Lenore Skenazy is the president of Let Grow, a non-profit promoting childhood independence and resilience, and the founder of the Free-Range Kids movement. Lenore discusses the generational differences in growing up, how unrealistic the current standards are for being a good parent, and the importance of play. Dax asks Lenore to dispel the myth of common childhood dangers and Lenore explains the negative notion of the phrase “stranger danger.” The two discuss frequency distortion, how resilient kids are, and Lenore unveils her husband’s crow box.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
I read you do this ball. Bonbon bone bump, bump, bump bump bump bump above above all mobile boom boom boom boom boom. The already for this welcome while the under armchair expert, I'm dyin a bird and joined by Monica monsoon emanate miniature mouse. What is your Starbucks capsize, your name poser when you go to Starbucks, do they ever mess up your name? Oh sure, yeah yeah per day and dab drugs do you see came Oh sure, a lot of different ones. You know my move, for that is just like, whatever they say: oh yeah, yeah yeah, it's so much quicker. Imagine having a foreign name like Monica yeah
Well, ok, TAT day we have a gas that we ve been wanting to have on now for a couple years, because good old Jonathan High recommended her and we finally made it happened. Lenore skin easy she's, a journalist she's, fourteen years at the new daily NEWS in two years at the New York son, her column, why I let my nine year old Ride the subway alone and book free change. Kids, launch the Anti helicopter parenting movement. Currently the founder and president of let grow with Jonathan Height. Their mission is to create a new path back for parents and schools to letting kids have adventures development, independence and grow resilient idea. Her message: did you yeah it's scary and now I dont have kids, but I could see really having a hard time with this with giving them. Indeed
Yeah yeah, but yeah, I'm very pro it, and I am committed to challenge even myself in this arena guy. Can I please enjoy Lenore skin easy? We are supported by brutal Lenin,
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I wrote out your name fanatically, so I'm dyslexic just to give you precursor. So, ok, that's on me. That's not a new, but I wrote it out and I wonder I dont know how to write fanatically, but I have my own system but Lenore Scan Aisy. How do I send you, one hour's guineas and had you write it? I wrote allay space and o r e bay. I, as K e h scatter. And then space and a White Z Y Y, you lunatic I could get a job at Webster, breaking down the bank. I following pasting, your time and so forth. Foremost how're, you doing nervous can be on your show, but in general, pretty good, oh Why? Why are you a misdemeanor? Shall, I feel like I should be flattered for that. Yeah right should both be flattered, right, ok, you're, gonna, cost contributions to found nervous
I'm doing Pakistan last week? I think we had five hundred listeners, so I'd say yours is a little bigger, makes me nervous I'll go, but that's all to be credited to my wife. People various relates to relaunch the shell with a big fight between us. Some people seem to like that. Did it taking anything? Where are you from originally suburbs of Chicago Well, your fellow midwestern yeah yeah yeah there. What did your folks do? Mom was a homemaker. She started out as a social worker and I think for the same reason. I started out as a reporter in just really wanted to be able to leave you to meet people and find out. What's going on in that house in that house and my dad had a furniture store and he loved play tennis, and when I was fifty, he saw the furniture store and started in indoor tennis club, which was totally fulfilling to him, and he ran that until he died round each ninety. Did it have the big inflatable domes over or word new. I still don't understand what those domes are looks like about. He has,
guys yeah, I think they're much cheaper, you just inflate them with air like the Pontiac, silver Dome and then you're going to go. I think that's my understanding of him. Now you were good student, clear, We have. No, you got in the Yale stating one leg and what was the driving force was a just your own entry stood in achieving things are where you'd, driven by apparent in no way so long ago, that it wasn't a thing to start thinking about college until by junior year hastily, no one in New York there was that mom who the Pre school, where her four year old, was going to school because the kid was in a class with two european plan. How is my kid gonna get him do it It's all I gave her being held back by the US to Europe. Morons like it should be in studying the constitution or something by back the day you serve just went to school and then eventually you met with your guidance counselor Junior year and they said time to start thinking about college, and you did it wasn't a long term plan, I'm in law
step with you on all the free range parenting and your let grow foundation. We had Jonathan height on two years ago and he brought you up and then we reference to you without learning anymore about you just simply what he said. We pirated everywhere excellent kicked out, but I am also aware of my own why I think I'm predispose. To embrace it so much which is. I had a single mother, raising three kids who is building a business and I had an inordinate amount of free time and responsibly Eddie and then my mother also very generous, and she let me take road trips at a young age as long as a budget in the map and whole nine, so I just happened to have loved that upbringing. So I wonder if I am a little biased in that section and then, of course, I'm curious if you or maybe by us in that direction, reappearance abnormally, trusting and now I'm not surprised at your buys net direction. I'd say everybody over thirty or thirty. Five grew up the way. Well maybe not on the road trips, maybe not in the MID West, the the
you know what we now call a free range or electro. Childhood was the norm back then I mean when I was five in the suburbs of Chicago. I was walking to kindergarten risest nor but it wasn't like my mom was a dare devil that she was like. You know, I'm going to show the world that my kid is independent. It was just everybody was walking school and the weird thing is: when you got to the corner, there was a crossing and the crossing heard you remember this. The crossing, I was a kid, HU, I felt somehow fellow kid was trusted with getting you across the street and what did they have to stop? Traffic was a sash, dago, sash and action. Sure they dig law back. Nobody ever sash I remember a stop saying: well they animal my neighborhood, but it got increasingly heavier the longer you held it most of the time it were employed in theirs in their duties in the family left under their traffic staffing, good that yeah now can I tell you one step
story about me and the crossing our yeah would love to hear that married him. Ah, oh, why are we not? Then it wasn't like? Ok, let's move it up again and it wasn't like he was an older man. He was tat. I was five doc. A man in a uniform I gotta go get em. It was just that we realise. Actually, after we were married years later, as you say, he mentioned that he was a crossing gonna like where, and he said, the corner of Ramona look like You re always save me. You can't be alive. Who could marry me twenty years later, at so great or our door, explain this to folks in California, because most people that are either from California have been there for decades. Like I have. We have an enormous immigrant population that does most jobs like busboy gas station attendant seven eleven employ blah blah blah
always reminded in shocked. When I returned to Detroit, the whole city is being run by teenagers. No one wants the total gas station shift after five. P m, so you'll go in there at two in the morning. There's a sixteen year old, woman or I'll. Go to my request. There's like three thirteen year old running the whole thing and, of course, the grocery baggers, r, r, twelve and thirteen year old. I think a lot of people don't have that experience if they live on on either coasts. Maybe that teenagers are running tons of business is around the country when there's not a cheap immigrant labour, poor things they think about such as Jonathan Height that started like grow with me. It's also, a man in Peter Gray, is studied the importance of free play in childhood, but he also is the psychology professor, and he talks about how kids today, especially teenagers, are often depressed and act.
Yes, and you probably seen it goes about both nodding in unison, another blow sex. Well, that's at least something that they can do. That's grown up, but everything else that's grown up is not there for them. They can't have responsibility, they can't drive there not expected to do most things other than to be students, often and that's pretty demoralized. Thing when you feel like you're, just feeling you're oats in you're, ready to take on the world and you're told I have sign your reading. Logs till I mean how could you possibly feel empowered when you literally aren't, because you can earn money and you can get around and your parents don't want you going out by yourselves and the malls don't want you in the malls and pretty soon you just stuck doing your homework hang on line that stood demoralising experience. I was wondering how did this transition happen, because my parents are incredibly fear
oh and I had a job when I was fourteen what if they had kids now, they would act so differently, so it's clearly societal cause. They themselves are fearful. Yes, yes, it really is the size of people. I think that minority anti helicopter parenting person at first of all on part helicopter. Let go my mom side, but I don't blame parents because, like you're saying they were parents to you and you were seven now, instead of whatever age you are They would be wondering if I don't know if I can let her walk to school and I'm just gonna sit here. While she plays to make sure that nothing bad happens so gradually society started. Thinking of all kids is endanger all the time. That's like the shorthand for what I can say. It's like we ve come to believe that kid's cant do anything on their own safely or successfully. So they're always has to be an adult there to make sure they don't hurt themselves to make sure that they get the most out of bed to be the teachable moment and the best example. I can give a why
don't blame parents, but I do blame parents, which is a parents magazine, is an example from parents magazine which is that they had this article a couple years ago and how to throw the pearl play date, which is already where we are as a society of already brought him out of our problem: attic you're, an anthropologist ears and artifact from a culture that says that parents need help doing something as basic and something that actually parents didn't used to do. It was kids who would go out and find their friends or call them up or go to their house right. Yeah, yeah, yeah you're instigating all that right now, it's organised by the parents and the question that a reader s Parents magazine was my kid is old enough to. Home alone by herself and often does some new, I run an errand, but now she's gotta play date over. Can I still go to the dry cleaner and what it parents magazine set I'll, be cheating cause. I've watched a lot of you. Your interview signed a I ordered Monica Monica wildly, I say said now:
that so irresponsible. Why what could happen if the parent isn't there too rounding choking cutting each other's hair to shore mood at state level? Hers right I'll, get my abode! Much more remain right. It is well when they first of all it came up with the kids, could get hurt physically, like you're saying you know that gave an example of some kid who once put some macaroni and a microwave and when she took it out, it was too hot and fell on her and she had to go in to the doktor the end they were so desperate. Find an example of a kid being physically hurt that the example they gave while the man was still home, but in this case the mom had been in the back yard. So already you're during that? It's not even safety. In the back yard, when your kid is knowing anything It is also add to what you're saying that notion that among two kids, that Neither one could dial nine one one I mean what is the Paragon do were acting like all. Parents are better or first
saunders are e? Our doctors? We do the same thing, twelve year old, pick up the phone call mind we're gone him of Albert I write in their boats, got a phone. I think the implication there was that you would have put the macaroni and she's in the microwave. You would have taken it out. You would have blown on it till it was the exact right temperature or use one of those spoon to be seen. Those babies born, it turned a different color. When the food is to act as you couldn't possibly around yeah yeah red means hot no getting so they could hurt themselves physically, but then the magazine also said and one if there's a speck, you wanna be able to jump in before anyone's feelings. Get too and to me, that's the Rosetta stone of this culture. There were talking about because it is implying a couple things: one is there spat is unusual. Lord terrible to is that your kid getting hurt is something that should never happen
three. You should always be intervening and for what they do get hurt. What does the application? The implication is that they will be so hurt, or still traumatized or This'Ll, be such a terrible experience that you will have failed as apparent because who knows how that's going to affect them later on? You should be making sure that there if, as a smooth e in nice and cool and no chunks and kind of healthy and kind of Jackie, I'm not a smooth event. Otherwise your kid is going to be damaged, and it's all your fault. So when you're asking how come your parents Monica would be scared today, it's because the Bible of the past the world and we don't even have our grandparents around to tell us things were living in little itemised homes with the nuclear family, so you're you're, looking to the experts to tell you what to do and they're giving you this advice that I think they pull out of wherever that, just as dont, let anything happen, never, and actually one of the other things in that aim
article was your daughters had to have an overnight and friends house. It turns out that the friends Father is divorced. That's the only got this who's gonna be home, and parents into doubt. Do you have any worries at all? Don't let your kid stay over and so once again, all the single man, although single dad's, our written as they were only held in check by the who, hives without a white they're they're gonna common attack the kid. So it's just this, this scaring world filled with a flaming cheese and hurt feelings and scary parents, and that's the diet that we ve been fed over and over and over again, when people ask me like to lead Europe kid play outside walked, a school would arise a yap, and then they often they bring up an example from like law and order. The whole terrible case that happened twenty thirty or forty years ago, and why are you thinking about that? First and its considered a mark of good parenting and kindness to be,
way to that worst case scenario offers. Ok, I got of tin drawing things own ass you. What one is. There must be corollary between the time invested as as we ve evolved, suicidally torn less children, more concentrated effort in more capital being spent on each I hope those most correlate nicely, but is that cause allergies? You know I don't think that's a question we can actually determine. I dont think the currents cared less when they had more kids sack when child mortality was much higher. I'm sure they were more resign to that horrible fact of life. But I dont, they mourns last. You know when you have a few kids it would. You have, is a lot of resources and, I feel like that's the correlation than I think I can make, which is that if you have to people working and may be one or two kids? That's a lot more money per kid that you can span than if you had a dad working and six kids and also the marketplace,
those were dollars. R M dollars are out there to be spent on kids to make sure that their safe. You know if you can scare apparent about something happening to them I mean there is one thing I hate using the name so I'll try to come up with a fake name. Let's call it the gopher. Ok, there's a little device called the gopher, which really isn't called it's an electronic sock that you put on your baby. When they come home, healthy and everything fine from the hospital and Mary their house there, temperature, their movement level and their blood oxygen level ogre. Ok, I'm gonna ask you guys what your blood
oxygen level, I hope above ninety seven now cause you're. Mr, like, like, I can't use his number by the way. I only know this because of covert. I know when you're spoke, get yourselves oxygen or sir. I have no idea, but it's really high, though that's the other memorable thing about that numbers. It's like anything below nine before you're in trouble. I would think doing anything. Ninety four percent efficiently, your your golden rife, Dylan that actually like you're, dead by b plus exact allies, are those numbers, as are all the while. You really gotta, be perfect at this oxygen level thing I had one We question along the investment. Quite do you find variation socio economically in the thing that immediately popped in my head, as I just heard this interesting story about how large?
why a flu appearance of pulled the children out of football, but your seen still power income minorities at the same rate, because again the reward is so great for them in that position that they ve determined its worth that risk. While I hadn't seen now, I have no doubt that there are various options and every stripe among different groups are very striped. But this statistic that most fold me over, I guess was then your touch an article. Two years ago, I certainly paper. I read that was on the front page and it was the pain of intensive parenting and one of the things it voted was a study that was done across the economic spectrum right in a rich to poor black. To wait, you name it and one the questions on the survey was you're making dinner and your kid wants you to come draw with her. What do you do and across the economic spectrum, the the most answered answer wise? You drop everything and go draw with them because it so important too
support them and show that you care and spend time with them and role model and teachable moment in that, and I thought you know a teacher moment is like you draw, you know, I can't wait to see what you do, but I'm making the spaghetti right. So this internalize thing this sort of thing s magazine model of what it means to be a good parent is to drop everything you're doing, and there are other studies to talk about like how many more hours parents, especially moms output, In today than Monica, your parents did my generation out to the point where among college educated moms and am I wish I could remember the number among Non College get about, but cottage catamounts are spending nine hours more a week, then moms were in the seventy. I called them all. The time are you are you? I love that. I just said that this female friend of mine, who is kind of feeling guilty- I said I guarantee you you're spending more time, is a working mother with your child than any fifties. Housewife did just know that understand you're, probably doing much better than you think, but yet this this collective,
guilt and shaming is so toxic. I'm so happy that you quote that statistic as it helps sort of ass to get out that we're just asking so much of our selves, particularly of moms and fruitful, there's something lost to the kids when they are. Constantly you now under surveillance and constantly helped and assisted and supervise Rebecca tracer wrote this book called all the single Ladys and it was about how basically a lot of the social movements throughout american history were spirit by women who work married because they didn't have the highest and they didn't have the kids. They didn't have the kids that they had to take care of, and the part that struck me so interesting is that she said that one the industrial revolution came along and there were the forced labour saving devices ever for, like Genoa Wash machine in our an automatic ringer or something like that, or maybe a vacuum cleaner. Just when it got little easier. What happened is all these books started being published about how to make the perfect home
One of the things that votes is like there's more to setting the table than you might think. You know an idea, you know how many forks you have to do and don't forget the placement of starch, the linens and this man and adjust felt coincidental that just women were getting a little bit of free time and may be. Could use that to evolve or work or do anything other than housework housework became more demanding and to me I've always been a little suspicious that just we talk about the Seventys and oh that's just when women restarting to come into the workplace as women have gone further and further along and where the majority of people in college now and we're doing better than ever. Suddenly the demands of parenting. Are outrageous you'd better sit through every soccer practice and if you have three kids, while you better
make sure that they have it on alternating days or else go from four in the afternoon to nine at night and watch each of them because it so important that you're. Therefore, every thing it's like, isn't it a little odd that suddenly were expected to do so much more just when we were getting ahead so weird kind of, and I wonder what your opinion of it is. So I'm raising two daughters, and so there is a little this in my head right where I go, I'm basically establishing a relationship that they might try to replicate later down the road with a significant other, and so, if, if what I'm setting up for them is that I will be endlessly enthralled with would do and then I want to just stare at them, while they doodle X, Y and Z, I'm setting up an expectation for them and I'm just being, I think, realistic. What's in the market place for them, there's no dude out there. That's ever get to stare at them knitting.
Nmb thrill, oh you're, ready for another row. Let's see how it goes, I don't want to mislead them into thinking. They'll be another man out there, Thor woman. That's going to be this excited about every little thing they do. I think it'd be false, ties in a misleading and I think I'm setting them up to be completely, in holy unsatisfied in any relationship because the relationship should just be the other prisons, a spectator. While you do whatever the numbers and cheers when I'm trying to figure out what I should do I'll go or what I do this in a relationship and unlike never Now I would never indulge my wife like this. What do you think about that as a barometer? I think it's really interesting. I friend who once pointed out that we keep talking about parenting, parenting parenting, but we never talk. Waiting or husband thing, and maybe we should be thinking bout, our parenting in terms of what does it mean just in terms of a normal relationship? Do you have to high five everything that they do? You have to give a gold star. You know you have to comment on everything I was just talking
to some genius in the parenting world. Forgive me genius. I can't remember who were. Who was saying one of the things that driving kids crazy today is the fact that we ask them questions all the time. Are you drawing always egg? I love the younger was that the same color is the sun and the kids like Kenya. Let me draw Yeah cause arts the only criterion and there's something we're I feel like. Once again. I don't blame parents because this is some model that came from somewhere that we are all doing that. We think is showing the kids that we're paying attention that we love what they're doing that we care and what a strange idea that they wouldn't think that we cared or loved them unless there was a constant stream of interacting
and there are cheer and coordination with the yellow prey on which none of us really feel ya. I agree with you in your also it's very interesting because their much smarter than you are ever giving them credit for self. They are at some point. Gonna detect, will know and gives a shit about what color someone so implicit in. It is like, oh, that, what kind of fake so part of a relationship or part of interacting is kind of a. Why, like we're, only has a say in the bank has so I have of. I only have a few rules and personally for
which is- I don't laugh at my kids unless they were legitimately funny, but I think it's because I'm a comedian- and am I gonna- want to mislead them. I don't want them to think they got the material yeah when you're funny. I laugh, I'm not gonna, just like Yucas. How on earth are you gonna, learn to be funny if I'm laughing at every shitty joke you have you know, I'm not mean I just you get a laugh when you didn't farming audience you I don't know, but I do want to save its all beautiful right at the bottom of all. This is we all want so desperately to do the best job we can in its very sweet of us. I don't think you or I are casting the judgment to anyone who is listening right now going shit. I just said green. I got a beautiful green, its adding allows beautifully inspired thing. It's just you gotta quest
what is most effective for turning out an independent atonements adults who can self regulate and control yeah, really be perfected. Everything they do and have found has to relationships and never be disappointed that we can't do it first of all, like I was a thing like parenting. The idea that you can create this perfect creature by doing everything right by not saying I see, you're using yellow but on the other hand, also letting them know that you approve, and you know not pray. Too much, but giving them enough attention, but not so much attention that they get a big hatter, so little attention that they, you know, hitchhike afford to go to your uncle's has so there's no right way to do it and I feel like we are in this extraordinarily judgmental time, and I hope I don't sound like that too, because the whole idea is that none of us know exactly what to do. All I can tell you is that society this culture has made us extremely conscious of everything that we were doing wrong, an extremely fearful that somehow,
Kids aren't save, which has led to this over protection, and I'm just trying to hold back a second and say in our kids are gonna, be mostly okay and when they're, not ok, its fate or lock- and I talk to I don't want to go in this hall sidebar on religion or I ll talk about religion, go around the annual major yeah raging arts alumni laid aside. You it's not that religion doesn't exist today. Obviously it does, but it actually. This is the theory of alum of impetus, a professor of religion at James Mass he says, religion still influences our lives and our decisions, but I ever shrinking sphere, so it used to be religion would decide what you were wearing and what you were saying and what you were reading and how you are raising your kids on what you were eating. I mean it was like a covered everything and thou gradually a sort of adjust our spiritual life for many of us, and so that left this hall swath of lice decisions us, and so we shall actually know what response you. Nobody knows exactly what they're supposed to do as apparent. So we read of his magazine,
in the end we listen to the experts and we read the studies and in a way science has taken the place of the religion. All I just read that you can possibly use a plastic cop it'll give them ass or you can't puzzle. But their lunch heat up too much they'll get bacteria. Whatever everything is a study and your whip sod, because studies come out and you have to do this and they have to do that and the worst part about it is that if you think that there is odds. Plan right or somebody is watching over you or fate, is fickle. Then is something bad happens. It's like it wasn't on. You write riders. Plan and we don't always understand gods plan by as others, some sympathy right. It's like they are, but for the grace of God literally go. I write on its axis, oppression. But if it's all you there's something happens,
immediately, while she wasn't paying enough attention or she know it's all your fault and the other thing that this professor said is that religions are smart. I have to say that profession is just not possible in this existence right, so it's karma we'll come back later, it's heaven or how its judgment day, but if you think that perfection is yours to create here on earth, while you are still trying to make every birthday the best birthday trying to make every soccer game a winning game, which is why everybody's carry the trophy every car. I'd had a good talk and you really got someplace and every song you sang along with, because that's the kind of family you are every day is Disney world. It's! It's impossible, and yet that's what you're supposed to, and you worry that if anything goes wrong, you won't have the support of your fellow humans because it will just be
Why and there's nothing I have found. There is no topic that is dicey or to get involved with than parenting with other parents, as we all neatly feel judge, and I think one thing that's really relevant recognise, which we ve talked about before and here is your children are an extension of your own ego and it's really really important. I think, to monitor that state. I'm sure you dare we are supported by honey. We all shop online, increasingly so I'd argue during the pandemic. Yet
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Miami and Philadelphia and Bubba, and she was three and I was doing it all on my own. I didn't have anyone with me or just her and I, but I had to do interviews sporadically throughout that, and I found that when I took to you know what news station or whatever that, because people were excited that I'm there cuz I'm on tv. They were then very excited that she was there. I said she was getting an amount of attention that is, is just abnormal for a child to get it right and so response to it was to talk in baby talk and for the first two days of the trip I I didn't realize it at the time. I was personally embarrassed that people thought my three year old spoke baby talk right,
I kind of I'd be telling her like canoes, your normal voice or baby answer in the basque country and encourage her to speak normally and then all the sun it occurred to me unlike day two of this trip on my oh, this is this. Is my ego, I'm embarrassed that my kid who represents me speaks baby talk and I'm afraid all these people think that I have not taught my child how to talk, and then I was like. That's all my baggage. This is a mechanism she's created to help or deal with this abnormal situation. This works for her, and I just out of it, but it was real. Hard, and I recognise that- that's how frail my ego was it's hard not to feel frail when it's your kids and especially if it's not just a question of being embarrassed for your kids, if you're worried for your kids are sad for your kids, it is they who now it's impossible, not to feel bad. Let's just put it out there.
Yeah. It's really hard, I'm wondering. Could you walk us through? I mean I thought of a couple but like let's, let's is first acknowledge the historic role of children right I personally grub midwives, so I d tasseled corn, at twelve, in the summers- and I remember- maybe eight years ago, Siena Sixty minutes piece about how we need to get these agricultural laws to not include children in the way has presented, and I love sixty minutes I'll say. Oh if I had not had the experience where I d tasseled corn and wanted to end, it was all right, a passage. My family and I learned a bunch of money. I could never earned its wealth. Had I not experience I'll, be watching this going. What the fuck we still child labour right now I can with assign you now Andy, tacitly now for twelve year old right, I was
kind of shock to that. I just the luckily had an experience with that world like oh. I can't really trust that, but you know historically right children have held jobs, the brace children. They were responsible, our turn right. They were absent in others the especially now that there are economically worth lesson emotionally, where at the time, but of course you would have allowed First of all the other thing that's different, now that we choose to have the kids right, it used to be the kids came line you got married or worse for the woman weren't married and along came a kid and it's not like you were saying this is this is a stage of my life, and I want to have somebody I can share with and teaching, and it was just along. Came the kids though that may be one of the reasons that we weren't so obsessed with parenting because it was inevitable it wasn't this the lifetimes. I certainly chose tat. My kids They were valuable and, as we were discussing earlier, it's not that you wouldn't care if they would die, but it would have a lot of them and a lot of them wouldn't make it. I was reading Uncle Tom's cab,
Finally, last summer and one of the characters there's a runaway mom with her child, whose like three or four years old and she ends up in a Quakers House and the Quaker Mom- goes and opens the drawer and Harriet Beecher Stowe, says the drawer that All of us have the drawer of clothing of the child, who died at a certain age, and this mom Quaker mom gives the clothing the runaway slave for her three or four year old, but breeding that phrase, if, like I didn't realize everybody has a drawer like that. A hundred or two hundred years ago, because you knew you were going experienced the worst thing. Maybe that's what steeled people a little more, not that it didn't hurt as much, but that we were all going to go through this and if you want to be apparent or who are apparent, your in four devastation and now we hoped that we're not in for demonstration. I sure hope none of us are in for demonstration. I hope now listeners are involved. Station, but some of us are, and now that just seems weird- and it must have been your fault because the rest of us are not devastated ya
Abraham Lincoln right here. I know for sure they would deal at the death of one child, but I think I sorry ever three out of more did not make it to adulthood and we said, while one bad dad did you see what it is doing, all my God, what an out and out myself in this group, I don't think a modern parent could hold having lost three or four children. Iconic go to work, I mean that's how much it's of yeah dry there's no way be running a war right, I don't know. They're all dead by the time is running the war, but that changes your level of investment right. So if you know that they might not make it or their there, too detailed, morn or whatever here you're, maybe not think Why should I ask a lot of questions when they re so that their brains start like? I think a lot of this has to do with science on cognitive ability, like, I think the reason there all these questions and you gotta be interacting and stuff, is because parents feel like that's, going to develop their brain, and I think is science. Art thou, though I am just saying that I don't know that for her by feel like they think like. If you ask why'd you pick
yellow it'll make them start. Thinking of, why did I pick yellow in and that will grow by their cognitive ability, so I do think it's really an investment. It's like I'm going to do everything I can now so that they can the best future possible even more than danger. I think that's the intention and then the question is what the outcome, which now there seems to be allotted time. In on the outcome of that, which you know a lot about right. Ideal was gay prefaces by saying, like now is going to sound, like, It is the right way, and this is the wrong way and and once again there isn't a right where wrong, I'm just trying to dial back a little bit of the anxiety, and that doesn't mean that I'm not an anxious parent myself about exactly the right way to do it and demonic. I think you're talking about there was some study that said kids and affluent households here, three million more words by the time they're out of diapers, then and then less fortunate kids and that's how they get ahead, and so that
came this. Oh, my god, I was talking to a lady who ran a day care center in Oregon Washington and she got demerits for some things, that the day care Center had an, and this is the idea that you can be perfect and there's a recipe and one reason she got two marriages, because sometimes when her day care workers were changing the kids diapers. They weren't monologue, seeing it as they did at sea and taking up your diaper. Now, I'm taking the tape. The tape makes us out and the other piece of tape makes us. Are they sound to say because its two sides of the same viper, which side the right side by begins with our and the left side life begins with LA la rule out? You know, and I thought, what I have a human being crazier Armenia, whether the kid is being driven crazy or the poor day care worker who has to be a midnight dj talking, filling the gap air with a two month old, the entire time, and this gets back to the whole idea that, first of all, we using science instead of any kind of intuition
in terms of how we can be raising our kid and that there is a perfect way to raise the kid and then what I really See happening is that we just don't have any trust in anything except ourselves like we, don't trust that the kid would be curious on their own or that the kid is absorbed, and maybe that's good enough or if the kid is playing, their friend, and they have this squabble that they can figure. Out or if she does come home in tears that the next day she can go back with her friend and they can be playing tag again. It's like nothing happens successfully, nothing happens at a high enough level unless were there, and I told you Peter Gray- is one of the co founders of like grow in the talks about the importance of play and when kids are playing and adults are organizing it they're. Always there come to the end like. Let's get to the play part already, you now and my friend had ascended a playground his ten year old son, and it was
Flowers and the dad said: okay come on, let's go home, it's been two hours and the kids had dad dad now we're just about to start a war. So two hours have been spent in angry negotiations. You think that's not fair and that's too far and your team is better and how come I don't get to wear the green shirt or whatever it is, and if there was an adult they're making it a perfect experience, you know like smoothing it out and getting to the fun already so that you don't waste two hours. Just angry with your friends in there might be some hurt feelings. Those two hours were the important part of the play you're learning how to get along compromise negotiating. Yes, fairness. This isn't working much vote. Does this baron? I mean, like, I really think, the fundamentals of democracy are learned when you have to make sure that everyone having a good enough time that they don't I'll quit and go home
the oddly mirror the early hunting and gathering societies in that they're kind of egalitarian because they are operating in a in a round without status kind of yet so if one person's alpha and two other people can bond together and overthrow one alpha like it keeps it very EL tearing, but we're probably inclined to get in there and make it less with good intentions. I think that we just don't give credit again to anything. That's going on. That is just happening between kids unless we see that its building their vocabulary or in today's superfine or making sure everybody feels okay, and it's funny you mention, hundred gatherers, because you would ensure anthropology degree, but that's what Peter Gray has. Buddy, the mouse. Other cultures. Don't even have the word for play, because what they are doing- is there watching somebody make an error
had or somebody make apart, and then you know, maybe they have a little bit of flint next to them and they try to do it and play is being engaged in something, that's interesting and usually were kids. What to do is have fun with their friends and also try to become a grown up. You know they want to be so soon we brought this baby home from the hospital ear. Naturally, you have some anxiety about keeping this little subway sandwich healthy. So I can't tell you how many times in my head, I replayed this film we watch while studying Papua New Guinea. I remember even then being shocked with like the kids were on their own and I'm talking. There are two year olds attempting to climb a tree, and there are three year olds high in the tree, and I C seen I saw with my own eyes like. Oh, no, those kids didn't die crazy percentage. Like they somehow. I know how to do that, and I was is constantly when I was trying to propel myself steel myself into letting link
climb on shed in fall on stuff. I just like just remember that video you saw on all those kids. You know made it at the same level, but I just want to say cuz. I think it'd be really helpful for us to kind of maybe dispel some of the things that we fear. So your list of things, which I love is fighting the belief that our children are in constant danger from creeps kidnapping, germs grades, flashers, frustrations failure, baby snatchers, Bugs Boli's men's sleepovers in the perils of a non organic grape cuz. I think it's I just want to start with one again. I learned it Nan throw, but I had this class on witchcraft and the teacher happened to say how many people do you think, have been poisoned by hollowing candy or received a razor blade. Her sharp sharp object, and now my childhood that was already happening- they were setting up like scanning at the fire department in school, would hoster silly trick or treating So we are guessing our two thousand and two double up. She said there has never ever ever once been a case of a stranger putting poison or a sharp object in hallowing candy, very
van sharp objects and boys and put in by parents to injure their own children. There's never been a stranger That blew my mind. You have other stats like that of the these kind of urban legends we all live in fear of that aren't even real yeah. I do. But first I want to talk about the pleasant candy for a second, because there was the one case and it was a father in Texas who had taken out three have one or two but three insurance policies on his son and he put strychnine and a pixie stick and sure enough. The kid died. And this was quickly discovered because nobody else dying from poison candy. But what's interesting to me, is he like you before you read? That statistic must have thought: are there so many it's getting poisoned every Halloween know. What's one more, you know just throw it on the pirates, another all little Jimmy. I do bad he's the one from taxes this year. So really he himself had ingested as it were. This urban myth that the kids were dying right left from a Cobb neighbours who gave
poison to the kids that they set high to all the rest of the year and then didn't even have the fund of watching them right and pain and die because the kids Rebecca. That was always my point like yours, who commits a crime. They can't witness. I don't get it right is also talk about myth that now that there's the injustice, bulls and gummy bears with Tottenham that crazy adults are giving his wife. What are you kidding that expensive? Because now there no upside to giving this away. Maybe they're just isn't I'm trying to think. Would there be an upside knowing that some kid was getting high on our gummy? There someplace our way, I don't think so. Unless you witnessed it and then they fell in the bad tab and then they blew, you know if they did some funny that there are some story. I hold their own capital yeah, in the longer term talk. You know S father, the neighbour, that's right, yeah other buggy, stranger danger, is a terrible idea it's a terrible notion that
as colonized our brains, and I think in part is because a rhymes, you know, there's actually studies done things rhyme, they seem more real and the vast vast vast majority of crimes against kids- and I don't like thinking about crimes against kids- are perpetrated by people they now so the idea, stranger danger, is first of all point in your wrong direction and, secondly, taking somebody who could help your kid. If, God forbid, you know you was walking down the street and there's that White Van, which, by the way, I think way, fans must be live. Ten percent of all cars out there anyway, so the white fan is following him really slowly and the guy's thing, I've got a puppy candy about balloons, at which point. If the kid has been told, dont trust any strangers he stuck, but if he knows that most people are, and you see somebody across the street and she's getting her may offer mailbox, or he even if he is, I think most he's are perfectly great too he's right he believes you run across the street, and you stand up to that person and you say: there's a creep
when is Van going by I'm just going to stand your or it's on the street and you run into a store and say I'm going to wait here or can I use your phone and I don't even like the advice that sometimes given that says, look for a safe stranger because I don't think people turn into unsafe strangers just because of can I stand here while you could stand here, but now that I have you, I guess I'll kidnap you. I mean it's unusual to think that it would be weird that the guy right in his leaves, is going to murder you, you know as it is in Cahoots with a gentleman in the White Van. That's how I got nowhere. I go to lend our right right right. You free, came out and then he'll come among our get the rope. Take a crow AIDS, the browser- I did you say, a crow yeah. We're obsessed. How smart crows, aren't I mean my husband will bring in the crow backs? What
They made a crow box and train them with the Chino, so they start coming first, they could just get the Tito's easily and land there's a little cover over the Tito's Box and they have to stay in a certain place than ever and then finally, they have to theirs quarters on the top and they realized like. Oh, I kicked in the quarter and the box opened and there's all she rose and then finally, you make them find their own TIM quarters order, like a vending machine that should now. My guys I want to hang out with your husband my madness. What are the odds of this therein, the millions to one? So this is the problem, that's right, and this is where the Tito's would go and then there's a top across there in the topical, and then this is an easy place for them. Stand and then you have to cover the
higher ground biogas, Airways, which vetoes, so they get used to coming to the cheetahs air and they think that China throw their snickers farm, and then it turned out that where was funding our summer, you now we see pro like once every eight days, so is perhaps not the right place, but yes did he Ok, that old thing or is that a key, thereby there's some little parts that you get that a cemetery, the printer that you had to put any it took him like we do. We have to growth that seem to be taking up residence at our house and I love crows. So Monica I've been trying to think of what aid step problem. We could do that actually benefits us, but it seems like your husband's any figure out to get rich backing out his king. If it's our neighbours, King S, sought after have earlier pike. S next is Josh plying Jacqueline, color low, genius. Do you know him now? Ok, Google, Josh Klein and crows.
Already. We are we weren't Lamby Georgiana, so we're going to earmark thou we're gonna handle Josh. Ok, we'll worry dogma before the land. Is there anything besides curs how to raise cells is self reliant, independent, rose. I do remember what we're talking about we're talking about bogeyman array media, because I did on one of my own that, in anticipation of talking you, I agree with you across the board, but the one thing I thought of, as you know, the numbers for be molested again. This is very you go centric in that I wasn't unless it's, why haven't a unique I for rice? I, oh that's a good one in five, The least estimate in Ireland, and one in four is another one that there's some consensus around, but let's say twenty to twenty five percent. That's you say far too many lives I'd like a staggering amount epidemic travel so that one man in anticipation of talking you as I said, then that one is the one. I still am crazy, vigilant improbably overly vigilant about, but I anticipated your retort and I feel, like you'll, tell me yeah, but it's ninety percent. That is people. You know our trust.
Be a response. It wouldn't be dismiss it. It would be. I will give you a tap that I think is really helpful. Please if I, you know all my information is not right out of my brain and says from talk and other people anyways there's something called the three hours and because yes, the vast majority of crimes against kids, including molestation, will because not by a stranger but by somebody to know teaching your kid stranger danger is not gonna help them as much as teaching of the three hours which are recognised, resist and report recognise you teach your kids supposedly. You can start this as early as aged three, just like you teach kids to stop drop in role is not can make them terrified that you know any second, they might catch on fire right, good advice, so recognise nobody can touch you wear your bathing suit covers her. That's it! Ok,
resist anybody bothers you. You don't have to be nice, you can kick runs, scream, pull their hair hit them resist, because that really will help you in a lot of cases. But then maybe the most important one is report, and by report I mean tie your kids that if something happens to them that makes them feel bad or sad. They can talk to you about it and even if somebody says This is our secret. You can tell me, and nothing bad will happen to you. I won't be mad at you. I won't blame you just tell me I'm here to help you and there's no secrets, except for fun secrets like there's gonna, be a party in hours. Surprise party for MOM Anna, recognising, like a kid, will definitely no, then this is wrong and resisting is good, but the reporting ideas so great because it takes away. The secrecy that a molester is depending on its is best asset is like this. Is our secret? Don't tell your mom will be mad at you. You know I'll kill you. If you tell it, you can always tell me and it'll be ok.
I've stumbled into that I've, I've sent them. You know. Yes, you should never ever see another adults genitalia under any circumstances, no reason for adult to have their payments or the vagina out around you ever if it happens. I want you to leave that area bottle and then against. Secrecy partner angle. You know nobody can kill me. I challenge them if they say I'll kill your dad. If you tell bring it on I can't wait to tell them my again very area rallies under my way right yeah you're right, you're right, you you're, not always gonna, be there in into two not give them tools to navigate the situation seems like probably the most vulnerable. You can make your kids Only that you're not always going to be there. It's that you want them to have this power you're right and you feel less terrified if youve empowered than this way? as you have given them a very practical road map for how to stay safe and, if God forbid, that
an app and you're still lack owing to blame them. Oh and you're not going to blame yourself because you ve been doing what you can in the other thing is that parents are so afraid that something bad will happen with their kids at their wit, their kids, all the time you sort of have to recognise that, most of the time, they're gonna be ok and you're going to equip them to rise to certain occasions. Obviously I am not blaming anybody. Ever being molested, and I think it's also relevant to bring up so that people have it is control in their head, which is the chemicals in your body for fear, are stronger, there's stronger my than than the reward chemicals right cortisol adrenaline. So that is
In every one should be aware of, like oh I'm, having kind of an outsider reaction to this in that's by design, so I don't eat my align or a poisonous berries right. You must run everything through like this little reduction model realise. Ok, I'm very fearful of this. It's probably worst case scenario, half as bad as I'm fearful, it is just minimally. Probably. How do you help parents work through that for Somalia totally right about the different chemicals and also not only does risk larger than reward, but we also very little sense of how we will be able to recover from anything bad ever happening. We assume that we never will actually were more resilient than that, and so our kids, which is why going back to their parents magazine example. If your kid has spat with a friend, that's not the end of her relationships with the world or even with that, France she's. Recovered, but we don't realize that really the fear and the anticipation of misery could be far bigger than what the actual cases, but in terms of poisoned
berries and a lion that's interesting to me, because until we had photography until the modern era, the only dangers that we were exposed to were real dangers in our neighbourhood. You know an immediate threat that Bush Donnie from there, as I said, you know Harriet than their portion, he is no more and Lyon Climb. The tree lines can climb trees right the females, the leopards take their prey up. There goes the lines can, but the point being that until very recently, all the dangers that we were warned about or that imprinted themselves on our brain is terribly scary- were local threats. That could very well happen to us. Now, now. You know you're, seeing the worst story from around the country every day, you know a horrible story that happened in Florida and you're watching in California, a horrible story from thirty years
but now there's a mini series of powder hits, and so it's back on your screen. The others are frequency distortion right, even eyes to come to a guy, some guy rescue this three year old from amount line and northern California and I'm very like yeah. I gotta have my plan of defence because there are more lions where we live. Of course, this is like one attack and probably forty years on, a child in the child die, but yet to your point, you're ever learning the rule. The news doesn't come on and go ninety nine point. Nine hundred and ninety nine thousand nine hundred and ninety nine nine hundred and ninety nine percent of people didn't die today. Its guy. It's the exception to the rule that makes airlines in its misleading, it's very misleading and back For me, as you know, is that I let my nine year old right, the subway alone and afterwards people would say to me like Don't you watch law and order? It's really really relevant here. Just so. In order of events you, your nine year old, had expressed some interest in doing this and you talk it over their husband and you
live in New York in you. Let him right the subway and about a month and a half ago buying them in that time. If you'd come up between parents or whoever l, some people were shocked to the point where you thought long and read an article about it. So then you wrote an article five or six weeks later, and then it became a big stir. Right right I mean nobody, like my friends, didn't really care, but yet nine year old, very interested in public transportation. That's what we're on all the time because we live in New York City has an elder brother whose eleven who didn't ask to take the subway at age. Nine nine calls himself fuckin old group snarking anyway. So yet the nine year old was pasturing, I would say- and this is something a ready for you never said it. In those words, nobody talks that women their nine, but he said you know I want to do it. Can I do it and one sunny Sunday? I took him to department, store the nice part of town, New York City and let him take subway home to us and in the aftermath of that after wrote, the column about it and was on a lot of talk, show
people would reference things like the one about the horrible story of there's is kid: I don't wanna talk about it, but it was a kid, was stolen from a bus been nineteen, seventy nine- and this was two thousand and something- and because what you are talking about how your brain find store. Since the availability heuristic actually have heard of that. It's how easily available a story is to your brain and how vivid it is because there's pick yours are theirs. Videos that go along with it in your brain makes you think it's more frequent right. Your brain isn't going like that was seventy nine. I wonder how many children have been born since then what I actually have done. The statistics take sun, a hundred eighty million children. Thank you since then, so you can imagine a hundred and eighty million kids waiting at a bust out. You can only imagine the one kid whose story you now and so that becomes your guiding principle like well, I don't want my kid to be like that. It's like the stream odds. Are that that won't have stated.
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Will you run Monica through the question of if you were to leave your trial of unintended outside? Oh sure, my favorite staff MAC? If, for some reason you wanted your theoretical child to be kidnapped by a stranger, how long would you have to keep? Let's call it to her and how are we to have to keep her outside unattended for this to be statistically likely to happen? How are we to keep the kid outside without you watching over her for her to get kidnapped by five years. First of all, I gotta say I love you for that, because so many people say five Min RO. I am also aware that I'm gonna get trapped waiter, on your bias Dax. Would you like to give the actual work I was hoping you'd asked me that, because I'm because I'm devious, I was wondering if European asked me this and then- and I already knew the answer- and I was gonna- go man a lot like because they like Six hundred thousand!
I was gonna, come close it six hundred dollar, seven hundred seventy thousand years, but I was gonna, get a hundred thousand pounds a thirty eight years. You're really going now that it's only five year and so wow I've been pondering. That's insane, because it's like how many power ball tickets would you have to buy to be statistically likely to win a powerful But the thing about playing the lottery and the thing about worrying about kid is that we go to you know. We know the picture of the person with the giant check and we know the picture of the missing kids and it's very hard to square that with reality, and I remember long ago somebody wrote to the blog and said I don't care if the odds are one in a billion, that's not a risk I'm going to take, and that is upsetting to me because, first of all I of one in a million aren't odds, I mean about a billion to one. It's just incredible.
The unlikely that you will be the one and then there's the assumption that there is a not opposite side like I will take zero risk and, like theirs zero risk? No less than moving in a house. That's carpeted and one floor and all The food is put through a food prices there before your kid drink, said Anne you're, making sure that the straw has, if I don't know, a cushioned tip and there's no allergens, and there is no stairs to fall down and there's risk in everyday life, but its very minimal and somehow, when it's a risk you sitting there, it's not considered a risk, but it's a risk and you're. Not. There were back to this. God thing why weren't you watching over? It's all your fault, so no matter how much you can't predict something bad happening. If it happens, when you're with the kid you get a pass at, if it doesn't, if you're not there your evil? Dear? So right. You know this, I think, is very consistent with just human thinking in general, which is highly flawed.
I always spiral about as if avoiding death is the apex of our concern, which I would argue it should be avoided ass: the notion that we would prioritize three trillion dollars of our resources. Is to fight terrorism, which is something then kill one in. I don't know what it is. Two million people verses, how many people will certainly die of cancer heart disease. It such a staggering deference that you have to meet legal at wow, so I guess the way in which we die is heavily biased or our fear how we're going to die. Yeah it's a cognitive hiccup is one that has to be recognised as not rooted in anything saying. So when you pursuing the protecting them from a one billion odds. What most certainly is happening is that time you're not pairing them for the thing that is of forty percent odds of that happening to them right
but what we were talking about that only when we are talking about stranger danger versus teaching them the three hours three hours you're preparing for something that is statistically far more likely than a stranger kidnapping, your kid, the street, the it usually what we're afraid of his dramatic and once again, but the availability heuristic, which is such a terrible word for how easy it is to picture. How many times did you see, twin towers, falling I mean, and each time brain actually registers that as another time not in it rationally knows that those do towers were the only to their word, thousands but you ve seen it so much in it so easy to think of ass. You get, so angry and there's someone to blame versus heart disease in our diseases, long time from now and its gradual, and you can't picture all those people of the times didn't put their pictures on the front page and those we have lost. So we really get this very skewed picture and what we ve got. A really skewed picture of lately is that our kids are endanger whenever there at the bus stop whenever their walk into school. Whenever there at the park,
and so that has changed childhood to the point where there always has to be somebody with them. And if you about. Why are the other facts of this one of the unintended consequences? Then we get back to the idea that kids are kind of depressed and kind of passive and kind of anxious, because they have I realise that they can deal with the main dog or got lost, had found their way back or fallen off their bike and had to come home limping and if you don't know that can handle anything because, there's always somebody there intervening in helping you that the disempowering distressing, demoralising way to live So I want to make a quick analogy may be that I find helpful, which is the amount fear and thought and energy put into imagining a kidnapping or molest sooner this or that right. None of that thought. None of that thought goes.
Do? How am I gonna drive the car today to school now driving the card is school. Today will be the most dangerous thing. Your kid does, improbably its entire child in no one, no one lives in fear of driving their car. So the question is why- and I believe the answer is because its necessity gone, you know what we're whatever that statistic is I got a fucking drive my kid to school right, so once it becomes, I have to. I think you, right size, the fear of the outcome, you're shaking your head. No, I'm shaking my head, I'm interested in that. First of all, I can it's not in assessing often People are living so close to the school that the kid could walk to blast. There's a school in Kansas, the superintendent Moscow Kansas I got in touch with me. You wanted the kids to start his students to start doing things on their own because he said from his office in the school in the town of four hundred. He could see the kids houses and yet the parents were driving them to school. So that's not necessitate. Certainly so that's a little
misconception, but why are they worrying about kidnapping and not driving? And I think it gets back to what we were talking about earlier with the expectations for moms and stop? Is that if your child is kidnapped its cause, you weren't there, so you get no sympathy, you should have been there. Why weren't you there? It's all your fault, if you in a car, and you run into a light Paul or your tea bound by a drunk driver. At least you were there one thing: feels avoidable. One thing feels unavoidable as far as like how much guilt you're gonna take on ensuring right, but part of the guilty, because, where you present or not and you're supposed to be so present in your kids lives that nothing could happen in them is something Captain Nemo your present? Well, at least you were doing what you're supposed to do right, so you were with the God. It's just too bad that there was a car accident but you were doing your job as a man by letting your kid. What the two blocs you know in Moscow, Kansas to your school year. That way
I was going to try to end that thought was just simply. Everyone go even if they do have to drive to work. Ok, let's say its excessively that they drive to work. Sir. They're not worried at all about driving the work, but the very worried about terrorism right in the exponent can, I believe, is what I have to drive to work. Once I've decided that its inevitable lobby driving a car worry. About it is a waste of time. Cuz. I'm going to have to do a write. Your brain recognizes that that would be a waste of your fear, cuz you're, going to have to do it regardless whether you want to or not now I think if we were to. I recognise the necessity of our kids learning the skills that will help them Navid the world without you if we saw that is a foregone conclusion that they after I have these skills they have to learn to navigate. They have to learn to talk to people. They have to learn. Get over heartbreak.
Add gray and getting into here. If we saw that is inevitable, I think we can build on it in the same way that we build on that relegating our fear of driving to the stratosphere. I totally love that framing so Lech rarely ever slogan, a bunch of slogans. One of them, is when adults stepped back. Kids stepped up but really are tagline or whatever is independence is a critical part of childhood? We throw it out the window because it seems so much less important than being with them all the time either to you not to say the three million Words board to incur them or to make sure that their safe and independence is this enormous building block of who you become and to ignore it because we're more afraid of the equivalent of terrorists which, as you know, the kidnapper, a bully or something untoward happening to your kid. It's like not feeding them. It's like now
giving them ere? I mean it was always a part of childhood like it. When you are talking about the Hunter gatherers, that two year old shimmering up the tree, trying to follow the three year olds, there was always an expectation that kids could do. Things on their own. They were gonna get into scrapes. They were going to have some disappointments and betrayals and frustrations, and that was to the good, not something horrible happened, them not a real trauma, but they give and take of learning to get along in the world. I was gonna regions, one seventh grade teacher on Long Island did electro project were kids, are sent home to do something on their own and that's to push the parents to let them go and do something. But I wanted to read you what these seventh graters, which are twelve and thirteen,
you're old road and little sheet of paper. What she asked them is there anything that you were hesitant to do some twelve and thirteen years, I wasn't comfortable going into a crowded store with a bunch of strangers. Without my my eye was hesitant to use a sharp knife, as my parents had never. Let me I was hesitant to tar, walking my dog law, because I was scared he would get loose from the least I was afraid to climb a tree. These different kids. I was afraid to try doing really on my bike. As I was scared, I hurt myself. I was afraid to try and cook because there's an open flame and I could get hurt so Our parents, who have kept their kids safe right, safe from they haven't, been kidnapped. They haven't been taken in a terrorist attack, but do not
how to use a sharp knife must feel pretty damn bad if you're, twelve or thirteen years old and you're looking at while these adults can use sharp eyes, but not me what I hear and that loses these kids feel so vulnerable, they're afraid to go and restore their afraid to do this in the whole point. Was safety takes the opposite? They feel incredibly vulnerable. Why? I think that's the same truth with when you talk about in a psychologist, use a technique called exposure. If you have a phobia, something you know like you're afraid of, it is and then they do now that you're in the same room is a spider. I've been pidgin immersion therapy for Monica snake fear. Well, I don't wanna, hear the detail of me: I'm not there, but yes emerge immersion Herbert anyways. Yes, so what you ve done? Is you ve, created kids who are safe but who don't know that their safe from anything I mean they're, afraid one could said he wasn't. This was an affluent suburban part of long island and the way I describe it is
French bakery is across the street from the olive oil store, so you now so, but one kid wasn't willing to walk to their because he had to cross over the train tracks and it's like the idea that you couldn't look both ways and listen. You now and be aware enough to keep yourself from walking in front of a moving train, which only comes there once an hour is distressing to me, because what the appearance have done is: crippled her care. They have removed, like Jangle, all the bravery, the curiosity, the courage, the will to try something new and it's this rickety structure. That's laughed the thinks it. Oh. I can't use a knife- I could get her Why have we done that and when you asked at the beginning, how did we get this point? You know we ve really been taking all of parents playing upon their fears
There is because we want to run an article that will make you by the magazine. Like you know, these things are gonna, kill you, kids. Are you what parents to buy the baby new paths which are a real thing or the five guards? Would you put on your kid when their learning to title are we had a big warrant? My house, I didn't want to order, but pads when they are learning rollers gave us a moment. Your body is a pad. It's been designed as a person to be your pad. You too, we don't need an auxiliary bad. I didn't actually know about, but can't so. This is an informative conversation for me. Well, ok a person all selfish thing. I want your opinion on this is to persuade my wife. I noticed this pattern early on where all this and she enjoyed kicking the soccer ball right and she want to do with me in the driveway all the time and I loved it, and she. We were doing it every night and then almost than it was all she
soccer? Let's we got a sign up for a soccer team right, so we sign her up and then she doesn't enjoy it right for any number of reasons. Then it becomes as big ethical dilemma level will now we're going to teach her. You know she's committed to something she must follow through Bobo than all other secondary thing, and then she likes gymnastic she's, doing cartwheels about we gotta get origin and I've started to favour. The opinion of like is ok to just like the fuckin thing and not get an expert involving not achieve some strata of accomplishment and then accompanied with a trophy like. Don't we turn these things that they like into this really weird protection of attainment. I don't love it. What what are your thoughts on now? I think you're just articular, If everything that I think the idea that something taught to a child by an expert is better than a something that a kid just likes to do and practices and does is
boss, unless you bring your kids, are a limp Olympics bound, which I don't worry, isn't it sometimes put kids and things is because there is no kids left to play with them. Insurance play soccer. She replied with you or nobody, because everybody else's in their sacrilege, but I was re listening to your interview with a camera was Jessica, Leahy or Jonathan Height and one of the other that was talking about intrinsic. Versus extrinsic motivation. And what you're talking about with your daughter is that you in love with the soccer ball and she likes tumbling and she likes doing cartwheels and she's doing them, because it's fun and she's practicing because she likes getting better and that's intrinsic, and extrinsic is, I was Thursday for him get in the car, I'm gonna go get Olympics or whatever gymnastic online, and many saying you know we have to start out with fifteen shopping Jack's and it becomes a class. It becomes something so external and once again Peter great site to study where they asked kindergartners, who were given
day of their was circle time when everybody shared something, and there was reading when the teacher read aloud a book and there his finger painting when everybody got two finger paint and there was recess and they asked the kids at the end of the day. What was work and what was play and play was recess and everything else was work because an adult said now: we're gonna be in a circle and adult chose the book and adults decided when it started and when it finished, and now you have to fingerprint, where the elect a finger paint or not. So what you're taking his play and you're turning it into nobody would call it work, but there's an adult there, you're sort of getting grades, your micro managed, you know your expected to attend you don't have agency anymore agency eyes is on the playground right right. So to me you know some of childhood can remain childhood without it being taught to them.
And what I think is interesting me lately and I'm going to ask both of you this question and I don't have a total theory yet, but I feel like if you have enough free time in childhood, you discover something that you like to do, that you might still be doing as an adult if you're lucky, get to pursuing, is there something you did as a kid that you still we see yourself doing some activity that turned you on our Monica go. First acting I started when I was in ninth grade that castles and one big kid necessarily no, no, no! That's the camera that counts ride like thirteen fourteen, so that still happening almost there. Thing I like the element is this: do you like I raised be amongst bikes, but now it's motorcycles and all my Hobbes are virtually whatever adding horse power to the fifth grade. Thing was literally now
play doubles advocate on this higher wall. I disagree. I'd really disagree with this because I think it's really. You know we had just had Angela Duckworth on on grit. I really agree with her on you. Should be having chow just at our just above your level. So then you retain those with hearty worm and then you will feel the reward of hard work and I think that is so crucial and it doesn't mean you're gonna be doing gymnastics forever that's right role, its right, a goal of just achieving the now.
Step and what does it feel like to achieve the next up? And what in that? For me as empowerment? It's like re. Oh, I wanted something and I worked hard and I got it, but that's not in opposition to what I'm saying and I dont think what she's a degree might be. Amongst biked, there was just a field, and there were many jobs in my goal was to get us to do a double and then do a triple and then to get higher and then to learn to spend the bike. But there was no adult saying: ok, decks. The next step is this: it's like, I still was setting goals for myself, but they were my goals and I was accomplishing them, but it depends on what you're doing right. As someone who was a year later, I would not feel comfortable being girl. Learn how to do it. I can't behind your own, like that's, not a good idea right, but the question was the Jew. Dr, did you expressed an interest in learning that back and then go to an expert? They can t our did your mom say no. Now, oh, you like rolling around you're, going to learn of the back handspring. That's how you accomplished this person is going to do it in their new there in charge. You dumb thinking here I agreed, should come from the kid for sure.
But I also think it shouldn't be like it go on your own in challenge yourself or all be the teacher today for you that what will you with your bag handspring like outsource, that to a teacher if they're interested but yeah agreed on just throw them on any old thing right end. There can be things that kids do want to do with teachers. Maybe hey, you know they like drawing and they want to take a painting class. I'm not saying don't, enrich kids lives and ignore other interests, but you don't have to take any interest and turn it into a thing that is supervised and structured, by an adult, that's not necessary, and when you think about the history of the world, my favorites rights do no one else. Einstein did as a kid for fun. Tennis ball. You who does what we spend a lot of time on. A cordon Wikipedia is building houses out of cards car
I was in which you can't, and first of all they can throw into card, has school, which is probably good I'm, but certainly it looks like a stupid waste of time right wise. This kid deceived, smart or maybe he seems dumb is just there We are with the deck of card is not even playing cards is not multiplying the numbers of the guards he's just trying to build something in anything like. While what was he doing? He was learning in a little bit of physics. Patients first racial tolerance. You know they always fall right, so kids can like meander too. Here interests things that same pointless things. It might seem little dangerous are not terribly dangerous, but a little risky climbing the tree and they will keep pushing themselves because that's what interest kids right you'll find the keep doing. The same thing is right: we are playing goldfish. You know it's boring. We know how to do it already. So I wouldn't worry that a kid who likes flipping is goin to level out because they don't have a teacher, but if they want to teach her and they want to go to the next step, and you can afford a teacher
go ahead. Diving, that's my thing is just letting them drive that I think the better move would have been to let my daughter play soccer she wanted and if she said I want to join a team. Does my girlfriends on one then now my we pushed back on all this is, and I actually done It's what you're saying, but I think for someone that might interpret it this way. I want to call it out, which is I hate, all parenting advice because to me what I hate about it is, I have two daughters holy shit: are they different? first want what you learn to write a motorcycle at three years old, the second one I was nervous. If she just crossed the living room, you know she had as its big old head and not as coordinated. She had stitches before she was to the other one. I still have yet to see fall off anything in seven, so is dramatically different clearly I need to have two different gain plans for these two kids, but I dont think years
but just address. I don't even know that, but I actually think they have the same game plan, which is see what the kid is like right and roll with that. So that doesn't strike me is two different game plan. This is like a key needs, a little more supervision or in out beyond whatever you gonna do You don't have to do the same thing with both of them and I think that actually recognising how different your kids are is away relaxing little bit as apparent to because you can see that it's not your parenting that made her coordinated or uncoordinated right or not soccer hate soccer urge you relating or not, I mean it's just they come with a lot of parts installed already yeah. Ok, Oh let grow is a foundation that you have a few other folks and there's a different components of rights of first, I don't have your collar curriculum, but you have an advisor for schools who want to get involved with let grow right. We have a couple of school initiatives. Yeah and their free one is the let grow private is the teeth.
Send the kids home with the homework assignment do something on your own, and it really is to make sure that parents finally let their kid use a knife or walked a town or make dinner, or something like that, because I guess ten years before I started like right. I had started free range kids and I lectured around the country talking about why we got to the point where we don't trust our kids to do anything on their own. And everybody would not along and nothing changed. You don't really hard to be the one to send your kid to the park when you, worried that you know your neighbors going to say that's wrong and somebody might call nine hundred and eleven and your kid won't find anyone there to play with so with everybody at the school, all the kids, from kindergarten through fifth grader, even up to eighth grade, like with this middle school our sending their kids to do some things on the wrong you're, not crazy. In fact, you have to do it to fit and in towns that have done this. We for great stories about like it's now being outside on their own again, like writing their banks and skateboards and escaped you, can see them
park and they're, not all in a uniform. So when to school or a classroom or better still, an entire district does the lack row project free, free, free it really changes the kids, the parents, the neighborhood. So we recommend that, because how are you gonna get culture change without changing, behaviour if you're an administrator- and you haven't we item in the show. Where would people go to get involved you Dax. Here, I've got, you might go to, let grow dot org and then you can look up in the school section and the other that grow initiative for schools that we have is the lead play club, which is the school staying open for free play before after school mixed age. Kids about the junk around. We call it those parts but is really just junk. There's balls, there's jump ropes, there's cardboard boxes theirs
bon Moors, whatever probably lawnmowers, bad idea and kids can just play with them, and, what's really great, is that mixed age play turns out to be something else that we ve taken out of kids lives. Right of your kid is going to domestic she's, not going to the five through fifteen year old gymnastics. She's going five and six Ya'Ll gymnastics and I'll tell you this study that was done at a school that was doing the electoral play club before school. All these ages were mixed together. First of We went interviewed the kids and one kid said. The most poignant thing to me, which, as I said, how is you know what you like about the play club and he said well now I have four, ah That's a really big thing in and one of the reasons is that if you are the awkward nine year old at school. You're, the one who comes to play club. Add you give the five year old piggyback rides, and then you come to school next day and is right there,
laughed, so it can really change your entire. You know there's lacking to hate school, and this is a way to make some of them like in, and I wanted to say something actually about the liberal project to which is that kid who might not be doing well in school. We did this at a title. One school title, one as well: lot of dead, low income, kids at a school and one kid came in every week and he was working at his amphibious vehicle. Taking yeah even severely adorable and he was too ambitious, yeah to anyone who is taking this little takes wagon and train the God of he adds noodles to where it will it saying that it was listening to this round. The kids would hang on is stories every week like how is it going this wakens allow it got, but then it started Think and I had a weight in and get it and this kid is not necessarily you know: Mister math Mister.
You now spelling Bee champion, but he had a way to be doing something that his classmates and his teacher recognised as education as learning as succeeding and This was a way that all the kids could succeed, even the ones who might be really struggling with the worksheets, and it was our transformative because school is really narrow. What its teaching is academic backgrounds, I really wide and they let there be an xbox and they like doing their gymnastics and their sort of Norway to tat in the normal course of the day or in the grades, and then the report card, but so this is just a way of engaging the kids and celebrating the fact that their Corky, my God, we did a study just now. What all the we're do things the kids were learning during Kovac as they had no school or they had in a limited squawk. Neither debris hair three day printing. How to draw sponge
how to clean the toilet, but the girls out of their my sister had a boyfriend how dogs are colorblind. I may noodles, I mean kids are a lot more than reading, writing and arithmetic and it's really hard to see through the traditional curriculum. Now let grow project is just a simple way for the parents to get away from the kids for the kids to find their new interest for the school to see the kid as a whole person and for them to go off on their quirky thing like you would be an xbox and now you're, a motorcycle guy. You know you have to have time to figure who you are, and a little bit of arms up, you're driving, I was really interested in, was making kids laugh and right aren't share in I'm literally doing that's my full time focused still. I think it's important work for me to say one more thing that in defence of the moms, I think the reason they want to put the but pad. On so often because they know that when the kid vote-
rise and runs to mom mom has to deal with it right, so I for so many moms. It's like I just want to prevent this, so that I have an hour or I dont get run to every five I may know this is I cycle I was gonna was going to say my argument. That is, don't placated, don't inner. Pain it. You know, when your kids hurt her and when your kids not her. I think we can delineate when there is a real issue when there's not and if you give very limited attention, in my opinion, and their little social creatures. They want approval. If you don't indulge it, it diminishes quickly. Ok, I'm gonna be the peacemaker here, because I'd say you're both right and
I certainly when there that little that their wearing about pad and let's hope it stops at some point. You now you probably around them, and it probably isn't tone pay me an hour to deal with crying nurse, just an article of the paper today about how were hard wired to like for the crying to really just light up every neuron in our brain. So one of the things that the liberal project and me just talking about childhood independence is doing is like you have to be away from them part because when you're with them, you will be running. When you see them her, then you will be saying: oh I see or using the yellow crianan. You will be saying you're having fun. Let me way with you now to, by the way, a great advice for parents that I heard recently thy love, which is don't try to make a happy kid happier, love them Isn't that right that adding to me tries at all the time? Ok, how can we
on this political but yeah yeah right. I write it already fun and now I'm going to put you on my shoulders, so it'll be even more funding. It's the craving cycle we introduce them to. My kids are in their early twenty is now so they should turn it off if you're listening to this package, because what I'm crossing the street with them, they are twenty. Two and twenty four and I see them like looking down at there followed a drive me crazy because I usually watching it a lot both ways and I treat them like their three year olds learning. You know how do you know what is a car and its because I'm with them? I know that when I'm not with them, I gossip. I hope that when I them they're not looking at their fallen browsing this because they have to take responsibility. So if I'm not with them, I'm not worried. And yet they somehow cross the street for all these years, and I haven't been with them all the time so as long as you're spending so much time with We just talked earlier about nine more hours a week. That's an entire worked day with your kids all the time. It's more time for you to be worried
and her asked and sad and put upon add covert into the mix where I'm now with them. Twenty four seven for five months straight- I mean that's so or more at talking and we were all enjoying this break, but I think what happens when your parent Monica you ve, witnessed the two guys you better on my kids as much as I have you get a glimpse into their real life. Often you look the window in the two are plain and were nowhere to be found right. Maybe they think we're still sleep or something, and I watched them navigate situations over and over again that they would not do if I was present or my wife was present, while in increasing order less if I'm present, as they know, I just don't, go down that road a lot, but by God they worked shit out. In fact, I'd argued they get along a lot better. When we're not around, you see it all the time you ll catch him out of the window, you'll see them on the rulers gates, eat shit, fall, get up and there's no crying as well
there is one. I would observe that you have to recognise the many dynamics that are going on gas teeth are always gonna buy for your attention, or at least that's what I've seen in my life. So it is easier if you're not there and it is giving them these the chance to develop those skills, as opposed to outsourcing the argument to bring us back to the parents magazine. That said, you should always be there to intervene. That's this crazy culture size talking about professor of education once who took twelve grand students over to Scotland and they were watching the kids on, ground. Once again it was mixed age during recess and afterwards they told her. It was so extraordinary what they saw and she's award. You see she said well, I saw, could fall down and none of the teachers went to the kid and the kid just got up and kept playing. I mean the fact it has become an extraordinary like a weird site.
Blue whale antelope, walkin downloading drive. You know I haven't seen that before I go. There used to be alone antelopes there before we paid the place, but in any event, there is something to be said for when adult standby, kid step. I love now quickly because what one element of this that is serious witches and you re did this yourself, which is you are you are allowing your kid to further explore and that the mass transit system and he's getting better and better in the dolly real stumbling block the train conductor, refuse to drive the train cause. He was on without apparent than instead of calling you here please now the police are calling you and that's happened twice. So there's even better. Crazy examples of people being arrested and or assigned work release, and all these weird things for basically just letting their kids act like I acted one thousand nine hundred and eighty three so
on the legislative side. Do. How do you guys provide help like there's a huge all odd, yeah? Three that the utilised, which is so fantastic? It is called the free range parenting law and it says that giving your kids some independence, letting them want to school, come home with a latch key play in the park can't be mistaken for neglect. If you want your kid to be doing that, and your kid isn't the three year old it off its reasonable and statistically safe like once again, it's not that nothing could ever happen, but it's extremely safe. Nonetheless, to let your two kids go play the part that should be of parental choice and then, as I studied this issue more, I found out some really offals statistics in terms of intervention, which is that thirty seven, Santa of american cans will be visited, were reported to see PS at some point, which has just excessive and its because people dont know when to call him by the way, if you're, African American, that's fifty three percent to three percent and a lot of times, it's because of mistaking poverty for neglect,
kid, you're eight year old is home with the five year old for two hours after school, because you're working to jobs is that neglect or is that you have in your kids rice occasion do something a little old fashioned, which is the holder kid watching the younger kid why you work so you can put food on the table, so we ve been trying. Pass a similar law, which we now call the reasonable childhood independence law in other states, and we thought we were so pausing Colorado. We had by Patterson support. It was literally Publican and Democrats. Sponsoring this law to sail through unanimously through the House in Colorado, is a weak away from passage in the Senate when Covert shut things down. And similarly in South Carolina had passed unanimously in the Senate, was about to go to the house. So we're hoping that when everything resumes that those two states will pass it, and then we ve had interest in a bunch of other states too, and we can't handle address data once because it's us like grow, providing information and testimony and contacts- but we are hoping to
ass it in another, six or seven states. This year- and I think you know, is still wrong to neglect your kids and it doesn't take that away from child protective services. It allows them to concentrate on actual years of neglect and not some mom who let her kids walk home from the park or play in the park No on a sunny day, while she was working her job, hopefully we will pass these laws in all fifty states. That say, neglect is neglect. Things happen, sometimes in your parent and it's happening on the fly and to think that every moment has to be perfect that would always have everything in control all is unrealistic, and here I'll tell you a story so there Diane in England, and he and his wife were a pub and the wife left, and then he laughed and then his daughter, who was, I think, nine or ten came out of the bathroom and said: where is everyone Now you could say that these were neglectful parents, but actually it was the Prime Minister of Britain, all their prey
this directive for this and get my blouse Tony Blair. Yes, it was Tony Blair Algonkins Tony Blair and they both thought that the kid had gone with one or the other of them. So you could arrest him and say he lay tis child in a palm. That's an unsafe thing: there's alcohol there strangers they were in the bathroom. God knows what or you could say these things happen, I really want us to have a system that you know might get a call. There was a kid kitten deposits like well, happen and you find out the story girl, that's not a story, that's not neglect their kids, sometimes, who get out at night now a three year, all too you don't realize they suddenly have learned how to turn the door knob and out they go in there wandering that's, not neglect the valley. Things happen to be a good samaritan. The kid back. Don't call nine when one it's egg, it up put my neighbour in jail that doesn't make any sense. Virtually a year ago, right now, we were ass. In Laos, education, where we have these two families we pod with and we always travel together and yet a two year old, just left,
The houses and walked behind this very, very long driveway in was in our house like trying to wake people up. Instead, it was his own, for I don't know about two hours you got Nobel Prize and then the so they were just like all my god. He was. How do you know about yet noted liked happening just like some right shit that happens right? Why do you like the public is on such high alert with this? fear that we have been all anytime time again, as you know, by themselves they could be kidnapped or whatever, and so judgmental that it turns into a nine one but also people are told. If you see something say something in nobody's ever told what something is there if you see it- and I guess I would try to figure out whose kid it was. But if I didn't know, I would call the cops, but I would not want the cops to think well well. I can't wait to arrest that mom, it's always the mom. I think your outlets, nine, who this kid lost too much.
Helper install a lock war even and Tony Blair's story. It's it's so rife with all the different status issues. So yet because, as Tony Blair, it's kind of a charming funny story- that's right out now low income couple, they would be island, when parents who are attics in pieces of shame and imagine if it's a single man, yeah well Lenore, what a part yeah and I think everyone should should petition their school districts to implement the let grow policies. I think that would be a great idea. It's not just for schools. You can go to let road at Org and click on the independents project, Electro independence kit. I mean it's basically fight for home use, and so many kids are home at this plans is another thing of like why dependence is important and how you can step back and here's some ideas were brought, your kids can do and if you want to share pictures or stories, please do, but it's it's free against the lack of independence
and the best part is. I watched the outcome of many of the Ep Associated TV. Show everyone every aren't my tv girl. I do my homework. Wasn't I not real time, but in my preparation of talking you, yes, but all the parents are very happier. The kids are happy every one wins. I want to add that I shot that you could find them. I can't find my at this as a major issue, crafty with the Google search. Enjoy the rest of your quarantine? We love talking you and I hope we do you again and all your the people, you recommended. Ok, great I've, a single list, our guide election thank you Monica again and now my favorite part of the show the fact check with my soul, mate Monica Batman, I told Doktor Ryan Matter. I've been out of my sling the lot at home and he said no problem, that's yeah that was gonna, be in trouble. You that you're breaking the rule yeah had admission to make them is a noble,
Just don't, you know, don't be a knucklehead about it. Try to bench, press or anything U I haven't done that now, as I did bang on some squats yesterday, but that was very conservative. That's it the ass aloud, I gotta say that's the worst part of this whole thing is being out of my exercise: routine you'll go on walks. Yeah I need you die. So hot? I'm used to read O regular, which you know you're treadmills on my porch is my goodness: you set it up in here: can be on it? While you during the fact check, I wonder how loud it is its whisper, quite small home. It was Iceman upwards of forty five dollars on it. What thank you. I really went for. Oh, my god, it's too much, you know really go over the top, if you want to Mommy five die, were ok is much cheaper than the White Mercedes. I'm trying to buy
nope. Do you think if I say what Mercedes on here enough times that they will just contact, doesn't give you one. Why cut it out? ass having so you did. What made me leave sounds spoil I forget. Why were we lose perspective? Some work on a bad? Are we ban? I don't know be back. We're gonna live your life. You know they make sense, well, there's always are well. This is a thing people we complain about something in their life and in some Naso girl. Like you, have heart disease, yeah, there's always something's war, sooner shaming people for having problems that are not as significant as other problems. Rightly people are just people, but the monarch in Paradise on an island, they're gonna find something to ruminate on it, just the nature of human sure. That's true peace. Is still important. Have perspective Senor complaining our feeling.
Oh, you know my condition its not act. I dont think its objectively related all the time to Europe. Actual situation. It is human nature. You you know spiral about things. Yes, ass about things to make a big deal out of nothing. It is people. It round worried about gettin attack by a bear is uneven. Gonna happen to me: you worry about it and I think about about two times a week Now I never using of other things like that. No, not like that, not a bear! but a human you'll think about human murder, young human murderer, kidnapper taking you, I used to think that out alive. I don't think that much about murders, anymore, that since you got your boy grown Jujitsu, that Y yeah yeah, you feel capable than that. I would love to have a black digital you'd be great at it, banks yeah yeah, a lot of aggression. You know why
be great at. It is itself of all the martial arts. It's the mouse rain. Heavy one how it is you more of a mental supplant fasting? Well, it's all about not exerting energy and letting your opponent get tired and just weathering their barrage of action and learn to do that, while keeping your breathing low in maintaining your energy So there's a whole mental aspect to it that unites us think and man's Marshall. I think a woman's yeah like that, it's all about like his strength, its about love, She now in using their weight against them and stop it very tactics. Hannah sounds Physics, Romania, which are not that you never have to use a calculator during all again to Bermuda, trig calculator people get like the size of a microwave ovens.
As you are, probably that was produced in my area, demographic calculator. I don't really know what I'm talking about. I just know that at a certain level of math and ice, quiet get some calculations, is size of your laptop, and it had so many weird symbols and buttons on it, and it reminded me of trying to learn how to read music, which you know how I feel about that stupid as system ever that stupid fans with a bunch of I'd Issues ABC De listen, that's called the grass thing, calculator isn't grafting or graphic, I think wrapping can get calculator groping. Mine was not as big as my laptop. It looks like this. You are now you know yet as a smaller and new or not, but there still like, there's like this egg gather really enormous. I loved it. Oh you did yeah, I feel kind of cool. Having that calculator. Sure, like you, had a real nice people, Hardware, ya, ya, to me
You know I dropped out of video games when their became more than to button, so I loved Super Nintendo and had a M and then about it, always stagger uptown left right to have a choice to know. Now. I just had a thumb: arrows, ok, yeah, uptown left right left right. A baby, I think, was the code to get unlimited life's in Contra anyways, I loved it and then the new one came out and then there's a pair of buttons on both sides at the top and then now may be for buttons and then yes, again We stick here. That was my era too much for me. Ok, I was, This is too many buttons to keep track of, and then I fell off in a kind of grateful that that happen. This is rising kazoo like gadgets, droughts. Weird I have very small threshold. For too many things are. You a calculator. This way too many buttons K, ok, evil.
Out. A young acts are growing today, my goodness Lenore Lenore. Trusting person. She is here to dream is and whether you agree with her or not one must respect the bravery being so against the grain and having the confidence to stick by opinion, I think there was so much societal pressure against her eye. Fine, though, because it's against the grain, but just twenty years ago, it was not again it is totally norm, commonplace, commonplace, yeah! It is weird, but I think especially when you know she was on the news in the headline always said like world's worst parent and stuff, like that they are calling for the name of her. Shall we asked yes? Actually it's called. This is a fact. Actually, it's called world's worst mom, world's worst mom Cineplex Produce series at aired on slice, tv and syndicated by tee. See international based
Toronto. The show features extremely overprotected parents and their families, and then she works with the parents to help get them outside their boundaries, and their fears. She seemed scandinavian to me really. Why of the stereotype about Scandinavians, that They are not afraid to do something that is unpopular if they think it's gonna have a good result. They seem pretty fearless such stereotypes are used is like the highest opinion. You could possibly have of any culture. Would you have what scandinavian culture? always always win the happiest place on earth. When there's that there's like data were, I have a friend you lived in Sweden for quite a long time. And he says: yeah there's a lot of wonderful things about it, but it's also it's a very bland
yeah. Now we wouldn't really like it wealth, I've been there and I like to quite a bit and also He'S- got so much accompanying in turn, all bad going Zadig he was on vacation. There is, like you know, use separated, his mother be met. Any easy was an outsider, you know, yams, others is, I don't know, he's the best person to evaluate yeah, I guess, but you just like gathers, not movies. I don't know he just he. He said that he thinks. If we live there, we would find it fairly, vanilla, augured. Now, arts of those drowned move their fun. You don't want to come bulwark. The the weather is very
After all, it all yeah yeah, I'm in the fact that its it's dark all winter. He had no thanks, I'm already out you're out here with a few words boy, they're beautiful. You set your sites on those fjords boy there looking about ok, so her father ran a tennis club, any you asked if it had inflatable down smaller her. What are those domes for they are for whether speaking of whether an arena have a sound effect for time you should we should have sound effects. This isn't my was suggesting about two years ago. We are get a little pad. Get me lad and all all use a free naming, meaning that are lacking to be the one to be quick? Yes, indeed, Arthur land weather conditions. You can play tennis whenever you like you're, so she talks about one shoes
kindergarten and she walked to school and the crossing guard was wearing a day, glowing mass and then she married images so exciting, fro cute Oh, I marry my crossing guard Do you remember who were no, of course not, but it'll come out over time, then he he cross guarded my story. Well, if you, are the crossing guard and you have a memory of young Monica plaid men just, so we little creature, I welcome all the edge to him. I would kill them meet that little girl, because I'm sure you were still super opinionated and bossy. This depends on what great you got me like. If you were the crossing gar when I was in first grade, you probably at a low opinion of me, that was my rough year I stole sand Arden cookie you are a kind of
an outlaw that year. I think that was the year. Maybe we can agree that I was really mean to the boy sat next to me: oh Venice, dad and he was really cue. The taboo yeah, oh and said that I was being nice to him that day, because you like the guy now you're so interesting, some piercing was forty years older than you hardly now it was if I was in kindergarten, he was probably like truly at that his communist twenties yeah. What are you all right? handsome deals Iranians and now he was black and the Rhine is and is not by not that I know, and he had, I believe, like a mustache I like July. I think I think like an oh, my god, a mustache wouldn't kindergartner like some months. The idea to show care one he's had one before. Ok, I don't think he had one at that time. Maybe missed you.
Dad's mustache had and shaved it off. So no one time we went over to my dad's house on the weekend and die. He had shaped his whole beard off. It was like no, no! No! No! No! No! No! Thank you. I did not like it s like when news did, you are sending out their desire to cry said you dont locally, my daddy yeah hockey, Michael Myers, Thrifty, acres and mission you shaved in the parking lot. You went into Myers Thrifty acres and I body, battery powered shaver in than I outside, nay, I stood outside the car, and I looked at my reflection on the passenger window and I just it all off, and then I got the car and I turned and looked in the back seat and all to look at Mean she circle That is a shock I mean I thought you just like. Did it in the hotel room,
and she was there. No, nor did it right in the parking lot. I beg of you watching that you might think a guy, murdered someone and now he's trying to like change his appearance. I find it very odd that you did at it in a part of a really. I was in a hurry to get something off my fate. Clearly I do that or wherever they just Dory and then I went on my arm. I gotta get rid of you now I it's like an impasse, soon? Ok, yeah I get back to the days she didn't the same did it exists back then the color, A glow day. Glass, like you, know, day aglow, yellow yeah. They worn gangway glow color corporation. Oh it's corporation, Yad Corp, and was founded and nineteen forty six. So it did exist at that time. Ok
so she mentioned a New York Times. Article called something like the pain of intensive parenting, but she couldn't remember the exact title. It's called the relentless of modern parenting and feel free to look bad up and in that article tion thing. The survey found that college educated mobs are spending nine hours more a week with their kids and a generation ago. That's what Lenore said an inch mentioned sheep. Remember, the number of hours for Non college educated mobs. So in the good says the time parent spend in the presence of their children has not changed much, but parents today spend more of it doing hands on child care tat spent on activities like reading the children doing crabs. Taking them. The lessons attending recitals and games and helping with homework has increased the most today mother spend, they five hours a week on that, compare with one hour, forty five minutes in nineteen. Seventy five and they worry it's not.
Last year, parents leisure time like exercising our socializing is much more likely to be spent with their children than it used to be, while fathers have recently increased their time spent which and mother stones. Five minutes a week, TAT eleven minutes away. Here there is still a span of significant anymore. But I looked in the article and I didn't see numbers for Non college, educated moms in that article gun. Ok, she said three out of Abraham Lincoln to Ford kids didn't make it to adulthood, but she wasn't sure if they died, while he was fighting in the civil war, so the civil war was. When do you now? I think civil war. I'm just I'm guessing here. I think I want to say one thousand. Sixty four agents sixty one to eighteen. Sixty five. So that was only ass. Ok, yeah good! Thank you so First, some lived a long life. The second son Edward was born in eighteen, forty six and died in eighteen. Fifty
four years on a is believed to be tuberculosis, both the third on William, nicknamed Willie was born less than a year after Edwards death indicted age, a Levin while the Lincolns resided in the White House or you, oh my god. So Thou would be at the beginning of the civil war right. So if it was less than a year after Edwards DAS, who would have been an eighteen, fifty org in fifty, why, then, eleven years of subordinating sixty one okay so that their was then their youngest son, Thomas known as Tad eighteen. Fifty three he outlived his father by six years. Oh, he died in eighteen. Oh my god. You guys poor Robert Robert, all his brothers die and in his dad MIKE it's a miracle that Abe Lincoln was able to do. Is he aware that disease you think he had
Why nobody he had at everyone working. There is consensus on that we looked it up and there was no that was effect. You Ok. Anyhow, he had terrible depression, yet humdinger disease. What is it? now. It has within an Martians what he had Marvin's three of his children died in his wife. She horrendous, depression is well. I mean What is seen there in the White House AIDS Furthermore, what, but they went through ok, on Lincoln's, unusual physical appearance, Doktor, Abraham Gordon proposed in nineteen sixty two, the Lincoln had Marfa Syndrome testing. Lincoln's DNA from Orphan syndrome was contemplated in the ninety nineties, but such a test was not performed. Girl broke her, always tonsure, depression
of children dying and then ultimately assassinated or watching a play What I add, my goodness, that was his reward thinking The legacy yeah still was able to do that. Speaking of horrible, sadness is chat with Bozeman almost yeah yeah calling answer resembled a one year and he had it for four years and no one knew what he was doing all of these projects. He knew he knew I was like in between tree. And doing projects in my car they have one of those in the candy. No, I don't. It was enormous black panther as such They clearly were making more. I wonder if they already made one they had announced another, but I don't know that. A shot at the end of it so so
admiral I mean just like pushing through and that kind of way, like Obama posted about him and just ended, basically by saying what a powerfully use of his years yeah. I always urge them It's not a popular opinion, but in evaluating the life, not by its longevity, but by its yeah potency out. The right yeah There's a ton of lives that ended in their forties that I would prefer to have over many many lives and went to a hundred b, I now that's that's not to say that it's not heartbreaking, when I want to add a weird aspect. This might sound insensitive but incredible that he was battling there and it was also in the physical shape. Using I mean he was so fair set. I think there something about he did an award show or something and who is really like gone, and everyone was like commenting on which also just goes
like everyone just wants to refund other view that only when he has cancer right right right Ok, so so she asked of lions can climb trees and you said the female ones. Can you have seen him ok, so the lion is able to climb trees but is limited to the lower branches line as large and bulky gravity gives these cats a much harder time by and large, lined prefer to sleep on the ground. Although a couple of prize throughout after have proved that they are fully capable of climbing up, but I couldn't any gender. I looked at a lot of genuine reason. They can only go to the lower branches cause they way so much. They re females way three hundred pounds and then the males way form fifty pounds, so I think fit there. Similarly rang attends the males live on the ground in females live up in the canopy. Males are just too heavy and aggressive. I love orangutans with those males are naughty there,
oh you're not be like grow pooper people will know they re there's a lot of rape high among orangutans and what's really interesting, they ve tried to study the the female can still select which male they get pregnant by, which is this great mystery? but then they get raped. They get raped here they pretty much just stay away from those big deal. Sit down on the ground, but still the female ragged tens are so fucking Cubans, Martin, cable wow, that's are all to similar Amelia. There is orangutan orphanage in either Borneo or Sumatra. That's where they live, those two islands they have shores and then they complete their chores, get the select from one of their Hobbes, so they have to wash well said: there's the obvious religion and washing close to us and then
the one I watched the to arrange tens favorite activity was canoeing. Oh my line at Washington, their clothes. They get the coup canoeing in illegal Canute out into the middle dislike and then just started hitting each other with the oars. Oh, there really care giver, see the Julia Roberts Duck your men, about orangutan. She was at that orphanage in she went There was a big now in their fuckin big, the that their above three hundred pounds is well and she got close to one and she was just sitting in everything. Looked these four and then he described by the neck. It was so fucking scare, oh my god, and then the deeds ran in start, abandon him around to get him to really. Sir, but it was now is quite scary. Oh yeah, you know one of mess with those. Do you think those boys? I do think they were? There was war, fine, ok, ok,
moving on this kind of a dark upso between Abe, Lincoln and then their rang, a TAN Chad in Chadwick, yeah, ok said, I think that there is a woman in the Netherlands has a video or she gives you a drug after you, ve been exposed to something scary and then you're not afraid afterwards. This was in relation to immersion therapy. Maybe she's I think she did. I e that doesn't sound familiar to me at all. Ok, so Merrill kin. Those pronounced marijuana nope marrow kin. Togo is a professor and researcher what the University of Amsterdam and she's develop what she calls be met correct method for phobia sufferers. This method is based on premise from Mcgill University Research are Karim, nadir that our brains, re, save memories and that these memories are malleable. So Kint explains our method works. First, we trigger the fear memory by exposing what do a situation or stimulus that they fear in your case, snags? Oh yeah kin, then
add something new to the experience such as challenging a patient afraid of heights, not to close his or her eyes. This is a signal to the brain to update the memory. Says the memory traces temporarily in a deep stabilized state. Usually that fear memory would be real saved in the brain overnight as the patient sleeps, but kin has found the patient- takes a single dose of a beta blocker Brandon. All pro ran all Wall Protocol Plannin on my God. His sword calls opprobrium along omega you, Hence here up saying, prefer prey on them all its appropriate now, lol, You think you're getting closer to a further away. Closer ran Mama programme along minute. It ok so anyway,
single dose of beta Blocker called plan along after the memory is triggered. It disrupts the re saving process. Fran. A law was originally devolved to treat angina, not but China that's a heart condition he up here, but it has since been used to treat many health conditions, including tremors, cardiac rhythm years, and since it lowers heart rate and blood pressure, anxiety, The treatment is successful. The memory is altered as the patient, sleeps and a strong fear response will no longer be triggered. Deserve results is a dark. I don't, the area or does work, she thinks that works in kind even with a snake in your bottom, we'll have tested out of destiny, other Amsterdam, the University of Amsterdam gap, you know, Arizona state has a reputation of being a party schoolboys. You imagine, the Amsterdam University mean the ultimate parties yeah, but
Stewart there. So they're not going crazy. They really are now. It's only be american Dingus is over there that are like following about the streets and stuff. Here I was one of em at one. Me too. Did you good shooting when you're there did you now yeah, you marijuana so now, just archeologist drink you per year are directly at here. You stay here tomorrow Sobriety word. There is, and I quit dipping tomorrow, you can do it, I'm gonna. Do I know you can't do it not excited about it again. There is a free rein. Parenting, lawn, Utah Lenore, talked about, and that was enacted in May two thousand and eighteen type in born really was, tion and was wanted it to be here. I'm want to get better at Thailand you're doing a great job. Thank you and that's all four Lenore ought is a. I took a screen shot of it
and then I meant to send it to you. But now this read it out loud that with a personal get credit for it, because it was a very funny. Joe Cholera, ok already yeah, it's about you I'm scared Gary Howard, twenty seven on in Scram fan ass to episode, Jason Bateman is alleging congrats and sixteen years Bubba when Monica p baby girl, in trouble, does she say urine about a year, trouble hats, raying says really Gary Gary really good job. Thank you. There's a lot of people out there that could Brighton Film in television yeah agreed as it as the upside of that There you are in trouble is definitely that's for sure. As really good, ok, great I love you and down happy writing birthday. Happy sobriety vote. They too, you are you gonna. Try
not drink tomorrow on my birthday disposed to women are all right: you're, gonna, slowly, good, yes, maybe just like five or six miles, ok, go up in all I'll. Do half you go down
Transcript generated on 2020-09-07.