Toni Collette might be the first actor to tell Marc that, yes, she does learn about herself through the characters she plays. That's a lot of learning, considering the wide range of characters Toni has played over the years. Toni and Marc talk about how she grew into herself while starring in movies like Muriel's Wedding, The Sixth Sense, Hereditary and now in Charlie Kaufman's latest, I'm Thinking of Ending Things, a movie that left Marc asking a lot of questions (which he'll try to get Toni to answer).
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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all right. Let's do this, how are you what the fuckers, what the FUCK Nics, what the
academics what's happening? Are you holding up what's happening there? Would you got Goin
Are you working on that shelf?
I do in that would work
are you standing are you
screwing things in the things? Are you putting things together? A? U cleaning things I swear to God.
The guy across the street, his dig
In four rodents in the ground, the
don't think or their I'd think
people are losing it
at the house out he's got the shovel out. I got no rodents in my heart. I have a lot of birds.
Now you ve got to assume a porch.
I believe, there's woodpeckers years are woodpeckers in LOS Angeles because
I saw one he seemed to be.
Just didn't seem to be that engaged in then you dick in this waiting game.
It sometimes it's interesting you really have to.
Can I go with the flow if you're expecting nature to entertain you, you ve, got to take in the whole picture,
You gotta be like all this
does nice, it's really about this sort of
peace and quiet and flow, but that bird
Bird. That aid does something and I'm scared. I wish you would start doing it, nay. I just pack up.
Secondly, like tat was it go? Man go and then you just wait
and he can't seem to decide and then
Becomes a very aggravating showed, then you have to shift. You have to
if too, a squirrel, but after that
three, it that's all I've entertainment I'm dealing with. How are you guys do?
Oh by the
hey, I'm sorry, tony Collapse is on the show today you nor from the six cents little Miss Sunshine, Muriel wedding, hooray
it carries in the new Charlie, Kaufman movie
thinking of ending thing, she's great.
The United States of terror.
Anyway, she's the best, and I talk to her and I
think I took her to task a bid probably unnecessarily about the new Charlie Kaufman Movie Bay Ways
You can listen to that in a minute
Thank you ever suggested to analysing the Martin Short Episodic, as it was then
after the heartbreak kid.
It actually available on Youtube
can't get it. I dont know why someone waded out from ya think the it's part of a proper
that was bought by larger entertainment company and they just don't give a fuck about
making it available, but
I watched it again on Youtube cause. I guess I brought it up in the conversation with Martin her he had an what
they fuckin movie yeah, there's a few movies
a time that are of that ilk
I would say, the graduate and,
You have five easy pieces to a certain degree in a way, but not quite just the idea, the the kind of exit
general confusion of a generation. The story-
you're different, but there
momentum of the story is the same in terms of the character.
And I believe we have to see
both of them several times. I am going to say that
heartbreak kid is, is kind of a better movie.
I just realized that it's a lane may
and the great
No, it was MIKE Nicholls bright. I just
like the way was written, I mean sometimes NEO Simon can can actually do some amazing things were character and I
I can't believe I've been said dab, but it's true. There is,
and there's a couple of scenes in California Sweet Movie. I, as I said before the M the step between
I want all then Jane Fonda, which was character driven, but you can a beautifully written stuff and I don't know
It was this great watching the heartbreak kid of his great watching the D. This
cringe E Conover unfolding
of a relationship that should not have happened at all.
And then the ending of both the ending moments of both the
break kid and a graduate of their spectacular anyways
there you go you I just gave you a very positive review.
Of a movie from nineteen sixty whatever.
Nineteen seventy two so get out. Quickest boss
won't get your movie theater and nineteen. Seventy two
watch a movie. Also,
The other thing I'm doing
side from taking in the news compulsively on my phone to the point where I
I entirely my ability to have any.
Help whatsoever. I am.
I somehow got obsessed with a band which I very excited about. I like when you get that sort of moment where you're like, and what is this and it's like all this.
She had some go and I been record shopping a bit because I've decided I want to em, spend some money
to try to have a nice time, even in the midst of this apocalypse epoch,
this double album.
The collection of the incredible string bandit, I never heard of them before now. Look I'm not!
I am not adverse to hippy shit and I m not adverts. I am a little adverse to renaissance fares and there are certain strands of folk music
dont didn't used to resonate with me by this incredible string, ban shed some
then about it, the layers of the depth of it, the looseness of it just of the whole vibe of it it just
no a locked in I locked in it hooked me so
Then, of course, I'm like I got to learn about these band I got to. I got to get all the important albums. I knew that they existed as a band from a book. I have the hundred essential albums that one must have
and I saw one in there and I had no idea who they were there. Was this sort of in the back of my head and now I now I do know who they are, and I want
nuts. I had it
I had to get there first. I think I think
consensus is the first four album so
finding it haunting and deep and transcendent in a way. Take me to a different place
Now, sir, I've decided
I've decided that the kings
Lola versus Power Man and the money ground part. One nineteen, seventy!
is the best kings album now look, I'm
a music intellectual, I'm no music historian. I can't even tell you that I have listened to all the king. Sound was, but I do know the ones that people think I'd be
I stay. I know some of you are out there who even give a shit about the kings right dude come on man
village, green preservation, society, muslim, hillbillies, certainly
you know even Arthur but come up low LE versus Power man in the money. Grandpa one come on.
It's the best one. I will stand by it. I had
most a planet waves, experience with it and other kings fan.
Early stuff. I like misfits a lot, but
muzzle Hoboes IQ preservation ray I like it by now,
a really put any time? And oh, oh verses, power and great fuckin record.
As you can see, I'm trying to be happy because, like I, you know, I have had a wave of grief come back over me and ate it.
Seems to be settling in I'm trying to not let it become depression, I'm trying to wet it stay sadness and now
You know become depression, but that's what's happening now.
A lot of people- and I'm not going to- I can't I'm not I'll, try to stay in this. I try and stay into the solution here. This company tsum, I think it's
I've sent me all this teeny products, because I had this
mine, blowing experience pudding
two heeny, I'm vanilla ice cream. I talked about it for this company soom sent me a choice
I quit teeny sauce and when I
Instead it I started crying
being and laughing at the same time and my body started to shake it's not
a plug man, bright, holy fuck.
So that's! What's going on with that
Tony Collette! Here now I'm going come out this again now
why not do what the paranoia sheep in it so fuckin hard to not
Oh, it's gonna happen and see how this darkness- I mean it smokey here. Why gets
most unreasonable in the other day
I got it into my head. Where was like,
I gotta exercise mega exercise, my sanity, but do the air is almost unbelievable, Adam I gotta exercise, and I
there's a couple of days from a high sir, my throat her my chest. Her might this is fucked up
I gotta get out of this state. I may still have to do that.
Yesterday I like,
check my Google app. I got some app. That tells me the air quality wasn't great, but it wasn't as bad as it could be, and I said well, this is the way it's going to be man. This is the way it is from here on out, so
if we're going to survive. If what living is now is just the sort of data they struggle of literally surviving until shit
yet even worse than if
to choose to do that. We
afterward to adapt, so I
Look. What am I ninety five masks I went out to my height and it was,
Saturday. There wasn't any one really there and I was like fuck it fuck, the air,
the smoke, and I did the entire hike within it.
And if I mask on not because of covert but because it
fuckin air- and I just did it- I felt
this then I got into a sort of that. I would never compare myself to a fire fighter, but I'm like they do it I'm doing it. I got the mass. This is
it's gonna be. This is what life is like from here on out deal with it a day.
I did the hike and
next day. My want felt like shit, but I'm ok, I'm gonna, adapt, I'm gonna fuck
and adapt man I don't know. What's gonna happen, five minutes in front of me, god dammit.
So a Tony collated here.
I d go too intense about the Charlie,
Calvin moving I may do. I is account
your Kaufman Charlie Kaufman Movie, absent
thinking about it to a certain degree. But it's really like it's not a matter of like what I took away from the movie. It's a matter of like what was that now,
dismissing it, I'm not diminishing it. It's a long very. What well thought out very sort of
Tick, yours we added in shot and conceived movie,
I just work, I just a.
Then the issue I have was really I get it. There's a lot of your teeming
There's a lot of young insect brain machination is going on
often the genius it just I don't I don't want,
walking away from a movie, not knowing what the fuck was about. Maybe I'm stupid, but I
now our desired nicely. Let it pass over me and threw me and insert a veto
masticate it. Oh I mentally and
a kind of work it out. I do know that it got me to see women under the influence again enjoy
there's one beaten it than I thought.
Great during one of the dance numbers hits when I think the the water fountain comes on. I thought that's the best moment. The movie was
the musical number when the water phone starts
really the best beat in the film for me was that water phone
nothing away from the fact that Tony collated gene
but anyway, work that takes nothing away from the fact
that Tony collated genius and a great actress o one.
The thing on the sick.
Before I get into that real quick mild manager, Olivia
when gate is now in the
I'd cast racket and
is producing a new one that you might want to check out. It's called come on come out and it's a scripted.
How many podcast it's like a lesbian version of Alan Partridge. Can Europe
your brain around man, it's gotta run.
You're funny women in it, like Mary Houlihan, again
Gabby Hoffman, great, very talented people
That's it. That's called come on come out wanting to Morrow September fifteenth wherever you get your pod casts artwork Tony collect. Let's,
honest who doesn't love Tony collect I'd. She is the star
or one of the stars of
I'm thinking of ending things and she's brilliant in it.
Of course, is the new movie written indirectly by Charlie Kaufmann, who,
talking about now streaming on networks, and this is tony color
in Australia. Talking to me,
in LOS Angeles, coming right up,
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Reviewing on camera work in zooming enduring press still dying, so I really vital drivers very often and in fact really
Evelyn proud people you're making me look this way. That's a nice room is at our hotel room, it's a hotel room and you know I would have done it all. The time but it starting
credibly early and I have children and a husband. It wouldn't work side. I got a hotel room actually looking. How can I show you this
I wouldn't know an, but I the Opera House
oh look at that very close. His room is on the second floor. You feel very close to the water and you feel like you can touch the opera house.
Which I mean I leave your group and senior still love that building. It is an unbelievable architectural fate. Nothing looks like that
that's the only thing that looks like that satellites. Maybe
I've been to I've been to Sydney a long time ago. I was there, I think, with pride to
as an in six year, that is, let me go.
I was a sad man. There was a sad comedy club over in some sad area. That was some sort of failed
fair area. There is like a movie theater, and it was
like some area that was? It was
used to be like it was it first, some bigger event and it just sort of never
happened or something. I know there was a movie theater. There is this comedy club and
like you. Look like a worlds. Fair, almost like area that is imported was next to fuck, steady eyes, yea. I. What is something like really interesting, like the entertainment district right ha right? Also, you had a great time. It sounds like with a guy who owned the comedy quote, took me to the zoo that was okay and hay, and I went to a to bind I beach with
Luke Davies, gonna look Davies like use, I do yeah, he say
Ah, he often numb. I do know he loves, knows Bundy and often rent someplace, that a friend of his owns straight out to the ocean had been buckler. You stay with me
I didn't stay with him. I just visited visit we hung out. Then I went to the place where you can swim
that poor. That I think, is ocean water. It's right there on the beach. Yours is the icebergs upon diarrhea,
it also wanted Marie Bra is one. Could she either to include vehicles, calls wireless while his bonds, which a pretty great great sneaking I used about a sneak into the night, was sorry sorry, lovely vote. You did when you were a teenager. I didn't mean it.
Yeah. I remember experiencing phosphorescence for the first time and I
standing on the rocks at the Beach Bronte with a couple girlfriends
we ve been swimming and I stood on the rocks and you like a faint tat generally spots, coming off my feet: Savior bulk. What one is what causes that we really? What is it?
reaction in the water and actually quite understand myself, but lights up and looks like fireflies.
These black in the water, but he never sailors magical,
I'm person there only happen in Australia? No, I saw at once. It was a strategy, so maybe
now it has been demonstrated
now strolling thing. I don't like it happens everywhere, but it's rare something has you'd like be lined up for it to happen. It doesn't just happen all the time.
So, what's going on there, I like how bat like is, is life? It's terrible. Is it? Is it what's the lockdown situation? He I talk to her Sarah
knock in Melbourne, I think they, like
on their under martial law? There Melvin
really suffering, I'm in Sydney. As you know the opera house, and it's very different here I mean we,
I was shooting in Toronto and
I wasn't shooting housing prayer and I didn't even get to shoot, and then I gotta say virtue:
weeks leave I'm in the middle of March, and I was
the flight with I announced you had to suffice light for two weeks if your flying into the country, so I did that we
my family and then went into locked down in IRAN, is locked him for a couple of months condition.
States have had their own rules
and it was weird when it ended, because it was like an ever happens. Payments.
I too, like stupid, sweating engine
next to each other, and guy have dinner and hugging Kissingen touching anyway,
but all this shit hit a phantom Melvin ends its all its big relapse. It was mishandled misjudged and it's very sad return on their Sidney. You can mosques are optional, you can go and aids
you can wander around mass is, are you sure don't yeah? Do you have
who's in charge. There.
But there's no rule is not mandatory. Saw you just kind of choose where they want to die or not. Basically, do I wear master the shopping center and share the air with everyone or not. You have an idiot in charge of the country's well or no just ineffective, not as much as a moron. Perhaps pass just right
in effect is not as damaging very by age. So did you? What did you go?
After did she? Wouldn't you, without here for a while
Yes and I used to drive around listening to you and it was so much fun and I can't believe I'm talking to you. This is such a true. Why leading their life and for years, and we move time at the end of twenty. I think now. Ok, so it's what's track it because I come trainer,
I think I feel like I've seen you in I've seen you know how to movies, but you ve done a lot more movies and I've seen and it seems like you do. I
nine movies a year.
Health is five just
is slightly absurd, but you know some jobs are only too well
exhort you know they re very. I get an wouldn't do
if I was myself somehow nervous breakdown actually love. What I do
ah, but also loving mother. So a balance out house how we, how new, is that how old, Giraldus Kid Twelve asserts been twelve years of that yet
well it's ok. We make we start with this move, because I did just watch this movie
How did you go with it? He
Our me, you don't, but the coffin does.
Because it's like you know he tries to get everything in
like literally everything in eight there, he
It feels to me that he
You know he so smart movie, so self aware he has
into actual capacity to challenge
himself, an. U am question everything any scene,
to find a need to put that when he directs a movie and rights it. It needs to be loaded up with everything that fuckin guy knows and everything he thinks about. So, given that.
You know a lot of times within ten minutes. I might go fuck this guy anymore. They wouldn't fuck him so, but
my problem with him,
I say that this exists? What a great reaction yeah! I guess I guarantee that had to be what he's working for, because
it does not want to predetermine or ever manipulate the audience. I think he put so many ideas into
its film and others, but specifically this and its very changeable and the ground keeps moving in a cage challenging you us it's,
so I very sensitive like is complex, but it sensitive, you know, there's a real tenderness to it and I think he does have love for humanity. But
I think, depending on your experience way rat you your on different levels
that's right so and being argumentative. I love the guy. I've talked to the guy, I think he's a genius I
If you know you were great ain't, you got have suddenly find out. If I have really felt about child Kaufman,
I think, he's a genius. I think
is nobody like him and originality is everything that's lacking in our industry and its so exciting to work with the mind like that? Yes, I agree
but that is another thing about geniuses and singular talents. Is that
you know they run the risk of being annoying and I
I don't agree, I find it incredibly. Generational annexes and work is definitely not as well, but I've been
and if he's for so long I love everything is worked on. I really do
I'd like to go, I come craving to have a conversation,
yeah about the film, because various stuff
In it that, like I really like this is my reaction to somebody who sort of blow me away, I think it held together you better.
Then synaptic in New York, which I really had a hard time with it, but I think
dealing with a lot of the same kind of things that he likes to deal with, but
this one to me. You know it. It did feel
the movie. It felt like three or four movies and
and I do like they're there,
the things that I like the best about it odd. We
I loved your performance. I, like Jesse Clemenceau, lacked
I like everyone. You probably just saying that to you talking to me: no, no! No! No! No
I like all the performances, quite honestly and but
the other parts that I like.
Like when the water fountain came on when they were dancing- and I
secret hissing, isn't it at this amazing soggy outside I loved my one of my favorite parts was the musical. At the end,
I don't mean to spoil anything, but I think it's hard and I and I really want to see a woman under the influence again I walked away from that movie like I want to. I want to see Gena Rowlands do you know I wanted to get, but
like when you hear presented a script like that. You know like
How do you even read, then? How do you process it? Did you get a whole script yet it I was
told that Charlie wanted to talk to me about project really had. I was sent this script, I read it. I was.
Was blown away. I mean it's so rich and saw textual and complex, and I love
when things are ambiguous you can read,
different ideas into us and then spoke to him. We kind of clarified it. A bit.
Really it's. It's kind of strangers coming out now could ultimately is about his lonely. Guy has disconnected and just leaving with memory and sadness and guilt and regret.
Pilot and longing and loss and all of those things, we feel different moments that it comes thick and fast during the course of the film,
it's coming thick and fast in reality now, so I find that timing really kind of incredible.
Now the the bleakness, the deep feeling of it all
So that's what the movies about it's about, a guy who
a lonely in reflecting. I think
did you watch the whole film or a tender? Ok,
I want to show you
you're telling me you tell me it's only several different things and in actual fact I can't talk about what have what the
real constructively over these, which would you realise at the end of the movie, because it would give it away. I know
but wait until we have an authority that of this boy bringing his relatively new girlfriend homes made his parents and how strange
awkward intensity is and how things keep flashing
In changing and how it everything is not, as it seems like the simple version of it
maybe but you read that script and said: oh it's about the guy in the truck
I can't remember what I initially thought, but I do remember, having is an idea about it which was closed, but no cigar, and shortly afterwards, and
Are we told you it was about the guy in the truck.
And talk about it in this way mark merit.
You ve made me go if I give too much away. No one knows what I'm talking about and even if they see the movie they're not going to know what I'm talking about till the last bit naughty right. It does. I think, because, like
Like I worked at the conversation ever with you, although in
I sound like I'm being weirdly argumentative. I had to say,
with Paul Thomas Anderson and make him explain certain movies of his to me, because I was mad at him so
maybe maybe You'Re- not the one to be talking about this with, but by Jove like for me, because I
when somebody presents like Kaufman presents
yeah, I'm going. Do you think I am going to think. I have to understand all elements of this and what is trying to do, and I know that ultimately too much simpler undertaking than what I'm seeing it as because he has
idea in his head, but it's all grounded somewhere
but I don't necessarily see that means. It is totally abstracts right before the I understand, but with you.
Not by the way is based on the know. How you did it had not read. I was no ready, so I'm really any fact. I dont you that with anything I just like to deal with the screenplay, because there are often things that they are intentionally left out or that are in hand. So I decided
deal with the material I'm working way than not money,
because I am confused where things are coming from
How do you approach a movie like this? As is the seasoned actress used on nine hundred movies,
yeah, and you know you you day,
this world. That does he said.
Will for you that you are just this person. Who is
this in this situation, or do you see it s some sort? I clear I, like you, can't
of the enormity all that you can't play the context of it right say: oh yeah, let's just playing each moment, which is why you have to do in any Phil playing any characters.
So I play a woman who is,
a mother to these boy whom she has smothered and who has no intervene?
it will send to be self cost so entangled with his parents, and he brings this.
Woman home, and I am trying to welcome her and try to present some kind of normal see, but it's so painful to share my son with her ass. She does is contorting in size
crying and smiling and trying them. Yes, just all pain.
The crying and smiling thing. Is you yeah,
would you call it a? There is sort of a kind of slightly gothic feel too. There is a bit of a horror feel to it
yes, I will
see, I don't even think of things in
of general anymore. I know people say genre for poorer itself, but I'm talking,
any longer. I dont think about that. I always just think about the truth of the moment
That's all I have all over right.
And sometimes I don't have any control over there and that's the best. That's bear those are the best man. Actually, when
You have no control over the truth of the moment, but you
you are in it. You are now exciting. You just have to let go
so great is like a metaphor for life.
Had happened on that movie, Allah,
the sheds stream of consciousness. It seems like we're having a conversation, but it's almost like it's all. Coming from one mind specific
that genocide and then moving into the library that whole sequence in the farm house.
They were all really hard to rely on each other in order to kind of rail safety nets because
It was so long ends,
we had one rehearsals, a kind of you grab a leetle, a slight structure, not not enough to kind of him. Anyone in so there's still a freedom to it that there was
at least some structure to follow.
Because of the rhythm of it and we were listening to each other,
they were launched, runs through right having they were long and tight.
And it was pages and pages.
I remember that because if there is actually ties rose like AIDS is still the same shot and it was the same shocked I could go on for a while disenchanted by
extreme insulating is leaving no. We usually enjoy that. I was engaged in
in in the way that I was engaged. I what you may not be shy or not. You need to talk to you. I told you.
Yeah, but he had come with somebody else. He came with the director of a normal lisa and you know he he wouldn't do it on his own, and I got about forty five minutes with him, and yet it was great. I in I had a good time with him, but I'm sure yeah. He felt that there was a. I have,
I want that. I have a friend whose an artist and she didn't, whereas TED talks and break down,
and having to explain her work,
really upsetting to her son, and I can understand that, and I think that's how Charlie girls like he does.
But he does he doesn't want.
To determine how people respond. You just want to give them. I d is of what it is so that they have their own reaction and idea about what it is. I get there
I understand that he made you know he's when he's left to its own devices and he writes in directs the films that you're dealing with something. You know that
fundamentally, an experimental movie really
I mean he's very meticulous, any very decisive but anyway
things very open to ideas. He is very collaborative. I had here very specific, which he is I mean he's creating a world. Someone has to be clear about it. Someone has to be at the helm of the ship, but he's very
like this one line, I did stating the trailer paraphrase the I saw you should know it, whereas I say
Oh Jack would lose his head, it wasn't screwed onto his head. I I thought that
That was the wrong line and he got so excited by. It is likely that he'd right so he's really open to those really great accident
what look. I don't amateurs and I am aggravating, does I think, he's challenging and that's the best compliment
and give somebody who is with general.
It was creating something you know like theirs
thing like I get mad because I want to understand and he's defined.
Me to understand something that,
fairly incomprehensible, because everything is laid out. There is no way
put that together and be I get it. I see what's going on here, because it's just no fuckin way, but am
but our right that aside, I
got any city. He knows I think. As I know, I know what the story is, but actually else I can't talk about it could give it away, but you're, saying there's no one to give
Why do we need to give it away? Because no one understands its know, anybody really going to tell me the story. I guess the reason I'm trying to get it out of you, because I'm not even sure the story is I mean I know those two people went over. I know the car right, I know the guy in the truck. I get all that you know what the relationship between the guy in the truck and a couple that came over because like there
the time issue- and I know that time is not really that important to him and that you know time is sort of YO nebulous and fluid, and in does it necessarily mean years, and I get that, but I'm still
How much is is in ahead. Is it not now head to tell you what I know and manage the unilateral play it somehow you delete it because delete it.
Just tell you are you yes, but I don't know I can trust you will not have to stand back. Anybody I'll tell you later yeah we can do it after and then maybe I feel better I took
like these moments, it you're talking about word there. You know you, you play the truth of the moment, but sometimes you dont know like, for instance, I watched
your most of hereditary now,
no idea, it was just cuz, I was trying to catch up. I just got out of jail. Cuz like I want to be. I want to be at one.
The forehead, a view you now going into you with the talk mescal. That's not
We have the oil because I have memories of you. You know anybody and I just wanted to see. Yes, you know because you ve done so much over the years but for instance,
like. I guessed what resonate with me because I have been in some grief. Lately is
in them in that brief meeting,
was at a moment where we
that where you were playing the truth and the truth is sort of got away from you into something else.
A lot of us in that movie. I have to say, I think there was just there really was
It's very bizarre, but in reading that script it was just
Immediate knowledge of what is needed and
although not knowing how I would like climb the letter, I knew I would get there. You know why
there's some. We acknowledge that I it's just
an understanding, and I can't help it to us.
I tried not to do that. I'd just comparison
I myself. I knew I had to do it because I could feel it sewing
initially and some- and this is going back some kind of Charlie's idea
everything's like something like not articulate about that. There is such a strong cool when such a strong currency,
A technical. What I've been going
the sun matter what you do you have to learn the lines you bet
Billy it's just aligning myself as closely as Post
we'll be they sense of whatever the characters guy
and ended it did.
A frightened me that in hereditary at I really just understood so much of it here, because it was so dark
like you, you there is, was there some
risk for you mentally, oh,
I don't think so. I've never felt like this,
the Erika, you're gonna, get out here. I never feel I didn't go to the other side and never come out, I'm not that I don't like
I always have a sense of myself, but I'm we
in that kind of wood between?
actually caught happy to just let go and is now the way to put it rather tired, better
don't you find you answer? You find this area
ease and afloat things when it's written well, when it's not written well, you can't remember it appeals or rigid, and you have to work
to make it work the good ones. This just a fly. I can look at it and that's it
think that's true, you like, I don't have extensive experience acting in an usually I don't do things at arts, something
I can do like Ivan I'm yet to be interpreted.
Jack Romagnoli challenge myself with this and
Be this completely other person like most of what I've done just requires me to sort of Adam
take things out of my own personality,
driving my sectors do not hide behind the character, but actually everyone, it's it's all
it's all every character is me everything. So we know very well that that sort of the Charlie Kaufman idea, we are all everything, weeds and everything else. I lines then link, but why didn't you? But when did this start by I mean over the years? It seems that you ve gotten like. It really seems that your particular
recount, although from early on yet the emotions were coming through and the like,
you can really sort of. It seems
you ve grown in terms of the risks, you're willing to take emotionally and character, wise and also Justino weirdness wise
pink. Existing is weird. So why couldn't everything like everything is weird? I know I know I think potentially my work has
I think anyone's work is going to become more interesting, the more they know themselves, because there's more use because you're dealing with knowledge and not just free willingness re. Yes it s like it. I guess that's interesting.
Because, like recently I've been noticing that my thoughts,
coming together in a way that I find surprising
just what is thy market, I middling several times and hung out with her and I'm sorry. It was just so shocking and I am very very sorry for you and all of your friend
you know I'd where I met with her when I was working with Megan unlucky, then oh yeah,
yeah. I have other things I can imagine what you're going through and he will be surprising herself might write Gatesman. It's it's been brutal, really
but yet message being it'll, just keep changing the dull. It doesn't go away. You have dealt with it yeah.
By means of lights
ox man? It is part of life, it's that's the weirdest thing about it, as is that you know in free,
mean grief or in framing tragedy. You realize
Is that you there is
nothing unusual about it. You know it there is better.
Wait for it to happen. There is better timing for it. It's
we'd better when its expected, but
There is no way around it and
and you know it just eat there, but there's nothing unique about it other than my particular it the tree
Judy of her losing her life, but also Jessica having to deal with that that whatever we do
to that, but it is fundamentally human thing, but it's been two in terrible when I
talk to people about it tat. You know it brings up the feelings, but you gotta go through the feelings tat. You can't JANET. That's thing you got around it. Goggles
right, but this is a thing is like I'm telling you it's right there there, but there are different stages in your life and in terms of what you're saying where I think you
these chunks of life. Will you think you have things together and you're doing a certain type of work and then either some
thing, happens it's tangible or or it's not an ear, your dick,
the person, because you ve come through shopping
a grey and actually the shittiest moments the most beneficial in terms of growth and understanding. I think we're going
you started like words, you grew up in Sydney a in insignia
Are you folks do around here? That's great!
What kind of way would you would you would you parents do my dad's? Well, then, several different businesses, sometimes my plan was younger. My dad used to saying that I had four jobs at once, but its generally,
They both are educated and they are delight
for people and they are the salt of the earth- and I worked so bloody hard to keep the Threeg birthrate heads kids, good lives
My dad's predominantly was a truck driver and mom kind of was Mama loaded the time and then had some other. You know or jobs have a
thanks to two younger brothers, young, the eldest. Really
so how do you sort of pull away and become this person that day, you decide to do what you do when did that happen? I am I
think its eyes. I could have realized
I could sing ass. A teenager ends
listen to some erected did not, oh my god
ok, so I'm moving on. I was thirteen in here seven first year
I school and I was unaware of how things work now doing people at school. I went to a girl school
a whole and align down the middle and then a boy school on the outside, and
ass. It was raining. It was going to rehearsal and I found out about it are so desperate to be a part of it and I miss the boat. I went to every performance, I loved it was hoped, and
in the following year, a kind of guarding their early. In addition to the gods spell- and I had this like life changing experience, but I think
during that time. My grandmother died, and so I think I just
I had. I did for a long time use acting as a way of expressing myself, because I didn't know how to do that. I didn't know how to contact all of those
things inside myself, so it was almost like a clean way of experiencing things where it wasn't me
but I was using myself felt somewhat their again york, so any were conscious.
How come? Why do you think I want? I only realised much much later, that that's what I've been doing. Do you
shut down. Was it just like where your family was? It was not an emotional bunch in general or
coming emotional, but not grace, communicate,
is, I think, getting better as life goes on
so so in a sense, the the performative element helped you,
indicate all the things that you couldn't say as yourself. Yet absolutely
connect with myself. I've literally learnt from every character that I've got
because it has many different ways,
of living under the first pillar,
I've assets as so many actors. I got it
ask them if you know what they do, they weren't,
from their characters and no one.
Through a given me a definitive answer, I they the for some reason a lot of people. I think that I've asked dont really do make that connection, but ie you did because it seemed to be.
What compelled you initially was your ability to move through other people's emotions. Yet I think,
and you know I wouldn't have admitted this visa because I would have been mortified like it's embarrassing to admit that I would have liked.
Hey now, but then I think, because because I
I feel, like I couldn't do it on my own as me,
like if someone were to find out it would. I would be exposed somehow right so
I was really worried about that, but now I give a shit
really very weird, but I feel like a different human. I know people change through life, but I've heads I feel like it. If I look back on the
ass. It really does feel like somebody else's strange how to achieve.
That experience, I don't know how many people feel like that.
Who were somebody else said it was somebody else's lie for that you're different person, eyes
it's my life, but I feel so very different to that person. Why think I had, I think I profound problems.
In an earlier manifestation-
it's time to get to know yourself and begin stuff out, yet it sir
yeah I mean in high in I pushed the envelope a little bit. You know I mean, didn't you
when you speak to someone. I don't know. If that's true,
Why would you say that we are now talking? You know? One thing I appreciate you is that about you. You are
I am an impasse and I
feel when someone skirting around and you are just you
really it's when you speak to someone who's comfortable in themselves. It's actually makes me feel comfortable judges of the work of what are they trying to do.
Well they actually trying to say what are they hiding where lifting in all about stuff
exhausting. So if I made someone who is actually
in taking the responsibility now
themselves has gotten
a point where,
Frank about who they are. I love it. I am so inspired by that
I mean I get up, but I'm really like that when I talk to people like you, I'm going
when I talk to people like you know that you're like I've design,
I did to telling my job. I know I know I know, but
did evolved like that. You know like I was a cranky bitter fuck. You know when I
started. You know it is only through. I think it's like dueling impacts is what it is. Is that
I have to assume like you have given how much you know how our able you are to sort of open yourself up in these parts that
how would you remember when you were started act?
when things started happening for you or in theatre. Where are you
you started to kind of shit.
A loose and start to realize? Like you know, oh, my god, I'm dumb, I'm becoming a human Yang literally felt like it was a religion I felt so alive. It was clear to me magnificent
I went to that's. When did it start like where'd you go to school. When did you start your real it
I mean I would be nine is a whiskey. I lived in the inner city till I was about five
takes, and then we moved up to what was more.
Blue Rural area, which is now just as all the big urban sprawl now, but I'm
the western suburbs Sidney. I would even call the whisky rural frowned upon and kind of thought out as a thought of as inferior people. For
quite some time and is actually something I'm really proud. All staying there going up. There
but I was all side aware like at the age of sixteen of like looking at girls, my I'd pushing prancing just thinking this is not me. I've got to go here,
I did I'm not an ambitious person. I am open to the flow of life and,
but there was something in May at that age. That was just so brave. I can't believe it if I had to start acting now get nowhere, but I just had no fear
I think myriads waiting was really back. That really did feel like a religious experience, but even doing that musical. When I was like fourteen fourteen years old, then I did
I'm not experience school. One of the music teacher said that doing these big bicentennial means
bicentennial, meaning Australia had been discovered. Two hundred years ago I e invaded and said it was a big celebration,
and they were putting together a musical and kids from eleven New South Wales, which is a state, are living in cities, the capital answer. There were auditioning kids and I
elite like it was so bizarre and from from that experience I would go home every night after that,
God you rehearsal and maybe a couple of times a week after school, my parents were so supportive and
Has the training on the weekends I was so in love with his whole experience. Can I feel the right
I'll go home at night, and I would literally, I can't believe I do these started to be.
Meaning of the show and run through the entire thing everybody else's lines, every move, every every note
everything I'll. Do the entire showing my head. How crazy is that some people do that?
though, like you know, the whole show you what I mean
I have no idea what I was doing. I was just doing fantastic miracles. No one had said you know, try doing me. So you know I always being reported.
It's weird is very like I've known people that, like you know, you talk to somebody
Ike Rockwell and he's right. I read the script a hundred times all the way through MIKE really hundred having here. Ninety Eric laughed at a very low shit.
I thank you.
Yeah he's some. I'm saw him like a good answer. Man he's a bloody
working out his arm. He just didn't
he is he did just getting
jobs and just continue,
mislaying, brilliant I'd just and saw happy for that. Guy he's such a good person. Great! That's good!
yet the idea when people are happy for other people, I don't
Is that your both in a position to be happy for each other's nice Yonah yeah dead? You usually, like
when you can celebrate fucking celebrate exact yet
sure but like it, takes a certain amount of your personal,
being grounded to be happy for other people. I took a long time to be that way and I can't I,
can't do it for everybody. Everybody
now, maybe neither can I not generally, I videos
world next man rule one it's true true than
ok, so from from from them,
musical, but you did you studied you want to do you go to the school that everyone goes to nationalist,
She'd have dramatic, you touch your nose. I touch mine eyes, it's real thing, isn't it's like a younger,
Now, don't you were good. I would
before it's a three cause. I had done one film before I went then at the beginning is
second year I was offered a job because it's wonderful feed, a direct EU actually heels and expands as well. But at that point it anyone found was a guy called me. Longfield is a very great friend, an interesting guy,
yeah. But at that point I was a child and had no idea, and he was directing Uncle John here at the Sydney Data company which was performed at the opera house.
And so I decided to leave neither and go with whatever was being presented in Africa. Talk to somebody else. Who did that?
in Austria, the UK planchet go there
She went tonight, oh, but she did the whole course. She was a good service, Nook go there, I wonder, etc,
and I must say at the Toronto film Festival several years ago. I think
on the same flight, and I was with my agent and she said all that you know that's yards from strivings. Here's looking she was sitting down here,
I M sitting on the floor, desperately China cellphones work
and China organised, begins and videos like just getting my car.
Car. Rightly there we'll both from reject lacked, but my god she's, so good in succession. Everyone is so good in succession. I believe russian crazy shit. Oh wonderful,
I just enter via Karen he's a character.
I can imagine it is because he is what our so good
let's go so then, like I'm, I'm curious about these turning points and sort of like you
you started to at least connect with yourself through these characters gives you say your confidence.
The beginning, going in
to it that you didn't understand at that you're just a showman, I guess or show woman that you just loved it. It was if you
on the part of you. That's where you lived was up there right
but then at some point did did that confidence started
collapse in the other thing. Take over, did you or did you just right that all the way through school and uncle Vanyusha right into materials wedding? Where you just talking all
I'm I'm great
no who no now I'm grace I mean I'm always like
nervous and feel inadequacy, but no good
Partly my balls were bigger until gotta like I just I don't know where these bravery
right right right right. So why so yeah you were compelled to where there is no other way of life for you and the fear which just became just part of the way.
Why? If you chose, but it wasn't going to take you down some areas where a k that sense tat spread.
Create, I don't know, I don't know as a young woman, especially strain it and then all of a sudden as working away a loss in other play.
Since I always felt like a bit of an outsider, but I think that's a good thing. It kind of keeps you humble. I never felt confident in what I was doing. So I always worked really hard.
That's it outside here! Also special
Now here's the Australian
right is somebody it's now. It's embarrassing, but you're all pretty good. So it's good
there's no way. I act there, I'm yet to see like a shitty Australian who could have a that other guy that Fuckin guy just through I didn't realize you is Austria until recently that Mendelson fella, then wow fuckin actor that guy
my first veil was but then or seventeen really how
was he is anything is older than me yeah, which movie was that spots? Would yes, one look here with a scream I referencing left and right away?
we have really impressive. I just read a word
it was very, very imaginatively re titles
efficiency expert in America
who wants to see the efficiency expert at about the same.
Now people who want to see spots would
that's what it lays has a sense of humor
well, yeah me out and what it means, but you're gonna go like what is that she got to work
but I have any Hopkins and you first movie yet another
his assistant again, several years later, we were just going. Can you believe this in Hitchcock Hitchcock? That's? Why would she show bronze watchword?
I was too young to notice wow. I gotta know we ve been so for a long time, but I wonder so.
By some murals wedding was huge, and that was pretty quick. That happened pretty quick, yeah, yeah
I was twin. I turned twenty one during the shapes and then I spent a year travelling around doing press spirits and everything just changed yet was pretty fast.
You are that well or did you lose your mind, thereby yeah?
believe it about. It was really fun. So then you feel guilty for feeling we'd about it right, because you are just leaving the dream, mating amazing people and travelling in having great time, but was also you know. Her was a loss
because all these movies that you did
early on, like you it when I was reading about you, it's you.
We are fortunate in that you
ninety eight percent of the time you know you
performance will stand out, despite whatever the fuck and movie is by Sir
it's a real gift. You have that, like even at sea,
even when the movie is not great dry, but Don T go out was like an amazing sewing, that's great,
and you know any and also like you were fortunate net
some in the movies urine made a lot of money
a year. The tuna usually go together like great filming experience and then really well right, we're like me but like by
time. You get to this extent you're already.
The Big Movie star now why now I was now
in my mind, you weren't cry. They got away from me
around with your theory. Is so much more flattering
I don't know about the time six sends me: why did they? You know what I tell you? What happened? I
I had actually audition for Waste Anderson Film, which one rational.
Oh yeah. I love that. Maybe I love all of his movies of whites and
is produce rather time. Very Mendel, who is a good friend of mine, was also working with nice on the sixth sense. So when I didn't get the part
on rational one?
It was an issue about ass because I had shaved. My head, I had turned twenty five I was in May,
a gold was a lot of the
Miller involved and I saw a pudgy bob. His hand trusted it and showed my head.
And then I do not get that job rush.
But the same for Jesus was doing six answer. He got me in. He got me into Bosch with night and Bruce will ass was there,
But at the same time I was also brought into do build a gold mine had been at the Camp Film Festival and Moscow says he was the head of the jury that use a he came. He asked me to come:
in order to bring out the data film that he was making
there's really start working with money, because night was new
I didn't know human bodies and nine figure in a genius and who wouldn't want to work with him
So, at the same time, these jobs were kind of hanging around, and I didn't even you know, I didn't even read the sixth sense initially also so focused on working with
I ain't idea where you live and then one night ass jet lag. I write in New York and I thought that every description in trouble and then it absolutely floors me it was the most incredible thing ends.
A call all I had both meetings are gonna call my ages in UK
they offer on. I didn't even hear my scraped. I thought it was two months concisely bill, but ass. It was like
I was the right one to get
Because that's right, the ones corsage found that, like no one has seen its you haven't, seen it
but I have no reason not to
What is that had the job?
I feel really well, there's probably busy. But yes, I just felt.
I do not feel some it's an odd movie. I dont know what what what
happened to that movie I'd. I remember, liking it, but it s not memorable. I didn't think it
I'm sorry about this, a shaving your head business would be. That seems like a cry for help what the fuck is going on there
a gold mine. We were
spiralling was so much fun. Velvet got mine, my God
Todd hides a genius. He eyed. I love him. I talked to him
just and the loveliest person.
I think, he's making a documentary about. I just read about it. He is just finished a documentary on something that they actually
as far as I can remember, the subject matter either, but I did hear that he was during that year.
Like okay, so working with him like it was that, like waiting
I just felt like that they really cool kids at the back of the Boston is no, I'm gonna get his job. That's how I felt right with the velvet goldmine yeah and then he he key really.
He gave me a part and it wasn't like
I was not the obvious choice, let's put it that way, so I will forever be thankful for him giving may that job, because I just bloody laughed. It was so great we all have,
time. There lies a main its glam rock saves. Drugs
all the same young yeah
anyway I'll shave, my head five times to be honest,
shaved. My had once when I was, I was too young to deal with it. What what did Freaking out afterwards
like I dont like ours,.
I don't know like. I was in New York and as probably sixties,
I've always liked you, my twenties, but but,
I just decided, like you know, like that's the thing to do. I just get one those razor cuts and I really had a hard time
figuring out. It may be very
self conscious it didn't it didn't, did didn't free me. Italy did something it did the opposite. I'm sorry!
it's all right, I mean you know. I was kind of lost by the comments on your head shape
You don't know. What's up today,
this was sort of like who am I? What did I do what it you know. What am I made of now when I hear the blame
have is where do we go from here? Exactly terrible feeling? Have you have that feeling before not feeling I do? Let me do anything
You haven't me I know, but how? Why do you assume it's going to be good eleven, because
that's not the way my brain works
you could go away, but things can change. Even if it's bad
we get on who is in agenda drugs? For me,
like I just for me, it's just a panic music.
Who knows what can out I'm gonna take come gas at the dangerous. I know how it all scares me. I need to do so.
I myself meditating that reach me. I got so into I've disappear merged with everything that
They had stopped for several years
I was the blank swayed thing so compelling to you. If you can't meditate or take gas at the densher. Well, I can
right now. I went through period where I couldn't escape may because I disappeared.
Yeah. I think I can allow to allow myself to disappear to a certain extent and two because,
aimed at work but like tiny disappearing hideous,
anyway, I don't like the idea of doing any drugs. I don't. I just I mean I know there are benefits to doing my psychedelic and it can be really incredible. Go no one going! Imagine if guilty, you know
a depression, her anxiety early last year,
part of being alive, who doesn't have that dumb people look
here here you gotta feel at all is now around us.
I'm otherwise increasing out alive.
Yeah, I you know, I I have been sort of paralysed
by a certain amount of anxiety that turns into paralysis that too,
yeah then turns into a you know?
I've been able to get I get consumed with dread at times, and that you know that one. Some slightly as the worst yes, a tedious,
again it doesn't it it's not concerts.
It's that somebody said to me so much is said: a real nice,
to me actually, John HAM, like does
just checking enemy?
about Lynn? This is just like you know just a few days ago
I said. Well, look. You know he asked me how I was doing a said while not broke and I'm not sick.
I'm just sad and he said well that goes away said.
Sad doesn't stay around forever. I you close to you
so nice at him. I don't know
we're close, but you know he checks in sometimes
People have been very nice about you know, checking and with certain people. I like him, but like yours, very few people than I
I consider that I hang out with, like you know, I'm close to now that it was a new free,
and is Tracy, let's
who you are.
Naw man. Here
you played my husband in the real issue Joneses on Broadway. The willing I play yeah
he is, I mean, there's a similarity with you, it's what I was talking about earlier.
We sat down at lunch. He and
I can see hall and only goes well with the votes we gonna be spending a lot of time together. So let's cut the bullshit and mass glory was gonna with you in front of all
I love you so much.
It really really admire him. He is an incredible.
And I know that he has done a lot of work on himself and he just the coolest. What a writer
I gotta get him laugh in pretty good eyes.
Right when he gets laughing all my guy he's such a great gig le. When you re in
also another movie that I love that nobody talks about changing lanes? I love that movie areas.
I you know. I love that movie. I
Odin. I've showed it to people that don't love it as much as me, even with my passion for it. They don't like.
As much as I like. Your passion is generous enough to get people through war machine
poor guy, so it's really it's like it's in a movie I mean is in a movie, so I you know
If you're in it again, it's been a really long time.
If you about like it, seems to me that you know there there's a couple p.
Bull and I'm going to compare you to an american actress whose amazing, as well Alison Janni.
Oh my god, I love that woman, she's, reliable and two in the way way back. That's how I met her right. She placed
this, the saucy neighbour right now,
the saucy pickled neighbour. You guys should do it
We don T you announced and Janni because, like it just
seems to me that is both of you get. You know older. You get not only better but yeah the your ability
who to sort of take these emotional chances without any sort of second guessing, is like profound
In our view, becomes you calculated? It's just try it you ve gotta, just listen
You got like that in a knowing is the only thing I rely on that anything else.
What's to come into it? I realize I'm. Suddenly, offences are asking myself up in my head. It's all dutch, how?
you feel about this sort of like it seems to me that you're you're kind of being used or allowing yourself to be used or taking these roles and sort of I dont want to use a genre name of their kind.
The horror movies its I made
I've done. Actually, I dont know how many films have done. I have no idea now, but I've only done a handful of horror movies to be here.
I guess I guess that's true, but I guess it s sort of the parts in Nigeria. You rightly I'd. They are supreme.
The challenging bringing some kind of reality to that world is difficult, and I want a challenge
otherwise on board right. So that's how you see it bring something reopened.
At world I mean I don't even see hereditary tomato family drama. It gets yeah wiki rattlers at the end of that
I mean I just couldn't help it laughed with. It just seems totally removed from the rest of the film, and I think I worry asked the right. A director was very clever because he,
for the first time feature film maker,
and he wanted to do
something splashing, but in order to get noticed in Vienna opens models for yourself. I guess that children does things on it now sure I'm really it's an intense family drama for sure, yeah area and Gabriel burn. Certainly he such a great actor to leave us were with him
Was a great man right away, you guys, oh my god, what a great person guys you yeah! I get. So what about
stage staged you want, do more of that
No, I want to direct now right. Yeah
in office and things on Broadway, but I live in a stranger I can just cocky doing ass. I have done in our direct film, yet gap has grown. Are you? Are you
working on that. You got some things lined up things lined up a very good job on the very lined up army.
Exciting? Yes, why
It's an adaptation of a book by Graham, simply and call on the best about him shop and the films Chemical, the best of which will be an angel. He knows what can happen when hoping to shoot next year and you have your GDP
I do. How do you know from other movies? I did a film.
Dream horse last year in Wales, which was one of the best experience as an Ebay to wiles. No,
a man, it was never on my hit list. I'm telling you the people of beautiful it is damaging the places just unexpectedly beautiful. I will continue to go back.
Now all, but do this film is based on a true story about
A woman who kind of hills bit lost kids grow up their relationships bit boring and she'd. Have this history like training,
like having show pigeons and things like that when she was younger with her dad something she shared with dad
and she's decides she's totally broke, and
he's decides that she's gonna raise a racehorse, she's gonna break, bring the and
this racehorse goes on to be light, be the biggest. We know that, whilst seven nine and comes from this tiny little community, where she gets everyone in the village pudding and totally changes the community, it's the most people story, so anyway Eric Wilson, he shot. That is also going to
This is the first time I've been everyone said: go look at the monitor its suit.
I couldn't believe what he had done, literally just with the likely
That was a breathtaking zoning
well he's gonna he's gonna be shooting the film good choice sounds like a good choice.
It's norwegian. Now, of course, he's great you.
Because nor Norway, like I'm, a magic land. That's right! So I
I won't tell you this before we come, I I love you you're. He a huge fan. I like your work. I liked the movie
As I was just being argumentative because it challenged me- and you know, I demand answers and either
right but date by I shouldn't because there's no one's gonna Gimme answers, Charlie's, not gonna, get me answered. You're, not gonna, get me answers, but I eventually ok,
What I mean I certainly will you know I would recommend
The film you were great NIT Nit, Sir, it's it's it's a complex amazing movie, there's no way around it. It was great talk.
So what I'm gonna to do now is annoying.
Sign off kind of
say, is great talkin to you, because I know you got other things to do, and you're gonna say
Thank you market. There is a very fine. I've been a fan for a long time. I used to listen to you in the car.
And then you're gonna, tell me what the fuck that movie was about my marriage,
it is my pleasure. I you know what I would listen. She I listened to your show so often on my part. Isn't here asked me to do it?
Doesn't anyone asked me to do it so linen when I I was
the kid soccer match on the weekend splitting through an email about what I had to do today, and there was your name. My husband turned to me because my breathing changed. I was so like I'm gonna be doing.
But when I married life and all his days before I was gonna, take your
Kay about it because
Finally, I knew that you gonna, be you because you are, you are right it through and everything you do and there's nothing to be scared out, because you're lovely in the back yard
pleasure and I'm very very happy to meet you that's good, to meet you to thank you for doing it.
Ok, now what the fuck was that movie about
Ok, there you go, I put the time and see it maybe space it over to viewing
I'm thinking of ending things is now streaming a netflix enjoy.
Try to keep it together.
I will play now a bit.
our lives, says Monkey the fund,
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Transcript generated on 2020-09-14.