Who put Bella in the Wych Elm? This is an episode we covered in our earlier days brought to you by Alaina, but she kept up with it and ended up finding so much more information that she wanted to redo it for ya! Here’s our second take on the episode with some new insight, maybe we’ll finally close this chapter. Here are the books mentioned in the episode! Very recommended reads for this case! Who Put Bella In The Wych Elm Volume 1 Who Put Bella In The Wych Elm Volume 2 Another really great podcast that did a goosebumps inducing narration of this case is The Unexplained Podcast. Here are the two parts of his show on the subject, just for some extra spooky listening! Whispers In The Trees Part 1 Whispers In The Trees Part 2 As always, thank you to our sponsors! HelloFresh Go to HelloFresh dot com slash morbid12 and use code morbid12 for 12 free meals, including free shipping! Squarespace Check out Squarespace.com/MORBID for a free trial and when you’re ready to launch, use the offer code MORBID to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain ThredUp For Morbid listeners, here’s an exclusive offer just for you: Get an extra 30% off your first order at thredUP.com/MORBID. Terms apply. PrettyLitter Your cat deserves the best. Your cat deserves The World’s Smartest kitty litter! Do what I did and make the switch to PrettyLitter TODAY by visiting PrettyLitter.com and use promo code morbid for 20% off your first order.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Things I thought could never happen in a punk back was a new regional calmly streaming only on visa fees, mix of hash anthems, sour silent vote, I shall drama, Bismarck Basis, mom task than manager and me a Mina led guitar, you really good repute to live in front. We are late all the cells screaming now only on peacock, it's always a good time to avoid the hustle and also at the girl she stored, not to mention the crowds are stollivers everything you need to get dinner on the table directly to your door, contact free, gotta, hell, afresh outcomes, lush morbid, twelve and use code, morbid twelve for twelve females, including free shipping,. hey weirdos, I'm Alina.
and this is more bed in the morning in the morning in the village, it's just become customary at this point to tell you what time it is what day it is so is just see you get the feel. Ok, so I, probably know what day it is before. I inform you. It's Thursday Ray is Thursday. It is Thursday the end of the week, which doesn't mean, anything anymore. So this makes the same, but
we don't really have a whole lot to chat about beforehand, mainly just one I'll. Let you know that you might have seen the title of this woman like wait a second. They did that didn't, even though they do that again, Sarka we're covering today who put Bela in the witch home, and we did cover this a long time ago. This early under very early everybody, this was also when we are doing actual many more beds where they were, like short, I got off our eighty five men looked back and saw I've been looking like I've mention another episode ever looking back on the research and like the equality, the sound quality, the episodes just a remedy, or some- and I looked at this one now like four pages of research on this it s like that's not, it so I just happened to start. I would like to start looking into it, as I do like this case. A lot in the new stuff that had come up and there was all kinds of things that I just haven't touched upon in the original once was like, you know what we were still
in our research. I can do this better hats. I can do this better and with the new stuff that has come out. I think it's important update it hell yeah. So, instead of just putting a little update, we figured scrap it. Do the episode over again, because I can do ones? Do always improving so without further ado, we're going to talk about who put Bella in the which, to be honest, I only remember, like small details from the seller murder a tree, her memory which, on a witch element, I remember little kids, finding her yeah well like teens, yet he figure so little yes, so this takes place April, Eighteenth nineteen, forty three for local boys named Robert Heart Thomas? Will it spots? Farmer and Fred Pain were poaching rabbits and trying to catch birds and haggling would already, and this is located in was to shear. England was two years. I was too
or science moves you Gyre wished to shire. So this was this place was part of the haggling estate belonging to Lord Cobb him near which very hill Haliae. You know the place right. I've been there where Americans, we don't know anything about this, but I hope I'm saying it alright. I bet you are when they came across this crazy lookin tree, which is referred to as a witch elm. The tree itself is like a wild post, a photo of it because it's definitely like an odd tree at least odd. To me, it's like got a big bulbous bottom to it and then scuttle these crazy spikes coming out of it cause it's curve. It looks like a witch outlawing. It looks like that's what it would be called ya like obliged tree spooky. True, it's definitely spooky now Thomas will. It was said
teen. Bob farmer and Robert Heart were fifteen and Fred Pain was fourteen vs IE fifteen fourteen equals little kid at issue. Thirteen's either wish you're, either way. Now before I get really into this, I just want to mention. There are two books on this that I a regionally did not know about when I first of all certainly go Alina, didn't know about a book. I know it's insane and there are few books, their volume, one in two called who put Bela the witch out there. The authors Alex Marrow and Surely it's a father, son team, who did these two books on out Ex Merrill is his fifteen year old son. You help him right. The spoken do all the investigation, but he put his name on the book, ah, which I is so cool. Ferris cunningly gave him the that is a durable and there really cool sites recommends. You go check it out because they went back. One other thing
we'll see what this case is that a lot of the original documents are very difficult to find things have been lost, things were misinterpret there's just a lot of shit goin on here the authority is, but they were, they went back and really investigate. this they looked at all the old autopsy airports in the book itself. They have the actual, like text of the autopsy reports and all the inquest saunter reporting all the investigation. So it's really dressing and there's a ton of detail that I'm not gonna put in here that I think you should check out those books and see so these kids were act. We on their way home when they had passed, tangley wood and they were. when they saw it. They were like. I bet, there's some stuff we cause. I guess bird poaching is like taking eggs and poultry of like ness. Sixteen yeah that they there's different like things about what they were actually doing. I think they were there Upton. Ok,
yeah. That's a terror! Doing something that they then apparently is illegal to do. Unlike you, no sir, I that land and stop they were kidnapping burnt. They were being teen us fucked, so that when they walked by this, they were like. Oh, I bet there's a lot of stuff to do in their so there they gotta try so one of them. I believe it was Bob Farmer by all accounts. He saw a blackbird leave this big hole in a tree and he followed cause. He was like, what's in there with this guy, being asked in their so he followed and when he looked he said you know what I'm gonna look in here, but it's like dark in here. So he said you guys go look in these other trees that are near by and see. If you see anything, Sir Robert Heart looked into an old elm tree and he said immediately. He looked into this big hole in the tree and he said he thought he son animal Skull, but he couldn't and a good look at it, but he was like all cool. Is an animal skull? Marijuana see it so yeah me
got the other boys to help him and they ended abusing a stick to like some kind of like lifted up like stick it into the eyeball of the skull and then just like lifted up, and this cavity was pretty depots like three feet deep. So after moving in a bet, they could see that this was clearly not an animal scale. This was a human scale, so they were able to tell this one, because you know the look of a human skull, but to it had a big it had a clump of human hair on one side of Aragon. That freaks me. The thing I had very human teeth like a full set of human because teeth take a while to to away to disintegrate right. They know. Go, oh yeah right, never seen her head her new, but it had a full set it to, and you know don't you know, let's just what their Meda so cool, because, like your bones see no, that would be a long, long, long, long long long time for anything to happen. The fossils man aloud,
this is the air mash up. So he realized tat. He had found a full human skull, so they put the skull back into the tree. And then they ran into Wallace GOAT, were into town and ran into Donalds Paine, who was freds older brother and when I ran into him, they dragged him back into the Hughley Wood and they showed him that He was like some stand by me: shit. It's certainly as they were like they're like what they written into descendants squad because one of the issues was they were like we're. Not supposed to be in here like and we're doing shit that we're going to get in trouble for so like what do we do? We just found something really bad, but like do we tell anyone like
brother? Please help exactly so they brought Donalds Back Donald said he looked into the tree. He saw what they saw. He also saw a green bottle. He saw shoes and he saw more bones inside the cavity free, but again they were on this land illegally, so they were like. What do we do? So farmer put the skull back into the tree again and all of them returned home without mentioning anything to be so scared that I would You like cursed from like picking up the skull. Well, Thomas will its was on revive because it didn't take him long before he felt very guilty about leaving Magyar and he immediately told his parents at night about it. He was like. I need to tell you what I did what I saw it has, if not like who's to say that that Lady Spirit didn't like me in your fingers and proschium like you picked it up, yeah sure you got what you got it isn't so his parents were like o K, Thomas thanks for that spring you. So they brought him to the
I police station, where they told Sergeant Charles Lamb, born about this entire deal, so they made a plan to go the next day to go through it, because this was at night, and this was a late at night and the police were like, which has got a funny. The police are like, yet we can really see in their wake Flash was go tomorrow. Let you what if somebody gave a great if somebody was largely kids, discover this and then goes back and retrieves all that and it's gone the forty, but you know what at least at least they didn't. I ass others that so when they did go back. They also had with them sergeant Richard Scare, it Constable Jack, pound and sergeant Jack Wheeler lots of jacks.
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should get one to turn your cool idea. And to a new website showcase your work, Philip, so many of you guys are artists like set that stuff up on a square space and start selling your stuff and learn. Html and it's gonna be like Myspace all over again really square space. Has everything that you need right at your fingertips, so check out square space dotcom, slash marble. for a free trial and when you're ready to launch use the offer code. Morbid save ten percent off your first purchase of a website or domain, so the pathologists that was unseen was Professor James Webster and he was like apparently, very well known in the book that I read like there's a whole chapter on him and like his whole life and all is lino accolades and all that he's an impressive character began, which they also detective superintendent Sidney in an innate I believe- and now he was the senior investigating officer that was in charge of the body. The scene in the investigation, so
When Webster retired actually like to speak about how amazing he was the pathologist, he was described, as quote the greatest detective of them all his evident, sent more murders to the scaffold than any other pathologist in Britain while and they said that he was one of the most brilliant pathologist symbol, what an honor, so they had, like top notch, shuts up a pretty big deal to be like. Oh, hey, pretty venereal, the best detective we never had yeah bitterly regret ever had Britain's pretty big yeah. What one would say, one would say: it's. It's great is pretty big. It's great subtle, Felice check the trunk of a tree and they found an almost fully complete skeleton, almost of not only the daddy we're. Definitely still very were there as ashes, really focus and don't worry, we're going to talk about the teeth. Khazars like some interesting thing, I'd yeah, it's not like very interesting, but it's it's a unique thing
There was also shoe in the tree trunk with her and a gold wedding ring and some fragments of clothing and according to Professor Webster, he said quote, it would appear. probable that the pair of shoes cause they found another shoe like going with that pair a little ways away from the tree allow. So he said it would appear probable that the pair of shoes, one recovered from the bowl of the tree and the other at some distance are connected with this body, as will see later, then, will not, as will see later, like if you read certain sources, people question that alot whether these shoes were actually well connected to her cousin. I think when we get to it like she is like pretty old greatly get she'd been in the tree, awhile MIA! No, no! Yes, she I mean, did they think so, they're not positive, but I feel it would be weird that, like one of her shoes was in the tree and then one was far away and like stayed far away for a little by inelegant, you seems kind of weird.
Yeah. I mean it could have been that though she was in the tree with her and then like an animal, moved it marijuana. And then you know things can stay. in a word it area something and stay just like children for a long time. Yet you know, but I think there is a couple of things that point to it being like a little strange than these are crucial The body was then sent for forensic examination by James Webster and he said that he knew He knew without a doubt that this was a woman. This female earth is female. skeleton this woman. Certainly now this was female skeleton by all accounts and when he went through You know that the aging in everything like that in time of death and cause of death, that was one things became a little hare what I would assume like back then I am sure that was pretty hard to yeah and what the heat he said that he was comfortable, saying that she had been dead and in that tree somewhere between
eighteen months and three years assets like a pretty extraction, stretch, but he was like. I literally can narrowed down any further. That, like that, I mean it's a big stretch and it's not You know what I mean. Look at them like those pretty and honestly they do that today right it's just bone Can only tell you so much like their great for telling you very You know my new details and some things that you definitely need to help with that like when it comes to this kind of thing like one money neurons eyes, really not in its like Hey day here, not yet in the elements and then like the trunk of the tree, that she was then cause I'll talk about how small it wasn't. Everything like a kind of created its own environment will not tree where it's like warm, unlike
it just for I dont legislate without it being in Haiti son. It can definitely haste and left the whole city so really throws things off, but these she said he said that the time of death was in or before October, nineteen, forty one, that's all he could really all right, he said that he thought she was probably around thirty. Five years old, they used. They used a ton of different parts of her skeleton to really tell what the age was. They used, cranial sutures, teeth, pelvic bones and, there to determine this and what Doktor Webster said was quote. You can discuss anyone completely anyone under the age of twenty five. I am satisfied about that this woman, unfortunately has not undergone the usual routine, joining up of her bones, but I am equally certain that the other limit is forty years of age. Further, I gave as an estimate probably thirty, five years of age, but I cannot be done
As on the other two points, but my impression is that she is on the forty side of thirty I, rather than on the thirty side of forty thirty five times was Finally, the men of all those numbers. Your tell you like she's younger than forty she's. Ok, In twenty five I would say she's closer to forty than she is to thirty sure, so that thirty five, I think, is a pretty good. You know compromise a lover of here anyway. a job and she I'd what they describe initially as mossy brown colored hair, and there were some strata rude, but at one point in an interview. One of the doctors did say: she had the girl had ginger hair, so how she's a gin. she could have been an gin and what could have happened was she could have had ginger hair? That kind of faded into brown overdue come like D. Composition can definitely like change what hairless
like really near so they were. They were kind of veto going between those two then I guess sometimes like brown hair can look a little more ginger during de com so it's like that's interesting ass though they were wavering. A little bit on that ends, they believed at first that she was five feet all and they saw they thought that she might have had one pregnancy and they said they weren't positive, rapid. He he said he felt comfortable. At least lake ginning. If she had won pregnancy, how would you be able to tell just through the bones that, like I know, you get like hips when you're pregnant may Ike or the reason you get here? it's like after it like all the sudden like. I have definitely seen that in actions that all the sudden put on one of my old pair of pants and I'm like ok or all that can still threaten her wedding, employed or like or an old dress, though, if you go to be all over your hips and you like those weren't there before yeah, the hips aren't just like you know, love handle certainly think they're literally your pelvic bones have spread open
my suit. Allow that child's room and your you know, they're sitting on your pelvic born at one point during pregnancy. So it's like. It spreads the whole thing why? open sea. I didn't realize they, our bones, like actually moved when YE. I definitely me and then there is also. I can't remember what then tsar but their certain tendons that they believed, especially back then that would like the kind of tear off the pelvic bone and they would cause scarring alone itself. yeah they did mention, though, like there's certain studies, I will say, like you know, things like horseback riding can cause that to happen, though, like others right, there's variants that can make it. So I get might look like somebody had a child, but they may not half. So that's cool, I think, that's where he was back. Then he was like a lady I don't know The other things that I shall be excited to hear is that she had very unique teeth so
well underway, we'll get into it. So like like. We said this, I had a lot of good evidence attached to a teeth: hair scumbag, that's good and the issue was missing a couple teeth, but they said to of the tea set were missing, had come out. In the tree, will you ask or not in the tree but like after her death? determine that, and one of them was removed through a dental procedure like maybe a year beforehand. Ok, so what he wrote in his report about the skull was the skull was in two parts consisting of the head which lakes closed on the floor of the tree ball in the lower jaw was in line with the discharge stipulated vertebrae the spine under the overhang entrance to the hollow bull. So her mandible was you notice, articulated from
as diverse he also said- and this is very interesting- and this is the thing a lot of people are like who so he said when they got the skull. There was a black big tuft of taffeta fabric that had been stuffed into her mouse. Yeah yeah I'm telling you so immediately. He was like that could begin. He said it was stuffed enough of it and stuffed far enough back that it would have caused suffocation, so he said, quote tightly pressed over them lower jaw in the cavity of the mouth. I found part of the catchy or mustard colored dress that the deceased was wearing at the time of her death. So far as this thrust over the teeth margin and so firmly adherence to the teeth was this part of the apparel that I do not consider it likely. I cannot say impossible that this came into the mouse accidentally after death. It appears much more probable that this has been forced into the mouse prior to us, and if so, this would
been capable of causing death from a six year while as he a horrible waited exactly so he saying you know this doesn't look like it just happened to end up in her mouth after You told him here, events and what seeming more and more like is that that was shoved into her mouth and then she was stuffed into this tree and just like a lot I've exceeded. Now there was a portion of the hyoid bone that they found in the bowl of the tree as well, but Webster said that it looked like the reason it was broken was because animals have probably gotten to it. So he said cuz her head had basically after she had decomposed, and you know rotted essentially her head tumbled off the rest of her body. Anything that's when it kind of broke, so it doesn't really suggest strangulation. Anyone we ve mentioned in, like a recent episode, on all. Why doesn't always point to it either way so apt?
they kept investigating around the area after they had found this her in the tree and they did find the remains of one of her hands. A tibia, and then I believe they found a femur close by, famers freaked me out, but she was missing her right hand and they never found it interesting from the measurement of the trunk in which the body had been discovered. He said there is really no way that she would be able to be put into the street after rigour had set in gas. So he said she had to have been warm. It had been, but more rigour or very much after rigour had already broken right because in he said this to him, said that she was killed very close, to the tree or died in the tree, because either she was brought there and this person had her lay either.
You. She was brought their very quickly in this person had a method to bring her there very quickly like your car, yes or she was killed right outside of the tree or in the tree by suffering that thing in her mouth. That's like that's like very scary, because I guess The opening was only twenty four inches by twelve inches, and then it was an is. When I looked up what twenty or inches by twelve. Unjust only looks like bad at like it's like a hamster cage. Why So it's really not that, like a big hamster cage, that's not! I might really I'm glad. You said that cause I'm so but it s time to so I had to. I was like I gotta, look up exactly legal. Actually, what this looks like it's very small and She had been put in their feet first, so it's yeah and so he said one to a lot of people knew about these woods, Hughley Woods and this you know these kind of trees in particular. So he said he felt like a person was local because they knew this was an area that maybe she wouldn't be found for awhile and
and in who put Bella in the Witch House volume one. They suggest that maybe This was a secondary, dumb site and she was moved after De Camp had sudden, and this could be true, but it is its leg. So this parts of it that seem like it could be true that this could be a secondary, dumb site. But then parts of the notes of the investigators mention that some of the roots of the tree inside Hadley continue to grow. Had like intertwined with some of her decomposed clothing right. So choose that arrogant, whiling for awhile roads like air, like I don't know how many people are gonna move a body like while at stake pose. You literally just took the words out of my mouth. I got my next thing when I was thinking about it was like if she's fully decomposing, that's not easy to handle. No, It's not easy to handle and its link up. Of course, people are gross and terrible they have certainly we're all them, but it's like stuffing her
a tree while she's decomposing it. I know more murder is not logical, but I like, I can't imagine a lot of people wanting to handle it completely purifying corpse yeah. You know too far into pewter faction, and then it's also going to be difficult, because, if she's decomposing in your shoving, her into that tiny whole bits and pieces of her is gonna, be far gonna be embedded into that opening yeah and they didn't see that right and also it just doesn't. It does a really make a lot of sense to me now read up as one of the world's largest online turf stores, with your favorite brands for up to ninety percent off an estimated retail shop from over thirty five thousand brands for women or kids club, being handbag shoes, honey. I love shoes or more for last year insane deals of drifting. Would the convenience of online shopping? You can score Zara, which is like literally my favorite place to shop. You can get it on
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ask the orange seen a massive amount of insect activity swarming on the street. Right in this there was this. This was a place. People would walk through more be at least around the perimeter of in the smell definitely would have permeated to outside people walking around the woods in the records. Also say that she was just bones and hair, so her flesh was totally gone, and the only thing I could think was that this woman was murdered, allowed to decompose for a significant amount of time wherever she was or in a place that was rife with insects and high temps and things that accelerate de com and then her skeleton. Was placed in the tree near, but that then you think about his ear and right, it's like so it's that's like thing. I think I've heard her the roots of the tree. Where intertwined with her clothing, I think tat. I think she was a man
they get from the Gatt, be add since a strange. None of it really adds up. So let's talk about her teeth, because I have told you that she had a unique dental pattern short we do so in the maxilla, which is the top jobs. The left, lateral incisors in the second right mauler were missing but, like I said, Doktor Webster said in his records that they were there when she died and must have just fallen out urban like bumped out or something they were never found. So there is some speculation that it they there fell out in transport or that the murderer stole them, because one something there could have been like dental work done in them rash would have identified her
or there could have been, maybe valuable materials like a gold, filling arraying. I thought that he stole from them. They were all in her teeth were in pretty good condition. There was a couple like one or two that had signs of like I'm: a cavity, yellow the ash yeah, but What wasn't taken into account in a lot of the records which is strange to a lot of people, especially in the two books I was reading, they are questioning at like hard. Was that her two central incisors so her to Fronty? They were there very prominent. They are described very big and rude again in their very crooked anchor and when I say crooked, I mean one is almost entirely over the other. Ok, it is projected outwards and it's like fully over the other one. So it would be some, thing that people would notice about her realities in one of those like work. My tooth is crooked and you're like now
no, it's like it really was it when I really was like. When you look at the skull, will more poster picture of the skull. It's almost tiredly overlapping, the other tooth and its projected out zone, it would have something that you would have noticed the second, John, rushing factory, I'm not saying it's. A bad thing is just something like you would have like: oh wait. She has the right and if
a word to say that in their records and like really make a point of like this very unique thing about her to front teeth, people who knew her would definitely remember that about her metabolic. Oh, that's unique to her, that's like so, and so, but they didn't really make a huge thing about that. They more concentrated on the fact that in her lower jaw, a couple of her lower teeth were like slightly overlapping each other, but not even really noticeably. When I don't know why they focused on that part, but not the bay. Her yeah and I dont know if that doesn't make any sense to me and it doesn't make sense anybody really. When you look back on a casualty, really should focus. In fact they posted photos of Thee teeth in, like news,
papers and such like a news reports to try to get people to be like this is what the teeth like do they liked. You know somebody who Steve looks like that right at one point: they only posted the mandible ha. Then it's like that's not the, and maybe they did it, because one of her teeth had been removed in a dental procedure down there, some right or trying to point that out, but until the dose it is the central incisors in the top jar. The thing that I would have focused on weird but I'm not. I wasn't workin the case. So what were you doing? by the way side when I'm not working and nineteen forty scale. I know that in your life back, then I wonder why don't you just pop on over? I guess I was busy. I don't really know well what they did with the teeth. Was they started
a complete like a nationwide search of all dental practices and they were like they put out an inquest. They rode all the stuff about the teeth and they were like tell us if you ve seen anything like this, because they said that one of those that tooth had been removed, probably like a year before her death, it was pretty close to when she had died. Of that should have been a procedure done. That would be still on record and bright red and no trace no trace of of these kind of procedures, nothing if she took her own to throw like a ass. Maybe she did. I dont know there was no evidence to save. I dont know if we have any dentists listening, maybe you can tell by leg bone or anything like if somebody had like traumatically, ripped thirteenth out like not done it in a proper way right, but
Not very sure? But again they didn't mention those central incisors in the original dental inquest, which is a very strange thing to me. Yeah yeah, it's weird in terms of the clothing she was wearing. She was found. The clothing that was found was in pieces. Essential they like it was all very decomposed, but they found pieces of a corset, mustard or catchy colored skirt, which is what they used to suffocate her like a piece of it. There was a slip which they said was either peach or maybe, like, I think they said, like I'm, a phone call but they can tell us of how decomposed it was here and a Navy blue what they described as cheap type of knickers, that's nice of, but pretty reared in his friend real Lake there's doing or their kids dislike of the time, and there was also wool card again that match the skirt it had like.
Tat really huge. Often it was like when they look at a bunch of people have done like mark ups of this, our filling drawing of it was a q and it looked like a kid. forties outfit related. But He also said that when it comes to lick her status in life, because people were like our who, what are we talking about here is somebody in high society is with somebody. I wish, as you know, live their life. You know, in the streets is somebody in between. Like we gotta tried try to narrow this down because ass, we gotta try to find her. Ah, basically, what they said in their investigation was she's. She doesn't seem like she Billy crazy, high class he's not like a crazy, rich elite person, money wise, but like she's also not like you know, catching a ride, unlike boosts somewhere. You know you mean like she's she's somewhere, she like middle class problem in what they said. Was she
Moreover, a type of person who may have been rather neglectful as to her appearance and habits that in ITALY said this curious tooth flew along with their cavity. That was a kind of rotten which she had caused her considerable pain and must have given her a nasty taste in her mouth. Oh, so it's like ok, so she attitude routing yeah, but maybe she was here to the dentist yeah I mean if it obviously she if they're saying she was in pain like but again. You could take phobias yeah, maybe you're scared that enters or maybe she was in the mid class somewhere some workload in order not yet, but still couldn't afford the dentist GINO like. Maybe it's just. I don't know it's hard to this. It's hard to discern that kind of sake and say to declare focus. She's got one crappy to combine scale. One crowded eating
this- is a off color, don't judge your buyer one shilling to provide any tenth or twice he never had a shitty to perform. we propose. Should eighty that's why I'm using fight a liner lies so far, these bonds or a file so going back to the shoes, because the shoes were a big at first they were like this is a big find. It's gonna help us narrow shit down, but its veto. The allotted to weird stuff came from the shoes, so Doktor John Lund was another doctor who is given the clothing to examine and Detective Inspector Tom Williams was the guy who is specifically given the charge of the shoes to go investigate this. There are photos of the shoes in that book that I mentioned the two books, this photos of them. You can also look it up a mine. The shoes were actually dark, blue in color, although they had originally looked bill, I can they thought that they were black. They were worn out, and they were worn out quite a bit
They were Assize five and a half english standard, and she was only believed to be five feet tall and actually later found out that she was probably more like four hundred and ninety, why she's very sweet beats, and this would be considered a very big shoe for someone that size ok. So what was weird to them? Was they said? You know these were very well worn out, but there was no sign that there was any kind of thing like padding. The shoe like. If she worthy shoes they would be huge on her NEA, so they relate and if they're now it's issues, however worthy wore them a lot right, but there is nothing that would keep these on her These are. The very uncomfortable thing aware is very strange, so occur Turning to the volume one book on May first, they were able to identify the make and model of the actual shoe and they were able to trace it back to the manufacture. It was clear and spray limited was the manufacture and their records show that on
The issue in particular, was quote a set: a blue semi chrome side, Gibson Shoe with three rows of pen punching on quarter and it was made on a ninety seven. Last with leather through crape soul and fair stitch for part and crape heel. I wouldn't ever know what that is. But if you look at the picture you like Asher, like you, are speaking Javert shared it was made between April in June, nineteen. Forty, that's when I was manufactured, ok in they were able the track these issues to be actual stores in the area that there are sold to and they were even able to further narrow it down because they were able to see who sold those that size right right so see a Alan limited of built in Staffordshire they got six pairs of those shoes. Messrs Ambrose, Wilson, limited of London got seventy two pairs. They liked them, they like, them and Messrs STAR now and sun. In short,
its London received fifty four of those barriers also liked them. So not a crazy amount to a fourth like one of them only got six baker generated like it not so they went around and they started talking to be shop owners and they were getting a better understanding of how popular these shoes were and they found there locally. These shoes were definitely a quick so when they were going to sell out pretty quick and they, equally would have sold out right when they got them a set of ever like fashion, bullshit you they were just like they were. They were kids. use and they were also just like, I think comfortable or you are fairly priced and they were. You know you can wear him for a while. I think they were just good shoes, essential so. The investigators now think that they likely were bought around the date of June. One thousand nine hundred and forty and that's when they were made and sent into stores for remember,
said: there's a good of mountain where of wear and tear on they choose and what they they estimated about. Six months of good hardware was on these issues, so the earliest she was in that tree was June and likely closer to December nineteen. Forty that would put her a little over two years dead before being found in that. Ok because They are trying to use the shoes and the six months of where, on those shoes, when the shoes would have arrived in the stores to kind of estimate when she would have bought them the six months of wearing them and then her out of it as it, but because, where
positive these are her shoes. It really can. It makes you think a little, but also it again. They weren't proven to not be her shoes either. It so weird like talking about the shoes, because what am I talking about her like buying them and being alive and like putting such where into them, and then they were founded a tree yeah like added, there's something so creepy about that. There is a lot of creeping us Amelia. There definitely is, everything in our lives as getting smarter, like obviously we all have smartphones. I think, last time I read this, add we established that their smart refrigerators. I recently found out that there's, even smart, toilets the I not. if you're a cat owner. Like me, I have news. That's gonna rocky a world leader is smarter to thanks to the world smartest cat, litter Let her pretty letter is the most advanced letter I have ever seen like. Actually, it changes colors to help
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factors working on this they really tried to leg. They didn't have a lot to work. They really do. They really did not given at their best shot. I feel them trying. I fill them, giving it the old college try, so they they cobbled together description of her. You know what she was wearing, where they think she was in law, I like her shooting truth and the west to shear constabulary, got together a campaign to spread the word to try to coax out her identity. Their elect someone's gotta know who she is right asked anyone to come forward any witnesses. Anyone who could know her, but no one came well you're one person they looked through three thousand missing persons reports around the country, nuthin lights confined,
sing. It went with it and it was actually a year. It wasn't until a year after that, her discovery on March 28th, one thousand nine hundred and forty four. This is when the who put Bella in the witch ELM thing became started so at first they put all this stuff out. They ask for anyting, nothing happened right. It was just kind of like that's crazy to me. But then, a year later, a man named Wilfred White saw writing on the wall near his homes and it was in shock and it was handwritten. Then it said Hughley would oh that's all said, and another one was written on another wall in Birmingham and it said who put Bela down the witch our haggling would. This was banks a few days later, on March, Thirtieth a guy named James view roundly, Sir, another one on a wall on Hayden Hill and the it said who put Lou Beller in the witch home was I mean
that on out so they were all in shock and they all had same or similar handwriting and the styles were like weird and similar, so they they were able to determine when they looked at the chalk. I guess later that it was the same chalk and it was the same handwriting weird, and this was put in the paper. Cuz people were like who the fuck did this, but this caused a bunch of copycats to pop up people and aid everywhere, but then, on August nineteen, forty four on a subway wall, same writing, same chalk. It said Hughley would Lou Bela address opposite the rose, and crown has very what's. That means that there are like what the fuck does that mean worn out the August third, two days later, on a fence like this wooden fence. It's really creepy the picture of it. They found the same. Writing in shock- and it said address- was opposite. Rosing crown has very haggling. Woodley Bela, hey that some there like what the fuck on the same day on a wall,
all nearby. They saw the same chalk same handwriting, Hughley would Lou. Bela was no Pross and one that is because, when I saw those like what what does that mean, that is slang for court on court prostitute, I'd, that's on it So they were saying she was your sex worker. That's what they're saying ah, which to me is interest sing, because when we get into like theories, I think she might have been missing sex worker. Oh you think so yeah. I think that's why she hasn't been done yet I I think I made it. There was, and I think it seems to fit one at least that's what I think. Ok oh now remember. This is around the time that a little thing called World WAR two is happening right and it ended in nineteen, forty five. So this is right when everything suing on so the world, when it ended in nineteen forty five, the following year, the world was much more concerned with, like do you,
doing with that, unlike coming back into terms with everything and like welcoming these utopian, getting these soldiers home and re coming back from all of it, this small town murder kind of faded into the background, which is sad yet thrust back into the shadows which sucks, but then in nineteen. Eighty four in a parking garage somebody wrote who put Belen, which owns in nineteen ninety three, that the phrase who put Bela and the witch home was put on the which very obelisk and had glee, and that's the famous big o burlesque. It's like the Big Stone monument is the one that you see in this case it every time you who glad it's like that Big Stone monument that says who put Bela, which Omnia that's when that happened and ninety ninety three. I guess we like the chills now. What's we're just a quick way, really quick update November twenty twenty that
the very famous one on that obelisk was changed, that somebody crossed out who in wrote, hers, hers, put Papa and though a charm, yes,. ouch nobody can really. I guess there is like a graffiti artists, cold hers, nobody dead, every boy who in turn makes then again who that that could have been anybody that it could have been anybody right. But that's what people like you, what it is Strange and it was in November two thousand and twenty, so it wasn't that long ago. So in nineteen forty four, there was a police report and it was a missing person by the name of Bella. She disappeared, three years before a nineteen, forty four hello, which is why nineteen forty one? Yes, she was a sex worker who had she had apparently worked on Hag Lee Road. Nothing was ever.
Really found about this day was its inner police report. They never found her her name Isabella. Why would Bela be the name that would suddenly come up all? That's it. thing I mean, obviously people will point tilling Bela means beautiful, unlike beauty, and all that lay maybe that's what people are doing, but like one a weird coincidence and what a name to pick yeah that is, that is very and you know like to just throw Bela out therein, Lou Bela right leg, one a lot of times you like, we call unidentified people, obviously Jane delicate. Why wouldn't we just say like who put Jane and the witch on yeah It's a very yeah. It is telling, to me. It seems like a specially back. Then they weren't looking into sex workers. Disk no, that whereas in areas like that, we have trouble, I mean the Willy pick. An episode will show you anything. We still have issues so that in this world and it's like back, then they definitely weren't looking into it, and it's like that. Cottages went by the wayside, so it on there's no description of
her there's. No, it doesn't seem like she had anybody close to her, that they could contact and like it just kind of one by the wayside. But it's like the timing works out. The location works out the NATO me out, so I mean that's a lot of things fit and punish leg. Was it someone who knew where or someone who has told the story and decided to put that out there right right, because it's like it strange cousin, nineteen, forty four, it's like this, those that all these who put Bela the witch alms were happenings Alai makes sense if it was a report, nineteen? Forty four does just strange when there's also I like quick little mention of like- and I didn't find anything else about at that there was a police report around that time- that she was found. Where's like two guards wherein Hughley would cause. They were on the haggling, what a state- and they were doing like rounds and they came across like a car
I'm late at night coming into the woods which it was weird yeah and when they went up in thy cannot check out the window like they like knocked on the window in the guy rolled down the window. I think he was an officer of some sort, or was he just drunk he wasn't like? He was acting we'll strange, and they said somebody else was in the car and it was like somebody who is huddled up on the seat, not moving oh and then like they assume she was sleeping, so they were like ok and he was there were like you just gotta get out of here and who is like ok, weird, but nothing was ever followed up on that right. That's creepy swords like who that you're, like a huddled up on exactly like huddled up on the seat, sleep thing or terrified in order to add yeah Lake, because they said, I think there was like a blanket or something around them freaks me yeah, it's just those kind of things really what will cause we're gonna get into a cup of like crazier theories to, and it's like, I think it's something pretty simple
I think, if something miserly, it's always terrible list caravan. Nonetheless, but like more simple than like witchcraft or anything like that, I think it's like even link and when we did the episode with Paul hole and Billy Jensen, and we are talking about the Oklahoma girl, scout murders and Paul brought up how we were it was so weird that they were placed so far like from the Can I say you're the road and then he was like will ya, like maybe somebody had to get away car Leah and under getaway car didn't come, so they write had to like a sanction. getaway car running late, very simple answer, because it yeah, of course, when we are talking about it, we're like, while he cleaned up some of the blood and stuff the the sheets down in this keeping back. Why would he do that right and I was like they're just gonna fine, the sheets like you, didn't hide them well and he was like, while they were probably planning on taking them with them, oh my god, I don't even think about. Yes, why you're the detective and I'm not exactly but yeah? It's like a really is it's like you. You have to link programme your brain cells,
simple. If I look at it what it is. not try to like totally over analyze and it's hard to do so. The human brain, I think, makes thing What more can we do? We fell in pieces when we don't need. so in nineteen, forty five, a woman by the name of Margaret Murray, an anthropologist, an archaeologist from the University of College University College London. She actually work there should till she was seventy four years old. By the way are honoured as a damn.
She was known as like a. She was a well known, archaeologists and anthropologists, but you also known to be fascinated in very knowledgeable about the history and anthropologists surrounding witchcraft. In this theory became very prevalent, like people know all about this, very it's called its known as the which call type offices in it's bullshit and by fifty, so it was brought forward a broad this into a testicle realm. Yet when I think it didn't need to be right has I think this is just a pretty pretty nightly dry murder, but like we don't need to bring like magic and, of course we do but Do you remember like I said that Bela was missing her right hand. Yes, and they did. They were like what the hell's that will they did end up finding the bones of her right hand, partially buried quite a bit away from China, weird and they
thought, maybe you it had been buried through the elements for animal Siena. That's very likely well Margaret thought that this was purposeful. This was purposeful, see, there's a ritual in dark magic, apparently called the hand glory where bones are scattered to the wind. So she said that this was likely and occult ritual that was done on Bela, who was a witch and they see set a spell, would be done and then after they would sacrifice her and after they say when they sacrifice her hand, would be removed from her arm and it would be left. Thirteen paces away from her body where the hell overarching fresh pre, measured ingredients and mouth watering. Seasonal recipes delivered right, tiered, ah hell afresh lets you skip those trips to the grocery store and makes home cooking fine, easy and affordable. That's why it's America's number one meal can, however,
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I'm sorry, morbid, twelve and use go morbid, twelve or twelve free meals, including for shipping again not tell of Russia Comstock Morbid, twelve and use code, morbid twelve for twelve free meals, including free shipping, and hopefully you can you friends. There are, of course, sources that say that that hand was buried ten paces away from the tree, there are other ones that seafarers to realise the objectives unseen like counted the pay. No, I don't that's why in she also thing said the choice of tree was very significant because which alms play an important part in black and, like the dark arts, and trees. Also when it comes to light paganism and, like you know, any kind of thing like that trees do like have connections to lick, souls and yeah binding mad can binding spells and stuff. So she really well that their is also. There was also apparent
Bela Donna around this area. That which is the ancient name for deadly nightshade rang. That's a plant, that's closely associated with witchcraft, so she gonna put this altogether was like. This is obviously in a cold ritual that happened. Yeah, I dont believe I could see, I feel there is sufficient evidence to consider it. The very least results. So, like you know, groups and families of travellers in the areas that they wanted to try to blame. The sun poured out either. She was one of them like part of their family, yet at something happened and she was murdered and sacrificed, or that she was an outsider and was attacked by
no evidence literally out you there's nothing for I find it in so many places, people just conjectures as I S. No, the occult theory, like the witchcraft theory, was cranked up a little bit a notch, because in fact, on February fourteen nineteen, forty five on vat very near by me on hill. There was a man named Charles Walton, whose seventy four years old, I believe he was a farmer and he was murdered It was a strange murder so his topsy- showed that he was severely bludgeoned by his own walking. Stick. He had a ton of Lasserate fins on his arms from trying to fight off his attacker, and then his throat was sliced wide open by a single blade
what end it was still in his neck when he was found they had left the sickle. Tat is terrifying and he was discovered. Skew word to the ground by pitchfork what yes, like an actual like pitchfork, secured him into the ground through his chest wall, And so of course, people were like this is the work of the devil I lay it is the same and that's that's warrant and its unsolved so they were assuming that in this area there was some shit gone down and sincere there too strange, because it's like yeah fine someone concealed in the woods is not a that one.
Any bells of Billina must really halt. Ritual in a tree is definitely indifferent, feel ia. I feel you know and of course it's like calling it the witch, elm and stuff it gives it like a whole. Neither file- and it's like, of course, it is too strange murders and too strange Leggum scenes yachts for shared, so I can get him. I can give them that. I dont think that the that Bella killed by a call tests. I just don't have I don't know. That's me in, like I say the the people for believing like the travellers in the area. Unlike those families, I think that was just an easy scapegoats, jelly like, while they were in the
sometimes so, but later at me at it, we don't know anything about them, so they must be able bears or in the ass to sometimes, but I dont think a bare dinner again no evidence of this, but then in nineteen, fifty three something interesting, girdles, a journalist, name Wilfred but Wilfred by four Jones, investigate it went into this and he said in his thing: was he d, Finally didn't believe that travel, fair theory and that the traveller theory was like gaining steam. Oh and I thought so like in steam, in the sense that no evidence was people were alike by people were light, must be it right, and so he was really trying to dispel this because he was like a, just danger and he was like it's dangerous and we're looking at the wrong thing really was like. I think he said he was like. We have to get away from this witchcraft bullshit and we have to get away from this traveller fairy cause these aren't what happened and were not looking at the real cancelling cause, we're all getting like mystified by this.
They re crazy or thing right, so he actually said in an article he published in the paper. I do not accept it about the traveller theory and he said every crime is laid at the door of the Romans Does he was like it's true? It's just an easy scapegoats. That is so then he wrote those he published. This whole thing and then he received at the newspaper a letter days after publishing this research and thoughts and what it said it was by a woman. It was signed from a woman named Anna, and it said To finish your articles, the which own crime by all me on the watch on crime, by all means. They are interesting to your readers, but you will never solve the mystery, the one per. some who could give. The answer is now beyond the jurisdiction of earthly courts. The affair is closed and involves no witches black magic or moonlight rights.
Much as I hate having to use norm diploma. I think you would appreciate it if you knew me, the only clues I can give you are that the person responsible for the crime died insane and nineteen forty two and the victim was dutch and arrived illegally in England above nineteen forty one. I have no wish to recall anymore Anna wow, So, of course they get this in their like. Ok, you're telling me that Bello is dutch. Yes, you're telling me that the person who killed her is dead and died in an insane. Apparently NEA. Tell me more tell me more lit. Tell me I like: does she have a car? so they begged they were like Anna come forward. Please so they put it in the paper. Please Anna just come forward, but always on what you know that could be. Anybody reining in Anna showed. Why Yeah, ok Anna showed up. She showed up at the police station. She came and she was I'll, tell you what I know so her real
was Una, Haines or, and she was going by annex as a first. She was like. I don't know. If I want ahead of the eye and she told him what she knew she said she was formally married to a man named Jack MOSS up and after see he was like five. Everything was good. They had of young son, they had got married. Everything was wonderful, but Sir Suddenly he just began like changing use drinking more. He was hanging out with unsavory characters you staying out late. He would suddenly of money when, like they didn't know, turn around yeah and he was hanging around a man called Van results, and she also mentioned another man, but I can't find his name yeah. They were apparently kind of bad news, spares ok according to her and she there were concerned so one night. She said he came home from being out very late with Van results and he confessed to her that he and this very wrong character had put a woman
in a tree oak, imagine of John came home I'll, see you and he says to you. He says I put a lady in a tree I'd really. While you should walk right away that you came in and never come back again, I will you should stick your own ass in a tree, rainbow cool letter that we're all gonna put just like. I have a true crime, Podcast Canton of the centre. You at a tree, so MOSS up and then Rob had apparently gone. People some versions of this have another man involved. I think there wasn't. It seems likely that there was another person they had gone for a drink at the Littleton arms, which was in haggling like a pub. Apparently this woman who D referred to as the dutch woman,
was with them and later that night, their driving back and her husband, Jack was driving Vanderbilt Car and the dutch woman according to him, was in between the two men and you in the back seat, and she said he said the woman was drunk or acting very strange here. She offered as was acting awkward, which shows like same allies like an integrated adoration and she just suddenly passed out while driving like like flopped over on to one of them. Now, One story says that been rolled thought. This was like. Oh, I have a funny thing. We can do cushy passed out and he was like, let's put her in the hollow of the tree, and she ll wake up in the morning and be like frightened and change in her her way. Oh ok cause who're you, which way you're damn ways my way that one doesn't seem as likely, but I think it was him trying to make it
I make area what uncle innocent the other. One says that, while they were driving Van Raul told with Jack that this dutch woman, he was like she's dead she's slumped over and he was like. Did she passed sounding like now? She added which is linked to the poison heard a yearning and he told him drive to Hamley would lay. He immediately was like DR there, and then he forced Jack to help them stuff. To the tree, oh man. Now he also was apparently so upset about this that he was sure he had just had a nightmare. He was like this wasn't real. This didn't happen, so he went back to the tree the next night. Then she was still there, so he had originally thought she was a german spy.
slick does it is like spy theories that war was during World war, two willing one. I was not going to go into the one that, like a lot of people, talk about because it's been proven false. So this just let her little reason to go into it, but the spy stuff just makes it even weirder yeah. I just think it's crazy so he started according to her after he told her. This thing's got bad. Obviously she was like what's happening. He started acting stranger and stranger, more and more erratic and volatile, so she left him to respond and she was like bye was really eating away at him. Well, he later told her after it, so they divorced and they still talked a little because he was having a lot of trouble, we heard about him and he was starting, he was saying that he was losing his mind because he kept having recurring nightmare of a woman's staring out at him from a tree. and when the police, one
Q and she could any said I I've having at every single night. I can't every time I close my eyes. I see this woman leering out me from such a hollow of. Why did you say it again? Leering at me from a hollow oratory had spread. clearly there and at me for raw materials like it's like the Tell tale art. Yes, it is the laser thing like more like a woman in a tree. So it's like the same think that so tariffs, so the police, when she tells them all this like hey, can we talk to Jack? whereas I bought this point. They didn't know that there were like word. They didn't know she's telling the truth about what they were like where's Jack and she was like well, he was committed to waste to the Stafford Mental Hospital because of this couldn't, with those recurring nightmares, he was literally like losing his mind and he died at twenty nine years old in the hospital Why and it was before the body and the witch hunt us at home. So he knew she was there and she hadn't been.
around and that was making him go crazy. Look at my arm, yes, because honestly- and this is record for the record- that he died in this dossier, ya its record- that he was complaining about these dreams and if she had been found, I dont think that would then the way, because I think he was having these weeks. No one found her right. No one was like, I think he proudly felt some sort of relief. If someone found her, but he was losing his mind because he knew she was there. No one knew he was the only one who's gonna tell someone man, you got it too late. Now so on record the way that honour our Anna, I would say on because a frozen visit Una well yeah, but she had originally set on a, but yet sooner she had written about this. She said I had no knowledge whatsoever of the haggling murder internal until an article appeared in the express and star newspaper? Neither had I
read anything before which I could in any way be connected with the incident I've told you about. I have not discussed the matter with anyone else not until I was reading the details and bearing in mind the possible date when the woman met her death that I and any way connected with my husband statement to me in March or April, one thousand nine hundred and forty one, and because of the articles referring to witchcraft, Xcetera cited in the first place to write a letter and sign and honour, so she was saying because the witchcraft suffers come out and she was like learning the details about this woman being found. She was connecting it with her husband and then she was like. I have to stop them from going further into this witchcraft, bullshit yeah, it's just not true right. She wrote I put sufficient clues in the letter, which would have helped him identify me, and it was only because of a sub,
when appeal in the newspaper, and because I felt I ought to say what I know of this matter that I decided to arrange to meet you. So she was like. I sent it thinking, I'm not gonna, say anything else, but when you guys asked me to come forward, I felt how kind on which to me is pretty like it's pretty awesome, yeah, so bringing us forward, because nothing really came of this he's dead. They couldn't find Van results, it's just so it all just kind of one eminent way. Silence though well in February two thousand and eighteen, a woman named Caroline Wilkinson was arm was asked to recreate Belle S, face the add on her skull. She actually had rebuilt. should the third spaced after they had found his remains under a car, grow parking garage, illegal and apparently she was like amazing at this. She
is a professor of cranial facial identification at Dundee University had to use photographs to do this. Why did they have to use photographs to do this? Because they lost her skull, whom they lost his skull whites, how do people Lucy things? seriously come on. It makes me crazy liquid. Where do you miss place, a human skull? They lost the skull, that's nuts, You live in Birmingham counselor Peter Douglas Osborne, who is like very invested in the delegation. I consider now expert on it said, sir, these have been conducted by the police museum volunteers and they have confirmed that we hold no exhibits and can find no documentation. That may relate to the case at either at either of the West Midlands Police museums, what I'll go public? Where did it go broke? I dont know
that makes me insane, but not Caroline Wilkinson was asked to do this. Facial reconstruction by the authors of the book I mentioned, and they were the ones to publish the facial reconstruction in the book and it's crazy to look at you look what they like the teeth than ever. You like. That's her, yeah. So what post photos but like definitely check out those two bucks, I highly highly recommend. Could they have so many cool like just features of the investigation in them all post them in the show notes but that's where we are the ones that we do not know who put bell in which on, but I am guessing, it was Jack MOSS up in Van Ralph victory family now yeah. Why Now that we really did that one cause, I defiling Philip. I learned a lot more this time. Oh yeah, there was much more than this one and I feel better about it
the Jha like you here. I know you guys feel that way to every also hope you keep listening and we hope you keep it as river. You get turned himself the way in which on, even though you not serve you, boys and men were not like it. They just started yeah, don't put day body in a tree. Nor do it that's the moral of the story refresh your summer. It why? Why beat the heat with our handcrafted, smooth, easing repression or refresher handcrafted with one hundred percent real fruit juice and green tea, Robert Juba Dating Burst of Energy Trier, Delicious flavors mango passion, fruit or strawberry, dragon, fruit, refreshes and mix barrier strawberry bananas. Smoothie crafted keep you cool so repression your summer with our handcrafted repression in smooth these made brush your way at. Why? Why.
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Transcript generated on 2021-07-01.