« Stuff You Missed in History Class

The Origin of Cheeses

2013-04-08 | 🔗

Cheese has been around for more than 9,000 years. But how did humans learn to make it? Journey with Tracy and Holly to ancient Anatolia, where, people had begun to store milk in pottery and take other steps that set the stage for this delicious invention.

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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Listen I'm subscribe on the eye, hot radio, up apple podcast or where ever you get your favorite shall welcome to stuff. You missed in history class from house extra com hi and welcome to the planned cast. I am Tracy we welcome and I'm hardly fry, and today we are going to talk about something we both love, though my shoes, if one of our favorite, if it is seized she's having nine thousand year history and the variety that we have of it today are mostly the products of little tweaks that people have made throughout history for one reason or another, basically, every cheese that we
Today has some kind of story to tell about where it came from. That's tied to the animals that were being raised with the weather in climate were like the people making the cheese whether it had to be stored or shift or anything like that. allowed. These refinements come straight from human ingenuity and curiosity, but it's also a very necessity. Mother of invention, kind of story, making cheese is a balancing act with milk.
How much moisture salt and bacteria are in that milk and what people's lives were like when they were trying to make tease? So I'm excited- and it's kind of interesting from Interpol, logical standpoint, because as people have spread out, tease went with them gas. It really has brought its own flavour to be funny. Unfortunately, visits of various cultures like cheese informs cultures in an interesting way, hands of the cultures and form the tea. I love it. I did not mean for that to be upon that Well, I'm going to win were being all funny and reciprocal in the cheese cycle right but failures, the legend of where to use came from, and there are a couple of problems with this leginn they gets. It gets passed round its fact. So, according to the lower someone and a person in some arab country
was travelling a very long way carrying milk in a skin that was made firm and animals stomach and when he got ready to take a drink of milk, he discovered it had curdled into achieve. This may have been how people discovered when it, which is the enzyme from animals stomach that is used to make to you. But it's probably not where cheese came from for a couple of reasons. One is that before people started eating cheese, milk was pretty much just for babies, because adult humans could not digest lactose. They couldn't make lack taves witches, the enzyme that breakdown down lactose after they were babies. So unless this guy was travelling along way with a baby, we didn't really have had reason to be carrying a skin of milk with him, or maybe he was going to visit a baby. Maybe, but maybe people didn't often carry milk around in skins, because it was a high risk of sport.
right it really milk was consumed fresh and only by babies until after cheese was discovered, Flash invented a more likely scenario is that people discovered that if you left milk out it would solidifying coagulated and if you ve worked at a little bit, you could separate that into Kurds and way, and it's not far to get from that to achieve so that a little more likely than the animal skin carrying story you thinkin about cheese, So the more likely history you know by about seven thousand b c people living in the fertile crescent had started to do to keep animals only were cultivating plants, so they had sheep and goats and go to The killer were used. They were accustomed to
in relatively confined spaces like keys, so they would have been very easy domesticated that point. If you look at evidence from that long ago, the goats and sheep that were being kept were probably more about meat than men. Because there wasn't an overwhelming number of female animals versus male animals. They also look at what ages the animals were at slaughter, Farming for wool also would have come later because sheep that far in the past, didn't really have usable wool as their hair, so the earliest sheep probably mostly used as a source of meat, so several things that they have had to happen for people to wine making chief. They had to have a reason to want to pasture animals and use pastured animals as ever food source. They had to have annum.
That could give them more milk than their own young needed. I, which would have taken some generations of breeding to get animals that produce more milk. I love the sun they had to know how to milk. The animal fright that had to have been an interesting trial Yes, well in the animals have to allow themselves to be built by people, which is another thing you know animals can be very obstinate through. This is another thing that would have required effort and, lastly, they would have needed away to store the milk when, as we talked about before there are some difficulties with using skins, restoring milk, this worked out to be pottery or, more specifically, the every that you could apply heat clay and turn it into pottery, and so once we had all those things together at the same place. At the same time, people were able to develop cheese, and this happened at about sixty five hundred Bc Ii in the western half of what is Turkey today, we can look
cards of pottery from the era, and knew that people were raising animals for milk, because there are milk that residues in pottery shards and the proportion male and female animals also changes in the anthropological record at that point, so you could, because you would need more females to be producing milk. Yes, Now, probably this milk started out as a food source for babies, as you mentioned earlier, since humans had not adapted their ability to process lactose, but they would quickly figured out since they didn't have refrigeration that that milk sitting out was gonna quite late and that they could turn up the car then way when they stirred it most of the lactose stays in the way. When you separate the Kurds from the way so adults could eat the Kurds, all the nutritional value with either problems or fewer problems from the digestive standpoint. Yes, format, I just
standpoint. If you were anyone, you know is lactose intolerant. You have a sense of what that is all about so Kurds were really valuable source of nourishment, so people had a good incentive to figure out an easy way to separate Kurds from way, and this came in the form of perforated ceramic canisters. We have lots of archaeological evidence for people using ceramic containers with with perforations immense, separate Kurds in way I also have some theories about woven baskets as well right, but those don't really. Yes, I end up to scrutiny longer. They don't hold up as well over thousands of years that we don't have much concrete evidence of whether people were easing woven basket, stomach chief by separating herds in way based on the fat residues in pottery. I we think people also figured out how to make things like butter at about the same time. The we, as chief those, were all they were fresh cheeses. They,
more like today's ricotta or other stopped kind of curly cheeses. People would have eaten them quickly, since they would spoil without refrigeration They also may have sealed and buried these chooses to try to keep them out of the sun, keep them a little cooler and they will also the Kurds, could dry in the sun and its possible that ran in the environment from animal stomachs used to four men were discovered at this time as well. The record is super clear: it's not as easy to find residue of something on an animal skin. That's broken down over time as it would be ceramic, but it's the likelihood that really cheese making them spread out from the fertile present. We have lots of pottery shards as evidence that show the progression
thieves along with lots and lots of other things spreading out during the neolithic migration. People were making cheese and butter from the milk of cows, goats and sheep, and one of the most recent discoveries of this progression is from not too long ago, and it was a seven thousand five hundred year old piece of pottery. That was almost certainly used to make cheese, and what is Poland today have? They did the same thing of looking at the residues that were on the inside of the pottery and and what they were made of, and so for many years, even with this migration or progression outward from where it started. The cheese is still remained like the fresh acid, coagulated and Rennick coagulated cheeses, so they still hadn't gone to the eighth cheese concept right and in some parts of the world that that's that continue to be. For always what people were making endings
believes in India. India has a really old tradition of using dairy products, with lots of an which is clarified butter and using Kurds in their cuisine, only feel that indigenous to India is Pioneer, which is a soft cheek meant to be eaten fresh. There are lots of different theories for why India did not develop aged cheeses, and one of them is that there is such a focus on food purity in Berlin Texts in that part of the world that people were probably not down with the idea of letting things mould on purpose and then remove the zoo, climate in India, is also not great for be controlled, spoil it. that is really what aging cheese is all about? You know, I'm imagining that conversation no, it will be delicious now it will be rotted, but thankfully that worked out and as soon as cheese became an important important as part of
both diet. It also took on religious significance. Offerings of cheese were made to the gods, for example the siberian Goddess Anna, who got daily offerings of cheese and butter, and a number of greek gods and goddesses who had cheese among their offerings They are also lots and lots of references to cheese in many religious texts from all over the world. It didn't take longer before me, started, seeing the need to be able to store cheese to eat it later, instead of being able to make it and consume it within a day or two you so around. Fourteen hundred Bc Ii. Hittite writing starts describing more types of cheese that sound a little bit more. Like the harder cheese is that we have today, we don't really good evidence of all of them, we have more descriptions in writing, but they include descriptions like scoured cheese and hard soldier cheese, sue. There's the logical.
Fusion, that they developed ways of aging the cheese to make it harder to take down the water content and the trees so that it would last longer and being able to former Rhine on genes, but we don't have a lot of like very clear pottery evidence to go with that. It's mostly written descriptions that people are drawing conclusions from the first recorded shipment of cheap he's took place in twelve hundred BC e through the Mediterranean Sea, which is further evidence that people had developed cheeses. That would keep at that point. Most of the cheeses that were being shipped around were probably brine cheeses. Feta that were stirred stored in ceramic jars and the rest. but even though these visas are very soft and wet, the reason that they last for longer is that their lot, of SALT in them
if you dry salt white cheese that have lots of moisture in it. The way starts to come out and mix with salt, and it makes this brine that keeps the cheese pressure for a longer period of time. Thank you saw for fairer, which is delicious. Yes, I've literally just rubbing went on looking my lips over here. Now is one of the hardest part of researching this by gas. Does why not? When I got to you a couple of the team, that are delicious and also very salty, and I wanted some real bad. So Greece became an important area for the drone of cheese and just like with the earliest cheese makers. The Greeks were making fresh teases for daily eating, but they were also exporting teeth, so they were doing being these harder, hardier varieties of cheese that could survive voyages. Yes, we have a wonderful glimpse of how these
Visas are being made in Greece thanks in part to Odysseus, is encounter with the Cyclops. In the honesty, even though that is a work of fiction were pretty much seeing a play by play of how people were making cheese at the time, the Cyclops I believe that the milk probably using rent it and maybe also thinks that and then he pressed and dried way got from that the odyssey doesnt mentioned that he salted it, but probably based on other evidence at the time. He would have them salted what he got from that process and he would have pressed it and let it dry and it would have formed a rind as it dried. There were drying racks described in Cyclops, his cave.
and so the result of this would have been a dried peccary, no or complete no trees- and this is probably the first description of a rennet coagulated cheese and literature and take away from the odyssey It is by ancient Greece. People had figured out how to regulate, presents all cheeses in this way. Make arrived and would be suitable for aging, just so fabulous that it's in the odyssey of all places. This record of cheese making now February's later peopling Greece added a cooking step, also which allowed cheeses with an even lower moisture content, which would make them last even longer. In Sicily, hard cheeses became wildly popular and by the fourth century BC, their native cuisine at them, He was full of great its teeth and cheese office. It was so prevalent that there were seized naysayers. They were, they were sort of there. The sicilian fourth century BC
the version of the Agri food critic he would be like. Why does there have to be cheese sauce on every thing? Just let the fish stand on its own, suitably sir yummy oh she's, making in Rome, started a lot like it did in brief, with people making heat coagulated fresh cheeses using these vessels, which are called, boilers. So, while the cheeses worthies aggravated Kurds and way kind of process. The vessels that they re using were kind of unique to add the what's ITALY today, based on the distribution of these milk boilers, which were ceramic things that kept that the milk from foaming over the top its clear that making soft cheese were, was an important stable in the bronze age all over room. These were actually still in use in ITALY as
ramming milk boilers until the nineteenth century and then metal ones became in more common use. After that point, there is an interesting symbiosis that happen between cheese making and pig farming in Rome. The way that they were extracting during their ricotta process was actually a great food for fattening pigs right, making them also delicious. They would milk lots of animals, get lots of milk, separate the Kurds from the way, feed the way to pigs and then have worked as the greek influence. So we had talked about how, in Greece they were making these smaller harder cheeses. So, as greek influence spread in Rome hard Jesus did as well and by the seventh century b c e graded cheeses were a big part of the diet in Rome also, and there are many many roman writers
put together very detailed agriculture all manuals, and, if you care to do so, you can read so much about how people were making Vive in ancient Rome thanks to these writers and in room would raise large flocks of sheep to produce both cheese and wall. At that point, they had developed a sheep farming that was geared more towards more protection and they use the way left over again from the chief making to feed the pigs, and they also started experimenting work, a truly good for me personally, with smoked cheeses, right and also cook cheeses and much larger cheeses them a smaller size. Peccary. Knowing caprice knows those stay small so that the milk and fluid from the middle can evaporate more and they keep longer right, but then bigger cheeses became technologically more.
Do of all the most famous giant thing of trees in ancient Rome was called Le Luna. Probably the accounts at the time are really exaggerated because they very describe it. Is this like giant thing of cheese? It was probably not his job as it is often described by people were using cooking and high pressure thing to get more of the liquid out of the middle so that they were able to make bigger and bigger cheese is. Is it how how big is it described? Could a family afore livid it one writer describe it? Is being able to provide lunches for hundreds of your servants at than from just one, probably not actually, that big, some of this innovation of of combat
cooking and high pressure pressing may have come from the kelpie we're living in the alpine regions. They also were known his great chief makers and they had been making bigger cheeses than the little ones that had been coming out of Greece. The tells me have also started the practice of solving the smaller Kurds before press them together into one larger cheese. So again, the thought was making it into the middle of a bigger treaty cylinder and preventing spoiling right like how it's all about me she's vigour about making this is bigger than theirs obstacles when you're working with those kinds of more manual processes to try to get the middle of the chiefs dry enough so that it doesn't spoil in the middle wild outside is drying. Give us no good now so, where it would we ve gotten up to you at this point is
end of the roman empire before the roman empire fell. It spread military outposts and agricultural manner estates all over the place, both the military out there, and the manner of states had dairying enchieved making tools. So when the roman empire fell, all of that stuff was left behind that people then continued to use to make their own new types of cheeses. This episode of stuff you missed in history, glasses, brought you buy. Norton, sixty with lifelong. Let's just say your shopping online with your smartphone. I do it all the time. They sure feels that your personal info is right there in your hand, but that's not always the case, because, as soon as you hit submit, your personal information could start going other places. In fact, when you shop, bank or browse online, your personal info can get out of your control, which can leave you vulnerable to cyber criminals. More threats demand more protection. That's why Norton and Lifelong are now part of
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the vacant fake, an ankle sprain because you're absolutely exhausted, so which, in save with back up it's almost better than sports and those new types developed all sort of on their own trajectories. Based on the factors that we already talked about, this There was human curiosity and ingenuity, but also we know what was available nearby weather conditions, while the people that were there already knew, etc. So this continued to be true at even his manners broke up into tinier fires. Were people only had one or two animals, instead of like a whole herd, pretty tease from right so in in France, Soft, been peasant cheeses began to develop. This was basically using the same cheese, making methods that had been common in the Mediterranean, but in the cooler
I met of northern France. People could hang onto their milk for a couple of days before they mean she's out of it, so in the Mediterranean that would have spoiled almost immediately, but where the weather was cooler, you could milk cow and the milk again the next day and then maybe one more day after that and put that all together to make tease out of and the chief, the milk from the first day of milking at that point, would have more lack the gas at bacteria. In it, being able to put all of that together and then put what you got as a result into an ice. Cool speller meant that you could control this voyage. That was going on and Thou friends figures were coming up with gloomy rind cheese is lack, dick cheeses and washed Rhine. Jesus he's were all things that were having back real activity going on in the inside of the cheese that was creating this Rhine that has often edible that is basically mobile.
Holly you're, making the most hungry faced with this while manners crumbling into smaller farms and other of Europe in England, many of them state intact until the end of the middle ages. So many of those manners had secondary made supervise all of the dairying and most of the time The most minors came from the sheep rather than the cows for most of the middle ages, and they contain, to follow and refine many of the more hard cheese trends that the Romans had been using. So they have their whole own cheese culture again, not meaning to be funny, but their own methodologies and approach to it happening as well. Right in the thirteenth so partly through the middle ages. The sheep who were being used for milking were also used for wall and the cow
for milking were also used for me and leather, but right around the thirteenth century, people started to divide that up a little bit zoo. Sheep were therefore wall. There were dairy cows who were just for milking, and then there were other cows that were being used for their me in there there This is also about the time that the english dairying started to move to cows from sheep, because cow's milk separates more easily cream to make butter out of, and people were becoming very fond of butter in and a series of illnesses and really wet seasons, which are bad for sheep, also brought down the sheep population, making the use of cow's milk to make these a little bit more of a necessity and an thousands of Europe in the middle ages from the mountainous regions, Jesus had to be very sturdy and rugged because you had to bring them down out of the mountains and leader export them in, for example, one of my very
Jesus. Gregory year oh yeah, I love the stuff animals are generally pastured up on the mountains and then the for working with them would live there with the animals, make the cheese there and then it would have to travel downward. This meant that the people who were making he's in the Alps had to work around the lack of salt because to get fault to the animals, you were doing the milking and making sees you would have to transport it up there and that would be difficult and expensive. So cheese makers in the Alps figured out ways to cut the Kurds, make them smaller and cook more of the moisture out of them and that the Kurds into a more we'll shaped form a lot of the cheeses before this point or were more like cylinders than wheels so putting it, the more of a wheel shaped form would give more surface area for better evaporation
Some of these alpine cheeses actually have holes or eyes, and I was from the collection of carbon dioxide during aging. There was bacteria in there that would flourish in those conditions and create these little pockets. They would give off carbon dioxide as they reproduced in that carbon dioxide with its away. Yet when collecting a whole so that the whole that you think of in swiss cheese, that's from factories propagating cheese is really just disgusting. So good, I can get past any. The disgusting parts ineffectually in ITALY. What gives it that sort of nutty flavour lights all take it? Another mountains ease that came from the middle ages as Rockford, and the veins and wrote for cheese are from Penicillin Roque, forty, which grows in the cave where it was aged, real wrote for cheese today,
from these same caves, where it was originally aged in the middle ages, and wound up infested with this bacteria that gave it its look in its flavour Parmesan also came about during middle ages, though it was not from the mountains and the techniques used to produce it. Our car, in the mountains. But there was plenty of salt in the Pool River Valley where it originated, so they didn't have quite the same limitations in terms of resource availability, that it uses techniques very similar to the alpine cheeses. Just with the thought that the alpine people demand- and this is where I wanted some really salty purpose so bad yesterday, when I was working on it, so by the middle ages. A lot of the tools that we eat today had had been developed, at least in there.
we are formed, semi mirror many revisions and tweaks diseases that have happened since then, but lots and lots of the ones that we are most familiar with existed in some form by the end of the middle ages. One exception is the trees that from HOLLAND where commercial dairying did not even start until the fifteenth century, because the land and the climate we're just not right for it. There had been very small farming in Derry operations on the coasts of the neolithic period, though, but is not enough to really form an industry around it right after the fire. Of the roman empire. The aristocracy in HOLLAND started trying to reclaim HOLLAND's frontier and turn it into workable land. They did not have very many people Try to do this, it was not. I have vastly settled area, so they would reward peasants. He would clear and work land with big grants of land and what they were basically doing is trying to do
bogs into farmlands by using pumpkin dykes, to get all the water out of it as they were able to reclaim more land. They started by growing grains and then eventually move from growing food to vary, and then so many cheeses, dairy farmers actually became really really specialise and they put out a insane variety of cheeses through various innovations in packaging equipment, etc. Once they had the technology, they went wild sort of expanding and customizing at which a love, English she's makers at the time were responding to demand, while HOLLAND didn't have those constraints, so they could just invent new cheese that people wanted. So that's where we get an assortment of delicious nothing by including Edam good. A different kind of packaging came from that sort of pocket of innovation. The round instead of square wheels. Thank you, HOLLAND, right
was a hole in England. At that particular point, there is a whole kind of drama going on with cheese there with it achieves mongers, essentially union that was recognised by the government that had been really controlling the chief making around London. And then that with horribly awry, and they had to start looking to other parts of England to make cheese and that led to basically the whole of English t making being about how do we meet the demands of London? Hollan did not have this problem. There might have had a the rich luxury of a playground related to scan develop chiefly thought would be me so when you see these these cheeses that have really lovely colored coatings, their sort of like a and resilient readiness to them. A lot of that is coming from the combination of what the climate is like in HOLLAND than the fact that the sort of just got to go. Let's think up some new stuff.
Let's see what happens if we wash this cheese with this other animal product think up tee so get hit. Eventually, colonists brought cheese and she's, making pretty much everywhere there. People were colonizing. Cheese travelled with everybody gets appeared oh, how people of the ten t? Yes, then it's a very valuable needed food source. I mean it's. It started a sort of necessity of how can we make this milk not immediately be bad, and then people discovered that this is actually a good source of nourishment and alive. ways and the industrial revolution really change things, because it mechanized a lot of these processes that had been kind of what we would consider artisan handcrafted. right. So, whereas before they had done- revolution, making she's with highly highly dependent upon the weather and the climate and the now and everything
The industrial revolution made it possible for people to kind of replicate those conditions in other places, and so rather than saying, hey. Ok, we have chattered cheese that were making and we're gonna try to figure out how to make cheddar chief approximately in this, not very english climate and then winding up with some other chief becomes alarm or possible. The industrial revolution to say: ok, we're we're gonna, have replicate this technique and also implicate the conditions that were present elsewhere to make this cheese that that will be more like what we are thinking about from where we used to live in the? U S, and you know there was of the long term cultural heritage that Europe PAN going into cheese, development and the cheese factories just kind of blossomed yeah.
People, had I mean they had. Families and people have their family heritage and in May knew how their grandmother had made cheese before the family had made their way to the to the colonies. But there was not quite the the institution of cheese making as This long, many many generations of thing in one particular place. So the U S became a huge centre of making an exporting trees. In some cases, traditional techniques have kind of died out because of the mechanism mechanization as well as supply and demand. Mozzarella in most places is not made the same way. It once was now that mozzarella was thoroughly handcrafted, cheese and ITALY was made in very small badges, and you can't make it and a big factory with machines which a lot of the cheese today big factory with machines, rather than the previous handcrafted
small batches. As we have seen with many things. There is, of course, now and Artisans Eve Movement where people are making things in small batches, using the same basic techniques that people were using hundreds or thousands of years ago, cheese I now today, a lot of efforts to surf label but Jesus. I quote the real thing so like Rockford, he can only call at ease roquefort if it was actually made in those caves. Re people can approximate roquefort like cheeses elsewhere, but I can't carry the name. Brain cannot carry the name. There are protected designation of origin or patio labels that label where that use came from or the geographical and
Haitian or that the July level of where the chief came, Brahman and sort of like wines and how champagnes are only supposed to come from champagne and not California, though the sparkling Not every portal often call champagne right and not,
We blew cheese, is Roque for right. How I loved you see it's hard, not to work for exotic about gene. There is so much when, when I said Hale do a pike asked about cheese. I think what you said is I could do. I can't remember which sees it wasn't. You said we were like. I could do a whole podcast about gruyere, proper, probably or he tossed retorted norwegian cheese that I'm a big family. I think it's usually called Brunos over there. We call it does Canada it, but it's usually export it as that its phenomenal and it has a sweet nutty. The brown cheese is phenomenal. Yes, sir I'll say that alot there is so much to learn about cheese beyond the sort of the origins,
Jesus that we ve talked about. Today. We will link to lots of places to learn about more about cheese and her soon it when we put there's up after this time cast comes out. I'm only Sebastian manner Scarborough Cordiality, and this is the Peat and Sebastian POD catches is a show of beaten. I thought about a personal private lives two guys I am for Medium P Coralie and I were media Biometric PETE six years ago on a bus in Toronto. Ass, terrible Iheart radio is number one for podcast. Zeno purpose, may let you go like the step by step might have doesn't say anywhere near to the highest pitch voice. You have fast, as you can see, there's other podcast out there that you probably listening to or watching listen people I'm telling you right now this
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You that the new season of my show starts February Sex. I hope you'll join us for some incredible conversations about family identity and what happens to both when the secrets that have been kept from us and the secret. We keep finally a light, listen and subscribe on the hurt, radio, apple, podcast or wherever since your favorite broadcasts- and am I understand that you also have a bit of listening to you. I do you have. I have to listen to my office. both from Facebook and they are both about Johnny opposite to her, the first those from Benjamin. An Benjamin's, as you mentioned that John Chapman died when he was seventy and that it was impressive, given the life expectancy at the time was forty years, while those facts are correct, that comparison is invalid. Life expectancy was so low because of the high rate of infant child mortality, not that forty with age most
were dying while living to seventy is impressive. It's not far out of the expected lifespan of an adult at the time. This is true. Also forty is an average Yet faced on infant death, as well as people that were living to be in there going to and our shared I swear, you can go out life expectancies from birth, verses from each by verses from age, twenty one and really once you ve got to age. When she got past, eight five he's got a bunch of more years of life expectancy. I've been once you get AIDS, twenty the Avonlea average. I found this awesome site that I will listen to you and our shared. I swear. You can go out life expectancies, member verses from each by verses, maybe twenty one and really once you ve got to age. When she got past eight five bunch of more years of life expectancy and then went,
AIDS, twenty one, also, similarly extra years of life expectancy, so a lot of people were dying between birth and five. But if you got past five and especially if you got past twenty one, then you are more likely to live a lot longer. So, thank you, German for pointing that out, and we will linked to this awesome, also mapping history site that I found so I've been waiting much time doing that this morning, when I was meant to be doing other things. The other listener mail that I have about Johnny Apathy is from Jeremy Laramie says I love stuffy, missed in history, glass, your recent broadcast on Johnny Apathy. I wasn't here interesting and informative talks. While I take my fine racing dozen on long walks around town, I am a new church, music minister. I'm not going to say where he is the pastor, because I think maybe overtime. What it implies that you would like something Casey like that, but he is a new church minister, and we have always
and proud of this Corky character, who did so much to spread the word of Swedenborg in the early eighteen hundreds. We have several science of Johnny. Freeze and town here, and there are many descendants and our population of people that he converted. I love that you referred to the new charges, intellectual. It is true that it is great for explaining Kristen One thing I would note is that although Johnny was unusual, I doubt that it is true that he had talked of having to spirit wives, as this would never fit with new church theology, while it's true The new church had this kind of a holiday in the USA and eighteen hundreds, especially after the civil war. It still exists and is growing today, all over the world just keep up the great work,
so thank you very much. Jeremy, that's a degree in fight from a perspective. We would not normally have access to integrate the force of my thoughts about the Spirit, wives, things. So the source was the Johnny apples in book that we talked about in the pine cast. My forces source was by an and hill and others. The history of co, shocked and county YO its past and present seventeen. Forty two eighteen, eighty one containing a comprehensive history of Ohio, a complete history of Kerr, shocked and counting a history of soldiers. the late war biography. then histories of pioneer families etc. That is the entire title. It's from eighteen, eighty one you can really. Everything in archive dot org, if you want, which is incredible No! I dont know what the that particular books source was, but other information that it has about Johnny apples. Eve looks to be correct.
While I do not know for certain we're that information came from, I will say that, as is often the case, one person's, mere- should not be seen as representative of an entire religion yeah. Well, we also now from that punk ass. They he did love to tell a story even sometimes loved, to tell odd and interesting story centre, ten people, so we can know unless we really did pretty deep far back and we may not have access to information if the germ of that may have been in something like that. Really believed it. But now we know that that is totally not down outside of new jerks teaching. So thank you, Benjamin M Jeremy for your thoughts on these two I'm going to put a link to both of the head inordinately long titled book and the mapping history site in our surname would like to wish them. If you would like to find-
as there are so many ways that you can we're on Facebook at Facebook, dot com, slash history, class stuff, we're on Twitter at missed in here We are also it missed in history, not tumblr dot com, and you can email that history pike asked at discovery dot com. If you would like to learn more about what we asked about the day, which I absolutely do you can go to our website and put the word cheese in the search bar and you will find how cheese works, which have lots of information about why cheese does the way and little history. Second up- and you can do
all of that and a whole lot more at our website, which is for more openness and thousands of other topics, because it has suffered Stockholm. This episode of stuff you missed in history class, was brought to you by audible. I am Bobby Brown. Welcome to my party has beyond them you show from. I hurt radio, I'm here to be sitting down different people each week that I think we can all learn from. I hurt radio is number one for pod cast, but don't take our word for police into the on the beauty. I hurt radio APP Apple Todd cast or ever you get your package because we all have something to learn about the real me
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