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StarTalk Live: I, Robot (Part 2)

2013-11-30 | 🔗
Neil deGrasse Tyson and Honeybee Robotics’ Stephen Gorevan focus on robots here on Earth, from steam pipe repairing robotic inchworms and Predator drones to Asimov’s Three Laws of Robotics and the practicality of cyborgs.

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Skip the commercials support star talk on patriarch to listen to every episode, Commercial free, with this is filled with secrets in industries leaving us with many questions to be answered. We find ourselves searching for those answers as the very fabric of space science and society are converging here for the first time. What what the Japanese, it's easier. I mean the brakes daddy, you Glinda, did you grandma? ass, the brain? They get lab like a brother,
We are at the very start: I've got one of the founders of Honey Bee. Robotics Stephen welcome to start out you we're like most about honeybee robotics. Is it the based in Manhattan? That's just cool! you think, I'm in hand, is Broadway and was very and you'd, like rock, in the universe in Manhattan, Eugene Hooty, have already right eye
W Kemal Bell and Jason Sedate, one in the actual talk about robots closer to home, so you develop robots. My crib she'd here says comrade for Coca COLA, sell out for Nike. What what I? Why doesn't like you need a robot is to put the shooting boy? I can tell you that I have a preparatory agreement on now, but I can tell you the con Edison robot, the kind listen robot is of where they are about to make Europe. I would they take my first born now my for people who are not residents of New York City is the electric company of New York City. Consolidating Edison and if you ve, seen movies of New York steam rising through the streets. This is because that economists, in controls a something called. City steam system and there
this actually steam generated and sent through hundreds of miles of pipe undermine happen and that they heat skyscrapers the Empire state building is entirely heated with city steam. There? No boilers there are no air conditioners, their steam air conditioners in the empire, state building and world trade. I'm sorry! I have no idea what that means. Yet what is, I don't I don't even want, but how is there I don't how it works. I know that the city of New York and everywhere that you two guys don't know that works like that calls into question everything I have heard today that steam leak that comes up through the streets are none of this robots on Mars, and nobody knows you can explain and air conditioning in an hour run some steam, but the steam coming through the streets is actually there leaks in this. Did he seem system so cognizant hired us to seal those leaks. This meant sending a robot through the pipes and we develop an inch warm system that goes through the pipes and wells the leaks from the inside of it
I think that makes up for not knowing how should I feel that appeals robots. They go through our pipes and well. He built in each warm robot rules through the steam pipe and wells holes and when the greatest threat to the world, you may not be stopped us when we were called upon to develop our concept for how to get to the eyes packing Europa. We use the con Edison design as the baseline, that inform robot except foregoing sideways. We said we can use the same concept, down to swarm itself down into the ice pack, this autonomous or you tell me what to do well, almost all spacecraft, and automation! Robotics is what we would call supervise autonomy. You give it a sequence of commands. It has certain ability to
these robots intervention consciousness while it to make the effort to provide it'll just right curiosity. Just now. We ve switch to an auto nap system. Where of curiosity now is making some decisions. We dont dictate the path the robot, go inch by inch. It gets too makes of its own decisions. I paint manner cause? I'm it's like Nano going down there you down there, We haven't really allowed our robots to be completely free yet because we're too were afraid that they're going. We ve seen the movies we know. Why are we not? We know that what we don't want it with lasers everywhere? So what do you do for Coca COLA, whether used giant sign in Times Square that was imposed of until Super to moving a high it had five moving.
Prior to that of seventy foots draw, this is all mechanical devices and these devices that some of them were ten tonnes and they moved on and twenty degrees. It would form diet coke than Coke and the Coca COLA bottle itself. That straw was in was bigger than my first apartment: It was a huge not there, but we certainly led an incredibly giant first apparent, I'm trying to figure out out something bigger than a New York apartment. Therefore, its huge doesn't work that's not a small apartment is a very big object rights over the signs for them, but they really did he's robotic science, but is like shit, was once a dirty job, somebody's gotta Bob, and I see You also work for the Navy that, Nike unreasonably upset by the word Navy. While we were for DARPA the defence advanced projects, research, shots,
agent ass. One of the golden projects, really the robotics industry, is to be able to take spacecraft that our orbiting, the earth that are running fuel we're talking about spacecraft worth hundreds of millions of dollars and they become become defunct, simple because they're running out of station keeping feel yeah just to clarify satellites dont need fuel to orbit the earth once there in orbit there. There runny fuel to prevent, a little bit of atmosphere? That's up there from knocking them out of work. That's right! Italy send fuel to them or no. Well, that's what we're talking about now. We ve never done it before, but the holy GRAIL, if you will of space robotics people is to be able to get to the spacecraft and refuel them with a robotic spacecraft that can latch onto them hook up a hose We feel them. I wish you the best of luck with your plutonium hose what what what kind of fuel jazz disease. Hydras ain't hooker mostly, is likewise really nasty stuff very nest
yeah I get that its fuel, those errors, I mean, but what is most way back in the space programme. It's one of em reliable fuel sources that you can, but we don't use it alot under current now, really nasty data really now? What does that mean nasty stuff? highly it's you drank it you'd feel dizzy. I hope so, that's a jazz. Very volatile and I think its highly carcinogenic to you, but what you are doing for the Navy, where we do it for the Navy fighting for the Navy we ve done a number of things. We were making some sensors for the Navy. We were, Some quick attachment points for just to clarify. When the Navy wants sensors it's to shoot something down, then sensed. I know
but these are ok. I want to make the same page. We were talking about can't, say a word or maybe we built a little too. You should know well, a lot of robots noted function. Well, they have to switch hands there. Really any good human like hands on robots somewhere, we can reliable using So what we do is we switch our hands that no different things that's right, leg Unlike us, how are you doing for the Navy was that we were developing tools. Essentially, that were sort of related to different hands is the hand moving I mean, I know, like I've, never been a good artists, but people talk about trying to draw your hands when a very difficult as it is difficult to replicate in a robotic way. Then that is its back this it's a stunningly difficult. Someone else is leaving us with something else. We are very far away from me. Do that well makes you really believe in evolution.
Votes. Breathing space inside it down to earth you're. Listening to start. The hand I coordination. We are a long way away and in fact, robots and general don't act much more sophisticated them through. For Europe. I would say that year olds, I know, are being taught fists. Bumping, don't teaches robot fears pumping let's move past, that humans got a robot, delicate paint, a car better than any person camp. Oh yeah!
your words of the robot army. Wars sounds raise. This is the modern who's. The duke laying the railroad track without whose name, oh gosh, the members, generate John Andrea, John. The steel round, the steel drive and man, because he s machine, and I think he drops dead at the end, if I remember correctly dropped at, but I mean, if you want to paint you know a person. Paint a car very well, but a robot can do it with precision and and the next car comes along, can repeat it far better than ever. Human could ever repeated. So there are things that they can do better That way, it would only to have the same color over and over, whereas someone like, Michelangelo you, why hey, don't go to my robot you're, really do it again over and over well
but all the unmanned, the robotic aerial vehicles, including the predator, you build stuff like and now we were not informed. If you didn't, you have just said no, but he's Don't our Burnham Howard riders head here? We ve been contacted by some drawn people because our ability to sample in the Mars environment with very low power devices- and we have all kinds of sand litter some of your seat, so there was a time when we were contacted by drawn people. They one does this. If we had an insight into how we get to Saddam's bunker- and we set aside you anymore. We couldn't help what you'd robots, so the jolly uses are. Sometimes they want to look at see if they can do some quick sampling on the ground and that's on my only involvement withdrawals about robots that by do safety things. You know lately been saying dogs to rubble defined people in
Craig. But surely there are robotic things that could do that better, faster while safety. Always been the number one driver to use robot. If you can save the putting people in harm's way like it Chernobyl, there were robotic devices that were put forth by people associated with Carnegie Melon that were able to get into their nasty part. The accident and to do some critical mass they now highly radioactive highly radioactive year, would have died. The kind of this type thing to you can't get people these I saw even a minute turn him off their hundred degrees and how is it a bomb or is it not yet few? These are big things now and and and why pity, to cut the red wire, the blue are, which hide yeah don't send, as well as I see, there's always usually a person, though, that supervising these robots at this time again, I it's kind of interesting to me that we haven't really let these robots free development, sort of their like avatar issue, where there is a good example people you think they You think that we should move to a place where robots are allowed to just do their thing and not monitored by us
I have one of those in my house, the rumour, the Roma, its greatest herbage. Talking no on off switch. I wouldn't room just be around here. We decided on both a robot ruminant ask him. Yes, I think it is the rumbling vacuums Europe, more than Voyager. So do you own a rubber? Yes, I do. I never use it at the way that you see. I may not, on tv buyers up a robot just sits. There is high your clothes on it. What about the robots that nobody why he doesn't uses robot anymore, but if you use your number because it has a dust volume thing, that's the size of a peanut yeah dampening lamented Europe. What are your room again and others might can't you like hacking, Aruba, Megan twice as powerful? I could, I
but why did you just will devote more? When did you What you just said. Just to clarify. You just said this device that automatically vacuums. My house, it's too much effort to change that doesn't, can take over that's what you just said: God you it was never cities that doesn't he's trying to take on a spoon leave him alone. Can't explain this thing doesn't uses room I've. What about the robots tat help people out heard like dont, relate to other people. You know like artistic folks. What sort of slid Asperger's robot? That's like social, you coming
I want to read you a future robots as well yeah, I think so. Certainly there are selling robots that work as nurses and an AIDS and hospitals in that endeavour is for real as nurses nerdy out what does it mean that last place? I think important they are putting a robot do an alarm, I put in motion on my body now: that's the holy GRAIL is. Wars are good
I spent boasting myself because you say if I had a robot lotion or you could do it, you can do I or the internet multitask universe, thirty minutes so much lotions without going to turn about nurses are not sure their primary thing is lotion and I'm glad you ve been so healthy. All your life gets experts, the load I prisoners lotion, that's all I've unity around this I've been there stood, applies only one side of things. Do the nurse robots. Do I why it's more like it such aid. I should have clarified bringing food Thank you for not whereby those bringing bringing supplies moving supplies back and forth through the hospital and they have avoidance sensors cannot avoid people in some people on run into them. Once again, and basically no, so it doesn't run into people while our or by guy
like the robots are alive. The people there, whenever I would be upset of my people are international. Thy robots are very complicated. So when I think of a famous robot, but we know Remember this robot remembered as a computer. I think how on in two thousand and one how control everything. So, how was it computer robotic every and do you see that happening to see computers? my conscious and then doing things that we'd otherwise do because our conscious computers, while you know even in TAT Cyborg, I guess cyborg cyborgs, part human, no, the path to be with you using the word cyborg, I believe so site. A real word were I thought I deny this. There was a thing that, like villains, unlike unlike you know, the movie cyborgs a real thing, but let it be
well, just so computer chip attached to have presented and was lying, you guys are made that you call cyborg. That's what we're here. That's what you're after Cyborg had not yet it's so right. Ok, I mean deterring was a famous some early computer genius. People here I love his task- is test for the turing test. The turing test was that if you know it consider a keyboard and start a conversation and a response on the screen and if you could not tell whether or not it was a machine or person here, then you have in fact developed thinking she and we ve done it. Yes, its intelligently interpreter in your sentence, so itself cyborgs. So what would be the first cyborg? What can you imagine it to be? This is your last is its terminator. Is it what is it? What does it look like? Is apart biological, Why distinguish between carbon based and silicon based? That's very carbon based centric of you.
Technically, I think the first cyborgs I hear you we have to think about drivers, and I mean it if you think in the military sense. I dont think that there is any reason for the military develop anything but hardware robots but I just sorts recently, Stephen Hawking said that perhaps we can download our minds into a computer if anybody saw that so that we can extend, I would say that would be uploading in time yeah? That's how I would call, though it seems to me that that self preservation of life and extension of life will be unnatural consideration for cyborg development, and we have our official arts. We have got a fish or other components. Forget your organs that your brain you care about, get a machine that lives forever. Put your brain and the machine. Now you become the machine and I think it comes. I think they'll be a driver for that. So yes, I think so. Thou it's driving economic economic drive. You say that
It's part of how many years like using a hundred two hundred five hundred thousand nominating owner, almost twenty two. I dont know why a pointer library to get you didn't even talking about the singularity book, but by the time we leave here this evening. You where I get up level either because they like a kind of Corky jewish robot that was, I made you wanna, be very three made it or uploaded you get that you get it. I went zero people alive today that will see things like this secret, for you I'm gonna consider singing all of the ads on this shell. There's just one And where to get out of hearing there, go to patriarch arms last star, talk and support.
Where does at the five dollar level or higher to listen. The star talk ad free You can download all current episodes into your favorite podcast player and never we're here, another commercial on star talk ever again, you will definitely not have to hear me saying if you support us at Patria, dark coms. Last our talk, radio, I mean I'm just thinking, I mean just saying This is starter. If I put my brain and a machine, doesnt machine go to the Bahamas and then develop new memories. No, the machine is just stop there. I continue to add to my memories and my loves and hates and quests we re frozen,
that moment doesn't continue to explore, doesn't continue to live to see, but you could play chess the lifetime of sport. Why is this robot that your brains, they not have a hard drive? The can remember new stuff, I get on an airplane go to the Bahamas. The computer. Doesn't. Why not is a computer What are your prayed? A robot? Why can't you about the next step? That's baby. It's the Bahamas, no way a break. Remember it lay over how the one robots gonna get stuck at the mental detector for never gonna make that flight nothing else in your pockets. You don't talk about loading, your brain up into a machine, that's static, and there you haven't loading your brain into an evolving that basically continues to live out. Your luck amount, we're Tom Output, brains and other people by people die, and they put your brain that body and then you take over body. Yes, that's where we're headed right
You told me you, son of a bitch. You tell me what you don't. I've got secrets new joint like so here's what you get like this ever till we fix the ailing body duties, two diseases, horrific diseases that we live with, one of them racism and sexism, reckless one of them, is Alzheimer's. Will you let your mind together is at meal traffic lateral? Nurses carelessly, look Eric, disease where you lose your body and so, if one day, can move a brain somewhere to put it in a machine wanna put it in another body so that they are less victim. Has their brain live in the nearby from the, but maybe if I go into a machine before them another body, why not? I would have fun being first enemy
and then being like- oh my god, I bet you could stay out and all whether in things like that sell for everyone who is about, die, you build a machine and then they continue to live. The earth would be very crowded very quickly about. When I was a kid, there was a myth that Daphne was frozen somewhere in and they had to keep us aiding rice today. You gotta believe that there would be people that would want when they were both died, to at least keep their brain alive somewhere. So when he's not as far as we know, you guys know that hats activity as yet you say I turn to people who might know we'd be the Zulu years. These in the bay what about de la? What's your favorite robot movie metropolis rats! School Maria, the robot, it's the most beautiful robot I've ever seen by far actually, human in the movie. Well,
There was a Maria, and then there was a robot than impersonated Maria and the robot before she turned into Maria. Was this beautiful? Even anybody seen this robot, I'm talking about a beautiful design, Fritz Lange's design and it's getting its hot for robots. This is why I too bad. I would. I would hope I was very early in a robot agent and nothing surpass it for me. I'm a fan. Often terminator, that's a robot. I gotta contend with right. There really not data you. Just EL, the murderer so far too detailed that's a robot yeah yeah It's not me. It's not. What would you say looks like one of those years. What about opportunity? Not a robot? No, it just looks like a garbage. Yeah just beeps, I think because we're may be made to look like it, because such a big deal movie right. That's what we're here for the round,
Will you resign will know absolutely. I suggest, I wrote a novel nineteen forty one called robot robot with the rules on the right path, in our eyes again, most famous three laws over robotics, I will read them law want robot, may not injured, a human being or through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm every robot movie ever aid violates that isn't true, Using these laws, don't translate other movies hard law to a robot must obey any orders to it by human beings, except with such orders, would conflict with the first law as an kill. Another human being
Russia David contraband it, but then it would violate the first law. So I can't do that law. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the first or second law. It is sad to say that there are not being hounded already, but because predator, shoot drones shoot missiles at strangers. Sorry to be the one to tell you. We have missile planes that kill our enemies round to where we are also developing incredible killer. Machines are not me in particular Brett them. We wouldn't judges. We know it's complicated so the idea is to keep our troops out of harm's way, but there still keeping you keep out of. Super harms Wes That's one of the opening lines in the movie patent uttered by George he's got heap other p. Super harm's way it was
whenever one of war by dinosaurs country they went to war by making the there, dumb son of a bitch die for his country. That's what drones do basically, so these laws, there are motored erratic and work. Then right. Therefore, the kind of robots you'd have at your house somewhat, which complicates, went up. Loretta, writers and even those. Unlocking the secrets of U world and everything orbiting around it. Stereotypes,
tell me about your shrieking scenes in the movie- I robot I dont know if this was in the book was the robots because they are acting under programming rules and hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of lines of code and you keep updating it, but you clean out the lines of code that were there before so the kind of dangling there and If we have enough dangling lines of code, could dangling lines of code end up connecting and create behaviour that you do not intend from your regional programming and what they were saying was at robot started achieving consciousness.
Because it was all the left over fragments of stuff that was not intentionally programme to do that and that manifested itself is free will, and I look at the wiring of the human brain and the entire billion year, evolutionary tracking, that it has this baggage and our brains, and I'm wondering if it's all the baggage that gives us the illusion of free will, just as it occurred with the robots in that movie, and bout. It can you possibly ever have robot achieving freewill nicer I call on you to tell me about well in robots. We its unclear from your question, if you believe the people frequently, but you ain't gonna structure. This consciousness. I get asked us all the time Sorry, a boy you
literally use my window, you tape Saturday Night live so deal with that hold me personally. I dont think that this is something where ever gonna. Let it happen. I just don't worry it's not that you let it happen is that it happens well. I also think that we won't let it happen to. I really think that we will be in control I think you could man. I feel it we're like creating an entirely different race, and that would at some point there Side, hey, I'm, not work for you anymore. I got it from here and we will fight it and We have finally I'll be around here to see it or watch it. Why? Why are you just assume that it will get out of control? I just think that at all does yet at some point they org the potential to our Eminem, encouraging us to check ourselves before reykir cells. But what you are saying is like at some point: if we Too, to far with it, it'll no better, and at that point, if it knows better, I say: go for robots. Allow me some summit of thoughts based on what we sure I please I just
Close your show, I will Have somebody thoughts are not use. This is like nobody saw here in my region of history and human conduct and the creativity of novelist, especially apocalyptic this topic novelist. What I found is any time there's a scientific advance that could benefit humanity. There's a novelist who created story about that advance and how it destroys humanity, and I look at all the scientific advances that have come along. And at no time has those predictions made by those. This topic novelist come true about that technology. It is happen at any time soon, think, to myself. Maybe we just love death. In disaster in our storytelling because we're not getting it, pavilion reality so as we go forward scientifically and we invent robots, I'm not.
Reason to worry that one day the robot he's going to kill me. I agree with you basically and not with you, all right. I don't say: he's gonna kill us, I'm, U saint! That's gonna wanna be its own thing and we got to deal with like you but it'll, come of age. Wander off? Let me just say that water world you're wrong. The only person, however, that certain was the executive. The green lit The big secret tonight, Is that Stephen is actually a robot sent by his company. We have a couple of minutes for Cuban Ay and so we didn't have time to put out microphones, but only to point to you if you have a question for any of us up here on the panel. Yes, sir, I repeat the question for the microphone.
HU. We heard about the inch worm inside the pipe made by honeybee. Nature Influence Robot, you get some cues from nature. Oh yes, and in fact the interim very much on our minds when we develop that and if you another example, we were told who developing a spacecraft that had to perform on autonomous, rendezvous and docking in deep space to go to a comment, and the problem was a two spacecraft couldn't get together with a great deal of precision. So somebody told us at NASA who was a very smart guy, said of nature and so what we thought of what was a spider web, and so he said if we can develop one spacecraft to have lunch short of a spider web, deploy from it, it's not necessary to design a flyer to get in the spider's mouth is: all you have to do is get the flies caught somewhere on the web and the two spacecraft one spacecraft gets caught in the web and the other spacecraft in polo suck the web in the two spacecraft.
There you have it, but that was we were thinking of nature when they begin our hope very describe. Sex. The future of space and the secrets of our planet reveal this star die Another question. Yes, sir Regular up by one year can we expect the pleasure model and blade runner
Are you now? I get calls every year Ericsson forward, while from liars by robot lady, its I ordered nineteen. Eighty two now would be the biggest kicks revolves around the LAS Vegas area Code. So how you been looking. You have already started, there are people, let's have sort of these things that are halfway measures. Pathway measures here, he's got halfway robots. You will whoever does autumn half right. You're gonna just shows, however, makes a real sex robot. The first one is going to be a rich person,
the first trillion air! Yes right here! Well it s because we the question, so she said: if you finding water on mars- and these rocks it's only at a few percent level- that's the kind of war that we find in our deserts and we celebrate our desert for their absence of water. So what gives here? But by martian standards of the water in the Mojave Desert is a lot of water, and this is a surprise that we're seeing so much water in the rocks on Mars and its good news for when people go to Mars, because we need the water for fuel and to drink and there's a lot more than we ever thought and we could make it from those basic even take a ton Iraq's than to make some water yeah and you can make fuels in heat and oxygen oxygen to normal.
Eight two, yes, yes right here who can robots ever make arts they do they already do I've worked with seven, you see so minor robots and find out. I don't think so. Why not? Well, because I mean, if you like things like box, be minor mass and using a robot has been achieved, something I've gotta. Just something is possum. Ok, robots now beat us a chess and jeopardy. Isn't are just a few minutes. I met no way, no cultural meal, it's not all site. You Jason mentioned Michelangelo. Before I mean come on you're. Well, I have is not going to happen because you Wanted to happen was not going to. Because you don't think it can happen. I don't think it can happen because a robot is not a human. Yes, this gives us our identity, the great works
I think it goes back to a thing or two about better accumulating information and then having to go through the prism. That's you served develop as a human being and in putting it out. That's are mostly right. So if it doesn't accumulate that stuff it doesn't interpreted, it's got enough in Iraq to bother you go now. The question yes around here. I love that question because you you want to hear you want to drill through Europa on a mission, that's ten or twenty years ahead, but you ve only desire. They are based on any technology available today. So how nimble are you as you go forward to adopt? Whatever is new, because the memory on Voyager one is seven decay yeah, there's a lag spacecraft generally using technology that we use here on earth,
five live to seven years ago and the reason for it. I can't watch at the time of launching the end, and basically this is related to computers. Mostly, is because it takes a long time to harden the technology that we have and say five to seven years ago and make it withstand the radiation of space. It just takes a long time to do that and ran out with that, but we have to bet everything for years to make sure they were. Is there anything towards that when you say bring fuel to these places to put a few ships of ram on there as well in a couple of external borders that we, the Hubble telescope? Ok, was a serviceable, robot, basically, memoranda telescope at recent astronauts up the original one was not even to eighty six. It was like a summit. Before the two elegantly a flash drive in. It were like good luck, so they did that with hobble, but because the astronauts could get to it. Yes, and if you
put some far away, that's not on your travel route, its whole bay richer. Here. Yes, what does intelligence and how do you know if you gonna make an intelligent robot? Is it just making the same decisions? You would have that you program or two, but then it's not really thinking for itself, but I think Watson was really thinking for itself. Would you call watch and intelligent Watson, the computer, that, beyond one jeopardy operative? Yes, I would all it intelligent, but I wouldn't call it near human you'd say it knew a lot of facts and when it was intelligence or then what is intelligence do well, I'm open their aid, it they're degrees of accumulated knowledge and organised ability, and I think, though, that when you get to be a human being, you get into the realm of art, and then you see the difference it Micro Watson is named after Doktor Watson, a sample of the founder of one of the founders of livelihood, yeah
It was in this Watson, research centre out of assumed it was wants, and what's that Our aim is my word available you're. Only because I too call Watson would actually be a humble me, because Watson in Sherlock Holmes Mythology is the obvious point of your kind. Dummy in comparison to call in homes would have been a jerk move, but we call it up. Solve is a different thing altogether. That is where this week's Stephen you all you ve been listening to start or radio. What do you want? for the National Science Foundation dial up
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Transcript generated on 2020-01-25.