects of the United States for a relationship with Saudi Arabia So we will talk about all the atrocities that are committed by all these different countries, but Saudi Arabia

turn alarms Armada written like. Meanwhile, they like sent. They sentence to poet, to death for poetry in Saudi recently. How bad was the poetry, though, was it like death? JAM Slam comedy you know those things why you poetry, shading. Why are you free? Why you have body of the free verse? Shame right now. You know yeah prefer hands free version, free verse when you make poetry that doesn't like rhyme or have any meter or anything Haiku Haiku is a short one right, I'm not much into poetry, but I remember I've gone too. I went to a poetry slam in Venice once, which is the perfect place to go. 'cause people take themselves so fuck. It seriously and I was with a buddy of mine and we were high, as you should ever be, while you're in public walking around talking to people barely aware of reality and we walk by this place and it was a poetry slam and we like we have to go inside. We have to go inside, and we went inside and we're both like biting her hands, trying not to laugh because it was just so for preposterous. You know that really just

pretentious, save the world type poetry. I yeah. I I do. I don't have a twenty year old white guys with dreadlocks yeah yeah. I I do you I mean, I think, as a visual artist. I have a similar thing when I see like really really bad or at work, and I'm just like. Not only are you shaming yourself, you're, shaming, my hope fashion here, yeah. But you know what I also as I've gotten older and I'm sort of understand. The nuance of life like with this guy's doing his stupid. Shame shampoo slam, whatever poetry. What do you he's doing his run expressed himself and he's developing as a person of right now, it's kind of ridiculous to other people that are maybe a lil but more well versed in the ways of the world and with a more social experience. But he's trying to do is like he is the world is wrong and he wants to get social brownie points by pointing it out, and you know, and people clap and cheer and he's so he's shut down this loose leaf. Vine

here and wrote all this stuff out and he's just feels like he's really good and one day, he'll, look back then go what a fucking moron. I was just like I'll look back at. I have a comedy notebook from nineteen ninety and I should probably burn it in case someone breaks in my house finds it could do you know when when Bush is that, if you like, if you die, then someone will cook published the collected papers of Joe right thing a bit in there about wonder woman like trying to explain wonder woman, it's so bad, but I was you know I'm twenty one years old or whatever fuck, I was at the time. It's like that's what you when you suck and when you're yeah I mean it, takes awhile to get good at every so many years. I sometimes I look back at my old drawings and I'm like how did I ever get hired as an artist? What delusional process today ever think that I would be in just putting these things out there and again and again and again in the face of very deserving projection for many years, but it worked out right because, like if you just

to keep chipping away at it and actually eventually get through, and I really I tried to actually really right about that. In my book 'cause, I feel like sometimes a lot of artists they front and they act like. I was just really good from the start and then it was really easy and I was like no, I suck from the start, and it was really hard. Yeah most comedians will tell you that they suck from the start except the ones that aren't that good, which will claim that they were always awesome. I think all my friends that are that are really good. They will tell you they fuckin' newer terrable. I have Two young daughters and one of the cool things is watching their art like to really an art, it's worse than my seven year olds. Really, you know which draws every day, that's so cool and well. I would watch her Early stuff, like I save our stuff and I at least representations like you know like some of it and

watching like their early, like control of her motor skills are hands from time. She's like three to four years later, this just dramatic difference and what she's a bill? You know her ability to draw things and drop representations and and figure out like perspective and sizes, and we were going through this book yesterday. She has some how who draw figures book, and it was the weirdest fucking thing, because it was these princesses. It's just trying to draw princesses and I'm looking at the book. We're going through it together. And you know it's like one of those books where you have a framework. You know like there's like balls and sticks and you try to make the frame work and then you add the close to the frame, work and yeah totally, but the women's legs were like more than twice as long as they should have been when you're trying to do those like fashion

cartoon drawings. Everyone is like so stretched out and that's what's weird is that you get so used to seeing that that when you see like cartoon people done it there real proportions, they all look like weird and stubby yeah, but that's kind of too weird for because it doesn't seem that way for men like I was looking at the representations of men they're fairly proportionate, but with with women, it was all it's insanely long legs and insanely skinny bodies- and I was like this- is fucking strange so much so that I had a pointed out to her. You know she's, like you know, she's drawing it. I go well, here's the deal. You know, I'm like this is you can draw it like this? One of the beautiful things about art is you can do whatever you want? If you want to make people that have giant hands at her size, those phone number ones that people wear at a football game. You could totally do that. No one can stop use 'cause. It's just drawing is your expression, whatever you want to do, but if you want to draw like a real person, and so then we started started showing her like a real human body, I'm like ok, I'm going to stand up and I'll stand up next to the wall.

We're going to do is we're going to mark the wall where the top of my head is more. My waist is that's a network, yeah awesome, and so we went from the top of my head to the waist and then we went from the waist down to the feet, and I said you know, but it's like they're pretty much the same or at least close, but the women in these cartoon things you're supposed to draw were bullshit, there was twice as much length in their legs as there was from the waist up to their head and she was like well how do they do that? I could think some people think that it looks better to make people that aren't real. There are like longer than reality but like. Why do we accept that because, like if there was a woman and she had like a like a normal proportion body, but enormous tits, just freakish tits like every They would look at the angle. What the fuck are you making these kids draw you know, but for whatever reason like having the and when, by the way some people have freakish tests. Well, yeah there there is

there's people that, for whatever really is that that poor dude you can't go to the airport without getting fresh, because his giant hog has like some twenty inch deck like that they got the world's largest deck and like they, they always check as passive think he's carrying drugs or something well. There's women out there that are just naturally born with enormous breasts and there's nothing they can do about it. There's no one born with. There's no one six feet tall and only two feet of them are upper body and the if it is legs this doesn't exist. You know it's crazy and even when I was at art school we would have a different formula for drawing figures and there is like they were measured and had so. It's like this figure is nine and heads and a fashion figure what which what they called it, which is you know that take for fashion illustration, was like so many more heads than like any other figure, and so it was like that crazy along the native thing and exactly what you're saying with like the

is daddy long, legs legs, it's very strange because for men, I've never talked to a man who understands that look because men are not attracted, I mean I'm sure everybody varies right, but most men are not attractive to these? Stick figure people, but women are expected to be stick figure, people to be models, it's one of the weirdest things and then women think that, in order to be attractive, they have to be like these media representations of women, so they have to starve themselves, and then man like now don't do that. No one likes that, but like there's this weird disconnect between what the opposite sex or I mean I don't know. I can't speak for lesbians, obviously, but with the opposite sex finds attractive and the representations of attractive women like sucked in cheeks, basically like on death door like yeah, she's hot, like no, that's weird, it's It's weird to see someone all cracked out and skinning like that.

Being the most. You know the most obvious. Presentation of like a beautiful person in nice clothes I mean, I think it's You know fashion models, aren't for men, you know or they're, not for straight men, they're supposed to appeal to women who are buying the clothing do they even I don't. I mean I think you know, I think you know women of all sizes, skinny skinny, whatever I think I'll be super beautiful as long as that's really you yeah yeah, as long as you're, not like harming yourself to do it, but I think that I don't know. I think the idea is that you can just hang any clothing on them and it doesn't affect the hang of the clothing. So it's like almost like there is close to being like a coat hanger like possible. I think that's! The theoretical underpinnings of it but yeah. It's true like if you look at like like a playboy model or like a model for, like you know like a lot

men's magazine- or you know like a model for maxim like there like these super fit young women, you know who like have like really good like muscles, are really curvy. Yeah. So people like men are naturally attracted to women with a certain amount of body fat. It's a natural thing because to be health like the whole, you have breasts and butts and hips being attractive is because genetically women who, Have those things will carry children better? An will be more likely to be able to nurse those children, because they're healthy is the total generic things so much so this is the weirdest asp debit, so much so that if a woman has fake boobs, like you know, they're fake, you know, there's no disconnected all you're, absolutely aware that she has gone through surgery cut her skin stuff bags of water in the air that make them stick out like all, but they stick out more like men. Will be more attracted sexually, and this

sexual attraction is supposed to at least represent wanting to breed with that person. Like you, you are not just tricked you're tricking yourself like it's the web. What the what fake boobs are, one of the weirdest things of all time, If you really stop and look at it like we're. If aliens came down from another point or even historians 'cause, I guarantee you like. We were talking about like Bradley Manning and Chelsea Manning there's going to come a time in whatever not so distant future, the next one hundred years, where they're just going to be able to turn you into a woman you know you're going to say, like I don't want to be a woman anymore. I'd like to be a man make you a man for a year I mean like yeah I like being molly better. You go back to be a Molly instead of MIKE Marley and MIKE the Show- and I think they're going to be able to do that with breast, going to be able to do that with everything they're going to be able to manipulate genetics to the point where Have you ever seen a more listen to this radio lab episode on crisper? I haven't know what that crisp.

Is in a new method of manipulating genetics that they have invented. It's a really super complicated thing that I'm going to vote, but they've invented it by studying the dna of viruses, and they figured out how to utilize that that sort of method manipulate eventually at least human dna and the point we're going to be able to change your traits, the animated, email changed, so many different things introduce jeans into specific areas of your body and fix problems or change things that you don't like or going to I'm fucking freaky shit, and this is just one invention. That is, I think, two thousand and twelve. It was invented, and by the time two thousand and thirty two rolls around who the fuck knows what they're going to have. I think

we're really close to be able to just completely manipulate human bodies, but the point being when historians go back and they look at fake boobs are going to be like what the fuck, where these people doing like. How weird is this is going to be a Smithsonian that has like boxes of silicone, and this is the early days, and this is when they went to saline, and you know we're going to look at that stuff going what a strange time to be alive. But the thing is that, like with trickery and like matters of aesthetics, I didn't want to call a trick, or I mean there's all sorts of things like you can like totally like admire. I think I look looks really hot in a sharp suit. Even though you know it's not really his skin, you know what I mean it's, it's not there's, there's a whole like sort of visual appreciation of other people that doesn't necessarily just have to do with, like, what's in a quote, unquote real, like what's your genetic heritage. That's really true! What clothes are a great example of really good example. 'cause,

is weird. Like you see someone who's dress sharpening. Oh man, he looks great, not suit. Like that's, a beautiful vest wow. That looks awesome on him. That's a strange thing like you look good with stuff on you, yeah exactly could hang stuff on you. That makes you look good professional or authority over all of these other things, even though, like they're, just like stuff that you're wearing, I wonder if that's the truth, the same with hermit crabs pick out good shell. Like someone's, like I'm, wearing, like the really slick cool shell, like I'm, going to get all the girl hermit crabs right now, yeah, probably right There's some weird things in nature with animals, things like how about animals that can actually have you ever pay attention to Octopus at all octopi. You know, I'm like I'm pretty, shamefully ignorant. You might have to educate, here, I had will apparently cuttlefish or just as bizarre, if not more, but my Remi Warren is a he's. A host of a show book called apex predator, where they they

monitor they sort of try try to emulate the different attributes that certain predators have an how how they survive and see like if there's like some Hume, in version of that and and like check out like how it's called her and that those tall birds, her Herrans Aaron's. How do you say that heron herons like how they walk with their crazy long legs and then stab at the water looking for like frogs and shit, and he did well on octopuses an out of uh different animals we were talking about. He was like you know, there's cool animals. They were talking about like how wolves will chase down packs of Elk and how they of them canyons and draws, and how they figure out how to trap them. It's really fascinating, but when he started talking about octopuses like dude, you have never there. Fucking aliens like look at these things like look how they can change their colors.

This is real. They can change their colors and immediately adapt to their environment to the point where they are indistinguishable. From the background, this is amazing how old insane they're insane they can instantaneously like within fractions of second change, the outside of their body, to look exactly like a coral reef knot just in the image, but in the texture they do all. I think they can change themselves to look more like predators or, like Dane jours things, it's incredible what they can do. We live in the coolest world, my god all the world's amazing the world, the ocean still like, there's some new project that they're doing right now, where they're trying to map the ocean floor and without a doubt,

going to discover some freaky fucking fish life marine life down there that we've never encountered before, but just these creatures were just starting to learn what these things are doing. Like look at that, like a flower or something blossoming like a nun fast motion- octopus- that's not to, but it looks like it looks like a tiny like a wookie or something yeah looks like a video game, character running but watch this. It can merge with these coral reefs and it looks like a coral reef. So it's literally developed this ability to turn his body into the shape of a reef. Then it's little tiny. I mean it's. It curls its tentacles up into little tiny legs and runs on two legs. It's fucking incredible their amazing wow and look. It's like a teardrop shape,

that's so cool it. It's it's amazing. I literally just Octopus is just 'cause there like fun to draw with the tentacles and stuff, but my god I had no idea. I had no idea like the fact that they can do it like that they just change. And when a weird world- and they communicate with each other somehow through that- and we don't know how we know that really fucking smart, though, are they going to take it all over after we destroy everything, they are going to rule the earth I have been no, I really dwelling on lately when it comes to marine life and dolphins and orcas, and I'm I'm a huge believer that they are just as intelligent, as plus, if not more, and that what we're doing with Seaworld and all these wild dolphin shows is nothing less than slavery. It slavery of some alien intelligence that we can't communicate with we don't under and what they're saying so really

We can hear you, I don't know what you're saying so: fucking jump for fish or starve your choice and I've thought about it. Like our ideas about what is intelligent like we, don't think that something's, intelligent and less it does exactly what we do When we, when we think of intelligence, we say: okay well, Molly, send me an email. I sent her an email back. I know she's intelligent, she's, communicating through an email. The dolphin is not a fucking, make an email he's an idiot. You know, but they don't need him. Like. Why do we need email? We need email 'cause. We need to communicate well, they can communicate for miles through the water with their chirps and their noises. They recognize each other from for years and years being apart from each other, even though to us, they all look the fucking same they can move and manipulate through 3d space in the water. They don't need a house 'cause they're, smart enough to go with the water. Is warm fishes everywhere and it's freeze. They don't need jobs.

So all these ideas that we have is like what represents intelligence, all that stuff stupid 'cause to them. If you like well, I'm good build a house and drive my car to work till like what are you talking about bitch you're under the water I give you like I'm gonna hoard, all the fish. In my thing and and like kill them and then a like, sell you, the fish for Cal, that's a great idea. They bill like what you know the dolphin I'm going to write you a letter from my laptop with this new internet down your stupid. There's, no, like your crap Dolph, yeah, you're, you're, you're laptops, not gonna work on the water at all. It's good for all of our ideas about what's intelligent is only based on our ability to manipulate our environment or create things that didn't exist. So our intelligence is very bizarre intelligence 'cause. We we the only intelligence that can not just me Pulat our environment, that's local, but our environment. Globally, like we can we can. We can essentially change the weather. We can spray

Cloud seed and make it rain and put like that's one of the weird things they do in Abu Dhabi. They make it rain every week. They do purpose, purpose spray, the sky with some sort of silver, something or another. That makes it it. I don't forget, the exact compound is, but it it actually cause. Is it to rain and they've been doing it like once a week for years they have rain storms that they manufacture. We're freaks with freaks on our intelligence is fundamentally built on dissatisfaction, which I mean we have to have 'cause we're also like we can not APEC predators necessarily and we're getting weaker. I think too, I think that's part of it. You know if you went back to the early humans and you compare it like our 10s and bone structure and are they are they really humans? Are they? Are they stronger than? I was that they were like shorter and stuff? and those were said, there's not really humans right. There are a type of human in the categorized them yeah. They were way stronger than us, though they weren't just raw

Thus they were like really short. They were like five foot, five foot, two and but like two hundred and twenty pounds, just fucking gorilla like with super thick bones and, thick heads and and then they don't really know exactly how intelligent they were either this all the speculation as to whether or not they figured out too. On their own or whether they copied them from homo sapiens and aware homo sapiens came from and they interbreed and there's debate on that as well. It's and then they're always finding these fucking New found another one like within the last couple of weeks, They found another new species of human. We didn't know existed. They found some large tooth that turned out to be not category was a human tooth, but not categorized in any previous version of human beings that they were aware of before if they found quite a few of 'em. Now including the I'm sure you've heard of like the Hobbit people? They found the idea. Yes, that was fourteen thousand years ago,

That's not that long ago. No I mean that's not before the beginning of recorded history. Is it squirrel or is a little bit before a little bit depends on whose version of the beginning of recorded history is there's a bunch, people that believe. There's this guy that I have out of my podcast a few times now. It seems Randall Carlson and he's an expert in cataclysmic events and a special the asteroid impacts and him and this guy, Graham Hancock, have worked together and Graham Hancock wrote this book called fingerprints of the gods. It was a really controversial book in the find ease, and then now has a new one called magicians of the gods, which is it's of shows how much of his early work there was like widely criticized was actually substantiated now by science, where these ancient structures that didn't make any sense that they were trying to figure out who fucking built these like how how they hear an archaeologist sort of try to put like vague dates on them and the idea behind it was that

civilization has not evolved and not not on a a straight plane, but rather there's been these peaks and valleys and that what has happened is people have gotten this very high level of sophistication and culture, and then massive cataclysmic disasters have white people out almost to the brink of extinction and they've risen back up again. So, like sciences like found quite you have one of the big ones they keep pointing out. Is that there's somewhere around twelve thousand years ago, there was a series of impacts on the earth, and this has been proven by science now be over the last few years, they've discovered the stuff called. I think it's called try tonight, but it's essentially called nuclear glass, and exists around where they do nuclear tests, and it also at this at meteor impact sites, and it's the impact, creates heat that so uh pants to turn sand and rock to Glass God, and they find this stuff all throughout Europe and all

and it's all around the same time period, which also coincides with the end of the ice age, and it also well coincides with one thousand plus years later, that beginning of modern civilization, agriculture, mathematics and so their theory is that that wasn't exactly that. Winning is what that was a rebirth, and there was most likely one thousand of years of civilization existed before that, but it was almost entirely wiped out when people just bombarded with rocks in the sky, I mean it makes a lot of sense, especially when societies were less interconnected like the whole reason you know stuff various like Math or astrology survived the dark ages in Europe was because in the Middle EAST, people were able to keep it alive. We in the time now where, unless they literally wiped out, everyone would be very hard to do that, but in a world where people don't have that level of communication where they don't have that level of connection where they

Don't have that level of knowledge sharing. It would be very easy for one society to kind of get to that peak and then something horrifying happening to it and no other societies could carry on that legacy mean it would be pretty easy, especially today in our culture, because everything is become digital, so one of the weirdest things about us, advancing and evolving. Is that as things move to the cloud and ask things become much much less physical books like your book here, but much more like laptops and Kendall, I have a kindle and it has one hundred and fifty books on or something like that. It's that thin sits right in my back. Back. I mean the what that's crazy! It's crazy! It's like this magicians thing, but also you could potentially like drops server that the only copy of something and have that only copy disappear. Yeah because yeah and if the power goes out you're not getting any of this stuff. I had

friend, who is going back into an area where he couldn't bring books 'cause. There are checkpoints and had a lot of, and he had his Itunes account with something that, like just the country that was hard to you, couldn't buy. Good the books on September. I was getting him. I got him all these pirated copies of, like one thousand nine hundred and eighty four and like J Baldwin and catch twenty, two and stuff to read an you know, he only has like few hours of power and a and he's like reading like one thousand nine hundred and eighty four on his phone, and it was like the craziest illustration of both the like ubiquity of you, know a book and also the limits of it in the sort of cloud age. Yeah, there's a lot of limits of it. Our entire society is dependent upon the grid. If the grid was down, almost none of this stuff is effective, but by the same token, he could smuggle these books past check points, and no one knew he had them right now, NOME De mean there's there's death

only if you're in a war torn area like that, it's it's a great. It's just to meet free freaks me out. When I think of is something that happened like there was a big event. I think it was Indonesia in like seventy thousand years ago. They think that civilization was wiped out to the point of there being only a couple. One thousand people left on the planet. Yeah super bowl, interrupted. If anything remotely like that happened, we would instantaneously be brought right back to where people were fifty thousand years. Well, most of us don't have any sort of skills to maintain our rebuild anything. I mean I don't I I know if there is like the zombie apocalypse, I I'd be like fucking food or something and we broke into home depot like there's a home depot. That's like a few miles from here how many fucking people could get a hammer from there there's a lot of people out here, He is not enough. There's none of hammers yeah, I mean we. We wouldn't even I mean with hope, the shelters that we have hold up, but then we're gonna get food like water. In this we get into the ocean and go fishing

like going to shoot deer. How many deer are there like five in this whole neighborhood? You know like the level of population density. We have could never be supported by like traditional agriculture ever not anymore. Now it's weird you know what else is we? A friend of mine pointed this out? He goes. Why is but then, when you walk down the street, you see all these plants, but none of 'em grow food like everyone grows plants everywhere, but there are all these fucking useless plan. Like wouldn't it be amazing if, like cities were filled with plants that grow fruit and all the grass is Duffy Sour Edible, and there was lettuce everywhere Literally everything had food on it like you would be just same amount of water used, but you would actually get something out of it, but we're so rich. They were like no pine trees. No, I wanna oak when a beautiful okay here like we don't eat. We don't support the trees and the plants around us that we can actually eat

I remember one time I was in Spain. I was like seventeen and broke my my my friend, and we saw that, while he's hardinge trees to steal a lot of our in just a minute climb up the tree in like steel, the oranges and then we, peel them and then they're like bitter and Ryan like these are fucking decorative oranges. They tricked us the trick. Doesn't there there the oranges are lies, and I think that they specifically, we planted those type of oranges to avoid bad people like us, climbing their trees and stealing all of them is not funny you're, a bad person, 'cause you're doing People have done for the last exactly yeah bad person for picking. From a tray. How strange this is. It's also probably those what oranges really tasted like before. We start fucking with them I refuse to believe that that's a cruel world. Well, they they know that the fact for, like corn turn a lot of other food, was like really gross before people started, manipulating it truth,

truth? But oranges I want to. I want to believe that, like prehistoric oranges were tasty treat- and these were not- I don't know No, I ate an apple the other day and me and my friends were laughing we're eating. These apples were like these fucking things have definitely been fucked with, like they were, big big giant and they were so juicy or like what not genetically modified shit. Are we eating right now, because these are just not normal apples giant due? delicious apples, probably like the middle of apple off season, two yeah, probably you ever had a crabapple Molly Crabapple. I have a photo of me. Order crab apple tree, but I don't I don't know if ever for took that one. I don't know if I've ever eaten a crab apple and then I I I'm sure this will get remedied someday, but not not yet I don't think really yeah I mean I, oh no, you, oh my god, you're right got him getting like deep into the memory bank. When I was seven and I lived in far rock away, I think one of the

birds had a crab apple tree or it had the truth. Little apples are apples, crab apples, and I believe that I believe I stole some of them and I believe there very sour is that they remember them. Yeah there my shower. I ate one of those when I was a little more than once, I'm sure when I was a little kid growing up in Massachusetts. I remember biting into those things yeah so much hope yeah the good throwing at people, though, that we use them for when your kids chuck him at each other small and hard like yeah. Well, you know little tiny hands and get a good grip on the crab apple, India, Whippet, nice, nice. What else you got going on these days besides, I know you're promoting this book and besides that, so I'm going to really excited about this, going to India for a month, 'cause, there's all these literary festivals in India, so I'm getting to go to yeah, I'm getting to like Jeypore and Mumbai. Have you been before

not the first time in my life. So I'm really excited about that and then, besides that you know, I think I'm reaching the point of burnout where I'm just like actually planning to take a month off. I know it's a look for it sounds like a blast me, but I think I hate I'm gonna like lie on a beach in or something and read a lot of books and other than that. The only thing I really have to talk about is my super dork hobby, which is I've, been studying literary Arabic for the last year, and I got pretty good at translating stuff written stuff really yeah yeah, I'm really pretty proud of it. I do this every morning, so I'm translating like long dialogue by the syrian poet, that's called sex poetry in the revolution, and it is bad.

But other than that. I I think I'm actually going into that lake time, where I'm just making like a little blank space and then at the end of that, will probably be back doing a bunch of journalism for vice doing stuff, on prisons in the Middle EAST, working on my Nextbook project, and I don't know seeing seeing where life goes. 'cause thing, that's so strange about doing a memoir. Is it really is like sectioning off at chapter? You know like site selection off fifteen years of your life and then you've taken. All of that- and you put it into this book- form you've made it into an object, and then you go on to what's next and I I guess. While they have the vague contours of that in my head, part of me just wants to do nothing for awhile and then the plan will come to me. I think that's a great idea, I'm I'm thinking the same thing about my own life right now. I think I'm too involved in too many different things and I like it could use a reset like a calming. Instead, I think,

get that it's all good stuff and that's the problem, and I think that's what you're experiencing as well like you have so many cool things you have going on will awesome, I feel so lucky. But if there's no space I mean, can absorb them yeah. It's like that that Louis C k thing about like never being bored. You know I I mean I have that in the best of all possible ways that, like so many cool opportunities, but if you never have like any any time to like be border, be down you're, just like bouncing from thing to thing and yeah. I think it is the Louis CK thing about never being bored. I'm not aware of it. It was like a monologue that he had about where he was saying that, since we have smartphones based on that's right now, I remember it yeah scene

We have like any space to feel anything or to or to be bored, and so you just always in the state of distraction, and I think it can be like that with work stuff too. So after that, probably just probably just doing a bunch of journalism stuff. I work a lot with a really cool, um syrian american nonprofit that I'm going to plug here. There called out cut on the foundation and they Kram, and they do something really cool 'cause. A lot of attention right now? It's on the syrian refugees that make it to Europe, but they actually work with people who are displaced inside Syria, and then also people like on the border and for the last two years. I've taken part a program with them where we go down to the schools that are on the border and they bring like they bring dentist that fix all the kids teeth they bring. I doc, to get all the kids glasses that need it, but then they also bring like writers and philosophers and architects and, like you know, people who teach classes with

Kids- and I was I was- do murals there, I've done murals and two schools now and so next spring I'll, probably be back with them: painting lots of rebellious cats all over a school in SE, Turkey wow, you live. Which of of broad and fascinating life, mean I've had so many really intense experiences and all over the place like you built both all the place fessional in creatively, and then geographically this so going on, like you you're, not living a boring life. Now I feel so lucky That's why it's so hard for me to be that I need to take a reset because it's like the whole world is so big and cool, and I love so many things in it yeah, but I think I think your instinct Sarker so you just it seems to me like you're. Just you've got so much going on all the time constantly in so many different arenas. Yeah! It's it's a lot, but

I don't know must be. It must be the same with you too. I mean, like you know you do comedy you do this like super like thoughtful talk thing they host Emma Mae stuff. You mean you've done like so many fucking things, and I mean it's just 'cause like I feel in Peru. You feel this way like the world is just so big and weird and interesting and, like I just want to like learn stuff yeah. I wish I could live, tend it lives simultaneously. I have a bunch of different careers that I'd be interested in same same exactly, but it's to do any of those things correctly require so much attention and focus. It's almost like you can't can enjoy too many things. 'cause then the one thing that you enjoy the most or that you choose to enjoy the most. He really can't focus on it correctly. Well, she just never ever ever have downtime ever yeah, I'm close to that. I get close to that sometimes, but it's not good We are because, like mine on downtime, seems very recreational yeah yeah, it's like

super fun like I don't want to complain like wow. I get to travel all over the world and meet fascinating people and confront bastards, boo hoo for me, and yet you know it at a certain at a certain point paint. You know this is a big compliment, but and I don't mean this in terms of imitation but you're drawing of Trump and Ivanka was very Ralph. Steadman Oh I idolize that guy. I love him know that that's a massive compliment like I think that man is like a god amongst men, he's a bad mother fucker for sure, but that, image is just so much like I think of it. Like the Kentucky Derby, is decadent and depraved horrible, like the monster like toad people outside that I've got that on framed on my wall, my office, a print from Steadman Illustration of the Kentucky Derby,

we were not yet have you ever like. Had him on the shower. You know I would love to. I mean I don't know if he's ever in LOS Angeles, but I prefer to do these things in person. But if he's ever here, I would love to have mod just to talk to him about it. Huh turn to legend. What is life for time? One hundred dosed him with acid, oh when they when they went to when they went to the rumble in the jungle and hunter likes older tickets and and he was like drawing all the tv screen swimming in the pool and he totally fucked the whole story up 'cause. He thought that for I'm going to kill Mohammed Ali- and he didn't want to see it so you put a Richard Nixon Mass gone swam around the pool, yeah the uh, heat to this day or well, not this day, obviously is dead, but consider that one of his biggest journalistic failures and he went into a giant slump after he did that because, like he realized that his decadence and his indulgence gotten in the way of an amazing moment in history. God just to realize, like the fucking, like beautiful beast, that, like you, wrote,

to being who you were like was turning around and like the coming like sort of cliche. That was fucking up everything you liked it! Well, that's what did you- see the Alex Gibney movie guns the life and times I darkness is fucking incredible, it's so good. It's such a good documentary, but that was almost like, initially that's how they started movie off, he started the movie explaining that at the end of his life hunter, had really stop being creative. The writing. Wasn't there anymore the things that he wrote were like really middling there weren't that good, and it was because his indulgences and is accesses had really cooked his brain, and he just said he had become almost a caricature of himself and a long line. Some of the interviews they found him when he was a younger man and when he had started to become famous- and he was actually worried about that very thing. You saying like I can't even get out of my own way anymore and they don't even

necessarily when I'm. When I'm doing these things, I can, tell whether or not they want me and they want my take on things or whether they want reality itself like an I I'm I'm he is it's almost. It would almost be better if I died like for my own work, and that was like wow like this guy's, a key Sperrin saying, like a really early version of both also very rare that a journalist becomes that famous, so so rare, so rare, but I mean I think the problem was that he at a certain point. He stopped growing and changing and pushing himself, and it was just more comfortable to like stay in the mask. Yeah. No doubt yeah, I think, and also the indulgences in the substances became not just a habit, but probably physical addiction, and at that point in time, he's more of a slave to that, then he is even though the work itself in the work.

Itself is almost like something that he's eventually going to get too I'll get to that eventually I'll get that, but is just cocaine. We read off a list when Lance Armstrong was here yesterday of a typical day in the life of hundreds Thompson in stores. Oh god yeah. It just starts with like massive it does. It start with ether or coke. Does start start with starts it's like Chivas, Regal, cocaine, Dunhill, cigarettes, cocaine, Chivas, regal car. We like we read it all off, it's fucking preposterous, like you should be fucking dead, and then it says at midnight Interest Thompson is ready to write, and this is like, after getting up at three God. You spend your entire time like pouring like Lee, put into your head and then smoking things, but for a while it worked and he wrote some insane shit during that time he wrote some amazing stuff for it's almost like he just redlined his brain, never change the oil and kept the metal, and then this magnificent thing like happened until it like horrific Lee ground down. I gotta be boring and I

I'm really scared outta here, alright. Thank you. No, please no worries. Thank you. So much for come nah nah nah everybody drawing blood is the book I'm in the middle of it right now, and it is excellent in your writing- is really fantastic and honest and just really really good. Thank you so much you thank you and you can follow. Molly on Twitter, Molly Crabapple on Twitter, same thing on Instagram. Apple dot com go by the book. Thank you! So much Jeff Sassan Kamali by everybody. Thank you, everybody for tuning into the show. Thank you Molly for coming on an chit chatting with us. Thank you for Ting, the official cell phone provider of the podcast go to rogandotting dot com. You will save twenty five dollars off of any device or service. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you to zip recruiter, go to ziprecruiter dot com, Slash Rogan, and you could try it for free that zip, recruiter, dot, com forward, Slash thanks also to onit dot com, go to an it use. The code word Rogan and save ten percent off any and all Sup Landmands, dot, dot dot at and we're done. It's been a fun week. Folks. Thank you so much for everything. Thanks for all feedback, both positive and negative uh. I really do appreciate it and I take it all in, and you know no ones perfect, fuck things up. We get things right. We do our we move on. We hope to improve, got a lot of fun: shit. Coming on next week, though, I have a shrimp parade, we're going to do on Tuesday and if you don't know what that that's! When Duncan Trussell and my friend Doctor Chris Ryan, we get together and we just have a fucking blast that should be a lot of Thaddeus Russell be here on

Wednesday and brilliant professor in a really cool and interesting guy and, of course, the greatest funniest human being to ever walk the face of the earth. My brother from another mother, Mister Joey Diaz, will be here on Thursday, along with my other brother red band, we're going to have some fucking fun and then it'll be Christmas, and if you're an atheist, it'll just be another day actually sort of. I don't know what I am. I'm a non label non deity, believing uh, I don't not believe whatever got a lot of shit going on folks, lot of good stuff, so That's it that's it for the week. That's it for now see you folks who come out to the Bob Carr Theater this Friday with in adwords have never seen in his fucking hilarious it a travesty in the world. Not only that guys, not enormously famous Ian Edwards is absolutely one of the funniest guys. I know

one of the funniest guys on earth he's just a great great stand up comedian, an awesome guy. On top of that and uh promote me in as much as physically possible. That's do December 18th, that's this Friday night, so see you next week and uh bye, bye, big cast