I'm David verrier and new zealand who ended up accidently, marooned in america, and I want to grasp what makes this country check. Being you hear this always this thing looming over me. This fear, but like with so many fears I have. I don't know if the fear is justified or not, because I I have so many unjustified fears like that. Maybe I'll accidentally leave a tap on when I leave the house so that when I come back, it'll be a flooded kitchen or bathroom. My other big worry here in america being so are you an idiot, or are you just not paying attention just answer my question because legal system in the united states is scary. I mean americans file, forty million lawsuits,

yeah? Forty million many of those will be frivolous, but that doesn't mean they're, not scary. Cooperation spend over twenty billion a year on commercial litigation, which makes sense when you consider walmart get sued about five thousand times a year, literally so get ready to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. This is the suing at the search, birds fly this man. This is found because taxes normally sitting bias and captain We decided to stretch the limits of the exclusive Many countries will make us soon

But I think what am I gonna assumes are I love that will be like a sewing part, two episode, oh my advice about it on the ground in the field me and my court case of any myself. Why do you share my fear of this at all, because I honestly walking round I m kind of just expecting something terrible to happen or exiting the hurt someone in suddenly I'm in prison. I dont normally until we started doing this job yeah. I have really thought about it at all and not important enough. I kind of feel like you have to be of some level of importance. I d, think this all shark either of you I've both soon and been sued. He isn't gonna name had haphazardly. here. You are you out of there about ok, so I have a very specific idea of suing that I unwittingly had been advertised in effectively. I thought all lawsuits were frivolous and we should get rid of a more get into that. I'm sure, but I was a huge critic of

it also each other. I was always raved about new zealand musing on such a fund placed a visit because I'll let you jump off a skyscraper into a box, a glass. If that's what you want, do, there's no lawsuits. We don't really have low suits you anne, but it so rare that you would sue someone for anything and when it comes to our personal injury stuff, we ve got this hollow. The system in the VON site is you can write in a jet, boat ngos or been you can go on skype, If you can do the base John everything's on the dole out, assign any they don't give a fuck. Now go crazy tom cruise shot, some of those mission impossible down in new zealand, where he was flying helicopters upside down and the south island and museum, and I wonder if that's because who's gonna do shit. In addition down there? That's right. Also tom cruise is fine, a helicopter ups down in your neighborhood, you write him I'll a and thank you. Let go the court house. It would be to protect the company not protect Tom cruise year.

I'm curious goes down and have all the flames he might see or his family. My yes, you might say that movie company, that's making the home, but in essence tom cruise wants a fire helicopter upside down right, and he can't do here because of that because of the liability of the company. So the company is not going to pay for this production the film day, so he can't do what he wants. So he goes. Oh, what? If we go down to new zealand, get some leaves of us, in our work and put on his job we're on yeah. I think this stupid england, oh no! I love it. It's not looking out for your best interests. I'll say that yes, but let me just say, I'm gonna paint the full picture. I was a motorcycle singer. The first year I lived in l, so I drove all day long crazy, crazy, crazy trying to get packages and things to place. I got off work. I was going to see a movie a leisurely. whose down broadway power, which at the time was one way with three lanes and then parallel parking on either side of the three lines was very very wide and I was writing in the third world.

There was a woman driving a car in the second lane and right as I was about to pass her, she saw a parking spot open in the parallel parking linked to the right of me. He was a loved me. She slammed on our breaks and made our right. Fucking turn right in hit me, and then I got me a trajectory in do a parking meter outside Those you know those little aluminum signs around them, telling you the hours of operation just bent those perfectly around broke. My arm hiring lance the accident have good marina therefrom banana republic that what they were like corduroy fish and then I stood up and I was wearing shorts. where the fuck you got both hands vanish in accidents. Yeah just legs off below the knee

My right leg was just the brightest hawaiian punch a like from kneecap down to my ankle, but I was very much in shock right right, an said. No medical insurance, Another episode noted so the amber this comes mind you, the woman, gets out a car- oh my god, I'm so sorry Do you like if you're gonna gave all responsibility for this cause? That's a big part of it. Isn't it whether they take responsibility, are not minuet young who she's? Like I'm? Sorry, I'm sorry! So an ambulance comes, I refused to go. I can't ford and ambulance ride, and god knows what the bill be. Once I get hospital lottery and I don't think I'm that hurt cuz, I'm in shock my motorcycles really fucked up the handlebars are bent for but, but I I also can't pay for a tow truck. Oh no, I ride this fucked up broken motorcycle. That barely goes in a straight line back to my apartment. Like eight blocks I park it, I got no money, I'm fucked! This is my only form of transportation. I got

there is I get in the shower and as the warm waters coming over me. I hate this. I go. Oh my god, I'm in a lot of pain and I'm noticing my skin is completely gone. Finally, I can see rose, I'm gonna have to go to the hospital. I call my mom I can either she highlight guy mammas, a great approach that way Michigan. Ma? Am I I've been it's? Ok, I go into how great I am couldn't be better, but I think I need to go out. She's, like oh, my god use my credit card growth has to go. There broken arms and broken ribs. They bandage me all up blah blah blah. So now I don't have a motorcycle. I get this hospital bed and then I call her insurance company, a mare me. They, like tough bananas, call your insurance company got like whatever the minimum, whatever is, and then my neighbor in my apartment building knows a lawyer, and he said you should soon get this pay you for soul, ok so currently among moral high ground and that faded quickly, because

happens is when I go to the attorney in a very shabby office in santa Monica. He quickly explains me step number one. I need you to go see this doctor and not this dock. Monica nigh satisfactory, yes, he's a chiropractor, dinging, dang, I start going and one I tell you tourney. I cannot afford to go see a doctor. You're in bad shape, area, missing, skin, missing, scanty bright needs for some. this is some chiropractor gorgon broken bones muzzle twenty! I want to add a note what the fuck is going on, so I am now going to these weekly appointments. And I'm just going along with the program and he's like you'd these treatments? Don't worry, it's gonna be pro bono only when the case that guy I'll get paid the attorney I'll get thirty Our third lockers gonna get a third which I found weird. He didn't get an accident. No man, I'm gonna, get a third, so in answer, thank you. Gotta help me get like knew how my share

It's a few grandsire liking motorcycle bubba. This all goes on this, this racket. With me going to this doctor some months, I get a call I saddle being able it was worth three thousand bucks on tax, so I got it thousand dollars. I hate that I would try to imagine what that attorneys day was like you would have had to have forty. Fifty of us. under that doctor to make a living at this and who recommended it someone in your apartment, other unsavory character, who news the ins and outs of personal injury. Yours, I wonder, driving around single the billboards on bush else's and like in the desert, and it says I who are these people and which ones can you trust? Yes in a night bet, you'll get into the whole system. That's built around, so it's like

insurance company would just been fucking cool. None of this wouldn't have happened. I wouldn't have to pursue this route so that sucks it sucks that you're forced to do what I had to do so. The second thing is: I've been on tv for thirty six seconds, people are taking meetings with me, my friend Al Sheeran. I come up with this idea for a movie and then in the interim, I'm talking to my first and best friend and ally, I'm not going to say his name he's passed and I loved him. It's just very unfortunate. He said. Oh won't, you meet with me in the producer he works for for breakfast and you can tell us the idea. Maybe we'll want it. So I do that. I meet him in the morning and the producer and then that same day I go to fox searchlight and Allen I sell. this thing in the room at vocs searchlight great great congratulation, I'm happy! I talk to my friends like. Oh you know what these are not only out. You know we sold it fox lay. I told you I had a pitch later in the day,

They were one revers he's like what fuck searchlight makes an announcement. They ve just bought this budget in the trades and exciting beer. I got a call from my lovely attorney james Feldman, Jamie Feldman. He goes. I got good news and bad news and I saw what were he said. You officially arrived in- show business because you're getting sue silly me you know a blankenheim james, the name and I'm like yeah, that's one of my best friends. All this is all whole. What I think I figured out after the fact was that I think he had told his boss that he had been developing this. I the almost bring it to me. I think he was painted into a corner of a lie. I think that what is really like you, better silly him if he soldier idea whatever it wasn't enough. He heard the fucking idea this breakfast so now the machinery of at all. So I say to my attorney: that's fucking horse

if he heard about it an hour before I sold it like what are you talking about while he says that he developed the idea with use his ideas? Well, he goes look at searchlight I'll, just give him a couple of grand make them go away, and I go no. No, no! No! No! No! No! No! No he's not getting any money for this, not after that now, so what he said, is it will cost tens of thousands to defend yourself against this case. Yang has, the journey you, even if you are on the right, the attorneys given try to bring this case to trial and studio would way rather just make them go away for a few grand it'll be less legal cause, they'll be less in the press about it. getting all the reasons that I would be an idiot to not say. Okay- and I said, let me think about it. I call back progress. I was young in me, no fuckin vitriolic about everything. I call back and I said fuck that let's go to court

I'm so anna principle. Now, I'm not settling the man when he called back the attorney in said: ok, we're going to court, they dropped yeah, obviously cause. I had nothing to say up to that point, all the mechanisms all them. jean Marie our jailing, you do. This is a cheaper option. It's easier, its quicker. It doesn't take your project, how zone incentives to just give these fuckin. Well, some people, yeah a lot of money, all away money you're completely, and I think that maybe why I had such a angry viewed toward sealing wax. If you had a bad expand. No there's a super bad experience. Yes, then, that I die because of monopoly daggers of addiction. Sadly, How did that friendship, as I made a really bad for him? I was right, god he just ruined, like we had great friendship,

jenny wide is way under this situation. What a drag over a movie they never got made of you guys didn't talk, oh no, you done while don't specifically by my life, do not talk to him too. This is resolved, I guess, if you're being sued, you shouldn't start having casual take on give them any any anything any emma. So gear goes by two years and I was in back I like what am I gonna do. If I see this guide in the night, the monti report me was like you know. I think you should punch amount. That was my gut reaction. Like you came out me new factors, the over, and you put me this bad position and adding mason. I had that thought. I saw him across the room at this big event, this gm event somewhere. Parliament, a song says goofy here then I remembered how much I like my dear I like em, so my man, you couldn't choked me we locked eyes now. I can only imagine one key that he was going to. We saw me and I smile that I'm really big any while back and then we never talked

and then years later mutual friend of ours called said you he he died last night as I would have dragged a fuckin. Ending the whole thing I like the smiling, though I like that your last meeting wasn't you punching about media and winning smile like they're kind of nice and away weird waiter way to resolve things but kind of great mistake june for more flightless. This I'll be right back after a word from mouth sponsors. Flightless bird is supported by or a frames nina what dead doesn't want forefathers day. Another piece of gear device that feels like work with an aura digital frame dead, gets a gift that says thoughtful as it is, if it less to sit up and use yeah and dad notoriously extremely hard to buy for the worse. So you gotta get in. There was something thoughtful, but also easy. A digital frame is perfect and

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Do you feel like you're living in a media bubble like its head of an ever define views that challenge your own? That's where the last debate, steps in its upon caston youtube, show for political eclectic, suit, crave exposure to a diversity of beliefs and perspectives. We love is because this is what we d only try to bring different perspective, and it certainly will grow immunity- and these guys are really smart- its hosted by Robbie gupta, former staff for a bummer and school principle who fought republicans at the ballot box, then for alongside them for china, schools carry branfords on their progressive political organizer turn tik tok star, who used to host a fox use. Radio, show an ricky shot. A gene see new your purse columnist and libertarian fighting to protect free speech. I like this because they basically bridge the political I'll, which is what we are hoping for more up so join the conversation check out the last debate today. New episodes, job tuesdays and thursdays find the last debate on apple pie cast by the fire. Wherever you get your shows,

the I went and talked to a few people just to see if I was the only one that was terrified of being sued. This is what people told me to dislike the culture of suing people here that we just don't have in new zealand. Do you have any opinion on that side to america? Yes, they suit too much the ape the others, germany livelihoods, can I say this forty million lawsuits a year. I think I don't know about the number exists, because we can and people take advantage of them too much You have ensued a few times so what what for a bad business deal gone bad, sometimes, villages away for some people to get a como to hurt somebody to take based, wasn't my work, therefore, to be in a benefit. It was decided,

as for the other parts that they see themselves at the bottom, unless you say it and they want to make it to the top and is a quick way to get there. I mean it. It seems like a scary thing. There is a sense of like walking on eggshells. Because you might do the wrong thing. It's could come after you easily. Do you think it's like a good way to solve problems, or do you think the kind of a bit ridiculous bit ridiculous. I actually think so. Yes, yes, people do a lot of suing here and there evidence furbelows, but sometimes for principle. It seems necessary. Have you ever sued or being suit yourself have I have sued? How did it go? it went in my favor. She was very happy about. That was a very complicated story that I can tell when you heard that story where you like, yeah, that was worth yeah. It was pursuing what you said before, so it seems

justice and when it is a tool you can use when something is unjust, you can hopefully get one up on somebody potentially cooperation or someone much bigger than yourself as well right, yeah. I just want to point out that at forty million lawsuits a year that would be the equivalent of one in eight americans suing someone each year. That's crazy! That's crazy! I mean it's just a tool, it's just as commonplace thing that you jumped to in it so rod, and so blunt in so many used and one person can

I, like multiple lawsuits against the same person, is abuse like that is well yeah state by state potentially like here and allay it does seem like they are diamond. Doesn't lawsuits are everywhere like your agent sad and made to hollywood? Congratulations. You ve been sued like I grew up, and maybe this is just cause. My parents are afraid of. Everything. Suing is like something I should have added into my nightly prayer like, though, earthquakes, no natural disasters, no law suits, but here I guess you have people are doing it all that Why do people lose all their money? Some people do that's one of the many crazy things about swimming as you'll read about these enormous judgments, but it's like the person's got five dollars. It doesn't really matter when it broke, I loved it. People would say they'd sue me all the time might go wild. I dunno what you think you're going to get.

and yeah. I don't see you anymore, that money there's got to be an insurer involved has got to be someone money involved, no one's trying to bleed a stone ivory attorneys too smart to do that suing is an act of just. Eliza person has no mind to get in then you'll. Let it go for corporations and stuff that are doing bad shit. They should be held accountable. The state that I read was and twenty twenty years companies spend a total of twenty two billion on litigation for commercial law. As this or other situations when each believe it's a lot of money, but I couldn't make sense in this. Sir. I went and just talked her a lawyer, and this is what I learned what thing. This becoming pretty clear to me is that I am not alone in my concerns in this land of litigation. In what's funny, I actually have that shares will help. You understand how you feel. there's just litigation everywhere over everything. I'm talking to cameroon struck a lawyer

he works and media law and is also a published author and lower professor he's alive than tints looking man with a bald head he's. Also italy self aware, which is but I really like about him. I think americans love to hate lawyers in general- think about lawyer jobs right like what call a million lawyers at the bottom of the ocean was a good start I use right now. I should explain that my fear of being sued is a bit more logical than my fear of flooding the house with a forgotten tat. Because of beans. dude here in amerika are already twice my mom it's a lot more money than me as an I don't have millions of I was, and he did have millions of dollars. It happened back in twenty. Sixteen, I made a documentary called circles about david tomato and new york, man with a tickle fit a shoe, was harassing young men on lies. It was like

a bomb went on your phone them and a passionate and highlight known and have yet to publication on the hell. But for me, oh, how did break loose because when I visited america six years ago to show my film the subject of the document tree wasn't very happy, and so he Do me a few times my lawyer in that chaos sixty years ago was cameron. So this conversation, mozilla reunion of sorts had saved my bacon back then for discussion here we have worked together and just quickly I mean how unique was looking at circles and dealing with that was at like a very bug, standard job for you. Well, it was sort of standard

in the sense that you did a film? You were threatened with a libel lawsuit than you actually did get sued in two different courts. In terms of my practice, that's pretty common, I mean unfortunately, or fortunately, depending on your perspective, my clients get sued for libel or privacy violations, and I defend the cases your documentary was different, cause it was so crazy and the facts were just really weird and the deeper I got into it. You know I kind of became maybe a little bit like you. I went down the wormhole and that's definitely an experience that I've not had before. I still get the creeps when I think about that time. It was incredibly scary. One thing: reading the cease and desist leaders and eventually the court papers that had been files. I was sorry Listen worried all the time, but I did Some things in my favor for once I was telling the truth a good thing when it comes to defending information allegations. On top of this,

demand suing me was just clearly lying. What happened in that case was something. That's never really happened to me before and hasn't really happened to me since which is that I sat down with his lawyers and convince them that the facts were such that they should not bring this lawsuit, and that never happens. I mean lawyers. themselves showed the other side that we really got them and they can't let it get this case, but cases always go on, because lawyers always think they can win. In this case, remember very clearly meeting his lawyers. showing them the documents that you had and seeing the expressions on their faces gradually change as they realise that, while David model, maybe wasn't who they thought he was. It was extraordinary moment cut a long story short, I won the case. I mean I sort of did

I guess I don't know what would have happened because David to matter had a heart attack and died, therefore I was no longer being sued, but I learned to things through all that, for one thing, rich people can be incredibly scary, say We? Even if someone says you and your innocent, you still have to pay it. injure yourself and to me that shows a very big floor in the justice system. Here I mean that's the obvious thing: isn't it the the problem we have here is that it certainly gives an advantage to the wealthy and the privileged her. If they have money can literally shut down a media organization or an individual. What chance do you have in america as someone that doesn't have money that finds themselves involved in the system? So any sense of fairness? Or is it a money game yeah? I think it's not fair. For the most part, there do exist mechanisms to try to balance the scales I mean, for example, in the media context. We have

then called the anti slap laws which a lot of states of past. Basically, those are laws which reverse the presumption proof in a live, a lawsuit and also provide for attorney seas, which we don't usually have in the united states. If a media organization is successful, so if in media organisation get sued in a safe like california, where there's an anti slap statute, the media organisation can filed and anti slap motion, the anti slap motion requires the plaintiff to come forward to establish the merits of his claim at a very early stage, which usually is not what happens and then, if the plaintiff can't come forward to us.

which the merits of his claim and the defendant wins. The plaintiff has to pay the legal fees of the defended. Slap stands for strategic lawsuits against public participation, in other words, slap lawsuits. Lawsuits often used to shut things down like free speech, so anti sat laws are there to prevent people using the courts to timid eight people who are exercising their first amendment rights right site, free speech, but of worse than only works for well organised, sophisticated media. Come Please and states that have any slap war. It doesnt work if you're in a joe schmo and you ve got a grocery store in year, suddenly sued by Walmart. You don't have the same protection so yeah. It is, I think, a sad fact of American legal system that having money having access to lawyers and courts gives you a tremendous advantage. I keep thinking about what options Joe blogs heads

when some powerful entity is suing them. I mean when you were a kid just run away from your problems like you, can just physically run away from a bully, but at some point, we transition from teenagers into adulthood running away because less of an option, or does it if someone's trying to serve me with some kind of legal document or something can I just sort of run away? Is that a good thing to do well, I'm not ever advise you to run away, but you can, to a large extent, for a certain I have time runaway absolutely emmy, it's funny, because we have this kind of old fashioned notion that you can't be served with a lawsuit until your actually touched with the lawsuit writer a process has has to put it in your hands and say, sir, you are sir damned if you see the brain

the server coming and you run off before they get to you then yeah you can avoid it. I did have a client who she was a car and they put the papers. the window and she shoved them out of a window that doesn't count. He can't do that. Eventually, someone can go to court and get a court order and they can say I've tried to serve Mr Ferrier a half dozen times, and this is I did, and once I showed up and I saw him driving off in his car and another time I saw him sprinting down the street. I'd like you to authorize service by publication, which means they can put a notice in a local newspapers david barrier. You are, sir, you are now a defendant dennis lawsuit, and then you gotta keep an eye out for their publication. Has then you ve been served without even knowing really that you ve been sir, you can run for a while, but not forever.

Mistaken for more flight. This work will be right back after a word from male sponsors. Flightless bird is supported by policy genius new homebuyers. if you're buying home you ve got a heck of a lot of stuff. To juggle. Tell me about policy. Genius makes it easy to compare insurance quotes from top companies, so you can find your lowest price and fast customers save an average of three and fifty dollars per year on home insurance. If you're not sure what coverage you need or how to find a low price. You need policy genius, let They act like you're born knowing all the stuff you're not do know none of it, none of it. So it's really really really helpful. To have this one stop shop defined by the insurance you need had to policy genius dot com to get started. Policy genius will show you price estimates for policies that fit your search. If you like what they fine, we'll get you switchover for free customers who bundle their home and ato policies with policy genius saved an average of twelve hundred and fifty dollars per year over what

we're paying all the money that the team of policy any us- are in hand at every step to help you make decisions with confidence. The policy genius team works for you, not the insurance companies had to policy genius dot com, your free home and auto insurance quote and see how much you could save. for some process serving as a great job reasonably stable, because for the american justice system to work papers need to be served. I look at the website for the national association and professional process service naps, which comes with a list of pros and cons of the job prose its flexible, its unique you get to travel job security is people will always need to be served. The cons well, there's one main big one,

being served can cause negative emotional outbursts still looking on youtube. It seems to be a popular pursuit, many process service, offering up tips and tricks for I can tell the main floor of the job is that it involves a lot of sitting around waiting, hey folks, I've been a certain legal paper since two thousand and one the majority of my time I spend in the car- and you can see here, I'm at the park in the shade making this video getting ready to go, serve some more legal papers. Do you think it is a particularly just country. I think it's a country that relies on law and litigation to a greater ray than any western country that I know of if you'd look on the front page of the new york times any day. three or four stories on average are going to be about some legal proceedings. Hungary's is soon

the president or some former advisory suing congress or a state is suing the environmental protection aid. Sea or the environmental protection agency, is suing a polluter. We work out, our were governed or our governing through the legal system to a much larger extent than most other countries. The ports are. Seen as one third of the bedrock of american government. We ve got the executive, we ve got the legislature and we ve got the courts and that's one third of the way we govern in this country its baked into our constitution. Do you think, is a system that fundamentally works. Do you think it's for the greater good? I'm so torn by, because there are times where I'm so frustrated,

there's a lawyer and as a citizen by it, but I'll tell you something in the wake of the whole trump insurrection and all the challenges to the voting process. Listen. What was really reassuring to see was that american democracy in the end were All of these challenges were brought to all of these courts. All these different states republicans challenged the results in the courts. cited almost uniformly with the results. In that respect, I think it really work,

breaking news right now. Out of the? U s supreme court or the supreme court has rejected the texas led effort to toss out election results in four key states that Joe Biden won again. That is the thing that I find fascinating is how complex the system is. Here I mean I jumped on that wonderful slightly dodgy source of wikipedia. Before I talked to you and honestly, it's the most confusing thing in new zealand we've got a district court which takes criminal, stuff and civil claims up to three hundred and fifty thousand dollars. Then you've got a high court for like biggest stuff and more serious crimes than just like a court of appeal, and the supreme court has all kind of based on the british system, your system hadn't, even

I will begin from state to state everything. Death is site, fifty countries and one right. That's the really confusing thing about the american legal system is that we are a country of dual sovereigns, rightly the states and the federal government. So there is a whole federal judicial system in that, at its basic level, is pretty straightforward. You ve got the district court and the court of appeals and then that, u s supreme court, however, even within the federal system you ve got the cork claims. You ve got the patent courts, you ve got the bankruptcy courts, you ve got DC circuit and then the state system and the states is It's just a mess. Every state has got its own courts. Sometimes you ve got lower intermediate and highest, but not always in new york. We ve got the supreme court. which is actually the lower level trial or throw misleading name s. Then we have the appellate division and there are different departments

The appellate division, depending on where you are new york state and then our highest court is called the court of appeals which seems like it should be the middle court. But it's not. We ve got municipalities, they got county courts, doses, the court there's trap this less cameras, reeling off sums. America outward for me, it's like when you go to them. It is here and go to fill up. You drink there about twenty types of cohesion, get too many. So, yes, it can be a mess. We do it. one crazy state louisiana where it's the only state. In u S, I believe that's not based on english common long, but is based on french civil law, and so there is a whole bunch of weird procedures and These are called really strange names. I had a case there. We made a motion to dismiss, and it's not called a motion to dismiss, is called a exception of improper. You know whatever the

argument, was in a voice and we're gonna go in and argue the exceptions. This morning I was like, what's the exceptions, no idea, what that is, and that's a remnant from when the french owned louisiana one thing that seems a paling about the system here is that eyes and individual had changed. I have the power to take on a giant cooperation or a company, whether it's warm up, whether its etana, probably not facebook, there too big, but that does seem like there is a certain thing, because the individual power by I can take on the big boys know that's right either friend, practices, personal injury law and they take a percentage of any recovery. So, if your injured in some horrible accident- and you may not have the resources to sue, hospital or the trucking company that he too, or whatever

If you find a lawyer like my friend who is willing to take on your case on a contingency, you can be represented for free and unless you win, you don't have to paint and if you win, you ve gotta pay, my friend, the third or sometimes forty percent of your recovery, but you're right that does allow, at least in some cases, lawyers and incentive to represent them and bring cases on their behalf. So you're right, that's a pretty unique element of the: u s legal system, one of the first things I noticed when I got to america, where all the ads for personal injury lawyers mean and cheap suits, hair slicked back stared at me, from LA by stops on a drive across california, rows and rows of billboards, bye, bye under eye to get the best client today friend tomorrow, one eight hundred this one, eight hundred that whenever I see these signs, It all seemed so familiar you.

Better go. So I am sorry good me. Did you know that you have rights constitution says you do and so do I. I believe that until the quality level of these lawyers is a level of let people are actually grattan, just people that you just gonna get completely screwed cosette signs. Comedic, I mean there's a reason. Bitter Kosovo was originally a comedian. character, it's ridiculous, absolutely and unfortunately like a lot of stuff. It's not as if the p for who really need. Assistance are the ones who are really getting assistance right. It's often the people who just happen to have been hit by the right trucking company, my friend, always used to joke them just perfect case. Was a doctor on his way to work, who got hit by a microsoft We then sell. You know you ve got a doctor that lost income and he's got a huge defended, mainly microsoft, so give him knows he's gonna get a fortune, but if you're not adopt

and your some low wage earners and you dont, get hit by a microsoft van and said you get hit by somebody who doesn't have insurance. It's gonna be really hard to find a lawyer to take her case, and the kind of lawyer might take your case or may be one of those lawyers you see on those billboards, you'll always reading about it and headlines about frivolous lawsuits. America, being this country of frivolous lawsuits, that woman who spills a hot mcdonald's coffee on her lap got reported everywhere. I'm curious if that's actually a thing or effects just being blown out of proportion by the reporting, and maybe it's not as frivolous as we think it is here. I personally don't think it is as frivolous, and I do think that those cases have been hyped by business interests that have a incentive to make. It seem like there are frivolous lawsuits, the mcdonald's, hot

coffee case is a perfect example, because what nobody knows about that case is actually. This was a woman who suffered terrible burns on her body. She had offered to settle with mcdonald's for her medical fees they had refuse. There was evidence that mcdonald's soup, are heated, their coffee, two hundred eighty degrees, so that they could reuse coffee because it saved them rather than putting new fresh coffee and they use superheated water so that they could re heat the grounds they were warned that the coffee was dangerous. They ignored the warning and then Woman went ahead and accidently spilled the super hot coffee on herself. So there's an apocryphal story, that's kind of been circulated. by people who would have you believe that we're out of control and the system is just not work

the majority of dollars and time and money spent in the legal system is spent by big business suing. Other big businesses It's not the little guy suing over the spilled coffee, the judges and the court room time in all of this stuff, that's all being paid for by taxpayers money. Your pain for the judge, your paying for the court room and everybody use employed in that court room and they may be taking years of judicial resources at all for with taxpayers, money, and I dont think that ever really gets attention. It's weird to think that businesses use the legal system here, just as an extension of their business war games to them litigation is a business strategy. Someone wants to take every accompany. You will

eyes and finally shareholder lawsuit against that company. I guess all this just please into people's distaste for lawyers and believe me cam knows this really well Next to journalists. Lawyers may be one of the most despised professions in the heads. It's just the two of us I like them. I cited yeah. I think it's a close race for the bottom there, between lawyers and journalists. As a lawyer, you defending some people that are objective lee, not so great and some people that great do. You have any clients that speak to those

to answer the spectrum? Oh, my god, I defended the national enquire during the entire michael. Come trump fiasco this morning the publisher, the national enquire, is hitting back against former playfully model. Carry Macdougall asking a california court to dismiss her lawsuit against american media ink over a deal to sell the right, sir story about her alleged affair with trump. You just have to google me to see some of the vitriol, but I receive, even though, as I said to my daughter, who was critical of me. Just because you are defending someone accused of murder doesn't mean that europe, fever of murderers, defending the system you defending the principle. I am certainly not a fan of the inquiries journalism or the inquires politics, and I wasn't then, but I did believe in the first amendment in the rights that the enquirer as and I felt strongly about it. But I got a lot of

for it. On the other hand, I am very proud of the work I did with you. I represented the pretty sir of lay remedy taking on the psychologists and scientology. I was involved with a show that got the wrapper. Meek mill released from prison and have the charges against him dropped am very proud of that. So it's very rewarding to do that kind of work, but you can always do it and sometimes you have to remember the principles that you're defending rather than the kaiser to me, not to equate the two, but there were lawyers representing the nazis at nuremberg. Great I mean that was part of what the americans, who essentially created the nuremberg trials and based on the american legal system. They overcame objections that the nazi should not have representation. They insisted part of.

Serving justice was that justice was served fairly, which meant that the people accused we're entitled as good a defense as the people that were prosecuting. That's also a very american notion. This idea that two evenly matched sides will fight it out in the fee. the trial and ultimately the truth will try and we I thought always true, but it certainly noble sentiments one I think worth striving for he was a name is rather than the magic way he had about these down. An outline asking many of you I mean I came away from that kind of thing about more proof of the legal system. Here. Aren't I wouldn't you I'm curious what you made of that as both being much more american than myself cash and gets tricky when you hear national inquire

stuff, like that, all it's wild that he defended yeah, I really like cam and then, when he said that I was like. Oh man, that's all you have to do some of these jobs. It's such a weird thing. We have like a knee jerk reaction to hearing that, like bad guys, vs good guys, but ultimately I am really happy that we do live in america where everyone does have. The right to be represented the ruddy or whether there are good or bad yeah. I like that, because we only think of the ones we know were bad, but we don't think that all of the people that weren't bad were also vindicated. So it's like the system has to operate to family values, bad, yet, and good and bad can get very murky, but easy to take these certain cases and they

Oh, it's so obvious there, but in others you're not at all the documentaries. We watch her mostly about people who were seen to prison and quickly makes you think god the system's terrible. I just want to talk about that hot coffee scenario he gave because there's an incredible documentary called hot coffee. I hope people watch is really changed. My mind on the whole thing soon that one was quite elderly. The burns on her in her thighs were humongous in required scheme. graphs it was were like red skin. Her fucking skin melted all have full skin graphs. She went to court to get them to pay for the skin graphs cause she couldn't pay for. I was eighteen thousand dollars or something you're not cheap to get some new scan. The jury said once they learned, mcdonald's already had and don't call me, and this is from memory

over five hundred and eighty or something complaints of the same thing. They knew it was an issue. They were just saying that coffee was a bit hot, yes and they were ignoring it and they were kind of, I think, going like well, you know they're they're, all trying to ride this lying is automated factories. Do this? Should we recall the car and that'll cost x amount onto the lawsuits for the desk, cause that xml just numbers just a spreadsheet right in, and that was the case at that time, with mcdonald's in their coffee, they had been warned so many times this woman clearly needed skin grafts and the jury said we need to send a fucking message to mcdonalds because they're not listening to the people that are complaining that two million wasn't abstract. They said what does mcdonald's make a day on coffee in america and then There was two point: something million live so the accustomed day a day of coffee. That said, yes, it s a very poetic and interest year, very just about what the jury did, but that case just read the headline. I know- and I was a kid I was like you- could fuckin spill hot coffee on my dick and balls or my

base for two million that we have new zealand, that no whole idea spread. And then you look like the errand brok images of the world that, like single handedly, save a water supply because, as your point, the little guy has an equally loud voice. Is the trillion dollar company more room, that's gotta be protected and it sucks it there's so much bullshit. I like the slap so much bullshit yeah. I also all this was happening, I'm so sorry guys. I've been in a fourth lawsuit papa. I can't believe I remembered ask christen isoude recently a fucking terrible piece of shit publication in the uk right. printed photos of our children right and illegal in england in england to do that now, they'll! Do it just assuming thou, so enough magazine, they make their money in the annual balance out and we soon and we want- and they had to say I heard We'D- have make one dollar we eat is an opinion

legal fees paid will join did, but if we don't do that, they're gonna keep printing pictures of our children which was the law in the uk yeah. How am I going to take on that trashy, fucking magazine or newspaper or whatever you want to call it. If you don't have the resources, but that's the thing you should be able to have the tools to go out. publication like that. I don't want to be available to everyone. If it comes this weird socio economic battle hank, there is definitely a large portion of my life, where I would have been like yeah like soon This guy's get the man like they have good julian's of dollars. Who cares, which I may yet putting that context, two million dollars one day incur be sales own eighties from a guy. Like twelve million, barely touches them. Let me just want to say how we do. We all lacks resource, actually cheese, big, my lovely zayigo, and we know your favorite stated Sid, it's my favorite anyway. Now we work for a big corporation and I feel, like dogs,

do them like they're nice and they pay us money so tied up with your own personal experience. I think of what you think of the legal system, whether you've had a good experience or a terrible one, and it makes you feel like for me, I'm like. Why should they be punished just because they did a good job making a company? They become very bizarre thing in your head, where you're like yeah, get those rich assholes and then yeah once you start knowing some of those people and companies and stuff it's like oh wait. No, they just did a really good job, making a big company, and now maybe it's not fair that everyone wants to take them Oh thank you, and once you get big that some people do start wanting to take you down countries our money to nine thousand law suits a year towards warmer. You gonna wonder what real pain about her. I mean they must so why I also requires staff lawyers, but what are they like slip and falls? I'm sure daddy earning, is only part of it. If you grub where I grew up, people dont, oh yeah, MIKE's uncle he sued

at worst or as exciting, was like winning and then there's a cottage industry like staging slip involves you there's a lot of, she had had their fucking with the system to try to get a complex but there is a fun activity you can do we, google any go the news turban, just type in suing america and you get like just whatever where he story is currently going on. I did that this morning and the story that came up a federal judge on thursday reject a girl scouts. His claims that the boy scouts created machabeus confusion and damage their recruitment if it, by using words like scouts and scouting and recruitment drives. The judge ruled that the boy scouts america can describe their activities is scouting without referring to gender.

Why does the boy scouts is basically now taking, I think in female members or the other way round, and so was this big fight between the girl scouts and the boy scouts on what language they could use to recruit people in. So I dislike that as a court battle between the girl scouts and the boy scouts that so words on the girl scouts, I don't wanna fuck without the trouba a little girls. This case boils down to a single question: must the boy scouts continue to use the word boy in it's name now that it's become a coed institution? The judge said in his decision he ruled that the term was generic enough, that both groups could use scouting without referring to gender wow. You just reminded me of umbra, most popular joke from without a paddle that I had was in the trailer asked me if I was a boy scout. Were you a boy scout now, but I had a brownie once but that's what you doesn't want as well to those we can say that in two thousand also now, when she was brownie, perhaps like her going on around around,

then the traveller brownies. Are you really on? What have? I just meant people of color there was a races movie right? They, your dinner, inborn access, dormitories roses. Without a moment s was was ill advised. You talked about in the people's brownies having other physical, because we are now man. They change really quickly and an ominous ominous soon, without a paddle Our objective must be that I was told to say that I am very sorry, but I do the exile than I thought. I did a good job and it's embarrassing inquiry did it at parties might have there

just like I'll, do fredo on demand, I'm a little monkey who performs. If you ask how do we think it first started to get big because of the birth of business. Here like why. That was one thing I wanted to push back on your. What was your last name character? I wanted to offer a slightly alternative view of what cam said, which is. Yes, we have three branches of government, legislative, executive and judicial, but the judicial branch had no, irrelevance forever. The supreme court was in the basement when they built the white house in the legislature with a little eating. It was a backwater, nothing. The judges had to travel from different areas to make core. It was only once a week. There is a great podcast more.

in fact I'm so bad witches by radiolab. It takes you through the history of how the court actually evolved into a huge instrument in our governing. It does not resemble today today it makes laws in essence, and it never had that role. So it's expanded dramatically over our history yeah the supreme court, but I guess I mean like this influx in lawsuits in general, like what sparked the forty million. There must be some correlation to something else. In america, it's got to at least parallel beautifully on a chart. People's moving, from small rural communities into cities, because, as you left, your rural community life gets more more anonymous. Yes, rather strange, I restore owner clown yeah one in town or you're at church, ya, fucking, mike sue and Bob would have been confronted. You would have been shamed new york, city, you're, lucky to ever see the same person twice. Yes, the anonymous nature of it has boosted everything up. Be it didn't? Stop your friends,

from sewing you now we're close as you could be. If there was a nail hinder pizza, would you so bessie? I because the new zealand way is to avoid conflict at all possible costs right. So you just accept it and I'll be deeply embarrassing. I wouldn't even bring it up, whereas I think that a far here as light that's an opportunity right like get rich, I had a friend that got like a bit a glass through their foot in the bathroom. Restaurant and they suit and, as has been the slow slow process, and they gonna make some money out of it, but also its not always. crazy money is not always israel, heyday earthly, exactly events or broke. You are, and it's just so much admin. I would never see over. Like a personal injury, will you dad No, no, where I'll be more specific, I do have an expectation that, if I'm driving next to a car at forty, they won't slammed on the brakes, make a right turn into a parking spot and bring.

five laws and avoiding anything. I'm saying again, that's not my expectation, but my expectation at a grocery stores. That shit falls off shell gotta watch where you're walking I can't watch where I'm driving in that nature. I do believe in some personal culpability, like people who are on their fucking phones and then they trip on the sidewalk in the suit, as he was like that yeah personally, my own ethics would prevent me from like at a restaurant, there was glass on the ground like yeah, it's a restaurant. Now am I the eightieth person to step on glass at that place and they're. Just not. dealing with it. Okay, maybe that's something! That's why it gets tricky yeah. If there's a reason for it, how many people do you think there are around that do fake injuries? You know it's always an american comedy says people. I slipped over and then go and see that happening at all yeah Secondly, while the dashboard coming out of all the time like people were like they jump in front of people's cars, there's a whole thing where a car gets in front of you and then a radically locks up the brakes so that the person

mind. You are no way arise. The others like three, this bunch of very common games that are already in all the time. Here I mean how they drive like a cheap cars, because, if you're in a hot rod I know they know yeah, it is. It is my greatest fear here is accidentally like missing with the wrong person or like scratching their own car or something, and then it's just all over. I do also think people hate lawyers, we've also had insurance. We all hate that we have to have insurance, so I do think often people when they have the opportunity, like yeah fuck. This I've been paying for my insurance for twenty five years. I'm going to fucking make them you know, like. I do think, there's a sense of like those insurance companies getting their come uppance yeah like if you yeah yeah, oh god, it's confusing it's funny, because I almost envy your point of view. It's the only system we've ever known. I can't imagine a world where people don't sue each other, it's as so abstract. It's just not the default. You will just sort things out

in person over my coffee over her over hot mcdonald's coffee. What happens in new zealand with the hot coffee, the hot coffee a would be paid. Under a which is excellent. Compensation taxes go into it. So if an accident happens to you, if I spoke coffee on myself, that will just be sorted out by that

parliament is entirely like report and I'll pay. You and the members of the government has paid out like six hundred claims were mcdonald's, they would call magazzino look eyes as the government. You turn the yap, absolutely yet societies everything, but if this accompany consistently consistently doing terrible things, then you could take that me to court. It's just not done very often, that's not a common thing in america is the default to do that and you see on the school last resource. I wish we had some kind of cross country data. Our companies at large, more ethical, no less less. Why doesn't that have to happen all the time everywhere else? Why don t we have to constantly sue companies to keep them from pulling asbestos

in the soft ring. You know all americans cut corners, irving, there's a main take away from us. It would save americans got going. I think I will more than ever, they reminded otto used to say to me, which is terrible. He would say there is a right way wrong way in the shepherd way, and likewise maybe america's like there's the right way wrong way in the american war. There is there s a leg, gangster mentality here of do what you gotta do so there is that sense of like if I have to cut this corner there, so many layers to being an individual's opposed to community member, that's part of the company's lord Lee being run by shareholders. At this point like animals on company has some obligation, probably in some sense that I have provided a service or product people, I'm appreciative of those people for buildings coming, but what's its turned over to a board of directors.

Shareholders there's another layer of like not carry a racial yeah yeah, not caring. I think anonymity is a little bit and the core of some of this yeah. I just watched the knicks him documentary about that calls. I didn't realize how much that cult sued members when they left to silence them and the great thing about there was some of the members being sued by the siege organization, one because they had truth on their side and why that is one good thing like it. We have truth on your side. Eventually, you should be able to win. Ok, see you how you might just be completely bankrupted by the whole. Now always true also caused a lot of its money. How good of lawyers do you have you have twenty eight lawyers workin exactly the dream team, am I more american. Do you think you're deadly more american because you ve been sued? I've been so

it twice? I am more here. Am I gonna get now? Am I up to like fifty percent american, as we ve learned more and more about you through this wonderful show, there's another reason that I think it appeals to you. You felt a little. isolated from the main group growing up and you identify with the little person going against the big group yet the other something like very magnetic about that idea. Yeah thanks you guys, like you name so fun. You tell us about being its own: try and not get sued or do any suing. This year I can be a girl chapter of my life, the over. I don't know anymore, he's already.