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Tair Rada - 472


December 6, 2006. Golan Heights. On December 6, 2006, the body of 13-year-old student, Tair Rada, was found bloodied and slumped in a bathroom stall at Nofey Golan High School in Golan Heights. Roman Zadorov, a 29-year-old immigrant from post-Soviet Moldova and custodian at the school confessed to the murder and was later convicted for Tair Rada’s murder and perverting the course of justice. Zadorov’s conviction came into question when a lack of physical evidence connecting him to the crime, doubts over his confession, and the reenactment of the murder were deemed to be contradictory.

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Join wondering plus in the wondering app to listen ad free from wondering I dont snyder, I'm doing good justin. How are you
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you called me on the phone and wanted to talk about podcasting. So this has been quite a journey that both of us have been on together and we don't know any other way to celebrate ten years than to do something special right, a special event. So we need to get everyone to mark their calendars for september, eight, twenty twenty two kansas city- that's all we're saying for now, but will be doing something just mark that september, eighth on your calendar and we're looking forward to it. I do want to justin where continuing to get a lot of message is how do we hear more generation? Why and what do we tell them just any? What's our go to answer and sir patriarch We are very proud of our patron, not just because of what we put into it, but because of what our listeners put into it, it's really the place to go. If you want anything beyond, you just get on your feet. So if you
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price signed to find the lowest rates out there and you should do have price line. Every trip is a big deal. So when you ready to book your next summer, adventure visit price line, dot com for the best deals that are we get more out of it. wherein tonight's case international case, We call this the there's so many different aspects of this case going on you have moments of wrong. convictions? False confessions, a lot information out there that you can find and read up on it. It reminds me of the ad non heyman le case that reminds me of the west, this three case. There are so many different aspects. This case that completely and utterly embodied by so many other things we ve covered when you buy it up. I looked into it. I thought well, that's kind of weird and then, when I really do, then I thought oh, my
can we even fit this in one episode, and so we can do our best. now. What are we talking about tonight aired tonight. We're too about tire rada and murder at no fake golan high school in Golan heights? This happened in europe, two thousand and six now time She was thirteen years old at the time of this murder, but for the most part she very outgoing happy kid. She did have a lot of friends, but it possible that before this murder happened. Some of her friends might have distanced themselves from her, but its eighth grade, I know I had problems going in and out of friend groups and possibly not talking to people, but that's it one aspect that is brought up immediately? her mother was ilona and father. She mule He had two brothers.
What do we know about what happened at their own. On that day, on december, six, two thousand six tire was supposed to be in drama class. But- she decided to skip class, which was her second, our and she sat out in the schoolyard chatting with a friend. Some point, though she said she was. see- and she excused herself, she was gonna, go back into the school where she, headed towards a bathroom in school each grade essentially had their own bathroom entire tie, whilst went to the floor where the tenth grade bathrooms were located and on that day I then tenth graters were on a school trip. so it was essentially empty floors where she was that the bathroom was on what's called up mezzanine or could describe it as a landing. There is a flight of stairs that went up to
an area that has some bathrooms, and then there was another flight of stairs that went up to. I don't know what you consider the second floor, but technically would be this third floor. If you count this mezzanine area as a floor, so she goes to this bathroom there. But where the sends up is her family. Most notably, our mother doesn't know where tire is because she never, turns home from school, and so her mother Olano becomes very concerned and starts calling out of friends. of hers and to family members just asking Have you seen tyre and then even worse, she discovers that tie your never made it to her dance class. So she knows something's wrong. She does what they concern parents do when the calls getting anywhere. She report her daughter missing to the police and shoes, told her husband and Obviously her sons and friends and her
man, goes out searching for once dark out now: it's not like school, let out and he's going back and forth on the path from the house to the school over and over, and even King flashlights, out into a wooded areas and off the road searching for her, and he he comes back home empty handed now. It is made of the school on four currently at about ten pm. Tired discovered in a locked. I threw him stall in the tenth grade bathroom when they I urge this bathroom. They fell and that one of the stock doors, was locked and when they try to open it When responded, they called out known responded. They could see kind of underneath the stall door. It was obvious that something was wrong. Nuts, they found her body. She's sitting on the toilet, but kind of half on line.
against one of the star walls. There is blood everywhere. It is obvious that she has been slashed and stabbed, there's blood there's hair, there's all kinds of prince its obvious that this is foul play, thing short of a murder emergency services were alerted Paramedic showed up, they mean he checked her for life, you can say It obviously was a murder, but there is to save life and they did best they even attack easy g paths to tat yours body, but she could not be revived. The paramedics who checked her felt that rigour Mortis had already set in there isn't autopsy done on tyre rada and the time of Ass was estimated to be around thirteen fifteen or that would be
one fifteen that would be but about six hours, five to six hours before she was discovered. It shows two large cuts on her throat. Dictating better head was probably pulled back by her hair and then She was slashed because of the wounds and the direction of the cuts. It was determined that the killer was most likely left handed. There were marks and cuts around her head. Ah, sadly, she was hit from behind or somebody taken her head and slammed did against a wall or the toilet, something to that effect had cuts on her chin to cuts on your chest and one long vertical cut from the base of her neck to her waist and she had. Post mortem cut on her wrist now They know it was done after died, because there was no bleeding from it, because once you dying or deceased.
Any new wounds are not going to cause bleeding so there's this huge gash right below her wrist data was done, postmortem the cause of death. four tire rada was ruled as external blood loss caused by cut wounds through the carotid artery and jug vain. Now, just to be clear, looks like an attack of violent, sudden attack, is the way it looks right. Just in this wasn't something other elements to this- was a straight up: murder, The police are questioning everybody questioning everyone at the school. Questioning students, questioning teachers and some students recalled that she passed them in the hallway has is going up the stairs towards the bathroom. neither one of them recalled her being fought. By anyone or being with any one when she ascended the stairs the pool really wanted to find the killer immediately. There is a
concern here that a student could be murdered in their own school. Like this, so they to act swiftly in made some arrests early on. There said a homeless man. Now they only had him in custody for well days, but they didn't our jim, because an alibi that was verified, they then arrested the school gardener. They question here but he was released a couple of days later after his alibi, checked out in this we'll gardener. They went for because one of the teachers was, unlike the teacher a groom or something, and she d I demand in there that probably shouldn't have been in there and she described the school gardener, but he, had a tight alibi, and there were somebody else that looked similar to the gardener and that's the police lock onto someone else yeah this just about. Five days
after tyres, murder, a man by the name of romans, adore of was arrested just five day. after tyres murder. What do we know about roman the north justin. He were was born in nineteen. Seventy eight. He was an emigrant from Ukraine, he attended elementary school in ukraine headed listed in the army. He two younger siblings, he was twenty nine years old at the time of the murder and here went to Israel in two thousand and two on a visa which he extended while Was there he met and fell in love with a woman named Olga whom he married? he made a living working in construction and repair. He was contracted to this high school. He and his I've had a child, a sun together and added. time of the murder he and Olga lived with her parents on the day that air was murdered, said dorothy. Had
I'm at the high school at about eight thirty in the morning and this something that would happen throughout the day, but he didn't have certain mattel he needed to come wheat, certain jobs. So there were time periods throughout that day, where he was idle so sometime around eleven a m, he took a break to eat and then when he went back to work. He realized he was missing a glue, then he needed, and so he contacted a contractor and waited outside the school from twelve thirty to one or twelve thirty to thirteen, and just about an hour later, he was see and got a can of soda from cafeteria, so you can see the police, went through and really built a timeline of what the door was up you that day, at about fourteen fifteen or, as we call it to fifteen he returned to, again and worked until about seventeen hundred hours, seventeen thirty hours, and then he fell for the day and drank a coffee
teachers room. It was that he talked with the school cleaner. Who said could you help me translate a letter it has. My salary. Now the door of did not speak hebrew, peace, but very little paper, we should say- and he was not able to help this person with the translation. But after he had the coffee we headed home, at around seventeen forty five hours and spent the evening with his family, and that's why this one teacher probably saw him in the teachers room getting coffee and she described him, but they mistook her identification as the gardener when it was really roman. They mind, since there are all these contract workers at the school there are people that the school staff or whoever they don't recognize these people. So it is strange that there other people showing up getting coffee for themselves, in the teachers room now they arrest, roman and day
interrogate him hard and he denies everything Says it wasn't me and of course, As you know, during most interrogations, police officers can lie to you and they can say well, you didn't. Do it. Then how do you explain blood from the victim on your clothes blood from the victim. On your too was how do you explain your dna being on the victim and he that's impossible, there's no way you found those things and he he denies denies and denies he will be but in a holding cell another man, and that other man will talk to him and be like hey. You know, what's going on, you look distraught and rome We'll tell him you. I've been around for this murder and they think I did it in roman will sailor can they make stuff up? Can they just say that they found blot on something in
this other man, that's in the holding cell with them, says no, no, no, they can't make stuff. If they have it, they have it. So you know you better. Come clean because if you don't, then, It's gonna be much worse for you because now you're lying and if you come clean and confess. Well, then, maybe you'll get a lesser sentence, but right now facing life- and during these interrogations interrogators, her saying- maybe you don't remember doing it- may be this and you just blacked out- and so wall roman, with this other man in this holding, so he said- discussing how he gets. billy, hot, headed or very angry blood rushes to his head and he forgets things and how Well, he once beat his brother so badly He has no recollection of it put him in the hospital and he Karen we're doing it and then
ends up telling this other man in this holding so thing! I'm telling the police's be ass, its garbage this. I just don't remember doing it and then heat of acts out how he might I heard the little girl in this holding cell is like well, you know I would have done it this way. I would a slashed her. This is all recorded on video, so looks really bad he's now, confessing to another man who wins being an informant for the police who was actually hired in. in this room to be with roman to get him to talk by the way, but he Confesses to this man in this holding cell after real days of being held by police- and he goes back to the interrogation room again, he said, to deny everything, but then he finally starts turning around here. the man in that holding, so I get hot headed and I dont remember things well. He tells that to the police,
the man in the cell, said you know you should probably tell them that you don't remember things and that the a girl in salted you that way. You know it's not first degree, you know more of a manslaughter charge in these, All the things that roman will now turn around and tell the police It tells him how he did it. He said them that he can't remember doing it, but he has this problem with anger and when they ask him for his clothing that was wearing that day. When they ask him for his tools, we find out that sir, you did no longer has the pants. He was wearing that day rider that he says and anybody that follows true crime. You know, if there's a suspect, Police are really zeroing in on that suspect and their questions Where did all this blood go and then they find out that sucks That person of interest has gotten rid of thrown away pants, that's a red flag.
Right there and on my car, so he's already admitted to this other man in a holding cell that, done this and he got rid of his pants like wicked, in the podcast right now. We're we're done right, but were not done because there is so much more not only does roman now, to the police that he murmured this girl, but they, have him explained them in detail. He murdered her. He goes through any talks about slashing her twice. Members two big cuts on her throat. he talks about raping her talks about cut, her repeatedly and at once during the interrogation. They say: ok, war. Besides her Where else did you cut her and he says like our well her her stuff her abdomen and they're like where else and he keeps going her leg and there like, where else- and he keeps me
in body parts until he gets to the arm and nordic. Oh well, yeah! You cut her in the armies. Like I caught her in the arm. show us trust it show them how he caught her in the arm, and he says you know she put her arm up to defend herself and that's when I slashed her arm day. Take him to the school to do a reenactment and they ask him so walk us through this. He says: ok, Well? I was walking around the corner and I saw her walking up the stairs and she'd ass before a cigarette or something to that effect. her now and then she called me a bastard, or you know the son of a bitch, or something like that, she insulted me and then I followed her up the stairs grab turn pushed her into the bathroom. Now when they have him this they ve been saying, you know, said floor the second floor, so he walks into the school. talks about where she is on the stairs.
They have him in handcuffs unease, flanked by two or three police officers. ok. Now, where did you go and he starts walking The stairs and he turns to walk up the second flight of stairs up to the second floor. I'll call the second floor and about skip over the mezzanine level, where the bathroom is he doesn't know that's where the bathroom miss and they stop him turn him around and face him towards that bathroom door and there's step on the door. There's like a little sign. You know peace paper that says keep out. This is a crime scene and that point: he takes a deep breath and they walk. Into the matter. Now from our sponsor better help. It, can be very overwhelming, and many people are burned out without even knowing it can be lack of motivation, irritability fatigue and so much more, equally, we associate burn out with work that is definite not the only cause it can come.
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see movement. He just puts his hands on the walls and less himself up and out egos. He doesn't stop the toilet, he doesn't use any kind of other leverage he lay. The stall this way now the police Thinking ok how did you know- the bathroom stall door- was locked How did you know that she had slashes on her throat. How did you know that there was a slash on her arm where she defended herself How did you know that this ban install door was locked and you would have had to have escaped climbing over one. The door or one of the site, was pretty damning stuff? It's spot on right here I literally when I look at this, I go what he has details about this crime, this murder, that nobody else has thinking. This is enough for me, then you have
bloody shoeprints at the scene of the crime? A couple on her body like on her genes and if you look at these bloody prince what appear to be bloody print, They kind of match his shoes than they are about the weapon he used. He pretty much says he is an exact or knife or a box cutter or utility So this is more or less aid, just a shot. Blade or razor blade so They have everything they need. He's gonna go to trial. Will they have everything may need in that they have someone who is able to do pretty much a recreation of what happened to tie your rada in the school. So he walked him through the whole thing and they feel confident that this must be tyres killer and they have make custody? This is all they need because he's confessed they have everything they need and they're going to take him to court. But at this point, roman is now I made it all up. I was
The pressure I wanted to go home and see my family. I was just telling them what they wanted to hear, These investigators are looking out. I'm gone. Are you got rid of your pants. You got rid of the murder weapon. You got all of your staff that we could tested, and you confess the crime and you details about the crime such as the locked stall door tat. No one else should have known, so screw you dude we're going to trial and you need to accept responsibility for this crime and roman, is now completely going back all of his statements in saying I was not the one that did this law on part of it because he has an attorney during His trial iron. Obviously, tyres family is very distraught steroid. Fathers. Looking at this man, roman and saying I hope he writes In hell for the rest of his life, her mother, though
She sang, I just want them to catch, The murderer of my daughter, I just want them to bring me justice and she's, not sang Roman is the murderer of her daughter she's, like I hope that they found my daughter's murderer and they prove it and trial. But the roman went back on his confession, its to throw at least the family into a little bit of a tizzy of. What's going on here, I thought this was the guy. I thought he confessed so are going through the evidence, the shoe print. On her body. That's one of the most contested things this trial. Writer absolute it's something that's heavily debated as we said there's blood everywhere, and these shoeprints, or in blood on her genes. There his shoes, not aspire.
the blood on them, not a speck of her dna on them. Nothing on his parish. Shoes shows any tie to this crime scene, but that not to say that he didn't have any pair of shoes that he was wearing, that he got rid of them. were the exact same pair, so the prosecution they get an image of his tread of his you bottom of issue and they see or impose it onto her genes and throw it see it's here here and here and there like three different places where you can gatt and see a shoe print now air- and I watched the documentary on this- and I saw the photos of this print on her genes, it wasn't until they superimposed or over laid the image his shoe on her genes that I even saw a shoe print I didn't see it. It just look like bloody smears.
You're on shore is the one who determine that these were the prince by the shoes, worn by roman, said, Dorothy, If you're on a jury. If you're in a court room- and you hear a shoe print expert state that the France found on the body of the victim, were made, from the shoes of the purse on trial, but elsie need right, there's no reason no excuse that romans it or could have for why shoe prints would be on a murdered young girl me opposition to these shoeprints by the defence were pretty much brought down. The judge said that her looks like shoeprints to me, that was the end of it, so two thousand ten roma The doris was convicted of Iran is murder that trial begun in january, two thousand seven so he's convict in two thousand ten, but an appeal
was filed the next month, and this appeal was I'm with the supreme court of Israel now judge Yitzhak cohen of Nazareth. District court said There is no doubt that romans fedora had killed tire rada and even said that the door of had lied in his testimony conviction was upheld. in this nazareth: district court in two thousand and fourteen and in two thousand and fifteen, we'll start going through the problems with the evidence, so that I'll be back and just in in march of twenty thirteen from what we just described, earn the sounds. Why keep pretty much did it, but here's the problem the shoeprints on her body, might not have been shoeprints thee. knife wounds on her more, likely made with us raided knife or a hunting knife of some type, not a box cutter or you no exact, o knife. He said he raped her.
She had all her clothes on. She had no signs that she had been sexually assaulted in any way. He said that he, ladder up the stairs none of the sea since around saw anyone following her. Maybe they missed him, but it's possible and there was hair in this stall, check this hair. May or may not have then tyres. could have been the hair of the attacker that she was grabbing at theirs. Information on that justin and that's because when you collect evidence from a scene you're going to college, many hairs, but by reviewing the hairs they deserve It's some hairs were not as likely to be important. The key they can't test everything right. So they only test to so many of the hairs. They tested a lot of hairs, but not all of them. There's no dna or fingerprint evidence tying to this crime and your member. He said he locked the door all door trap?
tie in with him, then he his hands, on the sides of the walls and lifted himself out? No blood no fingerprints there, no blood or dna on the knob, the handle inside the stall, he said. into the men's bathroom where cleaned up a little bit, but they didn't go to in bathroom and find anything in there, no blood, nothing. Then They see that there might be other shoe France, not on her body, the one on that let's eat and one on the top of the toilet. And then a small blood smear. On DE I guess that would be the left side of the stall. If you facing the stall I from the outside, and that looks like possibly student or child, escaped from the stall because they would have had to have climbed up onto the toilet, to get out it over the wall. What you're saying no is the way
he escaped that stall in the recreation doesn't really fit with evidence at all, in fact, almost nothing he said or did during that recreation that reenactment fits Much of this justin is just the fact that they were leading him through this area, he was saying this is what I did. This is what I did than I did this. However, Winchell. As that and I saw his interrogation and you know it. beginning. When he's denying everything he seems somewhat believable like I wasn't there, I didn't do this, but you know they all say that, but then, during confessions. He sounded very believable too and his reenactments looked very believable? But then, when you start look, through the interrogation you see the interrogators giving him information through other questions talking about wounds on her body that he now has to explain or can ass to your notes, you can't say
how did you killer and then, when they do give you a good enough answer sake. Why did you stab her in the arm? Why did you slasher through because now he knows or the perpetrator knows how she was murdered and all of these pivotal, points of his conviction. You can find interrogation being fed to him Why did he get rid of his pants that day? Maybe he actually just got rid of his pants that day, because their old amid infinitum, while How did you know that the stall door was locked well during the reenactment he was in at the stall, and they said well, how do you? How do you get out, I mean? Is it that unbelievable, that He just assumed the stall door was locked because during the reenactment they had led him to the bathroom. He even nowhere was and then have find a way out of the matter you didn't know the position of how her body was lying.
and remember she had slashes all over her. She was cut, and then she had cuts on them of her head at no point does roman talk about hitting her in the back of the head. Nor does you talk about slamming her head against anything and if she was hit in the back of the head with a handle, the knife than we know that the knife wasn't a workers nice and had to have been a hunting knife for something different. You didn't know almost anything about this murder, he just got the look action in the time right, that's about it, everything so wrong. Now, if he was hot, headed and had this whole blood thing in his brain makes him forget things Then maybe he's gonna get the details wrong, but did the police even go back and double check whether or not he had beaten his brother? So adley and forgotten about it. They didn't even bother check that but can see how he was
because in the first place, because the prospect she had all the answers: what are all the answers we have I, who was at the school he confessed to following and bartering this young girl and because I am ever we hadn't. Do the reconstruction he was able to see the whole thing close enough right and then you have experts stating that his salamander shoes, the shoes that had to have left the prince that they found in the stall and on tyres body. That's a home run. No, evidence besides his shoe print on her body like now, fingerprint. No dna, nothing which really hard to do being that You see crime scene photos of this there's there's no way somebody got away with this without wearing gloves, without being, you know, totally covered in something to not leave a trace over these years right,
this murder happened. You can imagine everyone in the neighborhood everyone at the schools freaked out. They all think that a murderer is walking amongst them and theirs these rumours of rape rumours of classmates hating each other and an online facebook group has started and as most private facebook groups oh, you, genoa, echo chamber, of confirmation, bias and hatred there speculating about other. Students at the school that tyre. problem with or that didn't like her, these at the school. Now being there was a rumour that tire raped and murdered I'm wondering if that's where roman gotta information that he raped her when he confessed to raping her. but she wasn't rate, but This is a common thing right. Whenever there is a fresh case, there are rumours
there are those initial stories and some people, never let those stories go, they say, but that was reported. I heard that and it doesn't matter if it was later proven to not be the case. It's now lock in their heads. This facebook group theirs Thank you got up two hundred thousands of members, they start going after some of the other students messaging them in choosing them of murdering tire, literally just sending them hateful threats and messages non stop and a cup. Of these students they were the targets here. They were the ones that took the brunt of, these allegations, like you know, come word because there's a man: sitting behind bars for the rest of his life. Because of you cancel we'll at its best year, but in this facebook group
There was a person that came forward that defended these two students that were being accused of tyres, murder, course. He was attacked. Leslie and viciously by the members of this group, but Some of these other students who were the targets of this facebook group they reached, to this person and thanks for defending them in standing up for them when we get, another suspect enter used to this case now before We go onto that just in what were they we're going through here, is that while the police, while the courts, feel somewhat on the right track. They feel like they did. The right thing. There are met in the public who question all of this. and that's why you see even some of the public going after other people. There is a man that turned himself in two. Tyres, family or at least try to?
Her father had to say, go away. If you want to turn yourself into the police, you're saying you killed our daughter, then turn your. Often hidden. Why to do with it. And it turned out later that the man was simply making a statement that the wrong guy? They need justice for tat year and they're, not gonna, go as long as they keep focusing on the door of the law. passion getting stirred up about this case in Israel enduring the initial investigation to this murder, the police question one of these girls, one of these students about it asked her if she had seen anything because these two students were getting blamed for this murder. They happen to be going to the bathroom at around the same exact time that its I, the murder happened. So how could they have? missed this. How could they have not known what was going on? But one these girls had said. I noticed another older. person,
I had never seen her before. I don't think she was a student, not the school, going. the bathroom that's in the original, please report. Now I look statements like that- and I go oh yeah sure you know- but the killer would say just throw out some random person. I saw some random female go into the bathroom and that's it you know just burden. Get me in there is somebody else there, but say she saw roman. She didn't say she saw a man, but the bathroom fact She goes on to say that she went into the bathroom who's trying some of this, all doors inside. the stalls somebody said, occupied I'm in here go away and she said it was a female voice. The investigators Are you sure it wasn't a male voice? I sure wasn't a man in there and she's like not really sure I guess it could have been but her initial statement is. It was a female voice. Now too thirteen and twenty fourteen there
is an avalanche re hearing there, a re hearing of the evidence- and this is good because that mean the supreme court of Israel, has taken seriously says we see issues here and they ve sent it back to the nazareth district court for this rehearing right hearing of evidence and of information comes out from this? There is a medical experts, doktor, maya, foreman resnick, who testified for the defense here and at the time doctors I was working for a private institute and it was run by doktor Chen Google format, testified that one of the costs? on tyre rod s body was made by surveyed knife, now remember what we said before was that it was likely a utility knife or what we, razor knife where there's a razor inserted into a tool? That's what Woman said right the kind of tool that he would have had on him. But this is
kind of testimony that can flip that, because, if it's not, a smooth razor blade that was used to cut tyre, but us are rated knife Well that changes everything, because that's not part of the case, It's completely different and this is apparently one of those peace. Of evidence as it were, or testimony that call the court to look at this and say there thing wrong with all this. We need to do this again. You know when you take a look at this because This is the kind of thing that should be missed right. There was an autopsy perform this shouldn't be guesswork. They shouldn't be well, he had a utility knives. So that's what killed this poor girl you need to show us This was not a utility knife that we use in this crime, but you know the state prosecution- they understood what was going on here. They didn't you want doktor resnick to testify big, they knew what that men she's dead.
Calling into question their whole case on this. one of the biggest cases the country so now the nazareth district court rejected her testimony and they went on to limit her and restrict from being an bert witness in the future. Take a from our sponsor gang their good. I mean the key where rumpled suits and are all roughen graphic whatever, but they get the job done. Sometimes it seems like the poor might have had him fooled, but that ironclad, alibi by through that were that tiny teeny lie the killer, told them the first interrogation boom. He may wonder how going to end, but that's kind fond of a good crime story. Are you ready to stream some crime stories right now? Hulu, it's a crime not to watch, so the state prosecution they took another step here I mentioned earlier that doctor Resnick worked for a private institute run by doktor chen cougar. Well, they wanted
contact this doctor in order to get them to side with them. Here, let's get in for David supporting our position and Google said he agreed with after resonates opinion that it is a rated knife. You could see where the state. Prosecution tried to essentially double down on this and change what was they weren't a very good job. They had the court to agree with them, but when they try to oh past doktor resnick to doktor cool, well, doktor, cruel, supportive brezhnev's findings and because coup I wasn't in court to testify. Well, the state prosecution then went back to basically saying that they were right all along. They didn't have to fight this battle. Is how it goes with a lot of the evidence colluding. The shoeprints and their dna in or lack of dna and blood evidence it
It's not right! You know we talk about how important it is to get these cases right, because first, Foremost, is justice for the victim but we see how in a court of law that gets forgotten its literally? What do we have to do to win? And so like in this case you had a prosecutor, name. She lay in bar who in court stated that doctor cooled agreed with doktor resnick statements about this serrated knife that such but it happened and no cool tried to as clear the air was unsuccessful, so in the the prosecutor gets what she wants now, the attorney four romans at our off try to buy. Google in because of saving, get the person in and have them stay in their own words, how they see things that would be pretty powerful, but this was acted by the judges because they said, was a conflict of interest. if it already testified insarov case as a private expert before he was a point
as a senior official pathologist and the head the government's forensic science to. Now. I'm sure they make that sound like it makes sense to them, but it does it makes sense to me, I dont understand how you can speak for some one and then they want to come and clear. The air- and you say no bother no need. If that's the case, then isn t stay pathologist a conflict of interest. Also, I don't really get the the point there, but that's what they go with state prosecution for all this work. They were doing to block doktor cool from testifying and even filing affidavit well, the affidavit gets through, is published later on this matter that people are able to read it and see for themselves that the prosecution misrepresented, doktor, cools professional opinion on this case, I don't know what you say to that just another, then that's really fishy yeah, and it should make people question everything that the processes
did in this case, don't you think I free and that's why roman started getting a lot of support from the public. Even tyres mother was question whether or not they got the right man and how terrible, is that that damn smother ilona has to wake up. day go to bed every night feeling like they have failed her. They have failed. Her fan they have failed her daughter, because She does not have the confidence that this was handled correctly. Now, doktor resnick did not get this fight and actually later when a legal battle against the state prosecutor's office, because she accuse them of falsifying forensic reports to secure false murder convictions, she's, not wrong by her fighting this battle she's putting career on the line, this is happens. When you fight the system, system doesn't like to air correct. They don't like to be questioned because
their above everyone else right and in her employer was threatened over all of this but does she sued in TEL aviv district labour court after this day prosecutor's office gagged her from standing as an expert witness another cases. You don't get to testify anymore. You can't work and she was compensation for that a period where she was unable to work because of this legal battle she was instantly rehired in position after she won her case This shows that she was able to beat the system, but it took off. and she put a lot on line to do it first, they You can't testify in this case, because it's a conflict of interest and then they're saying you can testify in any case whatsoever which that's part of her job, so yeah they really wanted to silencer just taking. Moment to recognise doktor foreman resnick for her quest for the truth and her I'm dying need to get things right. I mean that's what we want. We want people fighting for truth and so
in this case? That's one bright spot now has to and is attacking the shoeprints evidence and they brought a british shoeprints expert, doktor guy cooper, and he determined that the stains on the victim were not left by romans shoeprints and may not have actually been shoeprints at all. He test. add to this information and the judge said they look if the shoe prints to me cut through threw it out. They brought in an f b, I I investigator william Bosniak. He also testified that bloody impression on her genes may not have been shoeprints at all and there no evidence to determine that they were from roman shoes. So you have to experts shoeprints evidence that are saying you making this up but judge, I can look at and I can see it well.
they're essentially saying that they're, probably not whether prosecution is stating it is. You know, I've talked while paranoia before we can look up in the clouds and see whether we want for looking for it right now, while the poor the commission's expert, is that says no, the solemn manner shoes at romans it or if war made. Six individual stains? Entire rod is genes, so it's very good, like we ve got the guy his prints or all over. But you know we look. back. Just in there is testimony from students, but the school when she pete she could pull my shoes belonging Tell your rada as well as also where's shoes and lots of blood now, party said romans it or of war, a salamander shoes I have one other shoes, possibly right if he was the killer, but we ve got pointed out all the problems. In the case, the question here is but all this evidence this case is full of holes and
and one more issue I have here is a noble- during his reenactment or confession. Did he talk? stopping on her or stepping on her body like. I know that struggling in a stall. So it's just a could just happen, but he never talks about that. So we it's kind of assume or just grants that those are his shoeprints and if you didn't mention it? Well, that's ok! One of the big things that happened here was that early on They seem to indicate that they had dna evidence against romans at all. They also seem to indicate that they had motive for roman, margaret this girl we really see They didn't have any dna evidence and the motive was that he was insulted by her. They also went on his computer and found new, pictures of females, porn.
Painted this to the public as under aged or child abuse images. They called him. the file, so there king at this and say. Well, he has these anger issues she and to him and he was a pedophile. So, of course he did this. Pon examination, there's no proof. he had these weird anger issues that he alluded to when he was probably trying to mitigate this some stances of the situation. You then and none of the images on his computer were found to be of unlawful nature, or just put it that way. Now They are just, as I have said, that they had found some hairs. They had twenty hair tested of the seventy six that were collected. It is reasonable that they can't test everything right. It's just reasonable, when you actually find out how they chose, which shares the test, everything this
where, when you start going down a certain path where you can go down the wrong way and you could miss something because they their idea of what happened. Instead of be making sure they tested all the types of hair that were found there, three of the hairs that were found on tat year had no routes, so they had to do. Might I can't real dna testing this the individuals. Major lineal ancestry. Common mother- this was not a matched his isidora. Now, when you see what the fence did. They claimed that the people destroyed evidence because it would not work her favour one of the things supposedly destroyed? Allegedly destroyed work. Trousers discovered in landfill. According to his defence, the trousers, matched with romans version of events they weren't covered in blood and also they claim
once the dwarf was in their hands once he confessed everything the police stop testing, they said, but we got our guy We don't have to test anything anymore. He already set everything, so they ceased all dna testing and there material that they had scrape from underneath tyres fingernails. Well, ended up being destroyed in two thousand eight without having been tested, they did asked the drains and his house. They ripped out all the drains and pipes like from every sink and shower at his wife's parents. House tested all of it. No blood was found nothing at the home tied him to this murder. They weren't to find a speck of blood on him or any of, his dna or anything on her now, if their stabbing and slashing going on Normally the attacker wool wound themselves. You know cut their own hand. If you see the
on a blood it, for you know that the knife would get slippery and not only do they not have the correct manner weapon used in this crime. but he didn't have any cuts on his hands either, despite a lot of evidence that call and a question romans skilled in this case he's again convict. In fact we have twenty fourteen at the retrial. I think we said it before a number of times, but it's not really about the truth because of it. About the truth. They would have tested the evidence they would have had dna evidence, It would have linked him to this crime in more ways than just a confession. As we know, people will confess they have it in their head in some sort of what he called a vacuum where they think if they are, helpful to the police if they tell them what they want to hear that they'll be able to go home to their families
I actually think that an romans case when he's having this conversation with this informant in me, whatever in the holding so that in may is informing him. If they have done in blood evidence against you, you're going away for life, so you better fesse up to something mitigate your sentence so again there appeal just in december of twenty fifteen. That appeal was denied, but this case pics steam. Again in twenty eighteen, when there the testing of the hairs that were found on tyre rod his body. This was worked by the abu copier forensic institute, this hair this dna profiles that they are able to pull. Well, it doesn't belong, the tyre and doesn't belong to rome, in either so a third party was at this murder scene. Somebody else was involved because its
is that this hair was kicked him blood. It was part of the the crime scene, so it had Been pulled out somebody's head or on summit clothing. It was thing that was left there at the time murder and it did not match roman now get back to this documentary referenced earlier, just in shadow of truth, This was released and twenty sixteen. If you go there and try to find it. It's not on netflix anymore, it's not on most streaming services, so you might have a hard time getting access to it and might be available for purchase. But wondering our company that will confer under they did pod podcast it's under the same name, shadow of truth. It's definitely based on this documentary series. So if you need to get in a little deeper, there's deaf, the series out there that you can get from wondering, but this
documentary series. Just they go. beyond it or if they go beyond because they say they have a different theory of. Why tire rada was murdered, and even say who they believed it. And how Do you remember I was talking about her? A guy came in and was defending the other students, india, facebook group accusing these two other girls at the school of murder entire, oh, that man says I'm a coward. I didn't speak but the time I've failed. You I know who murdered tire. That's big news right As we know, anybody could come forward and claim they know what happened absolutely. But what does he I have to say, because that's the key here well first to his girlfriend, and the document re she's referred to as a k. Ah, but her initials are actually different. claims that she murdered tyre with
a knife, she said that she had actually bound. Body up like two flattened her chest put on offer. Ass, wig put on some clothing that wasn't exactly you know, school, uniform or whatever, and the description that's the one student gave of this random female students going into the bathroom. I once it's an exact match, but kind. lines up with the way she said she dressed that day. So she as she goes in, she has a backpack as a change of clothes. She has a knife honour and she says that she goes to the school. And hides out in the bathroom now she sits in the store when she hears a group of students come in, she doesn't come out, so she was waiting for one student to come in She could attack them and at one point
student pulled on the stall door in she said: occupied that's a little familiar now. Why would she do this, and why would this girlfriend of this man yet kitchen gloves rap her body up, take a book bag and a night to a school to murder, somebody will triumph for this. But according the boy friend he said that she believed there was a blood hungry wolf inside of her who was hell bent on murder, and this is something she just said in the past head. And under the care of psychiatrists because of her issues. She's had A couple attempts on her own life, I'm assuming she has severe ptsd in some other issues and she goes to her safe space. Hers space is a pool of blood. Her safe space
It is burrowing into the innards of other people, that's where she goes in her mind when she's worried things are feeling anxious, there's a story that her boyfriend relays that his girlfriends father was like in a retired, ranking general or something in the russian army, and he took her as a small girl out onto a battlefield and she said she was cold, possibly she wasn't dressed and father put her inside of a corpse of either a animal or a dead fallen soldier. This is some pretty our stuff here and of course the skaters are looking at this and saying: ok, that's quite story, but how do we know that she actually did this,
herr that they found the profile it actually matches the friend h and he said that she was wearing his clothing that day now a lot People might stop here, justin and say wait a minute if it's his hair, that was ident five, thirty, nay, they couldn't he just made all this up to blame his girlfriend. absolutely and why they go to question his girlfriend. She immediately turns around. It says: oh yeah, guys crazy. He controlled me. He would rape and abuse me, he's the one that you should be looking at. Not me now seeing her interview, how fast she comes back with his the crazy one, it's not like No, I didn't have anything to do with this. How could you suspect me it is just immediate, like
attempts you and I can look at it- and I can say well me be he was a horrible person and she's gonna say don You dare look at me. Look at this abusive boyfriend or can look at in, say she the nurse assist. because she had every single explanation ready to go when they were questioning her is to me just because they weren't even looking I'm talking about them authorities here they were looking for anyone else, they already romans it or if they did Anybody else and Here comes a h with a story and have the dna match I could at least few trust him. They would help splain how his hair ended up on tyres body now explains how his hair would have ended up on here's body because he says that his girlfriend, we're a wig and also a coat of his. So he had this coat
that she wore and his hair could have come from that coat and then ty year, when she attacked, if his girlfriend a k had done this She said that she wrapped up. her body and wearing Jim gloves so why she didn't leave fingerprints, why shouldn't leave dna but she's this code, this jacket and hairs are left, but he's also was wearing a wig, but spain's how she climbed out of the bathroom stall to her boyfriend the time by climbing up under the toilet and after the side, now again he could be making this all up because he actually did it, but All of these details are actually happened now. Could you go out and read these things in the media? Sure you could but Why was this hair strand found there? You can spain that went away. That's a definite link, the eu.
just throw away now in age, came forward with this. The police question him. They turn out in question has, I guess, ex girlfriend sheet the police that he raped her repeatedly. So the police arrest age, they tell him that he's lying. They tell him that he's being arrested for this claims at his exports is made against him. They keep him for like ten days in every they handcuff his hands above his head and hancock, his feet to the bottom of the bed. So still lay there like that. Every night he can't roll over. He can't move, he can't get up to go there. Through without somebody coming in and I'm walking the handcuffs Tell him if you ass. The truth, if you say that you are making all this up, we will drop the charges against you that your ex girlfriends leveraging against you
All you gotta do is use, tells your line and he doesn't. They don't like their story, their theory being challenged. all, I can say is, if you locked me up for ten days I a essentially its torture. Ah not sleeping not able to go the bathroom being interrogated for the rest of the day. I mean roman essentially, what we can assume is a false confession, sooner and without as much pressure as what age was put through. Now, a h. His girlfriend was in a now the relationship and when so I started, and the police were questioning her. She called up her current boyfriend intoxicated said. I To talk to you, I need to come over and she said up at his house. She had- a broken piece of glass like a glass shard in her hand, and she starts org, with him and
holds that piece of glass up to his throat people intervene, they get glass shard away from her and she is taken into custody and the police question her again and at this point it's pretty much obvious that there's something wrong with her and she tells the police about how she once blood how she wants to get people. She too, the police that her come zone. Her safe space is a pool of blood and she alludes to the fact that their things in her past that she doesn't want to talk about things. She's done so she gets in the two should listen to a hospital and her room. Mate that she has to live with at the hospital. We'll talk, her boyfriend that she confesses, all of what she, done to her
She says that she is like a frog or a wolf living inside of it that needs blood, but sadly this remains will taking her own life. So she will never be able to give a statement and then The boyfriend who got this confession, you know. This is totally here say at this point, but the boyfriend who confession of the room mate of this other girl whose admitting to the crime hilt his own life too. So other people that she's confessed to are no longer here. It is absolutely hearsay, and it is absolutely unsubstantiated can't that this, because there no longer with us its tragic we ve seen This system fail pyrite his family, essentially in there, once something new comes in some new information that has some kind of a tie to this case. Spinning this hair that was
nay, tested and matched megan. Finally, hopefully, head towards justice. It's like the whole thing falls apart between the sister. refusing to change, refusing to react to new information, good information and then the person who you think they would look into every one around them who is this story is either not believed or doesn't make it, and so this is all the cases we ve covered. I haven't seen a case with so much bad luck and bold, it s working against it. That's feels to me anyway. Of course, it's hard to vet ages statement, because there was many eighteen. This is overdue later so girlfriend, if she's telling the truth, he's gotten rid of all these things. She doesn't have any of the evidence anymore and
denying what he sang but then turns around and talks about pools of blood and other stuff. Maybe she did have a terrible upbringing. Maybe she does Ptsd I don't wanna accuse age of anything, but you know you look at the text. Messages between them he doesn't come off. Is the perfect person either, but regardless? I truly. At my core feel like rome, needs a new trial or needs to be let out because there's other suspects here then be vetted that need to be investigated, their spin much harsh reaction to it formation here by the authorities. I would think Like I said earlier with the dna match from the hair, tat would be For them to say, ok, we don't know we believe a h or we, leave a K or either one, but have you, but this Something we need to look into, because you would think that would be enough
to get them to say. Maybe we wrong. Despite a confession, I try to understand a ages motive to insert himself into the dialogue. Defence other students on facebook and say you guys are just making stuff up. Stop. King, these, these other students, there's a truth here and there comes forward and says it was my girlfriend What is his motivate if he actually had done this now he's just inserted himself into this case that doesn't make a lot of sense to me, but the hare point him so, That's what's tying him to this, but I think the explanation of how that haired output there. More sense if they had test and all of the hairs, what they had found something else. It's possible also found handwriting in the bathroom stall that they brought, handwriting experts. They say that
Little scribbles on the wall are determined to be a man for a sample of ok or jays, girlfriend sheared confess to multiple people that she had done this and she had details of the crime that she probably should not have known, this case at now, why of twenty twenty one. There was a supreme court decision that ordered a retrial for romans it or, if we're looking at, twelve years that he's been in prison, his attorneys they obsolete, believe as the door of his innocent and they believe A h is probably responsible for tire rossmore, I'm guessing that's because of the hair right, yeah, zero, attorney file, the request for trial with the supreme court, october twenty twenty saying, a lot of new evidence that proves unequivocally that roman did not murder the deceased and could not have murdered the deceased. This is why this been court made the decision they did
it's nice to know that you have a lot of courts who might be fighting against this truth against this evidence. But the supreme court did the right thing now in August of twenty twenty one. The high court released roma, the door of the house, arrest, Why is awaiting retrial bout and tat. He had a statement to make to reporters who were waiting on his every word, and he said there is only one truth: everything will be ok so he's being electronically monitored, he's paying. it is mother and laws home and the prosecutors. Of course they didn't like this. They believed that he's a danger to society and that the first second he gets he wilfully, but the the high court Alex stein? The judge said a lack of violence roman during his many years in prison and his proper conduct as a worker in the prison welding workshop also carry weight. This is the judges discretion feeling like he's, not
In any indication that he will flee that is my day, to society we ve talked before just than about documentaries and how they can. Way you what who feel this documentary dead right, and you feel that there is any bias and at all, or do you believe it is a quest for the truth. I think it the quest for the truth. The first episode is roman. Did this and for sake of storytelling, they go through and show you all the things that go against him and why he was convicted. Then an episode too. Go through all of the evidence and how problematic. It is how he gets the details wrong and then it takes episode? three and four december laying out everything else. That was happening, and the students and age and his girlfriend. All of that I thought they were pretty thorough with,
thing, I am sure that you can only fit so much into a tv series, but I didn't find it to be very biased myself, because they do lay out a lot of things and in a way against roman, were by the time you're done with the first episode you're like yeah. This guy did it and I don't need to watch any more. I look this case, I think if they didn't have a man but on that hair, kay, as we were calling her. Those are just initials weave assigned I dont know that you have this bush. We have. I think this is powerful, stuff no, we ve said before you can have any one come up with any kind of story and believe us, this case has a lot of stories. They just don't make sense, but when you come back it up the piece of real evidence that was found, at the scene. I dont know where else you can go, but in a different direction than this where it had gone previously. So I think it's exciting stuff and I are the issues too bad that in the quest to find
The killer of this poor girl that boy The door of was brought in and coerced The way was because it seems obvious that he was coerced yeah, it's one, for people who are comfortable at home in a suburb somewhere in america to say I wouldn't give them what they want. I wouldn't make up stories to help their investigation. But I'd say have a little empathy here. This, the sky was from it country. He was trying to make a living for his family and he was just trying to make it. He was just trying to get by and made some bad decisions, he's for those trust me. Their spending long time behind bars. Yes, else, what you think go out find a son social media, facebook instagram joiner page and if you like, tell us what you think they're, let us now if you listen to the podcast or watch the memory on this
I want to hear your guys his thoughts, because this is one of the most complex and crazy cases. I think we ve covered in a long time and if romance at all it is not the killer, then was it a k or age? because, given the hare evidence, it might had been one of those two never an episode of generation. Why subscribed to us on apple podcast, spotify, cast box or reverie listening right now? Also, sure to follow us on social media. Our tik tok is at then, why pod are instagram is at generation. Why podcast join wondering plus in the wondering, app to listen ad free? the
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Transcript generated on 2022-08-27.