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On the Ground in Louisville

2020-09-24

This episode contains strong language.

Breonna Taylor’s mother and her supporters had made their feelings clear: Nothing short of murder charges for all three officers involved in Ms. Taylor’s death would amount to justice.

On Wednesday, one of the officers was indicted on a charge of “wanton endangerment.” No charges were brought against the two officers whose bullets actually struck Ms. Taylor.

In response, protesters have again taken to the streets to demand justice for the 26-year-old who was killed in her apartment in March.

We speak to our correspondent Rukmini Callimachi, who is on the ground in Louisville, Ky., about the reaction to the grand jury’s decision.

Guest: Rukmini Callimachi, a correspondent for The New York Times.

For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily

Background reading:

This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
From the New York Times. I'm likeable bar this is a day like today a grand jury in Kentucky weighing evidence in one of the countries. Contentious police shootings declined to bring largest against the two officers who shot we on a tailor. My colleague think many column on is illegal. It's Thursday September twenty. Fourth, Romania, it's about twelve thirty in the morning on Thursday and were really grateful. They were able to talk to you and I guess just start with. Where are you this morning, I'm in Louisville in an urban beaver. I'm staying and how long have you been in Louisville
I got you on Monday, a we heard last week that the attorney general of Kentucky was going to announce whether the three officers who killed Brianna Taylor on the night of more thirteenth, whether or not they were going to be charged? There was a lot of anticipation.
Word this announcement last week, Brianna Tellers mother received a near record settlement of twelve million dollars for the death of her daughter and a number of police reforms were announced by the sitting, but her mother and her relatives and advocates for beyond a tailor, have made it very clear that nothing short of charging all three officers who killed her with murder would amount to justice. Now I've spent the last couple of days speaking to legal experts about this case and the peoples. I spoke to said very clearly that they thought that the attorney general was essentially between a rock and a hard place. They said that, because of the fact that when the officers entered Brianna tailors home her boyfriend, can you walk her, who mistook the police for an intruder open fire
shot one of the police officers because of that dynamic, the fact that the officers shot back and ultimately killed her would be protected under Kentucky is self Defense statue. So here you have Brianna tailors mother sing. Nothing short of an indictment of these three police officers involved in the raid that killed her daughter would represent justice and, on the other hand, you ve all these legal expert saying that is Dreamily unlikely because of this prince of events that happened and the state law governing police in self defence, exactly at embryonic family wasn't just saying that they should be indicted. They were saying that they should be indicted for larger for manslaughter. So on They we knew that the grand jury began meeting. We have sources who confirmed to us. We knew that they kept him deliberating on Tuesday and Tuesday night. We were expecting an announcement. Meanwhile, all over the city
There were signs of preparation for a clash, the mayor's off. Issued an announcement that a state of emergency has been declared. The police department announced that vacation days we're going to be cancelled, no police officers we're gonna, be given off days. We started hearing that the national, what might be called in that the Kentucky State police were sending officers here and meanwhile, an ever growing quarter, was created around the city square that had been the nucleus of these protests, which have been We are now in the city nearly every night for more than a hundred days, they put up concrete barriers. They brought in big dump trucks, tat blocked off the streets. Channeling fences were put around the area, making it impossible to drive their on top of that federal court announced last week. They were closing, then, just before the announcement. We heard that all of the other Courts family court
district court. All of these other courts also enough. They were closing its eyes to get. Everyone in town seems to recognise what is about to happen, and everyone is on guard for especially downtown the high. It is boarded up. The merry others boarded up business after business government office after Government office in the downtown corridor, which is where the heart of these put asked haven't happening, and I think that's a reflection of the fact that more and more protesters were showing up in the square with weapons, and this is an open carry state. So it's completely illegal to do that, but there was an ever growing sense that we were heading towards some sort of cash and that that Hush could be violent. So what happens earlier today on Wednesday, as soon as I woke up
on Wednesday morning I had a text message from one of my good sources, an official whose help me understand this investigation, and he said cryptically, it's beautiful weather for breaking news be ready. The next thing I heard was from a city official who can, from the same thing that there was going to be announcement soon and we started hearing that a possible time was Be one o clock, maybe two o clock and possibly that it was going to be in Frankfurt, which has an hour away from where I am now in Louisville, and it wasn't until Eleven. Forty, a m that I got an email the attorney general's office, saying the announcement is going to be at one thirty, so I jumped in a car and race to this place. It was like fifty minutes almost an hour away, and I
MR cut off. I mean literally gotten my car. This could I got the announcement and I almost didn't make it. When I got to Frankfurt, we found a capital had again been locked down. There were several city blocks that had police tape across them. Police officers directed meat. Where the media parking was and then I entered the building where this announcement was going to happen once I got inside there was a man who check my bag. Then they asked me to put my bag on the floor. There was a dog with a handler that came in stiff my bag and then a second person took up my bag and looked inside, and only at that point that they give me a badge and that I go all the way and the chairs were spaced more than six. Depart. It was a very spacious area because of covert we were all waiting quietly and sometime after one thirty p m. The attorney unroll Daniel Cameron, stepped onto this makeshift stage? A good afternoon
You for joining us today and began addressing the reporters the decision before my office, as the special prosecutor in this case was not to decide the loss of Miss Taylor? Life was a tragedy. The answer to that question is unequivocally yes, and he described the task of banana Taylor as a tragedy and then in the went on to explain
exactly what the legal experts I had spoken to. Headset early morning hours of March, thirteen officers from L, a p d executed, a search warrant, three zero, zero, three Springfield Dr Apartment for this was Miss Brianna tailors residents. There were three officers who discharge their weapons on the night of Marsh Thirteenth. These three officers were sent to Piana tellers apartment with a legal warrant that had been signed by a magistrate the day before these were not Roque, cops that just broken to somebody's house. They had
you can talk him aunt, allowing them to go that sergeant, maddeningly in detectives, cause Grove and Higgins and had no known involvement in the preceding investigation or payment of the search warrant. They were called into duty as extra personnel to affect wait, the service of the search warrant. They showed up at her apartments and conveyed sometime after twelve forty am and they began lousy, knocking at her to work with. This is something that we know from our own reporting. Because can you walk Brianna tailors boyfriend, confirmed hearing the knocking the attorney general went on to say that they had witnesses. That said that they heard the police both knock and announced themselves would officers were unable to get anyone to answer
or open the door to apartment for decision was made to breach the door as soon as they went and they were met with gunfire from Brianna tellers boyfriend, who had not hurt them announced or south. Mr Walker emitted, that he fired one shot and was the first to shoot. The two officers who open fire first dramatically and MILES Cosgrove, were in the hallway directly facing Brianna Taylor and her boyfriend, and they returned fired in the direction in which they had been fired. Upon from sergeant maddeningly saw the man's gun fire heard a boom in immediately knew he was shot as result of feeling heat in his upper thigh. So he explained to us that, because of the Kentucky statute on self defence
while there are six possible homicide charges under Kentucky LAW. These charges are not applicable to the facts before us, because our investigations show in the grand jury agreed maddeningly in cars. Grove were justified in the return of deadly fire. After having been fired upon by Kenneth Walker. He explained that these officers were justified in shooting back. This justification bars us from pursuing criminal charges it miss Brianna wish death. There was another officer, bread hang concern at the. He was also in this for me, and by the door, but when the shoe began, he did something that this day remains inexplicable, and that is that he he spent around
and you ran outside in the parking lot and from there he began shooting blindly and radically into the sliding glass door of her patio and into the window of one of her bedrooms, and he did this, even though both of those openings were covered with blinds. So you did not have a line incite inside. We know that his bullets travelled through her living room, her kitchen and clear through to the apartment, the back where there was a couple, a pregnant woman and her husband and their five year old child who were asleep after hearing the evidence from our team of prosecutors. The great this is planned.
Attorney general then explained that that officer was going to be charged with wanton endangerment for wantonly placing the three individuals in apartment, three in danger of serious physical injury or death. This is a lower class felony one for what she can get up to five years per count and he was being charged with three counts because of the fact that his bullets travelled into the apartment behind gonna tellers, where there was the couple and their child. Crucially, he explain something that we did not know up to this point. There is no conclusive evidence that any board five from Detective Higgins's weapon struck is Taylor. He said that Brad Hank incense bullets did not touch Brianna Tailor the person whose shots killed. Her was a detective named
Cosgrove, who was in the hallway of her apartment- and this is according to the ballistics analysis that was done by the FBI at their lab in Quantico, really just to summarize during this news, for the attorney general said that. Charges will be brought against the one Officer whose gunshots never struck Brianna Taylor, that's right and in case of the two officers who did shewed Brad Heller, neither of them yeah we'll be charged. You know we had anticipated that this was most likely going to be the result that would occur, but it was clear from the way that the attorney general presented this information that he had himself agonized over it and tat. He knew that this was going to disappoint people. He said at one point in the press conference
this is a tragedy and sometimes the law, the criminal law is not adequate to respond to a tragedy, and then he went on Detective cosgrove and sergeant meaningly were justified in returning fire. As they were fired upon. I know that not everyone will be satisfied with the charges we reported today. My team set out to investigate circumstances surrounding this tailors death. We did it with a singular, go in mind. Pursuing the truth can talking's deserve no less. The city of global deserves no and if actually watch that news conference in what I heard him say next was basically the people Louisville who he knew we're going to be upset by what he said and by what you heard. You were in the room and he sickly presented them with choice here. Will you accept this? even though you may not like it or will
you react with three Geneva with violence. That's right! That's right! One of the Kosovo tell my notebook was. If we simply act on outrage, there is no justice mob justice is not justice. Justly sought by violence is not justice. It just becomes revenge. Our reaction to truth today says what kind of society we are. We really want the truth, or do we want a truth that fits our narrative while the back. This year, teachers are learning new ways to teach. Parents are learning to lessen plan an
mines, are learning a new normal. This year we are all students at Verizon. We are enabling the edge in that students deserve, with credential teacher training, free lesson, plans for parents and take an solutions for schools nationwide It citizen, Verizon inaction, our plan for economic, environmental and social advancement. Ray, Soon, as this press conference is coming to an end, I am seeing a what's up channel of my colleagues who are back we ve been here inside newspaper when what do you think about it? You know the airline worried by my colleague John L ago. How do you feel about the decision My colleague molecule Brown, my colleague, Alexander Garcia,
They need to be held accountable, but the whole damn system need to be held accountable out across Louis they're in the square there in the areas where the protesters are not one has been held accountable and there Reporting that the protests our sobbing, and that anger is mounting that and for the first part of the day they were chanting they were a king, and then you started to see a couple of small disturbances
He Brown was present at one area of the city, where a protest that had a stick began. Smell since some windows and broke the windows of a business, cap marching and they kept on getting dispersed by the police in different areas. Afternoon. I had made it back and at this point, because what the city done by creating all of these roadblocks and jailing sensors, obstacles leading to the square. What that means is that there wasn't a central point for them to meet so for much of the day, we were just kind of you know, chasing the protesters they're here, There there were going to this place. We're going to that place the boy things.
Intensify when the sun went down. It was my colleague, Alexandra Garcia, who was filming at an area that was near and overpass when suddenly shots rang out Shots fired, fired very quickly on social media, we started to see messages indicating that a police officer down. I was actually with some Aguiar, whose Brian killers. Families lawyer, he had just walk past me on the street and we ve got as
or as an area where we saw squad cars with flashing lights, and it was at that point that I got an email from one of the police spokesman who said that an officer had been shot. In fact, more than one officer had been shot and that they would get back to us when they had more information. Ask her if you were working in the streets of Louisa and were firing protest here right now, who has gotten a gps pen safe house. He says where the protesters are gathering, it's no illegal for protesters and citizens to be outside, media are still allowed, but we're following were following this young man who is taking us to where the other protesters are at that point we fell then, with a group of protesters, and they had shared that there was a safe house that they were going to, and so we fall
come to the safe house. Church has been opened by apparently by the religious community. Giving a sanctuary to the protesters. The safe house was actually a church was the first unitarian church and when I got there, I was able to speak to rapid lorry the minister of that church and she explained to us that they had research, the law, that it is private property and that they believed that the municipal ordnance stated that even when a curfew is in place, if you're leaving a religious service, you cannot be stopped. When we got there. There was a guy called Father TIM who was giving out bottles of water to the protesters, they had: snacks, granola bars chips, everything and several dozen protesters arrived there and they were using their megaphone in the sanctuary of the church, giving the same speeches that they would have been giving out into the square You heard the results of the investigation today. What what's your reaction to that
it made me want to come out March for the first time They ve been marching four hundred nineteen days. This is the first time I should weakening I'm curious. As the scene is unfolding. If you're able to talk to people about their reaction to this grand jury decision? What they're saying about well in anticipation, the decision. I had a series of conversations with people in the square about what they expected and- and it was clear from speaking to some of them, there's a pretty big gap between the fact that that I and other reporters have been able to uncover in this case as
dog and darkened dog, and the narrative and the version of events that the protesters arm believe the narrative tat. I was getting from the protesters, including things like that the police had gone to the wrong address or that the police had no legal right to be there. These details, dont line up with the actual facts of the case, but this is a narrative tat- has become much bigger than the facts in this case, and that's partly, because both the city and the attorney general and other officials have been so stingy with releasing information. On this case I mean I came here in July, and it took every bit of reporting scale that I had to this large, these hundreds and thousands of pages of investigative files. It was really really hard to get them, but it's only by getting all of this that I finally have the bigger picture that the attorney
general, we'll about today. The other issue is very tailors name her as a byword for racial injustice. Has spread from close to coast. She's become bigger than the facts of the case. She's become a symbol of a young black woman killed in a cruel, an awful way, by a group of my cops ok
try to get some sleep and thank you very much. Thank you so much to chemical I'll, be right back. Vanguard was founded on the simple, but radical idea that initiative Company can succeed because it puts investors. First Vanguard is I and owned you on?
funds and the funds, own vanguard, which means Vanguard, is built to ensure that your interests will be the priority together. Vanguard, thirty million investors are changing the way the world invests, visit, vanguard, dot com or talk to financial adviser to learn more here's, what else you need tenderly, the body of the lead justice, Ruth Bootmaker Ginsburg, was carried into the Great Hall of the Supreme court building on Wednesday for the start of three days of public morning fur death, it has been said that Ruth wanted to be an opera. Virtuoso became a rock star instead, but she
chose the law during a short ceremony, the court's chief justice, John Roberts, remembered Ginsburg as a champion of equal justice or four hundred and eighty three majority concurring and dissenting opinions will steer the court for decades. The voice in court and in our conference room was shocked when she spoke people, listen among the words as described. That's it for the daily. I Michael borrow see tomorrow.
Transcript generated on 2020-09-24.