David Chang is an American restaurateur, author, television personality and founder of the Momofuku restaurant group. David chats with the Armchair Expert about growing up Korean American, his first time eating ramen in Japan and how he found his way into cooking. Dax talks about elitism in food and David discusses how depression led him to open Momofuku. The two talk about self-medicating, the responsibility to share one’s painful experiences and the importance of asking for help.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Welcome welcome. Welcome to arm chair expert, I'm Dac shepherd enjoying by monster mouse monster, mousing monster mouse. I do amongst the mouse good, where my apartment again love it here. Yet when I arrive in the door, was cracked to grant me entry entry. Was a smell wafting out into the forest, and it was at the most delightful inviting smell. You burn a lotta nice candles in here. Thank you. I mean this that Cadogan either way I could have been an event. Well, oranges spoil our shores, lots of things and that it was the candle. Is it there are specific sent rivers edge into they would z. Earthy, it actually was hacked clear holiday winter candle will, you would never know you'd. Never
Today we have a really fun guess: David Chang, David Chang, is an american restaurant tour and author and television personality. He is the found, of the normal FU restaurant group rest It's in New York, Washington Dc Las Vegas, LOS Angeles Sidney in Toronto. We have eat nuts. All these and have always been delighted that he also was the tv show, networks, his breakfast lunch in dinner in the mind of a ship. A chef very much enjoyed talking it, and I really really appreciated his honesty and you know he's in an industry. That's being hit the hardest right now, so I appreciate his time side. No, you may here a few audio issues at the beginning of this, but we sorted it out pretty early into the interview, so hopefully that a clearer quickly there was some mechanical technology difficulties. This is the time we're living in and were learning and growing. So if you think the audiovisual dicey efforts hang in there, it gets fantastic
I hope you enjoy David checking, he's hi. How are you I'm good at it? Are you held up in New York? Now we're staying right outside a friend sounds because increasing culture that when your birthday is like a really big staying in March. First, I had a lot of family in town from all over the place and they're all stuck, so I couldn't keep them all at my apartment, and I asked one of my friends who has several rooms in a house that lives by himself. While I need a crash at your place, those foreseeable future. There's a toddler people right now it's been a traumatic three. Or for weeks. I don't know how long I spent anymore. I want a man. For you, it's gotta be twenty times more stressful because of all the different trees are getting hit the hardest. The restaurant industry is,
in a shambles yeah. Yes, it water, most exposed businesses right now and I'm trying to be optimistic. I want to know what the floor is, and I dont Anyone that hasn't laid off a ton of employees in my industry, in that You know, honestly, like I dont care about restaurants right now, Applause, find a way to feed themselves in a variety of ways, and thank God there still restaurants that are open to take when delivery, this concern. I have is for all the employees that were undocumented or documented. They don't have a job right now said, that's not nice, to think about what actually year set up primarily in New York right, so the majority of your employees are all living in a city. That is what you say to cheap to live there. You can't really just kind of flowed along for awhile Now and then that sort of the discrepancies the recently customers, bellers,
expenses in York a very different then for employees and say LAS Vegas, Toronto or California, and it's dead a whirlwind. We have a really good team and we're trying our best and that's the hardest thing, as I know that we have people on James utterly hey. You need to do that job and I dont disagree, but we're doing out there in a situation where no one had been prepared. I can imagine they taught this class at college every school. So it's like when you have no, whether three months shut down due to a pandemic, make sure Your excellency, the I think it's gonna be. Still and that's what my friends and I move my friends and I moved industry we are trying to sort out is what does it look like when you do reopen up. So it's very Marquis how is your wife cream? She is like similarly first generation like you, yeah she's, first job were, and in and therewith us right now, and I am one of the few people. I feel like that
absolutely doors by in and how your baby hear him. Yelling disparities is just heard: thirteen months spend amazing to be able to highlight given every night, and I try my best. Even for this. I happened to make his food in a breakfast. To dinner. But you know that's really the only good thing that's happening Maybe if I was beginning to see him almost walk, that's where he's at right now and I would say, there's like another week before you can upgrade. It really take his first steps. That's like the best thing and if I was working, I kept missing it like you watched it on video on Facetime, so I wouldn't change that for anything, because it's been a total joy and develop and before my eyes- and I dont know a ton about you but I have to imagine you ve been sprinting now for the otter. Now, ten twelve years, yeah yeah no actual, I opened along with Blue in August, two thousand forward.
That was just me all the time, like no one really want to get work with me, and now we have over fifteen hundred points that we used to have over fifteen other employees in LA yes, have to imagine just every step along the way has been really time consuming energy consuming. It has been. Stop and honestly I did. Know what to do and tell you know like maybe a month before our son, born. I was just freaking out because didn't know how to stop. I work my ass off I'm out to work. Take the personality to begin with. It's the only sort of socially acceptable addiction, the out, I'm I'm a big time out its work. The yeah first and foremost, mom and dad are from Korea and deaths from North Korea, Mumps from South Korea, my parents, born in what is now North Korea. My mom came from a very well to do family, where a lot of
I would say- intellectuals, lived my grandfather. You work in a government, a guess vacuum sort of like a tourney attorney general at time and my dad side face, came from nothing and he was born on what is now the border of China. Korea and lifted or they lost everything in its whole horrible, storing it up self yet so how did they meet? This is like literally the story that I've been told. They were at a picnic with some friends from Dad's, older sister, dad saw my mom peeling an apple with a knife, he's like while she feels it so well. I have a very easy wow. I was better than my own great you're gonna. How much I believe about, but you told us that, in one here I met Sally or sleepless in Seattle. I forget which one
peoples in Seattle, there's an apple peeling with the knife scene or into someone form of recycling. It has to do with the love. My aim, I of course now I'm dying to watch your mom peel and I know I have to imagine its borderline rob she's really good at it. So what were they? where they, when they came to the? U S so my God, to America in nineteen sixty three and he moved to New York, he's pretty dramatically He went up washing dishes and you're not living what you put it. He was a real immigrant experience just getting out of a job and making your way through that. I thank you was here for like three four years and then he came back to create that's when he met my mom and then they came back. I think it's sixty, six, nine and and my dad was working. Restaurants, on the more before the house level, and there now and then my sisters, one seventy three, seventy ya, but it's
boy they end up only in restaurants and even a golf store is accurate, yeah, my dad squeeze a hustler, there's giant sections of my dad's history that will never be known: that's exciting, yeah. I have no idea like how he went wind up in New York and then I guess you work restaurants going all the way down the Midland wound up in Washington DC how he wound up owning a rush brought. Is the script to me and there's like crazier story like somehow, I think for a year or two he listens small town in Kentucky and again like having free and dad. It is not easy to get any information about? How can we do now is darkly and allay? There is a path for korean immigrants, which is that the you know there's a huge green community, the often on a community level,
Raise money and loan money to new immigrants, start small businesses, which was any of that happening for him out there yeah, that's how we actually got into the Gulf Business and she wandered getting out of the russian Business and I dont know how. But she had some foresight in two gulf, and you know that what I did for me, five to like, team or sell displaying every day but they're a time she got in the Gulf business and there are problems on Wednesday twelve to fourteen for young men that divided up Washington DC area. Oh no shit, narrowing DC where the Virginia and at the time, provided it all out, but I think they ll pull their money and the people that had the most money actually took the desolate actions in that area, the wealthiest locations, my dad being the poorest at the time, was you ve been reached. Seven in Winesburg
every day in your Thyssen's corner, and that before Thyssen's corner became one of the biggest shopping malls in America. So he was by given the worst worst location and a want of being. The best location owners, yeah yeah yeah was quotations washing golf centre and there was a delay but getting warehouse yeah, but you can't something centre. If we ve only got like four hundred square feet, it was, it was big and it sort of way you know such a long time ago. I ever recollections of admit this, Looking at Pasco, just like golf clubs everywhere just stopped on the floor and my dad told thing was, spend no money on how things look of competition Did you work? There is a kid yes, I did so I have. Class warfare stuff, and I'm going to get into that with you when it comes to fine dine, and I was a real, reluctant, a doctor to fine dining cuz, it just screams rich people and I feel less than in when I mean a fine dining place. So
I wanted you to know that later, but then you know golf also kind of does that to me. So if I had to pick the last group of people wanna be interfaces with on a regular. It be like right, dude working a golf on the weekend, I but I dont remember to where we were too there wasn't like old money coming to us. Ok, it was just so bare. Bones people that went to buy something there we're going there because it was like just count I'll get it right, regret it wasn't it wasn't. My caddy share not, like not at all but like. If my dad had any similarities is a little bit like groggy dangerfield with working. The cash register me breaking down boxes and they went Odin overgrown out. I how to regret than repair golf clubs- and I did that when I wasn't practicing playing golf like my dad- was pretty ahead- This time in regards to like now take a joke. If your create American, that you want you on your daughter. Do you like?
called worker star and when I was playing out there were no other asian people on Mars. Won't you I think it cuz, I'm I'm four years older than you- and I was thinking like. Oh his dad was following the Tiger woods Play book, but now there is no Tiger woods play book at that point, right actually knew about tiger pretty early aren't just from my plane, competitor golf that thousand a sobering thing. When you, when you're, like eleven twelve old and you think you're really good and you learn you're. Never gonna beat this purse yeah, I think out war must the two were felt that way for about a decade worker. Like what are we looking at handicap for you at your peak, depending on don't bullshit me David, probably scratch we're all my get. My montague doesn't mean anything that is. These just spoke the completely different language. I have no idea what any so scratch range on average you're hitting poor on every hole like let's see it's enough for
our three than a power for than a part three than apart you're, getting at the end of the round, you're not above or below, which is that's a very, very rare, rare, rare raw. But I didn't know what was going Thou, so young one. I was playing and dad you're my work, world was surrounded and centre a gulf or religion. Ah, what religion Presbyterians? You know basically burned out once I just didn't, have their mental game to play competitive golf. So that was pretty yeah also did you expect all that, like very stereotypical, first generation asian parents, type of pressure earlier. Do you as a piece of parenting today for sure, but I me you're a day in the life of a teenage first generation korean, I just remember some kind of punishment wasn't always like physical. I don't know you know what, like I talk to my brother's about it.
We're always in a state of fear, there were not doing a good enough job. We need to work harder. I would just remind my dad always saying: like hustled you have the house, you have the hustle. A lot of that was manifested in the golf course when I say about playing golf My memories are on a golf course because I would say fifty days year for ten years was playing golf because I was I one of bourbon tournaments when I was younger, so the expectations for me, or maybe a little bit higher and ammunition pretty early on. There was a different standard at how the kids, was friends with that we're all like white kids from, and I would say middle class. Families were being traded Engulf, wasn't the centre of their life, they had other Hobbes whatever I just. I didn't have that option. So did your parents care about academics are where they just pushing the golf thing. One hundred per cent fills, therefore the Gulf thing, but the weird thing,
What how create immigration happen and things similar to a lot of immigrants by came here. They're saw the two classes for Koreans. You know a lot of their people. That again, if wasn't gulf, it was in church and a lot of people at church that were considered, like, I would say to to do that they were on visas because they were doctors or engineers, academics. Everyone else that was, bigger owner or dry clear on summer time. There was a very light weird two caste system. In some ways I super similar to the Indian yeah migration story. And so my dad was like always do better at school, but thank you, saw primarily on that. I had no attitude So my sister was the real bookworm, strangely student. It didn't mean that wasn't demanding of getting the best grades, but I know I talked about in the book
you got push back and publishing because of this carbonate. Anything like it took a long time made a process, but I was so scared of my dad that I couldn't really achieve an academic because I was so scared of punishment The fear of failure urges burnt runnin rampart. I just cite myself about it. I never did well in school. Every group in what would be a DC supper, basically yeah of Virginia. It's weird, though, because, like I spent a lot of time in Virginia like proper, because I think that doesn't really start until you get to Richmond right, yeah yeah my God had a business there and I put a tournaments down there, so I would probably go to Richmond every weekend. That's firstly were was instrumental in my life, because I got to see what american food actually really was now, how much is being asian by a kind. Imagine you're, one of a thousand in your town promptly
the junior wandered having a lot of Koreans and that's why the church is so important in so many Crean american immigrants, because there is a huge population Chicago Latvia has one, obviously California dimension by decree in population in DC, nor the bridging area is pretty huge. Ok, but I like I just never fitted with cream people about either and I did a fiddle to well. We didn't like traditional, wipe your mind. Can every along? Did you wanna be white? Monica wanted to be Y yeah, but one hundred percent with my brother, my older brother, all the time. My older brother yeah he's a moment. I gave you David, you should sit like I'm just the whole thing from how my brother doesn't need a lot of cream food because a lot of the scarring just being made fun. Oh that's a unfortunately a way to grow up. Oh yeah,
I presented everything being korean, and you know the phone thing is by being honest about this now diplomatic. I wonder if you feel the same way by saying How much I didn't want to be claimed back then yeah, today, twenty twenty there will be Asians that we like thought you D Chang. How can you say that, like I'm not saying that now, then I felt like I didn't want to be clear yeah has emphasised that, but people listening to that, I totally we and I type we talk, whether all the time on this podcast and while we have another pod ass, a relationship, one that I talk so much about these early experiences and trying to distance myself from my ethnicities so much and yeah there's a lot of bad. Glass. It seems that comes back, but I almost think it's it's fear based. I think when I hear people responding like because how can you argue with someone's emotional right here? You know like you can and it was different, then indefinitely waited for you
I admit solely gotten better for people of different ethnicities. I think it's just hard. Issues are to be different. It made it do you like whatever I didn't get in was like magnified my ten, but I too, you know the cost, that we have in the names and the whole nine. It was just like, oh how we're to fit in here, because it's not even these other secondary churchyard things. It's. How I look is why, we're going to fit it all. As well even the black community, You can be more marginalized, but at least in the black meaning you have all kinds of different celebrities. You could point to four aspirational people achieve success in comedy Carmody, dramatic actors, stars of tv shows sports heroes for both of you there is really no one in the popular Zeit guys that
crushing has the Caribbean or an indian that you go like well it'll, be fine. I can t, not to be Eddie Murphy, you know why I need you have white people the point to so you think you have to be as closer that as you can get an ordered. It have sort of success, not one euro parasite winning weeping at aspects with such a monumental moment for cream people, at least America, because they're like holy shit, we have someone that we give route for actually career Yolanda, say your brother, didn't like korean food, which I get you were not in that same position as em. You liked the food. You know it was interesting, because I really well make my grandfather side and my mom side. They were to do- and he was basically japanese early nineteen hundreds, Japan to colonise career. You know there there's a lot of old woman.
That maybe never will be killed from various perspectives, increase base it on the doorstep, for Asia, for China and Japan away like He was raised so they took a lot of the well to do and smart korean men and women, and basically taught them in Japan, so they basically brainwash them, be their proxies in Korea. Yeah just slowly like assimilate japanese culture banging Teresa She didn't like cream through my grandfather, food, Japanese was so when I get the Japan when I later, when I smell the food there is feels more like home to me than when I landed soul and her some weird I got some sort of we should go in and, like crazy filled with something that my moms and basically my my there's mom is an amazing caught. My dad side were a horrible cooks and I've always jokes until two grandma's, you know a lot
What cream food is is, I always say, from a western perspective, pretty gnarly like kinky smells like bearing pungent an effect Its popular now is crazy to me because it was the, that I was vilified for so my brother quite related growin up was, I I don't know anything to do with this food. I'm never eating it, and I, to follow that nose like oh. I also won't eat this book and I think there is probably a good three for your stretches. Like I'm marrying previewed either this scrap young, when I when food it was always at my house, I never would ever bring created to school but I do remember when kids would maybe come over and how the next day or the came on a Friday Monday would say out, Games House knows I could, follow that was the labour, the ok, that's not what
would link him. She too, I mean you can't argue that doesn't have a specific smell, but certainly nine, although the Bali is, are really interested in getting some data sharing reactive will they they should the bed on that one Joe food, I think, had unfortunately a traumatic experience. Particular tribute as eyes and younger kids won't, like you, didn't quite often what what can be empowering for people who have been the victim of abuses to at some point confront abuser when they feel strong enough to do so in the fact that you checked it so much and then ultimately embrace it in such a profound and the way I have to emerge is cathartic gun some level one hundred percent in it's like I'm working this out with my therapists in front of everybody and yeah. So I now how to make sense, because what was curious to me as you you went to college Trinity, you studied religion again bless you, but when you got out you end up in Japan, what was your gate waited?
and the other than granddad. I was a horrible student again, though, like I couldn't get like everyone else, is like the dot tumbled, so bright, red, no nine- and I am I want to answer what the fuck I was gonna have to do so I literally went to the clear, fair I've made a right and it was teaching, English and repair incorporation? And I said I one job here and there to me, and I didn't think really about it. So did you speaking Japanese. That night, I don't know I didn't write and even have any care I just needed to tell someone. Would you do it, so I could tell them young. I didn't really think I was gonna go you're gonna be This is something I want to tell people do. It will never come here, and then came and everywhere, and it was pretty hard, there teaching of the English are just being in Japan. All of that it was a Jackson.
Lord about hotter and not nearly as nice. If you can say such a thing, ass loudly ass. Well, well, well that really the private! Ah, my entire list, where I wanted to go, was like Sapporo ok I'll check it out and they gave me by the place I wouldn't we chosen, which is a small village called. Is you need to worry, back yard, was arise. Paddy were again probably awesome for five or six days not now the fast- and I just I struggled, and I think that was setting me. I've seen us pages, since two thousand three powers like we can count like pretty much can point that was the first rate manic episode. I had warehouses. I was gonna Coquet, my twenty four seven. Aha, with mania, ok, I lasted about four months and in that time frame, though there was one Rahman shop there. I was too
I wish to go there because that's while the local villagers were eaten congregate in you gonna go in there and sure enough when I said I couldn't take it anymore and my eye wandered away, but I couldn't get a transfer gotta go in there and am I wrong in my entire life? Never an actual on a shop. What, then, I saw all these hard boiled eggs and balls, and it was just like a great places you can either hobbled. I put some on it in my drink beer and wait for your honor was like was almost like a pop up I ordered a ball of army. Only because I was so scared go in there and like one of those in a rabbit moments where I tasted their cells like holy shit. This is so good and drawing up loving instrument I didn't know that it was like a real thing,
out and how does it I mean this absurd, like such a dumb ass question, but yeah what or what's the most profound differences between what I've eaten and then what you had their best, where I could describe was having really bad frozen. In trade orange juice right in thinking that orange juice entirely, and then you get beautiful, perfect, fresh squeezed oh shit. This is what why she says: yeah like I could look back at it the same way and in detail making the noodles there. I assume right at the rather honour and the process, a milky imports. So as I go most five Porky good Denison, there was often twenty is like you. Can I connect the dots later in life in college, somebody I wanted to drop out here. You gotta cookie school, but my guy basically come to be otherwise. I was never going to fit in but world, no matter how hard I tried so like cooking, something that I wanted to do, but my dad watches entire life effect
so I would never work in restaurants because he knew how about life was young, even how I had it in going to do. It is not something I ever thought I was going to actually do so, even at that time in TWAIN in food was afraid. This thing from my mind when I got back to New York City, but you and I back and I was gonna, get a job and finance and working in food was a this thing from my mind when I got back to New York City, but you end up at the French Colony Institute. So how did you- and I got a job for about months, basely being corporate desk over. I think I was pretty influence. My office space, the movie and I had at the stage of their lemme crisis at the age of twenty two, as this is what people do at every day, you type a keyboard. Do something shit. You make your phone calls. You get yelled at dinner at your desk in you, go home you're, so tired and you pray to God.
I've got a working stated this. The horrible existence like this in I learned about this thing called be a negative vote, which is what the early catholic theologians would think about. Better to around to get closer to what God. It's because you can't know what got his cause he's ineffable me he's on the ship, but if you say God's, not this microphone gods, not this computer got stuck his cup water. If you did at all times you wouldn t, we get a little bit about that's it. Pretty easy logic that I would have liked to my life's. I'm gonna start to do all these things that are not to do almost like towards stanza, and get me a little bit closer to maybe what I want to do the right for a year or so I did all kinds of your job, everything that I thought I could try. Do I would do for like two or three days and then I would quit, and I was like you know what I think cooking, for me, but I dont know. I know that in this task is not for me to our french colleagues to and were you
who immediately great in cooking school, like Arthur prodigies of there are people that are more give that a cooking and others like any other, I would say: I've met a couple of people that are real geniuses in cooking rain, but didn't go to cooking school, but for the most part you have to become. And some people are gonna, have higher up to do being written. That might be how you move it it's in your nice gills, your precision and all of these things, but for the most part, when I started quickly, I was one of the worst students anyone's everything, ok, I'm a package, I only know one way of getting anything done in that's trying everything I happen to a problem there, but always works well with a partner right and should be told my first partner. Level once or their six levels in public school she refused to be my partner on level too. So she told the ships? If I have to be David's partner, I'm
school, and they only had to be Davis partner, so she quit school rotten and be my part la once. That's a straw yeah yeah, I'm just looking over. I do what a mess I was a human like. I really wasn't just a fuckin mass. So what was the turning point? You went to work for crafted why, in the middle of this year, that's an ongoing. I just started by what version George Osborne Cooking School and I just started pouring myself in the profession in an hour. I'm just gonna do everything I want to do everything I never used to do. I'm gonna put myself in this study and I just became light infatuated with all aspects of cooking and what a year later I lit his it took the day off without answering forms a craft afford. It opened up on my two days off from work and at most a kitchen outside She's, the restaurant that I want to be here and
maybe I like this, because it's not that I love it just like. I can't imagine doing anything else right now. I just myself into it and craft was like winning a lot of money because the t there was the time to adjust Oswald was a world class and game when even except me as freely They were like. You know what we don't need. Your thinking right there much you, you, son and You don't mean a reservation. So I was like you know what I just said the greatest there. So I will do. Never needed to do to get my feelings or, if I have to answer phones I'll, do that I did that for food. Once, while still finishing a cooking school until I could actually work for free Yeah that's happening so many people took me under their wings and I learned so much there. Stay too for more arm chair. If you dare.
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keep me on my goal of trying to be paleo, which he goes pain free for me but can we really hard, but they use techniques that are based in psychology, and it's really help me now names out. A diet is healthy and easy to stick to. No food is good or bad, or off limits noon teaches you moderation that can be used in conjunction with many preexisting popular diets. If you want, you, don't have to change it all. In one day, small steps make big progress. Sign up for your trial today at noon. That's an oh, oh, am dot com slashed acts would he have to lose? is it Numa, dotcom slashed acts to start your trial today, that's an oh am dotcom slashed acts when you're at craft and then you graduate cooking school and they start letting you cook in the kitchen. Is there anything that you recognise? Oh, I do we have a niece here now it's not a niece. It is very much a rigid cast stuff you're
The lowest person there and you have to your way up till you get to the top, and I very early on my role was I gotta do whatever they tell me to do right and what I learned was it wasn't an appetite like, I wasn't naturally gifted at it. But what I saw about cooking that was very appealing to me. Was man if I do this every day, I get better at right with a gun, he was probably great training for this in a way because it very much yeah Gulf is such a baby step, baby step bay, just micro improvements over years. It taught me a lot twas, a prelacy person by nature, but I get competitive as a mother fucker allow that's yeah, that's helpful, then Gulf turn me, unfortunately into total lunatic in terms of Michael in this and that viewed. It was out for me to get to this person's position. I need to be better than this person. How am I gonna get there? When I open up moment, you can two thousand for no one wanted to work with me, not one person.
It gives you an insight to how bout I was a what we would do. The people would have. If, if you have invited someone to be a part of it- and they said he, I won't work with David for Ex wife, I can tell you, because I've asked them they're all my friends to be you're. Not that good cash. You are never been assumed chef you want. Romeo. What the fuck are you talking about, because after I cooked for craft like I came back in, Japan is, I felt like there is unfinished business and I wanted to work there and I learned a lot in Japan cooking living Japan was like a lifetime Experience will learn a lot about myself because Japan such an expensive country, particularly food, and I had like the piss me, but I came to the realisation that I really well there cheaply and that that was a weird thing, because back America, two thousand three. If you said you wanted
like go to a nice rushed on. You feel, like fool. People would think you're like a snob right, oh yeah, yeah. I would about Can someone a snub year because you were wrong you couldn t whether that the whole idea of eating well was yet fast. And then to eat a nice meal meant like some fancy: french restaurant. That was just exclusive to any one else other than rich white people. So you have really a lead us there wasn't democratize, at all, yet known not at all. So this is the weird thing like I had the realisation when Cook in Japan. I was like wait, everyone to actually eating. Well, I most of my meals at convenience stores, like the seven lemons, their equivalent, like some the best, would I had worn like convenience stores like Sandwiches noodles, I have those type of Japan and the japanese work ethic, and I guess also through their engineering and in vehicle manufacturing, which is really field. I know a lot about theirs take your business to their work ethos that is
have it in their products. So is that what's happening with the food? Is there like a and attention to detail and meticulous, or is it they're using real ingredients that aren't process like we're using here? What was the distinctly factor that made it also good things care more like have you been to Japan before now dying the gods. One to me ass, my own place. Monica then that I haven't. I won't tell it's the greatest spooks you're in the world, in my opinion and everything's good in Everyone knows more about food than any one else in their food. Culture is just because back a thousand plus years their restaurants, better like FF. Hundred five hundred years old and killed right. So why? But like that, all trickled down to Everything Japan is just a little bit better because the care more, they just simply care more n like an exile sandwich. Would you ever buy and excellence in which had a american seven. Eleven, I be terrifying yeah I would imagine that have been made a week before of minimum later, while those six there you know into Egypt
is like, would be made somewhere in being shipped to these places. So it's very fresh and it's made with delight ingredients and it's amazing, like the exiled sandwich at a loss in communist, or is one of my top five things I want to see now you're Talkin, our language we like the convenience stores of yours is, I could walk down, we and I could just by like a newcomer which sixteen stop dumpling of sorts and it's like fifty cents and it's delicious another way, food amazing here in this cheap food, that's just as good as even the Mcdonald's is packing unbelievers.
all in all. We need a rectangle sound, familiar, that's fervour and chickens working over there. You know what, if I go to Tokyo, I'm unit in the dolls, because I'm Tellin ya, like that they say they still Friday, fries and be fat, the tallow so and they pronouncing macro down, reduce MAC, Madonna, those Mcdonald's Mcdonalds, I wonder if they really quick. So I read kitchen come then show when did that book come out around two thousand and two thousand doesn't want you? Ok, so I read that book and I like a while. If I had not gone in the comedy that would have been my wife, the kitchen life there's a bunch of hardy animals, sex, craze, drug Laden, herbal hours everyone's fucking each other, unlike I'm in that's my kind of culture, were you guaranteeing that crap. Did you like that, especially given the kind of cross your tea that your eyes childhood it was there,
chaos appealing! So when I first got to craft, I love most was how serious everybody was. It was like you entered like assertions room, but the moment service ended. It was I going to a party right right a car play hard enough? but during service, and this is why I have always deemed that, like a healthy kitchen is when people are making fun of each other like out. This is perfect for me if I could get hurt, someone's feelings. The most of this is exactly where I need to be in your making really delicious food, but like their different kinds of kitchens, and I was close with Tony and he wrote about in culture. That was very real. that time, but it didn't it This did certain levels. In my opinion, like the restaurant like craft, was only about food. I could the naive, but I never really signing because I was always just working on the food everyone, so fuckin busy cooking that you Do anything else and is pretty hot for there a lot of crazy stories, I've seen a lot of crazy shit, cause
and culture, thankfully, has been updated August did you get the ball start Mama hook up, I'm price show on his well known. Are mobile, flew so again like following the foot my brother, my brother, loved the Allman brothers, so I left the Allman brothers eat. A peach became like one of my favorite albums and I, when I was studying everything before I left for Japan. Like anything anything and became my hobby after the first trip to Japan, and I said I learned at the guy that create a cup. A neutral was no Mamma falander and I cursed all the time and I think this arms like motherfucker, that's a great name. Now you say if I ever restaurant or be called Momo, if you're gonna have the peaches logo after Japan. I work for yeah balloon endanger curling ETA. Up recite institution called Cathay pollute, and you know at this time I was getting better, but I didn't know what I want to do because at the time, then, if you wanted to have your own restaurant, you had to get tat by the chef. So, for example,
if I spent enough time with Daniel Annual in one of his patrons? decided hey. I won't open a restaurant in Boston do you have someone that I could higher and that's how you get a job or no one year and also? Why are they blew and I was I'd probably if there's like six, in cooks in my ranking. I was like fifty I'm, never I'm never going to be better than everyone else around. time I had my first manage Science on the depressive sigh tat year and things are going my family as well. And then all in I was also working like fourteen fourteen sixteen hours time six days a week is, but it was like crazy amount of work, and I Just was like losing my mind, and my mother and cancer sore twenty four years, my brother was in the midst of soon my god and all, crazy shit was going on, and
my reality, was like melting away and I was not a good place. So that is another reason why I had to leave and one of the reasons I started. Momo flu was: I the point I like fuckin, who cares I mean, like using that sort over that equation of liquids. worst thing that could happen. Yeah right, like I might just myself anyway? So who cares five fuck this up? Who cares? What can I ask? What were the depths of that period? Did you end up having to quit the job where you unable to work? How destructive did that spell funny it's like throughout my life, I feel like I've. I've wanted to ask for help in even times I think I've asked it in college or even high school in high school. magic for me, too, like I was a whole another like her, I went The private school that produce the last two Supreme Court Justices yeah you went to shorten the shorter term Para.
Yeah. I got a some of bs. Some, your classmates parents were like senators and shit, so wasn't it wasn't a fun time for me, so I had a really fit in and I am remembering high school asked for help and people like you're fine and then I never ass, my parents like hey. I think I need to see a therapist or psychiatrists like that. Doesn't it this determination American asshole right. You don't do it. You know what the the remedy is. Stop trying the socket toughened up yet any help is, is weakness right exactly in the hole dear, that you need someone to talk to or get medication on. That was just so foreign. That was never gonna happen, so you don't want like twenty six. That's where I reached a point where like fuck it and did you self medicate, oh my me out arrogant mean like man. I was get at it. Yeah Renault in your base line is feeling like a negative sex and a drug
in its worst condition, can teach you to add to your gonna play adoption and my experience yeah because my industry also was like you mean and have quality you go out every night every night I'm going to bed at four. In the morning five b, sometimes sleeping Locker room just to go to work in the morning. It's insane but a block a lot of that out because it wasn't like that fund, but a lot of drinking I don't like to say that I too drinking problem put yeah deaf. We had a dream probably shard, farewell you're talking to someone with a drink, so it's ok, you're in good company spat medicine for depression. Unfortunately, ultimately, you find out, really bad medicine and also smoking letter marijuana is really bad medicine. At that time too yeah I knew things were not right. Just me, the thought that we're going my head ocean really bad It was just sad. You know I just wish fuckin sad and I had no explanation for it so
I knew I needed to help, and I remember that York magazine over time would always have these best of less than I like your pocket. I I I'm just gonna call these p and try to find someone help me out, and I think I saw one or two and they weren't right for me and then find I found someone on line I see him and it was so expensive and helped I mean I think at that time it only covered like three sessions per every two months. Was really hard, but that was the begin that my life started to change that twenty six twenty six and I've seen him since oh, no shit, that's pretty profound one of the things that he specialised in was childhood trauma and- and I think that's like what we working on all these years, so there's therapy there was the education that eventually gone on opening up that restaurant.
Was not something I thought about actually operating is the goal of. I just had the physically do some to get me out of this, this hell that I too have a purpose here. The day we open- about like. Oh, I actually the bigger the shit out, everything Just us where the under given the dogs and we're gonna just through sheer determination. We're gonna win the game of purpose to get out of bed Isn't it the irony of asking for help being a form of weakness when you tally up the results of it, which are empowered you to be effective and productive and creative and not in for help would have actually defeated all those things in you. The real weakness would have been to not get explore this. Is it so ironic. and I wonder if, like my son, in the same way should he ever have the need to ask for help you don't but like the way, we grew up what
I'm a media told you that strength was asking for help the upon Ability is a superpower this first year There would be sessions literally, were I wouldn't say work, I'm so embarrassed, and remember like having to come to terms with like I can tell anyone there. I can't I can't tell anyone that I'm on medication- and this is embarrassing that I don't know what with myself and now here I tell the world that this is what I did so it's funny I would place. I that's it. That money I've ever spent in. My life is still on my psychiatrist Fisher, which is by the way, the most valuable thing to invest your mental health, this this kind of dovetails into I mention the elite- is thing which I have if she were but then. Secondly, I grew up blue collar area of outside. To detroit- and you say money about opposition than you maintain the shit out of it. You treated well that's what you did in you bought a house, and maybe you got about at some point like these are in the notion of pain,
Our experiences was a really foreign notion where I grew up, see you saved for objects and possessions that were assets, and you could pass on an idea the girl for nine years who worked in a restaurant in she spent every time she made at that restaurant at other restaurants, and I was always and everyone there did the same thing I was like all you guys were making pretty good money. All things considered this is what I was making and they would. blue. I never saw people spend money like us on wine on food and as I've got older and actually read some books about happiness expire sciences are a better thing to invest in ultimately, you're, just measuring it. By what impact it has on your happiness and that ultimately possessions don't we give you much happiness so come around to it for sure, but that better traditionally been? My other reservation is like oh you're, just blowing this money would
your relationship with that as far as is making that something you're going to invest in an indulgent and do you have to convince other people that it's a worthwhile endeavour, in the industry, hey. I have a reservation at this restaurant. Let's go and even if don't have the money you're in a fine away, because, like graphics, we're pleasure, attics what the dopamine yet somehow some way and even if you don't have the money like I've, been that situation so many times like fucking like hey, I remember like let's go to France and Europe is good at this Russia. This year's, like no one, has the means to do it, but we all find a way to make it happen. whether its Maxie, your credit cards or whatever and you're just constantly in the state of paying debt off because you're pleasure in yourself, restaurants- and it doesn't have to be the fancy of fancy, but it's like all your mom goes back to eating and drinking more. We are there,
it makes no sense whatsoever when you think it appear that younger generations have a much different relationship with it. Then I did they don't have to fight it. They seem in others. Are these articles being critical of them that they want overcoat autos instead of a house, and I think, there's true- do but I dont know that their necessarily are wrong for prioritizing that. But I would say: Mama is part of this revolution right, but you got you gonna got disillusioned with the reservation fancy restaurant here we would want to China that lead to you doing, Mama who go, but then Really then did create another moment who go is co, and that is make a reservation online ten days. In advance and only dwell people has How did you go from? You know these things? in time to do it this way too? Oh, maybe there's a version of this. I want to do right. You know tat.
about Japan and eating well and not just eating. Won't Japan, when I was able to travel throughout Asia, I'm eating an amazing meal for, like fifty cents Finally, I should like this: is something that everyone wants experience, and then that was the next epiphany like a fuck, everybody wants to eat. Well, it's just not accessible or the expensive, let it not the case, the place, where that's not the cases, America Yeah and I like it, doesn't have to be that way and thats what Mamma figure was was there's gotta, be different ways to eat than eating at a fancy place on their precise as much as I love the food there in the restaurant, like you know what there's gotta something else, and I thought that does this underground movement that had not been tapped into with food, do. Neutrals and let's try to apply the same sort of discipline and rigour that I've learned working at some of the best restaurants and apply it to a twelve to fifteen dollar bowl of soup? So could you leave? Having
the best meals to rely affordably, and that was really important to me and then now how did but the regal version. So so like we really ray and Mama, like almost going out of business a variety of different ways, so we do need a bar, and then we did somber, which was starting off as a burrito shop Korean Brito Shop. Nothing we had ever planned on actually work the way it was intended to do so. I was so leverage on banks and loans that I couldn't have this the original restaurant that was the bar that we eventually moved up the street closed and we didn't have enough hot water there, so the main reason why we did find dining was we didn't have enough hot water, no yeah don't give a shit. Big events. Food thousand furthest thing on my mind, ass. We a situation here that if this restaurant closed by the health department, we were gonna lose everything will, out of twenty seven seats, a six hundred square feet. We will do two hundred fifty people a day. It was a guy
phenomenon. We literally did the math reverse engineering as like, so how many people can we serve with a war. here that we have and it turned out to be twenty four people so Out of one fine dining, but like ok What can we serve? That will justify the same numbers that wording for two hundred fifty people yeah for twenty four people we had to come up with fine dining menu and that's how it While we didn't, we didn't do it. We. The whole goal was stripping away the bullshit all the things you hate about fine dining Dax I hate to, but people. Still should go on, celebrate and feel good and, like my my metric was always if you have a tea, from Delaware? That makes forty five thousand dollars a year and they happen to be a fan and they ve been saving their money. I want to come here, feeling like they left in drop. A hundred fifty bucks feeling like it was one of the best things we spent money on and it wasn't about trying to set up a benchmark for people they could afford. It is like,
Could we set an experience where people have had to save up money? That was worth it for them to save up YE ass, YAP now you're huge now I see you on tv, you have a restaurant, and Toronto in Sydney. Australia has just said: Vegas LOS Angeles at some point, transitioning into one of these MRS Keller type people ice. I know so little about this world I am aware of you as like a food icon at a certain point and obviously gotten so big you must, brought in genius people to help but this growth is an incredibly credibly, hardly any the navigate growth like that. You know now were blessed to have like some of the best It is people like I don't know. I look at my office now and it's like everyone like an Ivy league school? They want to work here like what the fuck is going on and all these cooks are so good and they're just better than I am, and that's that's what I always I've just learned. A great Europe
better than this than I am you should do it yet. I fear I just bound that's been my sort of man german style is higher people smarter than me and in just put them in positions to succeed, yeah, but the ear it is obviously, is the creativity now that the first thing is Think my upbringing has done such a good job of me being sort of self denunciation of anything I'm good at it. I regard this exactly some of the times and ours I spend with my shrank. It's like have a hard time forget what the fuck I'm actually good as well, especially because the people the doktor Nervy regularly. A pretty common thread through all of us is like this sense of being fraudulent, oh you're, one hundred percent. I think we all feel like Well, wait! I'm not Anthony Boarding, I'm not summons so somehow I'm a fraud, because I'm not those guys, but
Somebody wants to be David Chang and feels fraudulent about trying to be use. It's been really weird and I've been a bad boss in so many ways, and I just tried so hard to like be better. A lot of that's been through therapy in I've had a historically bad temper. and I swear to God, I think percent of my time with my shrink is like: why am I so fuck and angry? I can actually tell everyone exactly why certain things up to now and it's crazy to me, I can unfold. This is how my motion is at this point is how we reacted to that, because I've been so much analysis, but for the most part, when I think about what where's happen at moments ago. I feel lucky as flock and too. If it is something I tend to think that I may be good. Add I live in a world of sports analogies. It's like I'm, not player that can't shoot. a rebound or whatever, but their plus or minus ratings always very high.
In the team, winds and and and somehow that sort of how it plays out with me. Are you technically bipolar yeah so I would have to imagine, as the thing is spinning up in its getting hugely successful. I have to imagine that's a very dicey area for someone like you is that did. Did you have fit of highs. During all that expansion, will you know the interesting thing was being met? kid and and and seeing my shrink on a regular basis, think my highs were like not as high in my lows born is low the submarine Nation is really what fuck me up the most right right, yeah, it wasn't just does fraudulent or feelingly impostor syndrome I felt like it was survivors guilt than like should it happened to me to be happened this personal here, because there is so much better than me like why the fuck is this happening to me yeah and
had that release. I would just drink my face off at night, the arrow. So I'm you have we delicious right. I see that every time I open up, Netflix you're, so I break luncheon dinner, which, as I said, Amazon and Kate Mckinnon. You have to be friends with Aziz right he's like yeah yeah right, and food in the art by the way, he's great four year industry in that I watch master or not, and unlike oh yeah, it's cool to be Super Indo. What taco your the middle the afternoon like to have. That is like a mission of like no every single time I eat. I want to try to make it the single best thing I could consume in this moment and where I met geographically is I like it it's cool. You know it's funny likes weirdly. I got to know pretty deep, the world of New York City Comedy, I think it started one we open up? The first restaurant, John Romanian, they crawl, would go. Do there are sort of routine atrophy fees? I think that was a name, so they were just start
I will just starting out and I knew crawl from neutral friends and they would come over and we just lament how bout careers were from there like comedian. Just step kept on common in problem introduce me to Aziz when these were still it in what you Oh no, shit yeah like two thousand six, so I got to know these people before anyone you any any rights, really weird It's been funded like grow up together, they're in so many different ways right there, Stay to arm chair. If you dare
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ugly glaciers. What season are you in the world to which we filmed breakfast lunch and dinner a sort of a beside delicious into because filming This is so fucking heart, because they are Travelin stuff or, oh, my god. I think it was sixty eight days a trial for me. I got here and not just for that. Just like trying to assemble these massive topics and into some in a cohesive fifty minutes, thought you serious thing was tat in We wanted to do something fun, and so little bit quicker. So that's why now X and Morgan novel who want and ask for twenty four star into the Mr Rogers Dark my partner and ugly Delicious was like. Let us try to do like A one day shoot and it actually proved to be way can harder than anyone thought to it.
George you, because I thought I'd like a lot of these actors are like they're, not acting twenty like twelve hours a day, the you you do your thing for an hour. Then you go back to your trailer right. Oh yeah come on efforts, while ours I'm acting for maybe forty two minutes that's twelve hours, but you lines in front of a camera here and there eating, and it's just a lot. It's a pretty taxing thing. I will say the easiest one for sure was the one with Rogan we're we're just so I was so high that out, he would only do it by smoked. Join every hour that was the second season and we're working on the show with Hulu so a bunch of shows for Hulu right now and we're filming with Chris fatiguing a tv show
how to stop production because of this epidemic, so that was that was like a crazy thing, could you say which side of all this you like the Maoist or you at all or you hated all I don't know. I don't think when I do media it feels like work, it does, but its not working kids. that right to me what workers and it's so fucking hard and managing the restaurants so hard, but somehow I always again. I was like it to an addiction. Ninety percent of it. I think sucks in restaurants. that one percent who that's what you're chasing after all the time, it'll keep me in the back yeah and in the media, and I don't feel the high so much. It just feels like a pretty steady thing, and I like it because it's unable to like Gimme, a bigger platform and I want to be able to be responsible without platform, but I feel guilty. We.
we to say that I like it, I mean because its something. I know a lot of other Shasta have that opportunity and I feel like a wimp in some ways, but I also like it because it allows me to my brain engaged in other ways and continue to grow it. But I will say you know, is someone who really enjoys you and am I think, your great at it? I think you're great at the media side, I think people were so confused by Anthony, or because it appeared that he had the exact life we all fantasize about which is like perpetually on vacation. Going out and having great food drinking with people and having fun, and I think jeweled cell feeling time self check in time, all that being a cow I personally, but clearly some significant. depression issues and I think it's I went for someone like you for someone like me: the girl, ok Yeah the grass
screen over there I'm doing this. This is good, but Man always happen scheduled self here, time self check in time, all that being accountable to people, I sure hope, that's a party year programme and plan, you know I'm tryin, I'm tryin really harden and- and I know it's a problem- people like the first in people says Hey data. You take care of yourself when, like ten, tell me that, unlike a month, unlike oh shit, I I'm I'm really in it right now, and you know tony Tony passing was brutal for me, because in so many ways he was a mentor like an older brother figure to me, and when he he died, what was so hard for me. he was ass. I thought she was going to happen to me not to tony rights and he's the Jagger of your world. That guy is supposed to be impervious to something like that
Then we know we started talking about asking for help in old and that that being assigned a strengthened for goods period a time. I was really matter myself because I felt selfish in whenever I see Tony, I think we're not what I we ve got to know Tony really. Well, we will just hanging and eat and drink can have an amazing time and then I think it got a little bit less of an Hank, as you realize I gold chains, fucked up, I I got I gotta, be like. I gotta be like a respectable adult for him in help him out, I think that where I felt bad was she had to be so strong for everyone else, yeah that No, if anyone gave in return to him- and I felt really guilty, I wish I had said: hey Tony, like you're, always help me. What can I do for you yeah and I dont know if that would have made a difference, but I know a lot of people felt the same way because we constantly given to people you. I think that these kind of
furs, it's really hard to imagine that they need someone to take care of them as well yeah there are so many occasions where I could have just had that simple conversation, but as you is someone who's wrestled with all of it. There is no real magic words right. It's gotta, be the person asking for help and becoming open to all suggestions and yeah. I think I was intoxicated just like everyone else is like Tony's gotta, even though it no, there might have been signs. Are things and you just like she's gone through all that she's gotta. Do you got it? You know my good for They chose at its best and they had a very differently. Than anyone else, has chosen act in of writing different ways. He's like Tony just jump from heroin to work rising right ever went to rehab. He just call Turkey heroin the end tony Hadda of severe it. the personality that was tempered over the years, but it scare
for me for myself or to people that I care about that also have addictive personalities and end. it's something I never thought I talk about as much as I do. I'm so glad you do because again you're somebody's Tony. It is incumbent upon you, you on all of the vulnerabilities- and you know this goals in an helps people not feel alone and mares, seen someone successful whose still actively vulnerable and actively act asking for help, helps a road. This notion that you can succeed your way into feeling good, but you you can't do it absolutely, and I I don't know if I had ever be this open about it. If he didn't pass her because I really really rustles I well. If there they can be learned- means that, like it's stupid, bottle it all up and not tell anybody, and I hate myself in a variety of ways, and I always hate myself in a variety of ways. But if there is one thing that I can feel good about
Could I just help one person, then and it's worth it. But is it easy when you talk about all the stuff, because you why men in aid for fifteen years, so it's got uneasy in? I go you're my shit and from strangers ever city I'm workin in, and so I certainly I got used to it. You know how about your video, we ain't restart. My god will do that. First time I said I was molested. I've been sitting on Africa fourteen years now thing I told someone again for another five, and then I told them again in a year now tell anyone who did really doesn't have the weight it used to, but I'll tell you that if, I'm being that honest, it's a lady for me to talk about the things have gone through as opposed things I'm currently going through that. Why still very challenging for me to go oh, no, I'm still fight being a scumbag hourly that that's Give my dna its. easier, but I still yeah dude theirs
potholes all over just walk out your front door. Yes, so you know that some might. I could get better. I aspire to be better at that the time, vulnerability the real time struggle. You know some, It's crazy that I did recently two months ago. because I've been trying to get the right medication for me. Yeah there a couple years where I decided to go off medication and I can look back and we like wholly fucking shit like I was so fucking out of my mind and thankfully back on it, and it's always been hard to sort of get me. a place where everything is working right yeah. I feel so sympathetic to everyone that deals with what you did, because, even if you find that magic recipe right your body, evolves, its ongoing right. There's, never magic combination like the way I've always described that it feels like? I can just get enough oxygen if I'm, in right, like I'm, not drowning per se, but it feels like I could at any moment
after years of seeing my doctor, which way did I feel, like I'm bipolar, wanna, say three four years ago cause I'd ask MIKE what am I to say. Why would you want to know this David? Unlike far just tell me what I want to fuck it now and weirdly, like two three ago, because we ve been trying to tweak my medication to get it better. Ok, there's a said: dna see: in test that's offered right now and it just as your twenty two chromosomes. That is most why the associated with your mental health and does a couple that single does your liver to see how you process medicine- and this is specifically just get you on the best medicine for yourself, and I sat on that for a long time, but I just wasn't ready to do it because I felt like this was gotta shit. Like I don't know these are moral dilemmas and which open up Pandora's box, I, like I, don't know film in the show last year, was hard When I say I lost my mind, I lost my fucking mind in Cambodia. I was just re. Bad luck in place great place to lose it
because in so many ways I felt battles- and you know what this is. This is what tony What the fuck am I doing in an hour Get ready to have our first son, and I was just know, we're place and I was like shit like I needed, make sure Don't go down this road, so we were like really trying to figure out the rat best medication. For me, and I changed a bunch of things and just did work out and I felt like fuck, I'm just gonna say yes, I want to do this. I got the results back and it blew my fucking I'd really like. Oh, plain so much. It was weird thing to be able to connect the dots damn you know what was most interesting to me was like it. immediately out, if this becomes popular this is this statement. Mental illness immediately because you think I'm a candidate for KEDO me. Ah, there's like something in my dna that says I'm Ketamine responder and I haven't got
doktor, yet because they want to be legally allowed to get ketamine drift into me he's a gas. This could raising and other partners like this, a scary, but you say they have a spray. Where you're feeling bad or you know, you're gonna go to America, so you can actually inheriting your nose and your mediately gonna feel better going like this is fucking crazy, so effectively at second, depend for your emotions as a great you're a diabetic. You know one's gonna make fun of you because you're you don't want to produce insolent, because we ve accept that as a society like hey, you need to take medicine, we get that and I think This is maybe a game changer and how people can accept the fact that people's brain functions.
in their also worth starting to their sorry nicely. Some got bacteria that is really common, indifferent forms a depression. There I mean it's all opening up. I think we're gonna have such better options as we go forward in its an exciting time. Actually I mean diseases. Gotta mentioned yourself an eighteen hundreds dealing with all this stuff on pretty sure I would not be allied with idea. I dont know how to make it either will David everyone checks at you have a podcast Can you tell me the name your guys? It's a change. Show it's on the ringer, gas network with Bill Simmons, and you know now time, I'm increasing frequency because I think the ability to tell stories for ships that are going through this real actually right now the whole idea of light. too small- to fail as part of this hashtag is real, because if the economy almost club two thousand, because these giant institutions it's gone. Be the same thing, if we don't help independent businesses, it's been brutal.
three weeks or so talking to my friends that have basically lost everything, potentially I been weirdly really busy talking to people from the government side actually trying to give them some insight as to what might be to happen to help out everybody yeah, that's great man! I am glad that you are involved with all that so check out your broadcast ugly, delicious and then treat yourself. If you see the Mama who gosain anywhere well good luck at the table by fear see it when this is all over. Please go inside. We ve had a dozen amazing meals around the country at your restaurant. So thanks you're doing this with us. Thanks Valley, appreciated YAP sale, it's my! We want to come here with your New York yeah. I will really love that would be great. Well thanks a tall man,
I don't know my favorite part of the show the fact check with my soul, mate Monica bad men. we don't have normal set up what you say that right in quarantine life of We don't ever normal, set up at the attic where we can really fine tune everyone's levels in their head, foremost jam and now it is kind of a one. Size fits all right you out of here, Whatever volume I'm hearing it, curious as we also using a headphones splutter, so it is conceivable that you're getting more output than I am doing. This way Let's see what, if it sounds the same to ask I ok the sounds. The same sounds the same better mine off. Who knows that a lot of eight or mine have experiences lately view how predict what they are?
I have said it along. I notice you ve decided like three times and loud afforded. I always makes me smile every single time. You say I love, it is really the only thing I have retained from these back checks. Aha, is better mind. It's the only factor remembered is the definition of better might help, which is frequently the illusion. If you hear something or see some thing. Then you start seeing our hearings aware examples. You get a red, Bmw, three series in you, don't feel. Like see those at all, but the second you buy that car everywhere you go. You noticed, there's millions of you're not unique at all their everywhere. Every one has a red three series. I don't know that I'd say that's a classic example, but Swimming Louisiana example can relate to buying a car in the noticing. That are now everywhere. Yes, but before is invisible to you, that's true, though, when I wrote it was some attribution ere. I love that one.
I want some me up so much. You remember that when we learn that from here, what was that one? That is when someone cut you off in traffic- and you would tribute their behaviour attribution to a characteristic of them- are character flaw right so that person's selfish, that person's impatient, as opposed to making it a summation of them contemptuously that there is some situation that cause their behaviour either they had to swerve to miss a dog or there were rushing to get a kidney to the hospital yeah right, you don't know which it is yet unruly prone to just say: people are pieces of shit, make a real big character assessment. I dont think I do that very much you seem to be in the middle me, me in the middle. Well, it's not, and we may yeah. Maybe I'm in the middle truth, be told, I'm just not thinking about that person very much. So it's not like I'm, even like I just get annoyed for three for one second,
in one have second year, and then I don't think so, Well, maybe they're going to the era of the talk myself Yours, like God, Doc awful waters asshole just let it role right off for ass an hour, and I am that I think the goal forget trying to figure out yeah they're, going who care? Yes, yes, that that's the dream! I just dont need to be worried about what that persons do it. I can just be annoyed for one second and then move on. That's the dream, that's the real! What is interesting is is sometimes people are You know, there's some Stan you eating circumstance its cause. Their behaviour. Yes, but I'd say more often than not. I'm right, summoned to the impatient kind, also Kirsten, would always think it's somebody's going to save a life like there and in route to lumbering buildings in measuring yeah and I'm like everyone's a monster. I think I'm per cent
wise. I more often right. Ok, I think in some ways you're right. I think people are acting like assholes, I think they're on their weight or whatever, but it's probably because they had a bad or something's happening with them than is causing mass is not just that they're a bad, horse right right near yeah. That's true! That's true! I'm both thing so so quite often having to children. it likes semi impossible to get out of the house, so I'm often light or in trying to make up to now the golden just keep back enough when you start the process, which is great, that's would yet the polio. you got a feed him in this and that the package in the Tampa tantrums and the meltdown wardrobe changes in all of it leaves me probably, but on the highway going somewhere later than we should end when entitled prick
Both things are happening by cut you off in traffic, both people whom we write. It was our situation. And it was that I'm entitled pricked by just cause. You had a hard time getting out the door and your late doesn't mean you have to cut people off you can I'll, just say: sorry. When you get to the place, you got and not make more carnage on your way there well so here's another thing I think of quite often is because I both do it and I'm the victim or or recipient of it, which is, I drive fast. I like the fucking, I felt a joy yes on from, like it. and I I I never understood why anyone's getting maxim, not inconveniencing them. If I'm in the lovely and I go buy you going ten miles and professor near going no sweat of your back, there's nothing happening to you yet again people flipping off their hunger, the do whatever they do, and am I I'm GIS.
happily with a smile on my face, striving to work quickly no aggression on my end, there's no anger. There's no mallet yet I'll, be on the highway and would have reason I'm not in the mood to go fast. I'm just listening to a pot gas and for an instrument of below by me in my first thought. My Brussels, like God, that guy's aggressive you might be there smile and listen Christopher Cross Sailing out. There might be no aggression to it, but it's funny cause it's the exact same behavior, but when I do it, it's swollen loving. I just like to drive ass well when someone else their aggressive and impatient. All these things But it's also that people driving insanely fast it makes other people scared it's it's fair to be like this the driving too vast, as if, even if If you are driving next mean you're driving super fast and I got an accident with you, and if it was my fault, you been like the chances that one of us are dead is way higher. What I don't think so, to be honest with, you,
Don't think the difference between crashing at sixty five and eighty is a big difference, just percentage wise, think about a dna. Don't let's say this: if you hit a wall anything over forty, five, your debts, fifty five or something there's a point worth just damages the damage. Now it's gonna accordion quicker something, but I think there is a big difference. Twin crashing into a wallet. Eighty five and crash into all sixty five linger Gunnar. Maybe I don't know either. some experiments on an impression on six march, I verily I feel again and again aggression or eighty five whack, This is a episode that is very mental. Health heavy talk a lot about, mental health, which I love and he was so open and vulnerable about his struggles, beer, it's hard to be happy. there isn't. It always begs the question: why why
is mental health pandemic level. That's what was the first question when the dsl was created, they sort of being able to administer the standardized test to millions of Americans. Inclusion, was either this test is too sensitive in its labeling too many people with mental health issues or the a pandemic of mental health, I'm inclined it's, the negative mental. How you mean we're here and I am inclined to think the latter, that there is pandemic levels of depression and different issues. Here think, it's very, very common, so calm down and then you, Sir, you have to ask yourself why it was this: the mental state of human beings or a hundred thousand years ago. I can't imagine I would think about this. The other day watching an animal show- and I was thinking, there's no way an animal is designed in his evolve to live in mental anguish, there's there's no upside to it, and then I just started thinking
it has to be a result of like this weird life? We have that, where that we're not designed to help yeah gets a result of life getting too big, which also leads to higher levels of thinking, which is great and has a type positives, but also comes with some lows. So I think it's one of those like you can't have the good. Without the ban yeah? It's almost it's like a one in the issues, has simply to speedy amount information you have access, do so three thousand years ago, you being a try and you can probably be aware of one or Two other neighbouring tribes, and that be your full extent of the knowledge of the world's you and me finding out that there is some earthquakes Haiti and then a pandemic in China than the stock market crash in Germany. Ledges all these epic problems. Yeah, that's
and the globe that are all in your head. None of that stuff we've been you had also like Proteus. the powerlessness. We haven't anxiety because when you were that group of a hundred members of a great. You could actually enact a change container, all your whole world yeah and then the mix of crazy, fast pace with totally sedentary lifestyle. As far as not being physically active, sitting in everywhere, you got a lot in what interests me is. There is no going back clearly we're not going back to the stone age. So then you have to be pragmatic. About ok will then is working because these medicines better and better and better so that they can augment what it whatever things being displaced in her head. Something must correct for thou answered. I ask: is that the future, where we're going to have to be medicated in a way that makes our our environment jive with our reptilian wiring. Well,
more awareness programme, more research about the brain and the chemicals and what releases dopamine had been those can mean dirty is so much research, but I'm sure that's gonna continue, and maybe there are things we don't know that can unleash some of that staff. Naturally, just like exercise now we know you note there might be other things we just don't oh yeah, I'm just a little pessimistic when the solution is like a behavioral adjustment when applied to the seven billion people, like, like everyone can take a pill in the morning. Look at in terms of surgeries are Jenna mean they very right all over the body, but like back surgeries there, like fifty percent successful on average, that such a low percentage, yet people refused to do physical, and they know physical therapy, like nine b plus per cent of the time, fixes a problem, whereas the surgery only half the time fixed in that particular case, so I just always so pessimistic about. If there's a behind
Euro solution to all of it will people adapted its as Canada, interesting that Europe has mystic about it, because you are a part of a group that has made a lot of behavioral chain yeah and unfortunately, the success rate of that programme is at its best estimation, like thirty percent yeah. So you know way more people. Try it and don't achieve sobriety, then try and achieve sobriety. But alas, there no better solution, so even the lower percentage, one is still the best solution. That's chair now, I'm a debate, I guess it depends on the person, but would also- more now just like this. Just like this podcast and talking about these things makes people feel not alone and that helps, and so when we have people on talk about that's what I'm doing this helps me, then I think it encourages other people to make those changes to. I also think like
Ten, like you say that, in order to make a change in Europe ass to be on fire. We really have to be in trouble. I do think that true, I think a lot of people once they hit like girl real low low. They do start thinking over what I hope they do is our thinking. What can I do too climb over Lazy eight, this a bit me even me, I've been on the lower end of the happy. That's the hapless bacteria fur little bit and a few years ago I was like I gotta figure this our team and I remembered years ago when I had a heart of anxiety and panic. I was doing stuff together. like I was meditating and I was really good about exercising and I was seeing my therapy.
regularly and then I climbed out of it- and I didn't need to do those things as stringently as I was, and now I feel like. Ok, I gotta get back in those routines cause those helped. Ah, I once you feel the benefits you can tap back in a little. You sure I totally agree, but I will just also point out the year. Also someone who's, not a progress made her by nature. So, like thing for you, it took like three ways of misery before your like. Ok, I gotta do some and you're someone, it doesn't put shit off now. Extend that someone will the huge progress in the air and didn't their homework, which is a big section of the world, and I just get a little pessimistic yeah I mean I do think I should have been more proactive a month ago, a home,
so it wasn't like it was three days. It was a build up of three days. I really love to get there, but I as a suit you, but I don't know. I believe that people can help themselves. Yeah, a lotta people can help themselves also, hopefully, All this thought in conversation and research continues. No further upstream I mean you like to hope that a good percentage of this is is childhood related and I feel like we could improve the child, hoods yeah, that's a lot of pressure and apparent already is that's why I dont think parents. I think there needs to be more systems in place to help children yeah. You know yeah I think like it on child care became something that we oxidize or offered, and then it had to have a lot of emotional components to the rainy like it. You not have it. If we actually invested in put some effort into giving little
its tools and yeah yeah? I like to think it would be a lot easier down. Downriver, ivory: ok couple He said Japan is Korea in the early 1900s. One thousand. Nine hundred and ten Korea was annexed by the empire of Japan after years of war, intimidation and political machinations, the country would be considered a part of Japan until nineteen. Forty five, in order to average control over its new protectorate, the empire of Japan. Asian all out war on korean culture, which is when you were saying wines grandfathers, like basically japanese, I now talk about like generational trauma like that- get passed down. This idea that what you are is not good enough and are trying to be something else that really the piggy yeah Ok, so I just want to be clear, because you guys you guys we're talking about craft a lie
just don't know. If people know that your time out craft, the restaurant, crap c r s t that's Tom, collect as restaurant he's a big shot, he's he's on Topshop Hall and it's a huge fancy, big restaurant, but because its food related, I didn't know people we're gonna, think it was her after back and she K are eight have to correct them. My grandma always worked out the what a great company is delicious cheese, housing out ass Jesus, that's my growing cheese and the best hundred years running our along it spent invented, and I think, My grandma had worked there. It gave me like an extra amount of pride in the wrong place, it even better, and that is no way that it is better it tastes. So what a product we really believed it by General motors. Oh, it's a genuine, but anyway that's not the crap. That was alluded to. Unfortunately, yes, and really that was
those with only facts, because it was more stories and emotion, emotional exploration challenges, so lovely Rayner experts episode yeah, that's very that's true! She would go a little bit about I'm too hot to handle check. You got into it last night, yeah! Well I'd! Yes, we watched won T get Man you and then we separated and then you have been watching and then I was watching and it's a That is. Why show what did you say why? I think it's a good. She would tell the premise: tell the payments it's ten five hot checks and five hot guys go to Ireland. Presumably when it turns out it was Mexico, I looked it up, but at any rate there on a beach and earn a house in and make them to think the prom.
is your everyday reality show or there are going to date and hook up and step, and then they violate they can't kiss or fog or do not want asked for by or masturbate Zanna other, whatever monitoring the air so gives you everything you want you want. You want gawk right, you gonna be. Judgment all in dislike some people, like some people, not all happened. You get that you get a big tasty serving of that. But then slowly you start seeing like. these younger males. I hope that this is just a signal of what younger people are like I hope it's indicative of young people at large, because these boys on this show were or are so the port of each other. There such good communicators, they hug each other. They like and each other to be vulnerable out, just like, oh my god, I'm so encouraged by this show any I'm only five, then I know spoilers bizarre everyone's watching I think its top rated
I believe that in theirs is crazy. Gender reversal thing happening in the show were alike. guys, are having on these deep talks with one another and are also approaching the girls and like talking about their feelings and it's so the opposite of what you used to sing or used to sing the girls are being like quote MIDI and talking about their feeling. And competitive with each other, but that serve happening with the guys. Like There's two guys that were one guy was mad at another guy, because is. He was creeping on his girl, but it was. like he was fighting it. He was her. He was her and he was just being kind of quiet and aloof, and then the other guy came up and was like gone on to me. I was like oh, my god, that is so what were used to see women, do yeah so
like a shock to watch it in this gender of us what I love it. I let it well- and you know its interests easy. I hadn't thought of this while watching him, but I'm thinking of it while you're explaining it, which is it. This is not a. This is one of the worst aspects of men is that they often established there there status rank based on there. Vehicle prowess. So Kells is enormous, yeah, just so much bigger than everybody yeah there's something to that that there's something about the harmony of the men in the show, because that the strata is so clear, physically and then is one tiny little advantage. We do have men, sometimes it's so cancers, but I think in this specific case, you're nuts, in a ton of jockeying, for who alpha is it's kind of just very plainly obvious to the eyes. I think the girls are more cured or there's more anxiety about whose who whose alpha whose beta, whose gamma, I think they're scrambling more for the ranking, whereas with the guy,
it seems to have already been sorted out, like ones goofball ones, the big Tuppence mother fucker at their all attractive. So I think that's part of it is like there are baseline very attractive. That's like the point of the show you so their sex attics to mean I'm calling it back, but they all do nothing but of sex and are used to that. The often as your you're right, it's like big. You are, but also about how many women you can get in everyone. There is sort of on the same playing field with that I'm just saying there's a harmony in this house- and I think part of it has to do with the alpha quote. Alpha is clear, there's one that is so much bigger and stronger than everyone. Just because he's bigger and stronger. I would never label him, as the alpha like seeing this whole thing. Like a leader of the group in mind, he does not seem like the leader, I agree, It doesn't seem like the leader of the group yeah, I think
I'm talking about something and if you haven't felt that you can't understand it, maybe like that guy can kick everyone's, ass in there's, something about that being very clear. That can add harmony really quickly to a group of guys but when there's four guys that think there that guy, I think, there's just a lot of trouble, come in yeah, I don't. I can't relate to any that. So I now really stupid. It's pretty still have never making a case that it's the right way to be here. Just snobs observation, mine, it's a good show. It's worth watching good, really go! I love you love! You.
Transcript generated on 2020-05-01.