The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Kevin O'Connor to discuss the proposed World Cup–like group stage format for the NBA playoffs, potentially eliminating conferences, how to maintain the integrity of the NBA regular season, exciting matchups, and more (2:15). Then Bill and Joe House revisit the 2004 NBA draft and discuss some of the subplots, draft comedy, and NBA legends from that draft class (40:25) before redrafting the top 14 lottery picks (55:00).
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Today's episode of the bill, Simmons Podcast on the Ringer podcast network breathy by Ziprecruiter. We know a lot of things are gonna, be different. When sports comes back, how we get into games, how we have tickets, how we buy food and drink? How we, who were sitting next to well lot of things, may change
or opens up again, but one thing we change our presenting sponsorship recruiter and their mission, though, continue doing what
those then helping growing companies higher for their teams in helping people find jobs if you're actively hiring zip code, one by candidates to apply to your most urgent roles in faster and easier to reach. The people need by bring employers and job seekers to gather zipper. Twitter is working to help all of us hypocritical Dhaka, so
hush work together were also brought by the ringer dot com, where you can read sports and pop culture content, like always some of the best stuff and the Ringer pack has that work where we
a whole bunch of pies, including the wire way down the hall wrapped up season, one bad news for wireless, but they
at this season, twelve and then there's can be winners and losers later this week and speaking of that back ass, one of the cars Van late and has a new park as coming out on thirst
it's got higher learning, then,
in an Rachel Linsey breaking down sports pop culture, urban culture, low politics to an ass
super excited about this one so subscribe. Now the feed is live. Some of the best pot art David Shoemaker and his team have ever done for us. It's really cool, looking very excited for this podcast again, it's called higher learning. Go subscribe, get ready for the first part, it is unlike any ringer podcast we've had so there you go coming up we're going to talk to Kevin O'Connor about his World CUP idea for the basketball playoffs at basketball can come back during the quarantine and then the redraft balls. Two thousand
or the redraft buzzes back me Joe House, a breakdown that Jack. That's how come not. First, our friends from project I fresh from his latest battle, some worthy eighteen, fifty seven oconnor your beard, its indescribable. I cannot function or think about anything else, other than have full beautiful. That thing is looks I I can't
describe it. I really can't
going on you're, not grooming, anymore you're, just go on full out. Castaway wine based
dollar, full outcasts away fall out pandemic beard here I am, I do need a groom it. I do need to blow dry, it so say the beard experts that I watch on Youtube so that the next step is getting some of that stuff.
With the assistance of my mom, who used to be a hare stylist. Shall we,
about what some of that Gimme some tips and tricks
you're, so manly. If so much testosterone,
you should just be spreading your seed across very good out of seven hundred kids. I don't forget
the safest favour, found out about speaking of quarantine
you wrote today about a World CUP bracket format for the plan. So we talked a lot on sundays vied with Marcello about.
Different things I heard that aren't finalize, but I think what their target right so to rehash for people having heard yet I heard July, twenty fifth is when they want the plants to start hopefully September.
When he would be the last day of the NBA finals, hopefully September twenty fifth three
should be the NBA draft, either that Thursday, Friday, hopefully and then October, first free agency, the part that they have not been able to fix
yeah, and another word taken this on a Tuesday,
and who knows that they figured out by the time it might have happened by the time we take this until people hear it, they have not figured out. The part with the regular season will look like
The kind of preliminary part of the play off so look like Marquis, been there is an article to day in the air and the internet's by timid man about Mark Cuban wanted to do basically the old-
Danny, it's hell, Basque, about turn him an idea for the last two seeds bump out: twenty nine
to get rid of them. The next in the warriors have thirteen through twenty eight have some sort of tournament for the seven eight seeds. Let's start there before we get into your woke up idea. How many different ideas have
heard fur what they would do with this little abbreviated, regular season, slash
first ran plan, whatever the fuck. This is too many to count. That's for sure,
go back the march. It's been a endless amount of different ideas that the leak
I'm using for the policies.
Or the resumption of the regular season in it. No mark human
idea, which was basically all thirty teams come back to play and they play.
They were between five to seven games,
Then you would have the planned tournament in each conference, with the seven and eight seeds against the night,
intensive. That could be done in a different number of ways work.
Its double elimination or could be like many three aims: series
different variations, but there seems to be a lot of support in it and in terms of having an idea like
that a cuban the idea,
in a one, I'm me if that's what ends up happening and then we have our typical seven name, SIRI, starting in the first round
which is that everything they want by July. Twenty fifth is what your hearing that's like tat of the drop dead. We probably go further than that date.
It's like made Lage lie. What I would like you said lie. Twenty fifth is probably that last date, because you only have a certain amount of time that you're gonna be play,
games, and one of the points being raised me consistently over the last month is for the NBA for the Players Association and for the teams vein.
To figure out what is the best way to use our time?
is it having you know, a golden state verses, cleave on game is, is it like getting? Those players are paychecks? Maybe it is. Maybe it is
but there are a lot of people wooden leg. You say because of the amount of money
I'm from a national television contracts in the post season, but that would actually be the more advantageous.
To pursue, whereas if you start with the regular season with all thirty teams- and if something goes wrong
If you need a delay for a couple days or for a week and you get a cut some more games that could become from the policies instead,
The lot of challenges that need to be balance here for the NBA and I like Cubans
overall, but one of the things he said
article that I don't really understand. As he said, the group stage idea what for
then too devalues the regular season.
Don't see how installing a plant ornament that would give the Knicks the Cavs the pistons a chance to make the postseason doesn't see value in the regular season. To me that that's a separate issue, but I don't see how you can say that about the group stage,
a cop style group stage, but not about the planned torn up and allow some of these really bad teams to actually get to the planned tournament. The other say thing:
Cuban Wang in and potentially jeopardizing his mavericks were seven seed, math they're like ten games ahead of the nine said, so for him to say: oh, we should do this and it actually is
disadvantage to his own team. I thought was interesting. The other thing that came out today, you know Dame lowered talk to Crusades,
and he said how he's not coming back of its meaningless. If it's not worth anything, he threw out. Look if we have a plan with the seven through twelve seeds and we have a chance to actually do it. Then a man,
What I thought was interesting. We know that he was one of the ten guys on that phone call about the superstars right, which was two weeks ago and this that was the tipping point for when this shifted and this started to become real once the superstars going to buy. We know he's one of the superstars I had heard, and I mentioned
and want to last week's pods about one of the scenarios was dumped the final three teams in each conference and basically have twenty
more in the way that would work, as we explained on Sundays pot, is some sort of seven eight nine, ten eleven twelve for the last two spots and I'd heard that pretty convincingly from a couple people I thought position that he brought it up,
cuz. He is one of the influential guys it gives him a chance to actually potentially make the playoffs, and I think part of what you'd want to do with whatever playoff system you come up with is limit the amount of teams and players in this tournament. So if we have to get rid of six teams, that's a hundred you know hundred or so players and coaches and everybody else that are just removed from from the campus, which I think is ultimately a good thing. Do you think that's the best idea before we get to the World CUP that, if we're going to do a play in that knocking out the bottom six, seven through twelve, some
the plan for those last two seeds? Do you think that would work? I mean it's a good plan. I think it's. The best plan, I tend to favour the group stage plan and then the one thing I want to go back to that. You did say, as you mentioned, how for she went to suggest. That would be not the best thing for Dallas son,
certainly sure only a game and a half back from Houston and Oklahoma City, so they could actually move up understandings
you everybody plans had like Sergei Ass, yet
IRAN could turn out that ok, see or Houston ends up in that seven spot. Instead, ok so explain the World CUP thing to our lesters. I saw the World CUP style
stage was proposed by the NBA last week and their genes,
surveying and basically it could be. Twenty teams enter the policies and the top twenty record, so that would include the next four teams in the West Portland nor
Airlines, San Antonio Sacramento
Nobody in these because then the next forward, I'm Plath teams- are the best teams are in the West, Washington, five and a half back
women are worse off than those other teams solely the top twenty themes that gets slotted into five tears. You would take the top fourteen
and workin descending order by record or some other way, but this is the most logical way, so the top forty years would be bucks. You know raptors in these and in Lakers and clippers in the west they would be that the top two year teams- men from there.
You would have teens randomly drawn from the room.
Two years in order to create groups, groups and solidarity in some of to second now you're throwing away conferences
this idea. Throwing away copses are out. Yes, conferences are out in this.
Ashton and from what I understand. This is probably one of the only way that will see. No conferences seems like when I play off racket. It would keep with the car conferences. As is so it s. You would get rid of conferences. You would have teams playing each other team in its own group twice, so every team would play a total of eight games and the team. The top two teams from those groups would move on into the second round of the play off sent a typewriter would still vow favour the teams of the better regular season record.
After two teams, Vashe Foreign for the box and, let's just say the kings. If that were to happen, the bucks would advance because what I rolled on with that for a second of fighting with the Thai Breaker Bay
that alone, where he had no like what a great way for the kings to get knocked out of the plants, because they lost the thai breaker to somebody else, even though they are the same record. I wonder if you first,
they'll. Do you like this idea? Do you like that? The groups want so there's two separate things
I hear what is that,
Eliminating the conferences is its own, really fine idea that I think if you ever gonna try this, and I think
I think they're looking at a lot of this quarantine stuff as a chance to reset things that may
they'd always kind of wanted to change, including starting the season on Christmas day, whether it made sense to have conferences for the plants and stuff like that. So by eliminating the conference's, assuming there was in an uproar for it,
and assuming a just had more unpredictability and all that stuff it could be a way for than they did their funding. For that I've always thought it was a good idea. I always liked.
The idea of just one through sixteen more more random. The fact that these teams can you know it during an non quarantine time.
They can happen a charter plain and fly wherever it's not like. It was in the eighties where their flying coach,
I just want to learn the teams do have with conference for in the future, but at least well set out
see our fans react now because that they now itzhak as if you're, the Celtics and Euro five Senior Play Portland there are twelve seed and you have the flag of Portland for Games three and four than game sex
and that's thirty one hundred miles or whatever it is that would suck it's a big difference. We that Philly, but so anyway, for that first part eliminating the conference's. If you ever,
going to do it. This is the year and I actually kind of like it. I got excited reading your piece about it. The second piece, the twenty teams that solves two problems right. We don't care about anybody in the east, who's not apply after him, others
sir delay. We don't have already Washington and forget what I want to make a push, but you know five and a half back. The odds are with a month remaining ye. It's so slim that side Erika. Yet sorry enough, that's my problem with more Cubans idea. You're! You want to say that
As you know, the group stays devalues the red or seas and makes it a relevant, but you're tellin me it's fair for the next, so the calves are the hawks to get into the policies and this the group stage idea.
To me it is a larger change on paper, but it retains the valley
of what the season was in terms of the year,
Only allowing the teams are actually had a shot.
To have a chance in the policies and you're only putting those forty
is there on the bubble in the west in it. That's it well
The thing that I don't love is a team like the Celtics right. So there are the subjects the cut off team, whose the fifteen there
attacks they would be in the second year, and yet there be fifteen who are they? The fifth passed him now? There is somebody for, though I record yes by right, so they
potentially get screwed with that and there I don't know a game behind Toronto game. It have something like that. It would make more sense to me to have the top and I'm not just saying this cuz, I'm a Celtics fan other. Maybe ten percent
It would make more sense to me to have eighty five eighty percent occur. It would make more sense for it. I also think that.
One seed should get rewarded a little more right. The lay malarkey
So are you aware if you had one threw away- and you had five is with the fourth prestige, so that, though
fourth group, an you who's, the fourteen right now in the east,
No just then genera who's, the number for a variety of deep clippers right now right. So if it was Boston, is five coopers or for their the top two teams in the fourth group, and then it descends so that the Lakers group has the seventh Bestia
and walk his group has the eighth best team in I don't do that you can get there. I would.
See that and then have a lottery for the other twelve teams in Fort worth. I mean the way this was structured.
Article is just one variation of what you could use
I just asked him how it could be a random draw. That's what the World CUP does that's what the Champions League does that's what
Socrates around the world do, but you could have the top seeds drafts. You could have the Lakers select their tea.
Comes within their own group
an amazing data. We need. I love that that cause there. I mean a lot of that. It will also systems
Finland's idea of what.
Why you got us a lot about whether we block about talking about making rivalries
but you could do that or you could do as you suggested, that those top seeds get one of the bottom teams for shore right that that to me it would be a fair thing to do to instead of eyes they stop teams to approve that, but I would say
stop team, so you know if the Bucs, what the Adam Silver be like. We understand you like this idea, but we're not in favor of it. It screws us. We want the one eight matchup that we strobes have during the regular season at the Wannsee two thousand six hundred and fifty three games going twelve losses. If I get that, but you still are the favorites within your own group, regardless of how it shakes out and also because you had the best regular season record, you would have the advantage, and I tried
not to mention that for this situation, what is good for the overall league also benefits you as well. Maybe there's a short term hid here, but if this is a hit for the league for every team, playing
eight games which would be a total of eighty games. Eighty game's over two and a half three weeks, however, lie it would take that to me
Other people have talked to within wig off as from teams when they removed
unbiased from their own team situation. Whether there are good team are bad team. Everybody says from a fan perspective. The bay would be in favour of this. In response to my article two.
Our shocked at the amount of people who really really like the idea. Even Chris Vernon, like the idea
we do not disagree on the whole podcast people dig. This idea
and if I may be, I understand that what March man says what these groups state
for the World CUP and other leagues. Adam knows these talked about how is jealous of certain aspects of Sakharov globally. The NBA can capture some of that with a format
This would games being played every day that are, must win that matter, but are high intensity. That mean something for a casual fee
that's going to draw you in, whereas if you have a one hundred and twenty eight series between the bucks and the magic I'm sorry, most people do not care about that. Cuz, you're, blocked into bucks.
For a week- and I have maybe you
the game, five. But that's only me
We entrust infer a casual fan, maybe not hard core fans, lifelong fans. Are you and me bill and putting people assume those pod, but for the casual fan they don't care, but a group stage.
Something where you maybe get a bad match up twice for one team, but the other six or compelling and and intense
and actually mean something I mean to me if I got a no brainer from a fan perspective and, as I said earlier from a legal perspective, it
panes. What may happen in the regular season by taking the best teams and it creates environment hair that doesn't
things especially on fair for any team in particular way. Yet the dumb ten teams, yep
Then they can play they re. So that's you much safer. I think if I dont like them,
There is no conspiracy bill, loves it cause conspiracy, both those very get the fuck out of here has they end up with others, perfect batch of color, you, those like, oh, my god,
Portland in Oklahoma City, just randomly, ended up in the same group. I can't believe that happen
of silver at home. Would like boldly out you behind.
Arrest, is inevitably afro hand below piercing eyes by adding a day, blower Nebraska Westbrook against each other. She gave locked at that and you're gonna get the pelicans with the Lakers too. Oh yeah yeah do all that stuff, but I think if they did, if they'd, if they locked in the top aid teams, the way
said where it's like one in eight or together, two and seven three insects and foreign five, and then for those last twelve teams. You go snake fashion, but you start with the fourth group, because I think you ought to give as much of a cushion to the top two teams as you can, because they earned it because that's the whole point
The regular season see locked out others teams. Then, instead of the latter, I would have the nine seed wherever the ninth best team is that's in the group with four five. So now, that's like a murders were a group on foresight for the four or five days, but that's just the way. It goes even when your leg and then ten is in the third group eleven in the fourth group, twelve in the in I'm sorry, twelve in the Milwaukee group, some walk. You would be gone against one eight and twelve and thirteen.
Then twenty some work is one eight, twelve, thirteen, twenty an easy go that way, and then you know that they are properly rewarded.
If they can't get out of it, if they can't get one of the first top two seats with one. Eight hundred and twelve one thousand three hundred and twenty, then you don't fucking- deserve to advance to the
anyway, right yeah, I'm with you, like, I said, with two teams coming out of each group out of five five teams. One group two teams get out and to move into the top eight second round of the playoffs block is pro again through Lakers, probably again, for I mean the clippers. These top teams are still the favorites still heavy favorites, whose their talk, though who's. The next best thing you have that it's ok, see so you'd have group for potentially would have the clippers. The Celtics and ok see as
for five and nine: that's a fuckin gauntlet, yeah Jesus just thrown out there, like within the article that the tears that I outlined is sending order record. So tier one would be bucks, Lakers, wrappers, coppers to Celtics Nuggets jazz. He three thunder rockets, pacer Sixers for Mavericks Grizzlies nets,.
Jack five Blazers Pelicans king spurs, I wouldn't know, maybe that's the way to do it. You do stake fat stake fashion for the French for Radice in that something that was mentioned to me as a way to possibly do it
but that lag round should be should go backwards so that the twenty a team should be with the bucks shore here, which would be the spurs in this case, so that it is, if you did snake fashion one threat and that night team was in the bucks thing and you got Mukoki and o k c in the same bracket. That's a better
I might add that I think that works better Gazette having for five and nine and one bracket is, is to stacked yeah. I mean I'd,
a Google she'd would like twenty two
front variations of s. Unlike those situations in which, if you do a random draw a team get screwed, you could end up with a situation where a team gets the Celtics. The Rockets mavericks in the pelicans may
box end up a ban. That's really not fair! That's what Soccer France, core group of death with the world CUP? That's some
You do want to avoid, which has maybe, where the snake draft situation makes sense, or maybe
they met your suggestion. Suggesting makes more sense, but for the most part most of the ways you shake
so whether it's random draw or snake draft are pretty even between each group. That would actually be competing amongst each other and with all the benefits that would come from the interests and to something new for the fans. The benefits
from a competitive standpoint. If omby amby, I mean they are clearly considering that we know there are considering it was part of GM survey, and I've heard that there is a lot of support within the league office. For this. It really is a matter of of the players sign off on it and, more importantly,
forms of approval from the NBA perspective is if the team owners are willing,
Do this and clearly one of a mark human is not, but there are others that certainly are
you know there are Morey, has crunched of the eyes
both the figure out. What he'll be optimum thing? He'll be recommending that I'm lookin at Houston, Houston's, ten fillies, twelve, so potentially, if you did it the way, we just talked about words, foreign, five together and then only twelve and thirteen that could be she's has that could be celtics, clippers failure and Dallas.
On one group. Sadly, the group, the death rate, be eatin over that have thirteen teams of one group got out suck out now,
I am voting for your letter. Is there not a drop off once you get? What you get past Dallas, which is the thirteenth team? The last seven are Memphis Brooklyn, Orlando Portland New Orleans.
Sacramento in San Antonio and there it s really feel funny area. So forget spires make it. You know that figure out something
Rachel. Comrade some game plan d murderers,
suddenly felt issued in threes. But this is like a thing. That's exciting, though, about it, if you
over in one day, you have.
The broad James against pelicans up and coming team verse that one of the few
in the west and later in the day, you got Houston gone against me
lucky in two days later, Milwaukee ass ago against Damien lowered from our from a fancy
point. I can't imagine how exciting
beat a watch these Games data day while discussing how teams are gonna adapt with all these drastically different type of styles. Teams are playing
I mean I do. I get excited thinking about it.
Once it's a wonder Friday morning, yeah K K. I say this is the second best thing you ve done other than help when that war in eighteen, fifty two,
I telling you an enemy of the river at that that was brilliant at these dissolved, brilliant,
So what are we going? This last thing, we'll call it like the basketball cup
world and ever reach is going up. Why not the stern cup.
I think that allowed nodding people can't see me nodding. I thought stern kind of got the cut a kind of got overlooked in two thousand twenty. First, a variant of understanding.
Reasons right Kobe dies four weeks after he does three or three and a half weeks after, and then we have this terrible pandemic and all this stuff, and I think that would be a good way to honor him, and you know
With this type of thing, you continue to honour him move forward, because if this is a hit, if people love it, this could be at turn
do not being your midseason tournament in the future. This could be
Adam Silver has always wanted was some sort of in season tournament, and if this is a big hit, people love it. Just take this unpleasant
in the middle of the regular season and future seasons. He always had the stern cup midway through. Where teams competing
ten teams whenever the new format would look like,
and now fans had already love it cause of what happened in the summer of twenty.
What am I leave out of my head
nay I mean, maybe, if they're looking for a giant hijack, I mean it
Wanna make money back honestly. They should then they should sell. Presenting spots are, and that should be the copyright, so I feel that as a precursor work, we were
I defy the name of front or could it be stern cup presented by modifying.
I think we want. The Spotify CUP makes a cause,
Let's make it out of it all I mean I have to say. I do think. I do think if they want to recall some recoup some money, India having a sponsor
the cup makes a lot of sense, anymore, you're the miser and it's called the Amazon CUP. It would have to be one of the companies that so do. While you called like Netflix, copper, whatever that's pretty good,
advertising. No doubt a lot lot of people are gonna be watching. Ratings are up from sports across the board. Superbowl commercials, like five million, believe Beggar thy ten Superbowl commercials. Basically cod, though whatever its fifty million to get it is it is it turn? I mean through war
If a heck of a lot of viewers compare jail, gave the totality evasion and more gay you no more total dams. Yet six million people Watch Tom, Brady and Paint Manning play off a tiger woods and filmmakers.
I think we should be prepared for any sort of re record. I rating thing for this crazy. It's wonderful to see you you ve Beverly!
better. I'm really proud of your billiard regrets on this world CUP figured out tat. Is it? Thank you, sir.
I read it. I would in two thousand for redrafted, wasn't one second, if you mean
the ones we did from ninety ninety six through two thousand three. You can check them out on the book, a basketball, podcast feed or in the ringers Youtube Channel, as we videotaped, I think, all of those speaking part podcast
higher learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay. It is launching late late late Wednesday night into Thursday. It is a podcast, unlike anything, we've done here. It's going to cover urban culture, sports pop culture, a little politics
and I am super duper said for this one I they could be a signature podcast for us. You can subscribe right now on apple on Spotify, wherever you get your podcast
go check it out higher learning with Bin Laden and Rachel Linsey. In speaking to ban, we did a new up, so three watch was this week me there.
And Wesley Morris broke down the Eddie Murphy Classic Boomerang
I think one of the great round comes of all times that it is never thought of as around RAM combat a really is and there's so much to discuss this when actually is a rare reward was package that was longer
in the movie, which is one of my role, stalemate. The reaction was pack has long in the movie, but somehow we did at this time around so vague I'll, go check that
one hour and I don't think the we was come back till next Monday in flesh so stating for that. Ok
The redraft Abbas, the dramatic return, two thousand for being Joe
their this book, a Basque while the two thousand for redrafted was Joe House is here. We watched his draft together. I had just gone back to ESPN. Full time
after I was trying to split time, which it became a Shoney's ESPN went back, flew back to Boston in June, two thousand for gotta, writs, curl and sweet. You are Buddy Jacko and my dad. We all watch it
have together. My stupid. Dad went down there early at the hotel, barn had to apple teenagers and was basically didn't speak for the first two hours. You would
looking at the room service, Benny the entire time trying to figure out what we're going to order and jack. I was just making joke after joke that I could imprint the column. So I don't know if it's a sex,
as for experiment, but I do remember really enjoy myself about you. It was a very successful, successful experiment and I went back and I read your teeth
in four diary? And it's me
What you were able to print, I mean allows
the comedy lines were different back. Can you just gotta jokes you and I,
joined them. We were making fun of Pavel pop Pascal dines,
the two Terry Gland issue, and there I never find out people would be we'd have pituitary gland support. Group people coming Addison Twitter for dives arrives the big the big thing. With this draft, we should mention you did where Tom Good, we add, a throwback jersey for the job,
and it was a gift from you. I think there is a whole thing about year: Triumphant returned to ESPN. They put us up in the end,
the reds, an aim, which is to say they ve got your room and Jack o and I crashed in it and there is
poster there's all this stuff and all
remember, is arriving in Boston and basically being drunk until I got on the plane. They go back. Yes, really
I remember that trip that sounds accurate. The big debate of this draft was Dwight. Howard, versa, MECCA Oak before, and you and I were both in the mindset of college. Should
if you're succeeding at the highest level in the highest intensity games, that should matter were coming off. The tooth
the draft with Carmelo and darker and tat one that yes
vindicating the caning, how we felt Carmelo had a good rookie season dark, oh, was a non factor for the pistons in overburden. It's like why take these unproven guys, first, these guys that we ve seen tat we
We're good our good, I gotta say, even though this was a loss for us, like, I wrote in the draft error the magic round, the clock with first pick, if their smart, they take em echo prefer if there dumb, they take Howard and sad simple. I still don't feel bad about that, because I feel like evoke
it doesn't get hurt, he's just a guaranteed fifteen and twelve, with two blocks: a game for like fifteen years. I really liked his game. I don't know
You remember if we knew about his back problems back them now we death. They did not know about his back problems
and that really was the height of this thing we ve talked about over the course of
a bunch of these redraft balls, which is the bias that we
shared around watching college guy succeed on a big stage.
In Nancy, W tournament with all those eyes and all that pressure and having that you know, play a part in our forecasting how they might prove out
in the pros. This draft that two thousand fortress draft fourteen of the first twenty nine picks
either didn't go to college are or were foreign folks, and I we were just very sceptical, and is it comes through in that draft? I of the unproven talents. Dwight
you know, jammed it right up our rare ends, so to speak. He did so. If I had to describe this draft in Wretches
act in in one way. It would just be that it was an unlike draft. I disliked just about everything that
it out with how this came out. I had a list. Livingston goes fourth, he blows at his day,
in one of the ghastly is the injuries ever I love Livingstone. Were it talk about him later out
ever since I had one of the autumn. Bad luck, careers, fur! If you dated twenty times, this is probably the twentieth worst version of it will go through. That oak offers back kept going out. Josh myth he's in this draft J R Psmith polarizing Sebastian, tell Fair Roberts, Swear
the latter west. Those are two to thirty four thirty's Chris Hump.
Is buried a car dashing Kurtz tighter got punched out by Jerry stack us.
And then Bang Gordon who we are late as like good. This is gonna, be like microwave to point, no he's gonna be the next mini Johnson and then he gets signed by the pistol in his career, just tanks and now he's
that point of his life. Where he's writing the players Tribune pieces about what he learned, I had so much higher expectations for him and then finally, obviously Dwight Howard
as as Thea the headlines of this draft
a whole pyramid, podcast about hymn book about
about how he's, whatever at least favoured superstars ever has what was fun about this draft. Just house Jakarta eggs that that's it just picked. Her cry.
It it was really a bigger crappy, a kind of draft whose in retrospect, so right so goes white house.
As one to Orlando MECCA, fortuitous, Charlotte, Vanguard and three to Chicago clippers, for they take Sean Livingston. They trade down there. The second pick in this draft. They dump a contract and trade down from two to four and get a second round or out of it. We were apoplectic. Nobody ever drops, because we thought of fur was a sure thing right or trading backwards, all they're getting as the sector on peck and dumping, a salary that dishes and anyway, you're washed and wizards we're
five- and you are pumped about this- you are excited way at that point. Louis Dang was in their address with dollar Devon hairs, just children, s in your
large traded on the pic. I didn't it then I might have minded it then I dont mind it now, because what Anton Jamieson did for that era of the wizards it made them
competitiveness, it is directly led to one of my most enjoyable periods,
My most enjoyable stretches as a wizard fan, which was about two months in the two thousand and six two thousand seven season when they went.
Twenty two and nine and Gilbert arenas really ascended to the to the top of the superstar stage and Jamieson was an important part of that. So in retrospect, thumbs up for Jamieson, the trade was the number five pick: the Christian later contract thanks m J. Thanks for that contract
Stock House fur Twa Jamieson, which was a lot I actually think they eat. You could make a case that day overpaid, but at the same time they got Jamieson.
Do you not only between the whig six years at that point, and it was a twenty points again
guy, so defensible trade more interesting trade for Dallas Cause Stock House ends up being a key guy for them
sex when they make the final run in Devon Harris. You don't really gave them some speed than
were able to turn him in a J K a couple years later. So all the way around that was fun. So do I Dallas moves in that fives, but
Seven Harris number six was just children s by the hawks and there we have some more
The cannery number seven Phoenix is on the clock. They are about a week in a half away from signing Steve NASH inside
quit Richardson and building the seven seconds or less sons. We don't know that yet they need cap space apparently allegedly to to do the current riches and thing and they end up selling the number seven pig to Chicago and getting a two thousand six number one from Chicago and some
ass, an you look at this now, and this is a great fork in the road. Oh man, because Luau Dang, Andrea with dollar, are on there and they just cut it instead is paying forty billion for current Richardson.
They can taken luau dagger, it good dollar, eight without from Arizona. This was weird at that time. We did like this when this happened. Remember
yeah. I still don't have a clear sense as to what for
Next thought, Quint Richardson with bringing to the table for them mean you now he had
the little bit about microwave scoring ability right eagerly. He could come in hot, sometimes anime areas that three point shooter too. He was so bad.
Dominant. As my recollection. Maybe I'm wrong about this. Maybe they advance stats, dont back it up, but I just remember the boss, stopping with Quint Richardson too much. I think you're right, so you think like just if they do they,
and then they have the money to pay Joe Joe
it's in a year later now it would dollars per
higher upside as we're going to do in our redraft, but they
I NASH, they could adjust would say they just take dang. They have
Johnson there to have a merry, and this is it
that in the o, five playoffs really had a chance to make the final until Joe Johnson got hurt, but I think TAT
you know. Maybe he's not is ready as Quint Rich in that year, so that maybe you say it hurts them a little bit that first share, but then, as it keeps going, dang was away.
When you look at Deng's minutes per game, he was
He was led the league wagon minutes every single year here, Harvey's found there and think about him. You know as a perimeter defender
you are doing that that that stretch he was so good defensively
yes, so that happened seven and then at number eight, some comedy
I feel ruggedo I'd never ate who I liked it
raftery as like a rich beds, Bark Madsen, which is also really insulting piglike. That's that
You are either APEC, like I'm, not an batson right and he ends up being one of the autumn. Legendary by sea plays a hundred and thirty nine games and three seasons,
eleven minutes a game to point out. The two point eight point stupid a revised and was one of those guys you some once on an MBA court near like it's over
there is no chance, no way, no road back for him to be a good proud and when it really hurts as it without the next pick. Here is what one of a handful
negative when share guys. He was second from last in
in win shares of everybody that that played at all from that two thousand four draft class and you think about it. Blowing that pig paves the way for the terrible events trade that
which was you know he had a gun to their head and was forcing them to do something, but it
the, where salary dub trade of a superstar. We probably had the last twenty five years, where not only they knock at anything back. They had to take it.
At mornings contract than they actually like made their caps situation worse. But you look at that that oh five rafters team, which goes thirty three and forty nine- they have a young Chris Bush
They have been seized at twenty to two twenty three to twenty five point, a game score at the time they have our friend jail in rows.
They have more Petersen. Daniel Marshall refer us since there, if they take it with doll.
There's a whole road map, or that team is all set, the sudden pretty athletic and pretty competitive right away.
And then they don't have to make the Vince Carter Trade may that it's a weird what a fork in the road right cause the thing on TAT, I that might have been events Carter.
This came out now, as I look as soon as I saw
I'm sure the ruggedo I had to get the fuck out of there I just had to. I couldn't believe they took him. I would say I think, that's defensible, that that would be the finally a legit justification right so anyway, so that happens, Ecuador, fast, affiliate, nine and then that the tenth Pick Cleveland, Luke Jackson from Oregon
who played seventy three games in his career and what I was doing. The draft diary
add a note in here about they. They said he didn't bother, come into the draft and Andy cats reported they had. They got any cats, any cats reports.
Jackson just felt more comfortable watching it at home. That's a fuckin red flag house. I think
How would it be a lottery pick, a more comfortable watching this at home? What is that bid about this? Did he know
who is going to be a lottery pick. Maybe you know himself. Maybe
Jackson was very in touch with whom he was like were so. You could take me ten health checks to think up in a sack of that going at a terrible. But so is the other thing with that. You know the bronze on the calves by then their China build the calves in a certain way and Ecuador liquor
then one pair of landing and landing with a broad y know anything about it like what a perfect sidekick for Lebrun that can remain so prettier say what, if they're gone, stayed lands b
during that number eleven dude, I was like agents. There is nothing wrong with that guy. He just somehow
How or another he got the free throw Europe's right, but in the end that we build
season. I thought he had good moments, but yet good rebound
but a bit of a rim runner and then he couldn't shoot free throws the poor
that it feels like a ruined his Greer number. Twelve in now gets really crazy. So the Celtic said the fifteenth pick and it's all haste.
Rulers and who the fuck knows. Yet. You have four highschool standpoint. You have Robert Swift Sebastian. Tell fair our Jefferson, Josh myth, J, R Smith, derail right. All high scores,
geared to go around this range. And I remember I really wanted out Jefferson. I was really excited about him because they were just like.
Eighteen year old, Lopez, guy old score. But there are these rumours aside. This reiterated for Robert Swift, all its right. I forgot about that, and this becomes really tough when you're talking about Danny Age as GM there's been, some bullet said, he's dodged over the last two decades that are not just bullets there, like the Teflon coded bullets, the cop
their bullets that could break the ball, professed like they're, like bullets, their bad. This was one of them. They offered his two thousand for a first round pick and a future first round or to move up three spots. To take Robert Swift, that's
confirm that was a confederate offer. Oh yeah and the Sun External Dan Brutal
Oh a cup, but where was it how many years later, Justice Winslow? They offer the four first round pegs to move into the shop.
Which part of the Miami spot any spot to try to take Winslow and those pigs could a ban
jail and brown marked may mark. A smiling I forget not mark aspire to is the jailer brown pick deftly would have been in their brood before first, so Deniz had a couple close cause with like draft disasters, and I think this would have been one of them that a brain doktor back then
Who who really liked Robert Swift make up, which is hilarious? Has Robert Swift had one of the one of the all time falls from grace of of any top fifty per
like you know, really had some really bad stuff happened to him. So I don't know what the brain doctor was looking at to our credit, we were suspicious of Robert Swift in the moment,
I wrote the draft airy looks like a cross between Fred Vice and air mantra ass.
That said any time someone is avoiding work out all star gains, even interviews ever a good sign. Now he gets to be treated by the legs.
Jerome James, the Taliban, topical cow booth. Can somebody have downside that
outside. So we were all over Thou in house. I feel beer that so then tell Farragos Thirteenth. That was another
so the dire. I wrote. Here's a dizzy, Portland take Sebastian telephone. Is one hundred percent entourage number thirteen, unbelievable horrendous, pick up speechless
We know that when you tat takes her supper is fourteen and they Jefferson foster the Celts, fifty incurred state or sixteen and then Josh Smith go. Seventeen were to talk about him later in the region.
But man what a weird draft and then you go a little bit later, all the sudden there's a slight nice little stretch after your guy crap, I got steak. Skit takes twenty two and Monia twenty three.
You boys the lad, take us twenty four, and that was a gear your buddy had posted in high school. You were all in on him. Is he guy? We loved him in college? I was a saint Joseph steam with image of beer. Nelson, yes, Kevin Mart upside Tony August, twenty fifth Kevin
Ngos, twenty sixth in such a way a Czech goes twenty seventh,
they're good ones bear Zhao, went thirty.
And that's really it was. It was a really good after that destroys act. If there's one, I worry, AIM Christie had thirty eight who
I raise a series of out of forty three which seem dumb at the top yeah. So that's it. Do you feel bad about getting the Howard aquifer thing wrong?
I don't know, I don't feel bad about it either I mean that this is what what the overall
coming body of evidence of this draft confirms is be suspicious of the high school players most of the time. It will not work
Out there, the day of the success stories are very small compared to
the disappointments and this draft
proves that beyond reasonable doubt not an enemy.
Really does confirm how important you know. You're on the ground.
Duration or whatever the scouting, you know a copy.
City that you have at this moment. Just just think about the discussion. We
Add with that Danny Ange and Robert Swift, the self? Yes, you know
and an age have what we
I regard as a top notch in
the two should all stability,
Liddy good eye for talent. You know
it's been borne out over the years, but but look at that, we were. He was right on the cusp of a colossal backup, because that's what we're Albert Swift, when you look, would you please
critically. On his name, I mean I, you know all due respect to the things that he he confronted in his life, but
as far as an
You know why we
about DR profiling. He had read here and it s a big centre, the red hair and we're late. That's not going to work. Every good tried dunk at the sky. We should seriously do it a top five. Let's do the be all time top five ginger list. I mean seriously furthers it's it's! I can't do it off the top.
Head, but TAT Will Collins was a top thirty five per about time. Ready. Ok, I think he's our best case. That area that's right either. Has a scholar Bahrainis at their there has been a lot of a deal
We were worried about Dwight Howard, even before this draft is
DE in either the high school thing had been so hitter mess and then, before the draft they innovator, many said quote: I went from an aid
or Crown Victoria. That only goes up to eighty four miles an hour to a new Bmw that goes up to one sixty and we were
we're like. Oh, my god, let no change the pig
This is in the category of things that we talked about that
make it into your diary because they were acceptable even back, then we made the same analogy.
Too cuz. There was a lot of discussion about his christian upbringing.
And in order that sort of closed off kind of life, the closed off existence. He had their allotted jokes. We made in that risk Carlton about her.
Dwight being unleashed on on the female population, the NBA groupie population and guess what,
I was amazed. Ether ether is Dick around like a salami.
So I just met was: was the other one where just talk about some of the comedy stuff in this draft?
and there is, there is a lot of comedy the quips trading backwards from two to four and just
a second and pick out of it was hilarious. In the moment you were excited the ears. What I wrote
I'm sorry, I'm excited because my beloved South accept three. First rounders houses excited for Pavel POD, Gesine, whom he describes, as quote
cross between George Mere aside and screech, my dad's excited, has just threw down apple martinis at the Ritz BAR in Jack. I was excited for two things: the number of bad sits in the number mothers wherever three hundred pounds
everyone's pumped we'll figure. He really had- are a gay bad from a comedy standpoint bill
SK graded intangibles from one to five and Jack O K.
Is he said, had erected tangible from one to five intangibles there, the greater known yet he regs clairvoyant a great car, Hetty ragged, tangible, are allowed
we should ask you should get bills on Elgin Ray
about John Living potential to Jim Gray, saying quote it might take a season, may take half foresees that it may take
year. In that I rode after or could even take twelve months algae just in epic form,
and then try their traffic. What else? Oda and Belus ripped the Josh myth
to shreds during a time when I think I think you might have been able to hear the draft when the guys or talk about the past
I can't remember bill is said quote if you had to pick which guy was most likely to be a bust in the first round, would be this guy. He has no right handed. He can't shoot guerrillas
Somebody are you slept on the wrong kid woke up on the wrong side of the bed for this router. So when we talk about every trap, we try to figure out. Super duper star out
I'm a franchise guy, all star quality, starter, five star being superstar, superstar quality started being a one star. Guy.
Dwight ends up. Would you say he was a forest? Are all timer or three star franchise guy, his eye enforcing it?
Is he like a three and a half year? Ok, I like that, is a three and a half years he's straddling cause. I don't think he's at all times
cause. He didn't go down as one of the best fifty, whereas ever, but he did when defensive player the year for three consecutive years, any
did lead that franchise to the final, like the thing when you are
at a number one draft pick. You know that the first metric is candle,
player led us to the finals and why
yes and he did it in five years. I mean that's a very reasonable period of time for for a nun
One draft pick to take his franchised. You know to the finals. In the end, it's not like Orlando was good when, when they drafted him, I'm giving him a three and greenhouse fair other that there is no two star
did ass, dark ass. This draft, I think a gay was a one and a half Deng's, just a one Jefferson's one can Martens are one and the other the end
you know, I suggest Smith was a borderline one there,
there was a moment in time. Therefore, copyright on people thought he was a top twenty five guy. You know now that we know more about advanced metrics will go into that with them. Then oak afore, I think, can
however, we could have been an awe star if you stayed out that he was right red on the French. So let's do, let's do the redrafted boss, let's redraft the
thousand four draft. So the order at the time was
Nato, Charlotte Chicago, clippers, washed and traded to Dallas Atlanta, Phoenix Toronto. Philly Cleveland was our top ten I'll. Give you the first pick. Ok, maybe it's right! It's it's easy. We ought in this very place,
can channel, took who did a full evaluation of his whole career. We left.
Wanting more out of him and yet, for a period of time he was be dominant centre.
In the game. You is the dominant centre of of his era and if something had clicked differently in terms of really psychologically, he could have been because had all the physical tools he could, he could have been in our a top. Fifty guy, I think,
I agree. So we just talked about how he was a three and a half. He wasn't quite and Alzheimer, but he was a franchise guy, but he was a little better than being a franchise guy. I think one of the interesting stuff pots with his careers how unfunny it was to have him as your franchise guy, I think, yeah. I was another one where ya was awesome guy, but if you had to watch you out for eight
the edges so as their fun. You know it's like so much more fun have a franchise guy. Even when you,
Gilbert arenas for three years. I guarantee that was way more fun than fifteen years of of young man that replayed fifteen years. I was Fun Gilbert way on. Dwight is in such a word spot the Orlando fans of such a
good relationship with them and we covered all that our pyramid pots of theirs that allowed tat better. I think
clearly the number one I think only a few times over
the last twenty years as the first guy in the draft actually turned out to be the best guy in the draft
right had over they Davis. You,
the broad obviously, but if you went through AIDS, its hand down iron kinda, that's gone in the nineties, UNESCO infer further
these. Last twenty years, it's pretty pretty rare ok saw on the clock at number two picking, eight. First of all on the clock for the clock, I'm telling them I'm telling trade backwards. Don't do that stay! Put bad idea that this
MR sector outbreak of the salaried Dubbs. That worth that. One of the reasons it did the salary dump by the way forget to mention this. They thought they had a chance at Kogi,
Ah interesting, so they did
you know what an end. I think you
I don't recall where we discussed it, they did ever shouted Kogi. It came
dead. Well, he might have in Ebay it even cocktail in them a little bit sure too, to drum up some Lakers inches, but so they did this, where they traded back to dump a contract, and then I think they did one other thing where they dumped another contract with us. With that Sacra PIG tried, even clearer, more cab space
and then, as it turned out last second income their cause. I remember that year that was the first year. Compresses tickets are the clippers people up pissed off about it, certainly
this common here we had the whole thing. We're
set up were then boom didn't happen. So who knows how serious he was but come in there, but there was one of those it showed a backwards. So on taken a good, ol air really fascinating career,
I I remembered the fifty years of his career being better offensively than they were. He really was. Was he never even average? Twenty points again right,
I think I remember writing about him at the time always felt feeling like he was Miss cast. He he couldn't be the paupers
number one score on a best team. What he was was like a pip type and I think venture
a kind of realise that you look at the two thousand twelve season for him. He goes so here you, he averages. Nineteen point nine and eight season which ETA do very well and from
Oh seven through ten he's, basically averaging about eighteen points. A game is like forty five censure, couldn't you threes and then, as their team gets better and remember, they made the two thousand twelve Rhonda Collins's the coach,
he's kind of marine kind of morphing into what he would become he's only took two thousand twelve twelve points: a game, six rebounds
five and emphasise one point: seven steals he shoots there.
Nine percent for three years? I take it three, a game and that's it. That's the facility that had
Lou Williams on at Spencer Hall has, it was a fun teen. They took the cells to seven yeah. Who else was on that team? Now I got to look it up, but that that's when he start
merge into. I think what we are thought he would eventually become then that year, that was the lack access jihadism, that team Elton Post Achilles out brand
turner they're still trying to figure out what he is. So the team had a lot of talent, throwing him into that complicated Dwight, Howard Trade that where they end up getting into buying that summer, he goes to Denver for one year,
And they lose the gold state. Then signs were gone. State thereafter gone stay member. They did the trade with without Be Adrian's. They added some first round pics to it. Try to create some cower space. They make this big,
four egg, and then he just completely regions at reinvents himself on the on the Golan state teams. He becomes what we know, I'm as see her family to you, ass,
You know we have had this conversation. We had in the context of you now trying to properly established that historical mark for golden state. I think he is a hall of fame or because of the vital role that vital contribution that he made to golden state. I think the golden state part of his
rear is the part of it that that takes him. I mean part of the thing that we have to say it. Every time we talk about the NBA Hall of Fame. The bar is very low right for what he did. I think his his addition to that team in his contribution to that team doing all the dirty work stuff. It was a great final.
M vp moment for the league that he won that by really just doing all the dirtiest
being the guy that that would with willing to do whatever it took to win and- and I think you know in view of
the legacy of that warriors team and what he meant to it. I am fine within being in the hall of Fame. Yes, so in the following year, they beat ok, see.
To get to the fire ass, the seventy three when season and they come back and
they end up. Ok sees at three
on and that serious they come back when he does a really good
and the red those last three games. So so in his golden stay version of his peak, he was the best guy.
The league other than collide a guard leubronn and ran the two guys
had to shut down. I think right as a perimeter defender, it's funny. I always had Pippin in July on their own plane and that's it and then after that will discuss. Other people see
car feels really strongly that egg dollar is as good as those guys. Oh, I think even said that on a pod once he feels like it's a three person group that is not a two person group and that all the stuff I dread could do
defence, there fanaticism and how and self ass she was what an awesome t made. He was he just fears occasion
discussed with those guys. He wasn't the same office up where the people was governed state, then
made him to be. They offered up where the people was, but I think he's
in our view- and I think Robert order should be the event to add in both of those guys- should be adding plan performance banners
no in european and unselfish teammate, coming through
and over again and big moments you look just like at fifteen. Sixteen,
seventeen, and then eighteen
the bride. You know he's Higgins,
a bit order at that point, but he's going against the brine when Braun was just member. The brute force of the brain
The eighteen play off says Hannah unstoppable. I think all this stuff
Matters to me is all famer I'll be interested to see if he gets in, but I'll tell you this if you're you're picking
NBA draft- and this is the guy. You end up with that's a pretty awesome pick. You know, for a guy that you know there are a couple stats, no looking at it. At this, there was a from two thousand and six slash, two thousand and seven up through two thousand and twelve slash, two thousand and thirteen. He averaged at least five Reba
and five assist six different times in that era. There was only one other player who did it more times that was Leubronn from two thousand for two thousand five up to two thousand thirteen fourteen
he trailed only one other player in that entire time period in terms of overall steals. That was Chris Paul, like that. That's
the part of this weird, like translating egg impact on the game. He is
the upper echelons of insults, filling up the bucket with a lot of different winning attributes and
gold state experience showed us how all that translates into me
being full winning impact, so you know I'm I'm good with it. I'm good with envy, and I think the fighting about this draft I was prepared.
I ask you why you
inviting me on these terrible shitty drafts the crappy drafts, but looking at
draft. There are a lot of third bananas allotted
is that where there were important to you know they found themselves in
situations and made an impact as third bananas, not a lot of top bananas in this draft.
I don't mind this draft, I am, I dont get away with it. I think it's pretty good. You know,
again have been the second guy in the draft. I visit that's outcome compared to a three year. Ninety eight or some loans we ve done, but you know
the guy that I look at the advance metrics for him, basically from his seat,
First Golan stays in our states is not his pr just socks it's like
ten or lower rear. He was never a guy for the traditional basketball card stats
way with fantasy guy all that stuff. It was always the intangibles and just at what an awesome defensive where he was right really was really spectacular. So
I like that is, I think, he's a strong second pillar. We take a third I'm gonna go.
With Luella Bang. The comedy
and of his
nobody to beyond the basketball court. All the minutes that he played he be played
Of all eighty two games like in far off in the first six seasons like five other sixties, and something like that, something crazy
in two thousand six seven, he average nearly nineteen point. Seven worry two and a half this one point: two steals that than that.
All without him at that point of his career without a three point shot
and then he came on with the three pointer later really extended his his career. That
was a meaningful impact for player for a great chunk of
career. I have no regrets about taking him. Third in this draft yeah, it's funny all the sun. He is washed up because he hadn't
I thought all come back Caesar with Miami in two thousand. Sixteen they made the playoffs and then
fridge afraid Zairean that happen to be the year. The cap, like spite in the
baker sign for, like seventy million, I remember liking the deal for the Lakers. I was out thanks, though good the guy. You know he was of three
the guy when everybody needed at three in the guy and its
I can't allow left in the tank. He went the Lakers and his career justice, it's over it's dire, but it makes sense when you look at his basketball reference where it's like.
The guy plays nine hundred in two games, but he plays almost thirty. One thousand minutes see average thirty. Four minutes game for his career
and he led the league and minutes in two thousand twelve and thirteen almost played forty minutes a game a couple times the
as part of his career is its pre load management. They are so that's a medical staff stuff with him
whereas member they had that spinal tap that got. Oh yeah really fucked him up and that's right. There was some real like medical malpractice with him.
And then he got thrown into remember.
Being on count down when they did that
while dang salaried dump trade, when they they basically up items expiring contract that they could wave. There were still play off team at that point and they just comment
then to save money, and I will not go down that killed the balls and import the Collins. It must have a heart attack, Civitas, Chicago TAT s it I was just like this is ridiculous. There, the there in the third biggest market in the week,
their China too, to save pennies and cut corners, and it's like if I'm a boss fan I'll just be enraged like you still have a chance to make a dent in the play of society.
Second team. The east is that you do not sentenced
like. Why would you just give up on the season doglike homage how the blood to from its bad here about that? But
You know, I really thought he had a good career. He doesn't have a kind of a defeat
any moment right here. That can give me your three greatest Luar dying moments. I'm not sure I could come up with three, the nine plasters really fine against
ethics. I think that was one of the best first round series of other of our time. I remember probably their greater,
When was when they stopped the balls twenty seven game Wednesday great number that stops the I mean I'd, buy me my ear, but he member that yes right, there was a great game too. I thats a game
game. Should that should be a hardwood classics you needed to one of those you should put that up on the twitter. I'm gonna look up when that happened. He keeps
by lower than why look this while he ended up among the two thousand four draft class, he ended up forth in career minutes and forth and points out of this class anywheres. Third and in his class in in in win shares the advance mats metrics. I you know there there's there are other talents will go through here, but, like nice, steady, salad guy that you can count on fine third banana
so they be, they beat Miami March twenty. Seventy thousand thirteen may be the best regular seizing game of this of this decade.
There, then that ok see game. When staff had started thirty five uttered a beat, ok, say Louis, dank forty four minutes. Twenty eight points
every bad five assess gone against the bran LE bride had thirty two also playing big more minutes for their boasting Jimmy bother forty
minutes Carlos Boozer with twenty one, seventeen the up and then I Nazi Mohammed's there. This is kind of a weird. Both Nate Robinson was six four ten off the bench, but but
That was the world s greatest moment. I enjoyed a mite I'd. I would like
alternate universe where the sun's just keep that picket seven while they don't sign, quaint riches and and
is there in the sun's plan. Seven. Second, so ass, I think that's a way more fun version of his career, so too bad for him. Ok, I'm on the clock. With the fourth pick. It's funny I did a preliminary list and it had Josh Psmith at the fourth pick.
Then I started thinking about it and I like wait a second. I couldn't stand watch judgment than the guy never won anything. What am I doing so?
about out of it and did really deep dive this and take it out. Jefferson sure I get it way
better career than I think. People remember, and I think people remember that cagey trade with the Celtic says like they fit. You know they just gave away cagey, not sure
They got a bunch of number one picks in that trade or guys had bed picnic. First Jefferson was a real problem.
She was twenty two years old from two thousand to two thousand fourteen. He average twenty in ten. Fifty percent feel go
Two thousand fourteen Joe House, all NBA third team on Charlotte eight than the envy p voting, never want to play officers, just horrendous luck with dreaded larded teams. He landed also involved in one of my favorite under eight, a terrible David concentrates summer, two thousand ten, he trades out ever since you tat forecasts the coup face, a non lottery tooth as eleven pick that turn out to be denied that address Martha Yunus and non lottery picketed as twelve, which turned out to be Terence Jones House. I think we have officially identified the Poohpooh platter, how Jefferson forecasts the coup face,
and to pigs that led out to be bought in Unison and Terence Jones. So the thing with Jefferson that that in aid have, I feel I am really attached to this one, because I watch the lattice out the games does mid two thousands and really was just waiting in waiting for him to make the leap he gets heard. An ear to write is right. Is it feels like it's gonna happen
I forget if it was like a spray near or sprained at some sort of leg injury.
It really set him back. I was like right when he was starting a really show potentially gets hurt than that of seventeen there tanking for TIM Duncan,
that's like a throwaway season, but he still
just sixteen and eleven in thanking season near three near at that point, he's twenty one years old and had some like Mikhail low posts like you,
drop stabs. He had John Accede jump books of either either side. The old man, Lopez Game, o level in butter goes to Minnesota. They ve got there.
Even the KGB trade. So now another terrible team puts
the twenty one eleven for them. That year we go into the ocean.
Nine seas. And now it's got Kevin love is a rookie at his team he's playing great he's twenty three and eleven fifty percent.
Eating. At that point, he is he's born in there,
and eighty five he's too
Four years old put up a twenty three and eleven flows out his knee bomber.
Then there is the other thing if they just taken staff Currie instead of Johnny Flan, now
at a team with staff, Currie and and Kevin Love, and our Jefferson becomes
quickly, clear that maybe you dont want to play our Jefferson and Kevin love on the same team said two thousand ten. They kind of panic,
he's coming off the Asia and they deal on the user. Any puts up the from the next
for five seasons, he's really good ends up get traded to our sides were Charlotte is a free agent makes thirty march
I thought he had a really good career and- and I really odyssey strongly feel like if you play his career twenty times,
I think this might be one of the worst versions of it. There's a whole other scenario where he ends up that he never
heard early. He never blows at his knee. He ends up on a team that
uses in better, and I just like them. Would you think of him in
edible value at fifteen.
Gary and as much as we just you know expressed.
Scepticism and and gave Ange and Celtics scouting department. You know get out a jail free card with the Robert Smith, Miss analysis having
Jefferson as their back up and in the end I would say, looking at this draft in its totality Boston did awesome with all three of their picks mean they re Boston, one, this draft in terms of either
feeling needs and end getting meaning for NBA players who went. You know, make great contributions.
Or other teams with Tony Alan Indolence, but the Dante was important to Boston for a little bit. Also Jaso is
but that they are able to throw in the Rio and trade right
whereas now he ended up, if you look at how they built the big three alot of it happens because of this draft and the inner they went through,
for three with pigs, which usually doesn't happen in the agenda and pay out that retain them ass. They were sick, Bob Swift, it's it's better to be lucky than good. That's what that means yet feel bad. Now I don't feel too
for our cause. He had a good career, I made it I'll, be a team and how much money do they may could see he made.
Hundred thirty seven million dollars ass. Fine, pretty good, then up at ok, so that pick would have been for the clippers in
the draft, and so he would all the bad things would happen to him again if he ended up on the clippers you're up at number five, so I am going to take Josh Smith. I think you know if it's funny look
back. This is one of those situations where I'm prepared to be kinder now
that I would have been while he was playing because while he was playing Ike, you take it
Your head. You can't take out of your eyes how terrible
point shooter. He was and how insistent here
As it shooting the three, he really beat Russell Westbrook to the punch in terms of being a prolific. Three point attempt her and a prolific three point, MR he's just love to mystery pointers.
But this this step that that I encountered in the research shout out to the bitter report. Folks. This is incredible. He is the only player in NBA history to have an average across five categories of over fourteen points:
over seven rebounds over three assess one point: nine blocks and one point: two steals: he played thirteen seasons. If you took out the steals TIM Duncan and Karim would join him in on this list. Those are pretty good names. That's
A good company for John Smith, and the thing that I do remember about him was how fast he was off his feet. He was a great great shot blocker. He had four seasons with at least two blocks, a game tied for fourth, most in NBA history by a player, six nine
shorter. So, like a lot of stuff, like you know, I opening stuff, just couldn't put it all together, and so did you ask you if we had the of the fine breakdown of all bangs, most impact for game actually for John Smith is most impact. Will game was at fourth quarter against the clippers in the play off right? Josh Smith had seventh add my item, eight than my board. Ok from two thousand and two thousand thirteen, seventeen and nine three point: two stocks black spots steals: seventy three play off games. He played in.
Fifteen and seven forty, three percent shooting sixty three percent from the line. We need look at that words in. I don't think we fully realise that at the time.
I think we realise it now, especially as we can understand advanced metrics, better,
he's not a winning basketball player. If you have a guy who can't really,
control the boards for you, but he has to play the for the five and he can't shoot. But the best thing we can do is like how he
how he protects the ram, but more as I go blind side, blood, weak side, blacker, kind of guy, not
wasn't like Bill Russell, but he was good at like he was greater coming out of nowhere and buy of things like that.
I just don't know how you actually win was somebody like that would be my question
one and is it was proven out. I mean it out
for now, because they never heard they never wanted it. They were the bride. The turnover
the ban, the Miss Thrace, Univee average two and a half turnovers. It's funny cause. I remember that
so the await hawks, who gave the Celtics everything I can handle it
having game series member net. That was one of those things words like on my god of the south is going to choke in the series right in my memory is of Joe Johnson Whore furred an edge the athleticism Ajar Smith.
I just had this memory of Josh Smith being good. That series, then you look at the stats. He was
seen in six. He shot forty percent for the field and he he he was three for eighteen for the three point line
I insist that not a winning playwright. There were guys that I, like the more than him. Also leg. Can we gloss over the part where Detroit sign salmon with
two years standing bandages buying about whole. Just like please I'll carry your dead money.
Please leave! I it's part of his legacy quite a legacy. I still feel like if he was the seventeenth pick, that's pretty good for the seventeenth pack. I had a eighth,
Adam Rank Fifth raw one other thing within part of the regime, while straight oh ok make meaningful he
oh for when I Sharif he ends up on Rashid's like I'm like I'm, not playing Lana, they have to do. They have to scramble they get multiple teens above the south. Explain about that
some things got Tony Alan and then that
Alan end up getting judgments, so they ran away. You shall tell the Celtic Scotch she Tony Allen was drafted by itself. It's right. Let's hundred at the Hague to draft gotta gotta got out, they took Chuckie Atkinson salary, which I was bad about at the time to get this twenty fifth
It turned out to be Tonia in Atlanta, just like our I'd sure will will flip Rashid, who event
for three days. If you give us your first in the sun, add that so there I had
v. Am I bored I'm delighted to get him at six Kevin, Martin, okay from seven to one thousand? One hundred and twenty two point: four points: a game.
Sentences were forty, four thirty, nine eighty seven
his career? Seventeen point four points, a game: thirty eight percent three point shooter
and I think somebody that, as the League of Bob who made more more sense as aware you know, I think,
Because he's in the hard and trade because they felt like
He could feel a lot of the offence that they lost when hard and was in there, and then he just wasn't a good, FED and didn't didn't do great in that playoffs
and then his career goes down hill. After that, I think people forget that he was actually pretty good
Well, I mean he was a guy that year after year was put up twenty two points
This is what is one dimensional he's a pure score he's right
only player in this draft with fifty Point Game Yan, and that that you know that really to me said, tells the whole Kevin Martin story. He was a prolific score with the percentages that you just talked about:
you know, but that was his single impact on the game. You you're like a mess, a third banana,
worth banana kind of guy and that's it in two thousand. Thirteen playoffs plays eleven games for the thunder fourteen points, a game. Thirty seven percent from three so on paper looks great. I just remember in the play Ives feeling like they can't hide my defence. I dont trust them. I don't think he's ready for this, and if you look at the only played in three players,
his entire career he did make. It did make some money that has the eighty three million dollars a hurried and within involved than some goofy trades. He was about to know that
crazy, Houston, Sacramento New York
trade in two thousand ten were t makin.
Go to the next. He was involved in the Chris Paul trade
Dad they never happened right basketball reasons in two thousand and twelve is involved in the heart of trade and added to that
Thirteen was involved in another three to every trade. He was in there's at least three themes and he's. Unless people here,
add value, but the team,
had him always seem pretty happy to trade them. So I don't know what that means, but I'm takin him. Six, thirty number: seven, I'm gonna go with Trevor Risa here,
the buyer and works yeah that the entire body of work over the career. I honestly gave concern
relation to putting him in two that five slot instead of just met, but just
that's. The reason I have Smith is because Smith was a five to a guy and was so impact, for
on with the with the blocs, but Trevor you another thing that
It's funny who do you have
you're like the are that the original three indie guy cuz. This, I would say, raises in on that list I like, who is that?
first three India Guy, as that became a thing in the Lee
ITALY, Europe's are appointed in that direction,
was so. This was their time late to thousands is when we really started talking about three India guys
Railway is that's. Why not James policy on the cell tax, his age
They are the sudden it became, or we should try to find these guys. But if you go backwards, I think Michael Cooper, oh sure, ok,
but he's probably the first three d guy is. He actually had three point range but and paid defence of those were the two things he did
so I would say he was the year. The one point three point: three, the guy
and then eventually it evolves, but yeah Risa, two thousand nine in the fine US forty eight percent from three
We did. We did one of those games for the of book, a Basque by potter,
like our suit. Our reaction was
game for and he's out there,
each. He was a great wing man for Cobby everything you'd want from the three spot and
which is really valuable for them and then ended up leaving they did have the calves face to keep em but, as had a good Craig
that, among the with you, had him twice on the ways, the first time he was good on the west. He was good. In fact, the way speaking of cap space decisions came off about play off series,
can recall the year. Now we had to make a decision between marching or tat an arena. They couldn't keep both they.
They alleged, so they will. They kept Gore TOT. Let
these ago. But a reason was was very meaningful in an impact full fer. You know a little playoffs restrict run that the wise when,
and end you know he played the role perfectly.
Three and a role for the where's. The second trade was harassed,
and really the second trade was the thing that ultimately may serve the franchise. Well, because it's the trade that lead, I think, most directly, that run felt finally getting fired
well, you did, I ever see, there's the cause they gave up. Tell you Brian
back Trevor resolve on the idea that it was. You know that,
try and make the playoffs a couple
ago when they had no chance whatsoever? One thing with him this
teams always target in him. The rocket signed them in two thousand nine and then went back but went back four seconds. Two thousand fourteen
How is that was funny. I remember talking today about that- has arisen. They sign of five years
nine. They gave me your later in the day
get a bags. They dare what was it like? They did a reserve for you,
he's totally happy retreated a, but speaking the trades gotta do
for the audience Teresa, it's a trade, it's a trade, but they had sent for him. So it starts he's traded by the New York necks
With penny, hardware is expiring: contract to forward to does the six four Steve Francis, a trade that at the time was reprehensible because they are putting Steve Francis since the fond barber together labour labour as a coach, the irony of it as we have already seen them as the backward
the offer olympic team that everyone hated watching and lead to us.
Lately, remodeling Liebig team system, so good move by that time is there. Oh seven gets traded through the Lakers for Brien Cook and Mo Evans, which was a hijacking. This is in no seven.
The Abbe ages decides we need to get Kobe. Better prayers were telling
land out to give to give Trevor is Lakers were telling Memphis to give
pow beside the Lakers. Sooner or later at you, Lakers Vance hate those two trades
Trevor result in progress offered. Nothing
How did he never I'll? Never forgive I'll, never finished. I won't. We got Marcus Isaac. Mercosur is three hundred seventy pounds who then she got me. There's no getting Oliver Miller tractor trailer, two thousand ten August shaded by haste in New Orleans.
New Orleans trades, daring, Carson and James, pose the Indiana Indiana trades, Tray, Murphy, New Jersey in New Jersey, trades, Courtney, Lady Houston, so lack on out in that trade
I think it's funny that Indiana traded, awake I'd it didn't get wet guys back. That may be the only thing that ever happened, but I think I New Orleans Cruel clearly Windsor Trade.
Big day. I've been, ought not a mean Indiana once at trade they trade, Tray Murphy for cars and impose it, which I think pretty get two thousand twelve June traded with Makko before to wash in further
Shard Louis contract that you been dieting. I read her forever in two thousand for a second, what a great trade that was one and evaluation lowest, but a great big bag of eight. She H went along with.
Nothing worked out. Great two thousand fourteen another browser
one traded by washed back to Houston, Houston Trades, Omair, shake up Murray, Caspian cash in a bag of shit to New Orleans
neurons, trades, Alonzo, jeez, Scotty, hops in two thousand fifteen. First to Houston, the Tick SAM Decker were a rare terrible hall for here
then, and that our neurons traded Melvin. He lied to wash them
so that when I read that was where Washington couldn't afford, they decided they couldn't afford Trevor, and so they just did the trade
You know, tat to avoid having to pay em, they couldn't the extension. While you got more now than out lad of that combats then he's trade by Phoenix to watched in four Kelly Obray. It asked the rivers that God,
a disaster God, oh god, it's a letter
aid amid a curse. It's fucking unforgivable, I mean it's. You got a hired, it's a god! Damn confession! After fifteen years of of malpractice, one less God Damn cherry on the top mother fucking malpractice, I'm sorry for all the F bombs get sent by sacramentos of free aging. They decide that didn't work out. They trade him to port.
Forget bays more Anthony topper and a couple seconds which was as a semi salaried down for Sacramento, exhibiting expiring, back Portland trying to get somebody was better, so I ease Bene nineteenth just said, and incredible run for him. I, with the eighth pick on taking the guy, was seventh. Ah, my board MECCA Oak refer for
seven years: thirteen and ten, maybe Fiji career over again. I could find a better back surgeon forum and I just like them
I am getting there who take a night. Shamir chimera. Nelson. Here you remember that chimera
nah, starting now that debate also teams on this list. But you know he was the point guard on a team that went to the finals he and white
together. You know took that Orlando franchise to that to the finals within five years of getting drafted, meaningful career top ten talent
This draft- I don't have any issue with it. This problem is the key
really shoot your faith a great year that the problem with demure Nelson he was
He was just one of those guys, though tat. There is a million reasons. The talk yourself out of them
but he was a guy that in big games was really comfortable and I think
if he doesn't get hurt, no nine that serious might be different to because he's coming back.
Play with one shoulder basically and issues raised the same guy wherein the stretch of a job.
After I now where it's all rope where's, yet Tony out and Anderson Bear Judge Beer, Nelson Ben Gourd.
As a six man. He check Smith Devon Harris be Adrian's little Jas Children, S.
On and on and on. I am taking Tony out with the tenth pick. Ok,.
Dumb done the injury right as his career was tat. I was starting to take off as a role guy, where he dunked after the whistle hung on the rim.
Came down and blew out as Asia, the single dumbest ACL injury, probably the last twenty years. Did it really play on the oasis,
the next day. He just couldn't shoot, so they could put him out there, but I had a better run
damn it. Oh nine into doesn't ten but really didn't take off till Memphis and
it s. His queer falls in the place three first team, all the fences three seconds,
him all the fences was probably the best defensive guard
of about seven eight year stretch sharers, whereas I give you could put one guard on Chris Paul Kobe Bryant pick any
anybody under six. What sex and then honestly could probably have at least made Carmelo in Gaza Thou work. I think La Braun was probably cut off causes. Wasn't wasn't strong enough to guard Gaza that, but was just an awesome grisly in the grizzlies.
They beat the spurs and two thousand eleven and which was a real upset. But when you look at the spurs from eleven fourteen, it's a real blip, because that team for food
years was great and I and they beat him. His single biggest contribution was helping that team achieve and identity he established and identity. For that team he was a force of will. Guy right, he just threw his work ethic and and a rare is
a defensive player inspiring his team two to a level of play. You don't see it very often and that you know that the stretch
of time that he was in Memphis, YO teams are able to play. For
five against him defensively right because he just could not do anything authentically, but what he did in terms of of giving that team in that city really a basketball identity immeasurable, I would say, a really fun foursome Zack Marchesa kindly
Tony on man and they could never find that FIFA shooter they tried so many different guys led by a rude gay, was in there for low vat. They shall prance they. Never. I read
that one year jail- and I did the western finals for countdown and and we were joke about jailing, just siding with the grizzlies cause he was like. I can make that twenty four further in the corner. I can make it now. I could stretch the floor, but I like them in an easy
That's data Memphis and his close with our friend Verna goes on his radio show at times. That's when I the eleven pick we have four picks left. I get to take Devon Harris right. You didn't take em now
yeah, I'm taking him another guy to have he made the all start team. You know you were down to death itself at the point where
There are a lot of guys left who actually made and also our team averaged over twenty one point
the nearly seven assists a game in two thousand and eight slash, two thousand and nine the year. He made that all star team amazing long career, fast guy, backed up Jason Terry on that two thousand and six
finally team that you know you he would. He played an important role in that Dallas finals team, two thousand sixteen just a long career. He he found himself needing to come up with a three point or two
success, one illegally, any kind of did it
it's too late, though, by the debt write it did this speed was. There
was always always unclear if you can count on him in a big game. I remember really not trusting him and oh six, no seven, never feel great for them. Sure!
he's out there in o, seven like he really. He got really was
one of the guys I got works by that go and stay backward. Any now saw career town side. I feel like the talent was higher than what the career was, but you know he did make it all starts him. I can't I can't knock that pick without really
I'm Pickens. With these last three, I'm gonna take a Anderson Virgil, because at the very least I know that
he could play on a really good team in playing games and not hurt me somewhere at that point of this.
Raise he's one of the guys he at five guys are those seven calves are playing big minutes and he's one of the five and he's
there and his baby, no credit to him. They beat the pistons this this
really nice pistons run. Were there really big Baghdad? The wireless brothers still the whole thing
And I, and you know they went
the toads, those guys we're just him and drew good it. I made you made of defensive team the problem with the oil knock as he couldn't stay on a court mean hit you you have to play too
with its epee really valuable terror team. Any just couldn't stay healthy
but you're right. You know he was an important player for a meaningful stretch of those great when teams in now at this stage that there's nothing wrong with that taken Annie at this point of it
after he was also a beloved teammate, and
somebody that Lebrun really light.
And this is when the bronze started to get power there- those last couple calves years and they sign him to a really bad contract without looking up to make sure
I wanted to make sure the wireless brothers were, though, was were both while his brothers and narrow seventh piston steam Ben. While this was gone by then
I was when he had sandwich cargo. There's Togo
It gets Rashid Chris Weber, Antonio Mc Dice, those where the big eyes that year
An version now you has put up the eighty six point. Twenty five minutes ago
but he was one of those guys when you saw him on that,
for he was like your classic man. I love that guy great energy,
I know what he is he's playing: twenty twenty five minutes game. It doesn't hurt me in the red spots. He finishes good off, that's a rebound. Her and people always left out the part that he can stand. The fuckin court right here,
all the time got hurt all the time it was. It was always nuts like he has seasons, two thousand and eleven thirty one games, two thousand and twelve twenty five, two thousand and thirteen twenty five, two thousand and fifteen twenty six, two thousand and sixteen thirty one. The golden state get summoned in tooth.
The sixteen and seventeen barely place for them either, but is in some flash games for them plays in the seventeen team outside the sixteen team,
yeah actually get some run in game. Seven against the caps goes against his own team, so anyway, decent tenth man. If you can get him who do you have for the 13th pick
I do it, I know you want to go back on the iron meditating Aerosmith. I
really wanted their shine. Livingston because of you know what he meant to golden state, and you know the impact
he had as a winner. He turned out to be a winner, a winning player, Sean Livingston, but there's just nothing there in
I'm so of you now careers statistics, career contribution. It has all been
The devastating the injuries I feel bad, but it's gotta be
J r here- because you know by far leads this entire draft class in threes. It's it's not even close, I mean,
He had you now. Nineteen
one thousand nine hundred and twenty nine career three
is he shot thirty's over thirty seven percent, an average double
years in eleven different seasons. You know very
reliable. Three point shooter also had you know, was a good labour back in the day and he was a tough guided,
the fat like a lot about, let us as and when he was young came out of high school.
ITALY, we all recall what he did tell abroad and the calves, but look you know he also was- was an important player on two thousand. Sixteen team that that be gone, stay.
So you're the case for J R? Is this an aid? I probably should have taken him over version now he played big minutes for good teams. The owner nuggets lost forty Lakers in two thousand and western final six point: twenty five minutes and aim for them. The two
As in thirteen necks, which were the second best team in the east a year they lose the Indiana and ran to, but there is a run therewith,
Oh my god, this team, this might be a final contender, he's plant
the two minutes, a game for in that year, the calves all the way through those four years he's one.
Their starters, and then two thousand and sixteen he's out there and crunch time and doing stuff, and he played thirty five minutes a game in the twenty sixteen playoffs yet so interesting, two thousand and sixteen playoffs line is score. Is eleven point five points a game in thirty five minutes, but he takes seven three.
Forty three percent so basically is ease averaging one free, throw a game. All he's doing is just as in the corner and then
they share all you get your shoot, threes and played defence. Do nothing else, do nothing, don't do anything, don't even think about doing anything. You don't want to rethink ever, never think, J R D. I should have taken him before version that stupid
be the other guy. I'm gonna take him fourteen and I will make sure Shaun Livingston honorary fifteenth pick be grace great. You know if you do his career twenty times,
I was gonna those games early, Sean Levison. Where had a chance to be great, though
I dont mean good I'd- think he would have been in six time all star. It's a testament to his athleticism that he had a second career
with a with the with a leg that was not capable of being repaired or restored the what he was before think about what kind of athlete you have to be to basically come
within you know, a whisper of losing a leg and fully come all the way back
and have a long run after that, but he was an incredible athlete in the first three years he was in a week yeah. He
that oh six clippers team, which really had a chance to beat the fires in really got really just had a couple. Bad breaks in the past
but he you know they got there.
Same Cosette that year and Livingston
came by the end of that year. It's second year of his career he's. The third guard. He's, though, is the first got off the bench he paid twenty minutes a game for that team
and he was put up seven points, but he was five and five and rebounds and assess and was a really good defensive, where I don't the thing that stood.
Pretty early with him was his passing in his defence and that's why I thought he had a chance to be special sure you can make a case. He went to the wrong team because he goes there and they get castle and its,
when he really just, should have been playing yeah. You know
Think about, like Daimler, goes to Portland and they're just like here. The
case. This is your team now and such and their lambs and Chris Paul in New Orleans things that I think she's living there was ass. Good
guys? I really do I'd I'd think he would have been just an awesome pro. He was
such a good passer and he was so athletic and he was so smart and you can see.
By the time he got to you, I'm gonna stay in kind of redid his career as a role guy just
tell he had made up for all the stuff he had lost by basically being on one leg: yeah right
Was still awesome, so I the fact that he ended up
and until you played eight hundred and thirty three games,
the injury that he had is right possible. He
pressure been over. His need exploded, that's right side.
A bad grandma, I think, there's an alternate universe where he doesn't get heard, and we do this draft and his either first or second improbably, first sure I'd the odyssey think he would have been in Malta and be a guy, I'm gonna, take Ben Gordon Fourteenth
can't. You could make a case that he should have gone higher cause
no, he is stats for a couple years. There are comparable to the cavern Martin stats in very thin. The three points unique
you look at it now and if you didn't know any better you'd think like wow, this guy's, like the perfect guy for now, you know he's he's, got those last for real
his whole, both career Jesus, even
Rookie was getting the buzz his five. Both seasons is eighteen and a half a game. Forty one point five percent from three and has taken four point: two free throws a game like
we thought this guy was better Vinnie Johnson and maybe with a chance beings, Tony
could really guard anyone. He was only six three. He could get. Experts
on that end, but I was just an awesome awesome guy,
have on your team in the o, nine plavsic Celtics was a problem. We were terrified. Him goes to the trade in the end, his courage is spirals.
He should have been Campbell. Walker, that's out of any man like you know he. He will
He was very good as a shoe
very impact for negligible defender, but like why wasn't he camper? I wasn't an opportunity situation while dare grows. Goes there for the last two last year of his career.
But I still feel that could put together. You looked so the seven game series adding against the Celtics in no nine legendary
There is some of that to two or three of the best ran one games. We ve had he placed food
three point four minutes a game and that serious twenty four point three points a game takes six.
Have three makes thirty, seven percent of whom gets the line eight times a game, and that's why you get there
since contract, and I was fine weather.
Ben Gordon, was great. I dont know what happened to your basically getting if you're taken
in the region after you know you're getting five years and then manages it. Just completely falls apart a out of personnel issues, you bad depression, I feel bad form but
do you like he was offensively? He was a combat type talent. I don't think he was simple
under that Campbell as but he was somebody that you can clear out his can get shot. Yeah right, you know we were so impressed by what he did for you. Can it in that run that we we thought out. You know this that third
it was with us a very solid. You know that very early on epic anywise we're right for five years at night. I wish I knew,
I wish I knew what happened I so if you have yet to pick one guy in this draft, the canister
having given up on who is it still haven't, given
bond minds Livingston. I am a thousand million per cent in on you.
It had been great. I think it's such a bummer that applied out the way that so I still feel an attachment to live
And I also I gotta say
who is kind of enjoyed David Harrison Indiana Abraham. That centre is a tough guy. I remember thinking leg at somebody.
I could see that guy in the right situation, but he never made it I mean, maybe maybe be Adrian Medium put the aliens and our top
fifteen now, but I think he could be super successful in the current generation of the league,
I mean, I think, right now, with the his running, an ability to athleticism bright while another guy
That is the real right. I think you know another three d guy.
No DR, we also doing a draft that he had yet and cups of coffee. You azure nice kind of future. Third guard not ideal, but a feature. Fourth guard awesome,
and then I will check who we attach sorry secular. We judge who was out there on the court and big moments for fur teams.
One title so he's gotta be mentioned. Two Christie had a couple cups of coffee of potentially being somebody is around
just show address was interesting enough.
You gonna get a huge contract and then things fell par pretty quickly. Never never really figured out what happened there did have given up on pop. I saw yet Erna. I gave up on em what you got drafted, Lionel Chalmers. I mean what about money,
but I said Cropper Chirac are happier cropper mania, trapper Pablo what a draught of war raft was.
The one of the most unlikely drafts ever and I'm. So frustrated by how it turned out for twelve of these guys, you know what two thousand four draft great after six buddy marries job Ass, a pleasure
his good to see you here as well. Thank you. I that's for the BS pack ass. If you want to catch up on all of the redrafted buzz, we did so far go to the book. A basketball podcast feed, that's where they live forever, we'll have one more bs pod cast again on Thursday
don't forget about higher learning with the Unladen Rachel Lindsey. Thank it is
forget it, you will see you in a couple days. Hope you stand safe, listen to the experts, listen
the scientists to carry sums,
Transcript generated on 2020-05-31.