« The Generation Why Podcast

Laurie Bembenek //Replay


Replay episode. May 28, 1981. Milwaukee, WI. Christine Schultz was found deceased in her home, the victim of a shooting. She had been bound prior to being shot in the back. Her two sons, ages 7 & 11, had been at home and the older one had witnessed the gunman. Despite a description of a male suspect by one of the boys, the police focused their investigation on the ex-husband's new wife. Were the police connecting the dots properly or were their instincts incorrect?

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Join wonder, plus in the laundry app to listen ad free. How you doing tonight doing great Justin, how about you I'm doing good With no fees or minimums banking with capital, one is the easiest decision in the history of decisions even easier then deciding to listen to another episode of your favorite podcast with no we're draft fees. Is it even Susan, that's banking, reimagined! What's in your wallet terms, apply! capital one dot com, Slash bank capital. In a member f. I c audible it's me, enjoy all my audio entertainment in one app, I'm always finding the best of what I
and discovering new things every day they have an article selection of audio books across every John Raw best sellers to mysteries and thrillers, and they have exclusive audible, originals ranging from top celebrities, renowned experts, and it also includes the since a pod cas as a member, I get full access to the, rowing selection, including audio books, all their original ample cas. I found a lotta gems in their original section and I love the app on my phone because I can set a timer and fall asleep. While listening to some of my favorite audio books, you can download come to your app. If you're flying seek you listen to it. Offline new members can try audible free for thirty days, visit, audible dot com. Slash Judah BP or text Judah BP, two five hundred five hundred, that's audible, dot, Slash Guida, BP or text Gwp to two five hundred five hundred. We have a gnarly case tonight. I
realize what we bit off with this one cause. I just thought out system. Another Nother ass. If somebody, you know it's kind of crazy murder, and I actually went into it not realizing that it was kind of a wrongful eviction case, that sort of came out while I was researching it there are so many rather holes, but this one so What are we? What are we discussing tonight? We're talking about Lorenz, yet Ben Bennett, who was arrested and later convicted for the murder of her husband's Ex wife, Christine shots on May twenty eighth of nineteen eighty one? It will probably refer to her as Lori for the rest of the show Lorenzo Penn Bantick is her actual name in one thousand nine hundred and ninety four. She legally changed it to Laurie Bembenek, so I feel comfortable calling her Lori. That's fine many people they were were
to her as Bambi, but Bambi Is a name given to her by the media? and the media also was calling her a playboy bunny. This was problematic me, because when I was researching this for short. While I thought she was a playboy bunny, she just worked as as a cocktail way Is there a server at a a playboy club for, like everywhere yeah three weeks not even a month. She's now known as the Playboy Bunny That murdered her husband's ex, yet I think she was a police officer for a lot longer than she was a working at a a playboy club bright. Possibly, That was the career that she was looking too for herself, she went into the academy she graduated six, their class. I believe that's good, but at that I'm she had a roommate and her.
Mate was going through the academy as well, and her name was Judy's ass. She was using marijuana. That's a question with Lori. Was she a user? I mean we do really know, we know that there was a phone call placed that made an accusation and then later she and Judy went to a rock concert and according to Laurie. She didn't use any marijuana at the concert, but Judy did buy busted and Judy gets busted the police take her in. While she is a saying in a report that lorry used marijuana and that gets lorry in trouble. both of these women end up getting fired or dismissed from the department. For this reason We actually was involved with some different stuff with the police agency. We were with this later when she was going internal affairs and and filing complaints or issues with other
officers. This was later because she felt that the dismissal was unfair and then, when she was shown some photos of officers at a picnic it was a nude party will put it that way. It a nude party and there were activities going on at this party that were in violation of the department's policies, so she was looking at this and thinking we'll all of these awful. Are still working for the department at had a minor infraction here and in accusatory one at that, it's not like they caught her with it. Meanwhile, these other people are in photograph. Doing illegal activities, at least as far as the departments concerned against department policy. definitely right and they're still working for the department. So she took this to the equal employment opportunity, Commission of Milwaukee, She felt she had a good case here now. This gets them in trouble. The officers in question.
The other interesting thing here is one of those officers is Alfred, O Shalt Junior, it will just column Fred, because that's what everyone calls he ends up getting involved with Lori about this time. He's one of the people at these parties the party that was in question took place at the tracks tavern and he was the photographer his party's he'd document what was going on and there was a whole photo album that would show up later, so she in Fred are getting involved. Did Fred has just recently divorced from Christine so this is kind of a rebound relationship with lorry people say that she was. A trophy wife. It was just that she was filing complaints against these people and he's one of them. Yet they get involved, right now I don't know what you found, but it seemed to me as though he aware, but I
oh that she was aware of him being involved. It's possible it possible. But it's also strains that she would report on them and then say: oh sure, you're one of those involved and let's get together yeah. You would think that that would take her a view of him, after all, he still working for that apartment. So talk a bit about who Fred is because Fred, the police officer and he as a longtime partner, his name is call durfee in nineteen seventy five to rent back up a little bit here nineteen. Seventy five. They responded to a all that was actually not in their jurisdiction is at a bar, well, they show up, and the officer Who has a suspect ya, suspect next to him still has his gun in his hand, and he turns when these other officer show up when shawl and Durfee show up and he turns towards them and they both open fire They got him down. They hit him quite
number of times and they kill him and later, on the Milwaukee County District attorney's office clears them. I don't know how but they do right. I think there. Understanding here that it was an accident that they felt that they were in ensure because there was an armed person but that, Sir, wasn't wearing his uniform. I just don't understand how they can get away with an accident, whereas the rest of the populace, but let's just move on, but yeah he's cleared in this case and in so is his partner is to get married the first time they marry. It doesn't stick because, at least to the laws in that area there had to have been more time between the time of his divorce and his new marriage for the new Mary to be legal, though end up getting married twice. Actually is We too soon, who knows That is if it was just a good
match, or you know if he found her that attractive or what? What have you? Whatever? The reason was he was to be in a hurry to get married to her. Of course, this case has to do with a murder and we're talking about Christine Shots, which is Fred's Ex wife and she has a home and her two sons live with her eleven and seven years old. The eleven year old is Sean and the seven year old is Shannon about two. A dot m. On May twenty? Eighth of nineteen eighty one in intruder gets into the home. Now we do know a little bit about the intruder because he moves at the house. He doesn't just go to Christine's room. He moves about the house and actually enters one of the son's rooms. At least one of them- and he buying in gags her, and then you play his gun against her back and fires, one shot, and I leave that entered her heart. Yes, it did the sun's get a good look at him.
and he supposedly has pale or possibly is it- may be: reddish hair, yeah tied into a ponytail it'd, be wearing jogging suit Sean It is the one reporting most of this and he saying that it appears to him as though the man is wearing black police shoes, which is interesting because their father is a police officers or he knows what those look like. Right and not only that, but then their mother current boyfriend, as while the time was a police officer as well, and described the gun. They said it used or not new, not shiny. The reason why its partners cause it doesn't match the description of somebody else's revolver, The intruder, flees, the scene, but one thing to the boys say, is that it was a man he
I held, and he made grunting noises which, like they they could tell it was a man. There was no doubt in Sean's mind at least a man enters. The place kills the Ex wife of a police officer. Well, the police department, not take this news very well, and they see it as an attack on one of their own, even though divorced she's the mother of children of a police officer. This upsets there they're going to get to the bottom of it right, yeah and therefore suspect, well happens to be Fred. Shots because they don't have much else to go on, so it's always the spouse. They need to take a look at the spouse first. So first question is: is where were you the night of may twenty one thousand nine eighty one his initial statement is. He was on duty investigating a a robbery, I think her he and his partner Michael Dirt, we were on duty by it? That's enough
for them to say, oh well, he has an alibi and in Turkey his partner agrees or concurs with where they were. They both state that their on duty yeah that says to them, or maybe it's not him, but who else could have done this and they're looking at the the gun or the other the gunshot wound there thinking this looks like it was a a thirty. Eight caliber and Fred has a thirty eight caliber service pistol, and he that's his personal weapon. So then they go well. Who else has access to this gun and that night worry is the only one home and being that Fred still had keys to Christine's apartment his keys or at the house. So they assume will lorry had access to these keys and had access to his gun. So it could have been lost
well, Christine, didn't know we had a key to her place. and he actually took his son's Key Sean's key and made a copy of it. Yeah, and so she wouldn't have known he had it and the other thing is is he may have had more than two guns his duty gun, and then he had his off duty gun yeah, but he may Add one more even beyond that, so she would have access. to this gun supposedly now, corn to law she was supposed to go out that night. But then her friend ended up working, she flaked, and so she stayed at home right so either she made that up or she actually did have to work. So she just I'm staying home so lorry has really know alibi. And no one to confirm her whereabouts Fred has an alibi. Laurie does not I'll look good for a lorry Fred behind. now the crosshairs now she's in the errors in here
he's on her side, he's telling her reassuring her they'll figure out that the guy the wrong person they'll come to that conclusion in telling her that all the way to trial- and I'm sorry but that's like no lie if they're already charging you at the crime, there's no they're going to figure out the right person but anyways before we get to trial, and he sets her up with a lawyer. So he's sort of in control here he's illustrating things you, imagine she's young. She may I know what she should be doing lily doesn't know what she needs to be doing, although she does have prior police. You know experience, but it's a lot and it's one thing to be charging people's another thing to be charged and beyond the defensive, I would say This point she's very naive, absolutely and at some point she should have had some doubt about him, just based on the fact that she didn't I am for that long before
got serious people, people love man love rules. At this point there is she's a trophy wife who likes to spend money Fred is having to give all of his money to his ex wife and children. She He has access to the key and a weapon they also find a wig. That kind of looks like same color- is what the children described as the assailant having light at least same hair color in that is found and the plumbing of her apartment of lorries. Parliament this week dig her apartment shares plumbing with another apartment, but we believe that the wig was actually flushed in that other apartment, we'll get to that later right but it's in the plumbing of that building. They find this wig, which looks very damning.
So why would someone need a wig yeah, and so we have A circumstance show evidence, but it's all pointing at lorry and their puttin up, Puzzle pieces together. They say that this weapon was used in the murder is absolutely his off duty gun that she had access to they match. The bull stay say all this stuff is this weapon that he did I have on him that night. They also say that she had a jumpsuit or she had clothing that matched the the assailant's clothing. There is, two things here too on hairs, they found that they match with hairs, found in her hair rush on the autopsy of Christine they find hares and they say that these two hairs match hairs from Lori's hair brush.
So we have not just circumstantial. Now we have physical evidence tying her to this crime. Motive, murder, weapon: You don't get this too often. I was really neat and packaged up and they also check, to see. If there's any evidence of sperm case. There was an assault or rape and they say that there was no evidence so the trial. Last about two weeks, her friend quote, unquote friend Judy. She testifies at the trial and says worry has spoken about blowing away Christine Gun we're down blowing away at trial they also have the children that we Sean testify and chances.
it was a man of my house, and there was no way my stepmother could have done this. So you have conflicting testimony here. There's Judy, but there's also Fred testifies in his testimony is on the gun is because he almost wasn't at the trial. So what happens is a month before the trial starts there? A couple of lieutenants tenants, James Kelly and Craig. Sittings, they get a hold of the aid, and there need to move ahead with charges against Fred shots. Now DA responds, do you want them, then do. You want shots, the charges against Fred, you know, he's a police officer, they don't think I guess when it comes down to it that it merits taking him. and trying to do something with him when They have a murder trial, that's about to happen, and that takes press.
So they decide well yeah we're going to need. Calls for this trial so we'll just let these charges drop, so they they drop, drop it against Fred and pony on Maury yeah they don't just drop, they give him a munity, so he safe, no matter what he does a trial. He can go and do whatever he needs to do a trial. Now, there's your owing in on than banning or had been beneke and shelters home free, Sir give testimony on this weapon as stating. Where it was and and how it probably was the murder weapon, while he states that We did not have it that at home that she would have access to it. She knew where it was and she is sentenced to life in prison so yeah. You go through this and see wow. They found her guilty for good reason. Right yeah, I probably would have found her guilty too. Lot of people would cause, it was pre cut and dry,
how to say the only thing at trial that really posed a problem for the prosecution was Sean Shultz but being eleven years old, some people can disregard him. as I witnessed here too? you don't know how people are going to react to a child's testimony. he had been seriously hurt at the time they would have given him more of the benefit of the doubt, but It was just his mother that suffered then they were able to see past it, because there are too many other people saying: oh no, it's her yeah. Maybe the whig had something to do with two, because her hair doesn't match the description given, but physical evidence of the wig and the hair fibers that they claim match. That's pretty damning She didn't have a reason to be there. So why is
even being discussed right, he's clovy their stuff. That's it night pot cast well. Lorry. Does not take well to prison. no not at all and hold on. We got talk about the two appeals that were denied real, quick yeah yeah. She she she starts to find out. She starts to for information about her trial. In her case, she finds out from the original autopsy pathologist that he said that the hare fibers were not a match and they all showed they were from Christine. None of them were from lorry. Yet after he makes this determination, secure has the hare fibres, re, analyzed somewhere else, and they find that their from Laurie
she also finds that the the ballistics on the gun don't seem to match up. She finds out a lot of things, her friend Judy who The fight against her recounts, restatement statement of saying that lorry what wanted to blow away Christine come to find out the wig that was found in the plumbing. The neighbor, who shared the plumbing with lorry, says: oh yeah, your friend Judy came, go to use the restroom, and after that day the plumbing was screwed up. So now we're thinking did Judy go over there and flush the way down the toilet,
Cause, she knew the plumbing was the same, and she and she brings up. Ah these things during her peel process. They say no, her two appeals are denied, so lorries, like you, said she's fed up. She wants out. she's, been in there for awhile take a moment to get a word from our sponsor legacy box. How great would it be to surprise your children, this holiday with home movies they've, never seen before, or No, your boomer parents have a box full of old photos and Vhs tapes. This would be a great gift for them. I have boxes. boxes full of old photographs from my childhood old Vhs, Epps and I don't have a vcr to play on so see box was the perfect solution. For me, the service couldn't be simpler. I you their kit to send it all off their team carefully. It's a digital archive by hand I got digital copies, along with all the originals and right now, they're offering fifty percent off so you can have
think deserved at once for a fraction of the regular price. Once you have your digital versions, you can relax, knowing it's going to be good for generations and even What's the last minute, you can still get the most meaningful gift for the holidays, go to legacy box dot com, Slash GEN Y to take advantage of this limited time offer and get fifty percent off. Take advantage of this. Exclusive offer today and then use their kit now and send it in whenever you're ready go to legacy bob Stockholm, dot com, why GEN, Y and save fifty percent, while supplies last take moment, would from our sponsor a great documentary, makes us question everything and shows us the worst and the best of what human beings are capable of each be oh docks. Club dives, deep into the true stories that captivate our imaginations on episode of HBO Docks Club hosts Brittany, loose of the nod and for colored nerds.
and Ronald Young Jr of solvable and NPR as pop culture happy hour will take a closer look at a film or series. In the h b, O Documentary films Catalog, you can watch on H, B, o max they'll, get updates on the stories talk with the filmmakers behind each feature, documentary as well as experts who help us make sense of each film. You can listen to h, B, O It's club now so be sure to listen to each be oh docks club on HBO Max or were where you get your podcasts to stay up to date, with what they're watching next. She has a cellmate assembly here, Sally who has a brother who comes to visit Dominic. His aims make googly Otto googly Otto yeah lorry thinks he's a good looking I he thinks lower, is a good looking chick. It's like match dot com the reason is when he way they get to talking and.
She sorta of stresses that this is a good relationship, because there is no distractions. All they can do is talk yeah, so they do a lot of talking and visiting and get really get to know each other. I mean cassettes That's all you got, I mean it's. It's you're sitting in a visiting room or whatever, and you can't each other, you can't do anything. All you have to do is just get to know. Each other everyone should start a relationships. This way just leave out the prison part. I won't work otherwise right. So she talks to him and so now she can't be there anymore. She has to get out I know that some people think that Lori doesn't come across as a very intelligent person, but She must be somewhat crafty because she figures out a way to break out of this prison yeah and she does it quick like one they decide their. He says: he's going to
beyond the fence line with his car. she notices that there is a laundry room window that they leave open and she can get to it if she just. Times up on some washers darts out So I don't remember what her excuse was to the guards, but she said she had to go back and do something laundry. Yeah laundry. She goes back to do some laundry when she gets out and when she's heading out she says she doesn't know. If some headlights, we're approaching our Dominic's or not, but she hides and luckily that is not Dominic, so she died. But there I think she and she's able to get Dominic now on his part, he is stolen a couple of birth certificates, because If they need identification. Will their plan is to head to Canada when they get to the border will hold on his car is got just married.
all ridden all over it like they're, newlyweds and they're on their honeymoon going to Canada for their honeymoon. I think they are engaged, but but they play it off as if they're married you're right at eight when they get up to the border patrol You're, like oh, you know, we had all of our stuff stolen, but we do have these birth certificates to show who we are where we are, not to mention that her husband, Fred immediately divorced her after she was convicted of first degree murder, so she can get married if she wants And then Fred went on to date, a teenager but mobile, this go on, so she, The fence jumps in Dominic's car just married, go up to Canada and they get stuck by the canadian border patrol. They say her purse was stolen, had all our ids in it, but we're going on our honeymoon. Please just help us Let us through here is our birth certificates to show who we are this.
is pre nine eleven. You can get. Why, if you, if you look at these two people, when you just let him in the probably would they don't look dangerous. Canadians are polite there. Like then one of us, how long are you planning to be in in Canada? and they say two weeks come to Canada and therein, but I hate to say it if she gets a job, I think she's waitressing idea they make it about ninety five days or so yeah. It was just a few months there's a point at which she's asked if she is Laurie and the reason. Why is because the media is just swarming on this in a former playboy bunny convicted of murder escapes from prison. Her face is everywhere
sensational in in she's got a few know. This support group like supporters, everything and there there's run. Bambi run is what it's all about. Yeah, even these bump stickers that have been beyond the side and into the laughed it it says, run Babby run. So she has all always supporters, but there- are also helping to get her name out there yeah, which is alerting authorities to pay she might be in Canada, someone if she's lorry and she says no, but they know the time winding down there in trouble. It's like you said it's too, it's too big: they can't escape it. They end up trying to pack all their stuff away and then the road, Canadian mounted police show up. Don't don't do parties over she files for reckon? he status, yeah or asylum or whatever she wants to be taken in
I the Canadians and from what we know of lady law. That's probably a good call, yeah yeah, but they don't go for it well she's there about a year and a half yeah yeah, but one thing did the Canadians do for her? Is they contact Milwaukee and they say look you need at least review this and they promised to do judicial review on the case and inquiry it sort of hinted at it. But, There are issues with the evidence that was used against, in court and well, there's good bad news with this judicial review. And that is that they Don't really investigate everything and there's some big things: they don't investigate they also basically say that there were no conspiracy against her by the apartment or by the prosecutors it's just everything's above board on that, but
maybe interpretation of evidence things like that. So what are some? these things that they found that were not correct, while they could never find the hair is that matched dowry that match Lori. Those were just go. One or they never existed in the first place. So really the one piece of physical evidence that tied her to the crime out so now we're down to circumstantial d, sticks from there. The weapon not matching up so well now. Now that- they have their own experts. Looking at him, it doesn't match the muzzle burn from the point shot doesn't seem to match either kind of a Jeremy Bamber kind of moment here with they they pretty much, sure that that was the murder weapon, so physic
evidence is gone. Murder weapon is gone now, we're down to. Judy said that she wanted to blow her way, Judy recanted no more, a testimony that she wanted harm or whatever against Christine remember we said that they tested for semen and they didn't find any well wealth, actually, a component of semen that Let them know if they're here has been a man that has been involved with a victim sexually, and that was present in fact, even though they didn't disclose it to that ants. They were actually cross. Checking this with some other sexual assault cases. I don't the ink lorry has the ability to deposit seamen anywhere, it's really unbelievable, and ruled out. Now there was blue, on the gun. Also, that's than other didn't come in during the first trial. So
which gun had blood on it. It was the on duty gun. The one that Fred had on him, the one he said he had on him. Had put on it. Now they did a little testing on it and they found that blood was type a which is whose type well just so happens that Chris shops, is blood is type a what a coinciding yeah. So I don't know what the the odds are, but in Fred's alibi changes. A little bit yeah. We find out that he wasn't actually on duty. He was actually at and a couple of bars, that's what he claims says. Oh you found out that I actually was I'm doing my job? So now I'm going to come clean and say that I was drinking at a bar right in here the thing. If he had been prosecuted like they had planned to prosecute him, he would have been
useless. He would not have been able to testify now without his testimony. Maybe she doesn't get convicted because it's testimony about the gun. Now now that we know that he's not been telling the truth about a lot of things, now, you really have to wonder what what happened this situation. Why was it his wife that was targeted yeah? It does you a lot to think about in being that he divorced him wife mediately got with Laurie once lorry goes to jail, he immediately. Files for divorce with lorry then turns around and gets with a eighty nineteen year old woman after lorry. So he's real, quick turnarounds here, just just put not out there when the gun was collected and the gun was collected by two people. Michael
Murphy and Fred Schultz tell Kay now even Michael Okay noted that the gun appear to have been fully loaded. And not used for a long time, and it was shiny. whereas the gun that these children describe was dirty or old. Looking just differences in, and captain of the gun, whereas his service revolver, probably more old. Looking because it's a service revolver and it's been used a lot more. But it's an important point because his own partner made note of, like it was fired only now. You know why there were people that felt Maybe she wasn't involved
Maybe she was framed or railroaded because you have all these police officers involved. You had the prosecution who isn't following up. On certain pieces of evidence that focusing on only things that he's getting information on from his own experts, I'm not a conspiracy guy, I usually blame you know it. Patents over malice, but in this case it's This is too many coincidences to just think that oh well, they just screwed this one up, it seems really orchestrated another just kind off hand. Issue with Fred is his friend, Frederick, Frederick, Hornberger, he's an old boyfriend of
Judy, and he does construction or projects for Fred. So Frederick is a third character in this plot. Frederick Goes in disguise wearing some kind, as Wigan Mask and beats duty to a bloody pulp and robs her? A few weeks before the murder happens, Frederick is actually charged with this crime and ends up serving time for this attack, but Frederick Fred seemed to be in Cahoots, they're, all sort of inner mingled and entangled in this web here so get two theories and common terrio. I now give you mind after tradition when she's brought back in the lobby. They say, you're in solitary confinement. For almost a year, that'll Oscar anybody up. Well, of course, with all these problems
one of the things that occurred was they wanted the d testing to be done, but not in the state lab the state crime lab and outside of there, because they didn't trust him. They didn't trust prosecution, state lab anymore. Why one? They hadn't had good luck with them. So far, for some reason it seemed like they were going to have to foot the bill there's a man. That's been involved in this case for a law long time and his name's IRA Robins and IRA Robbins is a private investigator and he, wholeheartedly believes in her innocence, and so he helped creatively. To find a way to pay for the dna testing they end up making a deal with Dr Phil, so she's, going to be working with the Dr Phil Show to sort of give the people what they I guess the people want to know what's going on with her with her case and this will help pay the bill, so she grew
is to have the test results revealed on the show, but Mrs she already ran once I mean remember, this is run Bambi run right, so they, Actually, stalk her to make sure that she it's not going anywhere that the deal goes. Through that, when they get the results, show beyond the show, but she's pretty paranoid. She trying to get out of a window she injures her foot. She bad enough where they have to amputate the foot. He she like either jumped is a discrepancy about whether it's a first floor or second floor. Well, I kind of wonder if maybe it's just second floor, because house is she hurt her foot this bad, so. you started, a small business, because you had a passion for pottery, a skill for software or a mind for manufacturing and not necessary lay for your know how of the business side of running a small business, thankfully that's what Quickbooks is all about,
providing new small business owners with the tools they need to feel confident from day one because with Quickbooks you can get paid, run, pay and know where your business stands from the start. So while you may not know everything when it comes to the business side of things with Quickbooks. You can still get everything done for your business, new business, no problem success starts with Intuit Quickbooks Quickbooks Payroll, Quick events and Quickbooks online account required there trying to do dna testing to see if they could match anyone. They say that then Benelux, DNA wasn't their lorries seems to be cut I don't know where this goes, but they were all so trying to determine whether Frederick Hornberger Fred's old friend right whether his dna might have been in I have not found why that was never completed. but it certainly sounded as though she didn't keep her end of the deal with the Dr Phil Show yeah cheap
she was supposed to be on the show, so they could read the results off, but instead she's at the hospital, because her she jumped out the window yeah. Now I get it, I get she's freaked out, she's, not quite in any more and when you see later interviews with her you can see a level of anxiety or even PTSD she's, not very, clear and concise, she's very off the wall. Now I would say that that's the combination of what she's one through prison and her long in solitary when she got returned with all this, this new inquiry prosecutor and judge she essentially granted a new trial in lieu of a trial, they offer her a plea deal plead to second degree,
It will give you time served and you get to walk and they don't even look at the whole. Escaped from jail, peace then no contact, yeah we're secondary murder, but she's spacey, saying I'm not going to contest that she pleads guilty. to a lesser charge and she gets to walk. We have an idea why she does this well I know her dad is, is unhealthy and could die soon. I know that there's a lot of things, but take all that out if you could walk out of jail a free person that day, as opposed to going through another trial. Another appeal another whatever, with a fifty fifty chance of being found guilty again, I think a lot of people take the plea deal they're just like hey. I can walk now. Well, that's true, but when he spoke of this. She says that it was her dad that he was the factor because she was confident.
All the evidence they had now they were All the show that the state had, at the very least then misinformed. Mishandled evidence right. most. This was outright just fabrication. He was looking at years before it all saddle yeah sure I suppose the timing was important there too, but I really think she needed to get out because her dad had request that from her he said need be alive when you get out. I need to see you I need to see my daughter free right and he liked to see her exonerated too but yeah that was is important to him. I don't think now for her. We know that was everything and she worked very hard with help of IRA Robins and her attorneys for years even requested the governor pardon her? Will is. When she took the plea deal, she pleaded guilty that she did it. She got to walk so
she can't turn around and say: oh here's evidence strategy thing you know end, and so she she she gave up Oliver chances, but she still took it all the way up to the Supreme Court who shot her down and it's not the Shouted down because she didn't have enough evidence to exonerate herself. They shot her down because she took the plea deal and legally they just they couldn't do it. It helps both parties safe, I think when it comes down to it because he's not having to say yeah. I really did this, but then, also saying we still got a conviction, but she doesn't have any real recourse at that point. No and that's why she has never been exonerated and she that's why she went for a pardon. instead of at exoneration or a retrial or anything's she's tried everything. Yet she's tried going that route, but even the courts
we're telling her. No, you gave up that right, yeah that sucks but hey she. She got out and she was free. She had spend time with her family so here's this this crazy mess of a case. What do you think happened? I honestly don't know it's hard for me to say because, from what I read, one of the boys was being attacked by this man and I have trouble thinking that Fred would send someone to harm everyone in his family, but if it was Fred, The boys would know their own father. just don't know why he would harm his own children. I just forgot the feeling that Fred wanted any of them harm. he probably didn't want his children harm. Some people suspect that the photo album that I mentioned was found in her place in Christine's place and that
I have been something that the killer was trying to retrieve, so there could have been multiple. Police officers or law enforcement trying to get. This does know: that's what got him in trouble in the first All I'm saying is: if it's Fred, he had a lot of reasons to do different things here. In other words, one. It takes care of some of that alimony money. Three hundred some dollars a month. That's a lot of income going out. He could have taken care of that. I don't really understand. Because the the mammas supposedly trying to tie something around one of the boys next, like a noose or something. So I don't know his idea was just to bind everybody, but maybe kill everybody, we just don't we don't know, we don't know what was going on with that situation, but but Fred the one who had gotten into legal trouble, and at that point he wasn't clear
he did know he had charges coming up against impossibly, so if he could get rid of people that could testify again and who were also getting money from him. Now, that's your you tube once down he's taken care of a business all at once, and he s he can. just go there himself, because his own kids would probably recognize him even with a disguise, I would imagine. I got an actor he's police officer I guess I look at it is if Fred involved, then that would mean that he could have hired Frederick his old buddy, but I'm not sure of Frederick was out or free at that time at that time, because Frederick had just beaten duty to a bloody pulp and robbed her. So was he already behind bars, As for that or not or was he walking around free? I thought I took them a little while
im like maybe a month or yeah, and if that's the case, then it's right at about the same time as the murder. So if Fred hired Frederick and gave him his service pistol, his duty weapon, Frederick could have done this morning is also set. That Frederick was taking credit for this murder in prison yeah he bragged too. His cellmates that he'd killed Christine now they could lie, but I think if he is already incarcerated. When this went down, we would already heard someone say at no, but he was already invested. He knew that ever has come out. So it's so it's a possibility. I would say he was out at the tyre its iffy to me. I guess, if I look at it this way, that the router was not going to harm the children. Then then it's me more likely to me that that Fred Shots did send someone there, but It could have sent somebody there and had no
of them harming the children, but they just did well known it had to face him then, and this isn't someone he just randomly picked up off the street and someone he knew now and he's a cop supposedly how much they were able to do to Laurie. I don't think the guy you want to cross he's already gun down another officer and the right daylight. It's scary, I think Frederick, is a prime suspect. perhaps absolutely surprised that he wasn't even looked at during the case It was because they said, oh, it was his off duty weapon and therefore Lori was the only one that had access to this weapon, but once you realize that more than likely was his on duty, weapon or just another weapon in general. Now sky's the limit. You got a lot of options here, well. There was a man in the area at the time, early morning, who contacted the Yes said. I have information that you might want to know.
Them I saw a man jogging and it seemed suspicious and they didn't want to know about it because they had already focused in on Henri yeah, we already have a suspect? No. Thank you. We're good thanks calling the tips hotline and the jogger was a man. In case you were wondering really didn't go into this thinking. It was a wrongful conviction case, I actually went in just thinking that it was a crazy. escape of her escape and everything else. But here. You see all the evidence, get overturned or destroyed or vetted to the point where it it's no longer valid and done with it subscribe
Apple Pie, Spotify or wherever you're listening right now join wondering plus in the wondering app to listen ad free
from wondering I Mickey Boyer hosts of the new pod cast. Call me curious, look were all on twenty four seven information overload on our new speeds are in boxes on Tik Tok. That's why I'm bringing you call me curious upon cast that finally gives you definitive answers to life's burning questions. Like does intimate and fasting really work. Should I buy crypto every week, Call me curious, I'll dive into all the things you ve heard about, but don't really know about all both learn and laugh along the way, as we explore life's little mysteries. The internet's hottest topics and burning gotta know questions like What are the mathematical odds? There is other intelligent life in the universe, or is it true? You can't die in your dreams, you'll find out
me and some of my hilarious friends on my podcast call me curious, listen to call me curious on Apple podcast, Amazon, music or wherever you listen, you can listen early and ad free by subscribing to one plus in apple podcasts or the wander app
Transcript generated on 2022-04-11.