« Stuff You Should Know

The Skinny on Lyme Disease

2019-09-17 | 🔗

If you live in the Northeastern U.S. then you may know someone who has had Lyme disease. But it's spreading all over the country and parts of the world. Learn all about this tick-borne disease today. 

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happy should now production of Iheart Radios House networks. Are you walk into the park? Guest on Josh Clerk shows the reach of brightness Jerry over there. This is, You should know Chuck question. No, it takes me on line disease, so many The blame me for that, which is, I can say this, and I think you know what the lawyer and I totally agree that this sort of a follow up to our July. Twenty seventh, two thousand ten absurd. Why ticks suck which which is sort of the legendary absurd, because we falsely promised to send people
t shirts if they made it all the way through the episode, that's right and we re just kidding, but we still get those requests of where's my shirt, yes, that salaries. I forgot about that and also went to suit today. You have rightly so, I also want to point out and shout out or former website house, the forks dot com, because couple of the articles that we use for much of this episode is from the old age has to be webs nice homer down over there for holding down and the citizen you good stuff yeah, so we're talking today. About line disease in particular, not limes? No, we should say its capital l. Why am I e disease and the reason it's called does because its named after a town which is one of three towns where the initial outbreak of line disease that led to this bacterial infection, persistent bacterial infection,
was first describe medically. Yet one of the facts of the show, I think, oh yeah, sure who knew it was named after a town wine Connecticut. I knew did you know that before this sure did we cover that and why tick suck- I think you're, smarter, you're, smarter than mean it's not it's not. That I think got me got me was I heard about people saying disease like people take it for granted, but it's actually so this. Actually, some is really mysterious illness and liquidity talking about so I think I looked into this year's back and that's when I found out, I was all too, are equally smart right, exactly I'm not smarter than this marks a just like someone happen to know one thing, someone else knows another sure I say they cancel out we're all smart I'm glad you pulled it out cuz, I would have been like what is smart. I couldn't covered the definition So why am disease? What we're going to do with a couple of stats here
one disease in the United States has more than doubled since ninety ninety seven, that's astounding it is and it is spread to it- used to be very much localised and kind of North EAST and sort of It Atlantic areas, some in the south, but now you can. Get lung disease and I believe the entire lower forty eight is incorrect. There there are cases in all forty eight states suppose The half of the colonies in the United States now are considered at high risk for lime disease and, like all of this happened, just in the last, like twenty or so years, which I mean there's, there's a lot of debate over the CDC calls line. Disease Endemic, which is a is that has become a pie. Again on ongoing part, an area region in some other people- are saying guys. What we're talking about here is in
the this is an epidemic in. You should start calling at that, because it will come to raise the alarm to the next level or to where it should be because this is a very alarming spread of disease that we're seeing right now, buying disease- is the number one vector borne disease in the United States to weigh more prevalent in, like West Nile or chicken Junior anything like that, but it still kind of treated is like up there in the northeastern. U S thing: that's just not the case. It's it spread every, in every direction except east because it hit the Atlantic but everywhere else? where it can spread into the Interior, the United States and up into Canada. It's starting to get and there is also a history continuing to this day, even where line disease can be overlooked. Misdiagnosed, not again as seriously by your doctor as they should be,
including what we'll get to later on something called post treatment, lime, disease syndrome and it's over frustrating. If you have been a an end that has headline disease yeah there's. Big community, other people there like. Why would anyone listening to us why one or doctors take seriously and what do we have to do here like do? We have to start drop in dead yeah? There's a tremendous amount of frustration and in that community, because there is, is send men among the medical establishment that you know Haiti is antibiotics, man, exactly it's easy to cure line disease here. Some antibiotics is still a persistent symptoms. Fares are probably in your head. We're not going to see there in your head, but there in your head and the people who are experiencing the symptoms are like now by life, as is derailed by these symptoms- and you guys aren't doing anything about it- is frustrating like people out there that are pretty pretty stopped right now to be hearing this gear in area Fisher, gravitating Creek US share
not having myself in the back, although I am literally belly like I see the elbows sticking out pretty far so. Lime, disease is a disease. It's an infection caused by the bacterium, bore it Berlioz Bergdorf, Prairie Borg, the fairy Bergdorf Ferry we're gonna get you in April and call you the word butcher, Bergdorf fairy more more mark that we get the whites called out in a bit, but if you haven't got out by now, it is transmitted through Tick bites right, so a kick in particular a nymph stage of attack, which is a leg a dollar juvenile tick will transmit this bacteria, the boy really a Bergdorf fairy into here, and the reason we usually get it from nymphs Chuck is because an adult tick doesn't find humans, particularly appetizer, but a nymph take will cause they're stupid. They don't know anything yet so,
as their feeding on us after somewhere may be around twenty four to thirty six hours of feeding this infected tick. That has this bacteria in it. The bacteria it will make its way from the MID got to the ticks saliva and the tick transmitted transmitted into the human bloodstream, where it just absolutely wreaked havoc on that The human body yeah- and you said something really key there. Twenty four thirty six forty eight hours later really really important. They have to be attached to you for that long, sometimes even longer to transmit this bacterium. So if you fight to take on you and you get it off, you don't need a sweat lime disease. Now turn off in due time right, exactly a feel, you see it still crawling on you, son attached, don't worry about it at all, but when it is a test and win win it when it has transmitted the bacteria what its transmitted this be Bergdorf fairy is
I really amazing at its job, which is infecting you giving you a bacterial infection, it has figured out how to zoom through the bloodstream then also take itself out of the bloodstream by latching onto this. The walls of your blood vessels. Yet this is crazy about the cellular stuff they once its attached to a cell. They said it's like us. Binkie it doesn't let go it just like based leave, reaches out and grabs the next cell without letting go of the previous cell and just sort of walks in Dover end right, never unattached itself right exactly so. As its moving along its never it it it's not gonna get kind of a war the in the extracellular matrix its stock to their cell. If it wants to be stuck to sell, it can do the same. To the blood vessel walls, to pull itself out the bloodstream and NGO attack. You no specific parts of the body,
So it is really good at hanging on that's one thing that makes it kind of pernicious and minority other thing exactly it's. Basically, it's like the bacteria version of a ticket and think about there and then another thing it does I think this is really really recent research. It can actually change its protein expression, much faster rate than the normal mutation rate for bacteria, something like fifteen times faster yeah I want, but that that just makes it really hard for our human immune system to catch up to it right Our immune system will produce any bodies based on the initial infection, but by the time the annex It is come around the this. The bacteria may have changed the itself so that the antibodies about his while recognises go right. Pass it because it doesn't, it doesn't fit the description that the anti bodies have that right and you'll know that something's
bad is happening for twelve if you find that take them. But if you get headaches, fever fatigue is a huge, huge, simple, yeah, but the real telltale. It's called e m. It's in expanding in Rash, called erythema migrants. And it's like us. It's that circular pattern, and then we did talk about this on the ticks episode, but share the circular pattern. With a what looks like a bulls I in the centre of it. Yes- and you can take off your butchers apron now cause you just. There was a beautiful put on your chest: shuts hat you're sweating over there and so on that that particular rash. That balls I rash. That is like a just an absolute telltale sign that you have a law. I'm Borealis lists bore library, Borelli uses infection, the there. Comes around in, like maybe seventy to eighty percent of cases. I think, if every if every person got that right,
ass. We would not have this this problem with I'm disease cause. It would be caught very quickly because you get there within usually about a week or less of getting infected, but it doesn't come up in all cases and with some of those other symptoms, like you said they weakness, headaches like symptoms like those could be a lot of different other things. Joint pain answered the line disease infection goes on no sir misdiagnosed in a lot of cases are did for. Many many years is just now that they're starting to kind of recognised or suspect lime, when otherwise they might not have literally hundreds of things can be can have the same symptoms is lying disease. Why has been around for a long time we'll talk about, history here in a minute, as far as the nineteen seventies go and official recognition, but it
in around round a believed: Yale School of Public health, fine, the bacteria an ancient north Erica, like sixty thousand years old right before the arrival will of humans. They they have an autopsy that fifty three, hundred year old, Mummy that had disease yeah. You know it's either Iceman. Remember him embruting. Yet I was disappointed that they refer. Durham as a fifty three hundred year old mommy, it's like now. It's easy thy. I by knows him his name, but he headline disease. He did Was a german position aim Alfred Buchwald, who described this- that E M skin rash that we, I'll call I'm disease about a hundred thirty years ago right. So so, what disease has been around a while, but we are just now seeing a huge. Again an epidemic of it
and in a massive spread of it, not just in North America, but there is also to other kinds of takes that transmit to other kinds. Of lime, causing bacteria in Europe and Asia and in all three places, North America, Europe and parts of Asia. The incidence of life diseases. Picking up at an alarming pace, I think we should slow down our pace. Take ok we'll come back and we'll talk about lime, Connecticut, ran after this stop Miles, it's me jack right here, you right next year by next to me, just like a work. Hey one join with you to tell people too
tune in to a very special episode special year of tedious that is, I guess this is actually look. I know you saw the social media Zaza, the Ellie Otto. She said what are these two juggernaut supplied casting doing there when Mazda cause me ever they say miles. We know that you're, a loyal, Mazda owner. We want to align with you because you get it yeah. You know what I am willing to answer the call and help Ding Ding help people understand the power of it. So what we did is we actually got to record of special episode inside the New Mazda six, thirty where we talked about kind of like flow states and was feeling alive and how we feel alive. What makes us feel like it was really doped actually record inside the car. I got to press a lot of buttons and make them mad, because you like, please don't fumble around in here
They set out with it out I like to explore. Nonetheless, if you actually want to check out the first ever see Ex thirty check it out at Moscow, USA, dot com, slash, Iheart or, if you're, trying to check it up, I already them pull up to the local dealership. Today all so line Connecticut. Something is very old had to you. Right brand known about it for years, lime, old lime and what that their town, no less, call it a new line it was not going to be so mad. Their highschool football team is gonna, go berserk upon old line this year in the nineteen seventy. So there were group of children and adults in these towns in Connecticut, They were having all these weird symptoms swollen need skin, rashes, headaches, others severe fatigue and
bad enough these days, but in the early nineteenth seventies, doctors were definitely not have this on the radar and were very dismissive of what was going on in these towns if it were not for the work of Judith men and Polly Murray, too regular moms, although Polly Murray, did work for the World Health Organization for awhile. They were advocates. They were patient advocates because their families were getting sick and no one would listen and there are like someone's gotta do something. Something's going on here and these Actors are not being any help right, deal. Polly ended up reading a book. She made it sort of her life's work. Nineteen. Eighty six, a book called the widening circle and because of sort of the persistent sexism and science they were large discounted, even though they had a list of thirty seven individuals they risk on their own, contacted scientist at his word.
We just really need to shout them out. Polymers died, I'm just about a month ago, age of eighty five. I was I right near yes, you is a persistent curses. They call him up in the Yankee State. That's right so on the one hand, yes from the everything I've read in all the impressions. I have, they were very much dismissed and it was very much sexist and also, I think, because they Weren'T- actors by under, on the other hand, the doctors who are being presented with these cases, really I have idea what this is so as to pretend it's not real, but luckily those too, then, in the groups that they established They went on and they contacted yea all medical school, they contacted the state and they really kind of put this other maybe said there is a mysterious epidemic. That's going where you have a lot of kids who suddenly have juvenile arthritis out of nowhere. What do you guys gonna do about it and because of their agitation, this mystery made its way to the desk, or, I guess the Mai
The scope of a guy named William Bergdorf her, and he was at the time. The world's foremost authority onwards called rocky mountain. Spotted fever, which is another tick, bore, bacterial infection. I remember that when I was a kid I was the big news item. It was this area. He was working on. Colorado in Colorado was ground. Zero for rocky Mountain spotted fever for awhile, which is You do not want to have that. It's a really bad bacterial infection, but by this time they had done thing to the leg work done by the the moms and the patient advocate groups in line Connecticut, the aid had been pretty well a stab that the common thread between all these people, besides where they lived and by the way was Chuck lime, all diamond east. Adam sorry he's had em aside from the fact that they all lived in the same region was there all then we're almost all of them recalled being bitten by a tick
in a lot of them had a mysterious rash right before the symptoms presented. So I came to this. Guy Willie Bergdorf, offers microscope because they had said there's something in the ticks here that creating this disease that we have encountered before that right and He had already discovered this bacterium called it had. He had you pronounce a spear, Chet Spiky, a play the spiral. Kid is a type of bacteria and which it does Gimme, the apron spy Chet in use made me think of the older brother chat and weird science now go make yours foreign, but what, if they ever guides area, are appeal what what they'll Paxton when he died a couple years ago, very sad, you thinking of Bill Pullman now
and I was so sad because I have just listened to his Mark Marin Interview and he was Ike after that episode, wanted nothing more than to be built accidents friend a neighbour on it. He descended like of the best guy and best family man, and he passed way way to early yeah really did not know about. Then I saw frailty not too many weeks ago. Pretty good? Was it the first viewing her No, no, I seen it before, but your movie you yeah over here oh and I believe, directed and start, and yet he was so good and I love a good powers. Booth casting call first, there was the was unusual and surprising get. It was perfect, very good under aided film. Where are we owe you Talking about Rocky mountain spot Fever, Willie Bergdorf, for identifying the spiral. Keith was causing lined with kids right spiral, Chet now remember we establish squirrels market here
so. He discovered this this parakeet and he was honoured. By this discovery and naming that thing after himself. That's why, as that interesting name, I get the impression he didn't name it after himself. They named it after him, now go on? Ok, there's a big difference between him saying these things called the Bergdorf hurry bacteria in some way saying we're gonna name this after you know. I totally agree. Ok, so Door Furry or Bergdorf her. He figures out what is the basis of lime disease, which is great this enormous breakthrough. It establishes that, yes, it is its own sing its own disease and because it was a bacterial, it was a sparky which again it's that kind of a snake like shaped bacteria, specific kind that walks like a slinky, because it was a bacterial infection. The medical establishment set up a wii
here we take some antibiotics and over. You know the course of several years, starting in the nineties, when they really started to say: ok, we can cure lime disease, especially if we catch early on buying who d for weak round of antibiotics right here you go and they said case closed where the medical establishment, let's go, have a party for ourselves, yeah and here's the thing like many times that can take care of the problem, so it's not like they were just lazy and not doing their work, but I think they closed the book a little too and a lot of people do because at that all that round of oral antibiotics if kitchen really can really work, but I think they say but like nine times out of ten, if you catch an early, then that will that will work right there, so they're, so persisting with their assertion that if you
find a tick on yourself in you. Live in an been area were lying diseases known to thrive. If you can't say how long that takes bent on you deprive it is going to give you around Evanna by adding a large electrically yeah in India, like you, said in a lot of cases and I believe from what I've read the vast majority of cases in early. So age line disease. That round of antibiotic should work yet, They say that if you- and this is from the American Monday's foundation, If you live in an endemic area, have symptoms consistent the early lime disease inspect recent exposure to Dick present your suspicion to your doctor. So they hear she may make a more informed, diagnose itself. May I see your doctor and say yeah, Madame Sir Love and present my sufficient to you, please sit down while their say and sort of still you still sort a need to be your own advocate, because it is hard to diagnose still because going on
terms alone, like we said there are lots of things that share those symptoms, and one disease may not be the first thing they think of that's a huge with lime disease. Another huge problem is that they test we used to test for line disease doesnt actually test for the bee. Bergdorf free come yeah right it tests for the antibodies that should be present in your bloodstream. If you have a bacterial infection, not even specific to that one, but a bacterial infection, the problem is it takes days, if not be a week or two before your body. Mountain, effective, immune response against this infection. So if you find a tick- and they give you a test say within the first couple days, going to come back negative, even though you very much have Bergdorf free infection. It's gonna connect negative because the antibodies haven't been created, yet the other.
The problem is even if you take a blood test that tests directly for the Bergdorf free bacterium it moves out of the bloodstream really easily in within several days, there's a very brief window of time where you can directly test for the Bergdorf free bacteria and find it in a simple blood test. Yeah, you can also get fall positives and their advocating now for two tiered testing for confirmation of the diagnosis, so forget that first positive test, sometimes now you'll get a different test. A western blot test right, that's gonna, really get more specific to that anti body, not just the general anybody's rights of part of the other problem is, They are what what the reason a lot of patient activists impatient advocate groups say no doctor,
you're wrong, like this is not good enough- is that there is a sneaking suspicion among people who have woods called chronic lime or post treatment line disease syndrome is that the round of antibiotics, the two to four. We crown of antibiotics that seemingly cured the line disease symptoms You had actually failed to full knock out. The bacteria that created this infection, this created this line disease in the first place. It is burrowed further in your body and because the medical establishment said we got it. It's fine, you're these antibiotics cured it and didn't go deeper, that that bacterial infection is allowed to fester and then present in worse ways later. Yeah, it's a really big deal because we know what will happen as they'll say your cured. We, These antibiotics, they worked but weeks HANS and even years later, when people have persistent fatigue
and muscle lakes and headaches. You know like your knee joints, heard they said like a brain. Can happen. These are all things at her and was a generic. But if you walk in your doctor and say I feel like a fuzzy and have a brain fog and gonna get headaches and I'm tired sort of a wide it's hard to pinpoint what's going on here and there and they Your cured the line disease. So that's where some of the more dismissive, at least from the line disease community there saying like I have this chronic get you there saying no there's, no such thing as a chronic issue. Were there also saying like look? We gave you a test for line disease in. You came back negative right now. We know you had it before we tested. You became back positive. Treated with antibiotics. Now we tested you again and it's coming back, negative. You dont have lime disease anymore. So is a huge debate, whether there, the Anna
of course, is not enough in the line. Diseases is persisting elsewhere in the body and that may be its changed its form so that it won't show up on the tests like it. Good or theirs, In summary, I saw one one article that suggested: that The cell wall, from the spiral keep the Bergdorf spiral key can remain even after the things dead, right and persistent like joint tissue and cause, an immune response there, which would explain this long term. Arthritis is like a pole, tree Midline disease syndrome symptom there or is it that it converts into entirely different disease, like an auto immune disorder- yes, some people think It could trigger an auto immune response and the actions gone, and this is what happening later on is- is had this auto immune response, it can lead to other things like rheumatic heart disease ass, I think we'd to recover,
Turkey on bare syndrome or just talk about it in different episodes. I we ve talked about and I think, a firmer Kirklees Gay Bari give can, you remember I'm pretty sure here we could both be were in April. For this one will split it up. I get over half he. I get the top half unfortunate taken in the right of its cover, my bits down there, but regardless of of what's happening, what people know is is that they don't feel right and it's extremely frustrating to to feel these symptoms months and years later and not be taken seriously in a doctor's office. Yet so a lot of forcing the wee wee these this course. Nobody should be two to four weeks. It should be many months right,
Can you really need to get all of the the spire keep out of their or else it's going to persist in you're, gonna have big problems and in the medical establishments saying like this, where you're talking my doesn't even exists. So there's a lot of frustration that you're saying a big disconnect, and this is something that is probably going to keep playing out, although it seems like it may be on its way out because of the epidemic proportions. Lime is taking now in the United States, yet mean this statistics are mounting up that can be ignored any longer, not that it was ignored. But you know it was probably a harsh statement, but its being taken way more seriously. Now, yes, something like there's an expectation that there's going to be something like three hundred to four hundred thousand. Wasn't new cases of lime, disease in the United States alone and that tented one per cent of those patients will end up with chronic climbed disease.
Yeah I mean I spent a fair amount of time, hiking around the woods with my dogs and had pulled plenty itself of them and the ethics of myself, and I have fatigue alight because every four year old and every now and then and like you, I have learnt its will, only nine years. Why? While never had the bulls, I first of all: ok, that's a big one, but also the ticks you pull off your dog vizir dog takes. They do not transmit lime. It specifically the long late or black legged tick, which is a type of deer tick. Well, but here's the thing there are plenty of deer, Six in the woods. Are you saying that they, if they were. Latch onto a dog and maybe like you know, I don't know, I don't know dear, takes all over the woods sure there definitely are I don't know if, if dear takes, will lead
and do a dog that's entirely possibly wants. Is there such a differentiation between dog takes in dear takes, but I do know that dog tags don't transmit lime. Well, I think we should talk about. My favorite thing from the ticks episode- and this is one I will lay on people from time to time. Is remember how ticks attach themselves sure Just hang out on blades of grass and things and just snap, their little clause constantly just waiting for something that by? Yet these Indians latch on to break the, since the ceo, too, and of the mammal, that's walking past so interesting and Chuck. One thing I read is that somehow the lime lime infected ticks because their infected them lime resides as in like small mammals and rodents as a right. The war year they their infected, but they don't have symptoms, tick, skin infected with the stuff in there just passing along ensure like there, the ultimate source of
of lime does. He know, takes her misunderstood the really great, but from what I saw, the texts that are infected with the line bacteria are actually better at finding host. The nine infected takes like it somehow enables them to be better parasites, miss interesting yet since familiar to we cover that or do I just know that I don't I don't remember, but I do I remember you talking about in the ticks episode about how they waved their arms in the here we passed by, and I remember one of our listeners made some art of that. We gotta find it that's right and from snapping their little fingers on a blade of grass to my dogs, but to my scrotum, quite of squatter ride the wild eyed and then to Emily eventually blocking that thing out. For me, that's nice! That's what marriage Zol about folks ages? Have you forearm thrusts across your eyes. You get out get out.
So, what's he gonna break? Ok, we'll talk a little bit about prevention and then a little bit about two very recent interesting wacky. Things going on in Congress about my disease as a buyer weapon, ok hey there, it's Jonathan Strickland from tech stuff be sure to tune in to a very special episode of text. That was recorded inside Mazda, see Ex thirty at the Ellie Auto show. Where I discuss, all the ins and outs of human centric design, while you're listening be sure to check out the first ever see Ex thirty at Mazda who s a dot com, slash, Iheart or better. Yet to see the entire MA
the vehicle lineup visit, your local, Yo Mazda dealer. Today, Okey Dokey talked about prevention. How do you keep from having to have a tick pulled from your crotch? Don't Go into mother nature, just stay in your midst, three modern home with tiled floors and dont go into the woods sounds delicious. I loved the woods you let the woods right. I love watching the woods on television, the from your midcentury no idea. I love the woods myself here than just getting getting words, but either way. Come in things like deed? I don't use that stuff. My own body, but some people will say, put all over your body and put it on your clothes and put it on your socks and choosing to swap on spring
out of it around you constantly why you're in the voice? What I do is I just checked: Vertex yeah a good thing to do seriously. It looks super doorkeeper. What do you care The talk here panel, eggs and near sock, yeah sure, wind and then, when you come out like where light colors to kiss, you can see that takes a lot more easily and then, when you, when you come out of the woods, take your clothes off and take a shower assumes. You can induce inspect yourself inspector growing. Your arm pits your scalp part of the problem with lime disease. Those remember you get it from temps data from takes in the nymphs stage. Which are really really small. So you gotta check really really well to see if you have that take on you yeah, just while you're at it take off the adult, takes as well yeah. Don't leave us in check your dog no check your dogs under their haunches, like an arm
pit of their legs, whatever that's called they're like bits. Behind your ears check under their collars cause takes, are trying to You know they're, not gonna, hang out just like on the top of their back. They may start there. You're going to try and find a place. That's dark and warm, and out of that of the yeah, I don't mean to say you can't get line disease from an adult chuck. It's just that the nymphs are for more likely to lead on a human than an adult is, but an lime infected, adult tick will transmit you're lying to you to get her very Fort distinction? So now we move on to the? U S Congress, recently about a month ago and in July Yet there was a: U House, Rep unnamed Christmas Republic of New Jersey who introduce legislation That said Hey Department of Defense. You should review these claims. I'm seeing that our own Pentagon researched using ticks to spare
I'm diseases by a weapon in the mid twenty assent, We ran a lot about this works in article that we did research on plum, island and we we in other insects to not just takes turning them into by weapons in this thing past and a lot of this comes from a book written by Chris Newbie called Bitten, Colin, the secret history of lime, disease and and biological weapons, and this book, like I think her Chris Miss the representative from New Jersey said, like this book, really inspired me to take up the legislation, but in the book newbie basically says the gun. And at four Dietrich Maryland and employ mile in New York before it was turned into an animal disease research centre doing there was an insect disease research venerable right. I guess they were They were looking into that, while they ve they definitely doing by a warfare research there
fairly early nineteen fifties by them for Dietrich into however long either not still doing it now by the em they they were currently looking into ticks as delivery systems for I logical weapon here I'd. I couldn't that is actually verified, but I find that highly believable, but why newbie is saying? Is they doing that research and then way. We got line diseases, whatever research they were coming up with escaped, say, a tick attached to a bird that flew off of plumbing. When in landed in the area around Lime Connecticut, and these ticks got Often they started to breed and they ate. They became endemic in this area, and that's where line disease came from. There was actually a biological weapons that was produced in then,
a vertically, probably not purposefully released into the larger population in the northeast. Yes, oh here's. My question, I have read the book. But are they saying that that we created lime disease or that just weapon Ized it the two very different things I'd I dont know if she saying either and I think she stopped short of saying that, but that its implied that if you put two and two together government is looking into biological warfare and they were talking about. You know using ticks at some point, and you know that's really close to the ground, zero of where the tick epidemic began. You put two and two together. That's the impression I have is that she didn't actually come out and say it, but that she likes the reader surmise for themselves, which is the problem. Well, I mean that's very easy to
to disprove, if she's actually claiming that they created line disease because we just got there saying There was then, who is the the Mummy Itsy? It was their duty, over a hundred years ago over in the Alps? Well true, but it also in the United States mean it came around. We first discovered that in seventies and, like several differently is it wasn't just lime Connecticut. They found in California right and you can't just there just doesn't add up that it will be popping up and all these random places if it escaped from long, sound and nineteen fifty three right, which I think somebody who subscribe to this conspiracy. Therein is very much what it is as a conspiracy theory,
that will then they release wasn't purpose or accidental, whose purposeful they spread it around. The northeast, California and then spoons was counts in which supposedly right is the actual place where the first case of lime disease was described in the United States in nineteen sixty nine year about six years before this cluster of Juvenile arthritis cases popped up in online Lyman EAST had him was a very bad idea, if that's what went on because you have to depend on a lot of things, which is a these takes, and only finding their way to the enemy B. They attach to the enemy successfully and transmit the disease and then what that transmit a very slow acting disease. That will give people headaches and fatigue over the course of long time right that also pretty
since a one of a kind, telltale rash right that tells you suppose plenty of time that you have this this disease that needs to be treated with A simple course of Orleans Bioethics yeah has to be probably in the country there. Not they dont thrive well in the city right, so just it doesn't make a good biological weapons now again. People who subscribe to a conspiracy theory say well, they can all be winners but maybe it was just something they were experimental within. It wasn't very good trust me. I mean we ve done enough research on stuff, our american governments to do, and we will continue to do that. It's not that outlandish thing in the world know it's not, and thus also why Chris Smith, the representative from New Jersey, should just be dismissed out of hand because its re entirely plausible. It's it's not just go completely
echo idea right. The other reason Christmas shouldn't be dismissed out of hand is because he is a true lime warrior. He introduced other legislation called the Tick ACT and, of course, he had to make tick anachronism that an acronym that in an opposite were dead, ticks colon idea. Five control a knockout act. He was really grasp like a take on a blade of grass with that one, but the devil is? But now it's not one word analyses. It is knock out more that's what he's saying. No yes, this is really what goes back, but it would create different. One hundred and eighty million dollars in federal funding for Line disease research, sorely needed rain Adasa, I did know you're such an advocate. That's good here is he hates lime? Disease, like like blot husband, say something, but I wish
you take a pill that would it broke up my analogy region in my brain, oh you're, analogies are great. What were you gonna say I wanna? We can keep it out. Hurried who's, gonna, get political who's, gonna say he hates takes like he hates me. Ok! Can we leave that in bleep it? I will find out there it so the whole idea of it by a weapon almost certainly not the case right, but it makes for a good press. I mean like, if you look at like lime, disease and by a weapon. There is a lot of recent articles written on it just because a member of Congress introduced this legislation. Well, it's a lot of people are are saying, is look. It makes sense like this conspiracy theory that people would go to that, but on the same
same time. There's another really great explanation for it and its climate change that this whole thing came about in the seventies because we're starting to see what was called the first epidemic. Climate change- and this is really great article and on which is a great website by Mary, Beth Pfeiffer, spells like Michel Pfeiffer, the p called ticks rising and she's, a investigative reporter science journalists to really to a lot of trouble to explain how climate change has created a new world for ticks and we are now living in it yeah. I mean in two thousand. Fourteen the EPA actually started to use for new indicators about what's going on of crime, changing the impact and why of them was the spread of lime disease. So right, like the EPA officially uses that, as a factor
in an indicator in determining the impact of climate change. Now, right and so hold the whole basis of this idea is that because warmer whether ticks are being killed. Often far fewer hers from over the winner, so their surviving longer there as it gets warmer warmer higher and higher up their range spreading rather rapidly higher and wherever these ticks Oh lime diseases game to go with them, so the spread of I'm diseases is increasing, as the spread of ticks is increasing too and takes have gotten, totally out of hand in some areas, in that a on article, maybe Pfeiffer, was talk about how moose are dying in their thousands in like Wisconsin and the decoders, because their being bled to death by a hundred thousand ticks at once,
it's amazing that never happened before and now all of a sudden, it's kind of becoming routine, because the ticks aren't I not in the winter like they're supposed to again it's because of climate change. And then in the northeast Chuck what the reasons why tick population been this explosion of day, because there's been an explosion of, and there were tick population our minds and our predators. It would help control the deer Mountain lions and suggesting predators wolves would help control the it. It involves to help control the dear population, oh suggesting reintroducing wolves to help control the dear population. Oh yeah, you can bet, that's gonna happen! No early! No, I mean, do you think so, yet totally I have three hundred thousand people a year coming down with lime in the United States, they're gonna, start area reducing wolves still to come, if it has even a half of a chance to be interested to see, if that happens, for sure, because humans are gonna want to hunt those wolves
it is bringing it out in us for some reason. I well I mean they hunted the Mount minds right, but I think that The idea of of oh wait a minute really weird in security bad things happen. When we over Hunt mountain lies and wolves, maybe when we reintroduce some we won't have to you know where we won't follow that impossible. Just let nature take its course right. Who knows you got anything else. Man, I got nothing So there is a solution around of antibiotics in some wolves narrow cure. What ails us advocating yourself still people should be it in the wolves, see persistent skidding vice for everything. Chuck agreed almost everything there, certainly cases where persistence is not a good idea
You know what I'm saying I I do now. Ok, if you want to know more about line disease, go check out. All of the articles. Read in again go check out the a on article by Mobile Pfeiffer. It's really interesting and since I say it's interesting, that means it's time for listener mail. I recall this need story about how great the patient was. Her, sir, well, I think from Portland Main, hey guys. My wife daughter and I asked the was just four years decided last minute by it gets to the show. Well, occasion at Old Orchard, beach main just ashore, Dr South of Portland. I we had nose its naturally, because we wait until just an hour before Showtime that was more than coal by us. We are totally stowed just to be their whatever the seats when we got to How can you see it's? A friendly fell on a man approached us said he had three tickets were orchestra seats and asked if we like them are intended for friends of his who
duck and labour day week in traffic could make it to the show turns out. He had been sky. Putting the crowd for forty minutes looking for but three, even enlisting the help of the ushers to find three people together. We were the first group that he saw a brief downstairs, and there we were three rose from the stage for these supremely select show about podcast topic predicted thanks to madness in friends being stuck in traffic, and for not having tickets an hour before Showtime to having third row. Ten minutes before you guys took stage, we considered it a pink little piece of true magic, So I am confident this lengthy set up in telling you the story is way too for the air. No, not true Richard Clark. The whole family would be for grateful if you could give Matt and the Connecticut Grounds keeper a huge thank you, Rich Susan and Emily and update for sharing the seats with us, those fantastic and love
shows man. It's great people are so kind, and that is from Richard Clark, not Declercq, but Rich Clark, us even better the clerks taken. That's right! Thank it for rich card for recognising that thanks for coming to the show, rich and bringing the family, and thank you man for being such a cool. Do those very nice of you, utterly unsurprising, because our fans are pretty great people. Yes, Ok! Well, if you want to get in touch with us, you can go on to serve. You should know dot com and you can send us tweet or instead pose you're a commoner. What have you that kind of thing? Because all social links with their or you can just do it. The old fast, way, send an email, wrap it up. Spanking the bottom and sent it off to stuff progress. It I hurt. Radio dotcom study should know is production. I hurt. Radios has to have works from what had cast my radio is, I Iheartradio radio Apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite.
Hello, I'm rainbow valentine and for the past year. My dad coming clean to me about his decades long careers, a big time, pot smuggler my it wasn't the most organised criminals, he once lost half a million dollars varied in the backyard. How how my dad was a pot smuggler for twenty two years and at what cost I'm rainbow Valentine for my her radio and school of humans. This is disorganized. Crime listened, organised crime smugglers, daughter on the I hurt, radio, app apple podcast or wherever you get. Your pod casts
Transcript generated on 2019-12-30.