Thirty years ago, a van exploded in a parking garage below the world trade center. The plan was to send the north tower crashing into the south. It failed, but six people were killed and more than one thousand injured, the masterminds behind it all, were just getting started and would soon change the world forever featuring, never four heard audio. This is us He told by investigators from around the world using agents and an undercover operative to bring the bomb to justice. This his operation trade bomb and apple, original podcast hosted by marks. Merlin follow operation trade bomb on apple podcast. That time is rough even for peanut. That's why people will try anything to fall. Asleep head stands before bed, even blue. bubbles. but actually has a trick that works every time. A new timber, peter mattress it adopts

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it's the second half of october, my friends and we are in the mood for some dark and scary good beer. So this week we are featuring in old favourite for real beer lovers. How about some dragons milk from the brilliant women and men bruin up liquid black magic at new holland brewing? This is a bird in a barrel aged imperial double stout. That means it's dark delicious and powerful baby, a b b eleven percent around grade four and a half bottle caps out of five and hear some cheers thank you used to our friends for helping us out what this week's beer run. First up, big shot out to my friend walker down in knoxville tennessee, in the big we like to jib to many in the major and west friend,

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Alright, everybody gather round grab a chair grab a beer. Let's talk some true grime, true grime stories about the manson family. the jonestown massacre and waco taxes fascinated americans for decades, The fascination of these real life, tragedies and crimes is so strong. That each year, someone new turns out a new version of each other he's old news stories completely

new details and never before seen footage recently, documentaries and fictional eyes. Streaming shows continue to see much success with titles like the vow wild. Our country, and devil in ohio. The masses are reading watching and listening because we want to know more We want to know how it all works, What are the beliefs in the rules of a cold we want to learn about the colts leaders, followers and there these should they have any do they recruit and why are what turns a small number of these groups toward violence? defining calls in deciding which groups should be labelled as such is sometimes a difficult task because of the variety of groups that exist outside of the mainstream the way To kill The two thousand and one book by james, a fox,

and jack Levin, define them all this is being loosely structured and unconventional forms small religious groups the members of which are held together cares charismatic leader who mobilise as their loyalty around some new religious cause. Typically because that is at odds with that of or conventional religious institutions, in other words many cults. are small groups of seemingly like minded individuals who are taught teach practice their beliefs or religion which, Those cases is a loosely structured version of a more widespread and regularly practice religion, some of the largest religious groups, are christian muslims and in some parts of the world Jews, spite of the many differences of these religions. They share a fundamental belief in a god

as compassionate and just as a result, Those communities have nurtured people of extraordinary kindness from the bible, matthew, five, the good teaches us that Jesus also set very high ethical standards for his followers, including and unbounded willingness to forgive wrong. Doing non retaliation against evil. And love of enemies. Yet some of the most appalling atrocities in history have been rooted in religion religious violence can take on a particularly intense and ruthless character the objects of their violence or sea. blasphemy were enemies of god, or gods way narrowly conceived in the case what we have here today. It's ruthless violence, doled out, judge, jury and executioner style by the courts. Leader upon some of his followers,

god in religion. Do ask of us and try to teach us to live our lives out. Accessing high ethical standards God wants us to possess an unfounded willingness to forgive wrong, doing not retaliate against evil and to love our enemies if we truly believed and followed these teachings well, we would now commit acts of violence against one another. We would not kill and there should never be a killing in the name of god. This the currently called killings. This true gram garage

the distemper thirty first nineteen, eighty nine zip was called into the bureau of alcohol, tobacco and firearms. It was related to the chief of police and kirkland ohio, because the tipp was related to his jurisdiction.

The collar said that a family was missing and some bodies buried in a born on a property of a rented farm house, This is located at eighty six. Seventy one Euclid shot road. This would be one In a half miles, east out of town authorities proceeded to the property in question, upon arrival here, captain so far so good, because when they get to the property, they can in fact see that a barn is on the premises. So there may be some truth to this tip that they received by police found the property deserted with evidence that the residents had left in a hurry, but, of course, what police really needed to search based on the tipster information. Was that born on the property

you just fill the search becoming more intense. If your law enforcement in the barn, they found some personal possessions of presumably this missing family included some drawings and note books that clear, he belonged to children. They decided that there going to need to do a little excavating in the barn to see if they could find what it was that they were looking for but also keep in mind they're out there. Looking for work was called in on their tipp, but you're. Also, I would guess your hoping to not find what was called in on the tipp exactly so on January third, nineteen, ninety they started digging dan dunlap was a lieutenant in the lake county sheriff's office at the time

He was a patrol officer on the day, the kirtland police chief, Dennis Yarborough, requested assistance from the sheriff's office the late county crime lab in processing the crime scene, a the bar officer, dunlap told the news herald the place was damp, cold, dark and full of trash and rebel. So there was a lot of clearing going on. He said they found bodies beneath layers of soil rocks and garbage in the rear. portion of the barnes lower level, this would be a difficult day to be long forcemeat. They found the first body buried about four feet deep after that they stopped and and search warrants for the whole place edition. Digging the next day reveal not one not to not three but sadly, for additional corpses,

all in the same burial. Pet three of them were children, collar that phone in the tipp predicted that five body would be found all members of one single family and the collar turns out. He was right. The fire chief that was present that day told the news harold that they meaning the bodies they had rocks on top of them and they were back filled with clay. So someone took a considerable amount of effort to bury an attempt to conceal these bodies, none of these bodies were identified right away. Captain the the bodies very badly decompose. In fact, if the tipster was right, they had been there

and they had been buried there. For nearly a year by the time that they were on earth, but the collar did EL authorities who they would find- married in that bar? So the idea application of the bodies? not so much a mystery. It really. At this point in time, I just needed to be confirmed: yeah the collars telling you the truth or seems to be telling you the truth, there's no reason not to believe them. Now In fact the collar was right and you are right there, captain the bodies, ones The bodies were identified. We We learn that the five bodies were that of five members of the avery family. This is Dennis eva aged forty eight and his if Cheryl all aged forty one and then,

three children war. There are three daughters, Trina rebecca and little karen and their ages respectively. Are fifteen thirteen and seven Each victim was found to have been bound. They were executed and then dumped in the hole in the ground inside this bar, All of them had been shot with a forty five caliber gut. Do we have any odd topsy information from law enforcement? We do get some brief autopsy report. Nation that makes its way to the newspapers and its as follows. The autopsies on the five members of the avery family, revealed the following. Dennis the father was shot twice in the chest Cheryl was shot three times in the chest trina was shot in the head and chest rebecca was shot once in the back and once in the left side and then carry the youngest member of the family was shot once in the head and once in the chest, the coup,

are found: silver duct tape, wrapped around the victims heads feet in height, So in short, this the murder of an entire family, a five now no gun was found in the pit with the bodies every one of the victims were found bound with tape, as we just described so this family, as it appears from start of this investigation and based off of these reports, this family was executed. and then buried in this bar now would need to do deal, loved dale was a reverend and the leader in the kirtland branch of the reformed latter day saints and, I might say, or I d s at times. If I do, captain, I'm referring to reform, the latter day saints when the five

Parties of the avery family were found. He was one of the first people to come forward to talk, police about what he knew about the situation which in the case of day, olaf been turn, to be a whole heck of a lot. This eager Cooperation on his bar was likely An attempt by luff men to separate his organization, the reformed land they saints from whole murder scandal. This murder, a family of five. He told the in daily news that the five acre kirtland area farm. This is the property where the bodies were found. Had been least by a man who was formerly a member of the reformed day, saints organization and curt when ohio,

and he was talking about, was a lay minister. What's referred to as a lay minister who was d frock by the were formed a latter day saints because quoth he was silenced for ethical reasons, he would have been expelled from the church on the basis of unchristian conduct had he not withdrawn. His ambrosch. Well, if you're not gonna, like a christian you're gonna get de frocks, he saying that man then later formed a radical splinter group of his own, because this man had been kicked out of the reformed latter day, saints hastened They formed his own called a spin off a splinter group of of the original grew. if your law enforcement any fine, burial ground in this barn, the the then you're gonna look for is who is the owner? Who is operating this property correct and that

sense with what this man is telling police. For many reasons of gay. First off we had some general idea that something not so great, was going on on that property with it with a considerable group of people and they were already aware of this man that is being described to them. They were aware of this, but say air quotes for now called that was opera. Waiting on this property and, as you pointed out captain and what this man is telling police confirming what they likely already knew. Was it this man that he was talking about was leasing. This fifteen acres, this property and he was leasing the barn and which they found the five body, so them and that he was talking about. Isn't it is a man named Jeffrey lungren, so Jeff longer and had been kicked out of the reformed latter day, saints an essentially

from his own little called in which he was viewed. The supreme leader and his followers did his bidding luff men went onto. Desperately try to delineate his own religious organisation. From this splinter groups from this crime, one. The way all this went down for my understanding here, captain is the Jeffrey lundgren once he was pushed out or decided to leave the formed latter day saints. He moved to the farm with some of his divine tease and then ran this commune swords on its grounds up until April. eighteen, eighty nine when he and his feet Emily and some of his followers decided to split town whereabouts, unknown lukman, told ass, a gaiters he was certain lungren- was behind the killings. So what we I'm going on here at this time, ripe is murder and defrosting. We have body.

That, according to the tipster, have been in this worn for almost a year several months, and what we know so far, is that when police get there, they recover the bodies of the family of five from this barrier. inside of the barn. their learning, a couple things like grin who leased the place had these followers. He split and we don't know where he and some of the followers are and now, we're being told later that Jeffrey Lundgren is the one that is behind the killings of these five people that we just found one on top of that did something bad with The church or bad enough for the church did not want to have him be a part of it

Yes- and this is where the story gets a little complicated because we have to try to others- a family of five buried in a barn had sorry complicated, try to stand, then this region and then even more so what's more important is to try to understand this little faction. This little splinter group of of this religion so and I dont want a bunch of emails. If I get this wrong because look, I'm not well versed on my own region then let alone everybody else's, so the car in ohio established the founder of the church of Jesus Christ and the latter day saints a christian. East religion that follows the tenets of Joseph smith as I believe he was a profit of Jesus The latter day saints church is otherwise known as the mormon church. It was founded, smith in the eighteen twenties, he wrote the book of mormon and eighteen. Third, so Joseph

myth settled and curt when ohio in eighteen thirty one and establish the town as the base of his burgeoning set in eighteen, thirty six, he built a temple That was to be a beacon or not to be. It was a b. And to the members of the church everywhere. So members of this church in of this religion, their flocking to kirtland ohio back in the early, eighteen hundreds because he built this temple. If you build it, they will combat. He built it and yes, they did come. Smith dies in eighteen, forty, four He was killed by a mob in illinois and is when the church that he establish splinter so brigham young led some of the members to utah unfounded. What is known today, as the modern church of the latter day, saints

the church members who stayed in kirtland ohio, transformed, they're off shoe of the latter day, saints church into the reformed latter day saints church. This was formed Eighteen, fifty two in the wake of smith's death- and this during the church he established them reformed latter day, saints was headquarters in independence, Missouri, okay, so are we all on the same page year, roughly you're the best way to explain this as you have a pizza sharpening cod rays, and then some people worked at raise pizza shop in their one to start their own pizza shop, so they started another one called original raise after re, passes away right and then Those people decided to start another pizza shopping, cart famous rays so it's all raise pizza, but it is kind of a little bit different variants

The devil is in the detail or- or here in this case- maybe not the devil. But but something is in the detail in europe. Captain the crust, maybe a little different, the cheese might be a different blend. The appertaining most is ordered from someplace else. But but it's it's generally. from my understanding again, this is just some garage guys understanding of something that's much larger than him. It's at the at the centre of an all, it's all, very the same, and it all kind of comes from the same place. What it sounds like Jeffrey started, a division of shady raise piazza that that's exactly right, we're we're gonna find out exactly why here, as we continue on looking into some of these different characters here now the dead family

a vries. They were members of the reformed latter day, saints and kirtland ohio, but they were part of a small group of people that left that urge to join yet another offshoot, one that will not sanctioned by the church establishment, this being Jeff long grins, offshoot of the reformed latter day, saints well loved, men, wasn't the only one that wanted to talk to law enforcement after these bodies were found yet others had a lot to say as well and a lot to say about Jeffrey lundgren police, her one name over and over again from people who were familiar with the call and they outcast from the reform latter day saints. the name that kept coming up. Lundgren on grinned lundgren, this from the act, beacon journal on January. Ninety ninety, which says

hunger and who police say, headed a militant a very secretive religious, called calling itself the family was being sought late friday, so this is the act Beacon journal, reporting that police of, to a lot of people and we we know who we are looking for, where we are actively looking for a man named Jeffrey lungren because You believe either a he knows, intimate details about the killing of this family or he was the person responsible with all people so willing to talk. It was really easy for police to start rounding up suspects. largely jeffrey. Lungren was not one of those that they were able to round up so easily. He was missing in action, but other men. Of his call were living in Kansas city on january fifth, this is wrong.

they just hours after the bodies were uncovered a lake I a grand jury quickly, indicted thirteen people say of whom were already in custody in Kansas city according to grim beacon journal. The thirteen were quote accused of plotting the ritual slayings following lung grins, religious tenets, arrest warrants for all. Third people were issued, one person was deemed to be the trigger man, the rest, the other twelve were decided. It was they were all accomplices to this massacre. But still no sign of Jeff Lundgren. That's I am police were really trying to get a handle on what actually happened here we're stories about Jeffrey lung grins involvement. We know that, but I needed a figure out where those stories fact true and if so, how a separatist, religious leader.

into some kind of cold, blooded killer of children and their parents, kirk and police chief Dennis Yarborough told the d. in daily news on January faith that the leader of the group, Jeffrey lungren, appear to be forcing or persuading the other members to sign all properties and checks there, their money checks virtue him personally and from what they were being told the murder of this family of the avery family was not the act of one person. Instead, it was done in a ceremonial away with multiple witten. This slash participants supporting the execution.

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All right, we are back, cheers maids, cheers. Big captain has been inspired to do so, his own religion right out of our little garage here. He's gonna call original rays of regional rays and he's already got me I'm fully enrolled. I am signing over my paycheck to the captain. As we speak, should I make it the cash? but just to be clear just clear. What we have here is we have a religious group. Some of the members, create offshoot, Some of those members from the offshoot then, are killed. This is all witnessed or participated by the members of the offshoot.

And their leader is jeffrey, lungren, so artless go look at who this guy is an How did he become the leader of this corrupt organization? A call leader now, all and tangled up in murder and murder charges, Jeffrey lungren was worn in nineteen. Fifty an independence Missouri now keep in me and you're gonna notice throughout the telling of this tree, crime story that you will hear several cities that are, repeated throughout the course of the telling of this true crime story. One of You ve already noticed his independence, Missouri. Hungary was raised in the were formed a latter day, saints church which is based in his home town independence. Missouri court documents indicate that, as a youth

One grin was mostly a loner, but was active in sports and church activities. His father was a strict disciplinarian and its reported, the his father may have even and enjoyed teasing and punishing a young jeffrey Some would say: abusive, Jeffrey lungren attended central missouri state university where he met his future wife Alice. Who was also a church member, but london was not academically inclined and he never did very well in in school. He married Alice in nineteen eighty. He joined them davy and was sent to vietnam after he complete. his tour of duty and was honourably discharge. He held some short term jobs like hospital maintenance worker, but a really struggle to keep position.

finally, he and Alice move to kirtland, ohio and nineteen. Eighty four, this with there too, And then they would go on to have two more children, the move was motivated by Free, long, grins, affinity for thee, reformed latter day saints church and the historic and iconic temple. Remember the one that was but by the church found or more than a century earlier in, small town. This is a small town in ohio population, roughly about six thousand people who worked as a senior church tore guide for the kirtland temple historic centre this is considered to be for he shamed and obviously this was considered to be an honored volunteer position where he led tours through the temple discussing its history,

and sacred role with an thee reformed latter day saints church as a perk of being a guy. and for which he had to be very well versed in the churches, teachings the law, when family got to live in an apartment which was owned by the church. They get the live their rent free. All of this was fine at first for a period its eye church devoted. he's admitted longer and into the fold ambition and to look up to him Does he had like a legendary grasp of scripture and was able to recite passages from memory as luff men who we ve brought up several times described to the beacon journal, said quote, he could quote scripture not always accurately in a rapid fire style that some people found impressive and quote indeed Jeffrey lungren was effective at drawing people to the faith and

brooding them to the reform. Latter day saints church. He would take trips back to his the state of missouri and attend meetings at his old church. This to find recruits apparently captain. He had an uncanny ability to prey on people. were vulnerable manipulable to be a deuce canoe. Looking for you change seeking guidance, so he was at recruiting. Regardless of the methods he was using. Several people described as a spiritual bully. He promised a warm supportive loving and strong church community and curt when ohio and people actually if they are to join up with that legitimate church at the time, of the reform latter day. Small obviously becomes a destination for sunday that especially somebody like Jeffrey his raised in the church. This is

basically their holy land and so when he has no job, he has no opportunities, a probably thought. While this is a good destination, one has my faith, but because of this sacred land, Lukman said The first problem started back in nineteen. Eighty six This is when lungren was sort of going off. Script. Sorry to enjoy the spotlight as a tour guide. The spouse ideas that were increasingly radical, so he supposed to be leading these tours and teaching all these people who could either be recruited into the religion or are already a part of the religion, because I went to want to visit the sacred ground, as you pointed out it, but giving these tours, and now he certainly like go off script he's, throwing in his own ideas in, and maybe things at the the church telling him to say or not don't and don't want him to be saying during the course of the

too late to be the fly on the wall turn when those towards, for example, that we have some examples here, for example, lungren tell people that he had a special power to determine what was true in the bible and what wasn't so? That's, that's that's interesting to learn while you're on this or that detour guide has power to be able to discern. What is true and untrue in the bible, he emphasized that he had a connection to god. Again, let's go back to love men's words here a lot of what we know about lundgren comes from this love, my character, love minces, quote people were complaining that he meaning Jeffrey lungren was representing the teachings of the church during the tours he guided, he was increased. Lee putting his own spin on doctrine and many trains- were very upset but love Erin wasn't just a tour guide who was speaking out of turn by this point

our time line. He is a lay minister permit so to somebody who would be permitted to council parishioners, even our homes and to preach at some actual church services, so he's not The tour guide, any more, whose spout novice ideas he's now a person that is looked up to he's allay minister, please He stores and he started to push his own agenda push his own agenda, but two per himself as a man with special powers. Yes, so he's language, reaching about like the hidden meetings that he was able to glean from the bible. Based on his. You know that his method of of scripture and rotation that he was able to determine what was true and what wasn't true and then he was also doing stuff. That was reading text for reoccurring.

so so he says that he was able to find within the bible text that had re. Current patterns that contain messages- and he was a to see what these messages are and he's able to deliver them to two people. Like me, the regular jobs right this from a much later report, they came out that states quote Lee. Grim generally fit within the traditions of the reformed latter day. Saints faith in that he described visions. Direct beer experiences and god speaking directly to profits, but lundgren went far outside of the bounds of prophecy. So he claim to possess special powers, and I have a list of some of his is special powers if you'd like to hear how powerful this Jeffrey lundgren actually I can't freakin way he had the ability to predict future events

they come in handy. Yes, he claimed to have the ability, Who, since the presence of people and events which are at age, geographical remove from where he is he had the ability to trigger natural events such as earth tremors. He reportedly his followers that he was present when Jesus Christ was crucified and that in other ways as well. He was able to transcend the restrictions of time. While no wonder you look so frickin hold. He claims to have experienced multiple vision, and where he is shown his special mission or missions on earth this. I can't help it at them, but this reminds me of may one of the greatest rock and roll bands of all time. Depending on who, you ask tenacious d,

wonderful sawing, they had wonder boy where jack black describes for ridge cage and the rest of us his secret powers in the secret. Of his bow and the reformed latter day. Saints church leaders noticed that the historic centre was missing some money as well, so he's not just telling all these people all of his wonderful ideas on through the course of his horse, but money coming up missing as well The current well, that wasn't one one of his superpowers was not personal finances or the billowy to hide his his thief. from the floor of the people in power, so the curtly date, president dale love been longer in was let go for ethic Oh and moral issues that are critically important to us to their religion into that to the church. Later it revealed that the temple officials,

hughes, Jeffrey lundgren of stealing between twenty five thousand up to maybe four a thousand dollars from the temple coffers, as a whole lot of roman papers, especially in the late eighties. That's a ton of rolling papers, and then this academy, with inflation. I mean come on maybe not so many trolling papers with inflation there, as a result of his radicalism and am being accused or the belief that he was stealing from the church. Jeffrey Lundgren of course lost his position. As the temple tore guide this in october, nineteen eighty said and as a result of He lost his free living arrangements for him and his family so

Jeffrey Lundgren and the lundgren family they gonna have to move. So they ended up renting the fifteen agar farm that we ve talked about where the bodies were found. Just outside of town on that, Euclid, charred and road, and that going to cost money right, one and now going to have to pay for his living arrangements, and for this far where he moved his family. To so Jeffrey lundgren, basically, does a jerry, Maguire right he's getting kicked out any. he does the elder. You know who's coming with me situation, may hello, so he Courage, the defection of his of the people that the leave him like he's giving these tours, and he has people with inside the church that that he spouting off his radical ideas to and an bragging about his so

powers to, and people within, a church are believing him, and so he even You know before he's asked to leave the church, he has followers and he we encourage prob, we demanded the defection of his coat loyal followers from the reform latter day saints church asking m to move with him to the commune that he was putting together that he was establishing on this farm. That he's now renting about. Twenty people. Formally resign from the reform latter day. Saints church and move moved in with the lung grants. They were reportedly attract by his fiery preaching and seemingly insider knowledge of scripture.

meanwhile, according to love, men, lungren was then de frocks by the, r l D s church, not only were his ministerial privileges were vote, but he was ex community it. So you can see where this is going right. Captain Jeffrey lungren was kicked out of the church where he enjoyed being some kind of big shot. So he established his own called with himself. As the leader. and then we have his followers now at this point there referring to him as some kind of profit, they they called him dad had never good assigned to follow somebody that is one kicked out of the church, but to his not saying call me Jeff or common Mr Lundgren, their say call me dad her father good signs? It was reported that peat it left the r l d ass. They

followed him because they were ass light his group better because it was considered to be a much more conservative group. In the traditional reform thirty saying they were warmed latter day. Saints is algae, bt q, friendly and also allows women to become church leaders. This is in contradiction of that of the latter. saints churches teachings that way should be subservient to met so Jeffrey Lundgren started becoming increasingly radical with his new little group of followers he started doing things like predicting the return of christ to earth and the destruction of everything except the temple and

the devoted followers of Jeffrey long, grunts pre. In other words, if you didn't follow them, asked that he established you are due I am not following this douche canoe with a horrible moloch people, was to bring his followers to Zion, where they would witness the return of Christ. He started to dictate the lives of every one in the commune He started to control everything in their lives as well. Will this pro stems from light. We said before lundgren when he was back in missouri, Wasn't doing so well as far as making ends meet he goes moved to. Ohio starts town, a couple Phibbs austin feels, like he's, in some kind of power and money he's coming in, and They try to separate them from the church, while fighting

some followers with me, the maybe I can call them into my system and, I think alike, this was just cause- he did their dinner. his life don't like the way It turned out felt like a failure, and now these people make me feel good they. Think I'm something special. tell them I'm something special. They believe me and rent repeat calves and I think that your probably right here that the thing that I would say that also The situation would be that low, for these people to follow him. They clearly blinders on, but is there a chance, Jeffrey lungren had blinders on himself like did. He becomes so disillusion all so delusional that he stopped to believe these things himself or to start to think that he was something that he was not right, or else it is,

that he felt tat. He had the power to convince them to call them There is also a lot of people out there to that, even if they are doing wrong or if they are lying to others, they have the. I believe that, if well, as long as what I'm doing is for the greater good doesn't matter how I get their sounds like some of the popular programme podcast out there it doesn't matter how we get there. How I get the followers are get people to join me and that could be the situation as well that he he believed that he was trying to do good. It's it's really difficult for us to try to cross the brain and the figure out this this character now going. to his little followers his little group of followers. Or his sheep, as I will refer to them as at some point according to like weeds about him, trying to and starting to dictate

their lives and to control m and control everything going on on this piece of property. Here this fifteen acres Wikipedia. which is not my favorite source to go too, but they Sometimes they give you the good shorten sweet version of things and here on wicked media. They say, for example,. To show his his control. Their call members were forbidden to talk amongst themselves Doing so was determined to be a sin and We came up with a term for he called it murmuring. So all if we where his followers, we were forbidden to talk amongst ourselves to conducting. There goes the pike part of this murmuring anne and it would be considered a sin There's also reports that he Jeffrey lundgren, would find ways to eavesdrop on the call members, so

listening into their conversations in such when they are talking amongst themselves and their on aware of this and later he's using the information that he gets from four listening in on their conversations to get them to believe that read there might write like I said another way to catch them in believing that he has these powers that it was all this trickery and a lot of it too, and we, see this and unfortunately, we see this in bad times ex situations or controlling boyfriend situations, a lot of these types of behaviors right. We see time and time again in these different cases that we cover, and they all are very different cases, but it's interesting. to see similar behaviors by the country. Falling individual right so anyway, situation. We have

Every lundgren who start two I mean he actually manage to isolate his sheep from from. almost from the rest of the world entirely, not completely, but almost right he's got people living with him on his commune on this fifteen acres of an kirtland ohio just outside of town, and he he's convinced them too contribute, their worldly possessions and their page axe to the greater good, which was him. his followers, they work their day, jobs that, but they turn Checks over to him. while I these religions, when you go to, mass on sunday or maybe saturday night or whenever you choose to go you you don't have to They will appreciate offering an

At times these offerings or fifteen percent of what you are bringing in, which is can be pretty high for some individuals in family, but this guy's ain't, no, not fifteen percent. I needed all any browser you was torn in them. just getting started, so we need as much as possible. So we can build as quick as possible. Well, and they would work that the following, He allowed to work there simply working their day jobs most days. Long days and then turn over there paychecks to him that that is used for things like taking care of everybody in the group, but but primarily taking care him in his actual biological family in in his in a marital family, while he is the profit, but

after their done working for the day at their jobs, their request to gather in these submissive nightly scripture meetings to hear Jeffrey. You lungren just preach and preach and preach about his interpretation of scripture, all this, going on on the farm evening at night and is all really designed to continue to keep him in power to remind his flock they needed his leadership or they were lost. Wanna. Thank everybody for listening, join us here in the garage. So much more case to get to make sure your phone us on social media, facebook, twitter, instagram, tik, tok or

youtube at true crime garage and its will tomorrow be. be kind in dover.