I mean to fight this war and win it house of the dragon is back for season 2 and so is the official game of thrones podcast. I'm Jason Concepcion. And I'm Greta Johnson. Together we are going to be talking about every new episode of the HBO original series House of the Dragon. The second season starts Sunday, June 16. But new episodes of this podcast start on May 22. Listen, Directly on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. - Good to war then.

- Welcome to Pod Save America, I'm Tommy Vitor. - I'm Matty Hassan. - Matty, great to see you. Guest hosting today, thank you for joining. - Thanks for having me, it's always fun to do this. One of my favorites. People to talk to and debate although I'm a little anxious because you did write a book about how to win every argument that I believe is coming out in paperback soon so I'm worried I'm going to get brutalized here in this video. When have you and I ever argued about anything, Tommy? Yes. It's funny. People probably think we're too chummy or cozy now, but you should look at our conversations about drones and the Obama administration if you want to see it get a little spooky.

Icier. On today's show, we're going to talk about what the Biden administration's record on Gaza means for Biden's support here at home and in the critical state of Michigan. We will talk about what a smart U.S. approach would look like in Gaza and how Ukraine funding complicates things. We'll also talk about what's happening with House Republicans' train wreck of impeachment efforts. And in case you missed it, Donald Trump tells Laura Ingraham that he is America's Alexei Navalny. Seems like an apt comparison, right? No problems alive. He is still alive. He's still alive. But, Mehdi, let's start with Gaza, because you have a fantastic piece out in The Guardian today, arguing that President Biden... Could end the war in Gaza right now with a phone call. You point to an example of President Reagan in 1982 who stopped Israel's bombing of Beirut with a phone call. Can you give us sort of that brief history of what happened back in '82 and how you think it applies to? What's happening in Gaza today? So yeah, in 1982, Ronald Reagan was president of the United States, very pro-Israeli, just like Joe Biden.

Israelis were led by a very right-wing Prime Minister, Menachem Begin, a former terrorist. Just like today, you have Benjamin Nanyo, very right-wing leader. And begging and Ariel Sharon, remember him, was his defense minister and they go into Lebanon. We don't have time to get into why they went into Lebanon, but they're in Lebanon and they're bombing Beirut. They're trying to defeat the PLO. Were hiding in tunnels Tommy sound familiar and they say we will not leave till we wipe them out and in process of trying to Wipe them out. They're killing thousands of civilians in Beirut the capital of Lebanon and at one point The nightly news is showing an image of a child with limbs missing again. Sound familiar. Ronald Reagan apparently sees this. He writes later in his memoir, these images shocked me and he calls back in and he says, you need to stop this now. What we're watching is a Holocaust. Reagan used the H word. Tommy and begging says I know what a holocaust is don't you know, don't try and lecture me mr President along those lines and yet 20 minutes

Slater begging rings back and says to Reagan, It's over. I've told Sharon to stop the bombing. And the reason I opened the piece with that anecdote is because Reagan apparently put down the phone and said to his deputy chief of staff, I didn't realize I had that Kind of power. Now whether he meant it or not, whether it was snark, who knows. But American presidents have a lot of power. I know that from working in the White House, I know that from covering presidents for decades. Biden today and I get it a lot of listeners of pod save America will say Joe Biden is trying he wants to stop the War we keep hearing leaks that he wants a ceasefire. He doesn't like Netanyahu He's effing and blinding about BB. But what can we do Israel is upset after October the 7th rightly upset He wants to take out Hamas. We don't have the leverage and the purpose of My piece was to say, not only do we have leverage in the form of arms and finances and diplomatic protection, but we've always had leverage.

Could do it. George Bush Sr. could do it. And Joe Biden can do it too. He can make that call. Things I cite in the piece is Israeli officials have said openly we can't do this without America. Defense Minister Gallant early on in the conflict. When he was asked, Why are you letting aid in by his own right-wing backbenchers? He said, The Americans told us to. What are we supposed to say? No? Yitzhak Brick, a very top Israeli general told me, said, If they turn off the tap, everyone knows we... Can't carry on fighting. So the Israeli military officials are saying, we need the Americans. And yet our government is not saying, all right, then do what we tell you to. And that leads you to the very unfortunate conclusion that the Biden administration doesn't want to stop the fighting. It's not that it can't, it's that it won't. - So I think, look, first of all, I share your enormous frustration with how Gaza is being handled by the Biden administration.

We can get it to some of the policies we think would make things better in a minute But I think that I think the arguments a little bit overstated I think it's somewhere between you know we can't do anything in one phone call in my argument Would be, I think Israel today is very different than 1982 just because of decades of economic growth, frankly decades of US military assistance that has made them increasingly less reliant on the US. But I think the bigger problem-- for Biden here would be Bibi Netanyahu, because for those who don't know, Netanyahu. Is only in power because he cobbled together a coalition of some of the most odious, right-wing, racist ministers in Israeli politics. Itamar Ben-Gavir could topple his coalition government at any time. And so what Netanyahu is

Primarily worried about is, you know, if they withdraw support for the coalition and he has to face an election, Netanyahu's party, the Likud, would get crushed according to polls, he'd lose the PM job, and he would lose any future hope of using his power as prime minister to get immunity for the many crimes he has committed and is facing prosecution for. I think you are absolutely right that Biden pressed Netanyahu to stop bombing Gaza back in 2021. Reported in books that he said, All right, you're at a runway. We got to stop this. >>ANDREW: And they stopped within days, and Netanyahu was gone from office within a month. >> That's exactly right. I do think, though, the security situation and the politics are changed after October. There was a recent poll by the Israel Democracy Institute. I found that about half of Israelis would...

Pose a deal to end the war in Gaza if it included the establishment of a Palestinian state and peace agreements with other Arab countries. Another poll found that 72% of respondents agreed with the statement that, quote, the entry of humanitarian aid into the Gaza Strip must be stopped until the Israeli prisoners are released. I say all of that not because I think it should impact what the US does or what you and I think is right or wrong, but just to acknowledge that-- There's a scenario where Biden trying to tell Netanyahu what to do and then Netanyahu telling him off ends up being good politics for Bibi. Scenario where Bibi goes around Biden to Congress and gets some sort of veto-proof bill passed of Look, I think there's a lot more that Biden can and should be doing, but, you know, I

I think there are some limits to our leverage. - So let me say two things. One is on the specific Israel example. I think as I pointed out, in the piece I point out not just Israeli officials but people like Bruce Riedel who worked for four presidents saying, No, no, we have lots of leverage and we don't use that leverage, not because it's complicated, not because Netanyahu can go around us, but because of domestic political reasons that we don't wanna use. Uh, that's one issue. So, uh, you know that that and you mentioned 2021 biden literally called netanyahu and said stop this And it worked uh, so that you at some point we have to ask the question how much this is about biden and not about netanyahu Uncomfortable question. I know Lot of listeners and number two, I would say just on a general point not just about Israel Tommy and you and I've discussed this before sometimes is Value just in the fight, right? We have a president right now whose poll numbers aren't so great, who is getting beaten up on all sides by members of his own party, by members of the media,

and sometimes there is value in the fight. Netanyahu is not a popular figure. If Biden picks a fight with him and Netanyahu tries to go to Congress, tries to go to Speaker Johnson or even Chuck Schumer, I don't think that's bad politically for Biden. I didn't in an election year where actually closing up to Netanyahu could cost him states like Michigan could cost him a lot of young voters, people of color, Arab American voters. So I think there's a moral reason and a strategic reason to put pressure on Israel to end this morally unsustainable. And strategically disastrous war, but I also think there's domestic political reasons why picking a fight with Netanyahu is far from a bad thing to do. - Yeah, I'm in violent agreement with you there. I'd love to see. I mean, to your point about Biden's approach, to date, they have had this approach that's called the Hug BB strategy, where basically Biden says he'll disagree

Yahoo privately, but they don't want to show any daylight in terms of public messaging. And that included Biden literally jumping on a plane, flying to Israel, giving Netanyahu a hug on the tarmac. It's become this sort of iconic image. I think we need to, I thought that approach was a mistake from the beginning because not because I think poorly of Joe Biden, because I think incredibly poorly of Bibi Netanyahu. He's a. Corrupt, racist, bad leader who, you know, a year ago was trying to shred the Israeli judicial system, right? You had literally millions of protesters on the street every single weekend. Protesting him. Be able to do whatever we want. And then, you know, clearly is counting down the days to a Trump presidency. So the idea that Biden is helping Who was always undermined Democratic presidents you remember Bill Clinton famously emerged for a meeting with Netanyahu and said who the F is the superpower Right Barack Obama was humiliated by Netanyahu turned up and undermined

his Iran negotiations in Congress on American soil. - He failed on that front, but you know. - But tried to, you know, it was-- - He was a real pain in the ass, that's for sure. To Congress and tried to undermine the US president. So this idea that Biden, Obama, Clinton should try and appeal. He's a man who has always tried to undermine them in party political terms. It seems to me absurd from a domestic political calculation. I know that Biden has a friendship with Netanyahu going back decades. Ever right. This is a middle of we're in the middle of one of the worst geopolitical crises of our lifetimes We're in the midst of one of the worst, you know, a former UN official told the BBC You see this week, Tommy, that the kill rate in Gaza, by his calculation, the kill rate, the rate of killings, is high. Higher than in any episode of violence or conflicts since Rwanda, right? That is where we are right now, where former UN officials are pointing out what the death toll looks like right now. 30,000 people, which is a conservative estimate, killed in just over 40 years.

Months so in that moment you know put aside all the nonsense about whatever friendship you had put aside whatever nonsense yes He's a Zionism in his gut, and we can have that debate later about Zionism. But just from a personal standpoint, as President of the United States, what is he doing here? What is he achieving here? What is he getting here? Even if I wasn't pro-Palestinian, forget your politics in the Middle East. I just don't get it from a domestic political situation. What is going, it's election year. Do we want this really happening in November? Does he think he can win with this happening in November? - No, and look, to your point, I mean, look, the Hamas, the Gaza Health Ministry's estimates are 30,000 people are dead. I saw the UN has suggested. That it might be as many as a hundred thousand when you consider people who are missing or unaccounted for Or confirmed dead and so I agree with you There's a moral imperative here And I also think there is increasingly a growing domestic strategic imperative to put some space and pressure on the Israeli government

Look, I do wonder if early on when this conflict started, if Biden could have said, Look, we'll work with you, we'll back you, but you've got to get rid of Itamar Ben-Gavir, some of these right-wing ministers. Do you think the US should be conditioning assistance to Israel? At a bare minimum so that it you know the IDF has to adhere to international law and limit civilian casualties. Some people have gone further. That Bernie Sanders has suggested that we should condition US military assistance to say Israel must also make big progress towards a Palestinian state. I think the US needs to stop vetoing every call for a ceasefire at the UN. Happened again this week. I did see, Mehdi, that Al Jazeera reported that the U.S. has drafted a U.N. resolution calling for a temporary ceasefire, the release of hostages, and it overtly states that we oppose a ground offensive in Rafah, so I think that's a good step.

Listening who think this is bias against Israel. I just want to say the reason I support this set of policy guidelines or proposals is because I think it will save innocent Palestinian lives in Gaza but I also think a negotiated ceasefire is the only way to get the remaining hostages back alive and I think that getting the two parties into a political process that will solve the Underlying tensions that fuel this cycle of violence year after year after year is the only way to get to a durable peace. You cannot kill every member of Hamas. You cannot kill an idea. Is get our family members out alive, end this conflict, do a deal.

Vast majority of hostages who have been released were released in that very brief temporary ceasefire that happened, temporary halt of fighting that happened back in when was it November. Something like 99% of the hostages are Released in that way how many of these really saved rescued through military two three i think Kill, uh, we're now hearing numbers that they may have killed up to 10 15 20 in the israeli press of their own hostages through airstrikes About the three they shot dead who were carrying white flags. So it's been a disaster even for Israeli innocence this war. Let's be clear about that. And listen, I can't even imagine how hard this is if you are a progressive Israeli who feels like, You were like months ago you were on the streets protesting the Netanyahu government and now you're stuck with these guys leading this war effort that is a moral and strategic disaster. Like I have enormous empathy.

For people in Israel who feel like October 7th was yesterday, that wound does not come close to healing. I have enormous empathy for Jews around the world who are scared as incidents of anti-Semitism rise up. But I do think that getting a ceasefire, getting to a negotiated settlement that gets the hostages back is the best way to create a durable peace for everyone involved here. One quick thing before we go to break. We have some great stuff planned for members of the Friends of the Pod community here. So on Friday, February 23rd, the host of the excellent new crooked series, Dissonant at the Doorstep, will host an AMA to answer all of your questions about the series. If you haven't listened to Dissonant at the Doorstep, on the Pod Save the World feed. You can listen to it right now. It's the incredible story of a blind Chinese human rights activist who escapes house arrest, makes it to the US embassy in China, and ultimately to the United States after President Obama negotiated his release, and then a few years later winds up at the January 6 insurrection chanting away.

That's an unbelievable story. If you're not a member of the Friends of the Pod community, you have time. Go to crooked.com/friends to join and to learn more. The best way to get started is to subscribe to my channel.

Things in life, they come in twos. Two scoops of ice cream, two tacos. And now for a limited time, get our best deal of the year. Buy any phone when you switch to Consumer Cellular and get two months of service free. That's right, the same fast, reliable, nationwide coverage as Big Wireless, now with two months free. Proof that best things in life really do come in twos. Visit ConsumerCellular.com or call 1-888-FREEDOM. Second and third month of monthly based service fee waived for new customers with the purchase of a phone and activation by July 31st, 2024. Taxes, fees, and third party charges will apply. See website for additional details. Hey guys, our new book, Democracy or Else, How to Save America in 10 Easy Steps is finally out and available now. At this point, we all know what we're up against, American democracy is in crisis and that can feel daunting. That's why in Democracy or Else, we broke down all the lessons we learned from years working on campaigns and hosting Pod Save America into 10 steps you need to get informed, to get involved, to get off the sidelines. And it's not just a useful step-by-step guide to get you through this year. It is packed full of jizz.

And unhinged illustrations that will keep you laughing and save you from drowning in your sense of existential dread. Thank you again to everyone who's bought the book so far. Crooked Media is donating its profit to support Vote Safe America and progressive campaigns in 2024. So the book is already making a difference. And if you haven't ordered your copy yet, there's no better time than now, or head to crooked.com/books to grab yours now. I do want to turn to the domestic politics you mentioned, Betty. One place it's clear is in Michigan. Michigan has a large Arab American and Muslim American population. The state's primary is on February 27th. There's a bunch of Democrats in Michigan, including Rashida Tlaib and the mayor who are encouraging Michiganders to vote uncommitted, so not vote for Biden, but to write in uncommitted.

This video. A part of the meeting that recently happened in Michigan with some senior members of President Biden's national security team. Here's a clip. Part of what that, what this movement is coming out of is people have been calling the representatives. They've been calling. The white house. They've been protesting in the streets. They've been shutting down highways and Biden still doesn't seem to be hearing us. So you know what? If you won't hear us when we are calling our representatives or when we are. Are protesting in the streets. Maybe you'll hear us when we show you that we've got some votes of people who you can count out. So, Biden's 20... The third-pony march in a victory in Michigan was 154,000 votes. According to NPR, Michigan is home to about 200,000 registered voters who are Muslim and 300,000 people who claim ancestry from the Middle East and North Africa.

If enough of those voters just stay home in November, they don't have to vote for Trump. They could just stay home. It could have an enormous impact. Think of this uncommitted movement in Michigan, and what are you hearing from Arab American and Muslim American friends about Gaza and what it means for their vote in this upcoming election and what it might take to get them back if they're leaving the Democratic Party because of the policy? - Tommy, I'm so glad you guys have raised this issue today because it's a huge issue. I've been warning about this issue since October 9th, 10th. I can't remember when I started tweeting saying, This is gonna be bad from a domestic political perspective. Sometimes people get very upset when they hear this and a lot of folks on online have attacked me for even pointing this out like shooting the messenger. Like I think I came back from Thanksgiving and tweeted. Met a bunch of Muslim family members and friends, not a single one is voting for Biden. And these are all ex-Biden voters and people got very upset. I know a lot of people in Dearborn including Abdullah.

The mayor of Dearborn and not a single one is going to vote for Biden they say right now. Now the uncommitted strategy that Abbas Who I also know laid out there is exactly that they're not saying we're never gonna vote for Biden They're saying we're trying to put pressure on Biden who come around with the political tool that we have. This is a democracy. And I think that is a legitimate. Strategy no one is saying go vote Trump. No one is saying they're all the same. They're saying President Biden. Can you hear us? And my worry is he's not hearing them. I've been talked I mentioned to people at the White House a while ago What are you doing about Georgia? I spoke to a Democratic Party official just this week who said well, you know We're trying our best, but we also believe we can still win Michigan without that vote. That's a risky strategy given how close the votes have been. In not just Michigan by the way Tommy big Muslim and Arab American populations in Georgia Atlanta area very very narrow margin of victory Wisconsin less so in Pennsylvania

It's a real issue. And the question then becomes, how do you engage the voters? And my worry is, a lot of white liberals who I interact with, a lot of elected Democrats just say, But what about Trump? What about the Muslim ban? Yeah, that doesn't work. Right and and Abdullah Hamoud wrote a wonderful piece for the New York Times this week I urge everyone to read it and he says look when people come to me as the mayor of Dearborn and say, I lost 80 members of my family, which people have come and told him, right? There are people who have lost dozens and dozens of family members in Gaza. You can't say to them, yeah, but Trump would have got 100 dead. It just doesn't work. You cannot insult them and say, Well, what about the Muslim ban? They don't care about the Muslim ban if they've lost 80 members of their family. So you need to meet people where they are. Understand the pain and grief that they're going through. One of the criticisms of Biden is he's this great empath, the comforter in chief. We haven't seen that much empathy for Arab American communities. We didn't even get a mention of the Palestinian death toll when he did his hundred day statement about the war in Gaza. So we need to see what happens.

To be a much more empathy, but also in a policy position, understand where these people are coming from and understand why they're doing what they're doing. Don't just dismiss them as, oh, this is 2016 lefties again, or this is people who, you know, Turkey's voting for. They don't know how bad it's gonna be with Trump. They know but people are hurting right now, and that's hasn't been the starting point A lot of people in Michigan are hurting from direct connection to loved ones who they've lost and therefore The administration has to work out what are they going to offer and if they're going to say nothing then take your chances November, I'm super stressed about Michigan. - Yeah, I do wanna just reemphasize the point you just made, which is if you see someone talking about this issue on social media, please don't reply to them. Enjoy the Muslim ban. It like, you cannot scold someone. Out of caring about the death of innocent lives, about the family of children. I mean, I think we need to approach this issue and any issue with empathy and try to listen to people.

Reason, you know, Medhi, we mentioned at the top, President Biden sent John Finer as Deputy National Samantha Power, the head of USAID, who's a genocide scholar to Michigan to meet with Abbas and other members of the community of Michigan. John Finer was very clear that they realized they have made mistakes when it comes to To messaging. John said in this meeting-- an audio recording of it leaked out to The New York Times and other places. John said, we have left a very-- damaging impression based on what has been a wholly inadequate public accounting for how much the president, the administration, and the country values the lives of Palestinians He also said there was no excuse for the release of that White House statement you just mentioned of the war mark that did not address or acknowledge the loss of Palestinian life. I've noticed in Biden's comments since that meeting that he has put much more emphasis on the empathy part of it. I do think that there's a lot of work to do still on the policy.

Like we talked about so he spoke at the National Prayer Breakfast and he talked about Palestinians who've lost their homes and lost their lives and the grief that people are going through both here and abroad that was important Obviously the problem is that we are helping contribute to that group. Let's be very clear We are complicit in Israel's war in Gaza. They could What they do without American weapons. Biden has gone around Congress, I think, twice now to get those weapons sent faster. When Trump did it in Yemen -- Democrats were up in arms. I'm glad to see some Democrats trying to be consistent. Say let's not do that with Israel. But look, yeah, empathy's out. The centre of this. If you talk to a lot of Arab Americans and Palestinian Americans, they do feel dehumanised. They do feel like their lives don't count. They do feel like they're not getting the same attention. Or concern as American citizens or as American citizens of Arab and Palestinian said and that is a problem Joe Biden, as I say in my Guardian piece, this is a guy who lost two children. This is a guy who lost his wife. This is a man who's always been famous, rightly so, for showing empathy, being able to help ordinary people with their grief.

Seen that with the Palestinian American community. I know some of the five Muslims who went to the White House a few months ago to talk to Biden about this and they said he was very different in private. He was very apologetic for Denying the Palestinian death toll. Tommy, remember he did that at the beginning of the conference? - Yes, earlier on, yeah. - He meant to say Hamas, and he said, I don't believe the Palestinians. It's an outrageous thing to say. He's never publicly withdrawn. On that remark or apologize. Great for John finer to say it, but let's be honest, I mean, nobody knows who John finer is, has to come from the top. Truman, buck stops here, etc. It has to be Joe Biden making these amends and trying to reach out to American citizens who are,

a genuinely hurting because they are witnessing what they believe to be and what I believe to be a genocide in the Middle East that the United States is complicit. I also think it's worth mentioning that this is not just a challenge for Biden within Arab American and Muslim American communities. I think you're increasingly seeing concern with younger voters. My friend Peter Hamby has a great piece out today for Puck, where he looks at some exclusive polling about voter sentiment about the upcoming election. very concerning findings. Is that among black voters and voters between the age of 18 to 29, they are considerably more likely to feel like the outcome of a Trump versus Biden election will have no difference for them personally. They just are like, they're completely apathetic. And obviously, you know,

for political addicts like you and me and listeners of this show, that makes you want to pull your hair out. It's maddening. But I do think it speaks to a broader lack of faith in a political system that provides a headwind for Democrats because we're the party that believes in government and believes that government can do things to help people. And Republicans overtly say things like, No, I want to drown, you know, the government in the bathtub. I want to make it that small. - I mean, nihilism helps the Republicans, right? If we can create an atmosphere of nihilism in this country, that helps one party. The party that doesn't believe in improving people's lives and doesn't improve, doesn't believe in using the government to do so. So of course, the Republicans love cynicism. They love nihilism. They love pessimism. They love all of that stuff. They love depressing turnout, as we know. And you're right, it's not just young voters, black voters, the New York Times ran a piece of it. Recently from a bunch of black pastors in Georgia who said the lack of a ceasefire is a real problem for us with our congregations Is a moral issue for us in Georgia?

That wasn't Muslims in mosques, that was Christians in churches. So it is a problem across the board, and intersectionality is a real thing, even if the right don't like that word. Which told me right at the beginning of this conflict that they had a meeting scheduled with a bunch of young climate change activists in Their office and they when they rang them when they called them say is it still happening? They're like we don't give an F about Climate change right now. We only care about Gaza. Right. So a lot of these young activist groups, they are all interconnected. If you care about climate change, you will tend to care about Gaza. And to care about police violence, these issues are interconnected and therefore you need a kind of offering across the board that engages with young voters and you gotta do the right thing. My worry is all of these things meld together and just hurt Biden across the board. And the Democrats need to realize this point. A lot of the people I hear... Complaining about Biden's Gaza policy, they're now saying stuff like, and he's really old and he falls over. Because of course, once you go down the TikTok or Instagram or Twitter rabbit hole of being anti someone.

Serves you up everything else. So it becomes very easy to lose a voter on one issue and then they're onto you and everything. That's very easy in our social media age, sadly. Yeah, it is. One of the things I want to talk about, speaking of the social media age, Mehdi, so there was a report in Semaphore recently about how a DC-based PR firm with very close ties to the Biden administration policing press coverage of the war in Gaza, including going as far as researching tweets that journalists sent back when they were in college, like back in 2008, 2009, 2011. You are on the front lines talking about this stuff every day and have been for a long time the front lines of social media, of Twitter. About the pressure that you and other journalists feel both internally at news organizations, Social media when it comes to covering the Middle East in particular, and how do you avoid being--

while also trying to listen to feedback and genuinely be balanced in your coverage? It's such an important question and right now I know and you know that there are many journalists who are very concerned about the pressure that's being applied about the sensitivities of this conflict. And let's just be very clear here. We have the Israeli government has a lot of supporters in Congress, has a lot of supporters in the media, has a lot of supporters in activist groups on K Street. There is a quote unquote pro-Israel lobby, which does. Apply pressure on media when I think you know, if you've worked like I have both in American media British media You've seen the emails from honest reporting calm and camera and some of these groups your listeners may never heard of but I'll tell you what Every newsroom has heard of these groups because they get badgered into why is your headline this and why is your reporter sharing bias? And as you say, why do they tweet this in this recent case? It's luis He's a Lovelock who is a British journalist at the Washington Post. He's a fantastic Middle East correspondent, covered Syria, covered Iraq, covered Gaza.

They covered a bunch of things. It's so absurd, the dossier they've produced against her. One of the things they go after is, she took part in student protests at university in England against tuition fees. And? Hey, that's a bad thing B. That means she can't cover Israel's bombing of Gaza. Like it's so Absurd the stuff that they pull out with me. Of course I've had stuff going about 20 30 years that they've thrown at me and it's a real problem where people get intimidated into not saying not speaking In Congress filled with white supremacists. We have a guy I think Andy Ogles from Tennessee this week who was caught on tape saying kill them all

None of these guys get any attention. No votes of censure. Who is the only member of Congress who's been censured since October the 7th? The one Palestinian woman, so let's just be very clear who the victims of quote unquote cancel culture and suppression and intimidation. It tends to be people who speak out on behalf of Palestinians. And that's the case with reporters They're just reporting what they're seeing and what they're seeing of course is not favorable to these rainy narrative because what they're seeing is mass starvation What they're seeing are mass killings. What they're seeing are kids being pulled out from the rubble. And of course that doesn't help the Israeli narratives. You have firms like, what is it? What is it called? SKD, I can't remember the name of the firm. Top advisor to Biden used to work out a bunch of Biden people used to wear that. Let me ask you this Tommy Do you believe as someone who's ex administration? Do you believe it would be helpful for our democracy? We talked about the system and people being disillusioned system if we could have clearer barriers between the private sector and the public sector between people working in government people

clicking in PR. So I'm probably complicit here. I did read that. Tommy, don't write off the power of the underwear lobby. Tommy John is a We don't want to cross those guys. Maddy, I read that Washington Post story and I thought, on one level, okay, everything we all tweet and post and whatever is in the public domain forever and we just all have Of that. But really when I read into like some of the things they were attacking Louise Lovelock for, it was like she said Obama's failure to put out a statement about an Egyptian was deplorable and I was like I think that's almost terminally dorky but I don't really find a ton of bias in this dossier here but I do think look this

Is one where people think if they speak out, they'll get slapped down. And I think it leads to caution and inaction and a lack of courage, both in media circles, but also among government staffers, because I know that I could never, ever be confirmed. For some sort of State Department job ever again, based on what I've said about Netanyahu alone. And there's a lot of people that are just not gonna make that decision. Barman recently there was a Muslim judge who was up for a judgeship and went before the Senate a few weeks ago And Tom Cotton was it Tom Cotton or Josh Hawley? change all those freaks. And one of them said, I think it was Cotton, said, you know, what do you think of...

He asked like a poem? Israel, Zionism, two states. I can't remember what it was. It was something about Israel. And the judge was like, I'm a judge in America. Nobody cares about my views on that issue. Why are you asking me that? Like, that's the point we've reached now, where you have those kind of theatrics in the Senate. Elise Stefanik in the house accusing every college president of being an anti-semite. Meanwhile, she pushes great replacement theory I mean the use and abuse of anti-semitism to shut down critics of Israel is also part of the problem here Which is why a lot of reporters rightly don't want to be called anti-semitic don't want to be teamed bigger It's so that also leads to kind of chilling atmosphere around free speech on this issue And of course we should speak out against anti-semitism wherever we see it and there is a lot of it around sadly right now Including in the media But that doesn't mean you can just not have reporters saying what they need to say about what's happening in the Middle East That for me is a fundamental problem and it's a real free speech in which we have Republicans trying to pass laws banning American businesses from being able to boycott Israel You don't have to support a boycott of Israel, but the idea idea that--

American business owner can't make that decision on their own is absurd. Yeah. I mean look anti-semitism is a real problem Anti-semitism is a growing problem, especially since October 7th. It's something I'm quite worried about I think we all should be calling out and highlighting I think the the thing that people can't let happen is the conflation of anti-semitism with criticism of Israeli Government policies you are not anti-american if you think that Trump's Muslim ban is bad. You are criticizing a platform or a policy put forward by a leader. Those are very different things. And I think when defenders of Israel call criticism of Israel anti-Semitic, they are actually putting Jews at risk because they are conflating the two and they're making people feel like you can take About the Israeli government and what it's doing in Gaza on some guy who lives down the street from you who wears a yarmulke. And that is very, very dangerous. - Let's not forget also, some of the most eloquent, passionate, and principled opponent in the--

Streets against the war in the Middle East since October 7th are groups like JVP, Jewish Voices for Peace, if not... Now a young Jewish activist group. These are Jewish Americans. They are not anti Semites. The leading opponent of sending more money to Netanyahu is a Jewish Senator named Bernie Sanders. Yep. Yep. Complicating the policy discussion about what to do about Gaza is the fact that... Is real is part of a broader bill that also includes desperately needed aid for Ukraine. So the Senate passed this supplemental funding bill with 70 votes, overwhelming bipartisan support that you don't often see these days. But Speaker Johnson over on the House side is-- scared to bring it to the floor for a vote because I don't know Marjorie Taylor Green might get him ejected from his job. He's the coward. So there's also progressive Democrats who say they won't vote for the supplemental bill because aid to Israel doesn't include

Talked about earlier. By the way, this is why being the House of Representatives sucks. You don't get to vote on clean bills. You have to get these things kind of squished together for political value. What do you think the right move is here? You're a principled person, you want to support Ukraine, you're also concerned about what's happening in Gaza. What the hell do you do if you're a member of the House? That's a great question. And three Democrats in the Senate, of course, oppose this. Peter Welch and Bernie Sanders of Vermont and Jeff Merkley. They said their reasons, their reasons are right now in this moment we can't have 14 billion dollars of extra. We already give every year three to four billion dollars of military and economic aid to Israel. To a country that is accused, let's remind our listeners, of a plausible genocide by the International Court of Justice. That is what is at stake right now. For me, it's a no brainer. I don't, I understand the importance of funding aid to Ukraine. I'm not someone who is soft on Putin, but I think.

Right now we need our best minds in government to find a way to fund Ukraine without funding Netanyahu's war in Gaza, which as I say the top court in the world says could be a genocide I think history will judge us very harshly if we continue voting for aid if our elected representatives Continue voting for aid to a government that is accused of war crimes whose ministers are talking openly about ethnic cleansing I think that's a real problem and I you know if we were if if it was just the occupation Which is bad enough like it was pre October 7th. Maybe we could have some debate About well, you know the pros and cons of Ukraine aid versus Israel I think in the middle of this right now where we're not even ensuring a ceasefire or using any kind of leverage I think it's a real problem. And I think as I say I think in years to come this will be Like the Iraq war where now everyone's like course we but everyone wants to say they opposed Iraq You'll never find anyone who says they defended Iraq from John Bolton

Everyone else is like we never supported Iraq and I think this what I think that's what Gaza is gonna look like in five ten Fifteen years from now. So I appreciate what Bernie Sanders and Peter Welch and Jeff It is as difficult as it is and I'm sure in our labyrinthine Process that we have in Senate and House we can find another way that we have to find another way To get the right aid to Ukraine the reality Is the American public, if you poll them, how supportive are they of either? That's the reality. American voters will look at this stuff and they are kind of, what about us? What about the money at home? And I'm not saying that's right or wrong, but I mean, that is the political context in an election. Yeah, that kind of America first nationalist argument is exactly what you're hearing from the MAGA Republicans. It's a powerful one, both currently and historically and in other countries. I was surprised and kind of heartened by a recent pupil that found 74% of Americans view the war in Ukraine as important to US national interests.

And 59% said it was important to them personally so that did make me think maybe they would be More open to aid than I thought I mean maybe you're you know There's also polling showing a lot of American support aid to Israel with conditions. Yes. Yes, don't forget That's what US law says. That's what the Leahy law says that you can't Give aid willy-nilly to foreign militaries who are accused of committing war crimes. Yeah, and sometimes people talk about this in terms of well, we shouldn't single out Israel the point you're making is very important here Which is conditioning aid to say you have to follow international law would be what? We do with every other country. Very briefly on that singling out, I just want to say one thing. If Donald Trump were President right now, Tommy, God help us all. I think you'd see a lot of liberals, a lot of Democrats much more upset about the war in Gaza and they would be much more supportive of continuing to do that.

This is a Trump Netanyahu thing. And we saw that when he was supporting Saudi Arabia, there was a big support to get conditions on aid to Saudi Arabia and arms sales to Saudi Arabia. Remember they passed a resolution in the Senate on the War Powers Act and that is the reality right now that if This was any other irony we're not singly out Israel if Israel was any other country and we were in a different place we would say wow what the hell are we doing here why are we supporting this and that's what We just want some consistency on human rights grounds. - And you don't want to let partisanship sort of swamp the security and moral interests. Last Friday we learned a great setup for the Trump piece of this. We learned that a Russian opposition leader named Alexei Navalny had been killed. Navalny was being held in a Russian penal colony in the Arctic Circle when he died. Putin tried to poison Navalny several times before throwing him in jail for 30 years on trumped up charges So we should all assume that this was just a state-sanctioned murder of Alexa

Navalny. Now that everyone listening knows that context, I want you to hear a clip from President Trump at a Fox News town hall last night. >> During this campaign, a huge amount of your time has been spent in court, in the courtroom in New York and so forth. Now in this New York civil fraud case, this Judge Arthur Engeron ruled against you for actually almost half a billion dollars plus interest that. Runs every day, when I first read this, like $87,000 a day, how would you put up that kind of money? Because you have a bond to put up. Even if you appeal, you got to put up escrow money. -It's a lot of no. -It is a form of Navalny. It is a form of -- Communism or fascism. How could it be Navalny and communism and fascism? I feel like that's that doesn't quite work. I mean it's unlike Trump to speak in an incoherent manner in the historical law.

Or English sentence. I mean, MAGA, I made this point recently on social media, MAGA want to have their cake and eat it. They want Trump to be Putin and the victim of Putin at the same time. He'll play any role going, right? And also this whole Navalny comparison is so absurd and the whole anytime something happens abroad You know Newt Gingrich jumps up and says this is what's happening to Trump. It's like no it's not You know if only Merrick Garland worked for Vladimir Putin If only he had an attorney general who refused to do what needed to be done in the time frame that he had You know Trump The luckiest man in the world. He incited an insurrection, then the next-- This guy came in and said, Let's look forward, not back. And the next guy appointed Attorney General who said, Let's not go after Donald Trump And now we're in an election year and none of the trials might be concluded or even start before people get to vote So this idea that he's like Navalny is absurd. He's actually the luckiest accused criminal I've ever come across. And Teflon Trump continues to dodge.

Prosecution. Look, Navalny was almost certainly killed. I mean, the Russian defense is that he died. What was it? Sudden death syndrome. You just had to walk. Doesn't exist for adults, as far as I'm aware. So it's absurd and by the way on a serious note I mean, they're all of Republicans now who are claiming that Trump is going to get assassinated the deep state wants to kill him And you remember and we can laugh and but these are people who thought including Trump that Scalia had been assassinated And if you're in 20 in when that seat or 2015 whatever it was when that seat became available These people are obsessed with this stuff. So look, this is not Russia obviously we have a president who's not actually involved in any of the trials has run a run away from any involvement with any prosecutions of Trump and again Go back to the Russia issue. I was never a big kind of quote unquote Russia gate as the right person. I was never somebody who thought the biggest problem with Donald Trump's presidency was that he was an agent of Russia.

I always did wonder, how come the guy who slams everyone on Earth calls everyone an insult and a nickname? ever says anything about Putin? How can we never ever critical? Like find me one statement where he insults belittle. He even mocked Kim Jong-un as little rocket man before he fell in love with it through Putin nothing nada not from before presidency During presidency not since and even now with Navalny refuses to say anything critical of Putin's up for me That's always been a problem that next Yeah, and the irony here is that Navalny, you know, built his career fighting corruption, exposing corruption from people like Dmitry Medvedev, who was the former president of Russia or Vladimir Putin. But you're right to call out the people who think Trump will be assassinated because people who believe things like that will do things like January 6th and it's worrisome.

To be Trump's VP. Yes, he was asked in Dubai, I think, you know, he flies from one oasis of democracy to another. And said, he sat there and he they said to him about, you know, you didn't bring up all the killings under Putin when you Did you interview with him and he said well, you know every leader has to kill people And it's like that is now the mindset on the right like this is not your Ronald Reagan's Republican Party This is the body that's just says Remember Trump said that to Bill O'Reilly, like, you think we're not killers? And in one sense, as a lefty, I would say, I'm glad people are bringing up the fact that we've killed a lot of innocent people. I think that Republicans now are just going around saying, It's fine for foreign dictators to assassinate people because, because merit go--

Coming after our guy. I mean, they're not the same thing. Yeah, because Trump cheated on his taxes. Well, I want to ask you about Tucker Carlson. So he went to Moscow, he interviewed Putin, he forgot to ask about Navalny, but he did have time to film some propaganda videos about the subway being nice and about the grocery stores. So do you think Tucker Carlson uses a subway in this country? No, no, you know, he's black. Cars only for the last 30 years. I would love your take on this. I don't really have a problem with interviewing Vladimir Putin. I do think if you're going to do it, you'd do it right. Of a war. You're known for doing really tough interviews. People often retweet the videos of them and wonder why the hell did this person agree to go on that show. What's your philosophy on interviewing bad actors like Vladimir Putin? So totally we should interview Vladimir Putin. How could we not? And the lie that Tucker told in that video that he did announcing Interview was that nobody else nobody wants to interview him. That's why I came here, which is which even Putin spokesman said that's

Not true, we turn down interview requests from the West every day. Like even Putin's own spokesman disowned Tucker Carlson's nonsense. So of course people want to interview him, it's how you interview him. It's not in a kind of friendly, chatty, sycophantic way. And we've seen Trump's, we've seen Tucker's interview with Trump was very sycophantic and with Putin. And look, if I Was interviewing Vladimir Putin. And by the way, Putin has now told other interviewers, I was very disappointed with this interview. I think it's more challenging. Imagine Vladimir Putin mocking you and saying you were too soft on me. So good. Right. That's just I mean, take that to your epitaph. For me, I what I find fascinating about Vladimir Putin is he's taken some. Interesting stances in the past. And like if I sat down with Vladimir Putin, if he ever let me do an interview, which he probably wouldn't, you know, I would wanna talk about what he's done to Ukraine in the context of years of. Quantificating about national sovereignty and borders, right? Putin was the guy in 2003 who stood up against George W. Bush and Tony Blair and said, You

Iraq, that's an illegal invasion, it's going to be a disastrous occupation, and you're violating national sovereignty. Ukraine 2014 and 2022. I feel like you could have actually a quite interesting back and forth, pushing him on the inconsistencies of an foreign policy. And of course, he's a gaslighter like Trump. You're not going to go too far with such people. But I think exposing contradictions and inconsistencies interviewers to do. I would love to hear that interview. I'd probably be in a cell next to poor Evan who we should remember as well, an American journalist who is still being held. Yes, that's a very good point. Putin has detained a Wall Street Journal reporter named Evan... Uh, yeah, maybe if I were you and you interviewed Putin, I would probably not drink the tea that you're offered or whatever. I would do it via zoom. Yeah. Okay, we're gonna take a quick break. When we come back, we're gonna talk about how impeachment is blowing up in Republicans'

Hey, everyone. It's Ted from Consumer Cellular, the guy in the orange sweater. And this is your wake-up call. Thanks for watching! or visit ConsumerCellular.com. Savings based on cost of Consumer Cellular single line one five and 10 gig data plans with unlimited talking text compared to lowest cost single line postpaid unlimited talk text and data plans offered by T-Mobile and Verizon January, 2024. Hey guys, our new book, Democracy or Else, How to Save America in 10 Easy Steps is finally out and available now. At this point, we all know what we're up against, American democracy is in crisis and that can feel daunting. That's why in Democracy or Else, we broke down all the lessons we learned from years working on campaigns and hosting Pod Save America into 10 steps you need to get informed, to get involved, to get off the sidelines. And it's not just a useful step-by-step guide to get you through this year, it is packed full of--

And unhinged illustrations that will keep you laughing and save you from drowning in your sense of existential dread. Thank you again to everyone who's bought the book so far. Crooked Media is donating its profit to support Vote Safe America and progressive campaigns in 2024. So the book is already making a difference. And if you haven't ordered your copy yet, there's no better time than now, or head to crooked.com/books to grab yours now. So Republicans went into this election season hoping to run hard on border security and the idea of the so-called Biden crime family. Lately, it seems like both of those issues are kind of blown up in their faces. So last week, the Justice Department indicted an FBI informant named Alex--

Alexander Smirnov, who was a confidential source at the center of the Republican allegations that President Biden benefited from Hunter Biden's business dealings in Ukraine. This is the guy who allegedly said that Burisma, this Ukrainian natural gas company, had added Hunter to its board to curry favor with Joe Biden and that there had been some sort of Bribe or a shakedown or something by the Bidens to get a prosecutor fired. Turns out, Mehdi, it's all fake and there's evidence that Smirnov might be a Russian intelligence asset. In a new court filing on Tuesday, Justice Department prosecutors alleged that Smirnov had recent and extensive contact with Russian intelligence officials who were involved in passing him information about Hunter Biden. Today, President Biden's brother, James, is appearing for the House Oversight Committee and Hunter Biden is set to testify.

As part of the impeachment inquiry next week. So Mehdi, the whole paragraph I just read you about this Smirnov guy, what a name, it's all giving me flashbacks to 2016, 2017, the Steele dossier, the Russian interference, you know the story. Democrats do here. This seems like some credible evidence of Russian involvement, but I just, sound like I'm wearing a tinfoil hat again and deal with this nonsense. Which shows you the power of Republican propaganda that even you and I sitting on Pods Save America are like, Oh my god! Not Russia again! Like they're so beaten into us that the Russian thing was nothing burger when it wasn't a nothing burger That we're now kind of getting pdst and getting defensive. Let's be clear. The indictment is not just from the biden doj It's from a trump appointed prosecutor david weese. Why is like i never

Nance's last name who who has brought these charges saying this is ridiculous. This guy was quite a credible Informant or witness and don't forget the entire Republican impeachment strategy against Joe Biden Depended on this guy like Ted Cruz. I believe I saw someone tweet that Ted Cruz did dozens of his podcast episodes Just on this guy's outtakes. James Comer called him a credible witness. Chuck Grassley, when he's not out looking for pigeons, was citing this guy. They were all there like bigging up Smirnoff. Remember the FBI didn't want to give the form with this guy's evidence on it because they said, We don't think he's valid. Republicans insisted, Give it to us. And then built their entire impeachment case around this guy who the FBI said, Hey, this guy's not credible. He's now being charged. I mean the indictment, by the way, if PodSaver. - I'm down with a copy of the indictment 'cause I'll tell you what, I've become a fan of reading DOJ indictments recently. They are very well written. - Of course you are.

Whether they're written by David Weasel, whether they're written by Jack Smith, there's some good stuff in there. I mean, going back to that, the Morilago bathroom photo, like I've become a fan. DOJ indictments like put that on my reading list. This one has a whole section Tommy where they talk about mr. Smirnoff meeting Russian official one who Smirnoff describes as a son of some government minister who apparently is in Charge of assassinations abroad. Come on! Where do you get colour in detail like that even in the best of novels? So Smirnoff, the republic... This week. The entire Biden impeachment campaign could have been a Russian op is hilarious. But yes, does will be treated by a lot of MAGA folks. That's just another conspiracy. Russia, but what's interesting is in the indictment they make it very clear. This isn't just about Russian officials. It's about demonstrable evidence of falsehood

Like he said, Hunter Biden was in Ukraine when Hunter Biden never went to Ukraine. He's, you know, he made certain- the next one. Want to add one thing Tommy I am no defender of Hunter Biden or James Biden I do believe they did trade off their name I do believe they did get jobs and contracts because they were related to Joe Biden in the next one. Corrupt, I don't know financially great way perhaps probably that is not the same thing as saying the president I say took a bribe Which is a big allegation, which is an impeachable allegation There has been zero evidence of that from the very beginning and the republicans needed this dodgy dude called smirnoff To try and make it and look they don't care They'll you know fox are not even covering the stuff shauna hannity made at the centerpiece of his programming They'll never do a fact check which is why I refuse to call them fox news. Not a new Channel it's a pro yeah they're not in I love the idea of like you waking up in the morning brewing some coffee just flipping through some of diamonds don't

Read that Robert Herr one, well maybe read it. It starts shitty, but by the end we get good details. - All right, honey, which indictment from the DOJ should we download from? - Meddy the Dead with a three-ring binder and a little flashlight. Just do it on screen PDF baby. Oh there we go so plan B. Maddy since you're as you pointed Out. They cannot find any evidence that Joe Biden benefited financially in any way from his son's business dealings, is impeaching the secretary of Homeland Security Alejandro Mayorkas. This is like the consolation prize, right? If the Biden impeachment didn't work out. Who can we impeach next? Who else? What's our list? Let's go down. It's basically like, the Republicans think that they're impeaching him because they don't agree with the Biden immigration policy. Policy.

In the Senate. We're now learning that a bunch of conservative senators like Rick Scott, J. D. Vance, Ted Cruz, et cetera, they want Mitch McConnell to force a full impeachment trial. They might have been meeting with the parliamentarian to figure out a way to do it. So there's sort of two schools of thought maybe on how Democrats should handle this. One is dismiss impeachment via procedural means, just kind of like get it off the table. The other is call the Republicans bluff, have a trial, make the case about how absurd all of this is. Do you have a take? on what is smarter politically? - I would say the first option only because the second option only works if you're good at that kind of political trench warfare and Senate Democrats are not. - Out of any faith that the Democratic leadership or the Democrats in the Senate would be able to fight fire with fire in the same way. I just watched recently Chris Murphy, I'm for it's you know, very good on a lot of issues, you know He was coming out recently and praising my Republican friends in the

And I'm always like I never hear Republican senators talk about their Democratic friends funny that but this is a dumb thing to do by the house Dumb is the word I think Kevin Cramer, a Republican senator, used recently saying it's dumb why we can't entertain this. Cruz, Mike Lee, the usual suspects are pushing it. People like Ted Cruz and Mike Lee shouldn't even be in the Senate. They should've been expelled for their role in inciting an insurrection. The fact that people like Hawley and Cruz. Or even still Senator, I know we've all moved on. I'm still mad about the fact that there was never a full ethics committee investigation of Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz's role in trying to overturn American democracy. So the idea that we should take lectures from them about impeachment is absurd. No, I would try and get rid of it. I'm not part I do not. Leave in this democratic party argument that, Hey, let's talk about immigration and talk about how we did this bipartisan bill and they turned it down and actually we're playing 3D chess. No. Sorry. You look at the polling.

That bipartisan bill failed, they said they blame Biden more than Trump for that failure. People don't follow this stuff closely. When they think of immigration, they think Republicans tough, Democrats weak, Republicans win, Democrats lose. The idea that you should want to be talking about the border going into the presidential election... And that the idea that that helps anyone other than the Republicans is mad. I agree with you broadly. I think you need an On the border and I think that the Republicans negotiating and then killing their own bipartisan immigration bill is that answer and you're absolutely right? There was some polling that came out right away that showed the majority of voters blame President Biden for what happened, which as you note shows that they're just not paying attention and they just have negative feelings about Biden. So they're blaming him for anything.

So I do think, you know, there will need to be some paid media efforts to get that message in front of voters so they are better educated on the issue. I do not think an impeachment hearing is going to do it. I also think the Democrats just need to highlight how extreme Trump would be on immigration That for me is very important. You see the post today, Deportations with the military? Yes, and going back to our earlier conversation about Michigan and Muslims, when I talk to people who are skeptical about Biden and say, One of the things that comes up is, 'Are you okay with a Trump time?' They're either not okay with the Trump term or they'll say something like we survived Trump once we can survive him again And then what I do in that case, Tommy, is I lay out what's coming in Trump term two, because Trump two is not Trump one, right? This is not a. Sequel to a movie which is the same as the first movie. It is very different what is coming down the line. Fascism and I'm not just saying this in hyperbolic way as a critic. This is the stuff They're saying what Stephen Miller is saying what Mike Davis is saying what Donald Trump is saying what Steve Bannon is saying?

And I lay out what's coming up including massive detention camps to sweep up people inside the interior of this country from day one. The use of the insurrection act to deploy the military. So a friend of mine said recently, well, you know, we Against Trump, we'll do it again. And I said, Yeah, this time you might get shot at. And that's again, not hyperbole. We know from Esper, his former defense secretary, that Trump said, Why can't we shoot them in the legs? The George Floyd protest, and he said, You can't do that, Mr. President. Next time round, Defense Secretary Kash Patel will not say, You can't do that, Mr. President. President he'll say let's do it. So this is what's coming down the line Actually when you talk to people and explain what's coming actually you do get some sense of there are persuadables And I think the Democrats need to be doing that full ball right now 24/7 of what is coming from a Trump second term and not this whole my Republican friends in the Senate It's the fascist enablers who are coming down the trail

- Yes, totally agree. And luckily, Trump is kind of helping us tell that story. - He doesn't write anything. He says it out loud every single day. - Yeah, so he did a Fox town hall last night. It was with Laura Ingraham, where he was his usual thoughtful coach himself, talking about his legal prowess, many other things. How he's loved by billionaires. Into a little super cut we did. It's gonna be worse than any other form of crime. I have to say, this is, in a very positive way, He has been much better for me than he was for himself. I watched his campaign. They come out with. Faucets where no water comes out. You know, if you go and buy a home, and they know what I mean, the showers, you stand under a shower and there's no water coming and you're saying, you end up standing there. Five times longer.

Okay, well there's mail-in voting in Florida and you won huge. That's right. If you have it, you're going to have-- But you won. Sort of a greatest hits, some new stuff. The greatest hits are there, The Shower, the obsession with showers and faucets and water pressure. That is a book in itself. We'll discover why Donald Trump is obsessed. And when people say to me, Oh, Joe Biden, he confused CC with the president of Mexico. That guy wants to inject Clorox into your veins and is obsessed with toilet flush levels, You would get up and walk away from the guy on the on the subway on Tucker Carlson subway who talked about shower pressure Incentively, by the way in that clip Tommy he yet again admits to crying Because he says mail-in voting is fraud. That makes him a fraudster because he's ruled by mail in Florida in 2020 in the GOP primary. So once again, he can't help himself, but just admit to all sorts of wrongdoing, even on his own terms. If it's fraud, then he's a fraudster.

Fraudster. I guess shit. I think was yeah, the crazy shit is exactly which was as reported on CNN It's nice of Trump to make it easy for us. So yes, clearly they will keep doing this Maddy Thank you so much for doing the show today. It's so great Talk with you as always and everyone should buy your book win every argument because then you can just you know beat everyone in your family over holidays or whatever debate you need to do. Or ahead of an election if you're trying to persuade people. Yeah there's that one. There's a lot. That too. Thank you for having me. I look forward to coming back next week as well. You're not going to be that easily, Tommy. Damn right.

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Thanks to our digital team, Elijah Cone, Haley Jones, Mia Kelman, David Toles, Kiril Paloviv, and Molly Lobel. In a year as divisive as 2024, There's a lot to disagree about, but something we can all get behind is Jon Stewart's return to The Daily Show. The late night legend takes to the host chair to help us sort through news, politics, and entertainment with hilarious and satirical takes. You need to survive this election season. I watched the first one. It's great. It's great to see Jon back there. You know? Really, he just got right back into it. Yeah. Going back in time. Wiser. Or lines, this face is a map of the world, frankly. The Daily Show Ears Edition podcast offers daily episodes fine-tuned for your ears, along with the biggest headlines, exclusive extended interviews, and more. Listen to The Daily Show Ears Edition wherever you get your podcasts.