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stop, they don't shoot a production of Iheart breed Hulu will come back to the show. My name is meant, my name is now they call me, then we are joined, as always with our super producer, Alexis Code, name, Doc, holiday Jackson. Most importantly, you are you, you are here, and that makes this stuff. They don't want you to know the show where it's always kind of Halloween, just making them up is our listener, male segment for the weak, and we have dash, like the sun, abide, says in hell. Razor Such wonders to show you how to tell you about going through history. You were running into some curses. We're into the future of troubling. Problems were privacy, Frank

We are, I don't know where best to begin. Would it be? Would it be? Ok, if I took a swing first with his ancient history, stuff path at it have at him Good man we're doing this with the help from our first. Conspiracy, realist added Evan rights to us and says Hello, I'm wondering if you have done in episode on the burning of the library of Alexandria, so fascinating topics as Evan and has been said, send civilization hundreds of years back. They set civilization, hundreds of years back, it's a carbon miss believe that it was all of a sudden burned, as I believe it was actually becoming? Very unpopular over centuries, and then it was accidentally burnt, would suffice. It would be at a different place today. If it had still been kept intact, are any rumours of important documents that would have changed society today. Why didn't they just save all the physical copies as

media files on every so often says all. Joking aside, I believe there are many avenues to explore with this topic and if it has not already been an episode, it would make for a great show I agree, I think that's that's a fantastic point, because the library of Alexandria is one of those big historical. What if you know we all wrong? equally aware of it. We ve we ve heard of we know that issue Society in general has a bad bad habit with when it comes to book burning- or in this case squirrel burning. My I dont think a lot of us know I think in the modern day, like a lot of us, are not aware of how the decline of the great library actually work. You know what I mean like picturing, the library of Alexandria, it can remind me the exploration.

we did on around the city of pillars right, which was mythological city. We found the real thing and it turns out that maybe it just looks more impressive. Back then, because the people, finally happened upon. It were often starving to death, and you know, lost members of their caravan along the way. So maybe the law berry if we saw it in the modern day. Maybe it wouldn't have been as impressive as it was the people of the time, but it is an interesting question. I don't know what do you all think so? Do you think it would have changed? History I know it's a get mean, I guess we is hard to know. Do we have sense of what we're missing or as well as like us. Two gone. We don't even have any indication of what might have been in their own work,

We know a couple of things about AL Andrea of the time. what the library really was, right? The vis? The first thing you need to know is that Josh I mean it was tell me if I'm wrong on this ban. My understanding is that it was Alexander the great that founded this founded Alexandria, at least and that was way back in the day three thirty one b c, I believe you see an and from there it became this big essential Harbour Metallica a trade, not a big part of the trade droughts, Algeria itself in Egypt and one of the big they did in Alexandria was create pyrrhus, specifically for writing purposes. And you know you can imagine if you're at the hub of or if you're the

you're, the creator of most of the paper or something you be also interest. In keeping around the things that are put onto paper generally words which become books, sometimes pictures or both, which is the best kite pictures and words, laid my perhaps agree, but I mean what we say like a modern day. Equivalent of this be something like the Library of Congress like it's meant to. You now I was all of these really crucial cultural documents of import. that would be you know a legacy type thing, or was it just a really awesome library the just had like fantastically curated materials, the Agora field, some of these two d? the library itself had a

agglomeration, other type of different things. But to me one of the most fascinating parts of this is that the experts right now, if you ask them, if you put them to the sword, and said, tell me how many scrolls ram and how many things documents we're in the library, then their best guess is somewhere between forty thousand two four hundred thousand and the reason that's brother you'll see people says roughly the equivalent to a hundred thousand books for reference. The library Congress has more than thirty nine million books that are catalogued. the problem is, We know the fowl in of the Library of Congress, swim a factual history of how that institution came to be. But if we look at something ancient as the library of Alexandria. Ah, it's like finding

the origins of dynasties in ancient China. You know we get into the world of legend very quickly wings. It wasn't the first library of its kind, but it's their their mythical elements to the origin story. we are absolutely and just before we jump into some of those in the big fact. In my In answer to your question, all is that thinking about we, We can't even imagine think about the time of three hundred two hundred and eighty four BC. Just thee Number of writings of knowledge of of recorded history ease of sciences. There were being developed, I mean really anything, it was it it's not like you just go somewhere and grab a book. Right you couldn't order. One online: you can go to book store down the road, because people don't just have giant stores of books and papers

scrolls anywhere of rican, pick up and learn what you want to learn. Libraries like the one in Alexandria and in the few other places across the world. At the time that was it man that is, the knowledge base eventually right and if you're getting caught me copies or something you. You know needed to have the source material, and you can only go to a couple places to get it yeah they daddy, huge operation for this. The the government funded purchasing Talks were purchased in schools and documents and they sent out government agents to with time scans the cash to try. I too find any and every text that they could get their hands on. because they wanted. They were nothing if not ambitious. They wanted this to be. The number one repository of all all human knowledge, and that's why they were trying to archive things as well as collecting them. They they were

one of the oldest possible stuff, so if they had like five leads on, different translations of something they would. They would want all five, but they would definitely go for the oldest first, So in answer that question, that means that we can we can surmise where religious text because remember, religion and science or bury you, know, fingers on the same hand here this are. They would also white by the fees, they would whites things that appear to descriptions of the natural world myths, poetry, was really big. That's back when people cared about poetry still and because of this they would also host specialist. You would we'll get a job at the. I, which is, which is no small feet, because we also,

remember that literacy was considered a weapon in many parts of the world. At this time There are people who are not allowed to be literate because it was seen as a threat to the status quo. There is a rumour that there may be then been. They may have even started keeping live animals there like arctic animals as a report again a repository yeah you know. I never heard I'd never heard that that's amazing, I think I will idea you go into our We are the building. Where were you looking through alphabetize things. Let us call it g and you're, like ok, geography, and The giraffe, ok, While we await the disparity between the books geometry over here. So you shouldn't have been driving between just hang out. whom the bookshelf between the butcher house just beautiful bike too,

question about how how was this destroyed your right than it appears that went through a period of decline both for before it met its size death. Now we know that it was accidently burned by Julie, Caesar around forty eight b c e, but we don't know how much of it was completely steroid. How much could have been salvaged or rebuilt shortly after inner recovery phase. we know that it dwindles public support in front we're being pulled around two hundred, sixty c e yeah. The mid to sixty see membership at the library stopped being an option? and then over the course of

Belle Ukraine's counter attacks, domestic unrest. Sometime between to seventy two, seventy c e, the experts believe what remained of the library was destroyed, but it wasn't like some equivalent of a terrorist came to an existing, successful institution and then burned to the ground just kind of ended with a whimper instead of a bank more ok. So that's really interesting. We I'm. I had read elsewhere. I think you I mean it's not the best source. It was medium die, come by and I can find the sourcing for it. But The impression of this writer was that we are exactly what you're saying is correct about the first time it accidentally burned in that time frame. But then there is this: You're saying that with the decree of Egypt under roman rule, which is

your time. Oh that's! What kind of cause did have that downturn in funding and support in all that stuff? But then Exaggerate revolted against roman control, guess in there was that battle or the battles than soon after that is what caused it to burn. I wasn't sure if he has found anything about that year again is little tricky. The clothes we're examining the story of something that has a partially legendary origin take You know the idea, and then we have to consider great game of telephone, all the intervening, agendas of people who are reporting on this over the millennia we So I have to say that we also have to point out that it's a weird question, because it turns out that a lot

the information at the library, not everything, but a lot of the information there existed in other places like a minority is stop was actually lost for good, forever. It seems that would be the case. Getting out early hours, like Surely there were back up, sir. Do you now I'm in there, with even if its hand copy them in the evening, they would have made more than one. If these things are really you now, culturally significant, We know that one of the main thing I think been mentioned as one of the main things they would do at the library is make copies of books and things that were coming, and it makes me think of the idea that game of thrones were the citadel. You now the air. What are they gonna maister? I'll hang out in the library? Is this I bet you budget was even modeled after something like that. there's a lot of those scribes or the library you now masters are copying manuscripts by hand yet gap. In speaking of back

but there was a there is a second I bury that was essentially in overflow library, now, I'm pronounce it incorrectly serapion some this, sir serapion. Maybe It did a lot of but one of the major things it did was take heralding overflow from the library of Alexandria, as are still much just going in that place and today. I am assuming I've be again. We don't know for sure, but I assume that there is quite a bit of backing up of documentation when did survive another like a hundred and twenty years now I worry Alexandria, burned at least allegedly get, and that's that A lovelier pointing this out, don't think of library of Alexandria, as just a Supersize version of your local library.

think of it more as a research institute. This is a place where people are translating work continually and very rare happen with such systemic awe and successful design the thing is there are other libraries too that we will talk about. Maybe we should just say about the loss. ancient libraries, because the library of Baghdad was sacked LA there's, the house of wisdom that people might not be oh as aware of it. It is an enormous lost the history blights, but it's a very difficult question for us to answer me What would the world have been like revisionist alternative history. Aside to answer that question We need to have a little bit better idea of what was in there. That was lost the time you know me. The old chicken earlier question, but something that piracy

page, their ban. When I gave way to make it era appropriate this, isn't it blew me I'd I'd start a harp on this, but it does feel like as is a parallel with the national archives and the Library of Congress and the idea that, like this is repository of all the stuff that we think is important enough to keep and tag and put a number on, I'm sure, there's digitization efforts involved. Now, just in case you know there were attacked good God forbid, wastepaper basket that you now approve took the whole thing up. They probably do have those pdf that the listener was talkin about who I hold dear. The secret room in iron. Mountain should have a real rooms, narrow mountain, better public knowledge, but how fine, when his secret room be, it was a room in a secret mountain Besides the iron mountain, you know the nobody knows about this,

We may well dive into these strange mysteries of ancient library. is their destruction and how that destruction did or did not info the modern day, but before we do that, we are going to pause for a

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agreed us. She didn't need to tell us anything about it. She just said: hey look over here at this. I said: ok apart it open, and this is what I found It is a guardian article, V Guardian in fact, and the title is tourist. returns stolen artifacts from Pompey after suffering, curse yeah. You know how we like curses here on stuff. They don't want you to know. Please do not have any upon us, but we like discussing them specifically. What king took commons curse that we looked at back in the day. I think those the one year, sensory, maybe a few others. what happens when you metal with something ancient stead deals They were dead head. something terrible occur to it or around it or to the humans that used it. Well, that is the case here. Louis job

did the article just a little bit. There was a tourist from Canada who visited palm pay fish, ten years ago. As of this month- and she, while she was there, she took to mosaic tiles, and a piece of ceramics and she took both of those things back with her to Canada. After leaving Pompey, first of all, Not do this everybody. Let us make a pact right now, if you're in Pompey or some other ancient city or replace, let's not, four things from those ancient lasers. Should I should wait? What oh out I've? Just I I think the noble thing to do: What do you want to be honest? It did you know things come up. Well, ok, it's something we should strive to not do

Ok here we re looking at you british meat- I me even alike in others, this historic cemetery in Atlanta, colloquial cemetery- and you know there's like a golfers grave, their earth people have dumped all these gulf balls their unlike tease and stuff. Like that, you know people leave even that's like not cool in taken taken that as a souvenir or like Germany, Ramses Grave, and I'm sorry, I'm being depressing by that. But there's like a tree next to her grave, the people hangs, ornaments and- and- and I know I take- that stuff but you certainly know when it takes on the could be a culturally important artifacts let alone that has religious significance and the idea. Of desert, creating a great event cisterna, not chill the eight year correct in on this show we, as of yet have been able to furthermore, deny the existence of karma, but it certainly

something that I feel exists. and comes something that comes something akin to what you put into the world, you also get out of it, but it's not always true in history has proven this, so let us get back to this tourist. Her name is Nicole and when she was fairly young in her early twenties. She visited Pompey and she took these things. She too, these things back to where she was living and at this point, fifteen years later, she is blaming this since the single act on several Eddie terrible things that have happened in her life. She barely has suffered with rest cancer twice in her life, so getting cancer

being treated going to remission been getting cancer again, the second time she was forced to get a or she had to get a double mastectomy in order to treat the cancer and she said she had a run of misfortune going getting into financial hardship. I'm sure impart from her medical expenses shorthand they'd. She took these put them in a package. Them back with a know. That said, please take them back neighbouring bad luck M M he did apologize, for. the act of pilfering, and you know it's one of those things like at least she did the right thing and sent them back moving because not ever one does an people, take things from palm pay all the time in other places and I just want a job to an article from twenty fourteen, oh and from sources,

male online, but bear with me here Tosh it's it's not that bad of a source, but my goodness, if you try and navigate their website, the ad is just insane I get where you do in male unlined you gotta have as adds but come on. I can barely reader articles this in article twenty fourteen that describes just how many people take things from Bombay in return them there's a seven year old woman who took something from they call it. The attraction till it's like the actual city of Pompey was uncovered after amounts. Vesuvius erupted service it really encased the most. everyone who was there in the city in ash and the bodies he recovered after was rediscovered years and years and years later, it's very sombre place, but

but this one seven year a woman took something in nineteen, sixty four and then returned it and then in the dark, the director of the logical museum there. At least I think that's? U their referring to. It does not actually say here says they ve been leaving hundreds of packages with hundreds of fry whence for years, and they were considering setting up a special especial display? Essentially, there was going to all the artifacts that have been taken in returned. It's really annoying think there's a specific fresco fragment there was taken and the archaeologists there they wanted to. restore. The thing is called the Casado for tail and earth on this. The castle custody for tee o side as well, they want to restore this thing, but there is there a couple, important fragments missing and

one person who did take. This important thing returned it. And they were able to put the thing together, restore it. I mean that's nice right near, but Nikola believe her package Hudson. There were some other people, think a couple from Canada that included some stuff? They were returning and I couldn't find other people referring to a curse It seems like many people were just returning these pilfered pieces of history because they rightly felt bad about what they had done. so just to be very clear about my earlier joke? Yes, don't don't steel for museums, don't steal other people's culture and history, I mean one of the good, tragedies of the Iraq war that nobody talks about is how two thousand and three or starting

two thousand three are the National Museum of Iraq was lewd. It like this is not an ancient days. you know it's not a one off that happens. Decades are centuries in the ass. We have to remember that there there are concerted efforts to take this stuff for personal injury, and for profit is a huge business in a legal artifacts in historical, works of art, so good on. I would say good on everybody for returning this kind of stuff? You know some yeah we're right. I having it in your house, will achieve Cole, certainly didn't and what she wrote in her letter. Romany, I give you one more quote. She said we took them without thinking of the pain and suffering these poor souls experienced during the eruption of Vesuvius in their terrible deaths.

We are sorry, please forgive us for making this terrible choice made their souls rest in peace and again this is a special circumstance. This. This really is. This is a place where some terrible thing occurred. Nan lots of suffering took place and you know I understand that vat being there in the moment. Looking at breathing kind of you know experiencing, it is as you can. You may think I want to remember this forever. This is this is amazing, put to put don't don't do it I've been set. Also this isn't the year for it. You know I don't have time for this vote by you guys heard recently right. deny new mummies animist, a statue mysterious God were found in Egypt, Centurion it it's not the time. Let let the dead stay in the ground, just like

least until twenty twenty two are you say we don't need an undead plague. and all the other measures that a year ago? Does the euro would happen? No, obviously street. Certainly I shall carry on top. Let me why not listen go all the way and get away with it and be torn. hard by angry undead, deities, from another dimension year are you we could, but we know, which also couldn't could not see. Let's just assist was wrong play, and this also goes to you guys believing curses. Now I know you and I talked about this- the king Tut pursued if our cultural difficult to navigate earth complicated right because you do believe in some my karma, Julia formalised Garber,

I would really when I'm about curses, it's something that is, You do something and then a and alive person perform some kind of ritual. really is just how we talk. the on harm town, where referring to magic. The regular psychology gather rituals self is cell, weapon eyes self psychology, gray alone, almost like convincing yourself that I'm gonna cause bad things happen to this person I do believe that there is some kind of supernatural force, that region its hand throughout time and space and does bad things to you. But I don't know I mean if you you're doing anything to harm another person. Then you should be on the lookout area it's a say in how we words have power and if you really focus them on somebody with evident, been obliged to question, why is it

it's a curse of you? Just do it in private and don't tell the person in a desert, higher actually citing them out with some like you now, till jujitsu. Or can you just you know, whisperer in it corner in your room and then hope that debt, that the power of your words manifests itself? through the ether, I would say less so that pressure much more base equally weapon ice talking. We are like making someone, bad about themselves and they believe gas lighting, we have a curse. Things like that. You know because neighbours words we used errors as all the time you know we, we curse things all the time like a play a pox, your house, a plague on your podcast, those universes violence in hers scene. As a curse harbours. What was it, too, that we were talking about how like death to enforce c is much more.

accurately described the sort of dislike off like a mild curse. Sort of like you forget that Hang you now airline food am I right. Daresay airlines pledge is the sum of the Mosaic Deaf, Jim Math, Frederick and his entire family, as opposed to man, met Frederick sort of kill me now. I call dang night. I believe these things are entirely hypothetical. No one in their right mind would ever call you a pill, and if they did, I would have words for them I think that you just cursed me, but I think if you're till you be a sugar pill, man exactly completely ineffective, but his name, lady, whereas I can bring about results if you believe it. I logged on Europe in your abilities to bring about Syria. Let us know if curses work, let us

with you. If you had don't curse us, please we need all the help. We can get none of the insurance, but let us know really quickly. This is not an air, but I've been seeing to an audible book. It's called the three agreements, its We a little bit of a hippie dippy kind of self help situation quite enjoying it, and it has section like their parts? They go along on my own, I gotta skies really onto something. I really dig this and I totally agree before and then he'll go too far and wide examples was he's talking about this kind of thing, we're it's like you say: oh man, you know, look so good. I think. Maybe you definitely have cancer and then I'm thinking! Ok, you have cursed by putting the idea in his mind that he has cancer and then he's going to start thinking about the committee about it and he is going to make him unhappy, but Guy West have further. Instead, if man

believes the curse that you just laid upon him, he will cancer in three weeks time will that happened. I mean we approve of something like that happening. Multiple times in Australia, of of people die because they believed they were cursed. We also have we are we talking about the same, because I have read the four agreed. That's the excuse me, green. Otis yeah observe left one agreement out. I haven't got the fourth agreement yet sufficient so I wonder, though, because you know Kurt curses can, I think, We ve we prove through one way or another person can be enormously powerful dates. The debate is, whether we are comfortable calling that kind of psychology magic and then the main thing for me is what would happen if all the museums of the world return, their ancient artifacts to the polls.

From whence those artifacts came. There is great, I think it was in the whole Blazer comics John Constantine, where he, the writer as this fantastic lying about the British, the british museums They said this is where the impact drew the line and say no more will give you back the countries that were keeping this stuff and I about that? A lot you know like two: we weigh the benefits of the benefits, preserving history against the ethical problems, stealing it from somewhere else. I don't know I don't know. Maybe it's an interesting. I thought experiment, that's for sure, oh yeah, should we pop to a quick break and come back with one? Another was normal, absolutely don't

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and we're back with our final listener mail for the week this one comes from Hayley It looks as we were, looking back and more or less the eighties pushes a few great ideas rebel, does that we haven't gotten to yet but need to go back and check all of these emails out. but this is the most recent one that she sat and it goes like this good afternoon is maybe this will be the email. It gets me feature on the show, it all happened. You were talking to intention with the curses and everything it goes both ways. A thousand things it's out of weird hooker, ass, karma baby, put proposal the pattern of emails out of the universe, and you will eventually get one read on the shocking to watch. You know by gas via lotteries get today after honeybees now anyway, The boy my husband is an aerospace engineer. Specifically. Dynamic assist well says that he doesn't get into the whole conspiracy theory and they like to take a healthy, logical step back and look at things with a critical eye? Well,

We do you do for sure. I think that's one of our favorite ways to approach some of these topics are me The time has been lost in the show. You might be my dig him, so she continues sure sure, and then he pops off disown kids heresies this one. I had a share stage set I'm in the kitchen, a local, yet unknown number calls me. I answer. Usually I If it's unknown, we just move some a little more open to unknown numbers right now, if their local, I say hello, the line cuts out nearly instantly my but you know the recording and analyzing our voices to use them right me. What husband? for sure they're getting smarter, telemarketers and hackers used to call for many number, but now they have smarten. There are systems to call your phone based on its geographical number use to you would get

calls from all over the Eu S, but now there connected to your area code or area codes. You frequently call me sure, so so you think at the audio record, the auto recordings are hang ups for them just wanting to hear you say hello or go to help my husband, basically adios extra graphic. Your voice to develop, system which mimic specifically your voice and then uses it me. Two. I don't know that's why we believe this planet yeah and then just a little by little wrap up in love a show and all that's the yap interesting I have certainly never heard this angle just wanted to read it cuz. It was a fun little scene, But what what you guys think like how We know that. There's things like spoofing, you know where you get a call from like a number of closely resembling your own number. Maybe it's off by war, maybe it's the exact number, so your entreat, so

more likely to pick them up. Are you less likely to pick that certainly have seen You know the figuring out your area code, I'm more likely to pick up a number. Say from Rome, Georgia thinking who knows but it could be a could be work. Related thing I don't know, but it today your number. I definitely will pick it up by one year, most of them now on my phone say potential. spam or potential fraud Something like that mind did you does is selling and minors and doesn't do that? I dont, I think, get so many now this point that the who else is just getting smarter You seem to not really pick up when caused country like us, by modestly unsure how the Tec is working there, but I do know that I try to answer whenever I can and There are so many calls, and it's not. This is a real thing like telemarketing calls and just awful Robo calls are increasing and they have been incurred.

sing for sure to respond. I would say This is somewhat, but first of all, thank you for writing. Your husband is a hundred percent rights. This is not new thing either in the world of tat. This is somewhat old beans, because some version of this has existed for a number of years. Ah, you can fly and things dating back a couple years that prove Lee you solve Robo calls an voice recording at least for fraud, ah you, can you can get a call, for instance, linking with this way you get her elbow, call you get alive. Person is a scammer whose, instead of mentioning who they are and the answer, the phone, the first thing they say- Is Sweden gallic ring ring ring in a new answered, the folk oil or, however, he adds to the vote and then

the people on the other end of the phone and citizen who they are they say? Can you hear me, and then you say yes, then they hang up and now they ever recording of you saying yes, and so, with a couple of other Of information they can call an automated lying and authorize things, financial charges, and so on no, I didn't really think about that. That's diabolical! That makes perfect sense. Of course they could do that. I mean if they have you now, the last for Digital, your social or something else. But then again it sound, like you win you'd, do those cars or you have to audibly, say yes, do you, they're using voice print technology to like, like like it I find movie where you the leg, do a retina scanned the do? They really have a print of your voice, confirm identity, thought the out I'll. Tell you the scary thing. A lot of banks now here several in particular, do with seeing where they will ask you to say this free, oh, no, not even Oh my god.

There were about it- oh my god, yet make up. One new wondered sort: oh my god. Oh my god, it's like they quit Brown Fox Jumps, lazy, wooing, Mozilla, Open, says me that so there You say: potential pills, pilfer palm pay, pottery they just they make you say raise the end. If, if this Some recognizes your voice. It is an automated system. If it recognizes your voice saying that phrase, then he will are you in without any of the other pieces of it nation to confirm. Do it's designed be like a y, a single Siam one password for everything like face idea on the new funds now like yeah, but oh my god, because it's going over a phone line right, there's so much compression going on whatever audio can a matter

like in a matter. If it's been compressed again- oh my god This is terrifying dinner. That's trade in his verdict, non audio nerds out there. That basically means like you. Don't you recording a certain number of bits or whatever, unlike certain fidelity and then when you too, smite something we know as mp3, for example year reducing fidelity in a way. Hopefully it isn't like a unpleasant to theirs liking. A level of encoding, they will make small enough to transfer email or stream or whatever, but a phone is like crushed. Yet its essentially dismantling the sound and putting it back together in these, like audio equivalence of like big giant pixels or something and so you're right think about all the technology, the spinner, the advances made em like deep fix or waste a thing in even and Adobe audition suffer the we use, or maybe was a different one. Where was actually photos for audio were. I think there is some presentation at one of those like Apple conference, the big, the big ones like aliases Adobe, and they re created some

his voice. Saying a bunch of stuff and sound very believable having that print is like gold? That's a really good boy. I didn't even think about this. What I was reading the email if they can get a catalogue of people saying enough things. They could, you know the version of their voice to do what you're Talkin, I would maybe think about this issue much further than banks. I everyone, listening I'll win You have called lets you credit card company, a bank utility, We are even your. Maybe he stood alone. If you have those, have you notice the social engineering that is occurring on these automated lights, it is being sold to you dis ingenuously as a matter of your convenience? It is not. It is created in a new income or revenue stream for many of these institutions, because the agreement you sign when you

We are when you hop on with these services allows them to Use your daddy a ton of ways in your audio data is no different. I myself, just personally, I have complained to institutions about this. It starts the way sesame, credit started when title Wanna were used, that example, but the voice stuff was opt in first and data was opt out right. and now for many people you don't have a choice. You have to physically speak, you have to say a phrase to confirm a certain thing. I there are their places that I had been interacting with where I just continued to you use the dial tone or touchstone stuff

even when it was taken off the menu was like. I was ordering something off the menu at a restaurant and then when it got to the point where I couldn't use just the touchstone stuff, and I got with a human, human ask entity on the other line and ask them why this was happening, all day She got dodged real hard. They are selling your voice There may be not from nefarious purposes, maybe it's used to help voice recognition, a I which still has a lot of problems right. All you have to who is like a captured on you too, but it's happening it really is, and it is. It is not necessarily spirits. In theory I mean I don't know if it's even a conspiracy, I feel like it's not a cover up. I feel like we just in The conversation we're having we're already I'm bored with your husband daily, and I owe more to it, didn't take, but a hop skip and a jump to get there.

And it is. I hadn't even really considered it. We literally went there in real spot. At least I did do you now to put a slightly less horrific, bow on it and looking into this guy came across this really cortical from I call the story of Lenny the internet's favorite telemarketing troll, and it's about this, tat by Name Lenny, that is kind of developed. This cult, following at a essentially like kind of beats the well collars or telemarketers, or their own game, by a sort of playing ben- what you might refer to as reindeer games with them and sort of like some of the lines that you were talking about. Can you hear me hello you still there are things like that that sort of like illicit certain responses from either the eye or whatever you want to call on the other end or human, and this is sort of a way of Canada NASA.

from a little bit and then, of course, obviously that I can get you your voice. he's Lenny by it was developing two thousand nine there some I t the can it an anonymous. I t worker develop death because of frustration with the horrible job frankly, that the the FCC has done with regulating well calls and all that you did you write Matt, I mean what happened to the do not call. This would happen to this not being a thing anymore. It's worse! Now, in its ever been, and much more. What's the word predatory now like with the way it did at the target set of the elderly and tries to get be now identifying information for for Britain. People offered the other bank accounts. Seems stamina, maybe I'm just

seeing it more now, but this article did a stringent two thousand eighteen start with the staff at the New York Times Pad reported that there were three point: four billion monthly Robo calls at the time. Yet is it significantly exactly those twenty eighteen rights so since my theory tell me what you guys think. I think the telephone is an older technology. Actual telephone part of it think younger p who are using the text, features and social media in other ways to communicate with one another because the actual foam? calling feature on these phones used by an older generation older people that these he's, predators, really very worrying, cases predators, in some cases its people trying to do a legitimate business through full, calls and hopefully one out of every

five hundred picks up and says, and actually talk soon. I think their focus on the phone, because it is the older generation they had been with landlines for a long time, but now Phones are old enough where they're gonna be p. in there. You know they were Their forties, when this phone was invented. The first majors Phones are, they were accessible and added. Now there Her sixties, seventies, and there are more at risk. I guess for at least the people who mean the fairy who have nefarious purposes sure I would I would even call that a theory, though a billion for going. Ok, it's perfect observation and the absolutely right and especially with things like the pandemic and people being home more and being able to kind of creates there is everything's crazy. Now, therefore, I would be more willing to accept the potential of somebody offering me helping hand or or other being

problem with my bag. My mom got one from like Amazon and unlike Amazon doesn't call anybody It just doesn't happen. Do but but this this Lenny Chap up its programme with sixteen stock phrases, and it's really SIMPLE: adjust plays them in order that four or like kind of that, to encourage the Dell marker to continue with their sales pitch and then the last twelve phrases are played a loop until the day, a marketer hangs in energy age, says sort of is the idea to really dismissed with them and all it lessons for the over the only tat behind the really is that it listen for a one and a half second pause in conversation, sir when I say the next phrase and begin the the sequence of loop of looped phrases, I'd like to going into why the do not call registry became so ineffective if you

were seen in you, like many people, are receiving our unsolicited calls of Europe. if you're like me- and you got a bunch of Mandarin Cantonese before or if you she even things like fake Amis calls or fake. I arrest calls which can be very scary, for people like to empower you with some steps that you can take, Are these call? An artist and criminals depend on you not taking the time to report the that's. What it is it time. The burden of this has been pushed on. the consumer or the victim? First, as I think we ve stopped When you get a legal calls, or would you get these weird The calls just hang up if you answer it in its day, need feels off. Putting hang up, don't give them the gift of your voice. in case you know so apparently paranoid but dont do it. You can also report calls still that this part has not been dismantled. You can go to very simple

do not call Govt, or you can call eight hundred and eighty eight three hundred and eighty two one thousand two hundred and twenty two The last for a couple of things there, all budget, the last few to give you phone number, the lasting when you received this unwanted call and they'll, ask whether it was recorded, Robo, Paul or if there is any other information you can give They get a lotta reports for this. They are back logged I can well imagine there have been a bunch of funding cuts they caused. Fertilizers. You don't want to be able to do this. So there is lobbying against people not being able to be called, but there there are real actionable, finds violations are punishable by some like a little less than forty two grand per cos when these rocks get caught me. It is illegal, like the pregnancy agenda, that way

if you don't get any of that money, of course, but they are. The practice is illegal, but there are a lot of loopholes but found, solicitation isn't illegal like friend of mine, used to work for the fraternal order of police. You know that our organization than has like the stickers for supporters of looks like a book a badge I don't know exactly what they do is soak a blinkered, literally I think, like a lobby, kind of fur cops are like I'd, know, nonprofit that raises money for I'm. Actually, that point is heated cold calls. That is there. Is that legal way that that's legal right It's just a robot calls in the eye I read! Surely don't I obviously must be if it's a organization that you know employs humans yeah? Even you know, even if you do get yourself on national, do not call registry. There are charities that in call you local groups, obviously debt collecting. As people doing national surveys, local surveys they may call.

you in there are there some people that do not call registry die is ineffective on, like also you can't it's a complex legislative endeavour, A totally cut off the possibility of unsolicited calls without somehow act. At least saying we ve. it illegal for the average person to call people like that's how phones work you can't you can't make that illegal. That's why this why people get into terribly hilarious, very Vonnegut s situations. Are they used to back in the day when people would like Hall that's pay phone in the middle of nowhere in the desert or I'll when people would act. The deadly in this really happen when they would access We call nor had like they were getting get the wrong number and then there will be some hard core on the other end who is like? Are we go?

red tango like eyes, this dominoes there How did you get? This number trace the lack- and this happens, but the hilarity it is. It is a serious problem that, frankly, fighting is not just for reality: television, that's really what we're talking about now: rewrite orb, stealing podcasting, voices in using them for nefarious purposes. Don't do that. Police, awhile wait till you guys really quickly and if you ve seen this thing called Robo killer that has been around for quite a while. nobody really awesome name. Yes, I leave as an app, I know it's a website. Yes, as an app you can put on your phone and what it it's really cool is identified, a million plus spare. Yours and I and other groups that may cause all the time frequent those groups that are key. Lying or spoofing their number. So it looks as though coming from a local number from somewhere else, and it will

be easily identified as I go, that's a spam number, but what Although killer does is it's got a database of all of these groups in numbers and then recognizes them as are coming into your phone, any answers there. essentially as the app and it will I'll, give you a notification and tells us it I'll. Tell you hey a fake apple. in just called you, but we stopped it and one of them things that it does work. Lenny. Does the thing discussing earlier actually will keep l, a marketer somebody, whoever it is on the phone for as long as it can to get as much information from that line as it can. So it's me legally reverse, but what does that called It's gonna do whether what the spammers trying to do to you, instead of. new to talk, it's getting them to talk and its gaining. much information as it can just really interesting stuff in

sponsored by rebel killer by the way, but to reach out to us. If your interested, I am really pleased in this email generated so much. Conversation, we don't often get the kind of like discover- a thing at the same time like this. This is a lot of fun and terrifying, but do you know nothing keep us up at night and honestly, I so really answer those calls, and editors really is about educating yourselves. As far as like you know, if you have pair Sarah grandparents or whatever it is. You know it sounds like. You have that talk about about gettin scammed, you know what these with Rebecca ass highly. I want to hang out with your husband's deal you're using cool too. We know that take out with everybody because this is one of those things that its euro. We, we basically predicted this in previous episodes

You have to remember you know: everybody lives in a bubble of their own. so if you have someone in your life, who is maybe a little bit of a technophobe, or not on the cutting edge? I do help them out with this July. I know that there are resources there ways to empower out. Self and most Importantly, I would say remember no matter what it sounds like you do now. no, who is on that other end of the phone. Right who's on the other side and you dont How many other ears are between you and that old man other side, so I would say just be careful we owe it to ourselves since the legislation will inevitably be outpaced by the. Innovation, the burden of safety. calls on us as the end users and the infirmary. We have now may well be outdated next year, because this is evolving at a breakneck pace said before I say it again, I infer

there. You have it folks, sweet here's, hoping we don't dig up any ancient, primordial beast or infections. I here is hoping that we don't get any curses. Although we do want to hear about yours and, most importantly, here's hoping that we can hear from you we do list your email every week, which means we need your help. You can find us any number of ways you can just on the internet. I guess it is actually us Facebook go to here's where it gets crazy, Twitter, Instagram scarcely stuff on twitter. Were conspiracy, stuff show on Instagram and you can go to here's where it gets crazy. That is our Facebook group check it out. You can talk about this episode or any others with your fellow conspiracy realists. You know,

These husband is on their somewhere. We gotta, we gotta, find him, I'm sure he's non. Here's where it's crazy, so lurk her, but her like this. I hope this. This showed him that we are. We are peas in upon the four of us, yet give give the show a shot. Haley's husband, If you don't want to do that stuff, you can give us a call. I remember is one thousand eight hundred and thirty three std you why t K leave us a message again, we need your help. Anything you talk about any story. You wanna hippos to anything that you think we would find interesting or blower minds or just give us a charcoal. Please leave a message. We'd love to hear from you and hey, don't forget. back on you too, boobs Miss again meaningful clips from the show will be posted on Youtube. I think every day of the week write a new video. Every day for you to check out really been enjoying this and then their Vienna

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Stuff they don't want. You to know is the production of Iheart radio for more podcast. From my heart radio visit, the I hurt, radioset Apple podcast or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. hi. This is Hillary Clinton, hosted the new podcast you and me both there's a lot to be this and worried about right now, and it's made so much worse by the fact that we can't be together. So I find myself on the phone alot talking with friends. Exports, really any one? You can help make some sense of these challenging times like swimming nostril author of one of my favorite cookbooks or Stacy Abrams, who now is the woman who should be governor of Georgia. But did you know she's

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