Today on The Editors, Rich, Charlie, and Michael discuss the melee over Trump’s transition of power comments, and whether or not Trump’s Supreme Court pick will be voted on before the election.
• Rich: Andy McCarthy on the Breonna Taylor case
• Charlie: Sergiu Klainerman “Princeton Is Not Racist, but Race-Obsessed”
• MBD: Andrew Stuttaford “Lockdown Lunacies”
• Rich: The Blues Brothers
• Charlie: Ryan Fitzpatrick
• MBD: Ed Condon
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The Editors is hosted by Rich Lowry and produced by Sarah Schutte.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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will there be a piece,
transfer of power, and will there be a Supreme court vote before the election will discuss all this and more
this edition of the utter somber. Slurry unemployed is always by the right honourable Chelsea. W Cook and the tourist boot Michael Brenda, Dorothy Jim Dirty war
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anything? So I may day we had a typical trump controversy on for the last couple of days. I'm nervous
yesterday, a Wednesday I forget it all runs together, were recording
on a Friday afternoon. Ices once they re Donald Shops asked. Do you supports
Fourth transfer, all of power kind of the journalists balance the question a little bed because he made it seem as though he has largely talking about the riots in the streets. But this this is a question that, even if it's not asking the button up way, no president should ever NASA
just be yes, yes and, of course, because the present, when he contemplates his exiting from office, does not something you want to talk about work and see. That will never happen through
result went to his road answer. I will see you got these terrible
oh and ballots if you get rid of those ballots than that, yeah there's, there's not gonna, be a transfer cause. There's gonna be a continuance and outrage ensued. Understandably,
when you make of it yeah, I'm you. The question was botch because began with windows.
Draw will you commit and if he wins, there's not going to be a transfer of power but
no you're right. He Chavez. He just give one line answer. We look forward to seeing all the bounds counted all about counted legally and that's the glory of our country and the inner. That's it rightly
In that way, you you're not disclaiming. You eat me make clear that you
the lawyers, if there's chicanery, our, if the other side since in its lawyers.
We never eat doesn't do this and it's it's bad that he doesn't say that and
I don't think it can be written off, as you know,
even if you say, he's a bumbling fool, unease and serious and he's not going to lead a coup and there's no reason.
Think he's going to try to lead some bizarre effort.
Eric eight himself in the oval office.
In our through the lame duck, pure hidden and beyond it.
Does actually damage our ability to effect the peaceful transfer of power, because.
Starts putting in people's minds that it might not happen and
in this he's not alone and see if stock
actually, I think, even with the journal
to ask the question at the debate four years ago
He was ass because it was suddenly this moral panic in liberal media he's not can accept the result when he loses and twenty sixteen
And I remember that was the first time I thought. Oh, my gosh he's gonna win end and then
can accept the result, and I wrote that column saying, but
immediately brought it up and in fact Hilary weakened this norm.
By not conceding on the night of the election. When it was clear she was lost, she lost, it was a wooden
Now that didn't have any obvious negative result at night or the next day, but it was bad form and now Hillary Clinton again
As found herself saying in it in
ambiguous terms, Joe Biden, shouldn't kissed concede the election, and we just
to go at. It is hard as they do and will prevail. She didn't
any qualifiers about the result,
and giving the LEO result just dont concede and go hard, not be should be talking like us, and its is bad for our political culture. When power
since do it it's especially by during the summer when we ve seen
Political violence, when we ve seen now a trump supporter get executed. Basically,
for wearing a at its best,
when we ve seen congressmen, Guiche shot almost assassinated at the beginning of this presidential term,.
This unbalanced as people, so I think Trump is its
horrible for him to say
He said. I know I dont anticipate
Some kind of you know.
In early nineties at the Duma, in Moscow style footage coming out of Washington DC in twenty twenty
by this is opening. This is slowly opening pandora's Box and damn.
Secondly, an entirely different.
Why, on? What I think are inevitably going to be some controversies about balance and a few states yeah. I think it's is bad in its own right
I could even say this, even though there's zero chance he's going to do it, he's not not going to lose and order. The joint chiefs of staff to roll the time
you know and in Washington DC sets a normal somewhat. Nor can come come get em, even if you were
insane and malicious enough to make
order. No one would a at. I think that the actual risk it
the losers and loses unaware that can't be contested. It is actually cut. It leaves the presidency early and assess forget about it.
I don't really judging by the real downsizing choice- is not the idea of a coup asked after election. It is that is
deal. John Dene legitimize the result and he's he's very likely not going to accept it.
And that's going to sway alot of people to undermine their faith in our system. That's a really bad thing and then- and I think the theory-
listing nightmare scenario is really close. Result where they're a bunch of states we're just talking prior to tease starting this Ep Pennsylvania
It is is one that should be honoured, loyalist worth
The rules are gonna, be a model that can be litigation, and I are gonna, be.
Disputes are what mail and ballots to count and that the normal practices you know any candidate. Any political party is gonna wage, Hardball litigation to protect their their interest, but you also want some
bottom line of statesmanship. You know and everyone involved, which is what we had in two thousand, but there's no way we're gonna have that and twenty twenty is a great example of the problem with Trump a problem that is Trump. He answered a question to which the answer is yes, with an army.
Other than yes wasn't clear. He meandered around he mixed in a few other issues, issues
there are real and that his supporters do care about, and that vagueness led to defences some more plausible someone out, but he answered a question. His answer is yes with an answer
then yes and that's the route problem. So having done that, his critics freak out monsieur the worst they range and
hyperbole in the process of freaking out and assuming the worst, and then that allows his apologies to say why you sound really crazy, but the problem is Trump who answered a question to which the answer is. Yes,
with an answer other than yes, it ultimately doesn't matter that his answer was in Kuwait. It doesnt matter that there is
in fact, no danger whatsoever of Trump Leaving office, not least because, as you say, if you try to stay, he would be removed not up to him. What matters is that he was answered a straight question and he didn't
answer it as he is obliged to do, and he is obliged to answer it with a yes. This is not a political question. This is not a question of emissary if the people against the.
Leads is not a matter of man is not a question whose answer changes contingent upon your ideological assumptions. It's a bedrock questions, a universal question. Will you leave office if you lose
Will you preside over a peaceful transfer of power? If you lose, will you stick to the rule
has obtained in the United States, since George Washington left in one thousand seven hundred and ninety seven, and the answer is yes. Yes, absolutely yes, of course, yes without exception, and that he didn't just say yes,
shows that he doesn't really understand the importance of his institution and other institutions, even if he's forced, as he should be, to follow the rules
I don't know how many times I can say this, he hears unfit for office and the fact that other people are unfit for office to the fact that we are seeing riots and threats and extortion it doesnt chain
that it doesnt matter that many in the opposing parties doing their level best account casts doubt on the election to he's the president he's the focal point in our system. Alas, he has a responsibility and he failed.
Yeah she's not a case, obviously, where he's not formed by the institution are really care about it. Institution
he's playing by the rules. He has his entire adult life that he's not.
Guinea concession against.
It considers this personal interest, as so he's never getting concede, basically that that
Is this election legitimately, so anybody that there is a little bit of a disconnect. You have this kind of episode, which is Europe's of the very worst of Donald Trump. At the same time, you have some polling that that shows easily could win this race and in fact I put in the corner, but about this this week. You point. Actually
is both ways. You have a trump map. You know it is when Georgie ones needs one Florida, Arizona, North Carolina and Pennsylvania, and it's really plausible that that could happen. He had washed and postpone that had em, among likely voters ahead in Florida terms
only five four points at ahead in Arizona by. I think the point- and you know He'S- got
he's behind but close in Albania to two to four points and any other other hand. You have this vital point that that shows
no he's coastal landslide is tied in Iowa. I think it and why these policies is been closer head in a higher close he's, not gonna win taxes but close in Texas, so he went one way that our trunks could win is quit the other way up, binds good it gonna blow out, but anyway, there's credible, winding a question.
But it's just you look at this week and what prompted the shooting close right, you shouldn't be close to being elected press headache, and yet he is
yeah. He is
in a way which we just become inured to it? Right I mean we become a nerd too to the
a trump lies the way he
flouts these conventions? Is I mean some time for some people's thrilling right leg? I think for
people, they looked at the norm
about when we talk about peaceful transfer of power,
Right that phrases use like a hundred times on inauguration day by
on television right like this is the gory
system- you now you know- and you know I would want for President tramp- he would he would lower
temperature dramatically to say I look forward to the day.
The inauguration day after my presidency is over.
In sitting there on the steps watching the next present be sworn in
I'm doing everything I can to make sure that in twenty twenty four point, twenty five- and you know it would be great, but at the end it has died, Junior
his big sworn it only
Http should say something like right if you like, but we ve been
doing this firm right five years now?
what he should be setting is incapable
What were the reason? You side? He doesn't he
not paying attention to that stuff.
It's not his language and he wasn't formed to speak that language
sure some people find that thrilling and I think other people,
Can I say you know
should he commit.
One also being asked to commit to this site.
Battle, lace and heat,
so doesnt, because he's the president. That's why you're so shouldn't say this, because it doesn't help him at all right. Like he's running
he tried to run earlier this summer is the law and order candidate. So like Ebay
a committee of political power in your country. If you're for law and order that that's that's, there has always been a huge disconnect between away ducks himself. How combative he is now is costly, raising the temperature,
at the same time Europe, the lawn org either those those two things don't naturally
Go together and
same thing is true of Russia even to this day, but back and twice extensive, just say that I am not supporting one enough
You know our election is terrible to these emails or act it out, and I guess, there's been wrung out of a couple times under pressure, but that's not what is naturally prone to say again that he considers it a a concession against it gets.
So try ambiguous, saying I'm on an idea that we hear over and over again everywhere, peaceful transfer of power, peaceful treasure powers on the glories this system, but you know
A convention in that way, but this abuse
the convention is no one has to think about it. Everyone takes it for granted and every time you repeated it gets more ingrained and that served a harm that that's hard to quantify the deaf. Definitely
harm to to someone, especially the precise dates, not playing along with that convention of crosses a home. We have
A more formalize system in the United States in its true in many countries, certainly than his true in Britain, in that the constitution lays out the rules, but they are not self executing.
And one reason that we are by them is that we have made a deal with the other side.
And there's been an other side in american politics right from the beginning. This is not new. In some ways it was more acrimonious and in the early republic than it is now to agree to abide by those rose.
And I don't think there is any meaningful risk posed by president chum and his inability to answer this question, because this is an up to him
The president doesn't run the election, he doesn't ratify the election, he doesn't enforce the election,
the election is run by the states and by the people the Congress ratifies it.
We don't really know what would happen if the president's that are not going and the reasoning
You don't know that I shall say is. It has never happened in there.
It's never happened is that even when we were at each other's throats ass, we happen before twenty twenty at each other's throats and early republic at each other's throats and immediate Anti Balin pair at each other's throats and the great depression. Even then, this wasn't raised the answer to the question: asked was yeah, so it hurts and
is especially counterproductive. I think for conservatives or conservative aligned politicians to engage in because
We are the ones by and large who are making the case for the constitution and its legitimacy.
We're the ones who is saying now it looks like it's one thousand, seven hundred and seventy six and then one thousand seven hundred and eighty nine
and not undermine it with Toca, six thousand and ninety, not not the terrible things didn't happen in one thousand six hundred and nineteen, but the we have rules that was set independently.
We are the ones who are saying: no, not revisiting the electoral college, we're not going to tell president to our elected via the electoral college that they are legitimate. No we're not
Visiting the Senate no Mitch Mcconnell does not lack the powers that he enjoys, because the Senate is not
Apportioned in a way that vocs would like and then
a president who is chipping away the foundations of that legitimacy. So, even if it leaves leads now, I wish it won't it's bad for the country and its especially bad for the people that Trump believes he represents, which is defenders of the constitutional order as it exists. So anybody at this juncture rate, how likely you think, an election post, election train wreck
from zero to ten zero, you think it's gonna be a clear result accepted.
By all sides- and you think we're gonna get rival
flights of electors and multiple states. Absolute nightmare. I mean.
In February or March. When.
And something is unable to send
congressional delegation and agreed national delegation
Liz Cheney as Congress.
From why arming cast
the deciding vote.
The presidential election in the House
House just itself had casting an equal vote to all fifty
of California representatives,
In that scenario, I think it will be clear and the american people will accept it with grace and echoed Amity
now I am, I think it's just a two. I think if its close, there's gonna be some legal wrangling, maybe in pencil venier another state, but I don't I don't. Actually you think it will be close. I think it can be clear, intellectually, joy, I think, there's a reasonable chance that it will be a mass. I bet that translates into a crisis and I don't think it necessarily relates to the conversation we ve just had, which is about peace, will transfer power, but I think it's entirely possible that will have a bush. We go a star situation somewhere, and the election will be close enough that it matters. I can see the.
Court decision in Pennsylvania, mattering a huge amount. I could see the court decision in Wisconsin mattering a huge amount, given that this year will see an unusual number of male ballot. Sir, I think them
be some real fights over how to count the votes which votes to count and so on. But I dont think
that we're going to see a meaningful legitimacy crisis as a result, some other than what I expect is sound, and I think that lobby-
close. I think once you see I'm just gonna be close, then he I'd be pretty high.
And the scale, because if it's gonna be clean
it can be really contested. Think
states like Pennsylvania, the rule
are being written on up on the fly and are made now to be challenged in and not to be accepted by.
Are the other. So I'm going to say seven with that, let's pause and hear from our sponsor. This beat the American Federation for children. What did Barack Obama Joe Biden? That's closing down Trump all have in common. They all attended private schools chosen by the parents to believe that all families should have school choice. On average, american taxpayers spend fifteen thousand four hundred and twenty four dollars per student nationwide on K through twelve public education
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dot fun my child, now dot com signed a petition and far along with social media at school choice. Now, please check it.
So Charlie, as we talked in various episodes, Republicans amazingly easily,
things considered, amazingly quickly. All things considered have lined up for a vote on trumps nominee
it but up in the air, though whether it be before or after the election. I think the momentum is toward before an election. I welcome that momentum button
Colonel hasn't strictly committed to that yeah. What do you make of? It were surprised at how smooth sailing has been thus far
I'm not surprised that it's going ahead. I think my number when I was first asked with sixty five percent, and then I raised it to seventy five or eighty. At the moment it seems almost remarkable how quick,
This came together. Mitt Romney, Sadie UP cited Journey answer, Corey Gardener, Susan Collins said now. Listen Mc Caskey said now
That was the pool game and then Mc Caskey said actually maybe I'll be in his well was it happens?
it seems to me that the process is going to go ahead is going to go ahead, irrespective of whether
he wants it to, and so she will be asked. Do you wish dispersant beyond the Supreme Court or not, and if she thinks that that person should be on the Supreme Court should vote yes, so as possible,
where we see the nominee appointed with fifty two votes, there won't be any Democrats from what I can see dimension has said now, and he was really the only likely I'll Crosser
they have the votes, they seem to have the candidate and Amy Tony Blair, although we will find out tomorrow that looks straightforward, the one
It'll flag- I have in my mind, is that the Democrats have not accepted it
And there are especially in election year incentive for them to make it as difficult as possible. Now they can't.
Vote the nominee down? They can't filibuster the nominee because, in his infinite wisdom, heavy red set that train in motion in twenty thirteen
but they can monkey around with the Senate rules. And this is one of these fashionable ideas. Pops up from time to time.
That is currently going around. Maybe they'll impeach Bill bar to stop the Senate from doing its job. Maybe they will.
And of course maybe some thing will happen as it did with campaigners looking back,
The writing around the cabinet nomination before the letter that Diane Feinstein office leaked, and it was incredible how straightforward it all looked at the time until it suddenly wasn't. But at the moment this is really a non event. Serbia that working out a piece with John Cormick, just how this seems
I've found together so nicely for Mcconnell and and the Senate Republicans that of repose the latest later this afternoon, but
shot desert. There is really no inside story here. What
he is what you get once Senate publicans were convinced that there really was no problem with the president and the history lined up for them really well, thanks in part to demagogy,
its work. This wasn't a tough call is just. This is a core belief of of our publicans. That courts are really important. Something I've come campaigned on
I repeatedly something that they, they fear, was helped them in elections and, if you're, so you could face their voters, saying that they they are
Didn't didn't act on this opportunity. Just because Democrats were throwing a tantrum over it. What do you make of it? You I mean, I think
it is not just that the history lined up and we saw
I think what we saw was
similar Rami in his office. Basically, paraphrasing demagogue coins article
the history of aspirin,
core confirmations an election year. I think also
The political logic lined up where
islands in mean.
Reputation is so sad that she can just say. No,
and that helps her with her more marginal moderate republican support,
fears and the conservatives who do both for her, I just have to stuff it.
Whereas fur gardener, who also has to worry about looking independent from tromp, but also
Near the balance of voters for a Senate
in Colorado, gonna come from people who feel attachment
Republican party and conservative I mean there's.
He would anger more of his conservative voters opposing this than he would please moderates so
the political logic just started to make more sense.
It also allows
them to change the subject from Trump uncovered, which for me
senators facing real action- is about
change your subject,
so I think
I was surprised. How quickly went to be honest. I thought for
raw me would be tempted by history or something to stay
yes, but I was totally wrong.
Yeah, it's it's, it's a good thing. I also think it matters that the campaign on this right and I think they also probably realise very quickly.
By many phone calls coming into their offices and animals. That failing.
To do this would have serious consequences.
So the question to you, Charlie Cook, if the pic is becoming bearer, which we all expect
you expect the unveiling advance tomorrow.
To be a success, yes or no. Yes, I think it will be a success, not least construct trump we'll get to make two announcement. The first is that his pig is Amy Coney BAR for the vacant seat and the second,
Is that each one of her seven children we put on the expanded court that the Democrats as of next year, Emily
it'll, be success because any coming there is really impressive.
I agree that you never now but sets seed is, is a brilliant lady and central ashore on her feet. So I'd I'd be optimistic.
How this is done. Our on sport tomorrow so pause. My tell people about this
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the two dot org surreal, but a short time
so we're not gonna do justice to a tragic case and what one this had drawn about a lot of attention.
And has been the focus of more protests
and disorder this week, which is the Brianna Taylor case, I'll, ask you
we D exit question style that feel free to
Labourer eight. Do you think the decision not to charge these officers, except for one on at a reckless endangerment charge, was the correct.
Call yes, I think it was correct. I think the law itself shaped this tragic event deem french route. Our old colleague David from
rotating pretty eloquently that
Fundamental conflict between cast
doctrine, style laws and the practice of no not creates or certain raids where maybe the police aren't positively. I don't.
Buy the the people letter inside the home. They are about to.
Most into that shapes. These tragedies and dumb
Brianna Taylor should not have died that night, that has
It should be said and made absolutely in, but I dont think the officers can be charged fit justly with her murder
Or with doing anything, wrong,
maybe look to the
judge issuing a no knock warrant fur arising,
really shouldn't have expected heavy fire and
the decision to read in the middle of the night, but those caught those
Two cops who fired directly into the abyss,
when at someone who fired at them, they are not guilty of murder choice. Yeah. You have to separate the case from the law. Everything about this is a mass. I am sceptical that
We should have as many drug laws as we do that they should be written in the way that they are now. That's not strong enough
I don't think we should have any troubles. I also think we should be careful about how the police behave. I am sceptical in that case, that word is used correctly of the militarization of the police and in some of the tactics that they use
This couldn't have gone more wrong.
On the one hand you have police have been asked to execute a warrant, they ve been asked to do it in a particular way. They bring a battering ram and they shot at
On the other hand, you have somebody
is in his own home is,
Gunnar Legal, Gunnar protected by the second amendment,
and who is aware that, if somebody breaks into your house in the middle of the night, you can shoot at them special. They do so with a battering ram. Please say we knocked the boyfriend says I didn't hear it who knows, but you could see.
How that disaster would unfold and then to make matters worse,
Some one else get shot six times, not the guy who fired the shop, but someone else in this case Brianna Tailor its awful and it,
to lead to a review of our laws and our tactics, but I agree with Michael. That does not mean
but there is an easy way of dealing with this in the courts off to the fact that this seems not to be in fact an easy way of dealing with this in the courts. After the fact that there is a slogan chanted by protesters and righteous, I know there's not the same.
No justice, no peace and it's a bad slogan, because justice is a process in it relies entirely upon context and circumstance. I don't think murder was the correction,
in this case, I think the officer who was charge should have been charged. His behaviour is outrageous and dangerous and irresponsible, but I dont think that murder charges should have been forthcoming and I think if they had been forthcoming, they would probably not have been fruitful. Sometimes
four things happen and the best recompense is to re, examine all of the assumptions that led to the initial knock on the door.
I greatly about it. This is the right course. Obviously is tragic, tragic case with that, let's hit a few,
other things. Before we go Amby de you'd, like TAT Tipp at Condon, his honour, the Catholic, beat
Canada's reporter for Catholic NEWS Agency for a couple
years now he's been reporting on financial crops
in the Vatican, particularly from led by Cardinal back, you.
Going on over Cardinal Becky was instrumental in our state. The australian Cardinal Pell, who was trying to reform by the Vatican's finances pal
suddenly and very quickly landed in a huge cheap of legal mass.
About child abuse very imply,
mobile case in Australia and spent the significant amount of time
I'm in solitary confinement there before being vindicated by the highest court and now palace being vindicated in the Vatican as it was Becky.
Who is accused of wrong doing an vacuous
lost his title is cardinal and Abkhazia,
reporting was mister.
Tool in this and in
I have to say lots of new-
papers, have what they call Rome correspondence, and these are p
that literally just spending.
I'm in the nicest restaurants in Rome chat with a car
no occasionally attend little people, events and right. Ideological in color commentary about the oldest and
most fascinating long lived institution on earth.
Is actually journalism to be done and it can have a huge effect and all the applause go to him
business outstanding job Charlie. You has the yet another football items this time
Ryan Fitzpatrick. It's an old one for a Jaguar is found to offer up, given that the Miami Dolphins crushed Jacksonville Jaguars last night,
in Jacksonville and I'll ask, but my light side team is Ryan Fitzpatrick. Who is the Miami Dolphins quarterback? He is a larger than life character have a thing I think for larger than life. Floridian quarterbacks with facial hair Ryan Fitzpatrick has
Magnificent bed, I think he has about seven kids- had spent the entirety of the game,
ass night, crushing my team, but with with a
anxious smile on his face, and I just remembered how much I like the guy. He is a perfect Florida,
football player having played previously for the for the back in his back. It's funny with what will you look into the achievement to Harvard spent his silver, a mix of of things, but one of them is entertaining
So I've had occasion due to go back and look at some clips from the blues brothers, and I don't care what Armand White says what Carl Smith
what any credit says, this clearly is one of the best films of the twentyth century. If not, the best fell over twenty
century so that this good or editors picks ambrady. What's your pic, I don't know.
Because, because everything he said because everything is get right, because everything I'm so sorry, ok, we'll get it will take you
we can take tat, are the pick this week, a semi, Charlie Aspect or ever pick. My pig is at your pic. Princeton is not racist, but race, obsessed by, I hope I said, is right. Sir. You clean a man who works prince
and he's the Higgins. Professor of mathematics he's a Macarthur fellow and a member of the National Academy of Sciences, Khatami of arts and sciences and a foreign member, the French Academy, serious guy, picks apart. The idea that Princeton is racist, ass, a mathematician would so might take, is Annie Mccarthy on the Brianna Taylor.
Peace just stare classic Andy Peace, judicious, thorough, fair minded and packed chock full of information that, if a few father
he's pretty closely as I as I do, without ever having delved into this case, which, which I I had just pack chock full of information- that you would never get anywhere else.
So that's it for us. Unless ambition was to come here with a late breaking pick a sorry
only remembered is understood. Efforts of peace, lockdown, Luna Seas, which can have
was through the evidence and that the various policy
he's in Europe
and about how the cost benefit is not what
many scientists seem to think and that every
The commission has a duty to listen to their scientists, but not to cower behind them. There's a real political judgment to be made
and the whole economy is at stake, is very important. Piece great well, Michael, as is worth await. Your pic was definitely worthily
so that really is it for us even listening to an ashtray, podcast injury, broadcast retransmission, countless games that express written permission of natural magazine is strictly pro gibbeted. This podcast produced by
incomparable. Sarah shitty, it makes us out better
then we deserve? Thank you, Charlie. Thank you, envy d and thanks.
On four listening, and I should say thanks to the American Federation, for children as well. We are the editors and use of excessive for
some every Hacha the loose brothers has been approved.
Transcript generated on 2020-09-25.