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The beaten down is wrong about the breed rule. Go around here, the body, my awareness to a dragging him down the road losses. Keys now, remember: that's what he got: ally circles on the road and ralph peters finished there and all down the road. I went to the graveyard and yesterday on hooked me at last. He before he got to the graveyard on the right.

I saw last year when I did see their son flesh out there on Saturday june six nineteen. Ninety eight forty nine year old, jeems bird junior, he spent the hanging out with his friends and family. He attended to different parties and, after the second party, he left there quite late that night about one To one thirty a m that evening now he was walking home. His apartment was on the other side of town and is when he encountered three men in a pickup truck who had offered him a ride.

the next day at seven, a m on sunday, his body, was found located on the road and in very bad condition. His head in his shoulder were found. All a mile away where we left off We were in the middle of the investigation, and we're getting ready to bring in the fbi, and this is when they are talking to sean bear now bury was one of the three men believed to have been in the pickup truck that evening, James bird junior had been spotted by eye witnesses in a pickup truck matching that description well when the sheriffs department, when they have shown berry and the other two men in custody and they're talking with them. Remember we said that where they were probably trying to get them to turn on one another right it was. It was becoming clear to these to the sheriff that

these three men were very likely involved in this murder and that they had committed it together. If you can get these guys sort turn on each other, you're going to get information that can help you put together a case and take these dirt bags to trial yeah. They believed that this was a hate, crime and that's why they wanted to get the fbi involved and once once they started telling the suspects that That's when we get sean bury, who gets the encouragement that he needed to tell us what he? What happened according to him by his side of the story as to how this murder took place, while bury states that they saw he was travelling with the other two men bill, king and Russell bore and that they had saw. James bird walking that night. This was likely in the early morning hours. This would be about one thirty, two, a m rain. He is heading across town back to his apartment.

sean bury says that it was. He in fact that had offered james bird arrived james bird accepts the ride. There's a little bit of the communication between the two. That seems a little strange to me. The way that Barry puts this year's later is that he offered He said: hey do you want us to drive you home and to which he says James Byrd, Jr, said well I'll ride around with you guys for awhile, and we talked about james and his character and who he was. He was it. He was a happy guy. He was in a good mood. He liked to socialize with people known for being kind of a good timing. Guy right and sometimes you- you have individuals year, you're one such individual- that sometimes when you goin and your party mode you're not going to stop. You know so it could have been ass. Simple ass yeah, you can drive me home or what are you guys up to so sean bury said that he had stopped.

Offered the ride to bird early report speculated that james burden MR bury may have known each other, because I guess they had same parole officer, the associated press reported that this was a possible. He now sheriff roles I believe it was he that they set at one point that the two could have seen each other at you know when they have to go visit, their parole officer according to sean bury he claims that he did not know James bird, but he did in fact recognize him as someone who frequently walked around the town of jasper taxes bill king after James bird is in the truck bill. King became upset and became. He began cursing. So big. is upset with sean forgiving. James bird arrived, the men stopped at a convenience, store

this is when bill king is going to take over the driving, so he drives the men down a dirt road. All four men are back in the truck. Point during the short dr bill. King says, to bury that he is about to scare MR james bird, so instead of taking James bird junior home very brewer in king, they drove east out of jasper and they stopped at a small clearing in the woods now. This is where investigators believed that there was some kind of fight in this clearing because of the upturn grass, the disturbed dirt, the broken beer bottles morning to sean bury bill. King and Russell brewer opened up James birds door and they were

trying to pull him out of the truck james was hanging onto the door with both hands trying to keep himself inside the truck. I won't repeat all was said according to sean bury. As far as you know, what what the other two men were saying at this time, but at some point bill. King has announced to the group that he would like to kill James bird reign. The group, according to sean bury story at this point, should be well aware of what very likely could happen. Next. An even more horrifying and terrifying is that james bird is now aware of what this guy's intentions are very says, that he was, he was horrified and he was helpless, and he sat there any watched as the two men pull james bird from the truck once James was out of the truck

sean bury. He got it. He got between bill king and james bird, telling bill king to stop what they were doing bill king then threatens sean berries. Life sean bury says that at this point in the story, James bird is very intoxicated he's very drunk. The other two men took James bird to the back of the truck sean bury says, there was no problem getting bird to the back of the truck I mean he's once they get amount is being overpowered by two people and according to bury James bird is very intoxicated, so this this would make sense that they are able to easily over power. The man sean bury does not explain how the men got james burned to the ground. I don't think he knows for certain, but he does say it

It's no trouble for the men to get him to the ground. So there's a possibility. It's not just two own one. It's a good possibility! There's three on one and we're just not getting the story, so james bird is now he's on the ground now and bill. King is stopping him. and we have russell brewer is kicking him like straight on an sean bury says, the two men are low. Thing. While they are doing this, James bird was now trying to get is attempting to get up so he's like on all fours, but he still down. An russell brewer got a can of spray paying out of the back of the pickup truck. He then

sprayed james bird in the face with it. James word said nothing when this happened he'd, he almost didn't even react to it. Russell brewer than kicked him in the head very hard, and it was at this point there, on bury says that this was the last time that he saw James bird move. Sean very says he was petrified to the point that he went. His pants does next part is a bit unclear, but at this point either one of two things happened and in all explained this. Sean bury is either inside the truck or sean bury had run off, but Whatever reason he is not he's not

in the location where he can see. What's going on at this point in his story, re the game again what he is claiming. Yes, this is what he's telling the investigators, so he says that he at this point this is when they must have chained james, bird up to the truck, because he, for whatever reason, did not see this take place. So let's go through this statement a little bit here and not not this direct one, but but all parts of it. Okay, so so this statement is backed up with some of the evidence that we spoke about with some of the evidence that was found in we spoke about in the clearing the investigators found several items that could have, let's say, fallen out of a tree. Maybe while someone was trying to be pulled out of that vehicle, we also saw evidence of a struggle that took place

So sharp air is shown very, does tell us these things in his story and some of the evidence it was found backs portions of the story, and we also have the witness statements saying that they saw James bird in the truck as well. Ok, so at this point the unfortunately james bird is has been been beat up and he's been chained to the back of this truck. They started dragging him down a dirt road. Now Sean bury says that truck, was so loud that he didn't hear anything so so now he's back in the truck with other to individual, correct. He says

dead. At one point, Russell brewer looked back behind the truck and he said, look he's rolling and he said, look he's bouncing up and down referring to james bird behind the truck, sean bury says that the other two men seem to be having fun at pointing out what was going on. He said they should the truck than careened around a band and james bert birds body swung off the road. This must be when it, when his body struck the the ragged edge of this culvert. This is what severed his his right arm his shoulder his and head from his body shown very says the king continued to do for a little ways, and then he stopped the truck he got out of the vehicle. Any untied birds, lifeless body

He then through the chain. In the back of the truck, so James bar junior, he was dragged to half creek road, which would be roughly about three miles approximately from the location where police believed that this this fight had it ensued, so we have king berry and brewer. They they dumped james, The mutilated remains an apparently. They went to a barbecue of some sort. I don't know if this was at the the girl friend of bill kings. You know at her house or what, but this would be pretty late, yes, all or early, depending on how you look at it, but so they they go to a party afterwards this this could be. You know you never know with with some of these stories. You may win when you have what he say: yeah they

up here at four in the morning or what is it well was a barbecue at one point or was already at one point now. It's just four in the morning left over, you know flops on the floor. It will now Kay So there was a lot of questioning going on early in this investigation at this point in the investigation one, it was not known how long james bird was alive during the dragging but brewer claimed that birds throw had been slashed before he was tied to the truck and then drag. Later, we would learn that at the forensic evidence suggests the bird had been attempting to keep his head up when he was being dragged trying to keep his head up off the road and

topsy suggested that james bird was alive for much of the dragging and died only after his head shoulder and right arm or severed from his body from hitting the culvert. At this point you know the investigators are not only shocked at they ve heard, but it's also backing up kind of what their theory was. From early in the investigation as to how this went down, not no, not necessarily that sean bury. You know he didn't disappeared. In this thing he just happened to be there impious pants, not that part of it. It's just backing up. There thought that these three are the ones that are in fact responsible for this horrible crime, and these three alone With that information, now they're going to have shown bury led them to the chain. He will take them that day on that monday to fight

the chain that was used to tie James bird junior to the back of that truck right, the one that the possum king put back into the true yes- and I guess I find this chain in the in someone's back yard, I heard that they must have, they must have drove around afterwards and dumped it somewhere, but he with his help they are able to locate this chain so think about this. For a second here captain we have. James Byrd Jr forty nine full of life out with friends and family on saturday, a good, a good guy, just regular good dude walking home, gets offered a ride and within hours his bodies found your talking about seventy again on sunday morning, people are getting up in there they're starting their day, their cooking breakfast there. they're going getting dressed in going off to church. You know their stock,

in their day and people people found this body. And his body, these people that we're getting up to start their day, the last day of their weekend, all right, and if they do It doesn't get in that truck. Maybe he's waking up and getting gone to church himself and just and just within hours of the location of this of finding the body. We have our first suspect, rounded up his two idiot friends or are gobbled up by police quickly after that, their interrogated for quite some time, which name while a bunch of evidence and the scene. Yes, we ve located a bunch of evidence, then by monday morning we have again fashion and by I believe it must have been around noon. On monday, one of the suspects took them to find the change what's happening very quickly, right which, but that's the murder weapon, basically yeah.

And this is why you know I was I you know in in the last episode I kept saying how much I liked this sheriff roles, and- and this is why he is dealing with think about this- for a second small town small sheriffs department. According to his interview, this might have been only his second murder investigation in his tenure. When you know these things, Murders don't happen very often in this town. This type of crime doesn't happen, that often in the entire nation, in the world. Yet, and so we're too, about a guy that really could of When you want it, when you want to talk about experience, and sometimes we talk about in these cases where well they they botched the. ass, the geisha in they bungled the investigation, because they're not experience because they're just some small town, keystone, cops. Well, that's not

case here and that's why I love the sheriff roles keys, dealing with something that no town could ever have to experience a crime that never should have happened and he's in there's no textbook on this. is investigating this thing, and things are happening very quickly and I think handling it. I mean this thing: they could write a textbook on this yeah and the the problem here is that if you don't get this right, if you ve met this up, this is this is very bad. If you mess up, you know it's one thing: if you you'll botch a something here and here there, but this is all horrific crime These are horrific individuals and you need to make sure that you cross every tee not every eye, to make sure that these guys are never see the light of day ever again and sheriff roles asked you know: why did you contact the fbi? He said very bluntly, you know I I

no the definition of a hate crime, but I knew this was one, but he didn't have to to know. That's it to get the fbi involved. So after all, this goes down after the ass and after locating the chain and the evidence that you spoke of the sheriffs department, they do charge sean bury, who is twenty three years, bill, king, whose twenty three as well and lawrence Russell brewer, thirty one at the time with murder. Now the district attorney com for adding kidnapping charges to these charges. This would make it a capital crime. So once we Have we know the chain was involved. We know that their chaining, a man up in their taking him away, that's kidnapped and now we have it. We have the situation where we have kidnapping and murder charges facing these three gaps.

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but keep in mind we're talking about a small county in this particular case. Now this forced officials to raise local property taxes by twelve percent as it that's a huge hike when you think about that. well this results in MR bill kings. Lawyers asking that his trial be moved, arguing that the tax increase would make it possible to draw an impartial jury bill. King is going to be the first of these three guys that have brought to trial, regarding did james bird junior murmured possum king and it was judged Joe bob golden of state of the state district court.

The ordered that the trial go ahead, that we're not going to move it to another venue, there's not going to be a change of venue, we're going to continue with it here in this county and the prosecutors. They said publicly that they were confident that they would be able to get an impartial panel of yours. That could be found or this trial they were able to come up with a jury of twelve. This ended up being seven men and five women, and it was eleven of these members were white the sole black member of the jury was a corrections officer and in fact, strange thing here is: he would have been about the same age as bill king and I believe that they may have attended one of the same schools together at some point,

and their lives. Here's a weird thing here: captain and I dont know that it. I don't know that weird is the right term, it's more than just. I think this is something that's lesser known or maybe less accepted. There's no way of me saying this. Without getting somebody sending me a rotten email but I'll, send you one, look! Here's the thing I'll! Send you a nice one when, when we do these shows we sit here in the garage we- and we re tell these stories when we, when we pull together all this information and were telling you about these cases about these real life events that happened. We can't here worried about whether what's how it's going to be received we say we can't sit here and worry about. Ok, somebody's gonna come down upon us for saying this or they're gonna come upon us if we say it this way, so really what Just do as you just report the truth, okay, so

you sent a rotten email, keep in mind that we were reporting the truth to you. First of all, and second of all These are not the captain and I did not drive the jasper taxes interview a bunch of people and put this story together to report back. You know we are peace law. I worry through didn't want to go with me, so we're piecing this story together through court documents as well as newspaper articles. They were written by other people and some of them being local reporters. Now. This is something that I have heard and read before in other cases, but it certainly translates to this one. You know that we said that they wanted to get impartial, jurors, obviously

this panel, well a problem that you have when you have a case of this magnitude and it's. This is a death penalty case. Ok, let's be very clear about that. What you tend to see happen is when you're trying somebody in the penalty is possible. Penalty is death. While you have to interview these potential jurors and you have to decide, they fit on the panel. What tends to happen in a lot of these cases? You know you ask well, why is? Is eleven members of the jury? Why and only one of them african american well one it just, may so happened to work out that way. We don't, we don't know the details, but in a lot I what the prosecution wanted.

In a lot of these cases. What ends up happening is they dismiss a lot of african american potential jurors, because what tends to happen is they don't they're not, as let's say enthusiastic about the death penalty as as white people. Maybe this could be. This is due to several factors, one one and its the religious aspect and too, unfortunately, in this tree predominantly when we see somebody that is, has been charged and convicted wrongfully of a crime. It tends to be african american people, so they

they have a better understanding that it's not a perfect system, it doesn't work. One hundred percent one hundred percent of the time. Therefore, unfortunately, we know this has happened in it in a break your heart, but there has been at some point some innocent person, wrongly convicted and then sentence to die and they carried out that ends, and I think that that something that can get lost on some people and That's why you see in these death penalty cases the it tends to be. A little more white people on the group. Now the solve this african american member of the panel was actually elected as the foreman of the jury. Now some things female and trial. Here. Keep in mind this bill, king, that's being tried first, one thing: came out, was the the forensic power

Apologies tommy brown. He he brought to court and testified as an expert witness stating that james bird was alive and rising in pain until he was struck till he struck that culvert that decapitated. He stated that there was evidence that prove that james bird had fought to survive. While he was chained by the ankles to the truck and being dragged He said this would have taken place for about two miles along that paved country. Road state he was attempting to keep his head off of the pavement and he was cause. He was conscious during this time now, brown was the one that perform the official autopsy on bird, and he said the birds elbows in knees were ground to the bone as he try to prop himself up off of the road. He said did that the victim would have been very tired very worn out trying

to do a lot of things, trying to keep the pain from being so severe heap. probably would have been swapping one portion of his body. For another trying to get pressure off of other areas. birds head in right, arm and shorter were torn from his torso. When he struck that concrete drainage culver as the truck swerved from side to side the path pathology said, it's his opinion that bird was alive up until that point, so one thing I want to point out that the path ology said their drag this guy in their there. There weaving this truck as they are doing this going down there. street they found remains of james bird. In eighty one point says, along that stretch of road bill, kings defence well

little different than the other two defendants they would later have their trial dates. His defense was basically did me: wasn't there that this crime went down and it was not committed by him because he was not there. His evidence to prove that is he states that there was a phone call. He was during this time that James Burgess, was killed, that he was on the phone with his girlfriend making arrangements so that he would end up their later that that you know we can saying later, but it so early in the morning. It's confusing if right if you're saying the right terms it so that's his statement. Well that does go with the evidence dave that they found they determine that he was on the phone. Closer to around like four in the morning, and this would have been well after james bird, had

killed, so the timelines not matching up to start with other evidence against bill. King is obviously we have shown berries testimony. We also have a cigarette that was found at the location where the body was eventually located on their dna. Dna evidence this cigarette, but was it was bill kings, have the lighter than was bill, kings, possum, king, lighter so His defence regarding those two items was simply this one that the lighter had been stolen from him about a week before the murder had been committed, heir to the the the truck. If, if it was in fact sean berries truck that was used and he was not present with sean bury, then it's likely that he had put out a cigarette at some point.

in sean berries, ashtray and that when these men were removing James bird from the truck when that struggle went down that the ashtray would have been kicked and not to the ground, leaving cigarette buts and leaving this evidence behind the scenes. What police in what the prosecutors were able to lay out to the jury is that there is some other problems with this story because remember, we said that they were add up already before. They got angry about somebody being at the party and they left right. Well, people at that party said. No, we saw bill king using that lighter that night, so he with them during this party, so so days after he says it was stolen from him and then, second of all, we have

av and sean berries. Here we have his statement and we have this backed up by some other people that the truck had been recently cleaned. It had been recently cleaned out and shawn. Berry statement was that the ashtray had been emptied and cleaned out prior to that day's events, so it'd be a cigarette from at least the yeah and here's the other thing. Ok, let's say bear he lets, say bilking. You were able to confuse us in and convince us that you were they are using these. These other stories, which we know are not true, might remember. We said that he had been kicking James bird junior right and he had also walked in ample all over the the crime scene with

found dna evidence. They found dna evidence of James bird junior on his footwear on bill kings, footwear right so Discover this real quick. So we have, I witness, is put in em all three together that night. I just love it before James would have been picked up. We have dna evidence of the cigarette, but Yes, that was found there. We have the lighter that was found there and which probably has his dna evidence on it too, and now we have James byrd's dna evidence on a possum king's shoes. our boots. So it only took the jury of twelve. It only took them. It was like two and a half hours, a mostly white people. Yeah. They decided that bill king, a white supremacy

should die by lethal injection for the murder of James Byrd, Jr, so found guilty and sentenced to die and after the death sentence was announced, and there was a priest that had read a statement from the this is from bill king's father, okay, this Please pray for the bird family who have endured an unimaginable pain and loss. Please pray for these jurors who have shouldered a terrible burden. Please pray for our town jasper, a community that remain strong, though scarred by this unspeakable act. Now the younger mister king bilking, who is on trial, also left a written statement behind and as he was taken away to prison, he left the state

They said, though, I remain adamant about my innocence. It's been obvious from the beginning that this community would get what they desire. So I close with the words of francis yankee. The promise of success is with the man who is detour. And to die proudly when it's no longer possible to live proudly and was signed sincerely john w king and those from francis boo yeah yeah well on his way out of the court house when they were taking bill king out of the courthouse and onto prison, he he Ok, so he's asked by reporters if he has any thing to say to the bird family at this point, bilking smart, any responded with an obscenity LISA I, but I would

forgot to say it myself. If you want to, you can go ahead. The thing is, nobody said. Well, Then we will have to locate that he said something extremely rude to the family of a murder. Victim, whether he's guilty or not? Okay, and let me stop it and tell me all right, we're back magical spock So what he said when I if he had anything to say to the byrd family. He said you can suck. My dick is why he said yeah, and you know I hesitated to tell that story in it's entirety, because because of this I look cause you're. A good boy boil bill king as it is, horrible man and if their, if there is a hell, I hope he gets there. Ok, but the thing is captain

we gotta tell the whole story, like we just said we to tell the truth and to be perfectly clear, he was in an interview, and I think this would have been two or three years after the crime or two or three years after he was sensed anyway during this interview, he was asked why he would say that to his victims, family right and he stated He had while he had nothing nice to say to the bird family. In this interview he was clearing up that. That was not He was not directing that comment to the bird family right. There were as gordon Amman, as they escort such a pile of dog shit that people are not crowd, are gonna yell stuff at him. yeah there, the crowd is taunting him. He just been sentenced to death, he's being walked off to prison and there hunting him they're saying horrible things to him. He was worse,

hunting with something horrible back at one of those persons to which then a reporter jumps in front and right, whereas microphone is as yet anything to say to the bird family in it. That's how, according to bill king, that's down who knows again, but this this is very similar to him explaining away like pieces of evidence I'll just happenstance, you know get like now: you're you're, a giant oh shit. Well, the thing is: if you want, if you want to look at it from the opposite direction and say that that's what his intentions were, that he did intend to say that you, you obviously Have plenty of evidence to believe that he would have said that right because of we, we ve seen, look and when we say some people that are hearing about this case for the first time today and they're going well white supremacist how'd. He added Oh he just said some things. How do we know? What really have? No? They found plenty of evidence in

his dwelling that he was not only a white supremacy, but he was wanting to start an organization. It was going to do horrible things to african americans have tattoos all over your body about here. There is no question of who this guy was And so when you see how domini ignore it, he must be to have those beliefs into one to organise such a group. Then it's very quick and very easy to believe that he would and dumb enough, as he's being carted out of court, to say something that stupid to the public regarding his victim's family, knowing that he would have appeals to face knowing that you know what in the in the in the end, the people that the sentence you to death is the community yeah in the ant and if, if upset them and if you pass them off and if you do a crime, this bad and you show no remorse absolute and

slowly, no remorse for what you ve done. This community is going to make sure that death sentence gets carried out one. This is not the sentence, he should have got anyways I mean if you're gonna have the death penalty. Right then I say: go full out. I don't believe in the death penalty because of the idea that there could be an innocent person that is tried and sentenced to death, and then that's carried out and just one innocent person dying Something is too much and my mind, but if you're gonna have it it's the eye. the idea of eye for an eye, and so we are going to do that then the possum king, you know. Ah, let me get some guys from jasper or let's round up some of my buddies and let me stop and kick the shit out of this guy and chain him to the back of a truck

that's what should happen to this individual. We still have to trials to get through and, as I said, bill kings. Defense was a little bit different than what sean berries would be. An russell brewers would be lost over brewers, first yeah, because he actually tried second, so bill kings. Defense was, he was innocent. He was not there, he didn't, he didn't me no right liar. He didn't have anything to do with this murder, while Russell brewer, his statement is going to be the mile yeah. He was there, but he didn't take He didn't participate in any of the actions that lead to james bird death so hit. There's gonna be similar that he was just yet that he was just there. He was. He was in a situation that he couldn't control and things got out of hand, and he was a witness to this. Not a participant right, but

heard this story before I want one, and so let's go let's go into that night. We're gonna kind of mesh these other two trials together, because their very similar in this sense sean bury his defense- was pretty much the same thing. Yes, he was there. He was a witness to this situation. He was not a participant in the situation, so in both try is what you end up having captain is. You have shown very repeating the story that I Would you earlier that he told two investigators right he's going to put the blame? on Russell brewer, an bill king and then you wanna, flip over in the other trail, you're gonna have russell brewer who's. Gonna, put all the blame on sean berry and bill came right, rembrandt, so the only difference between the two that I noticed right away, would be that the rustle brewer did get a change of venue for some reason and then Sean bury did not so too

The trials were held in jasper. Aware and the other one was not. What could have had something to do with those two guys were jasper, resin residence for a while. So maybe that's what it was and maybe because blur was from a different county, he could at a different address or something. Maybe the lawyers can do some wigglin her friend benevolent, so they could. the different venue. I think that improves case in that I'm going off of memory. This didn't make it to my notes here, but I think I'm brewers case the reason why they were able to get the change of venue was because it was trial that immediately followed bill kings array wherein because bill king was good the and very obviously guilty. I think brewers attorneys were able to present that it was going to be very tough for him to get a fair trial there now, with berries case, was shown berries case. I think

because he was whether he's telling the one hundred percent truth or not. We will probably never know. However, he was the one that showed some ability of helping out and assisting the police in their investor asian by telling them some kind of story by leading them to the chain where I think, because of those actions, the judge was pretty certain he was going to get fair trial. While the conclusion to these trials Russell brewer, he was found guilty of murder and kidnapping, and he too would be sentenced to death. Now sean berry The jury decided that they were not going to. They were going to spare him the death penalty in his trial we had the situ asian, where we have russell brewer, who testified that sean bury had cut James birds throat before bird was tied to the truck right,

the jury, decided that there was not a lot of evidence to support this claim. So therefore, you know like we said we have, each guy, basically painting the same picture there just taking themselves out of the picture. I dont know why, I could not get to the bottom of in this case, captain was: was his throat actually cut, because this was this was kind of a big deal? the trial, whether that it pointed towards more guilt by on bury then then what he came forward with a find anything. The definitively said that that had happened now, unfortunately, as far as we know, given the factors of the crime they made

I have been able to determine that right and I think a couple of things here. I think one it's possible that birds to fence basically just mimicked what they could get from Barry's defense and if that's the case, then they're just going to you know, Barry saying that the throat was cut. So therefore we're going to say that it was Barry. Yom, who knows I wouldn't, and this from some awful but there's apartment part doesn't want to believe- and I is that I don't want to believe that he was alive, when he were, I dreamt right right right yet yet sounds awful, but when you put thought into it it's it's it's a thought of mercy in a way is the thing here: is they found. You know whether you want to believe bury story or bird story or whatever I do, but without sean bury caving like he did.

in telling them what happened, or at least his version of what happened I think it would have been a little tough to and harder. Yes, it would have harder to get bill king convicted. It would have certainly been harder to get Russell brewer convicted. Now how When I say that, but they did fine dna evidence of all three of these guys at the crime scene, and this would have been on cigarette buts and and beer bond of ninety eight in our our understanding of dna technology was wasn't that great then. So as far as the jury was concerned may be they wanted and indict these guys. They were also able to approve the tyre. barks found in the area did in fact come from the tyres on berries, pickup truck. So there's a lot of evidence that the points to the guilt of these guys, unfortunately, we only get berries version improve

version of what actually happened in all. I hood you know I they did present people at berries, trial. That said, he wasn't a racist. I don't believe that Maybe he wasn't at one point in his life. I dont know how that works, to be honest with you, but I think that I think all three of these guys were absolutely involved in this horrible crime. I think we're not getting the full story from either bury or brewer, writings, not talk in the minutes. It's a mixture, you know every one of these cases that we cover captain, they they break your heart. Ok, they break it heart first and then, after that, the break your brain. They break your brain because you're trying to figure out how are people even capable of doing such horrible things to one another and in each one of these cases, because of of the heartbreak and because of of the pain that that that I have to take in from from looking at these

cases, I'm looking for I'm looking for a little tidbit, a little morsel of something that can make me smile at some point. During this case, I was able to find a one of those later we'll talk about that a little bit later, but Why we're on our way? To that? The fact that the first to admit that I found that made me smile was that when bill king was transported, I dont know how many facilities actually to handle the execution. he's inmates in taxes it may be more than one, but the facility that he was transferred to there is an intake facility for all of the death penalty. death row inmates in the name of that intact. The name of that facility is James bond. Junior, it would have a different middle name, but there's a a bit of a Assad

it's odd any has. Then the name has no relation to are victim, but it kind of I dunno it is it's almost a wink, a little wink wink and a nod. Yeah yeah, it's almost up, but it's almost a little wink from a james. You know in Heaven looking down and and gone hey. I gotcha gonna sit so sure these guys were sentenced to death one of them has actually been executed. His appeals ran out and this was lawrence Russell brewer. He was killed in September twenty first of two thousand and eleven he He is known for something else, as well as committing this horrible crime. He listened well listen to this. This is You know where we had that winkle nod to feel good about for a second there. He he gave an interview shortly before he was sense before he was put to death.

And in this interview, brewer express no remorse for his crimes and in fact he told a houston newspaper or houston news channel. I'm sorry that, as far as any regrets I have No regrets! No. I do it all over again to tell you the truth in peace, so he just go away our wink and our nod, but but I know that his and was carried out before, his ex huge though brewer ordered a large meal. You know we ve talked about this before you get your last meal when you're on death row and he ordered a large meal that included, get ready for this and it included to chicken fried stakes: a triple meet baker.

cheeseburger a large bowl of fried okra, a pound of barbecue, three four. He does a meat lovers, pizza, a pint of ice cream and a slab of peanut butter fudge with lots of crushed peanuts in it. However, he did not eat any of this. He ordered all of this food and eight none of it just when you think he couldn't dislike a guy anymore. Well, what this prompted was the Texas present prison officials. They ended Eighty seven year old tradition of giving special last meals to condemned inmates look, I'm not gonna lie as a true crime fan. Ah I enjoy talking about the last meal. yeah it's weird. It's one of those guilty play here's, where you're, like I shouldn't, enjoys anything by it but ideal by fine and fascinating what people would come up with their last meal, but the book The party that this goes.

These animals don't deserve to take their last meal. Another last may to go hungry, I'm feeling for a while and nothing against the texas prison officials, but within like this come on, we know something's up here. You know like it shouldn't be like ok, you get this. You get this plate. and its fifteen by twelve in whatever you fit on it. That's it. You know yeah or or you have a dollar amount re. So now, nowadays, the before an enemy is executed in the state of texas. Now they just eat whatever the other. In may, seed red meal is right wise. Why should they treat you any different? so the other two guys are still in prison. We have bill king who at some point will be executed for this murder. He still has some pending appeals, he's running out of them, we have,

berry, who is in prison life in prison, but he is he's. Actually eligible for parole- and this won't be until june, of two thousand and thirty eight do not get getting out. No, no, no he's not getting them. If they get out somebody's going to kill. I wouldn't I wouldn't in well you you talk about somebody killing him he's actually and protective custody in prison. I dont know if it's still to this day, but for a lot of the early portion of his sentence He was spending twenty three hours per day in eight by six foot cell. only one hour a day for exercise- and this is obviously to protect him against, like you said, somebody's some he's got a target on him for the rest of his days as well, as here There was a moment of reconciliation for the town of jasper in this came when they they knocked down a rickety old fence

that for more than one hundred years had separated the black graves from the white graves in the jasper city cemetery now so this was a segregated cemetery and they find only remove that there they did have a little ceremony and they had a prayer vigil that went along with this ceremony to you know too, to mark this occasion. I do want to We know, however, that james bird juniors grave say it does have a fence around it and that's not to keep him sector aid from anybody else in the cemetery. It's because of this disturbing fact that at some point some teenagers, they desecrated, the grave. You know they I believe they kicked over the headstone and there was some kind of damage done to the grave. I think they even spray painted some things on the stone itself. So

that that fence was simply put up to protect that memorial. For that man for jane and to stop people from doing that type of behaviour, because in all of this is this is a hate crime, and this was done by three races. Individuals and ignorance will be. The ignorance and the old me some more on out there that will go to James birds, graven desecrated In the name of white supremacy, you know so captain you ve, been you ve been calm. You ve been pretty good

try and be in the garage. I know you you might be holding back a little bit. Is there anything you want to add? Ah well, I think it's sad that, if that this case isn't as known as you know, maybe it should be. I think, to shed a light on something. This is. These kind of murders took place very often for a long period of time, and I think this is a reminder of that and it's a horrific crime, and especially to somebody that seemed to be a good guy that live by the golden rule he treated, others like he wanted to be treated, and then you get these weak minded and weak individuals that come along with these weak en

ignorant ideas on how the world should be and they carry out this horrible crime and then they go on and they lie about it or some of them. By about it, and the fact of the matter is that whether as brewer or bury when someone is trying to pull out james from the truck, if one person jumps in now, it's too against to at least it's a fair fight. But you didn't want it to be a fair fight, cause your weak

an and then, if both of them are claiming was the other guy or this well. But if you both jump in to help james out now, it's three against one and this murder never takes place but you're weak, and he ate your giant pile of shit and, like I said, if, if you're going to have the death penalty, then these guys should have been tied up to a truck and drug down the street for miles and that's what should happen and if you're in that situation, you know, I look on the captain's absolutely right. Each one of these people are weak they're. There its together as a group, their weak as individuals, but eve it in this situation. If you're in this situation, in your afraid or you're scared, it least going get help. At least go and get somebody at least go and tell somebody what is happening

what may be about to happen so that you can put an end to this, somehow in some way and save a good guys life, the atalanta there was about the community. This was he was somebody It was known he was a fixture in the community. Why is human and- and it doesn't matter if you're, black, white, yellow or red he's a human right and and the fact of the matter is you either stand for something but or you fall for anything, so it was called something like that. But it's like you guys stand up and- and I think this should be a lesson to all of us- I mean it's not just when a crime is goin down or some

brutal beating is happening. That's not when you need to stand up in a stand up every time there is ignorance and any time that you see ignorance, because if you don't, if he don't say anything if he does turn the other cheek cheek, that is. That is one of the lessons here. The here's these two guys that put the blame on other people. I think they put the blame on other people because they wanted to save themselves. I wanted, I think they wanted to think you know, may maybe more so a barry.

Then brewer because brewer had no remorse and nino didn't want yo you're, not even going to apologize yeah, you wouldn't change anything you know. Ah, I think that what I'm trying to get at is it doesn't matter if it if it's a violent attack or just a violent attack with words. It is your duty, or at least I think it's our duty as humans to speak up and protect others. N n. It's just an it says, oh horribly sad case, and it's just not one that has been talked about enough in the true crime community. I do want to talk about what I thought was that tit bid of of joy and peacefulness there. I needed when looking at this case and then

was the bird family. I mean, I cannot say enough good things about these people regarding their there there class there their integrity just who they are as people as individuals and as a group Talking about james birds, parents, I'm talking about his ex wife, I'm talking about his children, renee ross in Jamie. I see I see a group of people that Are they don't? They are not looking for revenge for their loved ones, death, brain would they are looking to be? strong and to try to heal from this and try to this. This is what makes them such grape, or even during their grieving process, they were trying to help their town in their community heal from this as well,

and I think we can all learn a lot from the bird family from from his parents from his children and how We should carry ourselves in our everyday lives, because I tell you what you know of a person's character is best judged in the time of tragedy, and I I think of no bigger tragedy than what we talked about today and and how this family conducted themselves afterwards. Yeah cause it'd be easy to take, and you know the hatred and the ignorance of these three individuals and then take that and internalize it and then release that back onto the world. And- and you know the bird family decided not to do that, the above that and I don't. I don't know that I could and that's why I look. I look at the bird family and I remind myself. These are people that her. Their smarter than me. There are better

me they're, they're, good people and there's things. I can learn from them. I don't give that to beat yourself. So no, but you know you're not that bad, I mean you're pretty bad, but here's where I will pay myself funny. Here's where I will pat myself on the back- and this is what I hope everybody else does just except that there's things that you learn from good individuals like this, except that and try to learn from these people. That's what you do, that's what a good person does. We all have flaws. We we can all work. Want them yeah. One of the things for me is and- and I think we both heard about this case back in nineteen. Ninety eight ah, but I was listening to I wanna, say like this american life, and this case was just briefly mentioned in a rap lyric, which reminded me of the case and then dove little bit back into him and just felt that it was important when you said the cover, but one of the things that

He has talked about positive moment was, for whatever reason like it's like, I didn't know James beard, but I didn't, but I know James beard if that makes any sense. I worked at a recording studio for many of years and there was multiple artists. That would say I'm going to put you on the map. You know not not that they're going to put columbus on the map or anything but they're going to put me as a producer on the map anna. So when you hear over and over ah the stories of James byrd telling everybody I am going to put jasper on the map, and I just wonder if there was just some intuition that he had and his death doesn't have to be in vain n, it's up to us to carry on

not the legacy of his murder, but what he was in his life and that would be treating people the way you would want to be treated aye captain, I want to say you for everything this week that you, colonel all everybody. Thank you for joining us in the garage until next time. be good, be kind and don't let. Pandora makes it easy for you to find your favorite music.

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