On this, the fifth part of our series on Mormonism, we cover the polygamy-filled years under the leadership of Brigham Young, which resulted in the deaths of hundreds of people due to mass murder and negligence, as well as the founding of Salt Lake City.
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Hey. What's up everyone, how you doing be sure to tune in on October, seventh for a special episode about the upcoming movie zombie land, to double tap on the episode we interviewed the director Ruben Fleischer and give details behind the new film, don't forget to catch a zombie land up,
Alt Tab in theaters October 18th ignoble to escape to this is the last time gas on the left.
there's a lot of people. It's
give me Dru Hill
your own university, you gotta to be pretty smart guy. You know when I do agree. I am a smart.
Because you know as an axiom
I always live by. Some people say bring him young. I see
keep him young all right. Welcome to the last podcast on the left, everyone I am Ben Kissel hanging out who is Mark's parks? I bet they market so good to be back in the United States, it's great to be back in the states and, of course, we gotTa Henry Zebrowski over there. In LOS Angeles. You know, if a
girl dies. She sees to see Maine,
it's very scary, Brigham. It's very scary. It is scary, I'm in charge of the science department. You are huh, ok! Well, nothing can go wrong at that point. Good Lord I'd rather trust the doctor from the thing. Then
I'm young to be in charge of the science Department and trying to keep
The children safe from
the travesties it being sixteen years old. You know old and gross and passed,
for, like a spinster, those who just imagining
watching the leathery skin of a twenty year old girl right. Well, there you go, that's a little a little insight into what
today's episode is going to be. This is where the crime,
comes in specifically when it comes to our tale of Mormonism, which now we're on to part five.
If so, when we last left Mormonism Joseph Smith, the founder of arguably the world's most successful new religion had just been assassinated by an angry mob, while under locking key for destroying a printing press that it published an unflattering story about Smiths, polygamist proclivities
Okay, but here it is how much more scary is it if it was
if it's just a bunch of smiling people, hello, Joseph Smith, we're here to kill you now.
And everybody's got big smiled painted on protest signs. I mean that would be incredible.
Horrified, and so now that Mormonism's first leader was dead. Someone had
step up to lead the Mormons to wherever their next destination was going to be, because it was becoming obvious that time was about to run out for the Mormon settlement of new view. You might think that
vision of leader would be hereditary, as every member of Joseph Smith's immediate family were converted Mormons, but Jose's brother Hiram had been killed right alongside Joseph and Joseph other brother Don Carlos was dead.
Well, I tell you what, when you go to Heaven, there is
call number high. There is also mom sixty three,
old, thirty Hawaii,
I love it.
Lou reference day, you guys in Germany in Berlin, Mean Caroline visited the studio where Mambo number five was
order no Kim little known fact. Lou Bega German, wouldn't know that, of course, they also recorded like lust for life and low and heroes. Now horsh it. I thought you were about to say: we went to
Lou Bega's grave lies crisis and as far as Joseph's wife went
and her son Joseph the third left the church completely after an appropriate time of morning and formed a splinter group of decidedly anti polygamous Mormons and Emma eventually married a non mormon, but the only person in the Smith family who truly made a run for the crown was Joseph's brother, William, but William, had never been particularly popular with the Mormon
due to his overly abrasive personality, hi guys. It's me
William Smith, you wanna, see my collection of leather vest. You guys wanna see my collection to cloud shoes. I stole it from a clown hospital guys. You know you got a lot of good ideas, but there's yeah, I'm the world's loudest rapper yeah placement that there isn't it funky way that was rapper I'll. Take one of those
best actually well, as such, William was no match for the man who would essentially founded and built new view that man's name was Brigham Young, but before we get into the bloody reign of Brigham, let's acknowledge our source for this episode. Brigham young pioneer profit by John G
Turner. This book is an unflinching look at the life of that terrible man who took Mormonism to the next level, using tactics that honestly had a lot
more in common with Jim Jones than Joseph Smith's analog of L Ron, Hubbard
as we're going to see Brigham Young, a man of the people he's
simple man, he
the man who he can fix your crock pot. He could put his dick in the hole in the car
if you want to sure bring him young. That was one of those guys he's a very much pull yourself up by the bootstraps kind of individual who likes things straight and simple and dumb, but it was,
last time someone actually had bootstraps, I mean I do Doc martens, but that's why you have to be Schanke.
Bachelor, pulling yourself up by your bootstraps, but bring him
Also would you ever? What did you watch that thing? I sent you of the Brigham Young talking directly to the audience. It's like an old museum documentary. I was
able to watch it now. It just
song, is going like there's a lot of people disagree with the way I do things, but I'll tell you what there's a lot of people also could get them
smack. You have very, very old school, very intense for some,
and bloody reign of Brigham just sounds like a really cloudy day and then it pours from the Heavens Pintard, the Brigham Young,
going to Mormonism in one thousand, eight hundred and thirty, two back when Mormonism was still in its infancy. Young hadn't rushed to join Joseph Smith, Appan reading the Book of Mormon, but it rather spent a year ruminating its contents, trying to figure out if it appealed to as Brigham Young put it
his common sense. He literally was in guys who had the book he'd, read it and go
to see about that, so we had
some kind of New York accent. He came from the sky. Let me put on my thinking cap
it's a screw top '
so he's ruminating on Horsh it to make himself smarter, but also dumber yeah. Oh yes, but the thing about Brigham Young was that he'd, like Joseph Smith, had a bit of a witchy family history. Although Brigham didn't come from right hand, path, magicians, like Joseph Smith, dead, his family history was still steeped in the supernatural. According to family, lower Brigham's, great Grand Father, a Puritan named Ebenezer Goddard had been wickedly cursed by a neighbor.
Named Matt Smith over a property dispute. I love that so much like for like. Nowadays, you just pump your shotgun at your neighbor,
oh, I'm serious, but I love the idea of just cursing someone like you can still do it castle. Yeah. You do understand what we learn from Santa Moorthy. Yes, you can do it, but no, it comes back to Tri Fold unless you constantly are giving back to something what they yeah. That's the thing with saint deaths. You want so much well because of the curse,
The family's milk, spoiled far sooner than it should have, which is a pretty common curse. The hang papers from good darts desk disappeared and were found in a well completely dry, and the family witnessed a vision in there oven fire of their infants close by
being in the flame. They also received a vhs tape that said seven days. What is this?
Iron least the snakes from inside this. What I assumed to be some kind of pliable, would I tell you what the little chinese girl always inside show was friendly? Apparently that's a thing: they should
it Brigham Young, got the curse from the ring he would've just molested it.
And then all of a sudden, the rim and she's. Like I get back into the tv, please can I just go back to the well
this is actually worse than when I was going to do to you. You got me in the middle of a drink, just imagining just going with Rangoon.
Just like where, in the doll did he touch you ring? Do I just? Apparently, though, the curse was broken by a hard session of family prayer, but this story was passed down is backed to Brigham Young, which for Brigham made the supernatural presence of God and the Devil concrete realities here on earth. That's important, especially to the future. It's a very practical understanding of God and the devil. The way it could do twice these. Why
folk magic and all of these things were kind of directly embedded into this village lifestyle, because you really had this belief that you had an ongoing
conversation with whatever is
the veil. That would help you and
or hinder you if you're not doing things correct, so bring him young once you kind of get in that world
by God. The guy you can know that you're, just like five steps for Mormonism
Brigham was also raised as a strict Methodist to the point where he didn't even here.
Your music, until the age of eleven, and even when that's
moment came his father beat him senseless for listening. His father beat him for
hearing music. You are years are open holes
Like you have to fold your ears open, it's like it just hits your eardrums, but Brigham Young
ever the same. The way he described it was like when I first
to the violin at my first thought was
is that a snake singing with their nine oo,
I knew at two could dance
What is why? Because I grew up evangelical and the one thing
about the evangelicals they sing horribly, but they sing loud, oh yeah, why did they hate music I'll? Never understand this whole notion that music is bad. Is it just because it gets your toast happened yet man? I was a Methodist for like two years and I still couldn't tell
but I know there was no music in the church. That is sad from what I've seen it's about anything you're supposed
want to go to Heaven so
anything that is pleasurable connected to your corporal life is bad, because that proves that you could have
any sort of joy or release in this timeframe overall, supposed you're supposed to be shooting for the top that you are also very, very very strict. Yeah sounds like it yeah well, as far as schooling went, despite having a whole college named in his own
young never spent a single day in a classroom because he spent all of his formative years working on his family's rock farm, just like Joseph Smith. Sad. What all this added up to was a man who is hard, bitten, gruff and stubborn
but it also gave young the resilient spirit necessary to be the leader at that a weird front, your religion needed to survive. Even if Brigham Young was an awful person, it's almost like you had to be an awful person, yeah right.
But the thing about Brigham Young is that even though he ended up being the man to take the Mormons to Utah, he resisted leadership positions in the church for years and it took a direct command from Joseph to make Young accept polygamy, but once Joseph convinced Young to accept these roles. Brigham went whole hog and I think this is something very important about Brigham. I think he knew that there was a darkness waiting in his soul
Joseph Smith ended up being Brighams devil. It's very interesting because Brigham Young was Joseph Smith's bodyguard that was kind of what he had worked his way up to 'cause. He was a member of the apostles once Joseph Smith had started really delegating who was important
his inner world Brigham Young kind of became a guy that could be known for the fact that he had a
Leather, strap that if you had problems, he'd spank you with this,
sucking strap in full grown men like this is like him, spanking a full grown man in a field with the strap. You like this
God wants to hear, but you better you bring him, you better, be careful if you spank him too hard, it could make the sound of a drum which is technically music. And now your saying Skype in my own head who I'm hearing birds, I should count every bird
because even there talk to her singing, but this is amazing that he took to polygamy so hard
because, as you all mentioned on the last episode, he said he would rather be in the casket yeah. He would rather be dead than have sex with a bunch of women. Would Young knew he had authority
tendencies, and he knew that more often than not his answer to a problem with violence, so he resisted leadership roles and he also knew of his sexual appetite. So he resisted polygamy as well Brigham Young. I,
love this. This take because he did know is authoritarian tendencies. He did
sort of understand that intrinsically about himself, but also Brigham Young was he's not smart, he's cunning? Yes, he he knew that he could,
back and watch, because I think that it's not a coincidence that whenever the major ship went down around Joseph Smith, brick
Young was either on mission going in pulling in
people he was always separate the polygamy he waited like. So I think, there's almost say, there's a part of it is that he he kind of knew. There will be a time
for May is going to be a time. For me, Joseph Smith is a inspirational figure.
Sweet and he's pure and he's the true prophet, but I'm the guy that's going
I have to do all the hard work when it comes down to it and
all going to be very thankful for a man like me when it's my time so, unlike most call,
leaders. He was self aware. I think he was extremely SW yeah and I mean just it's like Henry said:
we've mentioned Brigham young watt. Twice this
Tire Series right, because Brigham Young was never there. When the ship went down, he was an important figure, but he was up to this
point of more of it now wouldn't column a goon, but he was,
I don't like to go a kind of like a goon, but he's more of a background figure like he's just making happened, he's not doing the sex. You work in a
words he's doing the hardship yeah not like Joseph Smith? Oh yeah, all these Mormon men doing all that sexy work. Now will eventually get to the violence that was born from Young's leadership, but after young accepted polygamy back when Joseph Smith was still alive,
young almost immediately married a new arrival in new view who was only seventeen years old, and then there was the story with the english girl, Martha Brotherton in Joseph Smith, store that we talked about in the last episode. Were young corner the teenager and told her that they could consummate the marriage that night and her parents would never need to know especially
If we do it in a colloquially, we call it the dookie maker that keeps you a virgin forever. I don't know if you've read that revelation it's
back to one of the thicker book now well, how well? How is freshman seminar at Notre Dame?
Learn if we do it in the dookie maker, it can be a virgin for life by the time of Joseph Smith, death, Brigham Young, had four plural wives. By the time Brigham him
self died. Thirty, some odd years later, he had fifty
you gotta get them waves that lives in every single area. Code doesn't work because it doesn't rhyme, but it's true.
Dole out of wipes, and although young had originally resisted leadership roles, he had been the driving force of the english conversion. Efforts that brought thousands to America plus he'd served on the high council for years by.
Time Joseph was killed so when it came time for a new leader, Young stepped up without hesitation because he tasted power and found that it was absolutely intoxicating, but it seems like Brigham Young, either didn't hear or outright ignored. One of Joseph Smith's last private communications, because Remember Smith, Proclaimed Polygamy,
need to be the curse that would eventually undo the Mormon religion that field, because he just came to talk about this last night, he? Finally, he emptied it out. He was like wow.
I made a mistake and of course Joseph Smith is one of his last revelations was what two in the pink one
in the stink and it seems as if Mister Young did not take that into account, and there were some in the church to figure Joseph Smith. Murder was the perfect time to do away with polygamy completely, but Brigham Young was not one of those people and the church splintered, but because of it, see the top two contenders to lead the charge to the next phase of its existence, where Brigham, Young and Sidney Rigdon rigged in wanted to take the church in a more reasonable direction, while young wanted to double down on polygamy and weird rituals, in other words, Sydney figured that if the Mormons were not perceived as outlying weirdos them,
people would stop trying to murder them, while Brigham Young rightly followed Joseph Smith, lead and thinking that it was precisely the weirdness that kept the Mormons together. Absolutely because it's a secret keeping mechanism that's been happening since the beginning of time, the secret schools you need to have rich,
tools and initiations that only select members can get too so that you can feel like there's an inner club that you want to be a part of it's like uh
with the sky miles. I think I did, but it's there. This story starts to get for
he very, very intense, because we're going to see the flip if the Brigham
song going to be sort of like what David Miscavige did with Scientology Brigham Young.
Thing is going to understand that we're moving this forward and away do we have to do
for the religion again, which will see next.
So when we cover the story, that's inside the book under the banner of Heaven, where that group is that
the same violence of this idea of we have to restore
the original original Mormon Church and every single time you go
You want to change it to make things reasonable. Well, we have to do, is actually take it even farther back
yeah right, and I would also assume, by going with the stranger outlook, with the rituals and all those things, all those things it
Here. Is that you're going to have enemies you're going to have opponents you're going to have people who are like this group is very strange and without that group
Mormonism has no power at all, and so Brigham Young began a purge. He first excommunicated Sidney Rigdon after Rigdon named Joseph Smith, a fallen profit, because the whole polygamy thing then Joseph's brother, William, was excommunicated for taking.
ART and Une sanctioned plural marriages. Yeah. I married this big pillow I made it looks like Ray. Are you call me from living? Galleon yeah says that problem I married a fire hydrant earlier today is that bad and excommunicated excommunicated wow, so Joseph Smith
is now Gerald Ford in the eyes of
and falling all over the place, so yeah
oh my god, oh my god
So we must be ready for mad magazine in nineteen. Seventy football was coming from Saturday night live from night
teen, seven thousand and seventy six, the last contender to the crown was James Strang, who claimed he was in possession of the letter from
of Smith, that name Strang as his successor, adding that Joseph last command was to take everyone to Wisconsin.
Or somewhere thereabouts yeah, but after straying started,
gaming revelations of his own Brigham branded Strang a heretic and excommunicated him as well, but quite a few Mormons had believed Strang's story. So when young forced out Strang he an thousands of disgruntled more
since went to Michigan and settled on an archipelago on Lake Michigan and are currently I looked it up. Arkham
you archipelago archipelago Archipelago is then, if the new resort, that Donald Trump will open loses reelection in Like Alaska, damn it,
that archipelago. It is
well, yeah you're from Florida. You know that yet yeah hell is an Archa Pelago. It's a group of islands. Ok, let's just call it that! Well, once Strang got there, he proclaimed himself king of Beaver Island, and he held that he held the title until now:
seventy six until Arnold Righetti actually claimed king of Beaver Island at a resort off of the Turnpike in Newark
no kidding wow and from from that day the t shirts, big Johnson.
Created and everybody had fun with golf puns about testicles in per time, Strang was successful,
even rose in the ranks of political power serving one term in the Michigan House of Representatives, so they
literally? Was it king of Beaver Island? It was on the ballot because I have money- and this is my best friend he's the Duke of Beaver Island yeah, shoot it pushing
not trying to let him talk a lot.
Images he's here for flavor he's bringing in the southern boat yeah that sounds about right, but just like Joseph Smith, Strang took his authority too far. He had one follower flogged for adultery and he excommunicated another for getting drunk and soon afterward. These x followers formed a conspiracy,
with two others who were also unsatisfied with strings rule. So these four men followed string to a dock at the harbor of Saint James and shot him
the back three times and pistol whipped him afterward for good measure. Three weeks later, the king
Beaver Island died from his wounds. Wow
Abraham, Lincoln of Cult leaders, king of
Beaver Island is gone. Just like game of bone
but the Strangites were only one splinter group that formed after Smith's assassination. There were also the rigged, a knights who followed Sidney, Rigdon that Joseph fights who followed Emma and Joseph, the third and, of course, the Brighamite's who event
they won the crown, but in the immediate aftermath of Joseph Smith, murder at the Brigham were in no way safe, the Illinois Governor Thomas Ford.
Possibly allowed. The assassination of Joseph Smith told the Mormons that
they're on their own, but the only thing for did do was travel to naboo to calm down the
anti Mormons who were selling to finish the job they'd started with the murder of Joseph Smith, but since Brigham Young had heavily armed both himself and the new View Legion Ford revoked the new view. Town.
He remember the Nauvoo Legion was not supposed to exist anymore, then, with the new
the new View Legion was just like they were not supposed to have a militia, and so he had to keep
everything on the down low, which is as we're going to go further and further. The next episode these little secrets,
very important to Mormonism, and so
No view Legion became something else quite like the danites were, which was super secret like holding
like planners that are just like rifles.
I mean it's like you know, bouquets of flowers that whips another like stuff like that to hide it, but they all were very much hiding in plain sight because they knew they had to be flashing pieces to be safe.
So sticking with another nineteen seventies reference. My next reference will be in the nineteen eighties. I promise the governor was sort of like the dean warmer from animal house. He revokes the charter ha and next thing you know blue does out there trying to get a whole bunch of girls yeah. They are on double secret secret probation,
But even if you think this is the part of, I guess really remember that yeah
member that with Ben Kissel. That's a new good show places you go and remember that one member, clear Pepsi.
You could see right through it, but even though Ford didn't actively seek the deaths of the Mormon people, he also knew that having Mormons in your state and never tablie lead to violence, so he petitioned,
isn't James K Polk to lend him a militia, so he could give the Mormons alight little poke to get the fuck out of there,
and that inspired the Mormon girl Series later on, for them to all receive a light. Little poke and a series of documentary films, no stubborn as Brigham Young, could be. He wasn't
stupid. The brutal massacre at HANS Mill was still a fresh memory and Brigham's own brother had witnessed militia men blow off the top of a young boy's head during that slaughter. So young sent scouts W over the american border to find a place for the Mormon.
Permanently settle, but while the decision on where to go is being made mob, violence against the Mormons in new continued Mormon homes were burned. Mormon men were within the streets,
and Young never went anywhere without a six shooter, lest he be challenged and murdered on the spot for being Mormonism.
New leader and he loved every minute audio ie. There is a. There is a thing here which it could be
the best violence, is what's going to fucking chase the matter in a view, but bring him. Young technically was the right guy at the time because he loved to fight Joseph Smith. Didn't really like he like to lead
and he loved his the love being a king of his own little world
bring him. Young became a fucking, folksy general yeah right all right. Well, if you are getting whipped in the street again flip it
and reverse it drop trou get hard and let him know you're, happy and baby. Yes, spank me daddy you're, my new daddy baby, I'm your baby, but still Brigham Young,
slow down on what freaked people out about the Mormons most polygamy, yes between one thousand eight hundred and forty four one thousand eight hundred and forty six young married thirty, three women and consummated at least a few as the year eighteen. Forty five gave him three different children from three different wives, eventually, Brigham Young's offspring would number bent give get
yes, thirty, three wives, thirty three West guess how many kids! Yet? Okay, let's figure they each have. Let's say three: kids, I'm going! Ninety nine you over shot a little bit. Okay! Fifty six! She added that's a lot of come. I
Honestly, that is a lot, but now
each ceremony the exact same yes for because I was thinking that would be very
if your wife, twenty nine and you're like I want a better wedding, Weddington, wife, twenty eight.
Then it's like you, gotta go up next to your on Mars for wedding. Thirty, three yeah
so we're doing our scuba wedding, I am dressed like listen. Do we
need the charger plates,
do? We have to have a candle for each table. Can't we just do some sort of like I can't
I'm not envious of this at all
keeps people honest within the Mormon World, because it's a big secret. We all have to keep. But you remember, though, Marcus you saw
how reasonable Brigham Young was because he said
everyone. It became a marriage spree throughout all of the the world of Mormonism, so everybody's getting married, married everybody, but he he said
turn down the man who wanted to marry a twelve year old because that's just not right or they have to make it to thirty?
that's the unlucky number, oh, my god, playing roulette and even though Brigham knew the Mormon
days in the view were numbered, he never stopped building the Temple that Joseph had started and that ten
cool still stands in the view today, you can go visit. If you want it now, it's now a chick fil, a no it's very sacred still to Mormonism, and it is there and we've had several listeners, send us pictures of it and is beautiful. Looking alright see, as I said, Brigham Young learn from Joseph Smith at the thing
who is going to hold the remaining Mormons together, was the rituals and considering how every other splinter group who abandoned the rituals died off. Young was absolutely correct. Young even introduced rituals of its own that Joseph Smith had partly crafted before he died, such as the law
adoption ritual in this, a man with seal to another man in a father, son relationship to replace lost family connections that one may have suffered as a result of converting to more
some look but to but how human centipede, how do you feel a man to another man's ceiling? Is you can ceiling? Is that their word for it like they? They don't say marriages. They say ceilings like is
It's not that it's not like that would be stuck on stuck on you or whatever the hell. It was no! No! No, but if you can pass a piece of gum
one but hole to the next. He becomes your father forever. Really how'd. You chew this gum so well.
Thing, I learned is a young pioneer lad. It was a trick to get native Americans to leave us alone and young established this rich war by saying that he had spoken with Joseph Smith in a dream and in that dream Smith had given him all the specifics to finish the rich wall. That Smith had started
spring, I'm not that be indicted. Everybody, that's what I was saying: it'd
What I had on the shoulder, your daddy? No! No. That is only know that, interestingly, though,
This ritual was discovered in eighteen. Ninety four, because being adopted by high ranking elders in the church became nothing more than a status symbol and it usually cause jealousy and conflict between adopted sons and biological sons. It's also a colt mechanism,
yeah of replacing your family yeah whole thing is to create a network and which
don't need outsiders. We have everything that you need here
we have a new daddy, Mommy
it don't matter not in,
Brigham Young's Mormonism. There is no mommies in this world that anybody gives a shit about. It's all daddies, because again it's the priesthood is handed down from. Do do do do do
yeah. So it's like not only a few of the aaronic priesthood and then the Melchizedek priesthood you're also like
Nu Sunt, a new daddy that is Brigham young. Who is the new profit?
so you are like bound and sealed until all the power structures of the religion, I'm just surprised that one
These thirty three women didn't all come together in Terra Brigham Young apart in his bed like the conclusion of the film mania.
With all of the corpses with all of the ghosts of the women that he murdered as they kill him. It's a great conclusion to that. By the way I love that movie maniac Great movie, where young believe that this ritual the law of adoption,
tool was vital in binding his people to the religion, an to Brigham Young as a leader and in eighteen. Forty
Young seal himself to thirty eight young men before the exit is to the west, began cheese and cleverly Governor Ford figured out a way to jump start that exodus much earlier than it really needed to
art. Eighteen months after the murder of Joseph Smith, and just after the Temple in the view was completed, Thomas Ford told Brigham Young that the federal government was coming to arrest young on counterfeiting charges,
It was a lie: Awat! No, no, but Governor Ford was getting tired of the Mormons dragging their feet, and he was only using this as a peaceable solution to get these people to fuck out of his state. So he could stop dealing with constant mob violence. He was coming up on two years of dealing with this yet and honestly,
which is pretty smart move. It was totally, but no no one died as a result of this and the Mormons just moved on alright,
to get him out of there. It's this cancer, that's growing inside your bullshit. You are watching this because it's just the thing you have to constantly deal with and also at the time the country's just really beginning to fall apart, yeah, because we're now we're now getting close to what is it fifteen?
they're about sixty seven yeah about the civil war about fifteen years or so yeah, okay, problem
as though the Mormons still didn't have an exact location picked out. All Brigham Young had was a vague notion about upper California, which back then encompassed modern day, Northern California, Nevada, Arizona
and, of course you talk. That's a lot of land. It's a lot of California, all the Mormons really new is that what they would most likely have to cross the rocky mountains at some point, which was naturally going to be an arduous,
and possibly deadly journey for quite a few of them. But Brigham Young had learned a thing or two from Joseph Smith about manipulating people. Young told the Mormons that a lack of unity and obedience amongst the people was what had killed Joseph Smith and if the people straight again,
actions would likely kill. Brigham young as well also bring literally lined up, is thirty. Three wives, like the mean woman from troops of Beverly Hills, member, the trips Beverly ever
another 1980s nineteen eighties. Yes, it does leave the area he's. Just like listen, my thirty three wives, some
will be coming out of this alive, but got damn it we're going to go on, keep on going we're going to make it an upper California
and what we learned, though, about women in Pioneer times they live yeah
the Donner Party they fuckin', survive because I think breasts
give nutrients back to that when we female listeners, if you
make your own milk and you're on a plane
Does that mean you never starve to death because you could suck out
their own tiddies and 'cause you're, making your own food, but they are still dirty factory, though so, if they're starving, then there's not there's no milk! Oh, I don't know no you're, both you're both wrong
I'm on my right now there's a simple scientific explanation. For: oh, my god. Ok, tell us about lactation, Marcus lactation, it's about being able to store fat. Women's bodies are
to store FAT
it is a child rearing thing. It is absolutely a child,
but you said it: that's why we're extra juveniles, but that's, but that's a big reason why women can survive in the frontier times and why they survive starvation in the Donner Party much longer than the men did social logical thing. Judging by two slash three of this podcast men can also store fat
It is also a hard
Yeah I mean one time in Carolina. Got lost in the mountains of upstate. New York wants and without her I may have died,
yep. Thank you
the entire time. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Now the United States was alright
well on their way to acquiring the mexican territory of California by the time of the Mormon Exodus, having already acquired Oregon from Great Britain that same year and President Polk actually figured that the Mormons would be a good advance team for the Oregon territory, so young lent the government of Force of Mormons who made up the Mormon Battalion, which is still the only US military unit to ever.
Exist based solely on religion. Yeah. If you try to make a satanist battalion, it would just be a bunch of guys all just walking and differ,
directions going to whatever is the closest Spencer's ticket, whatever skull that have
for Halloween decorations, but it's nice to be in Halloween sees the Brigham. Young did not want to do this, but he erroneously believed that President Polk,
add three thousand Missouri militiaman just over the border, ready to wipe out the last of the Mormons at Brigham Young refused to contribute men, but pulk was actually somewhat pro Mormon, because the Mormons had helped him get elected, so young's assumption had no basis in reality, but this was only the beginning of a paranoid streak in Brigham Young. That would eventually lead to a massacre in Utah. Think about this dick US government.
Told you, I okay, you can go we're going to give a group you guys it's going to be a whole group. You guys that are now an official army of the Us Gov, the: U Dot S fucking military y'all can go and sober
I'm young is going to get a surprising amount of power here he is allowed.
Just go and explore. I mean like they have no clue what the hell's going to happen to him out there, but he is getting first dibs on new american territory,
This is an old dream of Joseph Smith's to them.
Brigham Young is also making real of creating a separate Mormon, an entire either, hopefully country
yeah at this point, they're going to slow play it and say yeah will help you investigate your new territory and help you map out your new states, but we'll see what happens when we finally decide to sit down, because we know for a fact you're just about to try to fucking kill my s so while the Mormon Battalion
was exploring the Pacific Coast, Brigham Young and the rest of the Mormons temporarily settled in Nebraska on a site that eventually came to be known as winter quarters. Here, Brighams paranoid streak turned violent for the first time he began. Punishing an expelling quote. Unquote: sin
there's because he hoped to arrive at the Mormons permanent home with a purified church. This meant that Bruegel floggings became the norm at winter quarters. On one occasion he ordered the caning of several teenage boys for quote acting inappropriate towards. Ladies, although no specifics were
as to what actually transpired? This reminds me of that PSA for drug use. With the kid, this is a 90s reference where the kid is lying in bed in the father finds the joint, and then he looks at his father's music. I learned it from watching
What did you catch? You like the audacity of Brigham Young to be like you guys, are treated women appropriately, wife, twenty
don't scold them! Brigham, Young's. Hypocrisy knows no bounds.
This is my stool life. Ok, if you you're not going to take my stool, why for me Becaus my boot wife, she
really wraps away around my feet and I walk on top of it. This is important duties of a wife first,
denied, even knowing that the punishment had taken place, but he soon turn a full about face and told the parents of the punished boys that they were lucky that Brigham didn't kill him.
Wow. The Brigham Young wasn't doing this because he had the utmost respect for women. Young in fact believe that women were vastly inferior to men. This is a direct quote from Brigham Young,
a woman is the dirtiest creature dirtier than man, man or honest? If a woman won't lie, she is a miracle
Let me grab my chewing tobacco from my asshole or when I come by my immerse. My man purse well
when it came down to sinners, there's a kind of a loose definition of centers 'cause. The big thing was that Brigham, young
it's also incredibly racist, and so on. The trail like as they were going. He wouldn't even allow people to fraternize with anybody
browner than somebody from Utah-
so like why they were very. He was deeply deeply like. So that was one of the ones he saw you fraternizing, with a black person you get beat
I saw you speaking with the woman you get beat.
If he saw you being lazy. That was another thing too. It's 'cause. The whole thing was to inspire this. Much like again go back. Go back, will talk to the Jim Jones Kind of thing. You keep people tired! You keep people scared, you keep people working, he had them purposefully under FED because in order for them to get across
the the rocky mountains he says. Well, we can make it on this little amount of supplies, so people were starving. They were just literally pushing for can be huge wagon wheel, carts over rocky Desert just to get across to where they need to position to where the rocking
That's? Where that it's like he started understanding that these are the kind of things you keep people. You keep people on a very short leash. When I worked at burger
I'm fairly certain that the female manager was a great descendant of Brigham Young, because she was extremely racist. She would say war she instead of wash and then, if she would say, if you're leaning, you should be cleaning and then I really want.
To murder her, but I think she's still a manager at Burger King in Wisconsin
So that's how you hold your power and young wouldn't hear of anyone having a differing opinion. He doubled down in winter quarters on his obedience policy
saying that dissenters would be sent to Missouri. Where quote their head.
I'll, be severed from their tabernacles tavern
another word for body and their stems shall be removed from their water balloons.
I Brigham Young also believed a mixing a little sweet with the sour 'cause young made sure that the Mormons had plenty of
parties just so long as those parties followed all of Brigham Young's roles and here's one extremely surprising thing that I learned about Mormons over the course of researching this series. Mormons are fantastic dancers. What, in this tradition, began in the days of Brigham Young? It is
huge part of their heritage into this day, the Brigham Young University dance program is among the best in the country and Mormons absolutely dominate competitive dance.
Partitions. What kind of dancing are we talking here? They pop and lock him or they do in swing? Are they doing Riverdance back in those days it was square dancing and
Adam Young did not allow people to touch each other at least body to body. They could touch hands, but in recent years the beam
you program has loosened on those roles and they are allowed to touch each other.
Why you dance program is huge, open gigantic thing: yeah! That's good! That's a good thing! It's it's like a lot of jazz dance, yeah,
ok, so a lot of like flappers and that care bug, you know, know, know, know, know jazz dance, jazz dance is kind of what you'd see if you're like. I only know a little bit, because my niece did competitive dancing. So there's a lot of the like
Nano name: halter tops for some reason, infuriates me or speed thing them like fly girl,
from in living color. That would be was on the
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dot com enter left. So in one thousand, eight hundred and forty seven Brigham young and one hundred
fifty Mormon pioneers left winter quarters and headed w with the expressed purpose of finding a permanent home for the latter day saints and in June of one thousand eight hundred and forty seven, the group ran into,
famous mountain men, Moses Harris and Jim Bridger. Now both of these guys gave conflicting advice on an exact place to settle, but both agreed that the perfect place for the Mormon
was Utah, guys, you're, gonna, love, Utah, Utah,
It's flat is a new bride in his pointy,
as a new husband. What did they also didn't? One of them did they tell them stories of the Donner Party? I believe the remain
They met somebody that had seen the survivors of the Donner Party. This was the sum this was the summer after the Don
Oh my god. Ok, the the Donner Party was like the winter of eighteen, forty, six eighteen, forty seven. This was the following June.
And there was a mormon guy that had kind of scouted out to California. He gone all the way through and on his way back, he had met some of the survive
the Donner Party and he came back to the Mormons and be like, would you guys be careful
be careful in Diego S, go s she's, gotta Florida come on now there isn't really any big secret or revelation surrounding the decision to settle near the great salt Lake, the best reason for settling there was because nobody else wanted it in the Mormons believe they could live there in peace, but there were more subtle cult, specific reasons for settling there as well reasons that whole. Quite a few parallels to the decision, Jim Jones made to move the people,
simple to Guyana. First of all, you talk was totally isolated, meaning that once you arrived, there was no easy or safe way to leave
second Brigham Young knew that life in the SALT Lake Valley was going to be exceedingly difficult, which he knew would bind his people together. Even further Jim Jones did the same shit with going and settling in the jungle. He knew
people going out there and tearing down trees and building all these huts, he knew that would bind them together because it was hard work right. Furthermore, if life is hard- and you have to work every moment of the day just to survive, then you don't have the time or energy to think about how shitty your life really is, which keeps you complacent, if not utterly miserable right, and if you already have a christian streak, you believe you do.
Yeah and that's what he is constantly there's the the theological side too, we're being like this is suffering for the pleasures of Heaven. Yes, you're here to build this thing, you're going to take deep, fucking salt,
Sir and we're going to create a mecca for Mormonism in the center of it, and you will be your doing and what you feel proud. What do you feel proud once you die when you
Fifty seven is all you've done is break apart, rocks with your hands your last thirty years, your life for your good, it just been sent on the part of the plane are Monica. What would we went to SALT Lake that they did a pretty good job of,
very pretty city, it's insane things that they fucking did it
like they, they pulled it off. Like SALT Lake City is a beautiful town. It's fully functioning.
It's a good, I mean yeah. I like SALT Lake City, Sherman, full moon, but the thing was Brigham Young almost didn't survive the trip. When the Mormons arrived on the site that eventually became SALT Lake City Young was barely conscious because he was rude
covering from a bad case of Cala Rado tick fever? Until you want, you bring me that chicken I get me my scrap, I'm gonna spank that
take your interest and what it's done to Maine
just cut to the ticket and rock hard, but like yes, daddy and your daddy, no daddy
Amazingly, that was the worst that it happened. The expedition had been a huge success, because young had taken a hundred and fifty people, one thousand mile,
without any deaths wow. It has been three years since Joseph Smith have been assassinated and Brigham Young,
had finally brought the Mormon people to the place they still call home to this day, SALT Lake City and by the next fall. The original number of one hundred and fifty pioneers would swell to four thousand damn, but from the beginning, young Stroh for autonomy from the United
states he immediately declared that no officer of the United States would ever dictate to him in this valley, or else he would hang them on a gym it as a warning to others.
Got a whole pile of Jim and I gotta bunch of children at whole pilot Jim, it's weak to dawn upon them like ornaments on a Christmas tree which I'm also not allowing because they're gay, oh and the kingdom of the Mormons grew rapidly. Within ten years there were over one hundred smaller settlements between Utah Lake and Ogden, all of them populated almost exclusively by
Mormons in Brigham Young wasted no time in realizing Joseph Smith, dream of a functioning theocracy. He governed the church and, by extension, all of the Mormon settlements like an israelite judge, presiding over criminal cases and settling marriage disputes, which is again filling
now the original idea behind Joseph Smith, which is that 'cause, he said old.
Things like Solomon, where the king is heavily involved in all civic matters, where you
like he goes. Yes, he sets the fuckin' policy, but also, if you have a domestic dispute, you
bring it to him. He settles it. He does
to Marys who he is, he is very deeply.
French in every layer of their society. Much like
Saddam Hussein or when those people would put pictures of themselves up everywhere
You go so you're, constantly reminded of who's. Your fucking boss. This whole thing with King Solomon being a great king. His big idea was to chop,
baby. That's all he did was like who's. The mom, oh, you guys are both months chop it in half and will see, and then it's like
Obviously the woman who was like no, the other woman can have it then he's like you're, the mother yeah he's like Maury Povitch. It was a clever idea. I guess right yet, but if you were a woman and you have to go settle all of your disputes with a known sexist like Brigham Young, you kind of know, you're, screwed, yeah, well, Brigham Young also had a fucking filthy mouth, both in public and private obsessed with ship. He was like
I was at Jim Leahy from Trailer park boys when everything was a ship metaphor really yeah concerning the bill.
The Mormons were racking up. Brigham, said quote
our church debt
Shitan Church dead God he talks like Fucking Slim Pickens. He really does, but at the same time young also ordered canings when his people swore because young, if anything, was a fantastic.
Tick, hypocrite, ok and that's his worst crime 'cause there,
nothing worse than being a hypocrite. Yeah. There's a few things worse than being a hypocrite, but young was also overly confident,
meaning that he was the only man in the valley who understood the duty of armor. He knew more, though,
anyone about farming and blacksmithing, and he knew more about merchandising than anyone alive, really
search and icing merchandising and he had all this knowledge because he had dreamt
into reality, but Young's further dream
of a Mormon nation started to disappear in eighteen. Forty eight, after the Treaty of Guadalupe,
Bay Hidalgo, oh God, Marcus you've literally. This is from
social studies. I'd just had, like my eyes, just crossed my thinking about trying trying to understand this kind of like trying to remember. This is obviously a question. I got wrong. Unattested bucking high school. I actually wanted to quiz Ben. What is the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo
Guadalupe Hildago. She wanted to wear pants and they said no no, and then they made a treaty
that she could wear shorts. This is great
people in their college, dissertation yeah. Well, for those of you who didn't pay attention,
in high school honestly do not know the half of the modern Day United States used to belong to Mexico and after the mexican American WAR, we were given almost everything from Texas
California, that's the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo.
Me. I'm a idiot, Mister Burton all right yeah, I like saying I will make it is black and white said specifically you'll. You can't just joke around for a living, and you know if Mark says, he's he's passed on, which is actually wrong, that it markets and I went to high school together. If you like he markets, can you just move over a little bit to the left and put your paper to the right? I'm just so. I can, like you know, just
see if I'm correct, huh yeah, it's not a big deal that would be fun 'cause. Then it turns like you got some joints overnight right and you would say I have got some joints: yeah yeah. Of course a party man see I bring the good times after we both get to pass the exactly that we celebrate yeah. No, no, it is a quid pro quo might turn off, but the inevitable conflict between the United States and the Mormons was still years away and young was quickly establishing a bloody,
Terry and roll in SALT Lake City, all based on the doctrine of blood atonement. To give you a quick refresher on the doctrine and how Brigham Young used it to justify murder. The blood Atonement doctrine said that apostates anti Mormons and thieves,
could only be saved by ending their life on earth, which would give them a chance at redemption before they had the opportunity to send even
more so it's state sanctioned suicide. Nobody's calling for this shaking murder state. Is there going to kill their religion
Religion sanctioned murder, hi, pre, emptive, saving a person's life. The way it could be interpreted is that if you look at people that you believe are on
bad road. If you see them, is that you can
as a sign of God's love, murder them as a
way to release them from there? What they will then stumble into
more and more sins that will make them further and further away from
the goal of getting to Heaven, but it's so yeah- isn't kill
and someone to send that you're doing it for the blood atonement Kissel.
If they, if they do it, it's legal, it's like being president because they're all a priest 'cause also remember true right, but that's a bit, but also each man in the Mormon church at this time is a priest of the church. So they are given intrinsically these high
there are power, said say like well when I act on this, like what we talked about with ISIS, I think just privately. If I act upon this in the
some of the Mormon Church, I'm already a mormon priest. So that means it's legal,
That means it's totally fucking legit human mind is a powerful thing in this doctrine came into play an one thousand eight hundred and forty
when a young man named IRA West was brought in front of the high council for fraud. Now Brigham Young's initial reaction to the evidence was to order a public execution, namely
heading now, officially bringing coffee begin sweet. It's looking good! Lord, no officially Brigham Young back down an IRA W received a judgment of a one hundred dollars, fine and excommunication, but even after the judgment talk of beheading IRA W persisted in high council meanings. Now it could be that the Mormons just let it go, but future behavior suggests otherwise see discussion of IRA W possible execution abruptly stopped in high council meetings and IRA W disappeared from history immediately thereafter. It is also possible that it was the Mormon
who killed IRA W rather than the establishment of o cing blood. Atonement. Young publicly hinted that maybe someone will be doing IRA favor if they murdered him before he had a chance to continue his sinful ways. Yeah, it's it's!
very interesting to see how, but this
you see how this policy would become, like so firmly entrenched
and in Brigham Young's. Now this especially this time period he's going to fucking come back to this again and again and again, this is his favorite atonement. Yeah an Brigham Young was very good,
just putting it out into the world. He just put it out in the world and then, when it came back when an actual murder came back, he's like
I didn't do anything, I'm just saying saying: I'm just talking, I'm just I'm just saying things I'm just talking, but he is putting this out. This blood atonement think he's putting
out into the world over and over and over again
telling. The Mormons this is okay right to a group of people. He is
your BT into into yes. So he is
Don done. The legwork,
create a little army that he can then just kind of hit Chitat
and everybody so up their own asses to make sure they can anticipate. Brigham Young's needs to make sure that he's here
we make sure that their religion and all the aspects of the religion are filled, that they just jump to it. Yeah in this almost casual talk of murder when it came to apostates and Anti Mormons was also brought up in the journals of other high ranking mormons such as quorum of twelve member Erastus, know these guys were talking about it in their journals that we're talking about it privately or like this thing is true. This thing is good in this thing is righteous, and these were just for petty crimes. The Mormons were, if not, then definitely later, murdering people for crimes no more serious, then theft
because the blood Atonement doctrine allowed them to do so. At the same time, Brigham Young was settling into the life of an established polygamist by one thousand. Eight hundred and fifty young had twenty children and he built a long row of log cabins for his twelve
favorite wide supervillain yeah, oh yeah, she had fun, that's a fun little apartment complex, I'm certain. There is no sign of real housewives of SALT Lake City happening inside of those little log. Cabins must have been a strange competition there to get that to get in one of those log
but some of Brigham Young's, other wives ended up despising him. One Augusta Adams, sarcastically referred to him as Lord Brigham, his Excellency Mister Proxy and Alien for Brigham's part young, just ignored the wives who didn't like him and eventually seven
of them would dissolve their marriage. Is one former wife, Anna LISA Young wrote in Expos called wife number nineteen in which she claimed that the danites that we spoke of in the last episode regularly murdered dissenters and church enemies?
and from what I've read the danites are still functioning within Mormonism and that it's not no one speaks of it, but it is. There is a group of people that
art, Essentia Lee, like a Mormon secret police that go in handle these things, break
young understood that he needed to have
a main army. He knew that his militia, and then I mean this is
far and saying it, but then he had to have his ss. He had to have his smoking group of secret police. He needed to have a group of people that would do the dirty work that he just can't really come out and say for you to do, because he can't come back to
profit, because, if it does with that means, is that we're setting up all these kind of paper trails for somebody
to come around and fuck with me at some point. Legally they'd be able to so. Basically
Brigham young is Tonya Harding, just suggesting to Jeff Gillooly and his goon buddy that maybe Nancy Kerrigan should be taken out and then, when it happens, tiny just like I said I don't, I don't. I can't believe that actually happened, but I can already hear the reactions, because danites that good is a very controversial top
quit in the Mormon World, especially in modern Mormonism, because they do not like talking about that being a an actual function of the church
and they probably just about the Mormons, don't like to talk about their secret? Please don't want to talk about their seat belt. Please. He really don't don't huh, weird! Well, the danites
It's something that a lot of Mormons say is just rumor. They say that a lot of it was just create.
Dead by people like analyze, a young, and there was another guy who actually wrote a guy who supposedly supposedly a henchman of Brigham young Denna henchmen that he wrote like a whole memoir. That was a bestseller.
Back in the day, but you know modern, Mormons and a lot more than say like oh well, that's just who we and if you can't believe him
can you believe, will polygamy was set to become a big part of the new government? Although young had not yet publicly supported it, see the Mormons wanted to form their own state, which they called Deseret
named after the Mormon word for Honeybee Bee and President Millard Fillmore
I love that he is so funny with his little comic strips. Did he die fast? No, that was the one that died in thirty days, wondering there with Harrison yeah it's night nineteen days. I think he gave a speech in the rain with a brave boy, but he didn't realize that Medison, Israel yeah when the Mormons want.
From their own state, or at least their own territory. President Millard Fillmore surprisingly just said whatever
Do you want, I don't care and he appointed Brigham Young as governor
he made him entirely in charge of the what the n Upper California territory they let him.
I have it because essentially it's like alright well, you guys will maybe figure out some bullshit
because we haven't set up all of this stuff and Brigham Young's like yeah
did you see how many toilets I put in you'll be surprised when they go to my bedroom, so President Mala
Fillmore, Millard, Fillmore, Mallard Fillmore is the editorial cartoons, which is by the way horrible, but so Mallard Millard, Millard NAILS made him governor yeah
give me the Novo he just like whatever yeah do it. I don't care, but it came with a catch.
Since the Mormons were now a part of the government. Millard Fillmore sent a federal employee named Ullman Babbitt to oversee the establishment of the new territory
and young immediately dislike Babbitt, for what Young called his quote: fancy tastes, Ann Pettifor,
Okay. What is a petty fall? Yeah it just you just wash with soap. Is it just the the action of being petty, butted Patty fogging? Is the S very fun word whatever? Really, though, what Brigham Young dislike the most was that he was now a part of a bureaucracy he now had to answer to people.
He is no longer a king, yes and Babbitt was calling the Mormons out for some of their shoddy clerical work when it came to free and fair elections. To this young said quote, and this is a di,
quote okay. I would rather stand here and cutthroats and suffer lawsuits in technicalities if you
interfere with any of my dictation in the elections it will be. The last
You are shooting in my dish and I will look it out and
you too buddy, he didn't add buddy
Obviously, but it works though you were shooting in my dish, and I will lick it out. This is like straight up out of an Adam Sandler script was like. I eat pieces of shit like you for breakfast, you eat pieces of shit for breakfast. This starts to sound like it it's what's his name from. There will be blood, no Daniel
yeah yeah yeah. We he is, he he's a plain speaking man,
Dogmeat, know I've, never, honestly we're playing speaking man. I have never once been like outlook.
Straight out of a dishwasher keep on shooting in my desk. She did my dearest mixing. Should I
this, should I brought from home you're, bringing some strange man should into my ship dish all eat it too. That's just a warning of how hungry I am going to come to a shift lunch. Do we have any actual evidence to bring among truly was a scat man? We know we don't have. We don't have like pictures of him yuming up on some. Do cocaine are over him like underneath the glass table, but I did see him. He did write one of his journals we bought up, but up
well eventually, though, Brigham Young's forceful personality, one out as it would dozens of times in the coming decades and Babbitt sided with the Mormons
Others in the government, though, saw how dangerous Brigham Young actually was, and they left the state convinced that he should be removed from power. This partly had to do with the fact that in eighteen, fifty two, the Mormon Church finally went public with polygamy. Ah in August of that year, Brigham Young admitted being a polygamist in the Deseret NEWS,
which is the same paper that later broke the skin Walker Ranch story, cool cool. What young said was that he had more wives than one and he was not ashamed to have it known. He argued that the Mormons had every
right to be polygamist, because it was not only a religious freedom issue but a territorial issue.
As well states rights. He went on to argue that if Congress did not have the
ready to legislate? Which states could have slaves? Then Congress could therefore, if not legislate, which states could practice polygamy and speaking of slavery. Young had no Prob
whatsoever in legalizing it in the territory
Brigham Young literally, was like well. If you could own slaves, then why can't I own women
slaves. You see it's like the same thing: marriages like slavery. If you think about it, that would be think about how you equivocated that's how he rationalized polygamy. Well, here as it was more like, you can't, legislate slavery. So you can't so you can't tell people what to do with other human beings.
You can't tell me what to do in my marriage, in fact, it was young's virulent racism in particular that kept black people from obtaining significant rank in the church until one thousand nine hundred and seventy eight, he loudly and openly declared his support
slavery and was quoted as saying that if a white person message and ate it with a black person, the only way the white could achieve salvation was an old fashioned beheading, but
Byu actually is a great dance program and that's and that's what we should be talking about right now. You click great dance program back to dance actor. Death yeah, in fact, in eighteen, sixty six, a group of Mormon men, murdered a Mormon former slave named Thomas Coleman, just for courting a white woman Jesus. They slit his throat from ear to ear so deeply. They almost decapitated him and sliced open his right breast as well, which mimics the penalties we talked about in the last episode when discussing Temple rituals, but what the argument really came down to when it came to polygamy and states rights and all that
was at Brigham. Young didn't really even believe that he was a part of the United States. He still believed that the Mormons were a sovereign nation,
That was a goal. That was the goal all together.
Or was it go and make sure we're completely isolated because in the end you're going to have to come and get us anyway
going to bring us back in the fold you're going to have to fucking send people
Henry mentioned ISIS before an. I know the Mormons are not ISIS, but this is a califate yeah and honestly Brigham Young had the population of back it up by the end of one thousand. Eight hundred and fifty two, there were twenty thousand
Mormons living in SALT Lake City in the surrounding settlements, and they even had their own currency and young was not afraid to order death and destruction in the name of his people.
Even though early Mormon Doctrine held that native Americans were worthy of conversion, because remember native Americans can turn white
If they really want if they hold member. If you hold your breath long enough and breathing really hard careers, you can even turn blue, but even though you know Mormon Doctrine said yes, you should convert native Americans. Young had no problem in casually killing them on one occasion he ordered the murder of a large number of utes after he became friendly with a rival. U, chief in this casual attitude towards the murder of the utes trickled down to the Mormon Rank and file outside modern Day Provo, a group of settlers murdered a ute after they claimed he stole a shirt she's. Then afterwards,
to open his stomach filled it with rocks and some come to the bottom of the Provo River. This provoked a small war with the. U people and Young declared every you man, fair game for murder. Although the women and children would be spared, if and young's words, they behave themselves implying that if they didn't, you kill them too, and the Mormons heated Young's word in February of eighteen. Fifty a group of Mormon Militiamen, disarmed and murdered a group of youths and chase down the ones who tried to run and murdered them as well. The Mormons even decapitated, the corpses and sent the heads to Washington for
medical research in the Mormons killed the utes in indirect ways as well. They cleaned out Utah's natural resources which cause starvation and they spread deadly disease all over the terror.
Which is how we always seem to fully beat down
The native Americans are weird english disease, yeah and, of course, the the way that we just tread.
Pull over their lands with things like a Keystone pipeline which still happens to this day. Oh yeah, it never ends. Finally, though, Brigham declared peace with the utes, while also petitioning the government to create a ute reservation. An that reservation would have
actually become the site of dozens of Skinwalker sightings throughout the next century,
interesting. I love how all these things come together, yeah. So I love history but Brigham Young this again, but this does is yes, he made peace, but this slowly dehumanize
this is the gentile anybody who's, not a mormon it slow.
Would surely shows that Mormon lives are worth more than anybody else is life, so it sets a price,
and eventually it leads to what we will cover at the end of this episode, but that's not to say that Brigham Young had forgotten about the actual religion of Mormonism, although it seems like polygamy, was really becoming the focus here right in eighteen. Fifty three, the Mormons did break ground on the great temple of SALT Lake City, took him decades to build the damn thing, but eventually they did but at the same time
Young also built a new residence for what wives could still stand to be in the same room as the lion of the lowered. That's what the Mormons call Brigham Young, good, Lord and the house- is cool
yeah 'cause. They built the house he had like 'cause, he had his house did
the one where he stated by himself, which was, I guess, the nag-
free zone and then he'd go over
There is other house the main line and house we had this big lie in statue on the top of it. It was kind of dope look at all right, very Al Bundy of him, not surprisingly, Brigham Young was
quite liberal when granting divorces when they were requested by women, although that may have had
more to do with him wanting to get rid of excess wives than it did with any sort of progressive view towards fee
agency, whatever you think, whatever thing I'd ever accused him of being very
progressive thinking it just whatever helps him yeah so he's just like here here I get to sucking horse yeah get the hell out of replace it with a new wife and a second, and then you could argue that a dookie fetishes progressive in its own way. But although men
almost always rewarded custody of children. Young looked
on on men who requested divorces, he said quote and again
This is another direct quote.
When a man married a wife, he took her for better or for worse and if
push it in bed and laid in it until noon. He must bear it. Mister
not just going to say, Sir
they grow to love it because sometimes someone
There's some wires that will chit just because holy and consensual little funny.
Little pillow or duke, underneath him there there's role in it like it's. A bunch of chocolate frosting that you get from a graveyard smell of a freshly shift covered white. Much about follow,
Still, sir, just let
Florida on here I mean it. I mean it and not delete your selves. Did the smells of her buttocks venture. You see you all of them and it's just it's her love language for you and that went on to become the great documentary fart K. But what Brigham had very little problem with
granting marriages to men who
the Mary? What were? Essentially children? Young approved the marriages a fourteen year old girls without hesitation, but thirteen year old?
that game a little pause see so little paws
these days now. He did approve the marriage of one hundred and thirteen year old, but gave this caveat go ahead, but leave children to grow
Oh yeah, that's more disgusting than all the shinto belief chilled, so he recognized so. But that means he recognized that that is a child and then he's
but yes you marry her and for uh- oh, oh god, listen
I understand you want to marry her, but let
inflate a little bit and also have to recover the six year old story that Italia great Story inside stories. This week I have
how many emails we got of people who, like you, know
six rolls can get pubic hair. I don't talk about that. Other side story. It's good. Lord. The only time Brigham Young flatly denied a request like this.
Was when a seventy. Three year old man requested a marriage with three girls aged twelve to thirty
Now the thing is you're. Seventy three. This is
now. If you were maybe forty five, oh sure I mean you're growing with these wires. Why would he do key on the side of my mouth, because I had a lot of it this morning, however, it must be said that even amongst the Mormons at this time, polygamy was relatively rare. Usually it was only the men in leadership positions who are allowed to do it, while the rank and file had to remain satisfied with singular marriage. Well, it had ACE mystical connotation as well. You add to goodwill,
learn a little bit from all of the but the hermetic side of Mormonism. Is it your building, an army of wives, fear after life, and it's also mimicking the celestial marriage of the fifty planets?
slash human beings. That came can wear the uh
little things that came out of the Kabbalah nothingness God that that that marriage and consummation of that.
Search created worlds. So it's that, where Jose
Smith, who is way more ensconced in the actual mysticism or bring him young
it's all about. Like you get this special thing
because you're one of my inside guys. Ok, strangely, though, polygamy was becoming a political football in Washington DC. Remember the civil war was only about a decade away at this point and polygamy was being used as an example of what darkness could come with territorial sovereignty interesting, but on the process,
very side. You know had senators who were forced to defend polygamy, because if the pro slavers agreed that polygamy should be outlawed than the pro app
listen aside, could catch them in a clever gotcha. So if we're going to be on the wrong side of history, we should be on the wrong side of like all his
you you know we
we're doing a lot more of his own God, washing with pests.
Cause? Yeah I mean uh I mean no one should be able to tell you not to do it, but it's raining it's just. It's sterile and if you been drinking a lot of creek water, sometimes it doesn't smell as much like this, but I learned something episode of this television show friends that actually Piscon can heal you if you get bit by
but really none of this seemed to bother Brigham Young. All that much. He was much too busy moving on
the next phase of a successful cult leader relieve
his followers of their money and property. Now that his followers were suitably isolated, he reinstated the previously failed principle of consecration, which requested church members to give any wealth and property they didn't quote unquote, need to the church.
Wealth might be re distributed now, of course, very little money made its way.
To the needy are Mormons, and this was not mandatory- is less than half the Turk participated, but the
Women still gave enough where Brigham Young lived in high comfort for the rest of his days. He became a fancy
What do you mean Marcus? I thought that money was given to the church. It wasn't bill for infrastructure, wasn't gonna, be there. We I mean they didn't put up streetlights, they didn't make bigger baptism
yeah, that's for everybody to get into really do it in an express cutaway or you may have made bigger bath. Actually, let's see that oh, the opera glasses that Brigham Young, but
oh, the carriage
bullies, ensconce tin, leather, that Brigham Young roll around in and that's a private jet by today's standards, steering one moved from SALT Lake City to Provo, Brigham Young was said to own.
Several tons of clothing and furniture as well as a harp and two trombone. The thing is
I love Dukie naked, showing your shirt gets on your jeans. We can't wash it out so you need a new page. If you need a new shirt,
which is why I'm switching to an all brown mom
chromatic sort of high fashion choice. He became Elton John yeah, oh my god. Eventually, young was worth the modern day equivalent of
million Jesus as his people are dies, starving, being broke. Working their asses off to build his church
working really hard. But he also Bic
Does he spent so many years thinning the herd? I think that what he actually did was breed a community that believe that all of these things were proper and just yeah, so he actually he kind of funneled it like he did a thing.
The the more you you take out. The strains of dna that are going to be people that are going to question the apps
The lewdest Authority of Brigham Young that you make it so the actually are happy coiling
and building a community for God, because they believe that they are the only ones who have direct access to God. I know my church love
the sentence in the Bible in the Bible. The meek will inherit the earth, which is not true,
and also I'll, never forget, my mother. When I was about twenty five, she said she called me and she said Ben. I think money right.
Might really matter so yeah,
capitalist society. It is God well. The thing is that Brigham Young
it's not the only one getting rich off. Of this I mean there were:
a lot of Mormons that we're making a lot
money out there in SALT Lake City, casino, bigger man was still, he was trying to build a society. He was trying to build. It was not just about him; it was also about leg.
He was trying to build a successful country. He was like Biggie smalls given end
his friends. You know he was trying to start a whole enterprise. Yeah, you got it. You got to have some people that are happy yeah, but Brigham. Young's greed also resulted in a massive amount of death, see there were still thousands of european immigrants coming to SALT Lake City, and there were no railroads just yet to easily bring all these guys out west. That was post civil war, so Brigham figured that the most cost effective way to bring these
People to Utah just make him walk and in order for them to bring all their ship with them, make him pull.
And carts that they have to make themselves across
thousands of miles of american Frontier, no matter what
time of year. I mean that was when the first I see was created
person who had the first ic truck. Remember those I remember, though yeah but Marcus. You understand they got to, at least by the hand.
Making IKEA like set up from the Mormons first now yeah. So that's important.
Provide these things that,
I had to build yourself and he did
this whole series of like be pitched. It would be like you can make
it across the one thousand miles. All you need to do is if you can really push it up to
I need to thirty miles a day you can make.
So easily, like he peed. They had a whole kind of program where they meet you at the first leg of the trip, if you like
Missouri yeah, I'm like here you go, go out there buddy you're, going to love it actually beautiful mountains. Beautiful view
nothing most incredible trails, your all of your entire trip to SALT Lake City and then all of a sudden they get them out there, and then they are fucked.
You imagine trying to put together an IKEA Cart with thirty three wives. Looking at you like you're, quiet yeah, I mean these hand cards. They were just made of wood,
no iron involved, because iron was just a little bit more expensive,
even though iron was the thing that they needed to pull these carts across the in half of the fucking country walking across half of the country. Oh, it was a thirty mile a day journey that lasted sixty day.
On average, and these were mostly city bulk from England,
I have no knowledge whatsoever on
to survive on the american frontier. Now I can't tell if his card is rickety or if it's my bones other way, I'm tired as hell now many of them did make it, but one expedition in particular resulted in dozens of deaths, just like the Donner Party
expedition left too late in the year and they didn't make it to salt Lake City before winter hit many died from starvation and others just drop dead on the trail while still pulling their carts. It got so cold out on the planes that fly
began freezing and falling from the bones of the settlers and, although
there is no known cannibalism. This expedition, which is now known as the handcart tragedy, had a death count that dwarfed, that of the Donner Party wow out of the six hundred converted Mormons, that set out for Missouri one hundred
an fifty died before rescue wagons met them with more supplies, and all these people died trusting that the Mormons who met them in Missouri knew what they were doing and but, as far as Britain was concerned, no
this was his fault. Oh really, oh yeah, weird! Isn't that strange? He said quote marsh
skirts are clear in their blood feud
I have suffered severely, though so
yeah their feet and hands more or less frosted. More
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from Northland? Now, like Joseph Smith,
Brigham Young, never took in the more extreme violence himself. As far as I can tell, but unlike Joseph Smith, Young relished in ordering violence and blood atonement was becoming a deeply held belief of the Mormon people in October of eighteen. Fifty six, a group of Mormons castrated, a welsh immigrant named Thomas Lewis, after he'd, almost killed a Mormon with a shovel, but it wasn't the attempted murder. The gun castrated, see a local mormon. Bishop was competing with Thomas Lewis for the affections of a young woman and that Bishop had ordered the castration. While Thomas Lewis was being transported from one jail to another okay, so Lewis was dragged out of the wagon a blanket.
Put over his head and they cut out his leaving him to bleed and suffer before someone found him four days later. What was it about Newt? He took your new to
oh, yes, as I look down, I see they took your nuts. That just makes me miss,
Welsh, cakes, okay,
but he was from Wales
yeah. I know that part
I work for balls not so go buck. Well soon, after that, Brigham Young explicitly ordered the murder of two horse thieves, saying that they were likely to spread false rumors about the Mormons in California. Although those men did end up escaping building on this proc.
Another bishop decided that murder would be the best solution for a former Mormon who is supposedly planning on skipping town because of unpaid debts to other Mormons, with these fucking Mormons should even be talking about unpaid debts,
It's only gonna make me think about your body, never pay it back every day, trying to make up their own fucking cat and he wasn't going to be killed
'cause he's defected from the church. She would be killed for skipping now, according to the blood tone,
this man what
It was good. I just feel myself becoming Paul Scheer from Letterman, and I don't know I'm not sure. If they're not, they murdered him for skeptics for skipping I'll go back to playing music according to the blood atonement. This man was an apostate which, by extension, meant that he was fair game for murder.
And before this particular incident was said and done, that man and two of his associates were dead, who you think that
this rampant. Vigilante murder would be what attracted the attention of the US government. But what really pissed off Washington was nothing more exotic than political appointments. What
in what newest government doesn't react to something that everything is obviously a problem as soon as it fox with their jurisdiction. It seems like they get really really mad about a weird anybody. Twelve people have died from vaping, ok and if we don't clear the streets of these chunky clouds, today, every child will be dead by twenty twenty one c Brigham Young wanted and all Mormon Legislature for the territory. He wanted that to be a law, you had to be a mormon to serve on
territories legislature, and he told the US government in so many words that he and his people would not accept anything else. Now. This is not what you'd call a time of peace for the country. This was one thousand eight hundred and fifty seven, the Dred Scott decision had just come down
Eating Kansas was in full swing over slavery and government officials were literally beating each other with canes on the floor of the Senate back when they were honest, yeah
that's what they I think they just get it out. I do believe that the it because that's what we like about watching a lot of the: U K News when they really get to scream at each they've, Harlem it yeah they really
need to get it out. We need to set up like a wrestling thing where, like Lindsey Graham, could get himself a cat harden and he
get in there and let's see who's willing to get at him. You know I mean if there will end up tangled with the lens real he's got. A full like Lindsey, Graham, would be a lot like Andy Kaufman wrestling with the ladies had to takedown his erection, but, of course, he's not wrestling. Ladies use wrestle in men and on top of that, the government now had to deal with the Mormons out in Utah
actually being in open rebellion against the United States. So President Buchanan sent two thousand five hundred troops to Utah
to remove Brigham young as governor. In response to word that the army was coming, Brigham Young reinstated the new View Legion, recruiting boys as young as fourteen to fight a trained military force and he started covertly stockpiling ammunition. But while all this was happening, a tragedy struck, the Mormon P
That would send shockwaves through all of Utah around the same time that the army was mobilizing Mitt Romney's, great Great Grand father, parley Pratt was murdered in Arkansas. No,
oh, no, it's bad
Oh, no, I'm going to light a candle will turned out part
he had married a woman in Arkansas who was already married and when Pratt and his new wife for in the process,
of absconding. This woman's first husband pulled Pratt into a thicket of trees
have them three times and shot him in the neck dog as well.
This man, you out in the plugin pan dude you're out in the fight. You don't expect some guys gonna kick, it could get you bro I'll, give it a little bit of statistics, sick, sick, sick, sick things trying to come up with my peace dude. I don't know why it applies, but you can't triple stamp a double stamp. All had good, at least that did that is 90s there up into the 90s. This is great because you're starting to sound like a bathroom reader, I'm hip, I'm cool. Two thousand. You know that's ninety six, also not yeah! Oh wow! Now this action, the murderer, Parley Pratt, didn't necessarily have much of an effect on Brigham Young personally, because Pratt had married outside of Youngs authorization about the murder of Brigham, said quote now I was glad for it, for he paid the debt he owed, but young was also never one to let an opportunity pass, although he believed that Pratt got what he deserved.
He still used the murder as inspiration to pump up the Mormons. Comparing it to the vigilante murder of Joseph Smith and Young needed his men ready, because the army was well on its way to Utah. This was fucking, SIRI
yeah dude and they were. They were coming and he's
camping it up because so part of what he used the one. The first wave of this ship was like no trading any goods with gentiles. Nothing outside no old anymore
fuqing acquisition anything we have. They want we're, not selling it to anybody. So first he shut off that that vein, where he
he's pumping it up, but then he keeps turning up the heat just to see how much
so far the government will go and this whole thing was perfect for Buchanan, because you can
and was hoping. The Mormons would distract the
free from the whole slavery thing
you guys really was still thinking like others- is going to calm down
like this, is all going to is all going to blow over. We just kind of got to make it through the hard times, but this is one of those like wag. The dog bulshit like it's, always been this way yeah. It's always been this way. They use this issue as a distraction issue to say, like we're going to wipe out this cult. It's taken over our states and, like that's a whole thing that everybody can rally
I don't think you understand. Henry twelve people have died from vaping. I saw a map and there was. There was red over every state because every state has had complaints about. Vaping has had complaints, yes button, so guy
take immediate action. I don't know what's going happen when I
the family of Joe Camel
and I pray for their family and what they've been through will mean
the Mormons were battening down the hatches Brigham Young was preparing for total war with the United States, instructing his people to clear their feel.
Quote: to bury strangers in damn they've sort of burden down their crops and shipped yesterday, it's like they were like go fuck it we're going to have like when they come here. They are going to find nothing yeah. Damn
and claim that the Mormons will be able to kill as many soldiers as the government was willing to send, and he fully prepared SALT Lake City for a seven year. Siege telling his people that the final war of extermination was coming. People, in other words, were freaked
out yeah. He added, and this is fucking long for a
so. This is also good, because the government is really common for you. This is
John Wright, with the fucking senator showing up to the people sit like this is this is huge and he's getting them all ready. Cuz again, I just bought seven years of fucking full on cult
because now you're going to prepare for this this whole like for an entire siege, and now I
He really got. You got you yeah, but the mass murder at that was coming to Utah would not be committed by the Us Army nor with the victims of said, mass murder, the Mormons rather the Mormons, would be the perpetrators and the victims innocent men, women and children. In other words, it's a finely time
to get into the mountain meadows Massacre director to him all right in September of eighteen, fifty seven, a group of one hundred fifty odd immigrants from Arkansas in their
wagons were passing through Mormon territory on their way to California. No Mormons were none too trusting of these people from Arkansas, seeing how parley Pratt had just been murdered there and since the opportunity for blood atonement for parleys murdered necessitated a trip to the other side of the country, the Mormons. Suddenly felt pretty lucky to have a convenient proxy on their own home turf. The wagon trains first encounter with the Mormons came in Nephi near Central Utah, a local bishop requested that the train move along because they were destroying his winter feed pastors and soon word of Arkansas settlers in Mormon Territory spread the Mormons also refused to trade with Arkansas Company because, as Henry said, Brigham Young had forbidden all trade with the Gentiles. Due to the up
coming war with United States, and this only further the divide between the Mormons and everyone else. It set them completely apart. They were sitting ducks because they showed up with all their bullshit. They have there
entire lives in these wagons and they're, trying to get through and they're getting like
did you know what you're reading to for a while. I really believe that Mormons were Brit, did very accepting of people because they're trying to pad their numbers. So do you showed up thinking like like we
get to the harbor with them will do all it can ship and they were just getting a surprising amount of cold shoulders as soon as they arrive lot of side eyes. So the Arkansas Comp
He moved on the corn creek, where they traded with a couple of you. It's somehow a false rumor after this trading got started that the Arkansas company had poisoned both the creek and the ox, but they had to
get to the local tribe. We're also began to spread about how the settlers from Arkansas had wagons loaded with valuable goods worth about a hundred grand in today's money. But what happened next is possibly the most debated subject in existence amongst
frontier historians. That's because nobody really knows the full truth about the mountain meadows massacre. Now Larry Mcmurtry does a fantastic job.
Trying to undo the knot in his book on frontier massacres called oh, what a slaughter we really loved it, which was helpfully recommended to me by my father. Thank you dad, oh very nice. Mister bones! Thank you! So much good, sir, yes, but not even Mcmurtry, could come up with anything definitive and while we do know where the mass grave is, the state government of Utah has routinely blocked attempts to excavate it and forensic least
The remains come on only once in one thousand nine hundred and ninety nine. When the gray was first discovered, did forensic scientist get their hands on at least some of the remains, but only a tiny fraction of the bones were examined before the governor, who just happened to be a descendant of one of the massacre participants,
shut it down way weird,
all of the people at the scientists but like bring at the beau. Oh yes, we have our associates here. It's he's helping us to get some of these. Some of this evidence for the masquerade mister bone splitter Mister Brown, Cleaver
I brought thousands of both scientists are cool. What we do know, though, is why the settler stopped at mountain meadows, along with the wagons. The settlers also had about six
One hundred head of cattle in the meadows was a perfect place to let the herd, Grays and Brigham Young was well aware that the Arkansas Company was there the day before the massacre Brigham
sent a letter to the leader of the southern Utah Mormons Elder Isaac, hate who was in charge of the mountain meadows area and although Brigham Young explicitly told hate that he must not meddle with the settlers. Brigham followed that
statement with this sentence. The Indians we expect, will do as they please wink wink wink wink
I just funny that he actually wrote in the wink wink wink wink. Furthermore, it's possible, if not likely, that the letter either wasn't delivered at all. It was delivered well after the massacre began and some think there may have, even
in a second letter sent while the non meddling letter was sent as cover now, there's no proof that Young ordered this massacre
honestly, I'm not necessarily inclined to believe that Young ordered it, because this was a fantastically risky move for very little gain, at least relatively so, but even if Brigham Young did not give the order, the environment that he had cultivated, ensured that the men who participated in the massacre,
felt no hesitation in murdering gentiles, specifically Gentiles from Arkansas
well, they've already been dehumanized completely. So you have a group of people here that
you're, saying or eating your resources. You
have a blood atonement to get to yeah right here
got to get to that you're. Looking at these people and you feel like a maybe we can help them from their own sense. I don't think you need a little in actual come May.
And from Brigham Young
he's already done it well brought it home. It could have been the spark here or Brigham. Young could have
Using the age old cult tactic of spicing things up with murder, we don't know he might have sent that you might have sent the order, he probably didn't, but you might have the most likely. The main motivation was probably breed playing
simple, the settlers had a lot of cattle, they had a lot of goods and the southern Mormons wanted it. They were dancing
Arkansas settlers were gentiles who gives a shit
and they're, not getting a lot of trade because they have, since they have also cut off the american government, they're. Also not getting
that's right, so now they're getting all a bunch of free shit
to show up in our territory an we can kill them, and God loves it great yeah, it's perfect storm, but no matter what the reason behind the mask are actually was.
The first shots began on the morning of September seventh
the southern Mormons had allied themselves with the Piute tribe and when the settlers looked out there who shooting am it appeared to be a piute rating
because of what I've read, because what I read was that they landed right, so they got sent to the mountain,
Those areas that end up being very beautiful,
Apparently, when they arrived, they were so tired. They did from the long travel that they had set up camp
we didn't do the customary circling of the wagons where they didn't set up a perimeter like they normally do. They kind of just all flopped and fell asleep, and they think
all right, we'll set you up in the morning, but then pop pop pop pop what they will go up to getting shot at yeah, and what this meant is that when they finally did circle the wagons they did not have a substantial. Why
water supply anywhere near them. They hadn't done their due diligence as the siege continued, the settlers,
start a notice that out of the two hundred and fifty so pie you to attacking a good number of those guys out. There obviously had white skin under their war pay. Ten, this deception was the brain child of a Mormon named major high Higby Higby had reason that it would be a bad look if it was just Mormons attacking the settlers, so he blended his men with the pie you it's to make it a little more palatable.
As the initial plan probably wasn't to kill everyone. Apparently these people haven't heard about cultural appropriation, because that my friend is the little little problematic. So little problematic,
you kill people, but you do it as your own person, but as the seed went on, it was becoming obvious to the Mormons that they weren't going to overtake the wagon circle by force and since mountain meadows was around
totally. Well trodden trail, it was only a matter of time before other people showed up, possibly even the army itself. What was more, the settlers had ob
easily seen Mormons fighting with the pie
they may not have known they were Mormons, but at the very least there white people we're in Utah there, probably Mormon right.
If those settlers were let go the then it wouldn't be long before punishment truly rain down on Utah
so they're not going to take the Arkansas Yens by force. Do they take them
my dance, let's pop it in,
when we were in Berlin, that's all you have to do if you want to get a group of Germans to go anywhere, you just put a giant set,
speakers on a band blasted Edm and they will just Goth Rave
honestly in Burley was amazing because we were there during the climate march when they were literally science raven to save the climate. I don't know if that's how you're going to do it, but they were a delight three hundred o'clock in the afternoon
six vans with huge speakers all blasted, a different Edm DJ three bands who won the Germans behind it. You just being familiar to me to add in there- and now we don't know who came up with the plan to commit the massacre specifically or who, if anyone from above gave the order to go through with that, but the Mormons knew they had to get the settlers off. The main path with the whole thing could be ended somehow so they took off their war paint and used themselves as decoys to offer the settlers safe passage. They claim to be friends of the pie you and they offered to negotiate a peace and escort the settlers to nearby cedar city. All the settlers
would have to do hand over their guns. Oh that's it! Not! The settlers hadn't been cut off from water. They probably wouldn't have gone along with this deal because they knew the Mormons had been right alongside the Piutes shooting at him for four days straight, but the settlers had a lot of kids,
while grown men and women might be able to survive a siege until someone came along to help the kids, probably wouldn't o the settlers, took the deal four days after the siege began on the morning of September, 11th the settlers turned over their weapons. The women and children were marched out ahead, while the men were made to stay behind with the Mormons the Piutes laid in wait and uh
the men were marched. A suitable distance, Major Higbee, appeared on the ridge ahead, waved his arms and shouted something that sounded like do your duty. At that moment, the Mormons turned their guns on the settlers and murdered each and every one of them with shots to the head. Those that didn't die immediately had their throats cut. So as Larry Mcmurtry put it, the atoning blood could flow more freely and at the same time the men were being murdered. The Piutes came out of hiding and slow.
The women and every child above the age of seven by bludgeoning them to death. Aman named John Doyle, Lee actually joined the Piutes in this chasing down one little girl himself and slitting her throat, while two other young girls were raped and murdered on site after it was all said and done. At least one hundred and twenty innocent,
lawyers were murdered. Tango. Some estimates put it as high as one hundred and forty and as soon as the killing was done, the Mormons and the pie,
cut years from bodies for the earring hand, cut fingers from hands for the jewelry and strip the dad of all their clothes. As many as one hundred and forty bodies were left to rot, make it into two piles on the grounds of mountain meadows and by the time the
next travelers came down the road. Two weeks later, the corpses have been ripped apart by animals. The only survivors were seventeen children all under the age of seven,
saved because, according to Mormon believed they had not yet passed out of the age of innocence. These children were just given to a Mormon families, although eventually some were returned to Arkansas no hate. My question, no one is:
there's a lot of quotation marks throughout this entire thing because cause of the because we only know about this from witnesses- witness that believe that they were a part of it. Like John Doyle, Lee
would go on to be the guy that say the Mormons were the ones that did this Becaus, because they were the official line. Is that Piutes reacted alone, essentially Lee the idea that.
Many of these, so called piutes. The large percentage of them were Mormons in makeup. No,
that was about two hundred piutes in about fifty Mormons
Who was that you? We know that to be sure, we don't know that one hundred percent to be sure, but
but we do know, comes from the forensic evidence from the nineteen ninety nine excavation. They were not able to uncover every single body, but they were able to uncover about eighteen bodies and out of those bodies. The men had gunshot wounds to the head. The women were,
project, and we know that Mormons use guns. While the Piutes used blunt weapons like they used blunt instruments,
so John Dalys, John Daly's, or at least the people that were there their testimony that the Mormons called them in the pilots killed the women and children that at least holds true somewhat, but we
no one hundred percent for sure, because they were not allowed to examine all of the body, but the Mormon.
Made. This seem like they were under attack right now, isn't that the Mormons made to seem like they weren't even there, because the official call the official line from the Mormons was that the pie you'd had murdered the settlers, because the settlers had give
I am a poisoned box, so this okay, so ruling this is truly a hate double shot where it's like. You get to kill a bunch of people, and then you also get the blame it on a minority group yeah, and you also get to be
this loyal to a minority group that you are supposed to be allied with triple shot yeah
for the word minority. Then we were the minority, but that's uh.
Good! It's! If you were hated me, they were just hate it yeah.
So it's easy to position ourselves against them,
They were we distrust of them because we were stealing their lands. I know you were
set about it yeah, it makes sense. Now, supposedly Brigham Young was told about the massacre as soon as word could reach him
According to John Doyle, Lee Brigham Young said this:
maybe that matter, a subject of prayer would run
your you with it and asked him to take the horn vision from my side
if it was a righteous thing that my people have done in killing those people on mountain meadows, God answered me
once the vision was removed
I had evidence from God that he had overruled it all for good.
Action was a righteous one and well intended well. Isn't that what I'd call a
interesting how we just like. Oh, I lost it.
Now this massacre could very well have spelled the end of Mormonism. If anything it could ease.
Really be compared to Jim Jones, ordering the murder of Congressman LEO Ryan in Guyana, which led to the massacre in Jonestown and there's no chance that Brigham Young would have forced a mass suicide like Jim Jones Dead, but a big big push from the US government could have easilly led to the deaths of thousands all across Utah, but the mountain Meadows Massacre did not happen in nineteen. Seventy eight like Jonestown did. This was one thousand eight hundred and fifty seven. There were no camera crews. There was no instantaneous communication and there were no real forensic investigator bodies
watch the Mormons faced no significant repercussions as a result of the massacre. Well, you heard bring him God took it from his bright. Like I didn't think about it. Why would I even think I can think about it? It's been taken from me. It took eighteen years for anyone to be punished and even then the Mormons offered up only John Doyle Lee as a scapegoat who was found guilty and taken out to mountain meadows where he was executed by a firing squad. So one man did it one man by the way, all Mormon jury now. The reason why it took eighteen years was because Brigham Young formed rank immediately following the massacre. He proclaimed that any Mormon who didn't support the official story, which was that the pie- it's did it because
poison, docs, and that Mormon would quote. Dia dogs death, be damned and go to Hell demo and mystique breath
you will be able to dance, and I won't allow him to see you. No. I said that mystery singer song on show on tonight. He will be able to see that spoil the ending good for him and I'll tell you who it was. It was Kato Kaelin, Kato, Kaelin, the most ridiculous part about all of this is that it was starting to become clear that the army wasn't going to come. After all, because they had run into supply problems in Wyoming and their march had slowed to a crawl, the great
war that seemed destined to predate the American civil war, never came to pass. Brigham young had whipped his people into a blood
thirsty frenzy for nothing and one hundred and forty people died. Horrific death as a direct result, what's even worse, was that the mountain Meadows Massacre set a new template for frontier slaughter. At least four copycat attacks occurred in the wake of mountain meadows, most of which
alt, rape, death and gouging, snot, gouging, gouging of eyes or somehow jing of eyes. Yes, the gouging of ice,
spiritually. Then can't be witnesses. I know it's ready
else to say about the part of when you see with your kid
then they remove those types of things. So they covered the face. It's about not being seen right, but even with them,
occur hanging over his peoples. Heads Brigham Young was still waging what war he could against the United States, because the army had not quite stopped their advance just yet Porter Rockwell
if you'll remember, had been Joseph Smith's assassin and the attempted murder of Missouri Governor Lilburn Boggs became one Brigham, Young's main thugs and Rockwell spread murder across the salt lake.
Ali. When word got around that traders were in Utah territory, hoping to sell to the Us Army, Porter, Rockwell, captured them, and let the group a hundred
south of SALT Lake City, where he killed four out of the six merchants, but when the army was only a twelve day March from SALT Lake City,
winter settled into Wyoming, and the army got stuck for the season. This sudden change in weather likely saved the Thous
dozens of lives, Brigham Young, was willing to spend on Mormon sovereignty as such, the winner gave Brigham young time to settle down, and it gave the United States the opportunity to send a skilled, diplomat, name, Thomas Kane, to broker a peace with the Mormon people. Eventually, the army entered the territory in Brigham. Young was stripped of his political offices, although not a god. Damn thing was ever done about the mountain meadows,
secur apart from the token execution of John Dilley? Oh, it reminds me of TED Kennedy when he was like. Oh my god, because of Chappaquiddick. I could never
run for president and it's like. Oh, what, after you move them? Brigham young even visited the site of
mountain meadows, massacre himself in eighteen, sixty one and as a final error. Again he or
the meager memorial that had been built on mountain meadows, destroyed
yeah he showed up, he saw the sign he gave the sign of the
the sonic sign of do action, which is the squared arm, and then you went and destroyed the entire thing damn, but at the very
least young's. Last year's on earth were beset by painful maladies. He claimed to suffer from quote
arranged bowels an Hem roids, just what happened to her friend Eddie? That's, not that bad yeah. It comes from living like shit, eating nothing, but just just bear grease
they said that Brigham Young's waste at its largest forty five
Ok, yeah and Brigham Young was forced to use.
Cinemas that he mixed with consecrated oil, the same oil that they used in rituals, Brigham Young was shooting up his as so. This makes it not gay right. This is like it's, not gay shut it up. I ask what do I have to do. I have to tell you twice
can you make my colon is slippery for Jesus Christ as possible? Ok, Mister Young bend over. Do you want to play here? Comes the torpedo or do you want to play here? Comes the bullet. I'm not! Bending
sure, I'm not a chair when I'm standing. Ok. Well, then, that's here comes the torpedo you're getting it all over. My legs and Brigham Young never stop being a dick,
civil war. Finally, came the Mormons just waited it out, see Brigham believe that society would be better off without any black people at all, free or slave. As far as he was concerned, he could take a leave slavery, so it didn't really matter who won all he really cared about at this point was making Utah state, while still
meaning polygamy, you know. Sometimes you gotta make a decision yeah right time to take a stand. That's one of those times yeah, but as long as polygamy was a part of the Mormon Church, Utah is never going to be a state really. The only benefit the Mormons got from the civil war was that the government was too busy to truly prosecute.
The bigamous in Utah, but once the civil war was over and done with the United States, turn it site, Ords, true western expansion, and it just wouldn't do to have a huge population of polygamous weirdos right
where the railroads had to be built. Yeah dude, just too many wives, too few cars you getting out there.
Everybody. You don't know who single or not nobody. I mean everybody's married five or six times everybody.
Kiki all the time we got. One guy who's bowels are old arranged so
here's upon years afterwards, bill after Bill came through Congress to try to get the Mormons to abandon polygamy. They were just at a stalemate, although
Our men's were usually able to kill the bills with a well placed bribe me, but by the eighteen seventies, Brigham Young was starting to show signs of seriously failing health. His urological system was breaking down and he had to use a catheter looped up with what else, but
lots of great oil to urinate yeah fishing up there. You know what I'm saying you know what I've ever said is: what's the point of even having a cock, if I can't get to the pits fastenal anyway, this whole well, I'm hoping is that at some point we are human being
do an evolved to laying one big type of egg, those filled with shittin pants that I could just get out easily, because all of this pool of this cock is just keeping my pits from coming home. So get that too right up to the bag of pistachios are in the middle of me, please
I can really express it out, so the only justice we get here is got a catheter is and am in in it and what it is, but I mean the deranged bowels. I love it.
So it's not even a punishment. No there's a whole program needs help. Working one slash, neighborhoods, yeah, there's of cities, Denver San Francisco, where you go
they want. They want these things inside of them, and Brigham Young never stop being a hypocrite. When one of his wife,
divorced him in eighteen. Seventy three and sought one thousand dollars a month in alimony Young argued that he didn't know her God Dam thing, because their marriage wasn't technically legal say
oh, my ok and that's. Where he's got your legally, I see ok, but finally, Brigham Young's body revolted against itself on August 23rd, one thousand eight hundred and seventy seven young.
Collapsed, vomiting and shitting himself and his appendix burst two days later. Six days after
the line of the Lord was dead Dan. You know, I'm not for big game hunting
I do think this lion deserve to die. Polygamy continued in Utah for another thirteen years before the United States. Finally figured
out a way to legally sees all church
in assets unless
the Mormons renounced polygamy, completely,
and by some extraordinary coincidence, God change
his mind about polygamy right around the same time and Utah finally became a state in eighteen. Ninety,
and around this time, blood atonement was officially denied and repudiated by the church as well, but there were some in the Mormon communities who believed that both blood atonement and polygamy were ascential parts of Mormon belief and those people use those doctrines to justify horrific crimes about a century later and those are the people will cover. In the conclude,
into our saga on Mormonism. Oh there, it is folks Mormonism part five. We will be going in to the 20th century. On more,
some sex wow. That is absolutely incredible. I cannot believe
There is still a university with this.
Its name on it and there are active children, be like that's where I,
Wanna go learn about life. It is, I bet lesson.
We learned last week the idea of starting right. They they have such a troubled history
You imagine if we actually got a modern view of how Christianity was bird. I imagine we
see a lot of the same. This is some it's interesting.
I see how it goes and now next week, when we cover this kind of modern incarnation like well. I think we'll talk a little
what about the fact that you know Mormonism has done its best to change. The whole point is that they're trying to be more legit to trying
be more liberal, they're trying to add more to the conversation, so they can finally have a president one day because that's what they really want, because it's been Joseph Smith secret wish. Since the very beginning, it seems like they're only changing, because society is like forcing them to change their way. They would still be doing child brides and thirty five. Why that's the entire thrust of Mormonism? They don't they're, they sway like the read in the window, so my first comedy special will be called child wives, child brides, thirty, five wives, good Lord, but then next week, we're going to see. Is these they're going to cover two
Pacific stories a little bit as much as we fully can that show how in
modern times these little friend
Mormon systems they still create
ham, that is legally ordained by the church, even if they kind of go on
seeing it. I don't know, what's happening over there,
still in many ways another like little slippery little finger
so the more than the next episode of assuming we will be discussing a character that the Us Justice Department was able to get rid
need to go to San Angelo next week, boys, all right. If you have travel, it's a weird one. Think of the segway been Kissel put on your cat. King of traveling
we're going to be back on the road for our back in the habit world tour number one. Thanks to everyone who came out to see us in Europe. That was a dream come true such a great time and effort on it was so cool. I love it so much yes, so October, eighteenth night, I in October eighteenth we are going to be in Tampa Florida, the nineteenth of October Miami Florida and then October Twentieth Orlando Florida, and then we have November twenty first
in Portland November, twenty settler in Maine Portland, Maine, yeah, okay November twenty First Portland Maine, it November twenty Second North, Hampton Massachusetts and November twenty Third Buffalo New York and then finally, in this,
December fifth Toronto December. Sixth,
Finally, we are going to Detroit and yeah can't wait. We are so excited we're going to also the perfect time to go. Get the perfect time to be in Detroit. I can't wait for the tropical vibe
so you have a Pina colada and sit by the beach
and we're not under a massive time crunch. In no way is there going to be a snowstorm in the Midwest in December, know where everything's gonna be totally fine, guys ran under Detroit to Columbus and December smooth sailing boys sailing sailing December Seventh Columbus. Oh, so, please come out to those shows. We can't wait to see everybody on the road again.
One more thing: I'd also like to give a extra special things to research assistant, John Mckean, for his work on the Brigham Young,
book on this episode. He was absolutely invaluable. Thank Joe, thank you Jill also
kiss on, I will be doing an episode of side stories lie yeah November, eighth
Do you see a part of the death becomes US festival see?
we kiss- or I weave a tale of imagination in front of you. He as we speak to you and wonder what will say. Yes, indeed, as we wonder what will say as well know that will be wonderful. We always love going to Washington DC, and so yes
out with us and we will have a great time together. Can we see on the road- and I guess that's basically it as far as announcements go right
I believe so, and we're going to be returning to adult swim. This Tuesday, the stream last stream on the left, is going to be Rekt.
Turning to the airwaves this Tuesday, at eight hundred pm eastern standard time go to adult swim com streams, this Tuesday, at eight hundred pm est to check
without all right. Here we can see you guys, cannot wait to see you guys again and strut and fret, or,
corresponding internet stage for you
Absolutely alright, everyone never forget, hail yourselves, Hell Satan, oh hell G! Let's do a magoo, stellation, Shelby, Michaels Lane and anime. Now is it? Would it be too
had to try to swear pivot towards like getting her own little community. I mean, I think we could do it right
that's what they all say. No honestly, the flaming lifted off the flaming lips have done it right. Oh, I I've heard
well it's kind of rough over there. No it's great that you just make stuff. Jarrad Letto, however, is starting a cult and he's not doing it right. So he doesn't have the right people
I can help just trust me we're just we're all bad multitaskers
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Transcript generated on 2019-11-07.