Join wondering plus in the wondering app to listen ad free from wondering new ideas and other good justin. How are you killing her feeling good debt, We're gonna be doing com con con

uk yacht crime con in london, which I think is really cool. I dunno. If anybody is listening, who has thought about going to london, but let me tell you it kind of reminds me of new york in a way that both places I just head out on foot and I just walk- and I just explore lots of great places to eat lots of historical sites The visit, if you're on the fence at all, I would say it would well we your time to go to crime. Can u k? and to enjoy london. I think london, seattle, fatah, hipster bars and terrain and staff, and that's great june eleven. than twelve of twenty twenty to its being now that the leonardo royal hotel and spy in Saint Paul's dealing the thing you need to know is you'll, be flying into heathrow. Probably take over this thing. If you do travel but we'll be there and we hope to see you. Yes, please use our code john. Why do you say so? your tickets annual, let them know that you want

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calm slash, gaeta BP take a moment Word a word from our new sponsor: do you do you? Have a group chat where you continuously talk about summer is but never they go anywhere well summer's. Finally, here it's time to get out of the office or your house and get a change of scenery with priceline. You can save up to sixty percent on your favorite hotels plus, find amazing deals on car, rentals and flights, and when you save money you can explore more. That means more beautiful views and experiences and more poolside fun doesn't matter where you travel as long as you're out of the office, I always use price signed to find the lowest rates out there and you should do have price line. Every trip is a big deal, So, when you ready to book your next summer, adventure visit price line, dot com for the best deals that are We get more out of it. So aaron tonight's case hit home right This is a welcome one for us. I was actually living and re town Missouri when this

went down and it felt like It was happening in my back yard. Surely no people were acquaintances of some of the people involved in this case errand and all share that at the end is not one story: it's a lot of stories, lots of famine, These were impacted by this and it will big news, but it was huge news here, in Kansas city, so that what are we talking about tonight tonight? We're talking the disappearances and later confirmed murders of karl capacity and jessica iranians. The case are actually separated by some years. Corsica pesky disappeared may of two thousand and seven, and as europeans disappeared in september of twenty sixteen. Car with seventeen and Jessica was twenty one. it was from belt in Missouri, witches,

twenty smiles from kansas city and from ray town missouri, it's like ten or fifteen miles, but let's talk a bit about who these women Cora Elise capacity was born february. Seven mighty ninety susan be born in frankfurt, germany, her parents were mike and Rhonda pesky, her parents divorced early on and her dad would remarry a woman named teresa, her mom remarried, a man named Jim Bedford and I had a son named thomas when kara was nine really Story starts for us in two thousand seven. When kara was a junior at belt in high school, in belton Missouri seventeen years old and now, typical teenager she loved music and shopping and animals. She was play.

To become a radiology technician after high school. Let's talk about her boyfriend just than what we know about her boyfriend at the time. Kyler Charles used? He was born September four In writing. Eighty eight. He was raised by his grandparents alford endorse, he had a older half brother name, jessup carter and kyler well He was sort of the bad boy in high school. This anti drugs and alcohol. He said drinking and using drugs at like age. Eleven and twelve says, he was using cocaine by age, fourteen even started using heroin by the time he was old enough to drive. He Car would date on and off again between two thousand and six and two thousand and seven but they would end up breaking up in April two thousand and seven because

which is argue all the time in kyler, wasn't the nicest guy just in it. Happen when two people are dating, that friends can slip to the side right, they sort of really get into each other, and sometimes that causes people in such relationships to start to re, evaluate they sarka miss their friends. They start to think about where their life is headed and it certainly seemed like cora like. Maybe the relationship wasn't the best choice because she had written on or myspace page of anywhere members that I made no other for any of my friends nor my family over. Nine months. I forgot the person that I was I'm trying to that person again and sometimes you way to find that person is to break up with your boyfriend or your girlfriend She dedicated oliver time to him and it wasn't that healthy. What do we know about her disappearance? Justin word now getting into April of two things:

seven in this is kind of setting up what was going on in the final days before her disappearance just days before April, twenty eightth, two thousand seven she was leaving her job at popeye's. Chicken kyler was waiting for and asked her to hang out. She said no, but he being b stop her boyfriend or ex boyfriend said now. You need to get in my car and he forced her into his car and the name drove around a little bit and then he let her out and grand view missouri. So, if you imagine kansas city rate towns, the arm pet of kansas city, ran view as the shoulder and then Alton is right above that, so he's driven her waterways away, and then just let her out. Now you see they drove around, but really he was driving around. She had say in the matter here and he was

doing very abusive and aggressive towards her. This is essentially kidnapping cause she forced into his car, and she couldn't get out when this is She tells the police. She goes to the police and belgian and says my ex boyfriend kyler used kidnapped me. He restrained me and he choked me and he told them. We had recently broken up and said I dont know what he'll do next they inform her that she should probably get a protection order and chorus with their mother tongue. later. On April thirtieth, they go and submit for temporary order of protection against kyler. It was sir to him the next day and the hearing was scheduled for may tenth because you get a temporary order, which tells that purse You need to stay away from whoever, but then you have to

core and argue whether or not it's a valid protection order? That's just the way it works, but she had to wait ten days for this court hearing, but kyler was supposed to keep his distance during this time. So that's the last significant thing. Happened before may for two thousand and seven when at five seventeen p m someone to the belgian police and reported Carl capacity as missing many people have been trying to get a hold. Her. But no one could we're talking her family friends, no, get a hold of her, I should say she was seen that morning. She was very social. Very going very engaged with people very close to her family, not the type of person to just, away, a way initially when they try to thought this place. Support I don't know how serious it was taken, cause one

The family members is seen in an interview, say yeah said: maybe she just ran off. She didn't wanna, be around you guys anymore, then am I gonna? That's not what you should tell family when their daughter dismissing and that's something we said before. You need to believe the family at any amount of time that you start losing because you're not taking it seriously. Well, it could be costly, but despite that, just in the police begin investigating this disappearance and they managed to put together a timeline. Of course, there are interviews to conduct, but what they figure out that may fourth Cora walked a school about a mile, walk and sheep. I called her mom when she got there and told her about a textbook that she had forgotten at home and she also asked her to wash her work clothes if she could now Ronda dropped off that book later in the morning and kara picked it up at the school office. Now

according to witnesses at the school they said there was nothing out of the ordinary with car, but still the police got the videos, these surveillance videos from the high school, which, how often do these things work just then we cover all these cases and none of them work right bomb like one the class, but I dont want to annoy the audience like. Oh my god, my actual videos work. Yes, so they got them and data however, that at nine nineteen em they see Cora, leaving the school wearing sure blue jeans and black and white chequered shoes- is this kind of hunting video. This is the last citing of car capacity she was supposed to work at popeye's This is a shift starting at four pm but never showed up so she's. Obviously, in school early because nine nineteen- I am, she still has more classes, so we can just assume she's meeting somebody. I don't wanna, say she's skipping school or anything, but something's happening

she's left the school property and she's expected at work later, it's unknown We also know that she's, not someone who just mrs work so of course, justin who's. The obvious suspect it's kyler, you straight because cora had taken out an order, protection against him tat. You would think well I'd, say detectives, I think they're moving fairly. He quickly. I know the family may not quite see it that way, but it's on may sixty thousand seven ten thirty at night, when detect, is meet with kyler at his house and they ask him questions they want to know. Whence. Last time you talked to clara, whence last He saw her, and his answer is that he had last seen her on. May third, that's just one day before she disappeared, and he said he also talked to her after she got done with work. That night He said he did not see her on may forth, but that he had mister

from her around eleven a m. So of course he said, I tried calling her back, but she didn't answer. Justin when you're building a timeline. You can't just trust people right if there's a way to vet what they said to verify: that's what they to do and, of course, in this case the police they obtain the phone records they figure out that his times in a regarding these calls they're not accurate, throw little lafayette. Car I called him at nine thirteen. I am and it car and at on twenty eight minute after she was last seen, leaving the school kyler called her back. so right at the moment she disappears they're calling each other, I would say that's a pretty good indication that he might have something to do with this, and it also shows deception because he's trying to give times related to the

information. That's known right to the police anyway, in from and he would know about because he called her at nine twenty, that's far away from the time that he gave them. He said called they're back around eleven a m times are way off. In my opinion. Now we know this is a legitimate disappearance because may ninth cora go and pick up her paycheck from popeye's. Now she hadn't been working. Obviously, but now who's leaving money on the table and meaning is running away. You would think she would want her last paycheck to get a head start on that, but she doesn't come back to work, and this is just really backing up people their theories on what happened here. They suspect foul play not just in her mother Rhonda to the court hearing for it. order, protection and the job granted a continued order, protection against schuyler used. Then, on june, first, the police went to the high school and searched her

locker they found her debit card inside had not been used, her clothes, and other important belongings were still at home in her bedroom and her. phone wasn't used since that day that morning that she went missing. So this is contact is gone. There's no evidence of her anywhere at this point is when I first heard about this case, because made national news. It was being hoarded everywhere at the time in may, two thousand and seven weeks later, kyler spoke to the press about car capet He has a photo of her on his cell phone at that point and he said that wanted to have fun and experience life and had talked about running away to mexico, the next time she experienced any trouble at home- and he said I have No idea where she is now. This is question we'll just and because, if car capacity has an order of protection against kyler,

used. Why would the media want to hear what he had to say? especially if he's giving a story that oh she probably ran away to meet. This doesn't make sense on the face of it right. I think they're trying to kid it's him in a lie there trying to be like hey. What's your explanation here, this is what a lot of the news agencies do. I think they were trying to catch him, an ally. I think they were actually trying to see if he would say something that would make him look guilty, because at this point everyone at the school all the parents. Everyone knows that he was her ex boyfriend, They weren't getting along. She got an order protection. This is spreading like wildfire. Everyone thinks he's got it did it? Well, that's true! But you know we do have some evidence that the belgian police we're looking for any other suspects. They were

just relying on kyler use. Despite the strong indications here, we had covered a case, Kelsey smith. In the past and there was a perpetrator in that case, named at when hall, the belgian police contacted the overland park, place kansas and work. Damned determine if at when hall could have possibly been involved in car capacities. Disappearance. Given all information they had and the information they got from the imminent part police. It wasn't looking like a very good lead, but yet Some of the things we have to mention, because so often police will get sir thing of a lead and they will lapse to it. In this case they were looking outside of her immediate circle of people, so I have to give them to props for that it is good that there are broadening their view the media asked the button police, a good question and actually the captain of the belgian police captain spears.

was the one fielding the question he was asked about. Her cell phone couldn't day track the cell phone to figure where they should be looking, and he said the battery in the cell phone had to be on and charged and appears at herself was either turned off or the bad he died, so you can't just ping or phone is absolutely right and if somebody knows what they're doing they would have removed that battery from the phone. Now, despite us, talking about the belgian police broadening their view and seemingly tracking down is mainly as they can and doing many interviews well, in late june of two thousand seven, there was a petition started and they were more than twelve hundred signatures collected, which asked for Missouri attorney general J Nixon to take over the investigation, This petition was stating that the belgian police were mishandling karas disappearance and in this case the belt and

lease while they had a response to this. They said the family of karl capacity and the belgian police department would like to bring the focus of finding car teaches that binding cora said Karas family. As far as they could tell believed that law enforcement was doing everything they could to find her. Her family really has once spect in mind and they don't feel like the police are pressing him hard enough and I do understand that in our just then, just knowing that there is this contact between cora and kyler in that very short term frame between nine thirteen and nine twenty in the morning right when she disappears. How much more do you need right? I myself would call the pro bull cause to invest. It further and maybe get an arrest warrant or bring him in for questioning. But that's just me yeah they did,

I should add that it, it didn't feel like they really pressed him. That's just a feeling. I got it felt like they just wanted to speak with him. I'm not sure all police agencies would have handled it. That way. The belgian police department of course, says working with all kinds of agencies, even the fbi. put together a twenty thousand dollar reward, leading to any information about her location. The money was completely raised by donations. There were several fund razors, one was fined, cora capacity, dot, com and another one was a myspace page, and it's not until July of two thousand seven that detective. go to interview kyler again this time, they're saying why happened on that weakened toe where you were give us your time frame of what happened. The last time you spoke with her. We said that he and had an argument on the night of may third and that she is planning to spend the weekend party

and running around on him. Those are his words yeah. Those are his in out no matter what was said. I doubt carker pesky would say I'm going around on you, but he's a urging that she was playing to meet up with another guy, while the police get the name and they contact him. His initial reggie age he said he had in visiting from saint Louis Missouri, he tried calling kara on may six, but she had an answer. The phone and I may seven, he called her home and that's when he found out that she was missing. That something is wanting to happen more more as we cover this as we go on justin as will be used some initials, because the media at the time, while they were using initials, so that these people's identities wouldn't just be exposed I'll, say that it's. The main reason here is to protect their identities because a lot of these people- they're friends of colors they're, all friends with each other. They don't want

someone's name out there and then half bunch of crazies calling their house and threatening them. So there's a person police interviewed K are he's a friend of tyler's. According to him, I may fourth car called him and asked if she and kyler could hang out with him and care said sorry, I'm too busy, but- around twelve thirty in the afternoon. Kyler showed up to his house. Kara was not there, she didn't come with him later in the day, Kyler called K are, and he was crying on. The phone according to kay are in Miller said: don't tell anyone that he inquired together earlier that day, because there is that protection order against him. So k are attempted to call cora multiple times, but he couldn't reach her. course he wants to know. What's going on and kyler well eventually has an alibi that he was with his family. I'm a fourth and he also passed allied attacked her test. We come polygraph take moment ticket. from our sponsor thrive. Idle

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I think, and no one saw them together that day courting two cars family to police never checked his alibi. They never questioned his family or if they did, they just took everyone's work. For what sense do you have a this? Just, do you think that's pretty much it do you think the police, about two easily here or do you think they felt like they still? This didn't have quite enough to run with here. I think they could vet everything this guy, sang and if he says he was with his family, they could question is family. They could check phone records, they could check his family's phone records. I mean a few shot. lived somewhere they're going to check the security cameras to see what happened. I don't feel like bear vetting his statements that well, because we have already seen that he said this is the last time I spoke with They pulled phone records for that dated match up. They bring him back in for questioning months later

he gives an alibi according to cars, parents that wasn't followed up on one give it a new story as well a new story about having an argument with her, and so the question would be How many lies? Do you have to sit through before you say? What are you hiding? I mean they even have a friend of his coming forward and saying yeah. This is some stuff that I know about and it again puts the light right back on kyler I mean. Who else is there? There has to be a point at which you say have enough to run with. This is the person of interest we hear at many times that the police can interview you until you talk, I feel like they re they didn't put a pressure on kyler. No, in fact some of The energy is with law enforcement, they talked what we really wanted to cover our basis here we really wanted to nail this down and we just didn't have enough on anyone and I'm thinking

covered, a lot of cases where somebody said that person over their mentioned this murder and their throne. Into an interrogation room for twelve hours. So this guy last person to be seen with her has phone records phone logs connect hence and protection order. What's the pulled up here, I don't know, I don't either, but any time you have a missing person and its hit the media there people who think they may know something right may have seen something in this case in two thousand seven alone there were a number of bodies found. This included may do june and october. There were three different bodies found and they to check dental records in each. These cases, none of the bodies discovered were that of cargo pesky, which of course, her parents were happy to hear because

there is always that hope that while she's missing, maybe she's just being held somewhere and she can be recovered. Yet it's in august of two thousand and nine when there's to our special on missing persons on e entertainment and car capacity was one of the cases and by this time the reward for information. Leading to cars, location went up to thirty thousand dollars. Just in something interesting happened, a doctor by two thousand and nine in manhattan. There was a girl that was on the street there, claiming she didn't know who she was. A friend of Karas, saw the news and thought the kind it looks like cora. So her parents were notified and, of course, Rhonda took a look and said now: that's not cora summit. It just goes to show how many times there can be this false sense of hope, bodies found somebody spotted somewhere. It wreak havoc on the family, having their hopes rise, and get let down over and over and over again

The emotional rollercoaster must have been very difficult for this family and for cars. Friends, luckily that one and who they thought could have been. Caro I'd actually turned out to be a woman by the name of casey Elise and she was identified so that's good, but meanwhile rhonda and Jim her parents they just keep coming up empty. They do say that, because kara is named keith, It's popping back up in the media that they were hopeful that, because of that sustained media attention, that it would help the case in some way in two thousand and ten kyler was arrested. He had been working as an apprentice at a I parlour and the owner was very suspicious that multiple tattoo machines and boxes of needles, bottles of ink and razors were missing They were later located in killers car. He was indicted by

and jury in november, of two thousand and eleven, and in two thousand and fourteen he pleaded guilty to felony stealing, which is a class c felony, we're not sure how long he spent in jail, but he obviously spent some time in there the police haven't given up, but, as you can see, in the two thousand and ten now years have passed, and you would just think that something would happen. a lead anything but now April, twenty sixth, six of two thousand ten, a guy named nick yeats was interviewed by police. Now he had been a roommate of tyler's several the earlier and they played in a band together, he had a story to tell it was about eight months before this interview and We're gonna go back to two thousand nine here, nick and kyle, were hanging out at a fast food place after a party and nick was tat king about relationship issues, will kyler told them don't get tat to women, and he started his talk about how

cora, discordant, love him, and he was very angry about it, and he also told nick that he had just snapped and done something bad to cara so you can imagine this is another friend of killers telling police very sick Issues, information about kyler, used, we're not mentioning a lot of other people. It was all rumoured, but right after her disappearance, tons of people said: oh yeah, that guy he brags about it all the time, but it was never reported to the police now. Obviously, harris, family and friends. They want to keep her name out there and in may of two thousand ten I may second, they dissipated in an honor walk for, third anniversary of cork patsy's disappearance and they were very excited to announce a permanent increase to that reward, which was now eighty thousand dollars the hope is, but

much money hanging out there. Someone will be willing to talk and solve this case brain car home. Maybe somebody that's and with a certain somebody that may have a little bit more information would be willing to talk for eighty grand they also get. their story on the net graecia and if there is any, out there. That's going to tell it like it is: it's gonna, be nancy, grace and number of two thousand ten investigation discoveries disappeared also covered car capacities, disappearance. I've said it before, but I think that's an incredible show, because this story is hitting the news in a big way again in two thousand and ten, the police getting new leads. Unfortunately, of marked helpful people calling in what they know what they think they ve seen, but allow those things as they follow up on him turn out to be basically useless, people say I think I saw somebody looked like horror, but it turns out to be nothing it's in january, twenty

second, two thousand eleven when a pretty big break happens. Caitlin Ferris, who is killers ex girlfriend, reaches out to the police and she has some stunning information. She straight up says: kyler confessed to her about the murder of capacity. I dont know how much more evidence you need here, but he said that the day car disappeared, the two had bantered back and forth nearest car she refused to get in and like previous engagements, he wrapped her by the hair and tried to drag her into his car. Then he went on to strangle her and then he put her body in the woods she gives. This statement doesn't hear much back. Just days later. She goes back to the police. and said: Kyler had been at her house and once again talked about and confessed to The car is murder again, he does

I've how he choked her and saw her last breath, He put her body in the woods, so it's February eleven twenty eleven she agree to wear a wire I and ii b I and law enforcement get her to go. I can talk to kyler again trying to get to make incriminating statements about what he did on that fateful day. Now, the same year kyler had started dating a woman by the name of canvas saint clair. She had a moving in with kyler after she was kicked out of her home fairly or parents. Didn't like her son, king marijuana, now around midnight on July, twenty second or twenty third of twenty eleven kyler had come home he was drunk. He found her packing oliver bags up to leave him, she was pregnant at the time he dragged her to the bedroom and got on top of her and, according to her, she said he used both his hands to crush

my trachea and apparently, while he was doing this, he down at her, and he said, if you scream again, I will kill you faster than you can let out another scream. I have killed other ex girlfriend and jealousy. I will kill you before you can let out another scream out of your throat. She said she most when unconscious, and then he started punching her thighs to keep her awake He did this over and over again till she finally lost consciousness. Just in this process, isn't surprising, but she said when she finally awoke He was cradling her and whispering. I love you. Hats, creepy and now Absolutely in line behaviour of an abusive narcissistic person I believe every word she said here. I don't know She was dating ham and then away. You might have killed somebody else now. I'm gonna turn on you. I believe every word she says here yeah this July,

Fifth, twenty eleven when candice left him part of it wasn't just the abuse. It was also that he had been cheating on her on august nineteenth two twenty eleven she went to the police. They asked her What took you so long to come in a report this and she said because she was scared. Now she had visas are thighs. There is herr missing from her head, and she said that's because, He would drag her by her hair and it would come out. She said that. Kyler had killed. Pets set him, six? Twenty eleven kyler plead guilty to one count of domestic violence in Kansas city municipal court. He got two years of probation pleading. Healthy. He did that, so he wouldn't have to go to jail and he also was required to attack. and a better prevention programme candice filed. It's up in october of two thousand and eleven with an order of protection, she ended up cancelling that order. Two months later saying she didn't needed anymore, but kyler. Well, he stay out of trouble. Could he just and because his probation

was later revoked. He didn't attend one of his twenty six error intervention classes. So they im one hundred and eighty days in jail, that's the most. They could put away, for he was four hundred twenty days before he was led out. He got. We're time initially for stealing tattoo supplies, but then because he didn't show up to one of them, asses. They hit him with a hundred and eighty days in jail june, fifth, twenty twelve cod the former roommate set Duncan reached out to the police and belgian in really two thousand twelve. According to south kyler admitted to picking car up at school because she had fought with a teacher heat he said that he in cairo we're having relationship problems and he choked her to death. That's what he told Seth he again talked about. watching car. I take her last breath and putting her in the woods again. I think this is important because

This is the story we heard before from someone else in our hearing it from another person. You would think this is adding up to multiple people who, witnesses to confessions here from kyler used with this a pattern of behaviour. A lot of this just adds up, but he can They had a trouble now. This just keeps piling up later that year. U s customs agents in San francisco intercepted a ship designer drugs- while these just happened be shipped to kyler you. In Kansas city till they go and talk to kyler use, and he says why was going to use these drugs as vegetable fertilizer. I don't buy that so then he changes this story to well. I was buying the drugs for a friend. He got forty five months in federal prison after pleading guilty too intent to distribute the controlled substance. That's a fair a felony now Rondon Jim, they went to the sentencing were disappointed. He only got forty five months and that's because

Apparently, the guidelines recommend up to eighty seven months. They just want to see sky put away because they know when their heart of hearts that he has some to do with their daughters, disappearance and his I don't behaviour just reinforces that believe. So, while he's being held, and this when he's in Oklahoma in EL reno investigators go back and they want to talk to him because they say you talked with us- and you said this is when you gotta call, but your times don't match the phone records killers response was basically nothing. He did want talk with them. Eight years later there asking them about the discrepancies better late than never. I guess gallop. don't really know just I mean it's possible that over time this case has been kicked around two different detectives. I never got the sense that these same detectives are working on a costly,

if they were. This looks even worse, because it would mean that they took this much time to talk with him again about that. This is glaring contradiction. After just many seven months he was granted super. eyes, release and he went to a halfway house and then just two months later, he went to live with. His grandfather under home confinement his grandfather, lives and re town, not too far from where I lived september. Second, He was ordered to serve a weekend in jail for a probation violation when you over the amount of times that he was arrested. Apparently he had eight traffic citations, speeding, failure to obey traffic signs and proper display of licence Late running a red light parking tickets than they were ex additional municipal court cases linked to him, but those were closed, he's not staying out of trouble and its march twenty eightth twenty. Sixteen a witness j c contacted the police. He claims

He was a cellmate of colors in Oklahoma. He says that kind, or had asked him for an alibi for the day car was murdered. He explained that heat wrangled. His girlfriend and put her in the woods this guy's calling he's not trying to get a reduced sentence, he's not trying to get anything he's calling and say This guy told me what he did and he wanted me to be his alibi, but didn't know that well he's my soulmate, I dont get word jaycees mode, would be, to call and report this, unless it was just true. So, as we say, This has been years from two thousand and seven to two thousand and sixteen. During this time, car capacity continued to be missing, but in twenty sixteen another woman- went missing. This is where we need to talk about jessica russians who was born on July, tat, mighty ninety five as for John Jamie, and she

two younger sisters? Her parents, of course, were also divorced, jessica, I lived in re, more misery and she had a cat name tag. She worked as a baker at the box would spring senior living community. Let's talk about September nine. Twenty sixteen she was to go to a doctor's appointment, is a follow up to an app and act to me. What we know about this well, her mother was waiting, therefore, but just Her did not show up. She needed to go to this appointment cleared to go back to work, calls were made to herself on, went straight to voice mail. it's like her phone was turned off, and this was extremely unusual for jessica and again she had a doctor's appointment. She was supposed to be at her mom her families thinking okay, this is totally out of the ordinary and its at ten

Ten p m that night that Jamie russians, her mother, called the Kansas city police to report just committing. She reports are missing to the belgian police department. The neck day belt and police started investigating jessica's disappearance and, as I did with car combats keys case. They started to put together a time They wanted to know what she was doing around that time who she was in time with what do we know it was thursday September eight. Twenty! Sixteen, when jessica, was that a house already in grand view, Missouri and lo and behold, there's a name of a person who she was therewith named kyler used, who at that time was twenty. Six years old now kyler happen france, which ask as boyfriend for quite a long time, according to witnesses who they spoke with. They said kyler was drinking heavily and acting very aggressively here, also, apparently being very possessive of jessica. Now they said you could see these two arguing about it.

P m Jessica left the party with kyler she driving her black, two thousand twelve shabbily equinox according to the witnesses it appeared ass though she was going to be giving him a ride home, so that was September. Eight september tenth at one. Forty one of the morning police found a burning car in the air have ninety fifth street and blue river road. This was in jackson, county missouri. This vehicle was that too and twelve severally equinox that belonged to jessica, burundians, so earn this time I was riding around on scooters. I had a little hundred and fifty cc scooter and I could taken on the highways but in re town, and I worked in overland part blue river road was this isolated desolate road that I could take my school iran to and from work can it was a beautiful ride when this happened.

I will ride along blue river road almost weekly cause. I was like looking to see if I could find clothing or something along the road, because I knew this area very well when they found this burned at suv, pretty creepy jessica's He was not found in the burning tv Missouri She rescue in those days following the discovery of this vehicle, searched those wooded areas, but they didn't find jessica. She wasn't around this vehicle. Otherwise they would have found her later on september, tent jessup carter. Kyler is half brother would end up going to police. He tells them that kyler strangled jessica and she was gone. He dragged her body to a wooded area and then he asked for help too. Per car her vehicle and set it on fire this.

his half brother giving this story with tyler's background and history pretty believable, and then you see photos of kyler his ass burned. He has second and third degree burns on his fingers. There's a lot. going on here that backs up jessup story that they dumped this vehicle and set it ablaze. Sometime that same day, just in jessup, pulled over by the police. He was with kyle, and another person. He was charged with multiple traffic violations, but the here is. You have Jessup his half brother telling police everything he knows September eleventh neither six in the morning the police served a search warrant at jessup, mobile, home and edwards are there looking for items justin that would back up his story there looking for weapons, accelerants, any kind of blood or clothing, any items that are tied to this case or that are of illegal nature, brown eyes.

in time they also arrested. Kyler used on another warrant, for knowing the burning, jessica's car, that's a class, the felony, but the thing here is they can get him. custody and now they can actually go to work, can't they yeah at this. Time. When jessica goes missing, it gets. port. It everywhere. There saying the last person that she was seen with was kyler, and you can just imagine that cars family is throwing their hands up in the air and screaming at the tvs because they're like he did it he's the guy I've seen so many interviews with the family and their just in disbelief at this point that this guy has now got away with it again. Kyler used photographed. He has these burns on him. His hair is singed. He has scratches on his hands his arms and his face. They take swaps from him, fingernail scrapings. They collect some of his hair and they take his clothing. Now he pleased

guilty to thee, knowingly burning this vehicle, but september fourteenth detective. Spend about three hours searching kyler grandfathers house in Kansas city, his grave There is actually cooperative he's psych. He was with me, he's a good boy the things there showing now he's never showed here, but things change. I guess he lets the man he lets them, search everything he is somewhat helpful with the investigation, he was trying to do was help his grandson when he was in times of need, but he doesn't know the monster that was living there october. Fifth, two thousand sixteen erin cabin I do who is a former roommate of kyler use he reached out to the police, and he talked about in two thousand and thirteen cuyler showed up at his house. He was

Thank he was emotional. He had a bottle of whisky in his hand, and parenting had had a girlfriend who had just left him kyler. And this emotional state admitted to him that he had killed cora now he didn't give him details, but he said kyler, was confessing to this and crying aaron said he feared for his own life. While he tried to call him down. He had heard rumours about people associated with kyler, disappearing and again. This is a lot of the rumour ville that was going around, but people weren't coming forward, but now their hearing about a second woman disappearing ok, it's all making sense now Roommate probably should have come forward at the time, but he just wasn't. understanding standing, be calibre the situation I have personally from what I understand he did, immediately. After the place for one because he was scared of kyler, but also he said, he eventually went because once he heard about jessica's disappearance, he said this

situation was already eating him up: could not live with it. So after that discovery of task as disappearance, he said he had to come forward. He said not going to you to tell you this, he said it's one of them. are things that has ever happened to me. So is it If we get this off his chest october, eight twenty sixteen- This is one month after desk as disappearance, family and free. Of hers gathered a hickman mills community christian church. This isn't south kansas city and they have a prayer vigil and a balloon release? They were true. To raise money for the search, and for raising awareness of her disappearance. There were search is conducted in the grand view and belgian area. This gives a little. stir family. They feel good that so many people want to help out and want to bring just go home and even Karas family has joined with jessica's family. And their forming a bond in their searching together when jessica runnion disappeared, mom Jamie she did

have any idea who kyler used was and she the internet to try and see what she could figure out here. She was reading about car capacities case, and this is they made that connection justin jamie, contacted rhonda, Karas, mother and she's people say they understand that they don't really but rhonda. Does she talk about the numbness, the anger they feel like. They can't really do anything they feel helpless really, but to get there when they can join forces. They have more hope and they really understand each other. They won't get word from our answer. You know when you're watching a crime show and your like wait, did they act? they do it. Oh they definitely did way. Well almost definitely, or are you just meant to think they did nope it totally? unless they didn't? If this is you talking to yourself or whoever's? Next to you on the couch, we say, keep talking.

Who are we to judge ready to stream some crime stories? Hulu, it's a crime not to watch. Now we ve talked to. whole time just than about carker pesky, her disappearance, kyler used and then, of course, jessica trunnions. This case has gone on for years April. Third, twenty seventeen. When there is fine, Finally, a major break in the case, and this is actually about the time when we started talking about covering this case, and it was so close home for us. But I really wanted to wait and see how this whole pan out, but this must hunter he's identified is t K, he's up near a quarry by two hundred and thirty threerd street, and why highway mrs way up and cast county Missouri, he finds some human remains, he finds the skull and he's going to report- that back to the police and the police will up informing rhonda about this shit,

call Jamie and the two women went to the site where the place researching they clean they'd never gone that far too soon state only gonna like two hundred fifteen street. This was again a new search, a new hope and more sleepless nights for them in its tuesday April. Fourth of twenty seventeen aceh, can't human school and bones are discovered very close to the first again, this is going to be these two women. It missing, so guy? He says that he dropped their bodies out of the woods there pudding. This together slowly The very emotional quote here. I need areas from Jamie Karas, mother if the first body is jessica's glad she was with kara. My biggest fear was that she was alone, I'm glad they together and rhonda said, we ve just been trying to get you This for car and get resolution. That's our favorite word. I dont like closure. I, like resolution,

We ve been looking for resolution for ten years, and just in that really got to me because, as you and I we may use the word closure. But we know that closure is not something that actually works. You get information, a cry is solved. We know with it betrayed. Her was, we know the circumstances by which had happened, but you dont get closure because the pain stays with you. So I like how she talk. about resolution because it so much more appropriate? It really the nail on the head and you think, with these two bodies, all of these people coming forward and is half brother all talking about his confessions should be able to take all of this information. All of this evidence and thou have something really to work with its discovered. by way of the medical examiners office, that these remains are of car capacity and jessica. Runnion Jessica's remains

obviously had been there a shorter amount of time, so that was the first set to be identified. The second remains, took a while longer to identify they had to use mitochondrial dna. again. This is resolution for the families, the police, because they found the remains. They make very concerted effort to look for additional evidence in the area there, about a hundred and ten officers that participated. They move shoulder to shoulder sometimes on their hands and knees coming through looking for evidence, they said that additional evidence was discovered at the time they didn't give out what that had been April. Twenty nine ten seventeen there is, a celebration of life were jessica, onions at the internet no brotherhood of electrical workers, local union, one twenty four. It was said that there is about three hundred people in attendance jessica's. Forty sister Megan had organized the event

may seventh, twenty seventeen, the tenth annual walk for car a capacity was held in belgian. There was at least a hunt people. They walked along Missouri. Fifty eight really why Rhonda said We see the light at the end of the tunnel, we're just waiting for confirmation. So it's october fifth of two thousand and seventeen they charge cuyler with two counts of first degree: murder, two counts of abandonment of a warps and the next day the charge of knowingly burning a vehicle was trapped, which oh I mean I think they could have hit him with all of these things. They really hit him. What that charter? to hold him, that's really what this is about. They want to get him for The real crimes here for the murders of these two young women. They set his bond one million dollars, which

I don't even know why they gave him bond, but they did. He initially got a public defender and pleaded not guilty to offer accounts against him we already talked about this justin. It seems inconceivable to us that with the information they had in with so many witnesses, bravely forward talking about what they knew, that they didn't go after kyler use. It just so happens after this all started, moving towards trial that the police talkative how without a body they felt like this, is it ass, they could lose and they didn't want to take it to trial. Because few take someone to court and there's no body my slip away, and they didn't want that to happen. I dont if anyone actually wanted them to just arrest in charge him and take them to trial. I think a lot of the public, especially the families. They want, the police to press kyler harder. They wanted him to trip

and all of his interviews. They wanted law enforcement to just keep vetting all of his alibis and contradicting his phone. records. All of those things. Seems like he just came in and spoke a couple times gave some random explanation a lie, and then they wouldn't talk to her for a few more months, and then they stopped talking to him for years. I think that's. Really the issue here. Is it wasn't that they want enforcement just to charge somebody willy nilly and try to get a conviction they wanted pressure put on the sky july? Second, twenty eighteen. Teen carter was charged with second degree arson. Apparently there was a fire at home on manchester when our fight, showed up this man. Just Carter tried to stop them from putting out that fire and one firefighters said that jessup told him This is my domain. I started the fire and you have no authority here. Just said, I deny that

I had nothing to do with the fire, but they book him into the jackson county jail on september, nineteen, twenty eight teen around four thirty. In the morning, Jessup was found unresponsive and his cell. They had to sport of the hospital, but he was pronounced dead at the time. They said It was an apparent suicide, but they were investigating. Jessup, of course, was supposed to be appearing in court he took his own life. When you have the half brother willing to testify against kyler is referred to as the star witness, but really we have multiple witness here he might have had one of the more impact full testimonies if he had made a trial, but I don't think we need his testimony against kyler. Now one worthing justin recollection is, is that by this fire there was a shirt found that belong the used. Do you know anything about that? sir interviewing different friends from the party.

That night and different family members- and it said that, right after just erroneous, his appearance, tat, tyler and his half brother burn something in their backyard and then a day later, the suv is said ablaze Also in january of twenty twenty alfred used, Tyler's grandfather would pass away? Now you had said grandfather had good things to say about kyler yeah. He going to going to be testifying against his grandson, but in the obituary for alfred used, there is no mention of kyler so no matter what Alfred had said about him, the family. That's left there not meant kyler probably for obvious reasons they don't want to be associated with them. The trial is supposed to start november for twenty nine. But there were many delays, his attorney

These were arguing that, due to the media attention, they couldn't have this trial health and cast counting because he was already deemed guilty in the press. There's a lot of evidence against and that people knew about. They eventually agreed have the trial in cast canny, but they would get the jurors from outside of their. They would actually go to saint Charles county witches by saint louis. That's across the state. That's weird! But hey whatever works, now killers. Attorneys also claimed that he wasn't competent to stand trial so you know what that means. They have to order a mental evaluation, but they disagree. They say now he's competent honestly. If you ve seen any interview with kyler, if you ve seen him talk to news reporters or watch him at trial, he is very coherent, clear and concise. I was a little amazed that day through that out, because I was like there is no way he could fail

mental evaluation. This guy is very quick on his feet. Very witty and very intelligent. Now everyone say about him. This is obviously a move desperation. This trial, doesn't get under way until April of twenty twenty one. Let's talk about what the cascade prosecutor bend butler what he starts with, he said Carro tried to end her relationship with used because abuse used said. If I can't have her, nobody can use murdered sick, I with deliberation same as either cora before, because no one else can have Jessica either and he talked about how after kyler kill jessica, he took her body back to the same spot where he had disposed of cars body. This is pretty soon both connect, the dots here. We know that he admitted several people that he drug their bodies out into the woods now they fight We found that spot now, many of the peace.

But we mentioned they're out there. It's episode, like candy saint clair, negates sat Duncan. An errand cap, a meadow. Well, they all our custom, against kyler used there all statements about kyler confessing to murder. We talked about caitlin, ferris justin. I think he's very important in this trial because she had worn a wire that the fbi had put on her and she grew to speak with kyler. They had an hour's, long recording and they play portions of an court and he uses statements like death spot. He too caitlin that she was the only one who knew about the car a thing also Cato talked about how she got kyler to use a week aboard with her to try to contact cora this up. This is a way to bade him to feel comfortable. Talking about the case and kyler said he had bucking killed, and then he asked Caitlin this really

turns you on that. I killed a girl, ha Caitlin said that it didn't, but this makes kyler probably a little bishop say because he said you talked about this before you're trying to get me to talk. This doesn't turn you one I take that as his literally admitting to her he's done this. I don't know how to interpret this now. firstly, the defence, what are they have just in? They have? The old you don't have physical evidence that links our client kyler use to either murder and that, if the attorney sharon telling ten said not. Why hair or a drop of blood existed a link their use to the murders, but supposedly kyler is is amazing criminal. He killed two women and didn't leave a trace said the police had a suspect, driven investigation

meaning they had blinders honour tunnel vision and they failed to collect or even lost evidence, including killers phone records with location data. Then they turn their sights on killers. Half brother jessup. They claim that he could have committed these men. That is quite a pivot. Aaron, that's like It was stephen avery brother, not stephen avery. The defence also brings in a way same Deborah heathland now I'd need us seven by bringing in a different suspect into the trial, is actually the best move they could make because just a card is not around a talk. They can. Pen the murders on him. They can start to maybe get the jury to think of jessup carter. As someone who is haunted by the murders and that's why I took his own life right, that's

idea here than they bring endeavour half when, as a witness, she lived a few blocks from belt in high school. And she said she saw car walking nearer home when a sedan with four people in it followed her and then she she heard a blood curdling scream, of course, Solution has ambitions for Deborah. She admits that it took her three years after the fact to realise that the girl was cora. That sounds pretty. If she'd suppose they see some staff, and then it takes her three years to figure out who was we talk about all the time? We can't remember what we war, sometimes just a week before, let alone three years ago, and now she knows what person look like they also go after the police. They bring in James train him he's a former washington DC detective, and he said this. As a bad investigation, because the kansas city officer interviewed multiple. This is without documentation. He said the belgian police didn't put everything down on paper. They asked leading questions,

they disclosed information provided by other witnesses multiple times, but of course prosecution will ask a simple question: don't you think that we should be in getting a boyfriend with a history of domestic violence. Does that I'm a sense? I love this prosecutor, one of the biggest questions the happened It is when you have a case where someone looks very guilty and of course we need the trial the sword all this out. What will it offence do because if the jury is left, to sort out all the details based on what they ve hurting court. Well, that might be an uphill battle right. So do you have your client testify in their own defence or not normally know, and this defence has attacked everything they could, but they don't. gets gonna, be enough to sway the jury, so kyler will end up taking the stand in his own defence.

I dont know what exactly happened to kara. I didn't do anything to either of them the claim that, on the day car disappeared, he went to his grandfathers house and then to ban practice by the way one of the members of his band said that he admitted to killing cora, then we'll go to throw his half brother under the boss. Tyler thought his half brother jessup was going to take courage to escape park. Later he learned car was missing her aunt. Uncle came to his apartment to see if she was there, he allowed the couple Look around his apartment and he goes. I want to say that he believes that is half brother died by suicide because He learned. Kyler had pleaded not guilty to the murder charges, which you have to say this ridiculous, because that's a common plead right, you'd, say: oh, I'm not guilty. That's common men who comes out just as young pleading, I'm guilty the prosecutor,

I will say how unlucky of a guy are you and kyler will respond anyway. who had a brother who is a serial killer is unlucky. How the full context evidence How could you be the most unlucky guy out there were both of your girlfriend's would end up missing and being murdered. What are the chances of that? This is his response my brother's a serial killer. He also tat. the question of Caitlin Ferris, who had worn a wire, and he said because she was attracted to him because of the accusations of murder he decided to play into the sexual fantasy yeah. This is basically all just redirect it's all just its carter. I wouldn't have done this. I didn't do it. I could, have done it. I dont know why people are making these stories up when I first had heard about this, just in that they were accusing jessup carter and that jessup carter had died. By his own hand, it really got me wondering

It's a really got me wondering it meant like wow. This is One hell of a strategy how lucky would you have to be to have two girlfriends to women? were connected with die like this to be murdered and so I really wondered if this would work. I hate to put it this way, but It is a great defensive strategy. It sickens me, but it's a great strategy, the assistant prosecutor julie totally. She went right after Kyler Bessy said you're just trying to invent an alibi. She asked him why that week was the first time you accuse Yes, if carter of involvement and kyler said now. I told my attorney years before and that's why she was pending and pro bono, and she told him how human be the most unlucky guy in the world, have to ex girlfriend, go missing and be murdered and

their responded. Anyone who had a brother who was a serial killers unlucky. We talked about this justin and here's. The great thing is totally said: you're the one on trial, not jessup, just occur in kurdistan We are there there waiting the verdict, its April fifteenth, twenty twenty one tyler is found guilty of v. voluntary manslaughter for car as death? Now in that's right off families are not happy because Oh and terry manslaughter does not carry much time and this is their daughter, but he was also found guilty of second degree: murder in jessica's death, little better, but it was up to the jury right. They had the option. They had different charges to choose from whenever they thought appropriate being that's, much time had passed, not a lot of fun. It's evidence to tie him to this. They did what They could, I guess, April sixteen twenty twenty.

One family and friends gave impact statements before the jury would give it sentencing commendations now, Rhonda hers really hit me justin. She said I dont feel it. Justice was served as far. car was concerned, and that's just what you said. This isn't the kind of verdict they expected Jim said that run paid Karas phone bill for fourteen years. The reason well, if you were to check the phone records today we'll see that I called it on Sunday night just to hear that one little wisp of her voice jamie said it's been the longest for years and seven months of my life, this is pain that. liberates throughout the families. This is the way they cope, calling to hear a message on a phone just really hits home that this is more than the missing persons case is more than just a murderer. I've saved off voice bells. From my brother and sister from my phone and saved amanda. computer, so I understand,

really really sad, and this has devastated the families jamie also stated that one of the other daughters had a suicide attempt because of all of this, it's not just somebody that's murdered by their family is torn up. Are the jury recommended sentences of fifteen years for manslaughter and life in prison with the possibility of pearl former june seventh? twenty one, the official sentencing hearing happened, assistant prosecutor, Julie, totally said kyler shown a lack of remorse over the years. A failure to ever accept any responsibility for anything and she wanted kyler to finally be put as for stealing the lives of car and jessica killers, defence team, of course they are not happy with results. They file a motion for a new trial. This was kicked away rather quickly. Kyler was actually sense to life plus fifteen years in prison to be served consecutively? Good, yes,

I dont know what true justice in this case would be, but just like what was said earlier resolution justin. This is what helps the families it finally happened. The person who is responsible for killing Two young women has finally be brought to justice. He wore hopefully never been let out of prison. He will spend the rest of his life there. A lot of people are upset by this case because they feel that just his death was preventable. They feel like he could have been stopped after car capet, his murder. I have associates and acquaintances that new some of the people that were friends with car and kyler amongst the circles. Everyone thought it was him. Everyone said That guy is something about him, and We all know that he did it. There was no doubt in anyone's mind believing just

can you know, isn't enough same time with all these people going forward. You would think that there would have been a little bit more movement on the side of law enforcement. It just adds that feeling of helplessness that no matter how many things happen that you would think would help the case forward, sometimes it doesn't seem to help not for a while, and all these people come four didn't really seem to have an effect until the trial and it sucks, because these families are asking people to come forward. Please If you know something come forward and they do and then it takes years for anything to happen, I think just served, but it took jessica's disk and murder before it felt like the ball got moving there, so many other cases that we cover earn were somebody. as a history? Somebody has a past their ex wife I'd in it wasn't investigated and then their current wife. missing or dies, and then

sudden things are taken seriously or they started back and look at the first wife's mysterious death and then find out o thou hast thou play, and now we can charge this person with two murders and its frustrating, because you had hoped. The investigation could have been taken seriously, beginning and we wouldn't be sitting here talking about two wonderful people had been taken from the earth and their families destroyed, never missed. episode of generation, why subscribed to us on apple podcast, spotify cash box or reverie listening right now also sure to follow us on social media. Our tik tok is at general pod. Our instagram is at generation. Why podcast join wondering plus in the wondering, app to listen ad free

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