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#24 Exit & Return, Part II


This week, we conclude Shulem Deen’s story. In part I, we heard how the internet led him on a path where he was exiled from his community and separated from his family. In part II, Sruthi Pinnamaneni tells the story of how the Hasidic community has tried to block off a corner of the internet for itself, and how this new, informal Hasidic internet might offer Shulem a way back. 

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
This episode is brought to you by better for him a new podcast from eighty people. In each episode Francesca Ramsay talks to visionaries in business leaders about mistakes. They ve made how they work their way through them and came out better for it. Listen on Spotify wherever you get. Your pot casts on weight so that leave her activity about showdown dead. This interview you about, show out of his eye. We need effective, we need of language advisory on the up, so I dont even eat ass guesses thanks from gimlet reply? All show that the internet mpg vote- and I am Alex called me This week we have part. Two of story about you, Undine. If you didn't hear part one, you should go back now: listen our producers,
They put him in any reported. This story, shrewdly, will take it from here. So here's a quickly. Show him dean used to live in an altar orthodox hasidic community called new square. He spent all his time, their praying studying the Talmud. He had. No marriage when he was eighteen, five, kids, by the time he was twenty, seven and somewhere in all of that he got a computer woman. Things that came with the computer was three point: five floppy disk. The AOL trial. So I put in this field, This can it says you know: welcome you ve got mail, and this is all world. This news, their shopping, there's chat rooms, this AOL count started him down a long path out of his orthodox life and into secular world he lost his faith was banned, from his community. An enlarged sat beside. We learn that it had been seven years since he had seen his kids they're, not on Facebook. A local newspaper. In all this time, the
communication he's gotten from them is a single piece of mail, a note from one daughters will call her Friday. Until I totally with did open an inside was just a hummingbird said: happy Hanukkah, nothing, those personal her signature, so she sign her name Friday, D putting her last initial anaemic, like which, other Friday as if she's writing sending this to someone she knows, but not a really close found them still. He was thrilled. One of his kids was reaching out, so he sat down and wrote a three page letter and scented certified male signature required and then you know I'm sitting at the computer a day to later in with it packing number and I'm amino hitting refresh and its up in Jersey and its in North Jersey, and I was in rockland and then it's out for delivery and awaiting an
You know sitting there waiting for you to say like no delivered, but then it just stopped. There were no updates. Every day, he would check that there is nothing and us switch later. It gets up dated, saying being returned to centre in two days later I get it back in the mail that was at New Square had closed up again, but recently she'll discovered an opening another way to reconnect. It takes a couple sepsis explain, but to start you have to look a short story through the eyes of the has set him because to them there. In a lot of showrooms lately people who not only laughed but were also air, the community's dirty laundry to the secular world, so when twenty twelve, the history leadership decided the time had come to reckon with the internet. How this thing called me: a safer Hebrew for gathering the guy you oversized internet.
How soon that you sly, and it was a big gathering, historic, big city field, a giant baseball stadium in New York was filled with thousands of hasidic and orthodox jewish men, a sea of black cats and nah killers. This bill overcrowd actually old and neighbouring stadium, where they watched a video feed of these safer Nah, sixty thousand people, all you to save their way of life from the internet. What is the best way to protect me? Sell my home it business in the pocket again then it's your noise the trials our generation, as we all know, all of us gathered here, is playing the pitfalls, technology, modern technology policies, even though the sham has seldom have been resisting the temptations of modernity for a long time since the,
in hundreds when an austrian rabbi huh some sulphur said All that is new is forbidden by the Torah, time and new technology has come along since then the history of taken, what like and left the rest behind take the radio rate their frowned upon in the hesitant community, but say you wanna, Cosette They are to play religious music, it come but the radio, as almost all Cosette players do so you do it. Every good hesitate person. Does you break off the antenna simple, but that's just step one. If you want to hear a kosher version of the things you care on the radio. Well, you just dial this number two Two three, four four eleven hundred It's called coolness answer a historic hotline, their ads at the top. You press one for news, the weather, but operators, eight for the Torah, an open up, old and lots of other options for talk, shows or interviews. One person,
You sad, but these are our podcast Gabby the hotline, his genius, really everything from the radio minus the chance. You'd come upon a Miley, Cyrus Song or had so that's how they fixed the radio problem. But how do you take on a phone like the internet always to have. I talk to this guy. One of the people trying to solve that problem was calamari. We spoken accede of my car in my parking lot. His voice obviously mast. I suggested a cafe, but he didn't want people to see us. The has communities, wary of the press. I was thinking of you, gonna, be there in some of them have a victuals and as though we are ever, you're anything bad, but that's enough to the sea for the historic elders decided hey. If we can turn parts of Europe went into a shuttle. Maybe we do the same thing online make haste
internet, an hour. He had a part to play in this plan. He would for company that sold hasidic internet filters, I went out of business and I try to get to the definition of the and they would walk through the neighbourhood on people's doors, go into hasidic businesses, and they would ask. Do you use the internet, yes, okay, we can make it pusher weakened, one filter on your computer, one that lets you use the internet, the minus all bad stuff. We were interested in what I have to and you can decide how much bad stuff you one filtered out. Are he told me, I'm. Clients filter out everything except for their own company website, and if you need a little more access. If you need more open, you call them they own black, it a little more like Amazon for your business, Ok, so you have Amazon now, obviously their stuff there. You don't want to see the historic. Or can still protect EU faces phases of black,
raised as Africa technology that sees the skin color and his gang all colored up. Let's say they: they feel that skinnes too much exposed a comeback. So let me imagine this so if I were to go to say Amazon dot com- and there are some scantily- model selling I dont know toaster, then what I would, if I had the right filter on, is that model space and body would be black luck. The whole pictures even the toaster also I wanted to try one of these filters out for myself, so went to a hasidic internet cafe. I am sir. It's in the heart of historic Williamsburg we keep way working hours are just talked him before com. This is says the owner. He asked not to use a last name, and he also asked me to come late at night after it, P M, so I wouldn't freak out any of US customers with my giant microphone sits. Usually
over here like where did this will set us over whom, over her it's a nice big, with salmon colored walls some computers aren't boots. You can step right in and closed the door CAFE as a safe space. All the computers here serve up filtered internet Lucy Tobin, aware of this type of anything so we sat down at the computer and I tried to go to Youtube. And so this of that this category of streaming, video is blocked, a grey window popped up and green, that sad that this site is not allowed. I tried a bunch of sites, Facebook, Twitter, New York Times there all blocked and then I tried, the New York Post, Julie Oversight senior post. I see kind of the headlong, not even the headlines, just those that header and some headlines, but no pictures and its into your posts, but with all pictures of violence and celebrities time slot of gray. I like this
The new post Joseph does to in fact that We likes all his new sites from his perspective, it's crazy that we want com, Wheatley, unfiltered internet, since it means seeing stuff like videos of ISIS killing civilians before you go to bed you already know, as many see actually like lately. With every day that we had this the breadth of mental life and people saw this with Ex extra to say that I can hide she'd. Such kindest often forced myself to see, because we're saw so much discussion about in this. To my mind for for days. You wish you haven't seen it of course. Of course I wished. I will never seen a lonely. You need to be doing so the color legists to dislike the stuff. So take that view of wishing you could unseen something and just apply it to a big chunk of the internet, in fact to almost all of it, have tells me he's happy where he is. He loves.
Neighbor. He is a big family on Sabbath. He turns off his phone. Faced with this kid's, he doesn't want to change, and that is why and are the filter guy we're both at the safer to them the idea building the safe shuttle version of the internet, its essential, even if it seems like it's against the entire nature of the internet. Internet does not make me feel too so watch was should or should we put our heads together. She I give up. Now is, if I get we said we give up, then we give up definitely for our generations, so Yes, we will not in the EU. We know that the internet is here is here to stay, we're not, HU, the internet. You find myself to make sure that we are not so into the anthem Do you if I was in twenty twelve and thanks to the of Aryan Joseph and many other hasidic tech eyes, there is a kosher
corner of the internet. You can use it and not be branded a heretic. And that brings us back to show em coming up after the break. The secular internet separated shown from his community theirs internet provides away back in this episode is brought you buy better for it, a new podcast from eighty pig hosted by Francesca Ramsay. We all make mistakes better. For it looks at how mistakes have shaped the lives and careers of visionaries and business leaders and helps them think differently about what their working for you'll hear from an entrepreneur who ventured out on his own, and so I went out. I took seven hundred dollars. I had in the bank, but my own pickup truck took some flyers business cards and Later I had a business and in each hour, rule breaker, whose learn while we all care about work in the first place, you are proud of the work
Do you want to be able to tell your friends about you wanna, be able to feel like you're, making a difference, you'll hear how they work their way through their mistakes and came out better for listen on Spotify or wherever you get your PA casts. This episode is brought to you I saw her picture this a world where you spend less time juggling email meetings and status, updates and more time doing the work that matters. The most your team, that's the world economy, bill to create a saga is an app designed to help teams plan, organise and execute all the work they do together its built to give teams clarity. You can all understand your goals and how to achieve them together and whatever your next object, is a sonnet can help reduce the busy work that waste your time from small companies to global enterprises, more than a million teams across a hundred and ninety five countries get work done with Sata, learn more and
I s honor for free visit, assign a dot com to get started. That's a stay: Anais, dot, com. Before the break. We rather orthodox communities attempt to block off a piece of the internet for themselves to be tiny online shuttle. Now, sir, they pay the story of how Shoe Undine encounter, that online shuttle one sex of the historic and are not that came into being after the safer. Was this web form codfish table Yiddish for Coffee House one day when you twelve, he doesn't remember when show em dean discovered this site he but I can certainly bring it up, but it is so there's not that much You can see the oh forms and message boards Reddit Craigslist the Filter ox all of them, but this generally allowed. It looks like a stripped down, read it,
Everything is in Europe. There are topics you expect find news, religion, the Talmud, but also people here talk about things they never would have talked about and say, some he told me- he sometimes puts on a young to your dish, cereal podcast season, one, a true murder, MR yeah yeah threat So what is this? If you held two weeks ago. Would he have told the police that he asked her for a ride that day? In other words, Conversely, evil is a lot like a message board in the secular world, but there are plenty of differences as well ample when we pulled it up. There was this moment where we realized. No one else was online whose whose here now this is whose here like the Yahoo, but the Google by the member, and showed him did John, we eyes, oh of course, Saturday afternoon, it's the middle of Sabbath, because these guys are all at home now having disastrous meals. It's two o clock in the afternoon undertaking there you know after a and they gonna have an absent,
even though Shoreham is an atheist, who left his community at great cost Tom misses the rituals of Judaism. He told me he sometimes puts on a yamaha sneaks into historic services. Here the music, the feeling of oneness and kurdish people provided a tiny head of that feeling He could listen and unfamiliar conversations, these many shrimp and in the nursery what'd. I tell you this. I did not wear on the internet. Could you log on and find many many p Just of analysis about microscopic shrimp that live in tap water, because it's an insect in the Bible says that you cannot eat insects, but but that's not so clear, because I you don't understand how these things work, I'm not Britain insect, because what, if it's a fish and if its fish then is forbidden for different reasons. All of this minutiae, these debates, this whole site, it just felt like home, you feel at home, is coming back to your hometown. When you, you know, like you in thirty years in the place where you grew up in and you went away and then you come back it's like you know.
Where the drugstore isn't, you know in the bump, on the sidewalk as a kid, you would go over with your bike and right since I, like you, know all the little places, and you know who's the town drunken who's the right leg you place where you can either places where you go and meet people in person. Have this feeling there is no other place for me goes back to new square shores as he spit out called names- but here on this forum, all these when hotheads were welcoming him, there was one things were, I said like if I should go into this, because you know I am after all, just a guest here, because I didn't feel like this is my plea. They felt like I'm chiming in its work really belong somebody responded saying no you're like you're you're, a local. Your fine, like we hope, you're stick around, so he did
for a few months he debated, discussed and settled in until one day when he got this email from a guy. I know, but you he was a model of sorts, and so he send me an email and a pdf. Discussion that was going on about what to do about the fact that should convene is part of this group and do allow this or not pages and pages, a fierce debate, people arguing that a heretic didn't deserve to be here before saying locally, come here. We want a virtual representation of our community and allowing someone who has completely different thoughts. A complete different mindset and brings up the kinds of discussions that we would never allow within. Our community chain is the nature of what this forum is
it's kind of like you know, in order, we to change a nature neighbourhood. It was. It was a deja vu moment like oh, my god, another one of these meetings where they're like. Should we keep him or should we throw him out? It was that same debate as before back when children was kicked out of New Square accept this time he could. See it happening in front of him. There were people who thought he was pure evil. For who stood up for him who found the middle? It gives me complicated feeling, and that's what happened here. I was like. I love these people, but I hate them and crazy and they're stupid in insane and their ignorant, but some of them really smart and even the ignorant ones, is something really funny and when there are really fucking sharp, and show him says even back in two thousand five even I was being kicked out of new square. The ram
eyes were telling me. I am expelled at the end of that meeting. They said to me, but we hope you'll come back some time and what are the rabbi said you and stay at my house, you, your whole family and so the this weird feeling that I have about the hasidic community. In that you know it, love you guys for that for being such so really sort of likeable asked like I don't know before I left she wanted to show me a Youtube video this is a video of just a much as it meant something. I know it's one that you watch us all the time. And I tell you like tapping you immediately like the reflex I love the cylinder like these guys. I know that my note this guy this guy, I know like you from our committee in the square
they're sitting around as circular table it's at a bar mitzvah, is this faster and faster. Until slovens Shillin as homesick for a place he doesn't want to return to. In the end, the people published evil decided to let him stay he's glad, but all better about being put through another tribunal. Don't hang around, though, because sure. He sees himself in the people here on coffee, stable people appreciated, attach and then talk about cereal afterwards. Might see him as an outsider, but his hopeless
they're more like him. Then they know the causes bill exists because the chasm between his world and theirs is narrowing. Maybe day. Those words will come close enough. That is, kids will be able to cross over. Do you Imagine that some mention, of course, immersion, Of course, I imagine that, in other words, imagine a kieva with a smartphone. Somehow got hold of and watch and he's. Getting videos and he's like sheriff curious about the world and one day he reaches out- and he's like you know, I'm not so to this programme, maybe wants to remain hasidic, maybe not
the things that you kind of that you dream about a little bit like daydreams, you how you all the time all the time, but I wonder what it's going to be like it's almost like in my mind. I know for certain that something is going to bring about this shit. I'm happy the the amendment. Eighty is a producer for a shout. Sure has written a memoir called all who go do not return. It just came a month ago through they loved each other, so that there's not very much overlap between his story and what we reported. So if you want to know more about him, that book is a good place to get viruses by me. Pga vote
in our old man, you're bruises, we'd, better Howard, through the amendment eighty and edited by out swedenborgian FEAR, Bennett. We're mixed by Reverend John the war and gave her special thanks to El Douglas Emma Jacobs and James Hounds now, There is something you think is impossible, but you have to try anyway, our theme music, is by the mysterious master. Cylinder are add, music is by build buildings, and that beautiful saw you heard at the end of the story is by a group called sheer acquire you have more episodes, Itunes, dot com, such reply. All reply that linen and we ve got a dvd- threats for this episode dig up on our website is your file that diamonds, which is in partnership with our legs, thanks for listening, the next Wednesday.
Transcript generated on 2020-02-13.