Hey did you know, there's a place ring it, although it is true Krim headlines five days a week called sorting scale daily and its hosted by me Right Williams, Maneater Friday, we break down all the craziest case is going on in the country in a round the globe. If you weren't notes going on before everyone talking about it subscriber sorted scale daily on Apple podcast, Spotify Sticker tune in or anywhere he was near podcast and stay safe. Hoddan scale contains adult themes and violence and is not intended for all audiences. Listen discretion is advice.

Remember someone started screaming and at one point, I heard like us, and then the screaming start. This is sword and scale episode. One. Sixteen a show that reveals that the worst monsters are real,

hey, don't let the music full. We got a bad one. Coming I mean probably not of the stirring the mom brands variety, but still pretty bad. You see a lot of the stores we tell here are pretty predictable lot of where's quarrels or issues with money or just some sort of extreme mental illness. That's been untreated. This one is arguably much more horrifying because its

There's none of those things. It's just a random senseless, incredibly violent act club. Let me not give away the story, listen for yourself and hopefully you're not alone. Tonight we ve all heard that tis before we know that the A majority of murder victims have some sort of connection to their killers. Maybe it's a coworker, an ex lover, a relative or a spouse, These are the stories that we have become accustomed to hearing, but what about the rest bout, the small percentage of murders carried out at the hands of strangers cases in which a killer takes another life, not

of anger, passion or revenge, but simply for the thrill of it on the evening of Saturday October. Third, two thousand nine forty two Old Kimberly Cates was home alone with her eleven year old, daughter, Jamie David Cates, Kim's husband and Jamie's. Father was away business for the weekend. Who is my daughter case? It is, she only child. She is It is now Jamie's twelve always be back in October. Two thousand she was eleven who is Jamie, smaller Kimberly, Cates homeless, tucked away in the thick forest of Mont Vernon New Hampshire

although it was only a couple of miles from town Cates Home was almost completely secluded situated on a quiet. Half my along dirt road that was line tall trees on both sides. Were you lose face? and road map morning, along with their two thousand and four you might be familiar with Mount Vernon Virginia. The birthplace of George Washington, Or maybe you live next to some other city called Mount Vernon, of which there are many you ve, probably never heard of Mount Vernon New Hampshire MA Vernon. Is a small town with a population of around twenty four hundred? It's there and of place where everyone knows everyone, and up until two thousand nine community members felt like Mount Vernon was immune to the types of crime and violence that affected larger towns and cities. Many course didn't even feel the need to lock their doors at night came in David Cates

being lived in Tucson and Baltimore before settling down in MILAN Vernon Warrant, quite as true thing as some of their neighbors? They prefer to keep their door's locked alarm system in Europe. Was one in the house. Is that something that you and your wife or use we used for a very brief period of time. Two or three years ago they split the short in the system and we couldn't get it working. Was it working in October, two thousand and nine. It was not according to the Austin Globe, came and made up act with our next door, neighbor to keep an eye out for each other, that neighbour would later state. We always thought that it anything happened. Read here because we're right next door but Saturday, night, Kim's neighbour, didn't hear a thing. Newer way. Was it unusual for Kim and Jamie to sleep in the same room together not unusual at all.

What a remedy to sleep in the master bedroom I was. There slightly ass. It was he said this just for the record when's. The last time you communicated with Kimberly Cates on the weekend of October fourth Saturday night, sometimes checking in with David Kim and Jamie fell asleep together in the master bedroom point during the night came on by the sound of some one. Moving around inside the home got up and said Jamie shortly after four. I am on Sunday October forth now heard. Police sergeant, David Furlong was despatched to the case residence on trial, road The Milford Area Communication Centre had received a nine when one call, because,

were unable to establish communication with the collar. The car was despatched as a possible home invasion sergeant first called a partner for back up as it was unclear? Whether or not the home invasion was still. Progress, but he was the first stop us or to arrive at the house on trial. Road sergeant, Furlong parked got out of his vehicle and walked towards the residence He would later report the following, my cruiser up and exited. In order to approach the house with no light I hurried to the left side of the driveway and attempted to look through the front window. The front window is a series of windows showing the kitchen This is the window that was lit up from inside there's a small evergreen tree near the window, and the tree was on my left. As I looked inside. As I looked inside, I saw a child lift her head from behind the counter. I observe

that her head was completely drenched in blood, but was moving side to side, I immediately radio that I observed lots of blood and needed an ambulance immediately. I stated I would be gaining entry to the House, I tried the front door and found it to be locked. I now Milford Police Department and then attempted to kick the door in two times while announcing myself, but it did not move at all by then shoulders the door and heard the door frame crack I then shouldered the door again and gained access to the home meat, the after going through the door, I observed a young female to my left. Young female

Eleven year old, Jamie Cates, I observed tat the little girl I'm lying on the floor. They stay in a pool of blood. He observed the shoe is just try me out. However, nothing was coming out of a sword. For a long approached Jamie You could see that she was severely injured, just a laceration to her face. Her extremities observed that she was barefoot. I observe that part of her foot was completely missing. My observe that another part of her foot was just barely connected,

for a long finally got close enough to make out what Jimmy was trying to say to him last racial running from her cheek down to her neck prevented her from speaking above a whisper. I got close to her. I told her that I was a police officer. I was there to help. She then set in a whisper while shaving shaking ass. She thought her money was dead, sergeant, Furlong carried Jamie outside and re entered the house. He would later report the following. I then re entered the home with my flashlight and firearm crime. I was looking for additional victims as well as suspects I took right and travelled down the hallway announcing my presence, I continued to see blood on the floor. I approached a large bedroom at the end of the hallway Upon entering the room, I saw a sliding glass door to my left had been shattered and there was a piece of furniture through it. I searched the room and checked the bed.

Promoting the bed. I observed a female lying on her back with her head near the headboard observed, but she was nude below the waste. I continued to announce myself can approached her head while still scanning my surroundings observed that she had major trauma on her head and she was deceased, so she died as a result of these multiple sharp injuries that affected or end her neck for torso. Her left arm in are left leg. So, to be clear, wasn't just one case of the combination of many many wounds and obviously some are very superficial, and if she had only sustain those, then she she would have survive, but there are several their fair perforating vital organs transacting in severing major vessels that would have contributed to this loss of blood and loss of organ function. Thirty, two: it off! You lie! Yes, they are all causing. Oh, it's called a vital reaction, so bleeding in the tissues surrounding the wound, internal bleeding. They look very different from from loans I make. When I do a post mortem examination, I use a scalpel. I dont see the same tissue reaction when I make my incision she's alive, all thought yes, meanwhile office,

Eric whales had arrived on scene officer, wills would later report the following. I parked and could see. The front door had been broken open, Wheatley ran across the lawn toward the broken front door. As I approached noticed: a young girl sitting upright with their legs, crossed on the walkway noticed that she had several large lasserate he had several large lacerations throughout her body, I sergeant fur, along with my findings, and he told me to stay with her and give any medical treatment that I could. I look for her body for the most severe injury and noticed a golf ball. As laceration on her head aspiration that went from about her left or to her left shoulder allow duration on her right. Versailles that went from front to back. The inside of her foot appeared to be shaved off and what appeared to be her big toe. Was pointing towards her heel and appeared to be detached.

A small thread of skin, none, lacerations appeared to be bleeding out at this time, so I placed gauze pads over her foot. Ganz speaking with her asked her what her name was, and she said Jamie. I told her that I was going to be taken care of until the ambulance arrived, I asked her guys happened. The she said that those guys in the house. One of them had a knife and the other one had a bad me hit. My mom, the weapon that appeared to Jamie to be a baseball bat would actually turn out to be machete, while Intruders, continued, attacking or mom Jamie lay on the floor, pretending to be dead so that they here again. Why they were there She told me that she heard one of them say get the jewelry. An ambulance arrived and Jamie was rushed to the hospital. He had been staff and hacked from head to toe. Skull and elbow were fractured. Her love was punctured and

big toe had to be amputated. Your pediatric surgeon at Boston. Children's hospital would later state that in over few decades of practice he had retreated a child with so many stab and slash wounds, but somehow Jamie survived today. I understand that she's out of surgery. She remains in the intensive care unit in stable condition. Does appear that her injuries and life threatening, but that is by any means to minimize the severity of the attack on her as well. At some point, on the morning of the attack state troopers contacted David Kay, to tell him that his wife had been killed and that his daughter was in the hospital How did you find out that weekend that Kim and Jamie have been attacked in your home I got a phone call from this. Troopers on Sunday morning. What did you do? What you get that I immediately changed my flight and

came home. When you got home, did you get more details about what happened to Kim and Jamie actually in the airport. While I was waiting on my flight, I got some more details about what occurred. Investigators were already trying to piece together a possible motive for the attack someone afterwards. He told his eyes. Yes did something to say please, Show you. I asked yes by different and this was a burglary, but this was now an ordinary, burglary The sheer level of violence discovered at the crime scene suggested two investigators that theft was, the only motive that Jamie and Kim were now viciously attacked over a mere handful of jewelry. It was clear that whoever, broke into their home? That night was prepared to kill anyone? might be inside.

In the day, following the murder seventeen years Stephen spatter nineteen Christopher Griddle, eighteen Billy marks and seventeen year Old Quinn Glover would be play under arrest in connection with the home invasion and murder, here too, the arrest prison, The gravel who goes by Chris had participated in marathon interrogation that lasted more than seven hours staring into just having would argue about Is there a young girl is the newspaper in what they say they have stable my getting anything from she's.

Oh my gosh die too she's awaken perfectly happy, go lucky surfer. Another doubted for carbon assumed somebody specifically tried to tell them that robs against my conscience. Personally, Angelos Tavern, gentlemanly chivalry, soda guys you going ahead. Girls are treated badly if the girl in the hospital obviously injures registration, because I won't let you know she is going to survive. Fortunately, there is real good because it is good, because he deserves to be alive, saw this he s body, but is good

good, because I hate to people s worthy thirty, also, less polluting Chris lived in Brookline New Hampshire, which is about a twenty minute, Dr South of case home in modern and on the after of Monday October fifth, state trooper, John Incarnates, YO and Jeff. Our Dini had found Chris hanging out at the home of his friend Stephen spade the boy. Reportedly told the state troopers that they were about to go, find some job applications. This curious to the troopers, because Chris was dead. In camouflage and carrying for Pocket knives Chris handed over his knives and voluntarily agreed to participate. Interview at the state police Barracks in Milford. What were you all

if you say so, stop letting her brow was turning my suggest, ok, servicing they were in the house when they were attacked. Will you do to your could usefully Saturday night, so they're, probably watching tv or something of that work? Will you take the two people were to our house? I don't know. As possible. They were It was like a robbery wrong. I guess you could say was a robbery gone wrong, one of tat, little girl seriously injured What would you think people

The problem is altogether. They don't always present visibly debt alleviation. I honestly don't know politics on the death penalty, because without I dont know, if we have the death penalty is what can happen and would like to see. How do you think we could be fair to say that these two people want in the house and killed and injured a little girl we officially with which you are assuming that thing intentionally tat? They were in the house also serving a rotten hasn't interest or in Africa I'll say they should probably at least goaded present arise. The size of the death penalty. After I probably wouldn't

really goes so a woman in general, the little girl for ten years, or so. I hope that the summit, a library priests, insists that he had nothing to do with the attack in mud, Vernon, undeterred the interrogators start to apply pressure. Bringing his friend Stephen spade her into the equation: do escape you, opposition of pre, very predicament, Would you stop one over? You fall. I will deal with the consequences later. I would definitely stoppin because I'll put up with stuff

If he's gonna smoke, cigarettes is almost eighteen out of her fathers Vulcan cigarettes, so yeah we're not talking broken beer, urinary, Hawkins serious! Stop your job, you're very smart person. He said Tat was will you listen was come now your mouth, you very slight and intelligent person, but I dont think you really get the big picture. You were here for reason. Ok, use yeah? minimizing things- don't talk about smoking cigarettes, we're talking about a homicide here there is it dead woman, and there is a little girl seriously, injured, you're talking about cigarettes, You know what the other guys and talking about you're. Not

in about cigarettes. So you better start thinking really high ahead. Are you behind and start tell us what happened on Saturday night, because if you are looking very good for you right now, there's a train coming down the track you around the track. You see what I'm going to give this story. Doesn't you guys are telling us something? Different people asked about something different to what you are telling us This was a sweet. I should also like this was so they like. It is one day right now. There should be no question in your mind what you did just follow drugs, you'll break Yet no reason to have this matter laws,

don't put anything toward her memory and was its. Let's take a deep breath, about what have they said? You got over there, the start from their what happens Christoph. You're crazy? That's the story you, while leaving our electors You expect Jack and I too believe guy. Investigate sized cities seventeen years. Alarm was that you were CSI it all that stuff works. You watch the police shows how we talk to different people. We talked different suspects and we bring people in, and one person says something a little southern, not a person says a little something different people They differ things. We could I face together You are no doubt aware that why him too,

but I think I do what you think you did it don't matter which I think you did time what she did. Ok, the young man and tell me what you did for hours, Chris denies being at the gates home on the night of the attack, claiming that he just driving around having fun with his friends the interrogators talk Chris, that his friend were telling them a different story. In response, Chris eventually says if you evidence you'd be, Asking me right now. If you really had something from them, even that's enough to charge me. And you're not arresting me, so I think you're, bullshitting me and telling me that my friends are, writing me out, but as the interview continues, Christy to worry that in Two gaiters might actually have some solid evidence against him. I was starting to. Your kind alike.

Things they said when I was time I didn't have anything to do with it. Some of them and can accuse me into somebody saying something they mention things that sent me off that there's something you can infer from a crime scene that I could. I could tell them. Infer from it. There are some things that I knew were lies that I heard them say and there are other things that hid away to close the mark that they couldn't no without somebody thanks, like home Billy had not been able to get out of the basement. That That's something you can't infer from the crime scene. To my mind other things they mentioned something about. Did we go and bury something that specifically hit me- and I was thinking about that, while John was here in the room during that break, because as I remembered only Mean Steve, knew that we buried weapons and if he was Things then they could have everything.

So I didn't really matter at that point. Nose like once again the death penalty in this all be over with anyone so be like, you're, killing myself so when I was kind of like John one, don't you get you tape recorder, and he came back- and he was all excited typical- back in and that's when I told them exactly pretty much. The same way told to hear I mean he asked a bunch questions about a specific details and he wanted to go back over and strange laid out. Everything happened, form gets, are increasing their growth. Ok, trooper and car nausea reads Chris

his Miranda rights again and then they get started again. Just wouldn t you disgust tat. It was his version. Stephen Ursula over this is technically repulsed by psychologists declaration. There should be a paper especially case in the top. You're a black dress, her that says as much Is it too That was the earlier today. Excuse me.

Stephen, I have very little time crystals, interrogators that he'd lost touch with Steve for awhile, They'd recently become re acquainted through the Eagle Scouts leading up to the night of the Mont Vernon Attack Chris claim that they had been committing. Burglaries together on a reg, or basis with a week, or so it has three eggs with a camera desperate Leslie Lester before him. So we re until they were church you busted the door, we would run the stuff enjoy. Big celebration workable? Sobering possible place belonged to him

did you do that Stephen Contiguous enjoy from a small things. They said they were to go to school. She changed your mind so his breast, I was wrong, but I felt a little than resources, her joy to them However We decided that we were so long with me, to get jobs the true robbery actually gonna break and persons, We wonder how you do it. Saturday morning when I was with Steve. I already planned on being my girlfriend her brothers birthday party and saw he told

I believe that those whose somehow The reason nowhere after he told Chris He and Billy had picked out a house to target in mud, Vernon Steve. Let Chris know that this, wasn't just going to be another burglary this year, which is perhaps Mr Davies. There have so far Chris didn't have any complaints about Steve's plan to, in his words, go in grab some stuff and if any bodies in their kill em have some fun I agreed to do so. Goodnight Billy was in our till. He was off why we all have partners surely that my father own celebrations

fisheries. I brought it loses boys get up now the street recital she's one simply Another case they could go on about such as that. He was gonna, be Ilona too. And Steve met up with their friends, Billy Marks and Queen Glover before Drive, out to the house, they decided to target a fifth friend, nineteen year old Autumn Savoy had allegedly agreed to provide an alibi for the group if needed One of cover story said we get there. Whenever we told him, you were there for that time when the hostilities and was wasted, it is the

large with we were not able to do this because you didn't look like home. Keep in mind and it was already well after midnight, meaning and have been easy to tell if anyone was home. It seems more likely that they simply didn't care whether anyone was home to hurt every word that in a bulldozer tax we buy something. I was I jumped up the road to them. The other houses driver who still crossing the backyard recalled house waiting for them to get there

we will ensure that entry point noise systems with all the doors will we finally found one piece: we thought we were going to get it out, black and chemicals is to cut the screens try to cut nobody ended up working class, only the first step or two We basically dust in the window of the glass, but I managed to break it off down the hill others. On top, because otherwise so fine, so I started writing Billy Billy Was the smallest of the four so they had him slide in through the window. First, with the idea that he would open the door and let the other three in return.

The door was locked pushed on, and so he was still they simply return get around The idea was to take the side of the panels, are outside the official Steve I helped him getting to speed up is called him. We wish to go back to the red one screen. Ok, Had we study the whole time like this school Looking around, The boxes all workers in the front door, closer brackish, went in power. We got Billy observation that he was retorted.

We wish you every surrounding returned to be fast. Returned as to whether or not anyone was home. The group continued one of the girls still unsure as to whether or not any one was home. The group can, you'd searching the house using Ipod, as flashlight to his master bedroom. My report is alive stiff illusory. I heard the voices Stephen was enough, Honey Billy were offered the internet, Wednesday? That has to be said that there are people, but we thought he said: there's no people restart relaxing

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Oh code sword for ten dollars off any order of fifteen dollars or more for new diners, so damn The grub up app today and use promo code sword to enjoy the restaurants. You love delivered. During the early morning, hours of October. Fourth, she thousand nine Crystal and Stephen Speeder, along with their friends, Billy marks inclined clever. Into a random home in Mud Vernon. They swim duff all the breakers and began to search the house, Steve shined, an ipod in the master bedroom came Cates Her daughter, Jamie, woke up set of fleeing the scene Chris, Steve went into the room Chris with a knife and Steve with a machete quince. Outside the bedroom door. Listening

did you hear only noises? Yes, I did What noises did you hear coming from their bedroom? at first a voice said. Jamie is ideal. Response, voice, said he, I mom after that, there are screams cries for help. What other noises did you hear, Mr Glover, for and thoughts Billy remained outside the bedroom as well. Watching he, stood in the doorway, You watch the both attacked. Those, yes did. You was once I saw nothing try and help long overdue once during, tip confession the next day Chris would provide the following account of what took place inside

the bedroom soon asked what was the wrong question is in turn on the she did Steve started hacking. Usually they started. They heard something MR mostly, but I heard a headlong inside buildings daughter a few times measures only two or three fishes three. She said Steve, adjust hacking away. He totally lost it. Controls, but I do feel I thought I was gonna do when they stay by the door. I didn't do anything honesty everything the girl jumped off, I'm so stupid, aren't gonna jump

her mother was hacking away. She jumped right in my eyes, I started was towards the face and I felt the nice give off, and then I went for the front surrounded from Right Chester. Twitter is, I could get a better shouted heard, is automatic baby I started We back is Sweden around. The glass door head, start kinds of issues, probably toast amongst the gurgles breeding deeply stages, as actually gonna scare him he's got hacking into then had done its work,

The girl couple times? Still: taboos, and then hit in the head that preceded it he asked his eyes: Davis Woozy. I could tell Turning to the sharing of distinct relaxes fleets, Chris his breathing Hard good sense to bring this back. Norms, obviously not related pressure wasn't going to there is at least one flashed across the more space than from the tablet goodbye he right densities. Shutting there, I was still have to cover mortar.

But you still breathing over there. Sure artery, gone to establish the girl. I haven't solely according to Quinn Wednesday, and Chris exited. The room Steve told him that he the mother and daughter were dead. He said that we may enough noise, because two people are dead. You said the two, He bore dead yet and that's after he came out of the bedroom. Again, I wasn't machete Covered in London, hair done what he had witnessed. Billy I believe that both Kim and Jamie had been killed. You think people woman. Another girl rely on but they were dead. What did you do That was done

We started looking for us to take stock to steal. Yes, you are that yet, who is looking around the steel critical of lemon. What are you guys doing? Looking to yours, looking do Looking into a to remarks just infrastructure, steel, you asked to do anything you. Yes, we must do to find a yes for two, see what was going on. Told you Kostroma. Did he say Yes, yes of the treasure. Would you give it to you the two Chris grammar you have him, look for the jury. Yes, Chris estimates that the group

spent about twenty two thirty minutes in the home before leaving just before we go out has yet to receive assistance along by the door. It had died. The group drove away and placed their bloody close into a trash bag Chris Steve, dropped, Quinn and Billy off and then went over to their friend autumn's house. To make sure he was still willing to provide an alibi was ready to give the alibi his place. That's six thirty! We were gonna very great idea through traffic. We threw down. Don't you just tell me, there's a slave

that's what I'm gonna carry the day. We have always done trail, tossing the river didn't say so disappointed Both the jury boxes, one step closer. Like it was worth it. It's worth pointing out that they didn't all of the evidence into the Nashua River. They saved the knife and the machete used in the attack, burying them somewhere out in the Woods Chris's interrogation was over, he led, as to get her to the location of the murder weapons while we looking back in the woods. Chris ass one of the troopers, how Jamie was doing. What, like what kind of

Ok see you away from home over criminal today, I kind of like you. I hope you better. None of the young men involved in the attack had He connection to the gates family whatsoever. The home had been chosen completely at random, usually This would make for a difficult invest gation in this However, the criminals made it awfully easy track them down the day after the murder. Christen Steve had told one of their friends Kyle Fenton about the attack after they laugh Kyle looked online for news of any local murders when he came across

an article about the attack in Mount Vernon told his mother. What christen Steve had told him and his mother contacted the police Within forty eight hours of the attack Chris, Steve, Billy and when were all arrested quaint eventually, pleaded guilty to charges of burglary conspiracy to commit burglary armed robbery. He was sent. Two between twenty and forty years in prison, Billy pleaded he too charges of burglary first degree assault and can piracy to commit murder, he was set. Two between thirty and sixty years on November, eighteenth autumn, Savoy was also placed under arrest and charged with multiple counts of hindering apprehension. He was eventually sentence to between five and twelve years in prison. Crescent Steve were each charge with attempted murder, first degree, murder and conspiracy to commit first degree, murder, Billy Quinn and Autumn all agree

to testify against them at trial. Steve's trial began in October of twenty ten. The prospect an alleged that steed, as the leader of the group Steve himself had named the disciples of destruction according to court, documents. Steve referred to the disciples of destruction as d o d on the day of the attack he had texted Quinn. Writing it Stevie gotta get out soon, cause we ready we need the completion of d d to go on on the way out to Mount Vernon Steve allegedly told the other members of the group that the attack at the case it was going to be a form of initiation. After waiting his trial, Steve wrote the follow

in a letter to a fellow inmate, so Billy Listen Quinn knew that I've been. About bodies so offering to kill someone personally I was considering starting a crew, not Gang but a group of like minded individuals, but the boy to do crazy shit. Want pussies were people who just talk the talk dig I set this up to see if my home use could be about it again I thought wrong at Steve's trial autumn Savoy, who had supposedly decline and offered to be an official member of the disciples of destruction testified. His encounter with Steve the morning after the murder. And what happened when you saw the defendant. I told them or to park: stay parts there and and defend a car, and we started talking. And what did the defendant say you just

dancing and jumping around between different conversations. But he had said that he had killed two people, so he said he was bouncy. Could you explain? What do you mean by that? He was very up. Is the first work and describe it very happy, excited and adrenaline rush. And what did he tell you? He killed two people What about the definitive crespo? They say in how they were scared, not at all the opposite. The complete opposite What the defendant increase for talking about did. They appear to think that they had killed both of the victims. Yes, they did from the conversation was the power off the whole time. Whole time stimulus puzzled shopping at the bed. They were actually doing anything in the house. The power was supposedly off after that,

after they had thought. The both victims were dead. Chris said that a one time the power back on did the defendant say how the bedroom looked after the powers turned out. He said that it looks like hollowing movie, another friend of theirs. Elden spikes testify that Steve had also brag to him about the murder. What kind of things for the financing was at? First, I was dead. I lay how happy they were doing, also planning to do it again. Just to give you an idea of the friend group were dealing with a few months. After the trial Elden Spikes would be charged with burglary in an unrelated incident. Couple of years later, Kyle fattened would be arrested and charged with this tool, assault of two fourteen and fifteen year old girls, it turns out that the disciples of destruction don't associate with particularly wholesome characters. Shocking. I know on October twenty Eightth when glue?

We are told the jury that leading to the home invasion. Steve, had grown obsessed with violence and murder. So clever. Can you over some of the things that defendant was talking about? He wanted to do breaking houses. He talked about eating people roasting people heads on stakes, these things for the press. It was. Did he ever use the term sweeping over? He did so, and what did you take that to mean sleeping over people's houses? staying over the knight with the body is making a scene. Things like eating did you talk about breaking in homes just to kill people? Now, what else did you want to do any broken homes? take valuables money, jewelry, anything to make money. Who was

offended talking to him when he talked about breaking in homes, killing people stealing stuff from norms. He was talking to myself. Billing marks Chris credible. In the days leading up to what happened in my Vernon ditty continue to talk about killing people murdering people, the defendant They became more prevalent. Actually, they became one more prevalent. They became more frequent. Yes, the intensity of what he was saying Yeah see Gulf WAR, more intense till it was actually talking about going into homes generally ends As I said, on November. Ninth twenty ten Steve's nineteenth birth. The jury was set to announce their verdict prior to, Verdict being read: you ve turned to one of his attorneys and asked if he

the jury, would sing happy birthday to him. They did it this is vital. If you please, remain standing and face the jury with the four percent less than men for person who's, the jury, reach vertiginous cases. Yes and how say you, Madam four person? How do you find that offended serious Vader segment, two thousand TED too, for one charging purposeful, first degree murder guilty or not guilty. You say, Madame four person at the verdict is guilty. So say you all. Ladies and gentlemen, Steve was found guilty on all charges. The prosecution. Question: a sense of life in prison. Without the possibility of parole judge, in Abrams and agreed to that region,

for days and days and days when it is sufficient to say you long prison sentences. Decidedly mass meetings will find you remain additions to ensure these stay and rest for scribbles case went try the following March: Chris pleaded not guilty by reason of insanity when we leave when I think of them illegally insane now, as one might offences that I am right, you're saying you are legally insane. I'm saying as many financiers do not believing it. I do believe in my diffidence you're saying you are leaving saying yes on March, tenth twenty eleven Chris took the stand.

This guy right, it could be considered dangerous, yes tall, DR about a month ago, you have no idea how the issue now lay down When was times when you do that smile is that one of those times when you can kind of fake you body language open today smile because it's funny than all the people in their have no idea whether messing with added to his involvement in the attack and walk the jury through what happened from his perspective. I remember, Someone started screaming And One point: I heard like us and then some of the screaming start Not long after that, I kind of reached in and at the formed from me. I knew what I was standing out, but I can't tell you how can I couldn't really see well

but I knew where it was. I can't explain how even actually what I'm stabbing staring at Will you stabbing person at the same time that Steve was oh, he was never stopped, just kept going in going on. Like he stopped in between reached in. So you and doing at the same time that he was happy? Yes,. Chris, was also open about what he thought would happen if he are ever allowed to re enter society I know that it is a possibility, legally, it is possible If I were sent secure psychiatric union that I could get out again, I dont think its probable at all. I think the possibility is one of the sort of million to sort of things. But I know it's possible:

and if I did get out, I think it is possible that I could kill again. He went the testify that he'd been fantasizing about committing murders. Since his early years, I've known, I was the normal type of guy for years point. When did you start to me? I said I wasn't fourteen unwanted come along Chris Detailed, some of his specific fantasies involving his mother, including, pouring boiling water on her sensitive parts covering her with sugar and leaving her outside for the crows to pluck hat Among other things, all things like cutting little pieces of her little by bed before us. Listening to her scream like I'd, screamed. Taylor, hey hasn't, feel now. Claimed that his mother had abused him growing up and he blew, his social isolation on being homes schooled. He also insisted

that he had no emotional attachment to her and that The only reason even killer was that he would have been

but obviously suspect. We thought about telling your mom. Yes, I don't love you. Yes, yes, city, lorries is equally yes, there is a difference between emotional attachment and emotion was chosen. I don't think you like me. You have an emotional attachment to me. It is very simple. Yes, it is yes, I did. My mommy is usually long. Now two thousand seven crisper separated in a series of interviews with a psychiatrist

named grace. Tell us This is when Chris, his mother to men a rebel first learned that Chris had been thinking about killing her. At some point along the line in seeing Doktor teller Rico. She called us insist she wanted to meet briefly with both of us. We came in and she said I need to talk with you about a number of issues that have come up during counselling. She said that there has been an issue of what she called inappropriate. Touching with somebody charge. And I said what does that mean, she said somebody touched him. It applies. Did someone molest my child and she said no, it was just an appropriate touching somebody put their arm around him. Sir Kay, and she said, and also you need to Know- He'S- made death threats against both of you and we said

Is it seriously? She said? No, I think it's just. You know how teenagers say I wish you were dead and he's blowing off steam and he's not a danger to anyone, because it's not a problem. Requirements when their been death threats made. I have to tell you, inform you she said, but in my opinion there is no and what you were told is no, and she said he, I have to tell you legally I've requirements when their been death threats made. To tell you inform you she said, but in my opinion there is no no issue. There arise, not a David himself or to you. How do you feel very upset. I could imagine him being that kind of angry he'd. Never said to me. I hate you. I wish you were dead, anything like that.

The human mind is capable of so many things such ability for good. But when something goes wrong that capable mind can be Our worst enemy Chris was Hancock, as soon as that. First guilty verdict was red, and then the rest of the verdicts were red guilty on all charges. The nineteen year old, Christopher Rebel, would now be treated by society as the monster he had long, to be the disciples of destruction. Is only legacy in life.

thank you so much for joining us once again for this episode. We hope you've enjoyed it. Even though we love you right. Murder, daddy, loves you. Just a reminder that the next regular episode will be the last one before summer break we're going to take a little bit of a break after episode. One hundred and seventeen to recharge the batteries refill the creative juices, and we will be back with episode, one hundred and eighteen. So thanks again for joining us until next time, stay safe,

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