What do your dreams mean? Can you use them to transform your life? Award-winning poet, author, teacher and certified dream therapist Rodger Kamenetz explains how the deeper meanings of our dreams can lead us into spiritual realms we would otherwise never discover. In his book “The History of Last Night’s Dream,” he searches for the spiritual truths and directions of our dreams and, in the process, opens a new world to the soul. Oprah says, "What's so exciting about this book is that it talks about how there's a whole other life that we are living when we sleep, and that our dreams are there as offerings and gifts to us if we only recognize what the dreams are there to teach us."
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I'm over Winfrey welcome to supersede conversations the podcast. I believe that one of the most valuable gives you can give yourself is time taking time to be more fully present
your journey to become more inspired and connected to the deeper world around us starts right now. What if I told you that in your life
this one lifetime. You have the opportunity, the privilege really to be alive twice. What would your answer be? I know that a lot of youth,
king this time I really got off the divan, but what, if I told you that that is absolutely true,
that I really gained a second life in this one,
Well, it's a new world comes alive every night when you fall into ram,
r m sleep at your dream world and, according to my guy
as to joining us today. It is a likely afar.
More transformative experience than you have ever considered your dreams to be
just to be clear. I am not talking about dream interpretation. Quite the contrary. I am talking about dream work, author.
Certified dream therapists, Roger cabinets suggest that if we commit to
began to unlearn, is that what you're saying run on
our dream interpretation and that were willing to commit.
The dream work that there will be a path that will
began to be illuminated that can lead us to arduous deep yourselves, our predicament in life and deeper.
The situation of our saw its an inside while the can change the world from the inside out. So I just
that high Roger Oprah. How are you
I love the title? The history of last night's dream, the scum
bring the hidden path to the soul. It reads kind of like a dream so
What do you think the dream say about all of us? I think I think dreams
Each individual person, each individual soul, is so different.
And so were given these dreams to help us out of the
they commit there were in life yeah and it's like a whole
map of the inner life and with his characters dramatizing. What's actually
happening below the surface. It often were not aware of what pushes us what drives us? What stresses us
the answer to all that is in our dreams. Well, I
of when you say that were given our dreams to help us through predicament and life. In one of the things that you say in the book, you lose
three gifts of the dream,
discover your pain? Or are you block
stuck her lost is what you ask to see your soul, the situation of yourself and to explore it realm right, yeah. So that's what dreams are for yes and then, and we all
I have this tremendous resource in the whole world is dreaming every night and right what's happened to those dreams,
furthermore, being left by the wayside, we're missing the gifts.
Burke, and release every dream, a gift, or is it sometimes just release? I mean when I was looking at the three categories I was trying to
my dreams in the three categories, sometimes as it just
you're you're unconscious mind just sort of relaxing with itself or is every dream a gift? I believe every dreams, a gift. Ok
So what about all the people out there now who are listening, that one person who say
but I don't even remember my dreams right. It's true. It's hard, remember
dreams, because the brain changes?
the much when we wake that we snap into waking consciousness and it's very easy to forget tat but
to me it's about valuing our dreams and as we can
devalue them as they become episodes in this entire exploration.
Why do we remember, and in general, if we don't make an effort
our dreams. If we have no one to tell them to her or if we have no one to share them with a we don't write them down another book, we're gonna be more likely just to forget them.
Thirdly, and then with a kind of move away from us, but
when we need them, and this happens in moments of crisis it allowed people tell me- and it happened waiting
no one someone dies in your life yet and that person appears in a dream
Yes and there's so much a mixture of pay
In regret and
also joy, cylinders and again. I think that that kind of dream demonstrates how powerful dreams are, how important they can be
how comforting they are sometimes to people when they see their loved one who's gonna
and come to them so vividly in a dream and they feel like they were really their right and they
really there. They are and it's hard to believe
under my mother, Durban choose fifty four hours for early on in the first time
became, I said, mom you're dead and she said looking like you idiot, you know, but then she came again and as such,
powerful experience actually wrote a book about it. The dream was, she came in a garden to walk with me
and I saw a bird sing and I saw of plashing upon than I saw a coin
and she said all these three things seem to be separate events, but there actually connected like a single way through water. She said that here yes again and that's not my mom, ok,
Ok, ok, but that was showing me a whole realm that is inside that so
profound and really the word also comes to mind gas Larsson yeah. Ok, so
How did you get drawn into this sort of inner world? It started? I mean, I think, not.
The personal journey, has to do with the fact that I've had these dreams and I think everyone for many people had age
so meaningful yeah, so annoying I about the reality is undeniably I added brings to question. Well, what is real. Maybe this is more real yeah. What was that dream for you?
well, for example, the one I told you about my mother, really, it seem very real
to me it wouldn't how were you at the time? I was very early so on Thank thirty,
it was like a blow a lightning bolt really. So how did you interpret, and I know you say that we shouldn't be interpreting them? We should work them because when you work with a dream therapy
then the whole idea is that I take the opportunity, the dream to help you feel into your feelings and to know
how you handle certain feelings in your waking life, though, do we have
have a dream. Therapists such as yourself as most people are gonna, get
Roger, they can begin to appreciate their dreams. They begin to feel the feelings in their dreams, but the problem is generally for most people, the beginning. They get their dreams exactly backwards, Willie Hassle,
Well, you may see this figure, whose really terrifying yeah
coming at you and your so afraid you start running, but actually trying to help you, but if you're, if he evokes fear in you,
You'll never have the encounter you'll. Never what it really is exactly ok,
so you have a reaction and so on
Our dreams mean something oh yeah. I think yes, and is
this is something that all of our dreams mean related to to?
is going on with ourselves. Yet
with saw in the sense that we have an outer life and that you are referring than beginning whether to live. Yes, we have an outer life. Our careers are getting downs, our relationships wheels,
an inner life. Yes,
I say this in the very beginning, you say I know there is a conscious,
I'm an unconscious.
But I dont always think about what that implies, that more than half of who I am and what I am is completely unknown to me, except in fragments and glimpses images
dreams to receive these gifts. We must learn
how to dream, which
easy enough, but I mean dreaming with a purpose learned
to use dreaming as a way to depth our
We are doing with you that I had that really was the most profound life changing dream.
And because it has been life changing it be interesting to see how
interpreted and how I interpreted it for myself? Okay, so this is a dream
the boy I love having flying dreams. I'd read this whole book trying to see her
can have line, dreams work as I just love line dreams where you feel the weightlessness of yourself, where you ve really absolutely feel like you left your body in Europe
so this was a flying dream. Where I really was in flying very high, I was skimming the trees,
every now and then I would dark down
so to the ground and there would be cheaper.
Following me, beautiful children lab
all different races- and you know, different parts of the world
world I've, never seen such a rainbow of children where
the rainbow of colors? I thought of there's a rainbow children wearing a ring books of colors to me
all those children represented the world and all,
so represented the rainbow inside myself. Now it's interesting as I'm happy
the dream and in turbulent region.
Feeling what the dream means, while I'm in the dream, so
the dream I am flying just about
trees and every now and then darting down close to the ground and the children were following me laughing and every time I get close to the ground with the children, children would look up and they were
What are you here to teach me? What are you here to teach me and I will try to get the words
or say something to them, and they say no. What are you here to teach me? What are you here to teach me
and that continued
gosh. I, on I don't know how long, but my interpretation of that was when I,
bacon dummy. I felt it, and still I mean it was years and years and years ago I had that dream. That became the central question for my life. What are you here to teach me and every experience so after that occur after that dream? I started to look at every experience that I had, or there was a difficult experience or something wonderful happening. I would say inside myself what is this here to teach me? What is this here to teach me? Okay, so you tell me what the dream meant, what you
the protection of that dream? Rapture thing: that's interesting about your dream is in I've had a lot of flying dreams and I hope you can. I have more or less flying. I know well because their very pleasant yeah, but the pleasant part of that is its also somewhat mental yeah. It's actually a lot of
Interestingly enough, you mention meditation alot of meditative have flying dreams, and the reason is therefore,
I'm way above the world
a certain way and they feel good yeah.
Ever unaided comes on auditing and what the part of Europe
Oh, that's missing is represented by the children. Oh yeah, the work I do usually represent saw so it's possible
the dream is showing you a difference between the kind of pleasure, the pleasure
a flying, which is great. I I've had those dreams, ok and the encounter with the kids. That creates a certain kind of
anxiety and even concern harass what so, so, I'm I'm
guessing that that that's where I would work with that dream- and you might have other
children to work with so
saying there layers and layers and layers to it sure, ok and
also air dreams flying dreams tend to be fairly mental. It's a kind of pleasure, that's the heirs associate more with with with with the mind
ok, but when you get down into the water, that's that's where more deeply. In feeling that we call feeling, by feeling at an that's where you go,
down further, that's where you go down and wonder there: ok, because of excessive. Yes, it does. You say that
Also dreams can become meditation, exactly tailored to our sphere, to our spiritual condition right. How so
I had a dream about you and there was a young boy in your house.
I had a dream about a young boy and I remember and holding up saying
Have you been while all this time? Where have you been? I knew you.
We're here. I know it yet forty or so that support it myself right, it's your soul usually,
The dreams, the baby yeah they come in different ways, and so children in dreams represent parts like the spontaneity, the energy that the beauty of being a child would you
the fact that you have children, your dreams means that you're still in touch with all of that you haven't lost any of that are still showing up. That's what that means to me. But how is this it sounds. I did this
is interpreting our dreams. How is this not interpreting, while because most interpretation comes from a fearful place, if we're afraid and mostly fear,
real core layer feeling fears really underneath a lot of our feelings. So if we interpret our dreams, when the place were really truly afraid of the things were afraid to face
yourselves. Then that interpretation will relieve us of the dream and then we'd just for
about it, and you know got that yeah like when you wake up soon
say: that's a good dream and away your interpreting it. It sounds, isn't Sigmund Freud rolling over his grey right now. Listening to you is spinning.
Because he Volvo he's a great pioneer and here he, but he had no Sigmund Freud,
right, he went in their naked. He went down there into that world,
for five years for this incredible book.
But he armed himself with his intellect and his theory and it's brilliant theory, but it's coming from a place of fear, he's afraid and he's afraid to hear the voices like there's a woman in one of his dreams who says you know
can't you see that you're hurting me and he opens her mouth looked at her throat like a doctor, she's, not saying it for him to be a doctor bank, she sang it for him to feel, and I got a place he could go to see. I say:
Sulphur, for I know where the listener here now who's thinking in a lot of
I have been told for years. If you dream about snakes means this thing. If you dream about that, you're saying none of that true, not necessarily
that was snakes, mean to you right, I mean you're dead.
That he might have in a snake handler in the various dreaming. A snake would be a totally different, then yeah, and also snakes, which are somewhat snakes- yours politically interesting as they have both
there they can be both negative, like scary, negative poison, but they're us be positive energy
sexual energy, so they have the sort of its eye what it means to you now. This was interesting. I have learned that sometimes I can take in
subconsciously things that are happening during the day and they end up in my dreams at night, and so, if I I'm gonna run across some,
I run across something that I think might be
little disturbing, rather than we
listing it and shutting it out. I will try to embrace it
so that it doesn't have to come up in my dream later at night. That's interesting here, you don't
you don't you dont want to re, say it again in your dream. I dont want to see the great and if I don't want to see it again in my dream- and I think that
maybe something that my disturbed me later and a dream on the very sensitive individual Roger. You may not know that about me, but I'm first,
I'm feeling. Ok, but I get through
your gammon, its author, that history last night's dream about how,
our dreams, all of us
were dreaming and dreaming every night, those dreams or a gift to us. If you learn how to try to work them, but anyway,
What I know is I'm so sensitive that I cannot watch television knives
This years, people are really believe me, but I don't watch television and sort of like the
others children who have no shoes, because I do
television all day. You know it's just not interesting to me to watch tv and especially
late at night, whatever I watch is going to be somehow it pushes the veil of my.
Often I end up dreaming about it, no matter how hard I try, whatever
archer whatever I read the foregoing, so
what I learned a long time ago of a fine just even flipping through a channel flipping through a channel and see an image on that channel, and it's a disturbing image that image
will somehow enter
I dream and then what happens and caused me to be upset like
I don't watch movies where women are raped, attacked harmed. I don't watch violence whatever that
violence will bombard
at my penetrate through an integrated orbit
May montalais budgetary per second. So now what I do if I see an image or something I I'm writing along and I see an image- is just
curbing what I'll do is. I will fully take it in. I will fully take
and come to a conclusion,
however, I feel about it. I will let myself feel it so that it doesn't have to show up to make me feel it later will. Does that make sense? Yes, and I think that that is behind his of interpretation, that every human being has the anxiety and fear that they don't want to experience and their dreams.
Oh, but I think that the right the stronger way to go to face into your fear, because then you can go and find out. What's underneath it, in other words, that
The fearful images themselves that appear in your dreams are inviting you to face into your fear and then discover
what it is, that's causing that fear
you think oh yeah, and I know it sounds the opposite of pleasant
And maybe I don't want to do that and my sleep well
I would rather deal with while I'm awake Roger that's what I'd rather do a meal that I see in image like you know, just some,
whirl and should flipping through it I'll go back.
I'll take the whole image and put it into my conscious mine,
so that I can deal with it, come to a conclusion deal with it in my waking mine rather than to have to deal with in the dream and go figure it out. Well, I think that this that's mental,
The issue is: how do you feel into your feelings and go through them, because you know basically like
let me give an example, someone else not get not do that. I advocate so a woman clan I had whose dad used to Peter up
as a child, brilliant at background she dreamed that
it was interviewing the fire chief and a car it was.
We're dead, the car caught on fire hydrant she crawled over her dad and her dad burned. Now her reaction to that dream was guilt. She felt bad and, I said, he's a fire chief. What does that? He knows what fire is. Yes, you dont have to feel guilty anymore about what you did to do, because a lot of tat, some people or abuse they take the guilt onto themselves. They feel like they ve done something wrong that deserve right. So the dreams, pit really horrible dream,
Not pleasant right, but as we work through it and you got the other side with such relief to her, she been feeling their way or life. Well, so
dream could unlock secret,
don't go anywhere order come after this short break
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always a spiritual person or did this work led you to a deeper level of spirituality for yourself, I think that this work has led me to him
paper level. I think I've been involved, and you know
but just dialogue with tibetan buddhism- and I wrote a book about that years ago, and so
I've been around. A lot of great teacher said the Dalai Lama, but I think in terms in your teacher marked brakeman marked Brigman. Yes, incredible, no on amazing teacher, who I discovered
you know what is so you're saying for those of you who are just joining us this week, that all of our dreams mean something and that the dreams are really a pathway. To begin to discover the three gifts that they have to offer us. Would you tell her listeners viewers? What were those gifts are sure? The first gift is is basically to discover your predict
then meant- and what's I mean in you know, what's in opposition to your soul, emerging into the world being really being who you were meant to be born to be, and the second is to see.
That all as another character as a usually
little boy a little girl and understand what how that sir,
came into the world? What the issue is that you ve been sent down here to deal with at the social level and then the third piece is this whole row.
Of of exploring this inner world that becomes so complex and and feeling, how is archetypes come male and female com, the book vips very important persons how they work with you. They work with you as teachers, in your dreams and such a gentle. And
powerful way that you can learn a lot just from the way they work with you. But you know we all have dreams about getting lost or getting nowhere running around in circles
oh, you know these are all seemingly you know trivial experiences. You believe that all
These dreams have something to teach us about clue.
Is about not only who we are, but also why we're here sure absolutely
and give an example that good I I had a dream
But a lot of people have in different fields
my version, am I teach him professor jealousy so the dreams I walk into a classroom. They don't know what subject and switch to teach and so
You know I figure, ok, I'll, throw out a few lines. It right. You know,
and see what they say and then I'll get an idea of what was to be doing their students, Turner,
ads they ignore me. They walk out a classroom. That's the dream. Now most people say
oh that's an anxiety dream yeah, you have a bank that actors,
seems like there were, then another line drawn player and say no, it mine is so funny. It's interesting how you say that everybody? I didn't know that
everybody fits whatever their their air,
in field is mine- is I'm due
and reading the news with Water Cronkite
reading the Route NEWS with Water Cronkite and my script is completely out of order right,
I'm always on the wrong page right and wall,
is sitting there, and he cannot believe that I can't get the frequency
in order- and I can't either because here is my I'm sitting with Walter- conquered right he's the big that you have lobbied, glad about really and your anxiety is really a feeling of inadequacy when you're way
not measuring up right of all
over the times in the bureau for my script to be out of order, and I didn't put the script in order before it's not about the script. It's about your feeling that this is done on purpose, to get you to feel more deeply into that feeling and recognise that you probably have that feeling a lot in your life and so its point. The script is just a ruse kind of a trick to get you to have this feeling in connection to whatever. Why
two representatives is growing archetypal guy right, I have one would see we wonder ones performing on the floor where I couldn't get. The words wrote, and
and I was having a lot of anxiety at the time I was away from home and feeling really disconnected, and in
every night. I would have the same dream and the closer I got to home the more lines I could remember, but
you think that's not anxiety. I certainly thought
It has everything it would see. We wonder, understand things happen, underneath it is feeling of inadequate or isn't that what anxiety isn't that when everything is isn't that isn't that the key question,
almost all of us all the time and my good enough, and only in that way, I think it
so level we feel adequate in relation to the divine. We all feel- and we need to feel it's hard to believe that its that that there could be such a connection to someone is worthless ones.
You lost me, they're, Roger at the social level,
lost in relation to the divine I thought at the social level. We all recognise that we come from the divine at the social level
but our eagle level, but at our sole level
we realise that we come from the great or so at their sole conscience, hind justness level presence level. We recognise that we are part of a greater presence of greater. That's that's a belief that the many
Have I believe that I feel that were when you feel it you're, not feeling inadequate. That is true right. That's my point about when you're feeling inadequate away, aren't you feeling
an actual. Then I am gonna uneasily. I'm gonna get a good look at it.
So I agree with you Roger go where we are feeling disconnected. Try
are going well in our lives. We are. What we are disconnected from is the greater
dull or guide right, and we feel how could something so omnipotent love me
right there, and these were. How can I be of value in a world of such greatness? Needs no rivers here, it's those different, so it really would depend some people truly, don't feel that even at that level, the child the little child that they see as have the ability to feel that remain, but they might feel disconnected like in my work I found out that my boy was an orphan and so that boy did not feel
taken care of what you mean in your work. You found out that that boy, what will I, after a series of dreams, rose, laughed and wandering? Yes, I ended up in an orphanage which fire fighting
your boy. You mean yourself, my boy, my yet all yourself and you're, saying
that when you dream about a child or children run, it really is representative of your soul. He asked Kennedy yes, and so that's what you're talking about writing my boy right at that's. My boy and I've been files have a girl, but I have a boy on heads both genders in some gender specific necessarily. But the point is that to get to that point, you have to get past. The opposition is a party that wants to take you away
from your soul from the boy from the child when the boys in the child. So if you're so always a child, and why is it a child in this work if it appears that were it appears as a child and I think part because the children carried the feeling of the connection children, a closer
the feeling of that can absolutely you talk about during REM, sleep, but that we
also are able to disconnect from arson.
Identity and the ego true? Yes, it and that's a fascinating that the dreams open up this free imaginative round with so much gonna happen is no I'm or space there's no before after
everything so lucid and there the dead and the living can appear in our dreams. At the same time, we ve like abolished ordinary time. It's ok, so here
question for you when the dead and the living appear in our dreams. Are they appearing
where there are they just our dreams. You told as the last time about that,
foundering that you had of your mother run and when I
it was your mother really there? This is after your mother passed when she was fifty four year. Thirty something you said. Yes, my mother was there and law
to people who are listening to us right now are watching us, however, have had these dreams where some
his died and they feel like they were there. So my question is: when you dreaming are the people there or is it a dream, or is it a manifestation of spirit, somehow I don't know
I just got, feels really good really feels real living people have those experiences. It's almost shocking how powerful that encounter
is so tell us again about your mother. Your mother died didn't come to visit you the same night. She died. No, she didn't. It was a few months later and done and she showed up- and you said your dead. He had first time. Yes, it hey you're dead and she looked at me like you idiot
but then she later appeared and gave him this message that, basically, that that there was a realm of experience where things are connected, where everything is one
even though in our everyday life it doesn't feel that way. Also chaotic, and what did you do? The three things will we learn of a garden and we saw a bird was singing
coin fell and there was a splash fountain and she.
All of these things, it appear like separate events, are actually a single motion of a single way through water. There, all one I was the birds singing
with one eye was it, I mean: how is the birds singing the same as the coin, dropping in the what how right boggles the mine, I don't
yet I don't claimed understand
the material level waking level, but yet its it seemed to be pointing to
idea that, even though we
see all the hidden connections between events there actually
earlier. You tell me where the opposition, which is a prevalent correct,
for an and our dreams, and what does the opposition is? The opposition represent and waking life can be
legation duty. I had one client who dreamed he wanted to use a professor, but he wanted to be an hour.
He saw a little girl and a beach withdrawing he loved her. He was really attracted to her then fell on a business suit came across and said, come with me, I want to show you a new building and he goes
with a guy at least a little girl behind, so the opposition appeared as the man in the business,
and when I asked him about it, he said well yeah. If someone asked me to look at a new building,
I visited their camp ass. I would do it so he
more drawn to him. Then to stay with you
no girl who really was part of the WEEE, is more deeply useless.
The sole literally leaving behind the beach supposed we're having these dreams,
everybody just thinking about their own dreams and what rights,
you are saying and in this book the history of last night's dream is at all of our dreams. Are there to be a gift to us and what we should do
embrace them. So, let's just say: first of all, you need to read the book.
To fully understand, although we are talking about here today, but everybody's going to go to bed
night and they're gonna have a dream. What is the first thing? We should do to try to remember that dream. It be good to write your dream down as soon as you have it, and and read it over and think and feel the images without interpreting,
and you should write it down? Does it going there have been times? Why didn't do this? Because I allow remember that, as that was so strong and then you
you lose it so and everyday life so takes over when we re
things down, don't we sort of overwrite them with overwrite them?
is your writing it down and isn't the imagery
important than anything. That's what I got from right. The images are important and the feelings
Whatever your dream? Last week, I slowed down to ask you what you're feeling at each point
if you can do that for yourself and just asks of what of my feeling to ever, feel this and waking life. How does that correspondence and feelings? I haven't I'm awake, that's very helpful to
then this dream with the children right, the children were saying to me. What are you here to teach me? What he writes me right? Should we
be asking that of each of our dreams, though, what are you here to teach me, because every dream is here to further enhance and be a gift to us? Is it not, first of all that the true profound question, may I came to you in a dream? Yes, what are you here to teach me?
question I can ask of you, you can ask me, and I as and what I learned from that dream is what I was saying last week right is that I learned to ask that of every thing right. That is the most important question you can ask of every
being in every experience right. What are you here to teach me? That's a question that comes from the sole. Yet, if asked to deepen our level and those kids are asking that so
think? That's it tremendous! Yes, you know I had that dream. Okay. So it's been ten years now, since I was on trial, and I remember having had that dream before really,
may get through that trial because run through every aspect of the trial, I would say a right now. What is this year to teach me where I am obviously here, because I needed to learn this and what is this year to teach me
but is this year the teacher? Will the kids, children in general and dreams are more vulnerable and more open. Their feelings are more direct and so getting to know them and be with them and then ultimately to beat them. Who is part of the journey, and was that dream with your mother is: was that the most transformative dream you ve never encountered? No, not at all night. I know, in fact, I think the most important dream is probably
What are the dreams of having the book where I'm an orphan, but my father comes to visit me and then when he leaves I I weep, because I realize that he is my father and I missed him, and so at longing for the father is really important. Feeling you know to the separation that we feel from the Father from God from the divine is painful, but we can say that, but you actually feel it in a dream.
Listen shrilly. That was a transformative experience how to where you, and that happened,
my eye was: it was just before the booksellers. My fifties well. Well, I'm talking to Roger cabinets, author, the history of last night's dream so back to our Lester
viewer, who is going to now write down their dream run. How did they then be
and to do the work
rob allowing whatever that dream is run from tonight? There's people can have some very vivid one capitalist in all this
whatever their dream is, how did they begin to do the work to allow that dream to lead them to the path to the sole try to know what the feelings are, that the dreams were way to go to the feelings, to try to remember the feelings and see,
they connect your waking life. If you are having the same dream over and over and over again, is that because that dream is trying to tell you something or teach you something that can be Francis? The dreamer had room from the think. I'm the teacher where got out at them in a changed was marks. It could you you know, how do you know who the teacher, when you walk- and I said well course on the determined teaching for twenty four
Is he said? What had you know? Does anyone say you're? The teacher? I said no, but you know you are you know your own self in a dream well,
but in the dream, you can behave differently you I know, though, so he said I want to do homework
and imagine this is mark your dream, larger Ragman, you imagine that you are not the teacher soy. I worked on that and was really hard because, as I tried to imagine myself as all jumbled student,
all the stuff came in like where did I work all these years for and what did I learn so much and now I'm a student, you know so I had to struggle with that and I did and then I finally had a dream uproar I walked in. I sat down with the students and then the teacher came in so that was a real shift inside me, wow
saying that I was thinking. Maybe I wasn't flying above the children. Maybe I was one of the children. Maybe you're supposed to land, among maybe
what you say when you die in your dream, that it's the ultimate alchemy. What does that mean? Well, as we separate from the old condition self that is not faithful to the salt, when we're meant to be, we can have
the dying and at such a scary, aghast yea? I then this fear. We are talking about that. Everyone has you get to experience it work through it and then you never quite feels afraid. Again, you don't feel the same kind of fear.
And what is this fear that everyone has, I think it's just a primal feeling underneath all her feelings, its normal everyone has just so, basically being human being and get our dreams help us to release these fears. It can help help us experienced them directly instead of projecting out into the world, which is makes it really hard to know what's gonna one way off. If I'm, you know, let's say I'm afraid of you, and so I project from their place of fear onto you all kinds of stuff. She's judge image doesn't work
this or that whatever you would do this after you ve had the dream. The right here right, the dream down right look.
But that really means right. Try to find somebody like yourself or right, wherever they mark to help you and
so you're not saying do it within the cause, that's why they did. While I'm dreaming the dream right, that's a lot of people who have powerful intellects and are used to doing that can do that. But I thank you so much for the discussion
He is one of those people right now, but now I am a dream trying to interpret the dream, while I'm having us with surprising, because you like,
flying allowed approach. The freezer bugging answer you when you were taking the dream from the top down, but but
no and I can be in the dream into all, I'm dreaming right, but that protects you ve a little
from the only all the way I love there, you go another I'm off
so are you saying that when I'm in the dream- and I can tell-
but I'm in the dream and I'm interpreting the dream. While I'm in the dream, then I'm really not deep enough in it, you can't you could spoil it. I could spoil it here, but when I have I've spoiled it ironic spoiled it and what myself up? Because I'm talking to himself to merge where I think your things you'd
like to feel like? Just? U uploading everybody? Well, let's get personal here rather well. What we happen, personal, I'm telling you my geriatrics ever be yours things. I don't like to feel every human being has things they don't like to feel like being scared, yeah, ok, we're being terrified or being her or being abandoned. I mean we all have these terrible. You know these are terrible things to feel right, but all of it.
All this has been a joy talking to you. We got a minute twenty seven seconds. I have to ask you: what is the single most important aspect of the dream, work that we can consider before we those off tonight? Can we control or have some influence on as to what we might want to dream? I don't think we should. I think, dreams of the last delay them alone, their natural you, let's let them be natural. What's not try to interfere with the control, we control everything in our lives. Let's leave one area where we dont control and that's her dreams right. It's been a joy, it's been a great pleasure. Thank you so much thank you so much
due to the book, is called a history of last night's dream, discovering the hidden path to the soul when it I'm ruined free and you ve been listening to supersede conversations podcast, you can follow super soul on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook if you haven't yet go to apple podcast, unsubscribe rate and reviewed this podcast join me next week for another supersede conversation. Thank you for listening.
Transcript generated on 2020-02-01.