« My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark

29 - Episode: Twenty-Nein

2016-08-11 | 🔗
Karen and Georgia discuss family-annihilator John List, as well as Warriena Tagpuno Wright who fell 14 floors to her death. Plus a hometown murder by comedian Matt McCarthy.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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welcome to my favorite murder that's caring caldera that is georgia hard start you don't know and can tell our voices apart still as pretty weird someone famous i am i love when the truth hometown murders are people sending and like i know secret information about the case you already covered yeah because i know people from the whatever the fuck we love that someone was like last week send us one it was like karen i'm so you disappoint you but it was my case ya like how sorry nowheres hearted disappointed there's that happens a lot when people talk about i love one
think they say like karen says oh my fucking god during when door just telling it whatever it was it was like the reverse and i knew it was for shark as it was like one of your phrases yeah she's but in christ the army night i just think its precious it somewhere like illegal or ignore such different people there was a second thing on facebook that was like are you carrying our georgia does cone walker even though it has to be me where they both better now everyone loves you and i'm not a vicious everyone like i'm a current but my best friend is a georgia such fine i may karen heartily and then people will we're like it's funny how people what explained to other people how you can tell the difference between us and its that you sing everything yes that's me and i also have a scratchy voice times sometimes might i smoke cigarettes you yeah i didn't kill him sometimes
then you can tell you can actually you can tell how many have been smoking as like right now i've been talking to know why i'm scandalised by an hour you because you never told me and i feel like i thought we i thought i know i did also because it such a special thing that you do well i think it's wonderful that you have at times you're so more sometimes at my house like i'm home at the end of the naive great backyard what else you can either fires not but you are sometimes i just stick my fear i know you're living the law if i want to know it's pretty and i dont mind it but it's also lake i'm tired and i don't care to drink anymore and i don't get you anything anymore so i'll just smoke a little hand rolled dolly shags you samarova marcel yap karen
this is why everyone wanted to be because i'm so fuckin european they were saying like karen's about us and i want to be i think it's good i'm scared of everything and talk about their appeal is is you're honest about your anxieties nemo's i just tried to kill me just the most insane say every one small little hit me where i'm like alive actually said that allowed in it at least these recordings are permanent there's nothing we can do about it i am and i have actually been like no care when end is currently there's gonna be no record of this set of letter when happened the andes come oh yeah yeah i am not going to write off but will the grids gonna go down and they won't matter what's record of because we will be able to acquiesce delta is the first spoken as the first airplane line little good and no just went down like yesterday dont aware there a blackout
annually at their main hub everything was grounded and it's like across the country i know there is just a glitch like bull shit shit i whenever i hear those things it was excellent there is just a glitch no way don't even now there was was the lizard men that are underneath the denver airport they are they are down there and their fuck with the mainframe man don't even how much did you love as soon as i heard this i'm a stranger things that they had fuck em hey ultra line but we really line did you watch it all now i think i have like to laugh at our three left have you been to leave possible eleven months house yet now yes but they mention am k ultra allowed our why she's like that yeah because she was one of the people they are experiencing on
has anyone listen to this i don't want to i don't spoil any i asked boilers ok i missed that detail i just thought they say i'm caille tran only share of that do you like it one thousand times more yeah ok back and get through i do on be honest when i been hot shows a special netflix and you just can t like it hit enter on the blue box and then you just keep going they'll be terms or just fall asleep and i don't even know which one i'm on i just wake up and keep watching whatever's on i have the kind of insomnia that you can't fall asleep in front of television her fallen is asleep and of maybe wrestling that's means that while we be more different now how i policy very nice is very bad for you too to sleep and from it he will now i wonder how about it as i do that i can't fall asleep now without listening to the sea maybe cast out like a hat
you're his slave i'm his slave so i wonder if some data gonna believe it's worse falling asleep the tv cause he's infiltrated my dream that's right well if he is remained cale ter your screwed oh yeah ok with do you think he he so great you're fine weather environment that whatever his agenda might be like someone elvis whenever one and no one is like oh they ain't you got a virus from cats and it takes over your brain and makes you a zombie i'm out here he's some key so names he says we a few things i need it to be a zombie than you know he knows what's best for me sure absolutely yeah so you know you're gonna go whether europe zombie for a cat or you get hit by a bus you are going to leave this earthly playing a hustle just accept it yeah
his head smells like a library book but the girl who was in love with her care are eight give housekeeping i have a housekeeping that makes me very happy because its twofold housekeeping it was a tweet that my hero nikko casing songwriter nikko case tweeted even a tiny little happy clap from steel and just yeah we oliver love make ok don't tell me that the connection was lost and there was a loading here mono basically she retweeted this story i m pretty sure as from the cdc about how their government the canadian government is now opening an investigation on all the missing in
a genius women in canada so that's like all the women so you know like robert picton i'm i'm going to eventually do one on him if you don't beat me to it she's the pig farmer in canada that was just murdering women and they think it was in the hundred city feed yeah yeah it's a bad one it's so i wouldn't tangled it's yours ok cause it's too dark it's too let's do something for me when i turn away at him and pigs human being i am now it's just i m here i don't know well so there's a shoe making a murderer
in a lot of different ways gladsome well there's just a there's been a bunch of and this is very in amerika i think our version of it is women of color black women that get murdered and it's just as it no one talks about it isn't you you see all the little blonde girls always on the news if they are go missing are murdered reality doesn't happen with black women and so the canadian version i think is indigenous women indian women is the incorrect term for it but so the there's the highway of tears where we are disappearing on it rubber picked and they named another guy that i didn't recognize the name how picton is the right one and you know what i want you mass murderers because i feel like i won't give enough time to each of the women i'd rather do as this is what the victim was who the victim was their story right then here's the murderer was and it's like then there's nineteen women rate yeah i know them that's ok this is bad as yours but anyway it's it it's like honey
season of indignant indigenous women have gone missing in the last say if i could open this article i would god i would be accurate was argued but now let's go down upon i can give you my wifi connection i know every time you get upset that lets father legit none allow its fine kiss the general ideas yes what negro case was trying to get the word out about and i i retorted it on our twitter feed as well as just the government is trying to do something about it there trying to find the women there trying to investigate the murders they're trying to actually put a focus and say these women are important just as important as anybody else and we're going to do something about this which is humongous did that a country like on the whole just admit that they haven't up until this point and now they're going to it's incredible it's really great that's it's very helpful to me here about like this it feels like a new era in crime thank you
the net in the name of the article is just how and unflinching gaze on missing and murdered indigenous women might move canada forward incredible very cool and at what i was right to say they see news i'll take it if its even that small i will take and accuracy moment i will not take it away from you think you're appreciate it that's i mean that's really look the whole story that's i'm still trying to think of a way that we can donate part of the proceedings are like help some way with the untested rape kit situation marcia
russia moscow harvey tat thank you i want to give her all my money and leg do it help georgia was in america so an caring and she gave a multi millionaire all her money for him here and orderly was like do this arduous suing karen i think that's it we're headed all and lit a lawsuit between you and i i didn't see that coming as it my undiagnosed manic took no i don't think we call it the big giveaway georgia really just none and i think that's a really good idea i would love to the proceeds of something that we urge money for because yes podcast goes to those untested only have line shows like were eager eyes were in the fuckin process of leg
having life should be a part of our lives yes and a part of your lives text will you know invite people texas little what we got some numbers back that was a brag but we got some numbers back and hey taxes turns out you like i thought i was so surprised by that we both started laughing so hard but it makes sense yeah that's texas hangers has some murders texas knows what they are talking in terms of murder can i just say that once we got all those we gotta less like information about our numbers and then we were driving home and we almost had a pull over to start crying with how happy we both whereby how well this is how like how what a great
it's pretty nice pretty great is pretty nice at work we're getting popular because we talk about death yeah i think that's love well of you guys were listening ok i have again thank you very much for this before i talk about our teacher if i want to say that on the facebook page right now this is fucking incredible and because last week i talked about we talk about breaking and entering and how can you tell if a break in a stage or a robberies aged are real someone on facebook set page said something about real being paid i may be able to help you out i'm a real life burglar not me more but like seven years ago i did two and a half years for home burglary and i know a lot about it all now please hold so you gonna forget is this a woman what
girl burglar yap box she has i'm not doing that anything like that any more now i'm just completely reformed and clean so don't hate me i'm just an overall but to answer questions about how real life burglars do their work so it's an eia may from effect lady burglary and everyone everyone without gas is like i mean maybe like this giving her all the prompt she deserves and asking so many questions so just look up now be they announced a baby anti voice like i think it's wrong to promote cry i know it's not i just scroll down and there's like so many hilarious means the one of of what's his name from essen el even popcorn lessening oh yes bill hate our bill hater with this crazy idea that issues like so many great questions i can't even get to them all but so you i just need to go in its turn
nicky i'm ok i just like search it's not a roma i now search on facebook page like burglar find it oh my god i can't wait till i had two i've miss i haven't been on their awhile didn't have time even read it i just got so excited about it and then if it can pull my notes from under my cat i also want to say that we have our main logo teaching
it's available for the first time it's i shan t spring dot com slash my favorite murder it's just a short run from now whenever is now until august twenty third just to see how it goes so go by one of those are just hoodies o someone on twitter asked are they are two percent cotton or they cotton polly blend i dont know and that's you can actually get that information anti spring of spring has fuckin size charts and all information united net you know exactly what you're getting aunties maria and there like anything you're happy with you can return beautiful it's easy getting an actual self operating business yes sir you dont georgia have to become the president of teacher company short and i have a month a reality at an intern it's like make that that dough or just don't have distress and here i mean edging towards her and so on it say really quickly that
and therapy and therapy i want i talked about was that how crazy i am and how much anxiety i have because when i go to the back of my building to do laundry i lock my front door and how crazy at that i think someone's gonna break in and then i read an article there's effect echo park rapists and one of the ways he kind to her house was when she was big fucking laundry in the back of our apartment and after door unlocked when there is it it's not exactly when you're just being careful eye texts in my therapist article included in your face best nokia she was like that you know yeah now she does want to see me and you have to say is that if a funnel still she what could she was like you know were allowed to take certain precautions and that's ok and you can do that but when you start you know apply then it's a shoe supported it and i was like i feel so justified yeah you are just about you know so its border i bet nicky she'd be like committee would be like yeah that was an obvious crime community says you're doing the right thing your grand community for supporting me will also that
i mean jesus christ that's an hour a yes to a there are no shame and locking things devil i lock people walk by in the crosswalk and their part of my branches they might be able to hear it if you lock the door when like i don't give a shit doesn't matter much louder voice it says sorry to offend you but you don't get too in case the idea right maybe your on some white dress like when you are sitting at a stop sign in someone goes to walk by and you go click to lock your card or yeah yeah i'm gonna get mad at me fuck you because new memory but that's the way less monolithic creepy i get the idea because you're giving me the i also don't we said this million times fuck politeness politeness with julia there should be no listeners who don't yet no one to four oh yeah of politeness and you'll feel learned there's a ton of stuff a lot of experience is no life that'll make you make your question
how about if your gun between the laundry room and your house lock your goddamn no logic fucking door like it if you live in a major city her not at your vs house lush it feels really good because a literally that that was a worry every single time i walk out back is i come in the door and i check for the cats because if the cats were still out where they were that meant no one was in there because but if they were hiding that would mean someone came in the house right that's crazy no no that's a good theory that's a theory based on observation gap now huh all around thank you thank you i'll get you tube is that all our housekeeping last time we had so much i think i was alive oh yeah the top dollar
dull up sold out some that was not a well i pod fast yes uptown twenty that weaken respectable twenty third that's gonna be fun in the ball room in the ball pair we are performing a ball pet we got that awesome tweet from home with me let me namely by native give her twitter a shot out she meets all the followers ballpark girl we had announced us weaken it excited because we were in the ballroom and then we're talking about maybe that's a good thing which sounds really good and then someone name blake bourgeois on twitter
i they do is her is her handle sent as a picture of basically like the make the ikea ball pit and at his head how great would it be if this was the ballroom at alike but all of us and we laughed so oh my god or such a long time so now we are doing our lives shown the ball at ellie pod fest be there if you can end if you can't be there you can live stream it i just email the information about that live stream less so next week we will give everybody what we know or at least more information than i may be able to give you right now you can watch it if you can't be there you can i think pay a nominal fee and watch you ever you want to watch life which is really cool it's gonna be a great the whole podcast vests like revenge about asses so many call people yeah yeah yeah now is the time it's time the terrible shine it's time for us to guess who went first last time
positive you went first okay but it doesn't mean anything because i'm always wrong no you're you're and that is all that matters is i was really excited that you were confident about it so i believe it here's what i've learned so last week i came prepared with two because i thought georgia needed to pre record a right and so i had gotten a jump on my research on blue so then but then we didn't have to do to size like oh good because i kind of half ass that second one so now got to like
ass in a half this why wishes i jump on it which is kind of you know the zol a journey about me doing my homework but i'm excited about it guilty about every week the element that i dont do it i don't think we understood when we started this what it was actually gonna turn into which was the seriousness of accuracy and facts we do we discuss a lot but i mean thea harrier episode twenty nine going oh yeah yeah we have to know we're talking about a kind of your technical tenerife so i've known him this one for a long time because it is made famous by that great american television show america's most wanted haliae do you remember the americas most wanted about john less the man who killed his entire family and then disappeared for nineteen year see yes you do you yeah full that's my favorite murder for this week let me hear it i'm going to tell you all about it sir john list was exit
next successful business man he was a devout lifelong lutheran he was a sunday school teacher he was a boy scout leader a husband of there are three his family lived with his mother said their grandmother in a sprawling nineteen room mansion called breeze knoll she's in west field new jersey but behind close doors things are not going well shocking this is me kind of trying to write like a you know twenty twenty version of this this is this is a narrative this is i'm really trying to put something into this and it might really work ass well because as i see it feels a bit sweaty right now i feel like i'm trying odds hot it also is very its summer in los angeles so john lives lists wife helen which they didn't none of this you knew from america must why oh i love this tell me his wife helen was an alcoholic who was
really abusive and unstable she's out fine when you see the picture of the list family her eyes are going into different directions which she dressed wilbur yes was the picture i think was from like the mid sixty so they look like any family and we're gonna just picture her like us a party and she just drunk and like but she looks amazing yes i love it let she's got like a jackal outfit on her face is lake is slight kooky eyes and like labels above her head like talking loudly about their bedroom secrets oh yeah girl you just nailed to shut up ok ready oh my god so she
demanded that at that john by her that colonial mansion in west field which is a very rich see apparently town in new jersey or wasn't this set sixtys and seventys when john landed his high status position as bank vice president and comp trawler which is one of my favorite words nay english language saga comp trawler i dont know what it means i love to say i'm running for cop trawlers from this year okay so what no one knew as it john had recently been fired from being a bank president i'm comp trawler stress and you even though he was an ambitious career man could never hold a job for more than a couple of years because of his personality problems personally issues quote on quite all right
but he couldn't let us family now that i've gotten fired so every day he got up and he put on his suit and grabbed his briefcase any went to the train station like you is going to work and those people terrify me yes it's such deep denial it's insane denial of like that everything's by and then there's crazy things boiling under me this those people man yeah so he would sit at the translation i read newspapers all day until it was time to quote unquote come home for we should write and meanwhile he was skimming money off of his mother's bank account so he could pay him crazy mortgage on his colonial team room mansion and all the other bills are piling up so short john list was lutheran fuck up under pressure lets a virus so here's the plan
he on the morning of november nineteen seventy one after his children had left for school john walked into the kitchen where his wife was drinking her morning coffee at the kitchen table any walked up and he shot in the back of the head with a nine millimeter handgun wow then he went upstairs to the third floor of their mansion where his mother had her own like what are the sweet vs her a little apartment wing wing whale wing of the mansion and he shot her in the head right over her left eye it's too me sounds like he shot her face to face oh yeah which is pretty intense she's zahm he drove to the bank and he closed his account and his mother's accounts any cashed in his mother savings bonds
he came home he went to a steady he collected small photos and documents concerning the mansions history and you put them in a neat pile on his desk and he composed a letter a thank you letter to john wiki who was a descendant of the original owner of the house a ship you know the important diarrhea then he also wrote for other letters he called arbiter who is the woman who car pulled his sons john and fred to roosevelt junior high school and she had done that for the last time that morning only he made an excuse that the whole family was led into go to north carolina the next morning because hellenes mother was extremely ill and he promised tat he would let her know when they were coming back then he cancelled the newspaper milk delivery and he asked the post office to hold the male until further notice there going to be further notice absolutely not so now this lunch time so he made himself along
she now sat down at the table where he had just shot his wife and then cleaned up the blown off the table bologna are cold meat loaf i would guess bologna cause he's just like he's all business he just wants to get proteins and calories bologna on white with must stirred with mustard only and some do their bit the ship spectin i dont think john less ready potato jokes i think he would eat too sandwiches instead of having a side care and that was the best deal that was what i was looking for because i loved booed detail that's mine opinion of jobless and that was that was beautiful yeah that's the kind of i can understand that like that such a dude move i am like you could have chips the only thing you want with so much on your double down because licence pickles or nice but i always you know me in the starches array
everyone can you just don't keep him your house i eat them off that's right i mean that you won one so there he went around and cut himself out of every family photo in the entire house why that the craziest paradigm is to me i did it as a stand alone because it's the creepy as fact to me in this whole case it's fucking creepy is so creepy then come now it's early afternoon so he's waiting for his children to come home from school patricia who was sixteen a drama nerd and it was the he shot nineteen seventy one so she had been caught smoking pot there's the coolest she was cool and he came home he shot in the back of the head then his son frederick the youngest to his thirteen came home he shot him in the back of a heavy so they don't even know that their father no end
and he actually in the court later reveal that that he did it his if an his kids back there and so that they didn't know what happened what mom stories mother was a different story which is very telling me let's get so tell me more but then also john junior is a different story the fifteen year olds who is named after him and supposedly his favorite there's a couple different versions of this sum said he just came straight home from school but the one i like the best which is the one i will tell you is that he had a soccer game that day so jobless drove to the school watched his son soccer game drove him home try to shoot him but he some may be saw the gun and freaked out so he ended up shooting him in the face and chest overt when
well so overkill crazy fucking overkill hands and knew what was happening as as it went once in the chest and once in the face i yet something went worse and wrong that or he hated him more like something went ashley wrong for ten times yes because this was a man that was doing it ghana neatly uncleanly angstrom randy's systematically he was lake check off a list sure but when it came this guy wasn't john junior didn't play ball and made it hard for him and i think that's like the rage can yellow how dare you are making this too hard for me not even like your showing me how one horrible i am no no you're ruining my man you're ruining my good time only on its hideous so then he dragged he got sleeping bags from down from the basement and he put all the bodies on the sleeping bags then drag them into the back of the house
what room a ballroom yes but if you just hence legally bag set up on station the ballroom andalusia and we have a contest who can drag who around the furthest yeah they had a ballroom in this mansion that wasn't even decorated or furnished in anyway that's how big the south house was line so he pulled his wife and three children's dead bodies on sleeping bags back into the ballroom he put a piece of cloth over each of their faces and he left them there are turned into basically like a makeshift morgue then he said the children's pet fish in the twenty gallon tank in the dining room lutz went upstairs and went to sleep holy shit yeah so he's are the they show k that kind of thought this man is happening is that as a fish ok is this i mean as much as because i need to put a name on things is a sociopath alive
we'll talk about the name later but i he probably i mean i don't know enough any time it's like clearly have no feeling yeah that's what i want to label it i need to buy some study he is the real term for this guy's a family and i later and like a thing that happens and there's a couple different kind and you'll never kill anyone else again kind of thing yes right it's it's a situational thing for me tell me or okay so the next ring he gets up he gets dressed he goes down stairs he turned the thermostat all the way down she turns on every light in the house who and then he leaves the house any leaves westerfield forever now the weird thing is no one noticed course no one in the neighborhood notice that this family was not there and then
because they this family did not socialize we're just gonna com and if you have a crazy drunk yom like they state and they didn't talk to anybody the neighbors new john list as the guy who mode his long in a suit and tie she says i think i'm a suspicious power the that all the lights on that's right you honeymoon yeah like nobody especially in a nineteen romantic like sorry nobody's in the greenhouse no reason the brightest a house on the block they're not having a party so because of all this careful planning and because they were basically anti social and reclusive took a full month for anybody to actually discover these bought a month a full month
so the neighbors noticed that these lights were on day and night and that they were always on and that they started burning out and that's when they shouted getting suspicious oh that's creep in your majesty link one room is out and then the next room as yet and never comes back on so clear and no one's coming in or out of the house so some super creepy is happening up there that i'll see you don't want to think about it because what could it be that would be that we are here but who does is the most cinematic think of all the stories because patties drama teacher is the one who's like i don't like the smell of this oh my his name was at when italy on elm he thought it was weird that the entire family was gone that long and also he had a terrible feeling because patty once told him in family goes on vacation my data killed us i knew she talk to him about something yet she's said that she said to him so after
you know twenty eight days only need also met him once in thought he was super we're oh my god i'm so after twenty eight days edwin alien convinces us associate barber shared and to go to the house with him to check on patty and they drive up there they try to look into some windows and there being their makes the neighbors call the cops because they see people finally on the property ia and when the cops show up and when explains to them it some of the neighbors william and shirley kunak are their names they're the ones it while the police and patrol officers george hell's nick and charles heller were the first to arrive so alien explains what's going on and the officers decide they're gonna force open a window and go inside and when they open that window there hit with a smell adapt thankee so i this might be my previous detail when they go into the house
this thing they notice is that there's organ music playing loudly over the house intercom mccrae afraid because there's an inner common this house because there's organ is so you're jealous of the inner cognac set so cool off yap an organ music is the quickest john this set up they kept calling it a recorder and all these articles that i read you do research you realize everyone rips africa it is how larry s insane so calling something or a quarter makes no sense it sounds like it's the instrument children plain grammar school here which would be increasing just a child playing over quarter rather like oh god now ok it's gonna go deep go on he had set up a thing that just played this music on a loop until you physically turned it off and then added to play
over the intercom was like an old machine or something i guess so i mean the color recorded maybe a recording device or like a real to real yeah yeah that sounds really is of a seventy one that so so i said to things organ music is good for ice skating in mass murdering see it's too i'm trying too hard now need to keep a cat conversational so upstairs and studied they find a five page letter that list had written to his pastor eugene renwick
our amendment nine or no its leg bad writing like let what shall we named the old pastor eluded unchartered eugene ran winkle only so in that letter he said he felt the seventies were ascend full time and then his family was beginning to succumb to temptation especially his daughter because our interest in acting which an occupation that list viewed as being particularly corrupt and linked to satan with true fuckin solely them all yes so the holy religious thing to do is kill everybody john so as i he throws a mercy killing that's exactly right he saw too much evil in the world he had killed his family to save their sole concern us at any fuckin back were and also how giving now he said he didn't kill himself
because let's hear it but he didn't kill himself because suicide is a mortal sailing over that would definitely bar him from heaven as opposed to murdering five people where you're still in a grey area that can be negotiated what are you talking of nurses narcissism extremely zooms yes i see apathy i deftly narcissism i dont think the saucy passing might not apply only because this is the one off people yet mattocks people get matters is a five off sorry as fellow ok you're not saying on their narcissists or murderers ray
however this is an extreme case of nurses yeah i'd say it's a element in this personality disorder yeah i'm a narcissist i've never kill anybody exit foreign comedy ok care later a reporter who covered the trial described hearing this letter when it was read aloud in court and he said quote i'll never forget the audible sigh of shock from the jury and spectators when the last line of lists redder letter was red p s mother is in the hallway in the attic third floor she was too heavy to move my god dang that's your mom yeah sitting on his living like a moving box that you just like thing here someone take care that upstairs like it's your ladder do you think you might have had a slight problem where her ok so a nation wide mannheim is launched but he's got a month
lead time he's way ahead please investigated hundreds of leads without success all reliable photographs of list had been destroyed wasn't i was creep down yeah out it was kind of like savers mar yeah oh i didn't get i catch on that i did not either the family car was found at kennedy airport but there is no evidence he had boarded a flight he gone and would remain gone for eighteen year than on may twenty first nineteen eighty nine forward forward into the eightys the murders were recounted on america's most wanted which at the time and been on the air less than a year only do and it featured and age progressed per age per sorry age progressed clay bust voted by the friends ec artist bender and it took
to bear an almost exact resemblance to lists appearance maybe i'm making this a foot i fuckin remember seeing that oh you remember cause i'm about to hold up a picture to her i got i was nine so like old enough to remember this yes and this was i remember it i was nineteen all ground on bail bender consulted a frantic psychologist and created a psychological profile of list he looked at photographs of less parents and predicted knowing it would look like as he a holy shit he gave him or seeding hairline and sagging jaws bender was particularly lauded for one final touch he added to his completed our work it was a pair of glasses bender believed list would not be vain enough to wear contact lenses however he said list would have worn a pair of glasses different from those he wore before the murders he said they would be a pair with thick dark frames he and the psychologist theorized at least would do this to hide innocence he would want to disguise the fact that he was a failure and appear more important than he really was a shirt so he put these big old glasses member that i remember this is real john less all this is that sculpture we fuck it's fucking like exact
look this upbringing now isn't crazy but we'll put it put it on social media up at this on our instead but this frank bender nailed it so rarely less than two weeks later they got a ton of calls but less than two weeks later they find him in virginia and the various parties in the court john list reveals he was watching the show that night with his new wife and he was quoted as saying i was perfect perspiring like anything but his wife did recognising that in no way you had a fuckin she had it veil of i can't sit back and eyes and i bet a little then rose a little arose a little bottle arose as you'd all kinds of different veils yahoo mail ok so there a trial
he explained that he had lost his job he explained he was dealing with his wife's alcoholism and trial reveal untreated tertiary syphilis then she had con contracted for our first husband and army lieutenant who was killed in combat and korea and concealed for eighteen years so his crazy wife that used a verbal abuse em and publicly i may biscuit that part but there's o notes in this part he says in court that she used to publicly insult him about it i guess that completely you go you absolutely out to no avail phyllis makes your fuckin bananas he
said by by then the disease and excessive alcohol consumption had according to testimony transfer transformed her from an attractive young women to an unkempt a paranoid recluse who frequently and often publicly disparaged list comparing his sexual skills unfavourably those of her first husband one who gave her civil affairs as well as the changes that scared the shit out of me so here's me playing the prosecuting attorney mister can you explain how your wife often disparages year sexual skills and public if she's a recluse no more questions your honour and i turned my blazer down under the right so basically john last trip makes all these excuses in court he's like i have ptsd from being in the army what does he say i await a smoker
he no longer it was my wife my kids were going crazy i was be used as a child my father always told me that you had brought provide for your family and that you had to do this you have to do that and i wasn't doing anything any of those things cause i lost my job blah blah blah so appointed psychiatrists testified list suffered from obsessive compulsive personality disorder and he i saw two solutions to a situation except welfare or kill his family and send them to heaven welfare was unacceptable because it would expose him in his family to ridicule and violate his authoritarian fathers teachings level so this a common thing with family annihilate errors they say there are two types and one is a livid coercive killer and those are the ones that are usually abusive and the
kill the family when the family tries to run away from way so it's years of abuse years of abuse the family tries to escape and then excite me sit as all the time now i'll teach you all yes but the other kind is the civil reputable killer and there motivated by a perverse form of altruism so it's his way all rescuing the family from shame and hardship and in his obsessive compulsive narcissism john list didn't choose to fix his own problems but instead he fixated on the family problems on the problems of society eighty percent of family and i leaders kill them souls after killing their family that's when in my opinion john lists argument of this i was doing the best for the family mass down because
he went on to live a happy life for nineteen years in colorado and what sorry that the part that i was getting over as he basically told everybody what happened was that the day after the murders he took the trained from new jersey to michigan and then from mission in colorado he said in denver he took an accounting job as robert peter clark and limit the subtle yeah plain but then also excited here exciting anyway because of lives he was the controller paper box manufacture enver he was they said controller i want to say cop trawler internet it's our second started that's right
and then when you do he joined lutheran congregation ran a carpet for shut in church members and met an army p s clerk named loris miller and married her a nineteen it's almost like he's trying to prove himself that he is actually a good person yet was just circumstantial it was them his wife his alcoholic syphilis sick wife his hippy daughter rebellious children they ruined for him i feel like the fifties that might have worked better than in the seventies and eighties that excuse or like associated eightys but like that they came to an end seems like right now well that was also lake
all this variety of like there's only a father that's the breadwinner under the mother the no one gets divorced and this is the the american dream of a house in two kids while that bullshit everyone got sold that every one kind of hard to swallow whole basically lazo john list was abused as a child which is a very common thing and family and i and i leaders because they get there feel powerless they felt powerless as children so when they have families there exerting power family to give them that power now and higher and charge exactly and then when that doesnt work they don't know how to deal with a moment when when the seventies come in the daughters like i'm gonna go crazy yellin there's a fuckin cultural revolution in the country and your daughter's like i think i might want to act here instead of being a devout lutheran yeah you said they their train
create double the life they never had that they fantasize of as abuse children and then when that goes to shit there just more starting over area essentially here i guess the debate and this has a great twist ending good so that he was he was convicted of five counts murder of and the judge said john john emel list is worth without remorse and without honour after eighteen years five months and twenty two days it's now timeframe for the voices of helen alma patrick patricia frederick and john f list to rise from the great spirit of any imposed a sentence of five terms of life imprisonment to be served consecutively maximum penalty and list died of pneumonia in prison on march twenty first two thousand eight while body was
claimed ticket lose gama working claim he like a long time he really did the second wife didn't returned the call more was like oh we have your she's alone at my hello but eventually someone took him back and it was buried next to his mother in michigan ashes legs like this guy yeah out of here you show me the fucking face and then wouldn't even carry me the ballroom but are you ready for this twist ending though that's not it yeah this is it so somebody burnt down breeze nor the greater the great mansion some needs no one's ever even looked into who might have done it goes it it could be a good about a ghost i ask those new jersey goes fire but destroyed along with the home was the ballroom stained glass skylight
which was a signed tiffany original she's worth at least two hundred thousand dollars at the time which would have covered his spend says it was right the whole time in that room muted and go in gives you could deal with that my god it's gonna be signs in a ring to morrow and john thus john list everybody also because he disappeared and seventy one and db koper db cooper they thought he was dead were wild is a kind of looks like that sketching mr vague hands db cooper some two hundred thousand dollars was kind of around in they figured around how much john owed a sure it wasn't him the list vehemently denied it from jail that's how fucking boring disguise
no i'm not i'm no i insist i'm not db cooper long it could have been call if you were if it maybe he does it but it was him here i don't think this guy would have jumped out of a plane he was too details wife he got fired no one can ever he thought does delusions like trees asked me about jesus would how bout you did help out he gave him at a beautiful skylight activity skylight the lord was right there all along you know who ever burnt on ourselves fuck and permanent know that two year there were some rossini ran up at the and the last what are you at least get the thing you ghosts in your arson all right what's yours so i have one that i learned about recently because it happened recently in work and care and we're gonna do a little play ok this hole at the steam what does this day a mom drama drama teachers you mean for them
sat beside the drama teachers opposition are eight so we're rina right w h are i e any marina right was ninety six from new zealand and she went to queens and australia on july twenty ninth twenty fourteen to celebrate friends wedding checks into a motel on august sixth and then on the following day is like let's see who's on tender age and others when no she fuckin tenders if a girl six like a little bit look garthie at night in ashes hot so she finds gable hosty s he's he is high ladies man they meet up outside of a bar on this text i just want to say by the next morning marina will be dead after
from his gables fourteen tore balcony scales ass none then back there by nine p m there in apartment on the fourteenth floor cousin beautiful building so somehow gable which is a great name isn't it was his first name first name i like it for some reason he starts recording going on inside with a voice for quarter police somehow extracted it from like mobile phones our found i think i was trying to they traded jelly he trying to delete it didn't happen they were able to get it so so there's there's a whole there's a whole conversation that's rewarded academia so amateur reed but i of having to read i highlighted your parts ok here your war rina i'm gable
let me read it to you also so at one am the sound quarter started and its later ceased but the recording starts musics heard and twenty seconds and other according the man states fuck me one or two i am the man asks the female to chill and have a drink and she says she is i must psycho drunk and do not tell me then if our between went one if i went away the pair talk about death the male says throw me off the balcony and that's it this is it boom then on sixteen m there's laughing sounds are heard and sounds of hitting our heard as well but the music continues to play in the background that was scary as if on cue and there are soft sounds of growing and growing at one hundred and twenty nine a dot m the mail says i don't like getting beaten up
at one if thirty six an argument begins when female says she's leaving and cant find her i found she says are you going to fucking untie me because i will fucking destroy your jaw events locked the door and scared ever loving ever loving doin may we ma am elvis ten zero ok you gonna tell me about so at one thirty eight the man says i should never gave me so much to drink i thought we were going to have fun and they asked her to calm down one forty one i am the man asks the female to stay but says just a bit and violent he off
the cook some food and the conversation comes down at one fifty three am drinks are more drinks are poor the stuff shrinking you yeah what you already decided the drinkings bad yet that's who i am the occupant of the apartment below is woken up by the noise to ten i am they are recording in the audio recurring them male tells a female drawer relax and threatens to kick her hours ass a two eleven am their sounds of struggle a minute later the sounds of rocks possibly being thrown in the apartment is heard a too fourteen the man says that's enough you have worn out you're welcome you have to leave the female out of breath says so two hundred and fifteen a dot m the man says i thought you were kidding and i have taken enough this is fucking bullshit you're lucky i haven't checked you off my balcony you goddamn psycho little bitch
to succeed in the female whose breathing heavily accuses him of being success and then says lay off through which the male replies seriously what at two hundred and seventeen a dot m the man says you're a goddamn psycho i'm going to let you go i'm going to walk you out of apartment just the way you are you are not going to collect any of your belongings you're just going to walk out and i'm going to slam the door on you you understand if you try and pull anything i'll knock you out do you understand the female says i'm so sorry i don't care okay so the at two hundred and seventeen a dot m sounds of struggling and heavy breathing are heard the man says let go of it let go let go let go at two hundred and eighteen first choking sound i heard breathing slows male let it go sounds of a metallic object dropping is heard at two twenty eight am the door adore unlocks and the female states know the sound of glass of glass door possibly being head to toe the man says
do you think you are hey the females oh no no no no no no no no no the male says you tried to kill me hobble why did you try and hit me with that shit filthy mouth the female screen names now she's screaming no no no no no no the man says it's all on recording you're now it's all being recorded the female want more knows just let me go home the males as i would when a bad girl and then the sounds are heard of adore slamming shut up police at this alleged that he left her out on the balcony miss strain on the balcony the female says just let me go home just let me go home to twenty one i am females five hours or hers let me go home faint screaming is heard your look you're looking at me like i'm gonna as horrible okay so that damn right so the occupant in the apartment below his
here's a female repeatedly shouting no and then sees two legs dangling down so what's going on right now is either is crazy and drunk and jumping or she's terrified of this person and trying to get in the balcony below yeah though that we witness has in a matter of seconds i saw the person's half in the balcony above mine to twenty one a college placed from gables sancho his lawyer the causes and connected to twenty three a triple which i'm guessing his name on it all is placed by the woman in apartment below please her of the scene and at the same time the five key to his apartment is activated close caption cameras capture a male believed to be gable approaching the front entrance of the apartment any walked back to the elevator and rights to the basement
two hundred and twenty nine sounds of walking i heard on the audio recording which is still going from earlier in the night so he has the phone or whatever he's using to record what's going on with or in the apartment with hand with her she's like in the end the sorry recording this entire evening recording the whole thing and people said he might have done it because he was like a creepy pervert and like to record these things or he took a lot of women and this is a way to make sure that nothing we now just to have it if they go crazy or neither waits sketches three ten i am he orders pizza here he says i'm a piece of pizza supreme please orders a fucking as a pizza and three times three i am a calls place to his father he says hello dad i might have gotten a bit of a situation i went i meant it for a day she sorry getting aggressive
drinking and i think she thought it was a joke and she kept like beating me up cushions really drunk i forced her out on the balcony and i think she might have jumped off the dad says oh no are you ok so there's melon cops bucking walking around i'm fucked up at all to do that he says i don't know i like i tackled her on my floor inside the building and i never forced her over the edge so the dad picked him up and eventually he is arrested and so yeah oh he's claiming he's innocent she jumped he has something to do with it he didn't pusher over the edge it's not murder he sk i am he said her trial on august on october thirteenth twenty sixteen
free right now is out on bond and heat he can't stop talking he's posting shouldn't make bodybuilder start com he's just he's doesn't understand why people are plant he he has to be some went narcissistic at low you may like he needs to say his what he thought of it if it is also saying things about how many women he's been weapon he's never hurt them whose bragging about that how nice is a permit was how well he does i a witch hunt but they secures think he can be collected for murder because she reportedly in fear of her life and was trying to flee him today firstly allow those neighbours the prosecutor say that ok and i'm really interest i really like not but i'm really interested in murder by suicide is really interesting like there's that one case of there was the
i rode rage incidents on a bridge and to try and this man was coming at the woman who had rare ended him and she jumped off the bridge to get away from him yeah that's that was actually very firm like one of the earliest lawn orders really yes well yeah why and he was convicted of murder or maybe manslaughter cause you just didn't know worlds to go it was just like trying to get away i but also idea recording an entire evening just to be sure in of itself is suspicious to me enabling what do you need to be sure of that you have been in a position where this has been a problem for you or maybe she just already was being a little crazy ocean he started their order here not to victim blaming them clearly very drunk why maybe he liked to record his his sex x
but but yeah you're right i mean like she the things that she's doing don't make a lot of sense and not it's not like it's doesn't seem like she's the only victim at the beginning yeah it's out from what he sang the here's the thing he's the only one who knows as being recorded what's he saying about her fucking him yet is very specific and someone on like a red it said or me beyond the facebook page said when my boyfriend was beating me up he'd say he d i'll stop at what are you doing to me why dream ass to leg get the neighbors to think that she was doing something to him just to fuck with her in her mind so they could be that had just been what it sounds like happen from when i read the transcript which ice fuckin stay up all night reading and it was ex it's so crazy as i am either having rough sacks maybe she was incomplete coherence
she comes to and his freaked out by it and is trying to get out but doesn't know how he's hunger to calm down tells her calm down a couple times right i think one point she realised what was happening and pick something up just throw him and he gets so angry at that as you can hear him say like you ve been that girl that shit to defend herself he is like i'm gonna have to lock you out on the balcony just like to play myself but she the whole time she's been the victim and she's for him if i go and she's trunk and death and so she thinks the best option is to her go over the side of the age and get the balcony below which yeah that's like something from movie like yeah it only worsen stunt men do at any one in their right mind would never try that and so she clearly wasn't in her right my end is there
proof though we know that she is she drank like you i know people of let let almost like allergic to alcohol wherever one drink in there just like legless and out of their minds i dont know i do not like that i don't know their blood alcohol ever was i dont know if they tested over drugs maybe they're keeping all of that for the trial yeah it's like that's the story he's trying to push this recording yeah is like you ve crazy but he's feeding her alcohol to yeah so even if it's like will look how drunk she was i mean his own recording is it's gonna maybe the thing that convicts him i feel i will its super weird too i can't imagine is something terrible happen at my house leg or horrifying a person committed suicide i wouldn't be ordering peace an hour later no i mean i wonder
if he was so fucked up and it knows going on it will be almost be like he would go lay down or something or go high and or in our like i don't think but also if you i mean this also just immediately makes me think of the night of because the night of presenting the story where you completely i haven't much that i have only marks the first officer timing and julia general you empathize with the person that they put in front of your right hey that's the story are getting right which is what happens a lot of the time is is whoever gets hold of that narrative you go oh yeah yeah i know he would never do that he's so nice or whatever story yeah it will present you and then in one and then the shit that they talk about the other person yeah so in a way not to defend him i know i have no idea what's going on it s one this crazy but
it makes sense then that if he's kind of out on his own he's trying to control the narrative by tweeting things and posting shit on bodybuilders dot com or whatever you said to me like denny's it's a person is just scrambling and making mistakes yeah that i feel like the hurt you try to defend yourself on social media the worse you seem that more people can pick it apart yes harsher because i mean you know web sleuths have got have gotten a hold of this the website webs sluice have gotten a hold of this and our lake picking the and they think there's been some comments by by fate accounts he's made unjust just know too much about the detail details oh shit it's like he's his own worst fucking enemy well and also his is paying a lot of attention to this the process of the right
which is very strange yeah it's gonna be a hard one i feel like it's gonna be a hard one so surgery is just happened days ago twenty fourteen oh ok but he's being i ve no it's australia scientist i feel like he's being indicted or theirs be a trial to indict him on this in october ok well from what i can tell from australian legal keys i fucked up poor poor girl but this whole situation guys don't meet strangers on tinder not man i'm gonna get in trouble first let shaming such heavy so crazy that people just like but just dating though yeah but i i mean like about the girl that girl in santa monica that new the guy for a year repeater drank i mean bad things happen to people i just happen but this seems weird because you're the eye
dear that a person is recording an entire evening and there are four knowledge of that recording and not telling the other person that's there a manipulation on the surface of the suspicious fisher and to me it suspicious to say i record this because it just in case something happens and i need to defend myself words like but that's not accurate defence because we see what's actually happening it's just your play let its also where at the very end when he is like i'm i've been recording that like he uses it to throw it in her face somehow almost like can't prove any yang prove anything or like why would he use used against her if he if nothing had happened that he called the cops for or press charges for he never call the cops rain now and he didn't let her go either like at one point she was like i'm getting my shit name leading where's my phone and he like stopped her from leaving yeah so
it was freaked out and wanted to leave to both of them if you add a person this just throw this out there if you in person your house you meant a tender days you dont know them you guys you're drinking bigelow crazy you're you're the guy so they it's a girl that tries to be you up so it's like painful irritating not year not life threatening you when they wanna go what would be the wire why would you keep them there here like this is your care phrase if your keeping a crazy person in your apartment but code on quote so crazy you know you're making more problems the eloquent if they ve you just go ya get out what are you trying to get out of the situation if you want to keep the person his crime abusive cordelia around there you're getting something out of it or it's not as it seems great there is an option that i mean the uses people you know it
the gas laving technique or abuse of people who are like why are you being so crazy like this isn't that big a deal ray and and the people who that works on it works very well all and also you would get violent if you are like say tied up against your will woke up whatever the scenario where were you would try your best to like what are worry rocks they got thrown indoor whereas i wonder if i mean i wonder futures almost and capacity almost incoherent you know i mean where is like you're not yet here like like are aware that yearnest situation that's not good because she's not complete sentences most of the time yeah she just saying little reallocating right that's right that's crazy i now then you have to simply was naked on the balcony too oh really i think so she's definitely bear
but i don't i'm not sure she's naked check now i didn't i didn't think flax and things while yeah iceland operate yeah i've been thinking i found for a lot for a long time are you ok i mean not just those ones just make me keep on thinking about it i know the idea recording and evening is super and saying to me and also just like this weird damage that we live in we're like you could be recorded at any time yeah like right now my client where these microphone basis should we do hometown murder the earth to do tat read one we open that door i'm a guy pleasure sweating its yams dying other i mean and then just whatever noises we get we got a minute should i came out mccarthy's voicemail yes sovereign map mccarthy a course from that we much grass
podcast that just so happens we had a cameo earlier by events i spend who is also from now about gas does his final illnesses hometown murder he's been telling me is gonna do a perfect an hour and he did and analyse into at some excited okay i m really thickly we watch rustling podcast is doing to live shows some and apply them to it one is an i on the nineteenth of august and on the twenty of august are gonna be in new york city park ass comedy and special gas gotta brown paper tickets not com where they in your city you know this why hotel nice here and there at the copper still in los angeles sunk to that right cholera so map mccarthy let's hear what he has to say on kennedy yes well hello there it's your old man
we want europe and ask him to tell you about my home town murder i am from also from the imperialist interests or if you sell under its membership this anyway anyone promote i'm cumberland knows the name craig price used the most atrocious serial killer from around also known as the war flasher in july nineteen eighty seven i was hoping he broke into his neighbors how should the woman to those out you move your back to everyone even have a bearing what she's just a sleeping living watching the age one he goes in stand or her he said that he would ever workers being he was more than he was
find the knife and stand watcher sleep understanding over the knife the mouth shut and that much day by day the boy went on each one he was thirty years of all members will have to wait here and there two years later breaking through another neighbour's house mom are you mine her eleven times knives she literally bought that guy killed the ten year old girl what
are you sure of the knife broke off the end of an old man be eight year old he's got her several times and crushed her skull also during your tat the girls bit him so he better day and he put the mothers face and then they eventually caught hand because your hand open while everyone and then years after it was the state of to keep him in prison because he was a minor autumn what he's fifteen by law you get out of jail susie turned twenty want then you don't worry about out in twenty twenty now before coming to come and i hear he likes
here than in jordan ha now you think you think he'll get out now oh my god that's rhode island of all places thirteen that's oh crazy that's really young to stab somebody a ton of tat he had every so mentally yeah that's horrible good one man thinks me mccarthy for my mother of pearl areas stand communion as well as podcast super larrea senate committee who just to claim for us meeting by the wind oh did he threw them away and i met in the beginning when we're talkin albuminous pakistan we're talking about talking about murder to hunting party that's right that's pirnie was his party genesis there it is maybe genesis was playing maybe even bows lets them
this plan is a very good chance while that was an intense episode there's a lot going on comedy o speaking have we found out that one of the ways that we get up on the cheap it's on itunes is when you guys leave comments specifically summit fuckin shall some share and ask that if you like this punk asked or don't like this podcast either way can you this comment on itunes rate review subscribe karen he looked sad i'm not i'm really high camps i am a little bit tired i was on the show that but also the people that have been rating reviewing and subscribing as pets put us at the top of the charts week after week its yassin thank you so much for doing man it's
i may as mrs pack ass makes us want to cry yet we have a real good time while we cry yeah oh alice i was with events because ben's gives him all the cookies poland are well karen do you really get your cat fur come karen stay sexy don't get murdered by
Transcript generated on 2020-01-17.