A guy I'll ride words do this: how are you what the fuckers, what the fuck bodies, what the fifteen years, what the fuck's authors, what the fuck public and a few of you how their how's it going what's happening. mare, and this is my pod guess what the fuck rats I just evening it up. I am back. I am back at the cat, ran back in the hills of high when park, where belong in my slowly crumbling casa, casa crumble what that means so today on the show, phil elbow room and mark me, ok two different musician songwriters- I didn't know much about either of them. This is the truth. This is how this work phil sent me his record. and in a bunch of other ones. Now I didn't know of him. I didn't

I know of his former. manifestation, the microphones You know about mount airy, I didn't know, I don't know anything about him. My my partner, I guess that's the wording to try out era had the issue of the microphones and inside there was a period of music there that I just was not. I was too old or to something like a distant, somewhere between two thousand and two and two thousand and twelve. I dismissed a lot of stuff was in his engaged, but she of the microphones and there is a world of that type of low fi kind of experts. Mental music around? But I didn't know of him and I got there record with a nice personal note and I into it. His new record, she called it released under the name out areas called a crow looked at me it's available now, and it would just one those moments where right out of the gate, the tone

the sound and the words in his voice. Just kind of struck me a very real way in a very deep place. I listen to it. There was a devastating record and yeah. I invited him on the show to talk about this deficit record, because the backstory around the record is is devastating by, but there was something you're, beautiful and poetic has as dark as it might have seen. And or might seem in subject matter, it was if we, human and- and I was interested in it and out in that was just a record that was sent to me. mark Mulcahy as well. Like I didn't know a lot about miracle legion. I wasn't a fan had no real knowledge of them, but I was sent some of his at one of his solo records and I played it, and I was right. This is this is a real do. This is a real guidest. Is there some depth to this this I've been around and he's got an he's got some depth here.

Like the music and I became sort of a fan of his give from his solo work, and that was Long time ago now is over a year. And finally, it sorted came around that data was around in an. I got him in here to talk to these guys. These geyser, I would say veteran through a certain we certainly mocha he's more casement all the while those not that old, he certainly been around a while, but I do know anything about them, but it was all new to me. These were two instances where the music came to me and and moved me a certain way, and I am happy to be open to that, and I talk about this a lot. I matters. juncture in my life, this age, where My life is what it is. Where there I done, it intentionally or not you! I am fifty three years old child list divorced I'm ok with money and now I've got a little time and it sort like what

what moves me? What brings me joy? What do you know what engages me? What are my responsibilities to myself and others. Yet, this point, my life and how the fuck do. I have a good time and I'm realizing that expectations are sometimes a little; you know you got, careful of em be careful, those expectations good ones and the bad ones this You can always expect an end cassettes inevitable. Butter and I get a temper that shit so so I doing age with music and and when it moved me, I'm happy about it now I gotta could talk to these guys this movie, often today show I'm not going to deny that their fill algorithm is here is most recent album? I released under the name, mount areas called a crow looked at me. It's about some very difficult and a heavy stuff about greece is an active are,

stick: expression of grief it's available now, wherever you get music, and this is me and phil having a conversation, the new cemetery records, iphones record the mount eerie records and then the new record, which is under mount area. It is, but canada is it's own thing, but yeah it's mounting, and I get a lot of stuff yeah that looks like stuff and he wrote me this very nice letter, and you know this, The matter of the record is obviously devastating, but I hadn't idea about the microphone I know you think about it. I put the record on. I was very taken with the new record immediately that does not always happen, and then I sort of yellow,

asked around. To my girlfriend in particular, who was a microphone spain and you know you are part of this- world of music and I kind of miss some that there is a buried there in the nineties. She was dating defender of now. Ok. There seem to be the bay area kind of five poetic I don't know how you would classify the music avoid having to but buddy you sort of fit into that spectrum little bit right? I suppose yeah I mean I've been doing it for twenty years, you'd be a fit in at different spectrums, different spectrums, different points in different items, but there was a period there where the microphones, which was primarily you it's just me. that's all just me, its mouth eerie, the microphones. It's all just me: yeah occasionally have collaborators but. I think of myself more is a descendant of the pacific northwest stuff grunge, whatever

oh really, which is young, other than that. I'm young right and nirvana know, of course, but maybe you grew up with it. I grew up with it that was my portal into this stuff. Really, oh for sure, yeah where'd, you live an accord. Washington, how far off from seattle like two hours, little s into our earth west north, its antiquated rise in this tat, san one island, so hung so yeah almost in canada, very beautiful. I love that does my favorite part of the country. Is the pacific northwest me to the weight of it I mean to me: it seems normal twenty by bite like even the your sound. You know you can hear it in the sound of people that from there, even nirvana re likely for me, like that, just the size of the trees the gray of the sky, the the jagged kind of

venus of the rock of the coast yeah it. You know the feeling that you're closer to the top of the world than other places it to me. It's like there's a poetry to it that dark, but not sad yeah. No for sure, so you're a kid seeing nirvana yeah! he knows in terms into hammer and stuff and in his most eighteen spirit, came on the radio. How old we talk, see that was ninety one. I was thirteen nea and I grew up outside of anna quarter. So antiquaries is a small town, but I grew up five miles out into the woods in a barn he say clearly and my parents were building our house when forever I was going to be forever. It took many years in my room was the first. They got finished, say move me into it and I was living in this construction site. One of my walls was as tarp flapping in the wind- oh my god, so that kind of off the grid yeah rural living. Well, it more twin peaks

to end also twin peaks was on tv at that time, and so it I remember watching it was when I was on tv watching an episode, but being so spooked me hey getting to stay up late to watch it and then good night. Everyone walking down the trail to my room in the construction site with the actual owls, and you know it was twin peaks- who's everyone. Oh my parents the parents who have a brother and sister as well, yeah yeah and So what what? What was the incentive of your family to go to the woods? Well, let's see my and were born in nineteen fifty five which makes them a little too young to be first wave hippies. back to the landers, so they are sort of second wave ok that exist right, so you know that it certainly does exist. They weren't hippies, but there are like fire this yeah,

pretty much in it. You know not so radically more. Just like hey this seems nice to go to a rural area will would you're dead. Do oh he's a mason, so he knows how to build things yeah pretty much. The is the house helstone yeah has this huge russian stone fire place in the core of it. fairly low around Gallia there still there. Oh, my god, It's in with your monday, she's a massage, a massage na. So very like that body. And stone gaudy and our earth people and their good people yeah like em. So what are they? Swedish My last named norwegian, so yeah, my dad side goes goes back to normal. Do you have norwegian accented relatives now, like five generations or something Did you change your? What is your last name, how you pronounce it again, just l from l from over me. I guess I wrote a downright well.

How did change it recently e l. Are you m? I you know that's what my parents right His name is, but I the traditional norwegian spelling has an extra ie and there he adds a town in Norway. So of europe l room on your own private, pluck, probably norway, they say elbow room. Also, you put the eu after the v room. Yeah I mean you know is I started putting it in there and I was in norway just so. I didn't have to have the conversation over and over about. Oh sorry, my name yeah, I know it looks misspelled right, It are any of your siblings music people not really now No not really make there's music by in a casual, amateur music in my family all the time, but you're not way that I am right and music people When did you? When did the guitar playing start, Well, yes around when I heard nirvana the idea on realise o regular people can make music to not just fine.

Hence we have looking people, I fear, may seem it that was really ya know, is really and re three eckert Cobain and those guys on the cover of rolling stone. Look like guys, regular people yeah exactly so and then from there I discovered the local record store and they were have it add more obscure stuff that I followed the thread back to you. No care records and more obscure pacific northwest stuff that, like my world opened ike, who else beat happening was very beg. My hearty known about kara So now, oh well, That's definitely my portal and what is near records kay when he had a label. Okay is stemming they still exist, but it calvin job then, from the and beat happening. I know the name beat happening and probably heard their songs, but I don't know that I don't have a record of theirs and I have a lot of records it's difficult to summarize, but olympia was the olympia.

In this. The nineties been happening early eighties. Ok right, they were like the grandfathers. The label seen up right, yeah, ok and it was like a particular version of punk right, phoenician of punk? That was not. It was not masculine who was more inclusive in there lots of different areas, so I came on after they had been going for fifteen years or something showed up and olympian was led into camp I had a great studio called dub narcotic studio gave me a key too, and that's how I ended up, making all those microphones records, searches. You in the city with your nylon on sharing guitar with all kinds of stuff a huge amazon drums. Just it is an amazing kind of I think calvin was gone. Four sort of Andy warhol factory vivier aim asked speed the forum of resources that's available for whoever in and who are the other artists around. When I is there a mere I was their modest mouse had some records on K, a hurdle to spill built

spill: low, benders red nets, yeah he's off the grid, he's up there. You fertilizing is plants with poop, I talk to you has been a few years. Well, imagine that doesn't shift and only gets more. You go further down that rabbit all he can't go back from that he's good player yeah. There have been so many areas of that that version of the pacific northwest thing sub pop as well I'm sure you came out of that. No us up in case came up concurrently, but rather to develop their own distinct. You no one is a seattle thing ones, olympia thing talking about, regional differences here and what? What do you see what he hears? Ironically, the differences are timely seattle was darker harder, huh a darker, more greedy yeah, more masculine, and olympia was more geared towards in his arm and others.

At girl thing that right all olympia right right, yeah? So you are for that I was there just after re girls I was there when it was sort of morphing india. Who knows what else- and I was just doing my own thing- I would request my songs at night, and it was very much like a solitary thing, has really under recording and being alone, and it right did you make drug guy drug, I know you're just sort of like very center. The weight of the world guy here You really summed me ever. Let's interviews over that you're no yeah that seems- or I am a sensitive weight of the world, the guy and Well, no, I mean you hear very merely I mean it resonates with me, and I I just didn't know the the music and I listen to like a microphones record. A new record. So you layer sounds

you know, but it is all you but yeah I mean you, don't you know you, you don't just play straight in and then that's the end of it yeah. I know it's a recording profit. Alright, let's start that was my of getting in the music? I was an inter writing songs, but I was so excited about this multi track record for track. Recording this idea that you could combine sounds so and you weren't into writing from no, I just wanted to record, sounds and get these as as like. Well, if I had a really low base, he thing than a high pitched thing and then sort of like fred, frith or something They are just like a layers of like a john kg yeah like using using the studio as the instrument, and I had to start writing songs just to have something to record and then then, how did you show up there why they were Jesus duty of you didn't even playthings has making tapes in my home town. Where were they

These noise experiments with beats to us ass, just really obsessed with it. oh yeah, I was called the microphones. He and my songs used to be a basic pre, amp, compressor either technology of really as into singing about gear kind of? metaphors about of a muslim sing about here's, how preempt works, careful about feedback sousa humour to it? no isn't funny whose it was already nature. A really good idea. I was about how, like the microphone, loves the speaker, but it's this sir across love and right where he sat not truly sat down in a teenager way near algeria. Thirty eight, now, Were you young guy, I'm thirty, eight so to me, but you may I thank you. So when you

where there are other the other musicians around. I know you work with some people, the island, a move to olympia from an accord a seer it was like moving into a world of making people doing their things and resources. because I heard women singing on one of the records I was into yeah. You have got friends, gave me some time yet made some friends over the years, but when start doing this and it became popular. I mean. How did you tour with it? Well, I just still gonna tour in this way laura with iron, but when it was mostly sound external ray we're goin. What would the microphones do out there? There were a couple of attempts to fling. Playing live where I would try and as looked like a one man ban playing a drum and a guitar and an organ it just people were laughing so because it was the desired effects cloudy. No, that's not what has gone for so I just said accepted early on that. I can't translate this and developed

That's why I started writing songs because it worked better when, if I'm going to perform in front of people to be communicating something, what did you want out of it? Did you if you didn't want to really write songs? What what was the evolution from your sounds to you know these gee or finding a great deal of relief layer. sounds like you know, there's something very satisfying, about having something because it open palette so, like can see it making sense as you do it any kind of wrangling these different layers and noises. It there's a real or Frustration to that doesn't play by any rule, yeah that agent has two to create at once. You hit that place where ship seems right it sort of like I live here, yeah totally, nuclear producing and composing, and the blurry ness between producing composing composing with just south.

with sounds and instruments and yeah or I'm gonna, take this piano and put the mic two hundred feet away and what what happens then yeah it's exciting, yeah. Of course that's not the type of record I just made, as I sort that I make like that. That are these worlds of sound and sometimes I just write some songs on the guitar make records like that. My girlfriend said that when she had a microphones record that you would do the white, there was some sort of fold out pop Webb thing that you made she had that one yeah. What is I was like words, my folder papa yeah, that was yeah that was my second album on K. It was hot. We stayed in the waters the title, and I had this idea that yeah it'd be a gatefold lp. That was popped up like a pop up. Alright, but my idea about how to die, cut them didn't pan out. So I just had to get a crew of people together and we hand cut him with exact or knives and glued together and took a month year of people constantly in my house,

and you know when it came to undermine the record, how many press aboriginal thousand young israeli labour intensive that is, waiver intense, so that was so I urge I wonder if you still has its like a rarity. It's a rarity in the repressed was not a pop what was it got. There was called it was hot. We stayed in the water as from two thousand and one we were well. How do you construct songs? I mean previous to moving through the feelings of this new record. I mean what was your process. I used very studio base I go in thus do have a studio in my an hour to vienna, Cordis and says it's an old church, music and catholic church. That's not a catholic church anymore, This is big beautiful room just go in there and explore the kind of raw ideas. What would it sound like if I put this thumping thing through the sub- four and right hit the gong over here and right plays organ and then thou its,

sort of wrestle. That idea into a song. Haha things are there, so the words are actually the final element more or less some midway through and then also singing about really kind of big. His slaughter metaphors, trying to make big step means about life and death. Universe law What were the big questions for you? Then? What does it mean to be alive? What you know? What's the point so you do have that current of malaise, well. No, it's not a sadness or melancholy. It's just the honest question. Yeah, it's an honest question. I know he asked every morning yeah seriously. I mean what, where we exist. Isn't that weird? That's basically my feeling right, but some people seem to have a good time yeah. I have a good time. Do you yeah? Often in fact the fact that I get to make the task these questions and make this music. That seems like

I'm doing pretty good. Did you ever get to a point where you like I've got closure on me? What's the point thing died out. I mean what would life be like then. I dunno relaxing enlightened avian right here. Did you grow up with any religion? No, no sooner than have that hanging over here, too, to maybe a jump back to it necessary? No, I don't have any of that. I've maybe try to live read buddhist books just to see if that collect with media novia. Some of it did in like a poetic way, maybe but not the actual. I'm not gonna. Meditate to get an lightened, and thank god it makes me anxious. I get the opposite effect from adaptation, I don't get the enlightened. I get the sort of like. Oh my god, why honestly don't know if I believe that in lighten men as a real thing now I mean team a little bit like believing in Heaven, which I'll ask don't believe in

leaf for you right? It's trick. You plan yourself to get by yeah and age and people be critical of that Emmy that you can live in the tracker resort to it occasionally even gets the deafened that different, twin spirituality and religion right, yeah totally like when, when do you use it, or are you just always in it, if you're always in it, then yeah that that becomes somewhat of a I don't know I've been having these conversations, why they don't get any closer to god here and we can stop. No, I don't mind so when did you start working with her meet here, your wife, an errand. Thousand three genovese if ye ashen bf envy of the ashes, french, canadian or from more part, she was montreal montreal kid how'd you meet her her dad

It was english canadian. So he lived in Victoria, which is really close to an accord us to charity miles year. She was setting up, shows there and met a lot of people that I know through music. She was a promoter. Now she was she's a graphic novelist. Cartoonist she's got some books on droning quarterly that publisher there I let em. She was also musician, windsor lesson cast ray Yes, a pen name yet it yeah should give countries and am so yeah I met her through setting up, shows there and she offered to set up some shows for me- and I said yes, please set me up as me. As you can, we ended up going on this little tour together around the all those islands around vancouver island, little town love it up there yeah it's very beautiful. I want to live up there, yeah yeah you can. I can invite the let me so you felt instantly drawn YE. I mean even before I met her people that new both

ass forcing a fair way to meet this person? It's gonna be crazy. They were getting people just oh yeah, we were well suited for each other, how it goes Did you worked together to do the? Did you how we're? How did it starts? move down diana quarters? What happened here? pretty much mean it was. We went a hundred percent all the way we're like. Let's have kids. Let's be we hear my person forever. It was like gas certainty which out three, two thousand three a lot but we knew or freaked out there fell, whose person are you sure, you're gonna get Mary. This is so fast. How long were you married thirteen years? We we I married pretty much right away, yeah on leap day in two thousand and four will partially because she was canadian. So so she could live with me. It's funny cause now and I want to go the other direction to canada. yeah I mean when that was our plan just to leave the

Two thousand three was also a terrifying time. yeah politically in same wars happening, but We just couldn't figure out where, in canada to move and after a long time sitting there trying to figure it out, we realise our well. Yes, we live here hopes. So what did you? did you guys create music together, not so much. Swearer, both pretty stubborn, sir. terry, we may alone, tight people and doubts. our together that the one thing it struck me I put their record on because I didn't, I don't even know you said what happened in the no. You just said that your kid is warning to talk from hearing me talk here. What's your kids, I got a again and I thought those very sweet and then- and then

the record on and which is like a I think, the first song the item within first two lines, you say death is real or is at the first as the first sonya death is real, the air. and I was like all my guy what's happening here and there I can but then, like you, didn't, wake up. Once I realised as each song went through and there are very descriptive, I think more descriptive in a way that was related to real life than the other record. I listened to. It was not augmented. Anyway, there was a narrative rate while there was a shift, talking about how to tackle these big questions and use metaphors via this new record. All of that was like. Why was I thinking before? What how come Give me to train talk mortality

what did I know? Well, you all well was speculative vienna, it's what you may not like you, knew anything, but you know something none of us know about in terms of experiencing it first hand where he's, but if something were heavily aware of in and who are managing a certain lack of itself. cancer terror moving towards some sort of acceptance of it. As we get older and you just got delivered a very premature blow, yeah oh wool power your daughter she's to just over two? So when When did dumb see you had you had this child in your wife was an ill no. She went in just four regular check up like a post pardon for months thing and little abdominal pain, the heart of the regular doctor, and it was like you know, o business.

specious, looking little thing here, we're gonna do this other task for you and then that tests lead to more. Suspicion and just within the space of a few days and a few scans like everything crumbled, isn't it was insane so that there is a diagnosis within days, yeah! Well yeah. Our local doctor. This the scans and we're like waiting Inclusive, we don't know agenda of like. Could it be cancer is it cancer and the doktor said likely I am so sorry do and talk to the chaplain I have to go somebody's giving birth It was just a very bad social from down Those are not good at daddy ass. This one Wasn'T- and so What we hung on that word likely for ten days until our next appointment, where we are going to seattle to get the actual biopsy and were like what did she mean likely and what to chaplin or I was what art is.

she gonna die. Psych. Am I trying to put it out of our heads over at ten days, has very weird. Ten days but then yeah? She went to seattle and was confirmed in We still, then it really we this baby, you know we brought the baby to the appointment near to take the bad news. the doktor in seattle had to? How is he here good? I could tell he was just horrified at his job that data around colleges. He was a yeah surgical college so here We are going to him to confirm that this tumor was not surgically removable manner spectable. It had grown around is pancreatic cancer, so had grown around her from vessels ma. Am

I used to know so much about this stuff, but am actively trying to block it how'd sure of my mind but yeah. I remember these days very vividly- and I remember specifically having this crying baby in my arms in the doctors office. As he's like, I know that The baby there was making. The rawness of his job that right harder, the area, so I kind of feel sorry for him. Now gotten a babysitter that day, but we just were our mind frame was like idea I still can't be that bad they're gonna tell us good news today. Thinking positive sure, trying to live your life trying to leave our life. We are a new parents and we're just on this other path and So then you get this confirmation and the reality shifts in the process of acceptance must be horrendous. Yeah. I might get. I don't want to know it and want to. We just strove home. This kind of hazan with this, my baby

what was the prognosis, the way they talk about. It is possible. Thinking and optimistic, but we also were like looking at the statistics on the internet, which is not great, not good. To do maybe like a logical rank worse but can help yourself. Help ourselves and my mind, has this thing can't turn off where I just have to like prepare. Get ready for what's likely Ben. I might have some control yeah yeah, so through all of it I've been trying to act positively and think positively. Well, at this time in the back of my mind, preparing for the worst case is true, Why was there any possibility of treatment. I mean was diego's who's, that sort of like we gotta changed die. We gotta yeah fisher. She started. Chemo right away, and we there were some eggs,

mental surgical techniques that we ruled out. First, the hike different yeah we very quickly, went into the world of cancer. alternative cancer, stuff and mainstream cancer stuff, and up and coming like amino therapy alma different, like lace, surgeries at this place in cleveland. Nobody, ass, a hundred thousand dollars would blah blah blah here, just immediately india world an end. Was it a time frame then, and they never and no pointed anyone tell us you have this amount of time to live cassettes. That's a fast cancer is an she lasted longer than she was both do, I think I mean, even though they never told us well from from the point of diagnosis, to her passing how long was fourteen months, I think, oh, my god is, he there are some time. Yea wasn't good time. I mean account, it doesn't count because she,

got absorbed she transformed into a different person What I shouldn't say it doesn't count. That's too heavy but yeah like what kind of person is fuelled by the the kind of aggravated optimism and need to yeah yeah, I mean When I knew her when I met her and when we lived together for all those years She was like a kind of confrontational sceptical, hard core punk type nea. and in you like that, comfortable with pessimism and negativity, in fact most of her. Music art that she made was about like embrace the darkness row k process this stuff get into it to it up, don't get lost in, like rainbowy via positively

but then shut out. That's not quite like either a year a little more I'm into the dark too bad. You seem to like I'm a bright demand today. Here are you to ethics? Ok, I get Angela Syria, but then she and in two part of what happened to her through the desperation of like trying to eliza? Was she embraced a lot of stuff that too, He didn't seem like her right. Well then, I guess a yo yo yo you'll forgive her thou for sure like. Why, like what like, for instance, everything she did, everything she tried every she got into unicorns and angels and a thorough and all kinds of extreme diet. And she just tried everything and I I I need to be careful talking about that stuff, because yeah don't blame her at all? Who knows how I would react and transform it just was disorder

pointing to live with. I think you're just trying everything yeah, I think like when it would seem to me that one one becomes. a terminal that you know it's it, it's a type of its very hard to due to be giving in any way. I would imagine because yeah I mean the struggle to to. to find a way to survive verses, you know, being there for other people scattered, be tricky yeah. It was ok, for her to be absorbed into it. It was sort of like the stated roles that we I held down the house. I took care of the kid yeah I did. Shopping india, She was like. In her studio, drawing sometimes but mostly just listen. two like meditation ends on youtube and terror readings over the internet from people

doing all that stuff. How would the taro readings I don't: u remedy, I don't know I'm at a sort of turn the other way. Honestly, I was supportive, but our taking care this kid. I was buying, groceries and like calling needs. Company living in the hard realities oh right, right and so yeah. I was disengage from that stuff just a louder, this phase out of necessity for sure for her, but also for you to do all the other stuff. It really helped her? I think I think that a lot of that did prolong her life. at the same time it wasn't her and she was resorbed into staying up late. Just in that world, but yeah. But I guess I imagine, if you're just hanging around panicking too and doing the same thing have been good. There's, probably the distance in that way of practicality was probably helpful

I suppose so I regret having to say like stop doing that matter. Like wait, I've got, I found another taro reader. It was more like the reason why it's even an issue is that it was more that she wasn't available to have any sweet three person. Family time right she was inaccessible. to our daughter and those hard and sad. But understandable, but understandable. Oh yes, I complained about this stuff and forgive her for it prevention even talk about what happened when when it when she became physically hill, I mean did to the change. That process yeah she her body transformed so pancreatic cancer at digestive cancer, so she couldn't digest I would also her body was she was kind of starving and she got very skinny and then she was doing chemo as well, so that contributed and she had no hair

then she got jaundice amuse the whole the whole thing and war did. She find any solace in the child. oh dear, oh yeah, tons yeah I mean she was, keeping her alive and waterways and then should be. I was working on a book fur for our daughter that was at droning cordially, put out she's working on my aboard book kids book, although its very heavy causes unfinished, it's mostly finished, but she didn't finish, it was a book about a mom whose trapped in this bubble- and this kid wants to play with them, with mom sorry a menace bubble. Ass. Very heavy disunited. Aren't you still here? its illustrations. You know cause she's a cartoonist, so they're like, though paintings the sixteen pages very beautiful and then and then to the book as the bubble pops mom walks away and can breathe freely. She's no longer hooked up to the oxygen tube in

she's, drawing this with oxygen to punch over her death. Just trying to lake get the last page is done, and she didn't finish. You finish it and we're gonna publish it in that way. So you know a fucked up kids book I don't know what apparent is going to react to their kid it. You know it needs to come out we're so Were you, the primary caregiver yeah and then we had a big crew of people. and family that were helping allowed too, and she passed away at home, yeah yep. We brought a hospital bed in hospitals and everything. she tried chemo a bunch of different times. She even we went to hawaii a year ago. Cut seems like so long ago, but it's a year ago from like now and to do this, some natural path, perfect retreat, which turned out to be a big scam but anyways that possible

horrible revelation. It was horrible, but at that point was like just money, whatever near? We have figure issues right in and like so. How long have you been gone July. Ninth. She died so less than a year yet lesson here: yeah social, I dove right into this like making this record and go. back out into the world quickly. I dont know why did that my kind of do I was living in this under these restraints of, like being apparent being a caregiver. Well, you know when I listen to it like that sort of, like the kind of interesting in in an daunting thing about it in you know not not that it's a real,

will comparison but after mice who, after my second wife with me, you know I I was working through it as it was happening. Publicly. Cosette tie work through and. I don't know who is a good decision or appropriate necessarily by it, was what I had to do in like when I listen to the record, which in a really starts seems like you started. Writing that stuff fairly quickly after she passed away yet because it was all those questions that you seem to have had many seem to have been answered in a very sad way. And very real, like your death, is real that that you, that is

not surprising thing and intellectually, we all know that. But the tone of of that first song is that it's real and down in there is oh, I can prepare for it, and- and I and I didn't expect to happen now mia, but I've been living with it coming for a year Why, and also that the version of death That is real in real life, like an actual person dying, is a completely different thing then, that the death, get sung about an orange like reflected in art and music and talking about eight and literature. The actual experience of the thing is kind of unsaleable right. You said it all. Why attend I too, but I dont know I still think it's unsaleable its. I still feel, like my record, is the same thing is feeling if corner of course, but

but the immediacy of it and the details in the poetry are very their sparse, but very pointed nea and- and I think that does have you know like I can't feel you fell by, I can feel you fell in. You have your feelings and I understand yeah you. You know it's not it's never going. The same marie no in your heart really from the physical vessel. What that feels like but am, but you can certainly like you reckoning with it, media and guess. What I can say is that you have given the time frame. Given you know that they need to arm to get out. And be part of the world and to do to put these songs together party, your grieving process, I don't know the year. I don't that you're done of course, and I think there is a done no, but I mean like I think, like you know why,

I was the feeling I got that you're, like I've got to have these feelings and, and I've got to put them, I've got to get some control over that year, and these are the songs yeah, But I mean how is your life I mean: do you down there It's really like she's out she's gone yeah, Of course there are, there are those moments still they are becoming more spaced out that those Realisation moments I even harsher. Is this more just weird surreal? Like me, I can believe it is actually real. It's not a conceptual thing. Did you break down? Oh yeah, lots all the time. all over the house- and you know my daughter, just papa crying and again, I am cranked. Ok, she's just uses to it. It's been awhile. I've had it. She held her she's young enough, that I she's kind of oblivious to the existential aspect, but you know she's gone, did you remember

I don't know she'd like she hasn't quite put. Together, yet she who mamma s and she was a europe when she was a year and a half, but also just Pictures of her round rouse unitas presents right and people talk bout her yet so she's a person that this? My daughter knows, but I'm just a person. She had never seen a friend that went on a long, interesting because she's probably not going to have anything to hold onto now it seems, unlikely the actual memories right people often don't have, and although this kid is an incredible remember so, who knows here and what's your plan man? Ah I don't have a big plan, I mean in terms of music and stuff. I am I and planning on making more music. It wasn't planning on making this album. Funny thing. I thought of music was like

are irrelevant to my life. I was, I just get some job and seemed like self indulgent refocused on creativity in the way that I have been in the past, but it's I put on another level. You have sadly, and it's a it's a pretty like it's a beautiful record and it's a brilliant record and it's an honest record and an down somehow or another connected you to something very. non intellectual does has gone far. Why me You know in also I to handle that to manage that on the record and have it not be like as a listener. You know I felt part of your process, but I didn't feel levelled or sad for you. You know

You know I felt like I was being carried through the experience. Of something: that's very human and very tragic but but part of life. yeah sure you know your process, how anyone deals with grief and the actual loss of somebody. No and in that's it, that's not an easy thing to do is pride. The best writing you ve ever done. I feel that way. Thank you. Thanks for others. Compliments here I mean it I'm proud of it I'm terribly sorry for your loss. It's a devastating thing! Yeah! It is. I didn't think through any this and conceptualize it. I just now I m out of me this way. We I feel that it was a sort of like dipping into a stream that was already flowing, but your impulse was to map to deal there creatively, because that's where it that's what you are that's true at once

I started coming out it was. It was feeling so good to work on it to work on the songs. I would run up to that room whenever I had a chance and get you know, get back to work on it. it was just feeling so therapeutic, oh yeah, because you, you literally sort of answer these questions? You know if those those stages of I have a grief: in our real which they are, it feels like no they're, all in there do you know I I don't know in a jumbled up order, yeah well, I'd be, but kinda I mean I, you know, I I think that there's a lot of things that are going to keep coming back yeah I mean, but I I Imagine that you know your denial is done now her. You know. Acceptance may be rocky, but it's there right, but you know depression and anger. Those upright gonna come at you

yeah that's for a year whom I make an angry record. Next sounds good. As the designs lake creatively fun, why you didn't experiences Oh sure yeah. I think I mean we had a year of pre grieving before she died. The only thing about prolonged illness, yeah- and I have friends who have their partner abruptly car car accident or and They don't have the advantage vanish. So weird word to use, but it's true that I felt Like I'm further down the path right and then then somebody has that's the interesting thing about in this was not as long as long term. Illness can be now and she was you know, had her mental faculties yeah. So you are afforded that opportunity to

to have those conversations ya, although she wouldn't acknowledge mortality. She she was She don't want anyone to talk to her about the possibility that she might die. She thought all the way till the end, the till her last breath. It was that that's who she was fighter said he didn't change. Yeah. That's true. I mean an that's my proof for that and all this stuff that she kind of this new outfit she put on of rainbows unicorns, wasn't really her assistant desperation. but yeah she rushed for all other some here. He right. Why? She didn't amazing job of having answer and dying near here Well, that's a weird sentence, but like she did incredible, she did really good at having at doing chemo is best friends with all the nurse says she was just so she knocked out of the park. Grace yeah.

She died really well, even though Rather she didn't. I hear you do you want to do a song? Ok, which one do you play? monday like to play. I was gonna, see ass. These new. Songs No, if you wanted whatever happy with you know. If there's a song from the record that you know you find to be thing that you like to play. Am I play? they'll pay sancho forest fire it it's a good is relevant to the stuff. We talked about. Ok, sounds good. Okay, I'm gonna close my eyes. While I sing okay and I'll just watch the eleventh kitten, don't watch me, hmm

you were there Is there a head in windows and doors without coming through a cap for his arm but maybe calendar, no The

the lingering heene way. Then I remember late august or open bedroom window going through your things, with a fan blowing in the sound of helicopters and the smell of smoke from the forest fire that was growing below laying just on the edge of town where we used to swim. They say natural cleansing, devastation burning, the understory erasing trails. There is no, and but when I'm kneeling in the heat throwing a chair under where the devastation is not natural or good, you do belong here or reject nature. The desert

in the hazy smoke. I looked across at the refineries and the world was actually constantly ending and the smell and roar of the asphalt truck that was idling just out the window. Tearing up our street, I missed you, I remember thinking that the last time it rained here you are alive still and that the same long enough that I was in once contained you and then seen me know in the window next to you on your last morning, so you can breathe and then the ghost away

So the stop whispering. In if the grinder I'm not where folks at mass. Green, walking around sever we saw tee reasserts it. So I don't want it though

and being trail. Why that's great? Thank you if you are yeah. Thank you were coming thanks for having me with great media now, likewise, does the uniform, You have allowed them and I dont. I'm sorry. I had to go through what he went through, but processing it and elevating it through. The music helps everybody. I really believe that's true so this guy martin. Ok, he is,

he's got a record outs called the pass him in the driveway and get it wherever you get music he was formally and sometimes currently in the band, a legion scotty of a beard right now, anyway, his hat here, but I was, Will they get it back to him who also performing the album, the possum in the driveway in its entirety, three shows in the northeast at the end of this month parlor room in northampton massachusetts on june, twenty first lyric hall, or a new haven connecticut on june. Twenty. Second, I think I played there Joe's pub in new york city on june, twenty seventh I've played there a nicer good venues where markham. Ok, he will be performing the entire the pass him in that driveway album! I was absent. To amend it was fun to hear him sing and play guitar. So this is me and mark.

mulcahy the dunno where I got it, but somebody sent me dear mark J Mulcahy. I love you at a nowhere, and I listened to it- and I was right. Jesus crisis is great found a very moving somehow very honest, some earnest music yeah yeah, thanks yeah. We think and I was like what am I right in that way, you know was one day of recording for each on What is needed most does nail this song today, now any waiting till later on and bring in the other guy later a really Zero, positive you like I own I after I did. I didn't think of it. Does not know that smart but like after I did it ok, we're always moving forward. We're, never going back to fix the thing and never backward. Also, today it didn't have some it so was eggs are different.

a positive, usually laying laying everything out of this and then the other guy's gonna come on tuesday and a list of things you want to do. But everything was done, That was great. I was wished to make europe that is still took a year, a house, like the ways a ride out one day of higher, but it was real forward moving. You know- and I really I haven't done it since by well. That's all did that a register because that's what registered to me is that I didn't I I kind of new miracle region in You know you were a any. You seem like a wholly formed guy. I get into any research and you know a lot of records, so put it on, and I was like who the fuck is this guy and I think I tweeted and I think we talked on twitter a bit but but So I very immediate did it felt emotional it felt like it felt like it was happening. So it's on glad that my ears read well that you did that I mean he did it all live to tape or justice session was all in one day the session was in the uno. There was lots of overdubs, but we would yeah we'd keep going and then

the guy that has was working with had hanging, he would say, sounds pretty good mama. It sounds pretty again wasn't really let em right, fizzy, fizzy faustina sooner So there wasn't in. That was an intentional method to to stop you from from over analyzing. Well. The thing was the record that I am your company. Now is a record. I had all kind of made before amid the record you're talking on march him. Ok, We had that record all done, but it was kind of older and I thought you know a kind of having made a record on time and I'd rather make an immediate record. Reiner wrote I'd like right, the song, ludwig roar. I just felt I wanted to feel like I was coming from the new. You know the the phoenix me you know sure up and ryzen out, so it was like new material and the love. The other record, which that's, why put it out, but inches was better to do so. I may times if you phoenix.

Because I didn't playing with miracle engine and yoda than I was our quote watch my air quotes are, ask ever, but we put our ask eg ever you times, yeah the governor of rock and roll is whatever but may I point out was but that one, the the one that I I latched onto dear. Mark J Mulcahy? I love you. How was at the phoenix? So I can. How did you feel like that like? Well? How is it different that life wise Well, I haven't you know, so what happened was yet I mean it. I think people know, but my wife died. And I have we had two kids, so I stopped doing anything for probably for years didn't played in

record and make a record didn't. Do anything. Sorry to hear that yeah. I know I will have him. She just just dropped dead, no warning! No! No, nothing! It was pretty shocking. You know yeah, so that was just a that's a that was a place where you I had an obvious. She had totally different thing to do, but still had the brain I always had, which was just keep, though you know Yannick, music right and so it was kind of a real. Crushing of my normal self to do a thing that I You know I was happy to do good. to arrive at but and finally is that okay, I'm gonna I gotta get in. I gotta get back to my brain. You know he asked me to do this other thing, yeah and that's the phoenix part is that I just really wasn't. I was, really clear like what was going to happen to me. but I've made records. I've always made records, even though I really didn't have any chance of success. You know I was there would make it and hope.

Yeah. I never made one thinking. This is the one that's going to be possible for me. You know it. I would have made it anyway and as stupid mistake and well. I guess I think there was sort of like a I. I think that phoenix idea just moving through grief, You know using that too to process it did to using music to process it. I mean it works right. It. You don't like the one a long time ago. This is boring, but I was playing baseball. These guys, I say baseball and I play baseball as a kid and like a let's play. Baseball and the guy had ball and I just started run like a mental kosovo. Was ten years old like it still in your head, you still one do the thing that that yearn did data lot yeah so This was even bigger for me and so yeah it was it. something about just given your brain, the chance to do what it wants to do. Instead of trying to make it do some all the time that it

wanna do or it doesn't get on your mind or near whatever, whatever one of those things but do then you want to do than your branches. We remind honourable jack, but one of the other about your heart. That plan Hmm. I put a lot into it. You know jack out for me like best part of of your music, I love to sing by love. Writing were writing lyrics that and I put a lot of my have self internet. into the lyrics, even if they're stupid, I still want to be good stupid or good, silly or good whatever. So I put a lot of it into their and so that that's where my Then, when you're done you go in that all ads in a good way or no that was d right when you ideas it s, sort of like a bits and pieces or dick I find cause like I'm in your songwriting is pretty pretty amazing. very moving I'm new to I knows his sound weird, but I'm sort of new too to actually paying attention to leave.

meet me to someone it may do the certain guys I do, and then I mostly Y know really know. Is that weird when you put on some songs. They ve been known for thirty years ago. I really know that there are no one one bit it if I had no idea and maybe the chorus and I'm probably not getting it right used by but like you know you, you seem you like in a really capture something in any its emotional, but it's all went went out. Did you guys start? we started were re and I raise the guitarist missionary pepe, because he was the guitarist. And we had Ben the side, bananas- I I was a drummer, I started as a drummer, so he was a drummer. We were the guitar player in different bands and then we thought we'd just try to do our own bed. Yeah try to write songs, We never had done anything and in what ways allegory Kenny twenty some meal.

and what was going on a bit like what were the bands like what was driving you because, like you, guys, certainly fell into a world right? I mean that was the first wave of I guess what they would call turn of rock the college rock. It was a great time. Actually it was gang afore for us, the gun club We really must only beginning, we really model herself on the gun club. I know you don't run down there, s record, like I'm preaching that we try to fire of love totally YAP, love that guy he's on other donor, but He is men and that record was really the best record. He became a great guitarist I just Yeah refer, you know before actually yeah before I was in miracle legion, we re and I and we promoted a lot of shows when you know he did brought a lot of bands in new haven. You did yay

we really did a lot of promotion and I learned a lot. I learned a lot like what is so all interesting see: gangs of people, man, you ran the thing you are like we're, bringing the new music to new haven t. I would go to the say, look. I can get these bans. What values Well, the saddam the great american music hall was a place in Nguyen. Maybe once somewhere in hartford, but on a steadily at a place called the grotto or the bridge. there's three where the rises, but this was like nineteen eighty. Later than I was like it was sort of a big willing. I did maybe well whenever the replacements I have the replacements for, like you know, when they were unknown or areas? I too have any actual beyond that to be unknown. I did miss burma! Oh yeah, every time they came here yeah pursue

But I did, I fell into, like all the california hardcore came through video black flat. India, away and dead kennedys, and it was at that at the time were that we were still like kind of word of mouth punk rock, like he, you know a gm cause. I talked to a lot of cats. It I guess it might be a little later than that, where you know most workers and carry that shit, you know right. So They have to find the one guy who would carry those records or, like a lady, on guys they had to get the british records from adieu. Yet it was a kind of subversive world of punk fans that would take care. Each other's or were you on the the kind of like a male list. Of liking do work. You know a place we can play that. Can I was that guy, but I wasn't a punk arising. We had suits on. We were like area you're doing the more kind of aided by them. It's quite a mess, fits all right right, but more british trip. No, no, but but but why would I I some of those were the guys I'd get calls from. You know, get a call from I dunno

I don't know. I worked with a couple agents. I would have liked I don't like the feelies or something wow. I love the feel of bongos yeah, all that kind of stuff, all the stuff that was around yeah. Everybody would go on tour and there's was a finite number of band so easy to manage the holy or the point guy in new haven, yeah yeah, and so I learned in oh, I learned a lot about. I got in I don't really know about touring that worked or whizzing what it was, and so I shall things that helped us do kind than we might have done. I suppose you what about sound Why did it influence you that way? Not so much now so are what we while we were thinking about trying to do, we were doing we're doing like jays says this, yeah. I like people who go to the end of their ability to adding or anyone just go to the end of our abilities so you didn't have any driving influence. We had this idea like

we never sounded like we never see, but queen was a band that would do any song any kind of song right. So that was the openness of yeah how we would think about it. If I went one way or another, it was fine right, so we were never here. We got sort compared to orient milan I do. I read thereby didn't hear it. I think we set, we see, seemed like them, but I know that we sounded like them. That was my definitely had a little more of that thing that that we use it was named ray There is something more to read, mr re. He had. There is something I could hear from his influences in there that are aimed at do not do that. Mainly we had it. We have to get a plane with him because he knows it's clever. We know we could point twenty go and we ve been playing and, like I just finished yesterday in so glascock the alaska of history, and so so we had a, we do, have it we still. We just have a you know that thing that he hadn't played with him in twenty years. Not really no, and then you guys got together. We all got together the four of us.

What about the other? Two guys did you play with them? I well that the tv show ban that was Palermo Arusha. So we did that and that's what sort of open the dorothy? What about we get rags re wasn't in belarus. We re was just out Was ours and I we well. I don't have much to do until like everything, but we are assigned to a record label out on your eye all that our guy like here in those stories, because I think that a lack of basic you, you know they're, just this weird like demonic, element to the record business of of your values, the ice two out of cats, who are you in the music business in the eighties in an earlier that you just become sums if nightmare and you lose your freedom somehow. So what will you like to teach or just do what you want to do one way or the other he he yeah well. I did happen to us a meme most of the time that we were just

mumble along and doing a record as often as we could, but then we did get to the point with that label. I was going to say, morgan creek, that we couldn't get out. I mean they just wouldn't. Normally you just get released and that your that's your bomb out in a re wooden release us- and we were just stuck with nothing- so did surprise, surprise her, as in now I know we did that we were whooped for a while. We were on rough trade, which he a good record as a great liberal yeah we did, we did to two or three records with them and an e p and I was all good it and then they went bankrupt. She they. You know, we were here, we're just parties, things it didn't work, they went grubbed and then we had nothing but like that. With age time what we do here, we were never gonna. We never said I mean it's not working for us and we just always genesis, doesn't feel stupor than being like that. But that's what it was we just kind of what always keep on and we had this kind of tenacity or something not toward success, but just like, let's keep it

and what was it like? You said before, like you, I got enough. That's some! You ve grown into this red. What do I want this sum? Resignation You know you're not going to make the big record you're, not gonna make a hit record, but when he started imagining Think we ever had that idea. I just don't think we just didn't. Think of it. with him so are unlikely to have this was attacked When the bans are having had records, were you know, I don't know, over something here. It was theoretically in some story that nirvana just bludgeon behaving like a bed, but there were made at that time. I was sort of the beginning of the college, charts right sure yeah, we wanted to do better, believe me, and will we fired and thought and tried and now so and we had energy is here and there and we will try to these things and we itself. Have you know man, you know it's like this, so much love.

Can timing and you meet the right guy? Isn't areas robot and you're the thing people want, So we say that you know I don't William Hootie and the blowfish for ages. If anything, they didn't try to do anything, but the act, and they just was the right right on the top of the wave at the right. Second, you know I like at some point you had to let go of hooty in the world because we have seen in in my time of no liking music and then be when I like music, and I just wasn't a musician. There was a better that was sweet time to me for you, europe has different and you'd there's times when Something comes along like either our shit, that's with that's what it and I went to see them at this like a radio station. jingo, along with all these new ban, the air and they pay as I am I have added at so although you know- and I I mean I'm not trying to insult them, because you know now, of course, I'm sure nice guy, Zubaydah break I'm gonna. Let us acknowledge this really

and it was I care it is, and then they started its really elevate. Unlike holy shit, man, I'm no chance skin none, and then that just goes away. You know and then there's another one after that, yeah yeah yeah. I think so we all you know me and we just kept or chauvelin, so we got on this morning. Who's gonna tell you that we got a more concrete and they want. I don't know They were doing many. They made up a label to release the robin hood soundtrack basically, and they sign up bans, and I we wish robin hood that were carrying hasna and so that's what it was Well, they were film company, they were the film company and they made some good movies early on right by it, but the so they create a record label. Worry what was the radio record with all the guys from the old labels, the guy the head of the company was the guy the company. They opened the doors with gold workers everywhere where, but it was and started bob see, you're going back to the area and the head of the company was the guy

who arranged and is a great deal to amazing. I sang with arrange them the beatles in the swimming pool in hollywood picture, so he has, His credit he's your own bat want to say that he was. He was going back there, person bomb with yeldo, yet guy that you suggest you, so that was their press there. worker. We got we rob come on came we'll go and hard core, but they didn't have any clue. Really. I don't think so. We can get out anyway and that just did you make a record with m made one record we prepared another record and they never which nothing. What what? What? What is it? What what? What? What do you mean? They couldn't get it out? they have no distribution. They didn't want. Is a row of savings on children were now original. an hour ago. Fundamental for men. We know where we are. This is what we have is that we have

yeah, yeah you're all happy, and so we went for a couple years. I'm I came out here. I'd come out here they had a place there. Their offices were in century city and yeah tall buildings, yeah and I said, dude I'm going to jump out this window may have been there like a the unabomber hoodie on here and threatening the guy to jump out. The window is like a canopy man like that I can't open the windows earlier, you want me to open the window. If I had me insured. So I'm glad if I jump out the window, so that was the that was drenched was a record they put out I and then at the next one. They just add another allowance. Always we fill up, but the the reason I was telling you that was that in that time, when We was re in flares. No because he's like I finally had it in I cant do any I quit you got married. I quitting. I don't want to do anything and I got offered the players gig on my own or they offered it to us and he didn't want to so I said: could I try it and that's

where I started so weighing my own man, ok, so the polaris gate was that was yet a change. Name for legal reasons. Now there was no, I just, the job doing the music, which is surely it was early a hired to write music for the show and record the music for the show the band was sort of an afterthought. How did you get that gig? he said I love miracle legion, the guy whom You will yeah, I loved. Air pollution nicer? Well, I don't think you're gonna get married regiment measure because the eligibility joined up with the frank black area alex weren't sure sure the other, the the rhythm section was the catholics in their like I'm in the catholics. I don't know. This is element of tour bus that do that, but did that bosnia In the time before I got the gig with the polaris gate, with the tv show, I was managing nothing everybody's gone. I can't do anything. Were you guys, friends, re devastated? Did you yeah, we're friends and we've always been friends? Friends is like when we're together, we're friends then yeah like someone to get out of the van after two. I go well

and I feel like next tour. Let her know amnesty tomorrow, mcnerney it up, so I got it job and then yeah. They invented the ban just to be in the open, really right. Do you want your your your on t v shit, guys when there's going to be in the open of the thing we play the the theme song yeah, and that became a thing, but we never did a thing with that either which is like now not you know a peer, I'm not all full of great ideas, and so I I I never do anything and then this guy offers a gig like that was the same. Nothing I dunno how many years was fifteen years later guys. I am doing this nickelodeon project and Would you guys wanna play and we never had played a gig at all? We never did anything and its the biggest thing. I have I've limiting the impression. Was ban that errors when we, when we came out to play it, sank: ok, three or four hundred people, every town crying and screaming and loving, and whether we

Is it a kid show? Em you kid shows. A kid show by two brothers live without a cartoon. Ah, It was a very well written show, so wait. So they didn't wasn't ny from my sort of place in time, but sure a kid there was at a great soundtrack had magnetic fields and yeah iggy pop was one of the characters. S type was one of the characters you know have reached canada. How I miss that patty hearst, oh yeah, so is this really well done thing that you know was a smart thing for a kid instead of the rights mostly to crap, so some of the people involved got followings of these the yet the new group a kid They were kids. Well, you know, you know Toby Huss yeah. He was in it yeah. I have which I kind of remember the show, but I don't think I saw it. He probably wouldn't have watched it in I'd watch with my mom cause. I was in it and then after like two episodes like that's enough near here to see their yeah. Could you do this directive it? But

The value of an audience for polaris polaris is a great thing. It's a beautiful, it's like so like nothing, It's like what you really want. You go in there everybody's like dying to hear it every crying, every so united, like this beautiful, gig were everybody's in the same place. Here is no assholes nobody's dylan the wrong thing right. there is real reverent india, I loved it man. I really had a great time. I hope we do it again and I bet we won't, but I'd would in white soundtrack do this show we did a tory which were all over the place with polaris they declare. But yet we haven't played the guy, offers one gig and was sought. It sounded ok, so you can't go yet that the way is now, and that is where you got your your biggest following of suppliers and thinks himself area now. Wait, I talk about like how you it seems like you worked with some people. You know like once more. Galwegian when you down sized it crashed so

the album me Mister grey was doubtless after the crazy half quit row, did the original drummer and the second base by who had like poisoned his mind, yeah they quit, and so we said, oh man, but it's always like. Oh man. The equipment speak record of this right now, because, if that's all that it just takes one thought, yeah, I could that those guys yeah. So we had all these songs that we didn't really think we're too good year, and so we went and said: let's make these songs have a record and see what we can do and it it alternate real beautiful. You know what I was like a successful. That was a good record. That's a great amene! Excuse me that was a grey wreck of russia. For me I thought I achieved,

a lot of things I wanted to get any traction, probably not know not really. Where did you record that we recorded at paisley park? That was another super bonus. We would like somebody came up with the idea that once you can go to paisley park and like yeah sure what what where's that so we went to prison parking oats in minneapolis, there was little outsider minneapolis and was prince air prince. Was there only generally men who never had a conversation with him- and you know I thought like I walked by him- one time and as a key without duty, an executive super nicer would ever be error that work. But now I read you know after he died. You realize he read Alison what a great dude he was. He was always like involved in america, said you're going to syria, the place up in his eye germanicus, I used a musician you. It wasn't like a rice failure, but right, I wish to hear of a regret. One woman who pay

and who produced it. It's produced by a guy who was a total prick and we got rid of him and went to this other guy paul kultury he's the guy that fixed it he's the guy that produced all those boston bands at you name, any one hebrew small is he still around he's raunchy be mixed and march him? Okay, oh, it is yeah, that's great men of love relationship with the terms of the work there is a saying: let us do it he's made here. use the radiohead record in whole, and- has done, leads things but like could you mix this job? I will give you a hundred bucks were either which radiohead record the first one pablo honey asking us create hair, you friends with those no I've met. The figure is a big fan of my talk. It's a nice fan, but I've met him a couple of times but yeah we don't have any he's done your songs right. He did a key covered, a song that that offer the best, which is you know, one of our great songs.

Sooner, it was just in a tv show called the impostors and they used his version, and you know it was good. zero moment. The right is on the rise, jack, theirs. I songs, surprise chairs. It's amazing thing when you get paid to Europe. the song you didn't actually just get an envelope in the mail somebody else was I wanted to. I want to do that in some new at dead. That's it that is the that's. The best part about it seems about. Music iv is, if you got your publishing, if you write the song and it's a good song theirs they each escape is it goes out. It's like now go out and make money go somewhere pleasure. so, like aggies, had an amazing run of that with the future. Is right with you as you are lust for life over and over. You know yeah, yes to say the fixes have had a lot of good have they want? I well you look. Where is my mine where's,

minors in something and they had rare and an apple song. Forget the lad. Ah it just people, it's you know like writ the manager he calls all the time trying to find these opportunities, but it's strictly. I like them a yeah. It's never, It's never gonna happen. Businessmen college. No, it's we're way. It happens. I read that young, when they first did, search and destroy they used member these dickie search and destroy, Four nike add that they ran a movie tears I ignored I was on the other, saves on in the management the realm of the music or does the behind. You know not enough musician anymore. And he said the guy who use that song for that commercial, which is going through an titles It was no nothing to do with eighty path he like, if you like, tell us our concerted, destroying many within this. I think tat, yeah so's, I guess Random thing It's already airy go mister after work

here's quarter million dollars. Surprise have a good week. So I kind of like what, when you a show like in san francisco as one of the crowds, who's, who's who's left, who are they and we were good for like two fifty two hundred and fifty people and because of the very variety of at least me? in belarus and that there is a really good makes a people We challenge, you think, did it like a like in the outside of the poorest record as a miracle legion crew. You know it's a lot of people like drenched, which I too am a kind of half and have found you know that was the one who got the most attention and had the most money behind in them bad and billboard. He I run David letterman and. That really got a lot of the usual the hype. You were right, oh shit. You know a lotta. People know that, but a lot of people know they they find it. You know people are a lot of, and it's very encouraging lightweight right defines, but you kids, who fund polaris and they look and look. I find all the records and want to know everything. You know that vietnam, in the process some hope you know. What's always out there, it's

now he would especially the rich has made everything totally available sorts skin the richer management area. His fun awaited everything on all the points you can buy records what way when you- and I know must be- must be difficult with you. I pass away, but I mean how did that you know like that change where you approach to life in general. Did it bureau man to be brutally truthful you it's it's it's cystic I have to we have to provide. I never provided before. I do that, for they had kids, I wasn't a provider and so He was now while me we had money, we just had enough money to kind the two of us she worked I play at and we were fine but right, but you know I just look at what I'm doing. I still feel we are like an artist you right.

but I also know that it's all I have to bring home some may can't. I have to bring home money from it, yeah, just how old are they they're? Eleven twins? Oh right so that unites us. Is it just a responsibility right, there's like it may enter its? You know it's been. It's made me grow up quite a bit, about what I'm doing it makes me approach its turn me: a lot more professional about what I'm doing then. I would have been I would have given it should. I would have like if this was. If this ten years on out of come in, giving you a hard time, because I thought I was the sky, It was what does he want? What do you want out of me and I would approach everybody like that? What do you want out of me? Fuck you, you know, and I you know I love you doesn't make any sense to think that way, obviously, if, for whatever reason, you're thinking that way, but but I know you know- I have a- I feel, like you know- I'm really. No, I was necessarily man like I've learned more so smirk legion, that I knew all in all the time ozone I've learned about how to sing how I can sing differently in how to write- and

everything about. It has been in this. The really the thing over. The more you know, the more you realize you don't know anything right, So in that that's where I am zen wise. Oh I'm my no. I have a long way to go. What's also, Interesting when you, when you come at it because, like I I'm the same as you, and maybe that's why I you know, I I get attracted to the records in that when I set out to do stand up or what, whatever my chosen crafters, which is comedy, I just wanted to. I had I wanted to say something I wanted to do this thing right no plan, your people, I can, business. Some of them have plans, they have points. They want to reach that they keep a consistent hair. Do you know they there that they maintain stylistic elements they make connections, they do all that shit and I ain't it sort of like I'm here. Where did when? Did it start with

I know the idea we did the thing I mean: where is the guy? Wasn't somebody exactly? I thought they were going to get us yet when we, to be picked up here and ill. To go. They slowly. We did like Amerika region. We had a great success right off the bat gap and we went to england which I never him, I never been there, so there we we did well and annual more stein called us and every home greatness. Then why what I mean so, which album was popular in england, it was called the backyard. Record of net. He an epa. That's when he peace could go huge, adjust struck. Somebody then it was that the perfect tune, but Nobody knew how to capitalize. Nobody knew what to do in this country or white anywhere but anyway, video on mtv right away. When we made a video, this girl was one made a video kelly record of Univer. She made the video for it. Anna

Oh well! I guess you, I guess, that's it. Let's go there and then dish nothing! Nothing like a rock. What about the better get you to britain? We turn around england. Yet we mean it helped a lot. It helped us a lot. Do people come in england total, oh yeah, it was getting played on the radio and that's when it was an mp and everything mattered and we had to a photo shoot for every of a melody maker enemy, the bigger the photographer schematic income to give us the eu, but the gang over to the bare hemp, ned, hempstead heath and take some shots around deals. Ass graveyard, so it was really crazy, exciting and I wonder if that were york, got windy, he will eat. I wonder that's on offer. The best in his brother withdrew their. He said my brother heard on the radio we went to london about a record. He's told me: I mean he generally loves items like like it's not he's. Ok, he's not fucking kidding the first time some I went to see them play in new york and I got on the gases.

Now so he knew I was on the guess. I guess air, and so it was I met the show and he comes out. It comes up with anchors and when you are dedicated onto mark mckay, he loves an example, and I'm like why, Did he play you played? No, it wasn't offer the best. There was something else here, but it was there. Buddy, buddy, delicate, to me, and I am looking for Who is the only other guy who knows HU. I am here at this gig isn't that crazy? I went to meet him and I went back to my do you he any user. You couldn't and then you know that's. That was I dont oversell without was pretty much it item. I've never seen him. But, like you know that, but does not beautiful, though, I mean clearly that song shifted something in his head totally and his brother too. I know his brother a little better. I've toured with his brother's band with his brothers, but they were the unbelievable truth and he couldn't. I you know they were pretty good. He couldn't get away from being timers brother stuff so hard so that the bird

never sizzling, fame, would accuse them of not changing. His name should change your name. Man we're. Why? But I like, I like that, like idea that you don't know how that's a beautiful thing about meat. Music is kind of magic like that right, given always gonna drop in you. That's why everything's always available, like music, doesn't go away like I just get I'm just now, because I gather vinyl resurgence set, and I realise how much shit I dont know nothing about and you can't like, I always get into you're like even when I talk to you, because you know you ve done a lot of work? I know, there's gotta, be least one or two people out there who are gonna be like We didn't ask him about his dog. You know like you're, you know you talked about it in a song and I can't accommodate that all I can do. Is continue to be curious. But you don't know when it's gonna drop I'm like going on a goddamn lee, morgan. Tear he's been dead forever

yeah, you know india, like theo, nine people, lovely morgan and now MIKE's. Why did I not know about this guy? How was I going to know about it? I don't know on this. You know I don't know, I know what I knew up until it started playing music right So I know old shit, I'm on youtube. Look in a deeper provided that at that amat yeah. I think he pointed the heavy hearted dude. Maybe you know what I mean. Maybe are you at these gigs? We just played this guy comes I flew from chile to see the show. You don't know it's what I like you and they start hugging here. but you know the one that like he he he when he needs it. Yeah yeah. I know- and I am happy to hear you can have all but then like Ok! I gave an hogs or to get out of there. You know you're, a very serious zaga baseball got thrown runners in or else it that's all you're. Just because you're

to get out of it. Their sincere there still there really any you really get. We can feel than the interesting. I've seen the dirtier grind, balling, I'm looking across these every fifth person is weeping. You know yeah to hear this tune. That's their brain, their brains like? Oh, my god? It's the thing that we all, but nowhere case cry. Yeah aid and the happy growing, but that will not everyone can write, sounds like everybody now. I have one song dude in an interview averted, but it's called the don't talk crazy and it's about a guy who gets wounded in more and comes home. You can't no one can listen to it as a kiss on listen to bull song, it's just so I'm crying right! Now I honest to god: I'm like a little bit crying thinking of the tune really, and I'm not saying anything about me which record there isn't any records Thirdly, can really get it. You can and should take it out too painful.

I'm not in I've done something, but it just it's just that the idea of this thing you know it's just too much too, is too much to bear you I asked You know, as I get I've always been sort of move by stuff like that, that have a melancholy, you're dense, add a depth to it like that, and down I am I. And I guess that's what I heard in your music because I, like you eat. You know, there's a like a a frequency of emotion that people operate from creatively. You know and and and I dunno that they can wayne it you know, but it is what it is, and you know if you're one of those people you're not going to you know, fill stadiums, but ever gonna change lives. You learn I think I have a guide is certainly I do. I wish in this of some kind of something that self I just talk to somebody about that today. Oddly, like is like, I have this weird connection to ireland. That's emotional!

you know I got you, I'm just a jewish guy. You know, am the irish in any way, but when I go there their party this sort of way. We're down trodden way, libya, but you're down tried not by, but except it's of it that their there there is. point of view through the darkness, through the bog yeah yeah, that the other key we keep going forward right. You don't think no one said this was going to be easy right. It's a it's even about the everything about I've been doing music. It's never been right because I some huge success, eminent build on that happen, lemme give you ve got to keep going, keep tracking give going in and in experiencing the feeling, the struggle but I feel you know. I meet a guy that used to be in the ban and his deal a lawyer or he's got some get on my fuck me one. I do that you're not meant for that's. Why didn't I make the right move get out and get the OECD.

how often do you spend thinking along that lie? Not that often Do you know I do I could have all those things you know, but I know I don't like I want. I used to think I got which I try not to like. So it's much more specific now, as opposed to sort of like your cross roads regrets like you here I am at the crossroads. now just stay on the one I'm on the air, but by the other. When I do tuesday sorted beat my I was the only way I can put it into any sort of context which I do is like there is no way I could have done that I just I'm just not it's not in me. It's not not that guy It is very easy to judges, have against other people successes when they take this other thing. But, like you think about the time, that you might have done that there is no way you would have done and no matter what do you mean politically. I would have formed a most of those things in the somebody gave me some perfect right, chandler, but been right

having a job. That was just the right one, but I don't know what that would mean exactly when those guys make that decision. They let go of something yet europe, What's he do that you're not willing to let go of like it. When I was at my lowest and I was going to quit comedy, I was like well there's a couple options and one is not living anymore. You know I was amazed at you ps. I would say that. Look man, yes, journalists ever entered that is going to give you ps and nobody vs yeah I figured I could do that now. Yeah get some delivered to the truck deliver, get some coverage. You know get some insurance. It feels like a doable job to be a just got to where they are, except I get a little. for surely will hire move southern. It does. You might get a job than anybody could turn of worked away into. I guess there's jobs like that. Legally, held. We are right now is to adapt, The thing that is like when I was at my low is was in my fortys and, unlike the last job I had was working at edibles. You know I like

You go play. You commander, grill job, So what am I? I worked at the magazines door as such. I would not have the job of the eggs loan the magazines of the veto That is another issue, but I was well I. What do you want to place on? If you want me to, I, don't I'm kind of bumped on you, but oh no! No, I didn't know, I didn't know if you want to yeah. I do that all the time I mean I like people when people play. If you feel like it I'll try, it would be. I only I I really don't know a couple of. I know a couple from the and that's what I have been playing it all I've been here so I haven't yet you want try to don't keep up those on the fiddler from the new up the sums from the new album. It's called the village

now there's a little town or on the grass. Gee too now there's a little town around down that crime. that at any rate, love all cairo branch. Thank you did. in that astrid

well the beggar training schemes to steer this grey area to the underground. Trance there. He can hear him, sir, but there's always a moment. There's always wins.

The not as amelia emanating fan It won't be a problem this time get back. lack of blood or forget it man

I played a right that sound. It's ok, you wanna do tried again, I'm just fucked it up for gimme another chance and one more chance. I found it. I was I was into it. I wasn't going to keep taking on the triad. Of course everything. So I think so I dunno, maybe don't be too hard on yourself. Jesus. The guitar on one thing: what else are you fucking? If someone elses my guitar and I was thinking I wouldn't be thinking during the now that a little town around down that road in school,

hello, cairo, Brad, predicted the last reading the The whether beggar, Lou train. This data is green, known to the underground, there is less serious than him. But, as always there's always a moment when yeah,

The the yeah as a million. Everything will be fine. They want a bundle robin so give back vulgar. Is black and sound laudable lay the member states?

This need is green tansu, now Draftsman me he can, but, as always in a moment, there's always a move. There's always ended who

hm yeah. She kind of screwed it up, but I don't care you know I. It sounded great that sounded great. That practiced well, come on now, I'm happy with it. It is great talkin to you. Do you know that you got it now there are now ass, one mark mackay. Again the album is deposited. The driveway good record. Don't worry, It can also go to w p, a part that comparable you're, w tia pod related things. Pre order that book pre order, the book waiting for the punch, it's gonna be good. It's coming, it's coming right, ok I should play play some guitar

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