Hey it is your favorite host in all of pod custom. Now for the rest of the year, I'm gonna be asking you to join us by becoming a member of reveal reveal is all about going deep, pulling on threads telling stories that matter for more than three years now reveal has been fighting a lawsuit. That's been jeopardizing our very existence of restoring, did about an organization called planet aid. Our story raises serious questions about whether international aid was actually reaching the people. It was intended to help and what's more, our story was truthful and we stand by it. We believe it is our duty to fight attacks like this. The fighting a lawsuit comes at a huge costs are legal fees alone totalled more than seven million dollars. Luckily, we have pro bono legal support to help our in house counsel, but it still takes significant resources, resources that should be used to do more public service journalists. This kind of investigative

it takes time and it cost money. If you believe in the work we do the absolute best way to support us is by becoming a member of reveal to do it just text. The word reveal two hundred and forty seven, four thousand seven hundred and forty seven standard data rates apply and you can text stop or cancel at any time also all new members who donate at least five dollars a month. We get our facts, t shirt again just text. The word reveal two hundred and forty seven, four thousand seven hundred and forty seven. And all you who already support our work. I would offer a deep sincere thanks. We can't do this work without being willing afforded twenty twenty. We have big things plan, so, let's go to some good work together. from the centre for investigative reporting in p r ex? This is reveal a lesson

early evening, Athens, Shobo County Court House in Philadelphia, Mississippi if you heard of this fairly before it may be because of the infamous nineteen sixty four murder, the three civil rights workers here. The mission to be burning case, a towering statue of a confederate soldier keep watch from the courthouse lawn inside Felicia Hickman, a tall woman with a calm demeanor is taken, stand police Son Isaiah sits at the front of the court one an orange jumpsuit, handcuffed and chain as easily fourteen, but in today's hearing is being treated as an adult believed his last name to protect his privacy. Yes,

Yes, I see his tall like his mom so from the back key blends in with other adults in the court that day, but of close his A wise and lack of facial here give his youth away the the judge and lawyers, are questioning Felicia to determine whether Isaiah case should be transferred to the youth. That would mean getting out of the county jail. Where he's been waiting for court date for nine months, nine months in adult jail, that's linked on the whole school year. So how does this happen reporter co? Brag is the following, as is case, trying to figure that out call came to us through, reveals investigative, fellowship programme and should be working on the story for the last year or so called How did you first find out about? I say so

years ago. I had just finished grad school and bombing in my parents house, and I pick up a copy of the local paper and there's this headline right beneath the fold, and it says thirteen year old, charged with armed robbery over a cell phone and so there's not much contacts in this article and I read through at a bunch of times Myself, how does this happen? How is it that someone, this young, is sent to jail overt stealing a cell phone and then had to follow up on it, and so this paper, like a lot of papers in Mississippi, publishes people's address after they ve been arrested, including children. If there are any adult system, so I put that address, I put ideas address in my gps and I drive over to see if you know someone's home. I knock but no one answers, and so I stick a note through a hole on the screen, and I say please call me: anytime day or night, I really went up by their and so Felicia calls me and we talk and she's really concern.

And I don't have any good answers for her, but I keep trying to follow this case through the system. Co starts to learn more about ASEAN case and in the ISIS ends up, uncovering a larger pattern of unequal treatment for black heads in Mississippi legal system of Felicia, six kids, I their false right in the middle she remembers. He was a chubby baby, lays the column, lithium mouths. Oh, he was Faye, it has some believe ass. He started work if only turn why he would know crybaby in about a goal You go home gotta in bad he's vertical. When I say I turned seven, his teacher says he's really smart, but he's been acting out. Testing shows he has ADHD, which explains the hyperactivity, inattention, impulsiveness, so

We should start him on medication from Denon out. He was all eyes he could sit there, he could concentrate and he wasn't so easily again. See, I was there grows into a link teen. He keeps a close bond with his mom. He was just one knows, always real close to me like if I was having a bad day he was gonna, be that wanted the say sought in the kind of by no make me laugh. They said He was gone, he was going, graduating was gone occurs in he was. Don't buy me a house. He fell with my first real, you will go, buy me a coverlet, escalate and assets.

You know we holding it it now when, as exits to middle school, he doesn't want to take the medication anymore. He tells his mom. It makes them feel funny. How aspires make you feel fine, make you sleep to murder, Abbe wanna go I'll be. Were my freeze ass. I will this method is to help you sick You have trouble, I say so. If you don t you go out to be, which are phrase you get in trouble then work. Felicia's intuition is spot on as they are cutting schooling getting into trouble with his friends. Then the family moves to Philadelphia, Mississippi Felicia hopes it'll give as a fresh start. That's

what happened? Well, it seems like what I'm old fellow there were moved into Hegel as they feel differently about the move. He loves Philadelphia, I still don't screw are like relate, We knew for the night. They are both in our own eye. Every Friday said media the bone meal, as it keeps saying out late with his new friends. Felicia gives them a curfew and the talk that a lot of Parents gave their kids asshole, I must say, will you know you? Don't want a no good. In trouble don't you know in jail My mama, I know Do you know? Any ways is gone said above an earlier. We did. Hey, you know he discover. I'll hang out, and so he got Carl.

It's, not that bowling alley, one Friday night in September, twenty seventeen that as they make citizens That would change his life. He brings a be begun with him and then he shows it to his brother. I was doing not sir gawaine as they see the caddy knows from school. He makes a spur of the moment decision to run Timothy BB gun. When I saw her face all over your, he showed no baby real. It's a real gun and hands over his cell phone to Isaiah the classmates mom files, a police report, the next week, Isaiah gets called into the principal's office around fourth, the car. There, it may take him down to the station for questioning, prefers I will you daily life

did I did I say as upright about having to be begun, but he never confessed to a robbery. He says officers promise he can go home soon. He still doesn't know how serious things are. About to get going to be like going do juvenile more going since in the sun we'll be no juvenile detention centre for Isaiah he's going straight to the county. EL for adults, it all has to do with that be begun in Mississippi gun crimes automatically put kids. Thirteen years are older into the adult system. Even if the weapon is just a be begun so like that. The seventh greater becomes an adult in the eyes of the law, everything that is meant to protect people in the criminal justice system is lost. On children tried as adult.

I talked to Palermo, will whose Senor senior attorney at the southern poverty loss inner. She says the juvenile system is designed to better protect kids youth court records, aren't available to the public or the media and children must have a parent or lawyer present during a police interrogation. But if a child, then: the adult system cops can talk to them without apparent and kids. Don't always know they have the right to ask for a lawyer to be present as they did it. If you tell thirteen year old, just just tell us about the gun and using a home to know they do they tell you at the gun, what takes this time. Getting a thirteen year old, tell you what you tell them, they have to say to go or finding a gun, Coloma says children. He treated differently than adults, and the Supreme Court agrees. Twenty twelve rowing Miller versus Alabama. The justice is banned life without pearl for kids, calling it cruel and unusual punishment. They cited

studies showing that the part of the brain that controls impulses isn't fully formed until your twenties kids, that people say. You do the crime. You do the time right. We in every other part of our law said that kids are treated as kids, but when kids, do something where a cellphone gets lost. All the sudden we're saying talking about these kids are not kids anymore. Paloma focuses on Mississippi, but in more than half of America, states are allowed to charge kids as adults radically nationally. Black and brown children like Isaiah are disproportionately represented in the adult system and their also at higher risk for suicide depression and getting arrested again. This is who people say deserves assent, civic death, because when you're thirteen and you have a felony you're not going to college you're, not getting a job you're not getting housing. Your life is pretty much

over in the civic sphere. So what do we say about ourselves and our communities, when we lack kids, essentially be thrown away in this way after interrogation, officers take idea to the county jail? already been question without his mom and without a lawyer now he's about to be thrown into a facility designed to handle adults. Kids aren't supposed to be house with grownups under the RO prison rape, elimination act so in a bizarre attempt to protect them. A lot of adult facilities put children in solitary confinement. That's what happens to there. He says he doesn't get a shower for several days and he's hungry, but he can't eat my first night moonlight the first day it. I have appetite think about what I'll do what I do It is a long thin. Paloma says

no one should be treated this way, especially children in order to keep them away. From being raped. We, the term alone, which is one of the worst. So you can do to a kid is to put them alone. In a box I mean it's been called torture. Adults it's even more damaging for children after eight days in solitary confinement valise get phasing out on bond he's been expelled from school, so he supposed to stay home, but he breaks his moms roles and false right back in with his old friends haste order snake, Sometimes I get off rather were to see where he was. I mean I can much of our times of the day. I worked on the day in day out at night. He supposed to be in debate. He would get out the wonder just leave and I will get up and he gown

I therefore invite getting arrested for allegedly stealing cars. That's a boy, on violation that leads him back in adult jail where he spends his fourteenth birthday behind bars. He also gets back in solitary at times in the more he's alone, the more his thoughts pile up, I'll. Just read a thing like how my people don't feel like do people miss me most loud thing by my mom. I do want to let her know, but I was okay and Felicia she's worried about how solitary confinement is affecting her son's mental health. I kept telling them that felt like you need to be on medicine by him being in a locked in that cell by himself, and they can't tell him you got to call the nerves, the nurse at the jail, and I called the nurse several times and she Try to get no appointment set up for him go nowhere. No kind of here for him gave no medicine it. Nobody never got big lately, so he

in the midst, and holds that he was locked up as this has altogether. He spent three months alone in his cell research. Show. Solitary confinement can make ADHD symptoms. Even worse? One thousand about myself. I did try to sleep, Ashley Breakthroughs, and but am I get it It is about three he wasn't getting. And he's going here He was wearing a Bible Y know been away from home these low the out daylight Please don't be Wanna go home. Its island. I may dislike its ongoing pay by this summer. You may need is now I felt like it just well. Anyhow, because they already had the mermaid of what they were gone. Do I feel, like the here,

mine anymore. He belongs to them. I feel like where they they don't took him in it ain't, nothing else. I can do about it at this point. You might be thinking. This is a kid who got in trouble once gets out of jail on bond and then gets in trouble again shouldn't he be punished. But the question is: why does the criminal justice system treat so many black kids like adults? What rights are they losing and can a kid like Isaiah, ever recover from a mistake he made before he could even shave. Niece tended of the broken into the system can be overstated and the the terror of a child or apparent in Sicily, To be is draconian. It's it's an American five months pass its summer time and, as there is still behind bars, then

There's court appointed lawyer does something most don't he files was called a transfer motion. It's a petition to send the case from the adult system, down to youth court kind of like an escape hatch cases in use, court have more protections, anonymity, expunge meant and juvy. Instead of adult prison but very few kids meet the criteria to transfer or their lawyers, don't even try. I asked Paloma about that What has happened to some like his ear without this motion? I know a kid who after serving many many months in jail after being accused of armed robbery. His poem, fender, came and told him. If you don't take this plea, you're, never going your mom again. So he pulled out his dread lacks whose sobbing and pulling out his hair. He could not stand. The thought of nothing is so any plan.

We have the mighty way of state coming down with totally unmitigated force upon children. On the day of the transfer hearing, as there is embroiled, the court room and no one really explained to him. What's happening, the d, a Stephen Kilgore argues to keep as it and the adult jail and he wins When I say I find out, he doesn't understand. What's going on, and I would like I would like me- I post you going home today what happened when I saw that May I go on our own crowded just before, Thanksgiving Isaiah get another chance. A new transfer motion hearing here over to the court house, with the others being held at the new show, the county jail. Tackling chain it walk past the can soldier statue into the building and up stairs into a holding room where they pray before a court starts I really do wonder how my here now

Lincoln nobody they want to get over it. By when I walk, then I just looked around and hope for the best the Van Gogh were- and I did go home affairs as he sees his mom and gets choked up if you like, right the night they will find it like. The theatre prior come to light. It is welcome, there's, an orange jumpsuit? His waist chains reveal a slender boyish frame, ankle shackles, huh, just above his sneakers a pair of red and black Jordan. Thirteen's Felicia takes a stand facing her son. It was grass words after like that there was, after them tromp dorm away Syn.

The period as a court appointed lawyer questions Felicia about her sons, history with ADHD. The judge asked District attorney Kilgore. If he has any objections here, He says no, Sir Next Judge Duncan questions. Felicia yeah, and the like there is a his medication. I felt like it will happen again. Police explains how she's Chow did get as on his medication, how she asked the jail nurse there to help out and never heard back, but Duncan doesn't to buy it. I guess I have to set up appointment for. She's, not there she's, not all the time, but I've been up there.

She was there by this point Felicia starting to look visibly bothered by this line of questioning I really was angry. Really was upset, but she promises to get as they are back on his meds at the judge. Just let him come home Duncan spent seven minutes pulling his decision appreciate young age at all I appreciate highly. Legislature in its wisdom, making that a felony for people with thirteen fourteen years old. Agree with it or not, George Duncan, takes into account what the law requires. What would be best for Isaiah what would be best for justice? He says he doesn't know another was giving him heartburn in you and the fact that we did not. Really suitable for fourteen year olds, I'm going to take a chance so emotional.

But I want you to understand this. I took a chance on you one time and I got burned. If I get burned again, it'll be the last time I'll take a chance on me adult crimes you're going to be treated as an adult from that date fall. At least Username Craig you mean like now, two weeks later, I gotta Felicia's house, as they are somewhere out with and Felicia leaves a football game on. While we talk for a couple hours just before I get it to go home, she asked me something I want. Is this the first time a child been charged as adult? Here I start to answer her question because I know this isn't the first time a child has been charged as an adult in Mississippi, but she got me thinking.

Exactly how many ideas are out there over the next year, I set out to answer that question Cause quest for answers leaves her back into the roots of Mississippi's legislative history. What you're talking about a regime that is explicitly racist and explicitly built on? What's premises, so they absolutely would have been thinking about black children, African Americans, right by the time you get to nineteen forty, the system of powers, total power, and it is one hundred percent rooted in white supremacy. That's coming up on reveal

from the centre for investigative aborting impede our eggs. This is reveal a mallet forty or, as it has just been freed from the Mississippi County jail for adults after nine months. This case has been transferred down to Youth Court reporter Co. Brag still has a lot of questions, including one I say, as mom Felicia asked how many ideas are out. There call starts by going back to win original regional jurisdiction set of laws. They got Isaiah automatically locked up as an adult. First got on the books for research, takes us back over a century. I'm a pretty big history. Nerd so I wanted to track down when original jurisdiction laws Burst came to be I ahead to the Mississippi Department of Archives in history This is mine, numbing work to do alone, but I know of savvy data reporter with southern receiving help reveals

the Lewis. It is very bright out here, beautiful trees at sight of Goldstone building, it's nice to literally the laws they existed at the time, the archives or housing big building with high cathedral ceilings in the heart of Mississippi's Capital city Jackson is always way too cold inside, but freezing about off is worth it. I have twice swearing archives where we ve been going through.

The history of how juvenile quarter founded, Mississippi and Happy took shape. Both the Mississippi House ants in it published a record of all the bills, in particular legislative session. The records dating all the way back to eighteen, twenty one are bound and thick books can only access in person feels exciting. It feels like a part puzzle is important because we can cross reference loss pink, passed a discussion about legislators about their decisions to make those changes, reasoning, Pight, sifting through these The old legal journals from the forties we find lawmakers pass a lot of legislation to incarcerate kids. We my might come in here and see that link. Pretty the same language it in our active. Today stems from the forties peace,

her from appeared in his freeware, where people Lake were not free. So how does what it I mean? That's what we're trying to find out what is research, in nineteen forty lawmakers set the minimum age to be charges in adult at fourteen two years later. Mississippi lawmakers want to take it even further, so that children, any age could face adult charges. Democratic, governor, Paul Johnson Senior doesn't go for that because he already set up a kids prison unit. Police state farm specifically for quote delinquent negroes, Mississippi calls it a training school. He sang why should we worry about putting younger kids me adult system? There is already a place for black children. This detail is easy to overlook almost didn't find it, because it's only a couple of sentences in the back of an old book, but this is one of the rare times when it's clear that lawmakers had black children in mind when they were making the system

and this made me realize I need to get a better handle on what the climate of Mississippi Politics was. At the time I meet up with Robbie luck. It a civil rights historian and professor at Jackson, State University. Who are these people? These representatives, in the nineteen parties who are creating these I was about charging kids as adults and who were, they have

holding is their mind. Who could be like a doll divide in that way? Will you're talking about a regime that is explicitly racist and explicitly built on what's criminally, so they absolutely would have been thinking about black children, African Americans, right by the time you get to nineteen forty, this system of power is total power, and it is one hundred percent rooted in white supremacy. A lot going on in the forties well worth to us at its peak and his soldiers of all creeds fight, fascism abroad, white lawmakers continue to fortify power if held for decades. Ok, now before we get into this history, you should know that you're going to hear offensive words and disturbing stories about how black people were treated. You can get an idea from this nineteen foot. Six campaign speech now then available its scratchy old, recording of Theodore Bilbo, a former Mississippi governor in unknown clansmen

where pleasure as Governor Bilbil was the one who created training schools which were basically prisons for kids convicted of crimes, but the court also seek his there if they had been abandoned by their parents or even if the court thought they might one day commit a crime and Bilbo he built. Political career on racism when but mom reservation the wide range of innovation, the integrity of the library via bilateral relations with the republic and the people's lives. Emma speech, nobody has the inward nearly thirty times in Response Black Mississippi in Spain

petition and the fall out leads to a congressional investigation? Bilbo dies, answer before the matter is resolved, but here this long enough to see the day Mississippi lawmakers set thirteen as the minimum. To be me adult system by controlling these children and by at least having the option to control these children. You can control the economic power, and you can control their parents and what their May or may not do because if your child is imprisoned, you're Poland, push for advancing silver heights or human rights. Any kind of basic recognition of human dignity? system that allows Mississippi to track is, as adults is called original jurisdiction and is still on the books today. Is the reason why in two thousand, seventeen as their gets put into an adult jail, these laws not established in a vacuum between one thousand eight hundred and seventy seven and one thousand nine hundred and fifty mississippians commits

most known lynchings of any state. Six hundred and fifty four do the math, that's unknown lynching every six weeks for seventy three years and the state of Mississippi and these Lynch MOB also target children. I found an answer that happened in nineteen forty two the same year, lawmakers started charging kids as adults, fourteen year old, Charley, Lange and fifteen year old, earnest green are best friends growing up in Djibouti, Mississippi. They are accused of threatening to rape, a white girl. There is no proof. Only rumours still I gathered to witness, but some call a necktie party, a group of men, cut the rope down and they load the boys onto a timber truck heading to town, someone saps a photo of them in the Tibet Lang side by side,

a group of men cut the rope down and they load the boys onto a timber truck heading to town, someone saps a photo of them in the truck bad Lang side by side this is still secured around their necks that photo gets wired across the country. Governor Paul Johnson Senior condemns the lynchings as murders, and he has it's an FBI investigation that goes nowhere. The white mob, who dragged the boys from jail are never charged. Few ever are and at the same time, white lawmakers keep crafting ways to stay on top. This tension between those politicians who would have been explicitly racist demagogues and those who were more- a pragmatic in their approach to maintaining white supremacy and thought less much out the inward at the top of our lungs. Instead less create policies that don't necessarily speak explicitly to race unless we absolutely have to it's like our original

first action was written in the forties? Don't actually say their intended for black children, but that's how they were designed and at the same time, Jim Crow laws are disenfranchises black people from voting, and if you can't But if you can't like someone to represent you, if you can't change the laws, if you can't even on a jury. You can't do anything about all of the other auspices of power, and so who see attempts throughout the state legislature to craft codes that enables localised places to have as much power as possible is rooted. In that whole, tired old theory of states rights. There are some people who still save the Civil WAR

was about states rights. This is one of the oldest american lies. The fight was about upholding slavery. Mississippi's economy had been built on the backs of black people, so after slavery is abolished, white lawmakers use prison to key black people, including children in bondage. Black children have been going to adult prison ever since no man in the early nineties, hundreds the state bills, a prison form in the delta, where black people of all ages work the land. This is the Mississippi State penitentiary, also known as parchment farm. This works on was recorded there in the nineteen Thirtys. The prison is still open today, actor as an eighteen thousand acres operating plantation that the state of Mississippi money off of and I'd argue

It still is to this day and operating plantation, that the state of Mississippi makes money off parchment farm, if infamous, for chain gangs, cotton fields and black in the nickname, for I think leather strap used to, prisoners. Children were black and white strike uniforms as they tilled the fields, is not so much what has happened in the past. That is important as why it happened why we should care about it today especially in this context of children and others of african descent who find themselves disproportionately subject to the fate of the criminal justice system in this country.

Over a century. Later I say a ends up before a judge in adult court at risk of going to parchment, but remember I say I get out of the adult system. Judge marked Duncan grants his transfer motion in Duncans ruling. He talks about original jurisdiction loss and appreciating the quote, wisdom of the legislature, ask Robbie luck it about that. I believe that you have this system of whites primacy, so deeply ingrained that particularly the if we want to the state can make pronouncements like this and just assume their not being racist right, and that is part of the power of the last century of widespread monsieur Mississippi. The district attorney prosecuting idea oppose these laws to pay the ace thieving Kilgore pulls me aside before, as they are true the hearing we talk before on this guy you're, familiar with how it started and where we are in the process,

why I'm always wondering about he wants to explain how and why he's prosecuting a kid. I say as age refer, the original plan was to send him back to use court. When nobody wants a fourteen year old image, the sheriff them. We don't as far as don't hate on one of either stamina Maybe there nobody wants a fourteen year old girl, partial nets, that's absurd, but were bound by such bound by statute. The way Kilgore sees it, the Mississippi Legislature tied his hands when they created original jurisdiction laws. We didn't choose to prosecute a thirteen year old procedures as we have we have to start. I keep thinking about Felicia's question

How many other kids like there have been prosecuted as adults? There's number wasn't something I could just google no one's keeping track, but luckily I get a tip. I find out that the state of Mississippi keeps court data going back to ninety ninety four, but the state doesn't have to give it our under public records laws. So after a few stern emails, I convinced the state to turn over twenty five years. Court data for just twenty five bucks. My moments on from a young age to value my strength as Looking through nearly seven hundred thousand records is not one of mine. My colleague Melissa comes to the rescue and when I opened it, couldn't believe how much information there was. Was the king James Bible a hundred times, seven hundred thousand records more data than I had ever seen on this too and it was really exciting, because I saw like a timeline of what happened. Each person and There is knowing that a problem exists and then there

being able to go through a ton of data to say like this, isn't something that people just feel is happening, but this is a definitive pattern thereof. Five thousand kids and the adult system in Mississippi since nineteen eighty. Ninety four The next question is: does that popular Look like Mississippi in general. Is everybody going through? This you sent us information. I found that kids. The it's about even black and white, but when I looked at the data for whom being sense, does adults. I found triple the black kids over white kids three times as many black kids. It's not just a story. I mean it is stories, assemble into a pattern over twenty five years, more people. Being sentenced black kids, having to Sir longer time for the same charges. So there is Rachel bias in almost every aspect of this data. They are not having the same experience it feels like histories

feeding itself Malleson. I take this analysis right today. Kilgore I'm one here who the hell were you. Louis Data Rapporteur for reveal it's nice to meet. You must wait. You're Melissa has all types of charts embargo ass. To show Kilgore I wanted to show you that I broke out the data by dear tenure. So, for example, I just added something so we can see individual numbers. I could in Kilgore District, as is the case statewide black. His are over represented in the adult system per cent. The list asks about it. I was curious as to whether you have a sense of why black defendants and

Think, especially among minors, are over represented in these cases. There is a long pause I dont know. I am surprised that adds that, as far as the amount we as we speak either sets an oakley for the six month. It's not that farm for quote delinquent negroes anymore. Now it's ok, you development centre. It sounds like it could be a worthy summer camp, but it is still very much present As there was relieved when he finally got transfer to the youth court system, but when he went through that process, he was sentenced to more time behind bars up to a year and he doesn't get in credit for the time he already served in the adult county jail. But how can it be that someone who's? fourteen could spend nine months in a jail and now have to spend, more time in jail. Is there any room

The system that credits him if he were sentenced on any felony charge and our court, he would have gone down for every day he spent in jail. How that translates to youth call out, I don't know I feel confident that they use core referee look. Did everything feel confident she did what she thought was passed and have full confidence in that killed. There has been in Philadelphia, Mississippi all his life and he comes from illegal family before the judge in Ozma s case got on the bench he was the day and he recruit kill or a decade ago, Kilgore blamed sentencing disparities on a legacy of racism. He's

as its hard for white people who grew up in the cities to be fair. Thirty, eight, I grew up in Philadelphia and it's a completely different Philadelphia than the Philadelphia. My father grew up in the Philadelphia that my grandfather grew up here and there are several water found anymore things. You know, people aren't openly treated differently, but Kilgore thinks his district. What you better under his leadership- and I think that it gets better with every generation- grew more accepting. Then the generation before us, whose more accepting the new generation before that there still lots of over racism, but I think that it is getting better Kilgore says he's

It appoints a higher younger employees. Still all the prosecutors in his office are white Malleson. I have one more stop to make Felicia's in the middle of breeding Isaiah sisters, hair. When we walk into her living room, we ve come, tell her what we showed the Kilgore, yes CO is extremely cool and got a ton of court data and share it with me, I mean to look at it and examine how unusual Isaiah cases we hopefully show them terms of age. I say a man just a few dozen kids have been charges, adults at each thirteen. How do you

feel kind of like looking at the numbers like most, the kids are black. Most of the kids are not. Thirteen has a feel that, like your son, still kind of like went through the system, so I feel like well. Why did he had to go through what was? What was so bad about hand it. He had to go through as we're talking about Isaiah, fully support something from her purse this letter ass. They rode away. To come home. I guess I'm just enough and keep being something on that

as there is in doing well. It Oakley must, he says, he's gotten two months added to a sentence for Miss behaving IBM, sit back a master thinking, something about the way I was at. The candy is the reason I can comply with this programme. That's the thing about solitary, even when you're out you're, never really out, o the symptoms. Follow you pangs of paranoid, abrupt anger, steep sadness. I really just one- is blow right now a cry, but hold on a little bit longer I'm gone show them what I'm capable. As there is ready to come. I waited knee along a visitation where, As you get a chance, please Cassini, she hasn't been yeah, it's a four hour round trip and it's hard for her to take off work Mamma. I know for a fact. You promised crazy, but just keep praying body for me.

I love you more than I love get engaged travel allowances, Felicia does eventually make it openly met the boots by laughing service. Like a prison, I think that's a reunion and it's a proxy. Let's go Next on reveal from the centre for investigative reporting and p ex. This is reveal a mallet Felicia, Hickman son, I say

serving out a sentence that only a juvenile detention there are two hours away from their home in Philadelphia, Mississippi. This is, after he spent nine months in the adult county jail some of their time in south very some illegally housed alongside adults, reporter co, brag, picks up the story. Felicia goes to see Isaiah for the first time in months I mean Felicia Car it's only nine a m, but she's been up for hours. She had to go into get three in the morning, so she could get off in time to go. Pick up. Her son, I say, is getting out early, but she doesn't know why Any idea why they might be very much earlier than the Abovesaid ya wanna talk with the judge,

we sat down with the aid for like three hours did interview about as a his gaze. After my death do, I believe, is a worthy for chicken, its decency. Why did they locked them up? You know a and b innate that age. It was a three year. My final the dead. I'm wrong was will go on how we might believe him on. This will add like just let out they have either way she's going to get her boy, Felicia has on genes and a t, shirt that bring out the purple and blew in her steady earrings. That say: oh, oh, oh, her sneakers remind me of a vacation with their pink and green tropical print. She keeps that shoe steady on the paddle as we ride up the opening of the sitting. He grew up to fail,

Not to allow the do that's easy taking now decide database we turn into a narrow bumpy tree line road, We pass a pecan plantation reminder of oak. We start as a prison farm. The boots bow so it looks like a prison allowed to go inside. So I set in issues car the guards make me DR outside the gates and then

I see them. China behaving I take fishing, it is certain tat might get why ass net one, I'm being either got a good job, as there is taller than Felicia. Now, please put on some muscle he's wearing a great he shirt and pants the material of Doktor Scrubbs with a mode use all over them piece of a close he had on when he first arrived at Oakley, neither to small. We have as yet puts all of his belongings into the trunk and sits passengers. The state law. They two hours later, we point to Philadelphia and reality sets in as it has to check in with the Youth core office about his power. I wait in the lobby. I can hear counselor name, Mandy warning as the other she's informed everyone in town that he's out

when the meeting and she keeps talking there is a very smart kid. A pay would just apply himself. Things that are printed is right. He is they wonders now he's not on calls me any trouble whatsoever right as I. What do you say? I think I need to get out younger kids, a lesson on? Yes, my nicer yards, our eye hobbies. No, but I dare not say you walking on the street Hi mom, reader at nine, an eye for an eye arena chicken in on you A few weeks later, I find, as they are sitting on the front line in it,

being out on parole means Isaiah, has nine pm curfew during the week and ten on the weekends, no drugs or alcohol, no bowling alley, a few weeks later. I find, as they are sitting on the front line in a chair, propped up against an antique, then he's blasting music through his headphones. Do you like Felicia, is inside with her six we called grand baby her first all that your grand baby The importance of not understood the Lego, git you saw or life Lotto grew soil. I think there's the idea who chases his sister and sit on the couch eating pizza and then there's the one who wants to show his mom he's changed. Mama, let's be under a job

the report is still not understood. Lego get you saw or life love to grow soil. I think, there's the idea who chases his sister and sit on the couch pizza, and then there is the one who wants to show his mom he's changed. Mama won't. Let you know that I'm done yet intro and I'm going to straighten up my life and get back on check as is fifteen now in a supposed to be in high school, but he hasn't been a real schools and seventh grade. No news like this normally do. Fred education, in that light. Rayner Fiji and I feel like I'm, but tonight you go back to search the basin young do as he is trying to get back in school, and when I asked him about his other plans, he says I want to get my Jarvis licence by others,

as they are feels his aged. Much more than that lie Rayner Fiji and I feel like I'm about tonight. You go back to five starvation young do as he is trying to get back in school, and when I asked him about his other plans, he says I want to go are driver's license, buy a van start, a lawn mowing business and be a rapper and barber on the side. At last I got a glimpse of Isaiah. The typical teenager with big dreams. Thanks a rhetorical brag for that story. In recent years some states, like organ Florida in California, have gotten rid of their laws that automatically charge kids as adults in some crimes. Go also looked at how black girls fair in the criminal justice system, you wanna hear that

check out our next Parkhurst episode to see photos of Isaiah Felicia and to read more about the problems with Mississippi's criminal justice system visit reveal news, dot, Org I led producer for this week show was uneasy: DS, Cortez with help from Priscus Neely, our data reporter was Melissa. Louis Genji and is the show Co. Brags work comes to us through. Feels investigative fellowship programme special. Suppose Elder Andy, Donoghue, plus Martin rentals money, cayenne, Julia Riley and the Mississippi Department of Archives in history. Our production manders Monday in a host of regional scorn, sound designed by the dynamic dual J Breezy, MRS Jim Briggs, Fernando my man, Yo Aruba. They help this week from the g by me in aiming must offer our ceo script sharper met Thompson. Editor in chief executive producer is Kevin. Solving a theme music is by bye, lightning support for reveals provided by the Raven David Logan Foundation. The John Dene

Haven't you Macarthur Foundation, the janitor Logan Family Foundation, the Ford Foundation, the Heising Simons Foundation, the democracy fund and the ethics of excellence in journalism foundation reveal is a co production centre for investigative reporting. Impey are ex come legend and remember. There is always What's the story. These are last few shows of the year and let me tell you in twenty twenty we are bringing the fire launching some of our most ambitious projects we ve ever done, I can wait for you to hear them reveal, is all about going deep, pulling on threads telling stories that matter. And this kind of investigative journalism. Well, it takes time and it costs money. These are the final

Savar end of the year membership campaign. We depend on listeners like you to help make this work possible to support us just text. The word reveal to forty seven thousand four hundred and seventy four seventh standard data rates apply and you can take stop or cancel. Time again just takes a word, reveal to four seven, four, seven, four, seven, Let's go. Do some good work together.