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You are now listening to true murder, the most shocking killers and true crime history and the authors that have written about Gacy, Bundy Dahmer, the night Stalker Dck every week, another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous killer crime, history, room murder, with your host journalist and author Dan good evening, Daddy's little secret, a daughter's quest to solve her father's brutal murder.

The deployment to crime story about a daughter who appan her father's murder learns of his secret double life. She had looked the other way about other hidden facets of his life deadly secrets that could help his killer escape the death penalty. Should she come forward an inside look at the complex and fascinating psyche of a father who shared an uncommon bond with his daughter, Denise, had spent years hiding deadly secrets about her and Matic Father Wesley Wallace W was a trusted security guard of the Ritz Carlton Palm Beach, who is supposed to protect those who found themselves in his key

but a closer look into his brutal murder revealed the split personality one did his daughter may have seen but tried to ignore. However, detectives assigned to the case persuaded heard a system in the capture of her father's killer. The trail would lead from the glitz of palm beach to the murky streets of Dixie Highway and end in a courtroom where her father secret life and his dangerous pensions for sex slaves would be revealed. The book that we're featuring the seizing his daddy's little secret, a daughter's quest to solve our Father father's brutal murder. With my special guest author Denise Wallace, welcome to the program, and thank you very much for agreeing to this interview. Denise Wallace. Thank you for having me on Dan. Thank you very much. Very incredible book, and let's get right to this incredible:

sorry guys. We got lots of lots of cover. You open this book with the crime itself, and you talk about lake worth where this occured close to famous palm beach. You say, but not nearly as pricey and the lake Osborne apartments. So let's talk about this little neighborhood lake worth, maybe could describe it before we talk about what Mister and MRS Mancini notice their next door, neighbors in apartment near two hundred and nine your father's apartment before that tell us. Little bit about lake worth and palm beach? For we talk about what the Mancini's discovered that one dish ok Lake Worth is a mix blue collar and white collar town, it's known for Outkast, art galleries and antique shops and theaters gets close enough to palm beach

you can go on and it, but it's not on the water, and there was a famous murder that was born there. The Texas Tech, for sniper. Do I mentioned in the book as well towards the beginning to killed seventeen people, I believe, including his wife and mother, Ann several students at the university. So you talk about the The neighbors, the Mister and MRS Mancini, and you talk about what they found and their relationship. How long they had been. Building and how long your father had been at the the Osborne apartments. So tell us about the little bit of of the relationship and these neighbors and what they find that day Ok, the Mancini's weren't elderly couple, my father lived. He had just only move there a month before, but

they were living in a senior community in lake Worth and a Mancini said in there I believe nine years and my father we just moved in and they've gotten to know him. You know a little bit as acquaintances, they'd, seen lots house on the stairs, and my father was very very talk. Is very a boisterous and they knew that He had a grandchild and a daughter out in California and now that he works the Ritz Carlton Palm Beach, but they didn't. They didn't really know much more about him. Now talk about how they saw that his notice that his door was open one day, and so they just went in to check on him. What did they find and what was their reaction? What did they find that day and what did they do? Well rose Mancini,

the the one and had actually over heard the night before some banging, and she also heard my father yell at someone to get out of the apartment and she had looking up her husband, Frank and said: should we call the police he said now. You know it's none of our business and so the following morning, when Frank. Finally, last at the apartment that afternoon, he walks by my dad's apartment and the door was cracked open. He recalled now that there is disturbance from the night before, and so he pushed open the door to check on him and he saw my father lying on his back with blood all around his head in the dining room and he went back to the Hartman called nine one one. You talk about the officer Reynolds in Walshe. They show up they,

we have this report from these neighbors, so they're, not sure if the perpetrator is still there, so they do the cautionary method of going through and checking if anyone still there, what did they find? Initially, you talk about all the things that they do see initially, what do they see as they come into this as it were crime scene, while the crime scene was pretty scattered throughout the APA and it was a small apt. I had actually never seen it because I was living in California and my dad only been there a month. It was just a one bedroom apartment, but when they, when they came in you could they could see my fall body on the floor, the dining room the carpet was wet. The faucet was still running in the bath tub from the bathroom so that the water throughout southern over flowed down the hall and into the dining room upon further inspection. They found blood in the

kitchen counter? The cabinets in the kitchen were open. The bleach without the Clorox bottle was actually floating in the tub, along with gold lamp base and the top sheet of the bed and the cases in the pillows, and then when they went into the bedroom. That was an absolute mess. There would obviously violent struggle struggle. There had occured, because the door jam was broken deeds the closet door was pushed in. There was blood on a shirt hanging in the closet. There was quite a bit of blood on the bed. The fitted sheet was still on the bed. And that that Lance Bass had been you know, pulled out of the wall and and the court had been cut in half. So what the detectives assume later with that, though, the low light had gone off in the

room and said that the killer didn't realize that she was still on the bed. She was bloody, and so we just strip the top sheet off and put it in in the water in the bathtub and put bleach in there, but it didn't really do a lot of good to the top sheet for the city was still in the bed. There are coins all over the room. You know things have been Dover DC, are an to VC rs in a stereo were missing, but the speakers had been left behind from the stereo. You also talk about something even more valuable stolen that they notice, maybe not initially, but they notice missing uh. Well, his watch was gone. They They notice later to the tan line now he's living in Florida, where it's quite hot and sunny, so quite a

in line where the watch used to be my dad always wear that gold watch. She has now, since, as long as I can remember, it was gone closer to the skyline and yes in it and a Cura ninety six sick, a Cura Ryan. You talk about the homicide, detectives that are crucial to the story to come. On the scene here and being involved, initially Steve Bennett to CHI and Daniel Boland, and you talk about them taking over this case here. Initially, you talk about vented to cheat at the crime scene. Picking up before well tell us a little bit about this for awhile what he finds and again what does this lead to well. My dad had always been a big picture taker give me the Disneyland and my daughter, I have an older dog

you take it. You know many times, discipline and taking you know dozens of photos, so he had yet photo albums. With hundreds of photos in there of us and birthday card that I had sent him at Just one was in the back of the photo album and they see that you know I've written happy birthday. Dad loves any, so they knew that. I was around that he had a daughter and that they're going to have to notify me of this murder, but they uh when they found out. I was California, they didn't want to do it over the phone. They really wanted it to be done in person because they figure the whole story would be quite dramatic for me, and it was. You talk about two of the initially the stabbing inside this senior complex. You talk about a paper called the coastal observer. What was the reaction? How frightened were the neighbors about this? How big a deal was this

Well, very good, see if you can imagine they were all elderly neighbors and They were used to. The ambulance showing up probably weekly in the complex you know for respiratory failure or heart attacks, but not murder, and it's normally a quiet town, a quiet community, and so they were. You know quite scared, and they had a neighborhood watch meetings. After that, and you know, I would keep their blind shots and call the police to make rounds more often, so it is, should should up the community quite a bit. You talk about your father, W Wallace at that time is six foot two hundred and fifty pounds and he loves to eat, and there was some investigation right away that there was some talk of that had went to a church. To ask

the twenty two year old male, who had been sleeping in the church if he wanted to a place to stay, tell us a little bit about what police find initially before they contact you and give you the horrible news. How do they proceed with the investigation to find out? Who may have done this? How do they do that? Well, they figure that it was probably a man, because it was a struggle on the bed. There was blood on the bed. My father had a quite a large collection of homosexual pornography in the closet, which I had never I mean I wasn't aware of it and the state figured it was. It was probably a stranger or or a lover that he was probably a man they were looking for and when they were when they start

questioning witnesses, his coworkers and people that knew him is started to come out a little bit about his lifestyle, most most people, surface that know about a sexuality, but some did, and so that did eventually come out. You talk about later about the content of that pornography. What did the police find out in terms of any clues in terms of the content of the pornography? Was the nature of the pinard, feed itself, the ones in the closet there about a hundred videos, and quite a few of them, had a master slave theme and when they went to the triple x video store where he had bought the video the man that kinda counter preferred. But yes, he like the slave master themes. Where there was you know,

a man tied up so four so gear, I believe, apartment Now they also questioned everybody, as they did their due diligence. They contacted a friend that goes through this entire story is friend named bill and again you say that they deduce pretty early on based on the pornography and talking to some people, but they do question people about whether there's he's violent. They pursue all kinds of possibilities, don't they so tell us a little bit about some of the interviews they have and what somebody like Bill had to say about your father.

Bill is someone that I had grown up knowing as a child. He had quite a nice house back in green Bro North Carolina. Where my dad was from and where I was born, he was the deck on a clothing designer and he actually had mannequins with his in the curve play glass windows of his home. He was quite extension the place is very ornately decorated, with brass and gothic seems bill had told him that he known it probably known him twenty years and that he'd met him at a gay bar and they used to host dinner for each other. Quite bitch. They were close friends but he'd. Never him to be violent use is quite shocked by his murder. They, you want to interview every employee at the Ritz Carlton. They have end end up going and

giving people in Greensboro where he lived previous to the Osborne apartments, tell us what they find out overall from talking to employees. What is the picture that they have in their mind before they even speak to you of who your father is and what may have led at least a factor in his death. While they first again speaking the employees, he worked with at the Ritz Carlton and they they don't know a whole lot about my dad just more about his personality from working with him,

when when they go to North Carolina, which that they went there, because they have a clue that the drug dealer that it sold drugs to the killer actually moved back there to Virginia so what they actually flute. Abridging it to get my father's duffel bag with his name tag on it that the that the drug dealer had and while they, but there are- they visited his friends and green sprouts, and it's only about three hours away, and these were funds that my dad had known for twenty or twenty five years, and I knew them all as well one them. They had known the longest best friends confessed to the police that he, do that my father would pick up young men and that he would scold him about it that it was dangerous. This with a highly educated man. I was a theater director at a large university in North Carolina, and he would tell my dad you know it's very,

They just said how these young men get in your car with you or take them back to your apartment. They can steal things. They can try and hurt you and you but my dad had admitted to him that he would keep two wallets. One with very little money in it and the other his money and credit cards and driver's license. He would hide, and so, when it came time to pay the young man, he would just have that wallet with very little or no money on it so that they couldn't get any money

at eight that that actors kind of was forming a picture that my father was hustling the hustlers. You also talk about alcohol being a the issue in this and your father's life and obviously in your life as well. In terms of yet not a fact. Let's talk now about your life with your father who your father was too you, despite again, as we alluded to in here, the the secret that you find out the double life that your father leads. Was your father to you as a young girl in a, only child. My dad with someone who loves me more than anything you know to me he was a great dad. I mean he had quite a few flaws but I always knew I was very, very loved. He did all kinds of things with me took me,

Emerald mining and panning for gold and camping in the mountains, and but through a lot of those years he was a chronic alcoholic. He would still wake up in the morning with a hangover and and take me for tennis lessons or take me to movies and so he was. To my hero. He could also be very dangerous. Getting in the car with him at night was very dangerous, very scary. He also me drive at twelve one time when he was too drunk to drive and we're in the mountains? And it was- I was terrified. Because I didn't know how to drive and I had to be sitting on pillows and I almost went off the edge of the mountain and he slammed on the on the break with his foot. So it was.

It was kind of a mixed feeling that I had with them. I I was quite scared to be alone with them a lot of times. You know they go camping along with them without a friend um because of you know how John Q it cat. But then you know there was a great love that he had for me and at the time it was nothing you're responsible. What I mean I should say that the the drinking to responsible, but in terms of he didn't see any neglect, and you didn't see the again this pension for the young boys in retrospect later after you've given details, then you can in retrospect say well that makes sense now but at the time there was a dedication to you as a father, and this secret life remained secret. An you had no real idea. Now I did, but there were quite a few young men in his life.

But to me it was always in the context of him sponsor in these young men and AA, and that's what he would tell me an. I believed it. Certainly when there's the autopsy on your father, they find scratches on his face. Made with an edge of a tool- and they don't know what that tool is in also bite wounds, so tell us a little bit about what they think is going on there, or just tell us a little bit more about this autopsy and what it reveals to the police and what they do is a response. Well

from the autopsy. They could tell exactly how he died, because there was quite a bit of blood on his neck, so they couldn't really see until he was cleaned up at the autopsy that his jugular vein was nicked with adults take nice. It came out later, but he wasn't is for one split, it was just Nick and it actually neck and he bled out, and it was also a bite marks on his wrist and what they determined from the bite marks. With that the man Mandibular marks, I believe, with the top of the teeth, had bitten down harder than the bottom, and the reason for that the medical examiners said was that something or someone would have had to been pushing down on the killers head for that to happen, that way, where the top teeth

are sinking in more than the bottom teeth there had to be pressure on his head, so they start to wonder you know what exactly occurred that night in the apartments you know and if the killer has been backed into a corner, or you know how this came about because it wasn't of violent stabbing or a slicing. The neck detectives also cite the fact that there is no forced entry. Yet there's this incredible struggle in the bed and then it as the Father, your father had crawled. Sort of a distance to the apartment door, but didn't make it. You also talk about the angle of the police, pursuing they've finished as they pursue all the angles of the pawn shop in the VCR bars in the stereo in the stolen goods, and the watch so tell us what their look into the stolen goods nets them

Well, they they know that the two VC rs Mysterio had been taken because of the dust outlines on the shelves uh. I could see that there was something there and in the closet, at the apartment, they find the boxes for these items, so they have the serial numbers to put into their database and pawn shops have to report the serial numbers they have to enter them the database or, however they do it, and so they got a hit on one of the vcr's that was pawn and that,

let them to Montague the not a killer but the drug dealer that the killer had sold it to the c ours too. The billion. What stereo, because he'd forgotten the speakers she and so that's, how they find him a flight, a region, yeah Q, read retrieve the duffel bag that the killer had stuff. The items in my dad's name tag on it now with that information again, these are promising leads. There is a description from this Montague of open houses. Name right. There is a there is a description given so tell us what that description is what police think that they have in terms of a lead right. So what was

Interesting was that Montague was able to to tell them his first name didn't know the last name, but knew that his name is Travis and knew that he was a scrawny young, maybe one thousand nine hundred and twenty year old kid uh. You know light skin, dirty blonde hair, not very tall and certainly not very large, so they did about to go on once they came back to Florida. You say to the what a break in pursuing all these leads. As I mentioned, the they get an education, practical education in some of the homosexual lifestyle and the S and M sub call, and so they even go to notorious gay cruising sites like leaves trail and find out all the again all the terms- and I hadn't heard some of these bears and Cubs and Mary's and Muscle mass,

isn't winks, and so this entire world that they have to explore as part of this investigation and that still leads them nowhere does it doesn't it? No. Because this was a stranger that my father had picked up one night. So there wasn't any kind, I have connection and family, it wasn't a friend, uh yeah. They did get quite an education, because both both uh factors were family men and they didn't know a lot about that world, uh yeah. So that was quite shocking for them. You talk about when the police contact, you first

about your father's murder. Tell her audience as you do in the book. This very point had seen when you actually are given all the details. Tell us about that. Well, I had gone to the app store, and so I wasn't home when there was a knock on the door and the Orange County detective. The female detective apparently came to the door to try and tell me in person what had happened and my husband at the time was home and so the woman left him a teletype message that said, there's been a homicide, CALL Detective Boland in Palm Beach whatever it said, with a phone number, and so when I got home, my husband is not very good with emotion. Just handed me the notes- and so I found out

by reading the note there was a homicide and I and I knew right. Then it had to be my dad because that's the only person that was in palm beach at the time, and so I called and the miscommunication, because the Florida detective detective Ball and to think that I had already been told about the homicide person, and so he says to me, I'm sorry to tell you but there's you know, there's been a homicide, your father been murdered where you aware of his alternative lifestyle- and that was just too many things to take in at once. I I just found out he'd been murdered when I sat down with that paper and made the call. Anne I did. I had no idea about his alternative lifestyle. I had seen a couple of things that I I just kind of you know it wasn't my business

and I just kind of put him out of my mind, and so I that would be a shock I did not know, and so it's really hard to quite a long time for me to process both those facts. When you got the next call, how long was it later and what was the tone of that call? Well, I flew the palm beach, I believe the next day and I called it Texas. When I arrive there, I stayed at my mother's condo. She was in China and I stayed in Delray Beach and they came right over the Texas came right over about twenty five minutes later with the boat. My dad's photo albums in their arms. For me to look through right. I instantly recognize them and I let them in and we sat down at the kitchen table and they wanted me to go through each photo and see if I recognize anyone because they didn't have any leads.

And I really didn't mean it the man in the photos I had been living in California for the past three years. I didn't know my father's new acquaintances And so I really didn't recognize anyone. I wasn't very helpful other than to tell them that a was a big part of my dad's life that he had been going to two meetings a day and that was kind of a red flag to them. I think as to where he he may have been meeting people. At least you know somewhere for them to start questioning people my And they said to me: he's only been at this apartment for a month. Do you know where he lived previously, and I said yes, but I don't- I don't remember the address. I said it's a few. It was it with a couple of miles from there. It was not that far from my mother's and they said well, can you

it gets there yeah. That was pretty shocking for me that what is the last thing I expected them to ask, but I you know I said I would and I, and they put me in the back of their crown VIC and we drove over to it. It's just Atlantic Avenue in Delray Beach. And they knocked on the the tenants door. Upstairs. My father was in a guesthouse, very small guest towel and it ended up stairs, wasn't helpful, and so they turned around to me in the backseat and said where to now, and so the the afternoon turned into me, taking them too to recovery houses that my dad had had me swing by. If we've been on the way to lunch,. And where he would say. I just want to see if so and so wants to go to a o'clock a a meeting and that all I knew about it so I took two halfway health or Recovery House, and then they

then an AA meeting hall, which they had never seen before called crossroads. I believe by the track. So they didn't know that was there and they started to question people that you know knew him. It was in interesting to you talk about a Jenn Seale at the ea and he spoke of in an incident or she spoke of an incident of with involving your father and something to do with you about a dancing. Can you explain this and what it indicated to police it seemed uh. Well I had I grown up with that Jillian or daughter, or her daughter was uh you're younger than me, and he had met chant. You know and sell the four less or just the daughter, and I would do things together,

about one of my fondest memories? Anne and her disco back in the late 70s I believe in, and there was a tall african American. I young man, there dancing in Bell bottoms and he was the best dancer Ann at the disco. I think in my dad being very boisterous, very assertive search. When will you dance with my daughter and the man said no and continued dancing in my dad would not relent and he continued to ask him to dance with me until he. Finally, and Jan remember that very well, and she said that you just didn't I don't know to my dad that he, you know he and let you say now and and eventually you would give in he. You know he was a salesperson for years and he was good at that, so she was attacked

just a thought, someone who could possibly be very persistent, perhaps even manipulative and was used to get it we're going to use this Denise as an opportunity to stop just for a second to talk about our sponsor tonight, movement- a very important wedding. I went to on Sunday, which was my own wedding, believe it or not. I finally got married and a little bit before this Skype had to buy a new suit, get in shape and just as suits have changed very slim style. Very different than suits of

years ago. It is time for a new watch, and so I looked online at Movement M v m t and I picked a classic black gold. Now this is was impressive enough to wear for a wedding, despite it being very, very reasonably priced movement. Watches were founded on the belief that style should not break the the watch makers goals to change the way consumers think about fashion by offering high quality minimalist products at revolutionary prices over one million watch is sold to customers in one hundred and sixty countries around the World Movement Watch is has solidified itself as the world's fastest growing watch. Company movement watches started just ninety five dollars and at a department store you're. Looking at four hundred to five hundred,

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Is it time to step up you watch game, go. Do m v, M T, dot com, slash, murder, join the movement. We last left off the knees you talked about that police were questioning what aid meetings at this crossroads, the one that your father would attend meetings at twice a week. You would just been given this incredible information about your father's secret life. How do police proceed? with this information from the AA meetings. And what do they eventually find an from who will? First of all, he's been going to meetings twice a day,

Pardon me a lot of these young men, and it seems that all when they began to question people that means that recognized hello raise on. And gets a sex lays the work, a lot and they're down and out. Oh,

I asked to be your sponsor you're supposed to select that your own sponsor out when your style, someone sponsor, they have ulterior motives, and it said that police were kind of getting the picture that perhaps offering to be sponsor and no not doing yes tax with them. You talk about a year so. No was just a little garbled that so we'll I'll go over. What you had said is that you talked about that. They learn the term vampire at the AA meetings and the term vampire where is for somebody that will approach someone about being a sponsor and the rule. The unwritten rule

the rule that everyone knows is that that's not very a good idea and to be aware of that, and so that's where the term vampire comes, and you do get a picture police at this is possibly how your father may of approach. Somebody so tell us what what this information leads to in further in their investigation, our they picture of him and his character. But it's not very helpful in terms of tracking down an actual lead, because this particular young man, he did not find it a she found him. Side of the road near the Dixie Highway tracks. So uh, when he questions people at the meetings.

That doesn't really go anywhere for them. They just they just have. You know in our mind that picture of this lifestyle. Now, how was it? We talked about how the police finally find out? Who who has killed your father tell us how they proceed with this and in them into what are you doing and what are you realizing and whether you discovering well, I had flown back to Florida after a week I stayed uh and buried. My father had the funeral, you know and until up detectives as much as I could and then went back home, and I believe it's about five months later, very common practice in police work happens where they will. Either, pull over someone for traffic incident that has a warrant in this particular taste

under new the killer was friends with the killer had. Been caught, fleeing, eluding, flute, fleeing and Ilu In the police we ran out on the hotel bill and the restaurant bill at a hotel in palm Springs, FL an was fleeing from police and they caught him and put him in jail, and he gave up Travis his name in order to Hell So that's how that came about, and then the detective called me in California and gave me the news and told me that I would be needed at the trial

that it was imperative that I'd be there. That's the way that the jury see that there was someone grieving on my father's side. Now we talked also about deadly secrets that could help your father's killer escape the potential death penalty should be you come forward, so we talked about your life with your father. We didn't talk about your mother and your father's relationship marriage. What is it? What was it that was this deadly secret that could help your killer, potentially escape the death penalty by b? of that profound importance. Tell us something happened when I was nineteen, but I I really wasn't able to deal with it, and so I put

shit out of my mind and when I was sitting through the trial, the killers trial. I heard him testify that my father had been choking him on the bed and I remembered back when I was about or eat. I suppose where my father, which he would drive down from Portland Delta out, where we were living in a duplex and choke her just about three times a week. It seemed like because he had visited. It would be wednesdays and weekends. So on his trips down to pick me up or bring me home, he would be drunk and just knock on the door and she would answer every time and he would choke her and she would she never once called the police, so I believe the killer that he was choking him 'cause. I'd seen that there was a pretty common scene for me to witness and when he the started to describe the scene on the bed with the choking and

I'm having to stave my father off with a steak knife from uh needs him. I stop to remember what happened when I was nineteen that I had pretty much forgotten about, because I couldn't do do anything with the information or I wouldn't do anything with it. So I just had to put it out my mind. One morning it was about seven hundred o'clock in the morning when I was nineteen living in this condo in Delray Beach. I got a phone call and it was my fault he was drunk at seven hundred in the morning and he said Denise. I think I killed somebody come pick me up and you know I had been asleep. This is the

first thing out of his mouth on the phone, and I hang up the phone and grabbed my car keys. I'm in a t, shirt along T shirt with no shoes, and I jump in the car and drive over there and it's it's only about a three minute drive is right across federal highway Where he had temporarily rented a trailer and I'll never forget, there was gravel on the grounds and I drove up and my father. Already waiting outside the trailer and He immediately got in the passenger side. An I said: daddy is he ok, I just assumed it was a man. Might my father never hung around with women? It was always men at that at least once you've moved back to fly, and I just and it was a man- and I said, is he ok, daddy and he said to me, take me to my car: it's at the repair shop on Atlantic Ave

Fifth Avenue and Atlantic, and I started driving and I asked him again: is he okay and he didn't answer me and I didn't know what to think that point, and so I dropped them off. About five minutes here shop and it occurred to me that I had maybe ten minutes or so for him to pay for his car and drive back to the trailer, ok, And what was I going to do a about what I just learned, so I drove back over to the trailer and pulled up in the gravel and parks, with the car running. I think, and just I remember glancing over at the window of the trailer and just thinking you know the door is: is Pro Lee locked, I'm probably not even going to be able to get in and if I do get in then watt.

You know an I'm thinking if the and allies is he gonna be disoriented and thank them. I went there the killer or get out of that that the aggressor and can hurt me or is he dead and then what do I do? I have to choose in my going to call the police, and that was an option. I was so close to my dad. That was not an option, and so I I couldn't deal we never spoke about it. I drove home and for three weeks I watch the news and I never heard anything about a body or anyone missing or an attack or anything, and I never ask my father about it. You know because ignored me in the car- and I really didn't want to know any more about it, and I just put it out of my mind after that for all those years.

And I really is okay prosecutor. You say you did this all came back at trial, the process fusion in the sense obviously have a much different twist on the tail of the story of innocence and guilt. You talk about the prosecutor's theory on what happened in his depiction of the events and then the defense, and you did listen to the defense argument and you say that what was like a trigger to bring back memories so tell us what the prosecution idea in theory was, and how close were they to this? Was the death penalty a reality. The death penalty was a reality because he had stolen. My father watched like the the watch, was in every photo of my dad. My dad always wear that watch and when you steal from the Vix like that during a murder, it's a double

only. I believe and it's that gets you the death penalty, and so it was definitely on the table. Uh. The prosecutor was very good at his job, very, very handsome, very theatrical, very smart and he put on quite right. You know uh presentation and yeah and he wasn't there to kill at the murder. None of us were- and he painted the picture of this. You know jewel, thirsty young killer, killing my father to sell his goods or drugs, which is probably in fact, I believe, I believe the killer when he said that my father was choking him on the bed the way described it seen it so many times with my mother, and I remembered that trailer incident aneinu it it all pieced together me in that. In that moment, that's my father

was picking up young men and you know I don't even know if there were more that had gotten hurt. I had no idea, but I believe him an. I told the prosecutor. About the trailer incident and he said well. What do you want me to do? And I said I want you to tell the jury and Similarly, I can't it's hearsay, you weren't there are, you didn't see a body? Yes, we did. Did you see a body? And I now I didn't see a body, and so I can testify right. The idea is that the defense said it was self defense. Was there any consideration like some people? Might you know, despite the memories that you had it reinforced? What Travis Jones was saying by his

attorney. Sometimes attorneys will say too much exaggerated or weave a tale. That's just unbelievable was their aspects of what the Defense attorney Mitchell Beer said that rang untrue. Yes, it's funny. You brought that out there. The problem with, fence was and then the killing obviously was the obvious coverup of the crime that looks guilty and was quite a cover up. You've got oh, you know her story. Uh then do. A very good job, like I said left, is she very bloody on the bed and see in the dark there was Blood in the light switch they

they had a bit of dna from killer, but he wasn't in the Cisterna men they would have been so That was the problem. Where I remember that Mitchell Beers, the defense attorney, asked Travis. Why did you put this bloody sheets and it's hard and his answer was, I don't know, I don't know why I did that.

Obviously that's a lie out now is. It is very obvious to everyone on the jury that he didn't want to get caught, but I don't, I don't believe you went there to honor. I believe that Saddam was choking him and wasn't got. Let go what was the scenario that you saw that you believed obviously to get to talk to your father about this. But what did you deduce again? You talked about. You believe that Travis Jones is being joke by your father. What was the scenario we would be? As you talk in a book, there was investigation that there was a two wallets which was important and,

in the testimony from witnesses, said. Listen, he had the two wallets for this purpose. He didn't like to pay, didn't think he wanted to pay. He would pretend he didn't have any money when he did have money, he was warned that he could be robbed. Tell us the scenario from everything that you saw and you know, and you learned about what actually happened, that night. Well, obviously, I wasn't there, but the killer got on the stand and testified, which is pretty rare at a trial that they do that. Oh, I think he believed he would get off for self defense. He he he in his mind is telling the truth, and I believe he was you know not knowing you. I was trying to cover up the crime, but he he described that night as my dad picking him up walking along with you by the tracks. Anne asked him if he wanted to watch some sex film

and you know the id list for money and he got in the car with him and went back to his apartment, which is on the second floor and they went immediately to back bedroom- and you know my father- performed sex acts on Travis and then Travis wanted to get Dayton. Leave and my father wanted him to reciprocate and he did not want to and he for his money and my father. You know struggle with him on the bed and began choking him And told him that he was going to give daddy what he wants is what Travis had testified. You again, we there and wasn't letting up and Travis was trying to find a upwards poking him trying to get him off of him.

And my father wasn't letting go, and so he claims that he stuck him in the neck, trying to get him off and he wouldn't get off and that he finally I mean when you nicked him in the neck, that my father finally kind of got kind of stunned and sell to the side of it, and he did get get out from underneath them, and then my father chased him across the bedroom into the closet and Travis describes it that he he threw Travis into the closet door and then it you know that then he's thrown against the the bedroom door and the door jamb broke off, and you know by that point my father's bleeding, and so he, finally, I guess, he's crew falling down the hallway towards the front door

and then, as Travis described on the stand, he said now the defense attorney so waiting my frozen. He said he just froze, guess he uncon and right there on the floor in the dining room and yeah again. What did the jury and the court and the judge react to his testimony? What was the decision? How long did it take to deliberate? Was this? The testimony that was the most important to this trial tell us about that. Well, that's a hard question to answer to answer

which was most important in the trial. To me it was to me the kid was telling the truth and he was terrified and it was apparent to me and he was crying. But again the prosecutor was very good put on an excellent presentation. It was very persuasive. So there's that, and I don't recall how long the deliberation was, but I don't believe it was very long because my husband flew back. He left before the verdict, the left and got on a plane and uh. Now you know what I think is the next morning. I think my thing I went to dinner with my mother and it was the next morning that we got the verdict and they found him guilty With Manslaughter- and he got ten years but he'd already served a year and a half while awaiting trial, so he got time served for you and a half so

spent eight one slash two years in prison and then got released on work release for a year, which means you you go to work today and you sleep with the present at night. I got a letter about that when he moved into that stage. What's interesting, is that when you were called to speak with a prosecutor is that there was an offer from the defense of a fifteen year sentence with the prosecutor suggested or recommended that they do not accept and and suggested to. You recommend it to you that they do go that you take this to trial or that you support him, take it to trial. Yes, I forgot what that was very interesting, because at Travis and his attorney they were yours. Are the prosecutor wanted to try on a strong case and you,

we advise going to trial, and so we did and if what happens is after the trial, the victim impact statements and in my victim in a statement when I stood up and spoke, I asked the judge, give him a treatments. I said I think he had. You know it wasn't allowed in the trial. That, I believe, is a drug problem and I would you know, I think you should get drug treatment and because of that, instead of getting fifteen years, he got the ten years and then five years probation with drug treatments. All of that's how that ended.

But I I so you ask for that, and you may as well gotten in years. My interesting very interesting, be the input that they have from. You is very, very, very interesting in all of this again. This is it's not a great question. Was this worth the looking into secrets to find out the truth? What what is this done for you to find out this? Is it's been a positive live or negative, or a mix of both this entire journey. This entire book daddy's little secret everything he went the trial. All of this tell us about the impact this has had on you. What does it done for you overall? Well, I is something that I

had to do, because I wasn't dealing with it. I I had issues I wasn't dealing with. I believe I put In the beginning of my book, and that there was sketch of my father that I had in the claw. But apparently my oldest daughter's high school boyfriend, who is a famous artist, now had sketched this picture of my father from a photograph and when I would come crosses in the closet, I couldn't look at it and I would just push it in the back of the closet and I was framed photograph and so about a decade after this murder. I you know made myself pulled out and look at it, and I thought you know you're not dealing with this and you know what else was. I know dealing with in my life. You know I was tending to I'll, be in denial about things and push them out of my mind instead of deal with them in my relationships, and I decided that I was

going to have to you know, process my feelings with for him and understand him and so I you know, I dredged all that up order. The transcripts read through them on an intel dirty, but a lot of them and did a lot of research and as an now I feel like. I finally knew him the, but in the bad- and so I you know I have, full picture and I can space it now and move past it. Certainly I want to thank you very much Denise for coming on and talking about daddy's little secret and daughters quest to solve her father's brutal murder for those that might want to find out more about this. I know this is a wild blue press release. Tell us a little bit more about how they might contact you or find about Facebook page or wild blue press. Tell us a little bit more about contact information. Well, they concert

go to Amazon and ordered the black several countries as well as the. U S are they can also go to wild repressed, dot, com and and or if you're, there you can order from my website. You need smaller author dot com. It's available on Kindle Print Ebook and even audio sounds great. I want to thank you very much Denise for coming on and talking about daddy's little secret. It's been a pleasure, a very, very fascinating book. Thank you. Very much for coming on and talking about it. I want to thank you for having you and I appreciate it. Thank you. Goodnight goodnight.

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