Join one replied to listen a business wars when we early and ad free in the wonder yap down The one yap in your apple or google play mobile appstore. Today, The smiling late january. Twenty fifty the big machine record label office in nashville, tennessee taylor, swift, strike purposefully toward ceo scott foreshadows office. She's dress casually. Dreams and a teacher, but her face look serious or doesn't notice her ass. She entered his office. He standing at his desk bobbing his head of dark curls. Along with the music scott. We need to talk or shadow, looks up breaks into a grand,

taylor great, to see. I was just listening to a new demo spreading good swift smiles tightly. She's, not interested in talking about anyone else's music. Today she settled into a chair we're shadow twirls, his moustache as he talks, but it's no Shake it off. Mri swift song shake it off. One three grammy nominations this year, including best pop performance, The song was also a break from her country, music, sound. No sir acoustic guitar, no fiddles jake is all horns and hard edges like her music she's. Changing too she's? Not the pliable wanna, be that she was ten years ago when bullshit to discover she's coming to our own and she wants control of her destiny. Moving to pop really worked out well force yeah, that's partly what I wanted to talk to you about, she had to fight with more shadow over her desire to go from country to palm, but right now

she's here to talk business then all the success we ve been having. I wanted to bring up the possibility of getting back. My masters were shut. It puts the headphones down straightens up and looks at her his expression, serious. Masters or the original copies of an artist work, whoever The master recordings, also owns the very lucrative copyrights associated with them taylor. My ownership of your masters is something we agreed upon way back. When you first sign your deal, swift's jaw titans she A more should have control of her masters when she was just fifteen with no excuse. Rience in the recording industry, She didn't bother with an attorney She relied on her dad it's a decision. She regrets. I know, but these songs just mean so much to me. What would it take to get them back we're shadow considers this for a moment: swift contra

with big machine. Is up soon. She owes them one more album and then of creation. The biggest earner on his label. By far he's. big machine around her anyway. To keep her there as long as possible. What about this? give you a chance to earn back your masters, swift, leaned forward. Placing her slender arms on her knees, focused her blue eyes, intently on foreshadow, she's earned, hundreds of millions for big machine already earning Her masters can't be that hard in exchange, for each new album you make with us get control of one old album at a time. Swift stomach sinks, and she feels her blood howled in her ears. Suddenly, her weak position is crystal clear:

This arrangement would keeper tied to big machine forever. It would be bad enough if she was just tangley with poor shudder but Does she know someone else wants to own her masters it's not another artist. Or another label. Now it's scooter, braun, manager to justin Bieber area grundy in congo. West braun is the moon. Famous manager in the world. and he didn't get, thereby being nice sway. Spite for her masters, isn't going to be just as scrimmage for what she believes is rightfully hers, it'll be much much more than that. She will wage a painful, expensive battle.

That's going to change the course of the music business forever. Now the physical office is an ever evolving space. this is why embedding flexibility in your workplace solutions is so crucial for site workplace occupancy sensors provide data driven insights into where space optimization is needed, which is key for any organization, especially if you ve got shared desks and reservation systems by keeping a portion of your assets permanently flexible. You limit exposure and provide employees. Flexibility and choice learn more at court dot com, slash flexible, that c, o r t dot com, slash flexible. Today's episode sponsored by foreign, the only nutritional supplements brand, a partner with the mayo clinic thorns latest formulas daily greens, plus a blend of nutrient dense, MA

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swarms Taylor. Swift is one of the biggest pop stars of the century since being discussed by russia as a teenager. Swift is good. To become the best selling artist of regeneration. She sold more than one hundred fourteen million albums worldwide and has net worth of five hundred. Seventy million dollars, good abroad is the top music manager in the world. One very few to become a celebrity in his own rhine, taylor, swift and scooter bronze view is a proxy

for the furious battles over ownership happening all across the music business right now from streaming. the rise of music catalogues the battle is being waged mostly in boardrooms, but swear also in lists her forces from social media Not only is this a fight between the powerful pop star and manager for three hundred million dollar cattle. It's a fight, They could reshuffle the entire business model of the music industry and powerful forces are picking sides. This is pursued, one on the outside. November, two thousand for nashville A young taylor, swift, tux her blonde curly hair behind her ears and clears her throat. She's fifteen, but she looks older than that her pure in blue eyes, were fixed on a guitar this before

When is the most important of her life so far, she needs to get it just right. How'd you like that our real hard on it. Swept drums her first cord and begins to say but she's, not an dimly, lit nightclub or one of the karaoke bar she performed in his again today. she's in one of the offices of universal music room sitting, cross from her. Is scott bullshit he's array you're, an exact in his early forties he's had a decent career, but no huge hit. Still A big deal for swift to get a meeting with someone at universal. The lyrics are honest: confession. and its surprisingly well written for a teenager ever since she moved a few years ago from pennsylvania to nashville swift, it has been making a name for herself. She want

to be a star or shadow applauds. and swift mom, who is also in the meeting beams at her daughter that was great jet. Just great Who did you go right that with thank you, that one was all me We're shudder raises his eyebrows he'd assumed one of swift, more experienced collaborators and helped her. Rate songwriting is key for country music. Success he's entreat wow that's very impressive and Andy. You play any other instruments besides guitar. Yes, I play here Oh, you clearly and the banjo were shed a nods and other point for swift. He looks carefully at her. He first heard of her when he received her demo, along with the music. The package included a picture of swift modelling and an average crombie and fitch catalogue. She was held your guitar and wiping a tear. The picture projected this.

All american image, one that could work for country there were shouted, thinks she's the whole package. He thinks Second, teenagers aren't stars in country music, let alone teenage girls the listeners are much older and a lot of them are men, but It looks older than she is so he might be able to pass off as twentysomething plus he's a great songwriter, its risk from a marketing perspective. but he loves her music. He thinks she could be a star. Here's I want to do. I want to sign you as a solo. Word is not just a songwriter swift, asks her hands together? A grin spreads across her cheeks. This exactly what she's been hoping for but we're shatters not done by I want you to sign to universal, What you decide my own label, I want

but the music back in the music business swift looks at it. mom excitedly they're, both thrill. They can hardly I believe this is happening. Oh that sounds amazing. So what do we do now Well, I haven't got the label set up yet we out to you when I do over the next few days, swift ways even though she's only a teen she's got a clear idea of what she wants from her career She already has a development deal with a major label They want to wait until she's, eighteen to breakers a solo artists or shadow once the launcher career right away. So she does what A teenage girl would do when facing a monumental decision. She writes about it in order This last week was crazy, so capital records doesn't think I'm ready, There's scott more shadow

he's so passionate about the project. I think that's the way we're gonna go I want to surround myself with passionate people she calls who should. I forgot taylor. I want you to know. I made up my mind and waiting for you. She wiggles out of her old contract and worship, officially launches his own labour ignition toothless. five. The new big machine offices on music grow in nashville. Tennessee swift looks around her. The offices are pretty grungy, but it doesn't matter swift figures. It's only out from here walks in holding some paper. Our I hears finally, contract You can see, we ve got a six album deal. Swift looks at her parents. This is her dream come true.

her mom gives her and encouraging smile for day add leans over to read the fine print in the contract, he's asleep zestful stockbroker, but he d, really know anything about the music business there's been here. What is what does this mean? So this basically says that taylor will own her publishing rights and big machine will, on the master recordings, pretty standard duffer recording contract, swift, dad nods were shattered, turns to tailor We are so excited a partner with he taylor. I promise you my utmost loyal we're in this together and we are going to make you a star. You so much scott so excited to be at a label that cares about the music as much as I do swift beams up at her dead. Swift, dad might be a novice in this industry, but he's decide to invest in bullshit label as a show of support for his daughter. Anything for his little girl

I see the terms we agreed on for my investment, one hundred thirty thousand dollars for three percent exam. Please it's right there. So are we going to go we're good to go? Taylor swift lives up the pin, hence dealing It's the happiest moment of swift life. How could she no It would also one day be the source of so much pain. and humiliation back in the nineties prince famously started writing slave on his face to protein. His label owning his masters. He once said if you don't own your masters, they own you as part of his epic battle with his he changed his name to a symbol in protest was just one of the artist to demand the right to own their work, but despite the uproar

it was still standard practice for labels to own masters. Labels insists that owning masters is a key part of their business model. they take a big risk by fronting money to develop a new orders that made or make it the man Two recordings are insurance on that risk. It label loses money on one artist. They can make it up with. big stars masters. Would They can licence to tv, shows films or commercial. thanks for giving up rights to the masters, the label the artist in advance those advance paper studio times, promotion in any their costs associated with making the record that's it kind of money. Most artists, starting out just don't, have the two thousand five quad studios in nashville,

we have stands inside. The insulated. Vocal boo She leans into a large, vocal mike and pop filter. Huge had bones cover her ears. She looks through the studio glass to the man sitting at the recording control panel is Nathan, chapman It herod country, song, writer and producer swift's nervous, but chapman puts her at ease. Alright taylor. It sounded great. Let's take this from the pickup to the course no more patches time like you're, both angry and sad. Yet you know what I'm saying: gacha ready when you are and begins. Recording swift takes a deep breath or shadows in the back of the booth, watching you and now this zone, he's going to become her first single tim mcgraw. Its an ex boyfriend in it with references about the good times they shared One of those was dancing the timber grand. Hence the core so this new saw

swept sings it with a mixed fondness and longing in her voice. A perfect cocktail. On the nostalgia for her gone by silky, smooth harmonies, our classic country, as is this. Bull acoustic guitar. even has little twang her voice, swift finishes or take, or shadow brushes past chapman and hops on the mic in the booth taylor. That's great really great! This is the debut single right here. I know you want to call it when you think TIM Mcgraw, but I think let's just go with TIM Mcgraw. It's catchier for radio sheriff scott, whatever you think is best It's a stroke of genius on his part. Radio is critical for country music. Success by name checking a country superstar foreshadows hoping that people will hear the song and ask who is that new artist with a song called TIM Mcgraw

and we're shadow has another trick up his sleeve to help taylor break through to a country audience two thousand six, time on nashville infamous music row, towns, music, industry, hub of labels and then use on a few square blot taylor We have to sort out nor set for her. First big tv feature is with you: see family of country, focused cable network and make up This applies a final dusting of powder to her cheeks Leon. item billboards, eliminate the dark sky in the background per blonde. Early blow in the breeze caused gang the army is being able to do what I wanna do from the Rector's, monitor swift, looks more like dolly part and then a pop princes cheese law blonde, curls and rosy cheeks she speaks with surprisingly persuasive southern tang onscreen, theirs

ten in her eyes that belies rage. a lot of our image, is make up and stagecraft, but one thing is absolutely genuine and clear her ambition, the best pie Getting erected deal was that it wasn't. Stay record deal. It was the right deal for me foreshadow wants to sell swift story is an authentic country artist. By doing this in nashville, I love their according process, because I love sick and It really gives me a chance to home in on. Every single word make it count, make perfect and I'm a protectionist, truth is swift. Career began far from nashville. She grew up on christmas tree farm in pennsylvania. Still she had the female country artist. She heard as a kid. The fur c d she bought was by liane rhymes she devoured, the work of chennai twain and fate hill, her talent,

Leonard, musical sea and then karaoke? soon she was singing the national anthem at sports games and other big venues and very quickly She realized she wanted to be a country singer, as an eleven year old. She walked into every label and asked them for a record deal when materialised. She badge your parents to move to nashville, so she could take her dream seriously: They finally relented, and the whole family up rooted to the sound so spends the summer of two thousand six in big machines office. Mailing copies of her new record out to radio stations she's ready to launch her debut album with all the hopes and dreams that go with them, some debut albums do sale, but most often

They end up sinking straight to the bottom. Hiring challenging. But right now, when you got so much on your plate from personal to professional back to school year, in financial statements. The holidays coming up. Oh, they are hiring, can start feeling even more challenging and stressful will. Luckily theirs place you can go were hiring is simple fast in smart place, where growth businesses connect to qualified candidates. You know what I'm talking about that places. Zip recruiter, dotcom, slash, be doubly folks, it's as simple as the zipper cruder does. The work for you using its powerful technology to find and max there I can't it's up with your job. You can easily review these recommended candidates and invite your top choices to apply. In fact, zip recruiter is so effective that four out of five employers who post on ziprecruiter, actually get a quality candidate within the first day.

No wonder zip recruiters the number one rated hiring site based on G2 satisfaction ratings as of january. First, twenty twenty two and right now to tries it recruited for free listeners of our programme can go to zip recruiter, dot com, slash be w. That's zip, recruiter, dot com, slash be w check it out for yourself, one more time: zip, recruiter, dot com, slash be w ziprecruiter the smartest way to hire business wars is supported by Expensify. Expensify keeps money moving more. Ten million people around the globe, use expensive eyes, bree accounting platform to reimburse expire is managed business credit cards, generate invoices, pay bills and plan troops from one easy to use up. One of my favorite features is the level of customer support him. Focus on the user, experienced. Look it so easy to login, get set up and start using it right away.

snap a photo of receipt and submit it create workflows for approval sink up counting in a sharp whether you working yourself, managing a team or closing the books for your clients, expensive. I makes it easy, so you have more time to focus on what really matters down. the app or sign up at expensive. I dot com today. The. late, two thousand six tables, Stands in front of a studio, microphones, drab, gray, world radio station I'm taylor, swift and your listening to the morning dry with my can join a queue of four number one for country swiftly, the headphones off her head and turns to the host. Was that good? That was perfect? Thank you trust. Me you'll be hearing that a lot on the radio. I can't wait just so long as you play my song, her you betcha.

we have smother andrea steps in ten a high. Converse to get going share. Walk out of the studio and head for the car, swerved and andrea drive to the next stop, despite whiffs radio offensive to promote herself title debut. Album it only cells, thirty nine thousand copies in its first week, but swift isn't giving up doubling down. She It was all our energy and promoting the record to boost sales. Time at a premium, so she arranges to attend. High school remotely her days are packed with radio stations, interviews and performances in shopping malls, twenty not promoting a record in person. She can Eggs with her fans through a new website called myspace. She gets around six hundred emails a day. You try

the answer. Everyone with messages like this on de thank you so much I'm excited for you to hear that comes out in october, its hard work, but determined to make her alpha success and in time, her loyal followers lovingly cultivated by swift, will become a force for family, is all end. They moved out, so she could be a country music artist. They don't pressure She does that herself, she and her mom or on the road a lot going from one radio station to the next. She feel like she has to make this work. I wear out the next station things on, You're after swift's burst, album is released eventually reaches number five on the billboards, two hundred

it's been a slow burn, but sweeps career is about to take off like wildfire before long the album, whose sole millions of copies its great success for swift and we're shudder. new labels usually struggle, but swift success establishes big mission and were shattered as a T. A force to be reckoned it seems smooth sailing over. The horizon, however, is a powerful force. The man who will one day try to claim taylor swift, entire empire, whether she likes it or not, early two thousand seven atlanta, georgia

when something with dark hair and a baseball cap is sitting in front of a computer watching youtube videos, scooter bra as a former club promoter who works at germane, do priests label so so deaf. He's doing research for an artist on the label when a related video pops up that catches his eye, It's a young kid wearing a white shirt and black time he's performing church singing competition braun leans closer. This kid has Crystal clear voice, he's performing a note. they rendition of a neo head, but it's the kids, vocal style. It catches bronze ear. He sings with such emotion and natural ease bra? is instantly amazed,

needs to know more about this kid there's talent there and braun. Once in So we get in touch with this young kid, his name justin bieber braun, even flies beaver and his mom out to atlanta decides to account is managed swift, Labour will soon become a teen sensation too, and their paths will meet in the most unlikely of circumstances. november two thousand eight a wall, Martin henderson bill, tennessee, it's a lead, in fifty nine p m and taylor Swift is wrapped up in a scarf in winter, coat she's to make a late night run, not for milk or groceries research, thing a little more exciting. She will

past the t, shirts and underwear pass the cleaning supplies and thanksgiving, giving scott bullshit a stir, right beside her. They round corner to the electronics department and there. she's greeted by hundreds of things, my guys It hinted on myspace that she'd be in this warmer and her loyal fans showed up your clutching copy. swift, new cd fearless? The cover is her face in profile. With her blonde hair waiting out like a hang around taylor, taylor. Can you say my city share swift, it from banned a fan hugging the smiling teenagers. Most of them are girls, some of them chaperone by parents. They flocked to confessional songs about teenage heartbreak, it here, Swiss lyrics, don't have any cursing in them. parents are happy for the kids to listen to swim.

And you so much for being here for me and for buying my second city. I love fearless huge head thanks in part. the hit single love story- themselves nearly six hundred thousand copies in its first week. way. More than her first record, swift, built, a loyal following through myspace radio interviews in person shows, and now it's paying off she's a full on countries star. She's already selling out arenas, but I'd. Have teenage girls and country music fans a lot of people, still don't know swift and then something besides. It raises her public profile.

September, two thousand nine radio city music hall in new york city, it's the mtv video musical words then? You is packed, swept stands on stage in a glittering gown, her hair, a pin back in a sheep up, do she's just one the award for best female video for you belong with me. It's a huge deal. she's the first country artists to win a dna, she clutches the trophy with her right hand and holds the microphone the what it would be like to maybe win one of these some day, but I never actually thought that would happen. I think country music, so thank you so much for giving me a chance to be an a award, the just them

congo west jumps on stage from his seat in the front row, his black Their t shirt is opened the naval these, where giant aviator sunglasses He grabs the microscope taylor, I'm very happy for you. Unless you finish, swift talks are here behind career. She doesn't where this is going, The west is going to make a special presentation to honour her for being the first country artist to win, but then west- Since the crowd and keeps going I wanna bet video, so tat now it's beyond says, turned to look confused. She was nominated in the same category as swift, swiftest standing on stage expression covers space. Where that he shrugs and hands the my back to swift, swift, smell This open in shock the crown

starts booing any trace of a smile is vanish from swift space empty. The cuts to commercial. The nine million people watching at home are stunned. Swift is horrified she thinks the crowd thinks she doesn't deserve the award she's crushed. She backstage and cries bench pulls yourself together. She has to perform in five minutes She changes out of redress her hair down and runs to begin her song. But swift is a consummate professional. her performance goes down without a hitch the And even though west later apologizes, the fiasco makes major news:

president obama remarks on the incident calling west a jackass for swift. It's a pivotal moment in her career thanks to west's interruption, more people than ever know who taylor swift is, but she starts to say Maybe she can go even bigger means leaving country behind to go mainstream and she'll gamble her fan base to do it. This episode is supported by work, check and original podcast from lassie in our workplaces today or changing fast. Which changes are actually gonna service. Best work check takes your most pressing questions about the ways we work together and how she's out the best arguments on either side? I listen to a couple of

so do not me tell you. The show is endlessly entertaining this season. There debating questions like could the four day work, we'd, be a game changer for your team Why should you really, where PJ's, to a work? Zoom? Ah, I was afraid of mine and, by the way I am firmly in the business up top pj's on the bottom can listen a work check on apple. Castor anywhere. You listen, ipod casts and our thanks to work check for their support. june. Twenty ten fox bureau massachusetts its swift is backstage in her dressing room preparing for the show she's been torn constantly selling out arenas. By now swift is a bona fide star it's a sixteen year old from canada, with long hair that swoops across his forehead teenage,

girls love him and he is her opening act. Hey taylor good see again just in thank you, Sir much for plain its justin bieber, the guy braun spotted singing in the church, competition earlier this year he released a hit song baby he's a pure pop act, she's been wrecked, wording a new pop country. Album titled speak now. She's crying over into part, in that why she wanted beaver detour with her Taylor. I want you to say: what's up to my manager, scooter scooter brow on extends a hand to taylor. Swift he's got us. build and square jaw with a short dark beard. Hey taylor, nice, to meet you just then for me your face pops his head around the door sky, its were shut up soon, jumped up and gives him a huge heart or shadow two broad scooter,

lot about you? I'm sky a pleasure while bieber and swift catch braun and bore shadows, start talking in braun, bore shadow sees a younger version of himself someone who's ambitious, who wants to make a big isn't even thirty, but he's already more than just a manager. He started a venture capital fund to invest in start. Ups, braun is a business man. And this meeting is going to be the beginning of a very important relationship with poor shut. One that puts swift on war footing october. Twenty ten taylor, swift, just released her third album, and it's a here even

Over all see these sales decline. Swift cells, more than twenty million albums in five years, more than any other musician. In that period, she's making forty five million dollars a year. By the time she is old enough to drink. comes time to work or a fourth album she's, not had to settle swear starts to think Maybe she can go even more parliament, not just pop country, it's time. For her to grow as an artist and She also wants to reach an even bigger audience. She knows her country, music fans are loyal, They'll follow her into a new genre. september two thousand eleven recording studio in nashville. We're shed as sitting with swift and her long time. Collaborator Nathan chapman,

we're shed is here to listen to a new song. Swift enchantment of written we're shadow leaned against the sound board and nods along swift and chapman watch nervously they haven't shown it to anybody else. Yet the song ends. Or shadow raises its head to speak. The song is brilliant, great melody but the wage recorded the product. Just as in match it. What do you mean It needs more of a pop sound swift nods. She knows he's right. She trusts were shed his ear. Let's try again chapman and swift get back to work. A few days later, swift plays for bush eta again, but the results are even worse. Swift, exhales, This isn't working. She needs a pops out

she's written so many hits with chapman, but he's a country guy. so she turns to bullshit what she's about. Ask painter its consequences, will effectively and her professional relationship with chaplain stood buyer from the job he's got. Would you call max max martin Huge swedish pop producer behind hits by britney spears and katy perry or shadow picks up the phone call. Sweden. But this will be the last time scott bullshit. It is useful to swift Because ass she moves into the pop mainstream. She gets even bigger when she was young trying to get her career off the ground. She knew It bore shadow and his country connections. Now, that's not as important Swift is ready to move into a new genre and on to the next level and that's

going to be a major problem for scott or shadow on them. Episode of business wars as swift. spreads her wings and upon she butts here with more shadow braun, Works is magic to keep bieber's career afloat and swift. Take Hers into her own hands. If you like our show please give us a five star rating and review the next, Episode will be out in a week, but you can bear the entire season now ad free by joining wondering plus you can follow the show and amazon, music apple, hod and wondering at or wherever you're listening right now, in the episode ouch you'll, find some links and offers from our sponsors. We hope you will support and other way you can support. The show is by filling out a survey and wondering dot com, slash survey,

from wondering this episode, one of taylor, swift versus scooter, braun for business wars, footnote recreations you ve been hearing. In most cases, we can't know exactly what was said, though, seems drama, but based on historical research. For more on taylor. Swift, make sure to check out the miss americana documentary we also, recommend reading taylor swift, the whole story by chaz new keeper, I'm your home, David brown, natalie robe, I wrote this story voice acting by caroline gently and Michel, philippine karen low. Is our senior editor and producer edited and produced by Emily frost, sound designed by kyle randal, our producers, Dave shilling, our exact,

producers are jenny, lauer, beckmann and martial louis created by or non lopez for, wondering hi, I'm linsey grand the host of wonders show american scandal. We bring to lie some of the biggest controversies in. U S, history, presidential lies environmental disasters. Corporate fraud in our newest series. We look at the story of edward Snowden, a whistleblower who changed the national conversation about privacy on the internet as a contractor for the nsc snowden had access to a range of top secret government. rams. But, as he learned more about these clandestine operations, he came to understand a devastating secret. The government was conducting mass surveillance on its own citizens. Snowden would go on to leak more classified documents than any whistle blower in american history. He became the subject of an

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