Noah Rothman returns from vacation to help us make sense of the Biden administration's claim we need trillions in "infrastructure" spending at a time when job creation is going through the roof and the American economy is about to soar. Also, what on earth is going on with Matt Gaetz? Give a listen.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Some guy. Welcome to the Commentary Magazine Daily podcast today is Friday. If a second twenty twenty one, I am John Ports, the editor of Commentary Magazine back after a week's vacation, associate editorial Rossman Heine, our John thanks for having happened. We back, we missed you. We missed you dearly. We
We soldier lawn without you, but but what it wasn't. The same was if our size was its executive, enter a green walled, high, able not the same at all different pod, cast different podcast and see your writer Christine Rosen. Esteem John, I am the most delighted to have no back because his technical skill set vastly surpasses mine. So I disagree. I listen. Listen when I could. It sounded nice to me and you guys created a lot of controversies. Well, I was away so you know, maybe I'm just memoranda, stickins no was you're. It was your controversy I don't want to get into it, but it was part of your controversy. You been worried about basically since the beginning of the of the daily podcast, which was the question of whether or not we can end up as some kind of by four created society of the vaccinated and non vaccinated. As now represent by this vaccine passport idea be only the
a viable. The only current vaccine password that I'm aware of I now have a copy of that is the New York State, Excelsior vaccine Passport, which I it will be interested to tell people who don't know it expires. at the end of this month. So I registered at on the day that I was allowed to, which was the thirtieth of March, and it expires on areas of April, and I have to I guess I will have to re up again why that is the case.
What we just don't know in a long you'll be immune job. We don't know how long you have anti body. So it's just prudent, okay, so Pfizer announced yesterday and the day before yesterday that they are their current research says that the vaccine is viable for six months at a minimum, but that they are only six six months right now we want to get to the infrastructure bill M everything lifts related to that, but I think we need to. We need to make reference to the fact that dumb, the public health bureaucracy is now actually consciously, it seems to me trying to drive everybody insane com
justly were, shall will ask you to have a steady, see, told Rachel, mad cow on. I think Monday, that, based on their research, the vaccinations impede the spread of the virus or interfere as vaccines are supposed to do, not only with the fact that you will get sick and we will keep you from getting sick but will also stop the transmission of the virus, and then yesterday the CDC the organization run by Michel will Lansky issued ACE It meant saying that that was a mess thoroughly. True. So why did this happen? Well, a site, a friend of mine, a doctor who was involved in some corona.
this task, forcing a hospital old during last year, knowledge that she said the rat he Twitter went insane when we're We'll ask said that the virus that the vaccine is basically means you're, not gonna, transmit the virus because of course it's not a hundred per cent because nothing is a hundred percent. Nothing in science is a hundred per cent and so she was yell dad apparent. We on these two airfields that none of US seekers we're not virologists and a decision, is made. Who knows where? And by whom and under what circumstances, to walk back what sad precisely at a time when she and everybody else in the overall energy and public health community are saying everybody's guy. in fact today as fast as possible. Is the variants are coming, the varied from more contagious, and so we have to get everybody
vaccinate vaccine hesitancy is bad. This is all terrible. She comes out and says, get vaccinating kids, it's not only gonna put it slowly, Gregg he'll you, but it is going to make sure that you can't give them disease to anybody else, and then they say nano. We need to do more research, so I call this. It's not gas lighting. I don't know what the word is for what this is, but it's like when you know, ah, you are gonna eat, something you say that somebody is this, you know. Is this milk good worried? I was this saying that in the fridge can I have it and then someone so sure you can have it and then your d take the floor.
Can you dig it in and you take a bite me a bite and then you take us and then they got wait. No, no, no, no, no way way. Second, I think it's. Maybe it's three days. I don't know, I'm not sure. I don't know like that, and then you're, like your poise with your fork over the end. You don't right, I mean, and then this happens again and everything the fridge everything in the house. Everything is like me, I I can vouch for it. There people are terrible. I dont have terrible terrible. This is. This is one of the worst failures of public leadership in my lifetime without question I don't I don't follow where Twitter it sounds like a dangerously self selected population, Thank you follow their overall adjusts now they're virologists. I did follow regular twitter and I can imagine what the reaction is, that there really is no distinction, John, very serious, more serious than us people, but said the distinction between what
Shovel Linsky said on Wednesday that there's no data to suggest that you either get or transmit this disease and subsequent statement that we don't know whether you good because those two things completely congruity. If you're a nice she's still exist to the point where you are just paralyzed by your own, by the knowledge paradox which is entirely boss. That these people are just deferential to the knowledge paradox, but that just means its judgment called to be left to political officials, which is what we ve been saying forever. But let's get this money when you go hospital and you mean they have to we wonder right cause you're, either you're having like a minor procedure or what or you're having a major procedure, and they have to give you this speech about the risk of anesthesia. They are required to both firm honest communication, reasons and liability reasons of whatever and they say, look in
free thing. There is rescue you if you go under, there is a risk that both with anesthesia but at our hospital. I do think it's fair for us to tell you that our hospital- it has been twenty years since there was any complication resulting from anesthesia or something like that in my entire professional career of many thousands of operations. There has never been an issue within These are, however, I am required by the hippocratic oath or whatever, to tell you that there could be a risk of a reaction tenancy. Does that mean that, you should tell someone that you dont know whether anesthesia gonna kill them or not. I mean what you say: it. There's a one percent chance of his and ninety that day, All this is is the overwhelming
nine and a half out nine point. Nine out of ten result suggest that it interferes with the transmission of the virus. She says am interferes in the transmission of the virus and then somehow that is deemed to be recklessly irresponsible by her colleagues in the world of virology. Can I add to that just something I was telling you guys my one of my mother, my kids, a teenager, we I'm a dinosaur, still gets print. Newspaper has delivered your house every morning so that the New York Times game. He was looking at the front page and there's a chart. A covert chart right on the front page- and it says here, everyone, lives and counties with high risk for covert nineteen exposure, so I generally dont Bermuda. obviously we talk about the virus in my hustled, but he said everyone at risk risen exposure. It's a virus has viruses, work, isn't the real risk, hospitalization and death,
and it was interesting that even or even a teenager can look at some of the fear mongering in the headlines and say wait a minute where the goalposts have just moved. I thought we were supposed to be looking hospitalization rates death rate. Now it's just the risk of exposure. It's like it's out there. I mean it things. That is a real problem in both the public health officials and the mainstream media narrative about it are actively suppressing people's willingness to go, get a vaccine to return to normal life, to even discuss the option of. When can we all take our masts off? These are important questions we should be discussing people did. There is actually an effort to suppress that debate or that discussion. the figures. As long as we are on the page Each of you know. Well, if there is some risk, then then nothing good and nothing can be said to be over or ending as long as that's where we're at this never ends It never and there's no way out of that
that- is of your eminence situation. Right and and of course, this gets one of the longest live topics that divides the left from the right broadly understood, which is the case. The dream of a society and risk, and now the fact is that, based on thing that we are learning about the vaccine so far with the exception of these five five or six horror stories, the guy whose skin peeled off his leg and the woman who got it again after she got at one person in queens who got it asked. She got it all this that that we are with hundreds of thousand million Of vaccines having been shot in arms, not only here where third these somewhat forty, five million people, or fifty million people have already gotten the first vaccination Israel
a country where five and a half million people have been fully vaccinated. Tens of Billy, The people have got this thing and you can count on your hands. Then or of stories about horrible responses. That's like that now is as close to being no risk as possible, but it is no risk because there is no such thing as no risk He stepped out of your house. A brick could fall on you from of from from a high height. You could be hit by lightning. You step you cross at across walk with the law. a car, can smash into any way. There is no such thing as no risk and for some reason at this moment the medical community. Which knows about this better than anybody else on earth, because it is the higher science and medicine has decided that it cannot stomach Emmy, risk,
am I made it might. Professional responsibility did not follow the news while I was away, but I didn't stumble across this interview that Washington, Post, unseen and medical endlessly honour when gave to Chris haze the other night. I was there was this week at some point and she's been everywhere over the course of this pandemic, so she's one of the pandemic celebrities. This is not for a moment to shine, and she definitely said the girl, I'm sorry it was Chris Roma and she definitely said the why a poured out loud where she fretted about the reopening of states, not, she asked because there could be no more opportunities for transmission. Also that they then very under good faith? Thinks general believes what she's talking about her, but she said quote: everything is reopened. What's the carrot going to be? What's the incentive to get you vaccinated if life- is already available to you, so we kind of have to-
you're back society, just as an inducement to get your vaccinated them, that's not the province of public health. First of all, it something very different. Second of all, it is not Medical analysis whatsoever, its its public policy in public health experts have shed alive Their responsibility to be dispassionate scientists in this moment and have embraced The idea of a platonic ideal of this medical practitioner, as somebody who's, also sort of up Van Gogh, of a healthy, wholesome society. So so that is the public health side of the equation. Wrong though it is an end, inappropriate is no says that is it is. The compliment complimentary element here is the is the public that receives this message is in a place where
Because of the fragility and the you know, disorientation of the pandemic, we have completely forgotten what acceptable risk is so weird It's totally respectable, totally receptive to this crazy new paradigm that is being issued by them, but I mean the long term consequences of this for people likely Anna when granted as she herself has been. fitted mightily in terms of reputation and probably income and all this from the pandemic, but you could but the conditions under which a shockingly successful global experiment in public health, vaccination. You create a standard under which it cannot yet be considered a success or cannot yet be considered. The sort of thing where you can make
terminations on the basis of fifty sixty, million people already have been got my shot, meaning that the end our planet or many countries in the place of whatever our are a petri dish. For all of this, at least you know the immediate, action right, the immediate you get a shot than what happens in the twelve to twenty four hours after you get the shot. You know what. How does your body react to it? What are they the next time they need people to get of that they need. What are they gonna do when people come in because they do need that surgery and have to go under anesthetic? We we are having this public information and education session about medical science and risk, and the messages that are being transmitted by the medical community are incredibly injurious tool to eight
to a public understanding of medical risk? You can use this and say my god. This is really look at where we are look at what we ve done. Look at what it will look at what happens understand that, while there is such thing as zero risk. There is such a thing is overwhelming odds of success and overwhelming odds of a return to normal life and all this. This is a moment of great optimism of great enthusiasm in all of that, and they are not doing it, and that is a very, very threatening to our public future because it is an implicit cave. To the forces of aunties since then have been growing pretty much since the mid nineties
when we had all these science scares, because the tort lobby was going absolutely ballistic, a law on apples was gonna, give you cancer and you know, and then, of course, the ultimate which was Andrew Wakefield, made up data about how vaccines cause autism, This was really the sort of the scattered moment whenever, when this all went, nuclear and all these people who have ever reason to know that everything that is going on here is very dangerous are contributing to an atmosphere in which those ideas are made thinkable and possible unknowable- and it's very out to me- it is very- very worrisome in very upset effect, not let's move on to this fact this morning, Thirty. This morning the job support came out. Nine hundred and six thousand jobs created in the month of March. Unemployment rate down to six percent. The largest jobs report
in an hour I may I guess there were some point. Let there was. There was a bigger jobs report last year, but this is like a huge number vaccinations a common coming back to life and all that meanwhile, We are told that we need to spend three trillion more dollars to build back better, because if we doubt America's gonna fall into the ocean dia, the bite me infrastructure plan a while close to a million people got new got jobs last month and the economy is clearly on glide path towards a roaring twenty twenty one with massive job growth, a massive economic growth
we are being told that there needs to be. You know huge tax increases and an enormous level of public spending that that we haven't seen since the nineteen sixty m by some calculations since larger than the new deal. and he values slapped Joe Biden position has become the moderate position because four trillion is nice but According to Alexandria, Cassio Cortez, we should be gone for ten trillion, because ten trillion is a nice round number. It's basically the only thing I can. I can think of its very trompe and in so far as its big nice round, people are gonna love. It's gonna be great, terrific, the biggest number you ve ever heard of what would that go to I don't know she just wanted to be ten trillion. So Joe Biden now get to say. Well, you know my crazy left flank wants this, but I them
Most moderate moderates have come to the middle position, which is the biggest infrastructure bill in the history of a country. So we find ourselves, I mean this should not be an atmosphere in which the Biden proposal gets that much traction stock, both politically and I just taught macro economically right- a huge job growth. All of that potential. Inflationary potential here significant. We know that people are worried about it, both because of the feds lose money policy and because roaring in out ass if warring economic growth of the sort that we're about to see always has inflation because there's too much money chasing too few goods. That is how inflation happens.
So that's the macro economic threat of you know of an overheating economy that can overheat still more if the government starts borrowing massive amounts of money in shoves it into a ball of these places. Public sector unions did child care. I data. We can go into some of that detail politically. I just want to remind everybody, Joe Biden, one a very significant victory, but that was a four and a half per cent victory at fifty one and a half per cent of the vote, not fifty three, which is what oh Mamma got, not fifty seven or fifty five, which is what George H W Bush got not sixty two, which is what Lyndon Johnson got four and a half percent fifty one percent right. The margin in the house is five seats.
there is no democratic margin in the Senate. It's a fifty fifty Senate with Common Harris breaking the tie. The politics of this present moment do not speak to a gigantic political shift toward. The great society that was that was prepared for in nineteen sixty zero were not. I mean nineteen sixty or by Lyndon Johnson winning sixty one percent of the vote in the nineteen sixty four election Think having more than sixty seats in the Senate Icaria I mean whatever you're these massive margin, so he was in a position where I need them. They're. Getting some of this through was a was a very hard sell, a Medicare. You know some aspects, of the great society, but you couldn't doubt you couldn't deny that you know Johnson had this massive mandate.
Why doesn't have a mandate and Mitch? Mcconnell said this? Yes, sir, he said Biden is a very, very good person, but I just don't see where he has a mandate for something this size. So what are the practical consequences of the fact that they are trying to push through the largest growth in the government in sixty years. on the basis of a very, very, very slender majority at the national level and not even a wheel majority in the house and so on, polar, stating ways that it's all popular the right to that actually that rules are not votes, but the thing about the about the popularity is that the ec- and it can be true, but the question is especially with this infrastructure bill. People like to see roads, and
is in tunnels all improved and build, etc, etc? But that is a very that just one small part of this bill. So it's a weird kind of gamble: they're making with this infrastructure bill right, on the one hand, you're giving people what they say they want and what the country clearly deeds perfectly with the roads and bridges and that's good, but they ve and then on so much stuff. I mean that there is a huge part of this bill that if you try to figure out what it is they just it's too complicated, because there are too many political Pascoe with the money, and so they just call it other, but like the walking around money there to the union's into other special interest groups in the democratic coalition is enormous. So if you balance that the same time that there are their deafening playing to their constituents and saying what people who are gonna pay for this in the rich and we know the richer terrible, so let's just make them pay and we get new bridges and roads, but the problem is that's, never how it works.
And brought the shovel ready green projects that that the Obama administration embarked on, some of which turned out to be absolutely corrupt corporations, making backroom deals with the government. This is this is how federal government at this Although spending often works- and I think you know that Two enthusiasm if this gets pass is gonna fade dramatically when we see how few of these infrastructure projects are basic interest, sure and how much just political pay off that that's it's fifty it it's probably more than fifty fifty, but only a small portion of this bill is actually going to do what infrastructure, as typically understood, does, and that without you, if you don't, have their generous Emil preposterous redefinition of infrastructure. Here you know they have things like care, infrastructure, research, infrastructure. Everything is interesting these are the actual terms here for ending the data they put into. This is variable because, of course, the time that is being used here is human infrastructure, which is a joke
Anti oxymoron infrastructure by definition, the opposite of human. It is investments in objects and things an end and things that humans use in order make them more efficient than their lives. More efficient work better. There is no such thing as human infrastructure. because we are not objects and we are not machines and we are not made of cement and conquer it and steel, and you know, and fibre optic cables. That is not what we are child care is not infrastructure, it is the opposite of it,
restructure. It is a hand knit person to person thing where a baby has a diaper changed by another person matters: child care. It is not a massive public works project, and so it's a. Fantastic bit. I wouldn't exactly say it's orwellian. I'm in the right does some of this to human capital. Is a term that people are on the right. Love to use is itself kind of almost exact the same goods. Capital is the opposite of human capital is, is, is vestment resources, money things that you can put into something human capital is more like you know. Human activity is human capital and so whatever, but so the using these sorts of things to humanize things that are, by definition,
human. At all is it is. It is a habit of mind of the issue of visa semantically. The magic infiltrators who want to use language to get there. We have their politics, make their politics more more popular. I just This up by the way, so nineteen sixty four. Johnson won the election and then build the great society pretty much a nineteen sixty five and onward the Democrats had sixty eight seats in the Senate after the election in nineteen sixty four having had sixty six before it sixty eight seats. What are they have now? Fifty five zero fifty seats. What I mean we are talking about an hour after thirty two and thirty six same was true of certainly
thirty two, some comparable circumstance It was the same of the Senate for for Democrats the new deal fifty feet: five seat margin in the house. Now, maybe you can make the case that sir? the pandemic has up ended all understanding of American a week ago, going through an unprecedented crisis, but he already spend that money. He already got that money first of Zeus, tutor. I am now, and then there was nine hundred million in December before before he was became president. But you know after after he won the election. Now we're gonna spend another three trillion with a divided country I just also want to remind you that the debt of the fascistic monster, who pushed through the horrible tax,
Cut of twenty seven team got forties in particular the vote- you didn't, get forty said a devout. Jimmy Carter got forty percent of the vote. Nineteen eighty when he was denied a second term, George W George H, W Bush thirty eight percent of the vote and ninety maybe two when he was denied a second term d, don't got forty. Seven percent of the vote. Republicans got fifteen seats, one fifteen seeds, house back from Democrats in November and it's a fifty fifty Senate. The politics of this don't make any sense. This is not a moment at the Democrats and liberals have a run away now. Consensus or mandate for this kind of thing,
run, I don't know. I just want to add that one of the things that you know, one of the other categories in this building have a whole section on like infrastructure at home which again seeking to earlier point on. But you know, they're giving money to public schools, early learning centres in community colleges. a lot of union money is baked into that. To you know: housing, home and community based care for the elderly and disabled I meet. This is not that that's a social services build a solid infrastructure bills. So that's and again like that, is the three out of the four categories that they're calling infrastructure aren't typical infrastructure. People need to look really close. It is those mansion I think, has been good at already signalling that a lot of this stuff is knock knock. Gonna fly the binding, ministrations messaging hasn't changed, there's no evidence that they are listening at all in the same way that there are continuing to argue absolute flat out lies about what Georgia election legislation has not. I mean, there's the message: It has been really interesting and forget. The bi partisanship the party that was so keen on stopping us
and of misinformation. Disinformation and lying is doing plenty of that with very little push. Back from the mainstream media before that's important before getting to that. The amended just on the prospects for political backing. The logic behind all this deficit spending extraordinary deficit spending is that entered rates are ridiculously low right now. Writes I gotta just take advantage of that government should just Barbara Barbara and worry that spending back later now. We know public borrowing, crowds out private borrowing. and we know that public borrowing to the sky well that we have now will necessitate rape hikes soon, not like not like yours from that was soon and pretty soon you're going to have to go to be more expensive for you to borrow money, it's going to be harder for you to buy a house already very difficult three to buy a house that, because material costs are absurd in the inventories, are extremely low, but it's hard to be already buy a car
nobody was making cars for a year, and there was a strike that happened a year ago and just inventories really love with inventory low all over the place, and it's a lot of the man and a man not a lot of inventory hard to borrow. It doesn't take an economist to see where you hit a wall soon labour, looked down from himself said in twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen of the logic of infrastructure spending during his tenure was with woods. Very much the same, and it remains one of the great mysteries. Why He didn't lean into it more, which was yeah we're at this position where interest rates are two percent one percent. It's like free money. You can buy Take this money and borrow it over thirty years. The federal government can and then you do all this stuff and I can have all these signs on it. Saying Donald Trump built your bridge Donald Trump built your road down from to did this Donald Trump to dad and for some reason they couldn't get it together to pull it off
no is right that, on the one hand, the logic of of extremely low interest rate says, there's never a better time for governments to Tipp to take this on, because the because, though the cost of the thirty year cost of of, getting that money and then pay it back over time will never be lower. But the real world consequences of that are, not really really really fast, and it's not just that it's good. more expensive to our money. That's part of an inflationary cycle also it is that lets As we say the cost of goods, the cost of raw materials for houses now very expensive. So if you want to build a house it's now, it will cost twice as much to build a new house right now, as it did two years ago right when the fair government spends a hundred.
fifty billion dollars over the next year on bridges, tunnels roads, what are they buying? Their buying cement their buying steal their buying, would thereby all this stuff. It's not just that the its can be to borrow it is that actual goods actual materials that make our economy there's gonna, be massive competition between public sector spending in private sector spending that is going to increase private sector spending, and what does it when private sector has to spend more on stuff, just to keep going, it means less climate that might otherwise be the case. It means you know automatically recognised, purchasing power firms like general guidelines and that anyway, remedies but look it's not the seventies get, and
and it's not only not the seventies yeah, but much of what happened, the Reagan blow back against a lot of this was the result of the fact that they did all this stuff you know, guns and butter as it was called right used to be. You had to choose between guns and butter and Johnson said no, I'm not going to choose. I'm going to have I'm going to fight a war in Vietnam, and I'm going to create this massive federal an infrastructure, and then we had fifteen years of disastrous public sector spending that didn't actually do much good for the economy or for America that a lot of people. But see, and there was a real world experiment with that money and that an end that Reagan was the blow back to which, as you know, what We tried it your way and look where we hardened how we ve had fifteen years but look where we are now. Are you better often? You were four years ago. You are not better.
and you were four years ago now. I just want to read one thing, though, because this is important. This is mark, happens, news letter, which is called the wide world of news, and he basically saying Biden is in the cap, bird seed. So he points out that the dominant media home field advantage enjoyed by this administration pervades every issue topic debate, a new cycle based to say this White House starts with the builtin edge on, just every issue and the coms team knows how to play the press. Joe Biden is comparatively well why? hearted demonize than his predecessors, the quiet close on press and coordination among the White House in the democratic congressional leadership continues apace, the dominant media will continue to friendly, come to pass for truly more and spending as a heroic Biden Quest the price is conventional wisdom. This will be an easy. Even have your list of the pandemic relief bill is Trubel called it. The biggest speed bump
Getting that previously Adam was an eighteen hour delay for some Joe Mansion Kabuki until the likely final passage. Every new cycle will be filled with framing with starkly benefits the Democrats and hampers the Republicans there Literally hundreds of examples already, but here is one highly representative when the New York Times leads with this headline Biden, seeks to use infrastructure plan to address racial inequities. Good luck, messaging against that team, red another time story of just how very by parts in the White House is being quotes? Republican powerhouses, Jerry in and John guiles anyone. heard of Jerry dialogues on guiles, in favour of a big spending package, as if they are more significant than say Mitch, Mcconnell and Kevin Mccarthy, so.
Because the media are environs, pocket right now, as he I think, lays out systematically and because the Democrats are very coordinated an end to end because by himself as a creature of Washington, unlike Obama, and therefore has a greater feel for how to play the Senate and the House and the democratic majorities than I think I'll bomber did. Even Obama did perfectly well. How does the blow back happen that that's? My question I mean is the blow by happen because I'm looking at this- and I am saying you know this- is an unbelievable opportunity for a public and to get their sea legs after tromp right part of what I mean by that is not you can like tribunal like Trump, I dont care, but
Trump pushed weird issues to the fore and didn't debate major issues that put them in the background. We talked about common capron for six months and I don't know what whatever else right. This is just classic republican conservative issue, an issue folder right it some government, ridiculous debt, democratic government spending. Big government coming back roaring crowding out private investment, axing, knew they say the taxes only gonna go in the rich, but you know there's never enough money for that global bought. It is like here. Let me the buying people are saying Let me give you back all of your issues, so that would you, bash us over the head with them for two years that that then that depends that that relies on the idea that the four the republican voter today, those are still the issues. That's the question exactly
to develop young women anymore, because other because it another trunk cared about spending. It's not it's just that. It's not that you know it's not the sexy. It's gotta be cultural war or bust. Yet within gives up that whose getting exercised assigns eyes. Biden has made a point repeatedly of talking about how much republican voters love what he's doing right, he's always say other pulsar, even the republican voters, think I'm doing an amazing thing by spending on spending all your money. So I think aids up
the right, the things that are and the media plays into that dynamic by saying, while the country is trying to recover and were creating jobs and vines, doing all this amazing stuff, which they keep mention, the word soul. I pointed that out a few times you guys in our group chat like the costs we talked about, how is restoring the soul, the nation, meanwhile, the linking Republicans care about is stopping transgender athletes like that's all they care about, as if that's a fringy thing that isn't serious to the rest of the world and look at these crazies out there, so there is a marginalizing. That's been done both by the mainstream media and the Democratic Party that has been effective in in four for moderate. You know independent voters. We insist that issue is a serious and a serious of the doctors. This issue is, and it is serious, that's what they spend their time: walking about with the aid of it at the expense. of the details of the last stimulus proposal. It was only us was talking about the union pay out the conspiracy in Washington DC to keep schools closed, that sort of stuff. Just didn't it.
Guys. The base republican politicians knew it and didn't Lena horrid into it, and They left the stuff fly and those are serious issues. That's that's what a serious party does is they educate the public about the long term consequences of public policy, which is what this is and just because it doesn't general A lot of traction on cable news means indicated that role they dont have any interest in in taking it. it, does I dont know how that returns, because its demand issue their voters. Just don't want to hear about, interest rates didn't want to hear about an inflation. They don't want to hear about deficit spending, a definite, no one here, but keynesian economics in part, because Donald Trump fled the field on these issues but nobody seems really all that interested in taking up the baton, really boring I mean, can you imagine a Jack camp figure getting any track. today on the right with his issue site, I don't know
We assume that the voters are interested. How do we know that? I mean look, how many yesterday pointed out that if you abrogate the number of daily watchers, a Fox MSNBC and CNN, the average daily audience of these of these networks you get about one and a half million people in a nation of three hundred and thirty million we take a lotta wisdom from both the dominant me. and the more engage political media about what people care about? I dont know that we know what who care about I'm not saying that they care about deficits. Right deficits were a very big issue for a very long time and they had a very simple was very simple sort of like I have to keep my check good balance, so Should Washington right that that was a very easy cell and then basically, people stop which had started
being a deficit spending of their own with credit cards and all kinds of stuff way. More read so a lot of that like went out. Do you know about it when I was in the nineteen seventys when I was growing up in the ninety maze of one of the easiest things that any more. middle of the road politician to very right wing politician could say: is this? Is ridiculous, like every household has to have a bet. You now has two has to have a balanced budget, so why does government get to escape from okay? So so maybe that's out the ways you know. Maybe that's off the you know, whatever the public agenda, but Ah, hundreds of billions of dollars to public sector unions that currently employ four percent of american workers, direct federal circumventions for public sector workers, not just in the federal government but state governments, a direct payment,
to them in a bill that is supposed to be about building roads. I don't know I mean again, I'm not sure what to transmit how you transmit these messages Two thousand and nine the Tea Party movement bill came out of nowhere. literally came out of nowhere, and people spend ten years ago was funded by this. There was owed secret, dark money in the car. The coke said this and that the other thing Mostly, it seemed to have arisen from one tv appearance by one guy on CNBC, saying it's not fair, that they should be suspending your mortgage, but they should be suspending some people's mortgage payments when ninety two percent of people are paying their mortgage every month. You know that's how we had a t part me: that's that was that was sent Tele, that when he was on CNBC and boom, right it was so commonsensical. So I dont know what the common senses I do know this, which is that, if we create
million jobs a month, not just now, but you know over the course of the next couple of months the army but the Biden will be making that we are in desperate need of massive federal spending. To get the country back on its feet is got there's gonna be a problem. It doesn't make. national sense in the middle of an economic boom to say what we need is massive federal spending. Otherwise our country is gonna, go down the down the tubes binds success in the polls in it seems to me, is under SAM on this way people Were terrified and worried and didn't couldn't make sense out of what was going on with growth virus? He gets elected and he says we're just spend a lot of money to get the corona virus under control and were an end so due to various things, have happened, stance and good. For
the role that the vaccines come along their raid ago. They, the distribution system, is unclear and gets a little better. You know he makes this ridiculous promise of that he's. Gonna get all these shocks and arms that were already gonna, get an arms and all that, and so people are still in We need to get out of the crowd of virus crisis, so he spends a trillion mine right but well I was going to say that I think he's counting on. In a very I mean it's a fairly condescending way to think of the american people, but never never underestimate politicians, willingness and ability to do that. I think he is counting on two things: one kind of political, general political exhaustion. The lot Americans feel post trumpets like I don't think so. Anything anymore, we just report that I am not going to do there saying I'm I'm out, for you know I gotta you're off now, don't think about how trumps gonna destroy us with fascism or whenever and they ve stop watching the cable.
it shows that the relied on that you see it. You actually can see data that shows that their withdrawing from a lot of these debates, fine, but the other thing is it. They he's assuming that, out of people, are going to give his administration credit when those jobs come running back when the economy starts booming and he's gonna argue that is going to say. This is happening because we spend so much money in because the government took over this sector to this extent and people who believe that no, I dont know if they will, because It happened now what happened today of April. Second, nine hundred thousand jobs in details. There isn't going to be, there isn't going to be, Ill by maybe If everything goes on this way, they'll be another million jobs and may so, got to go to the Senate until you know, he's got to go to the house and set it granted. So Democrats are like in lockstep, and it's all great, and it's really fantastic and all that, because they're altogether is Mark Halperin describes what's the r,
but for three trillion dollars or four trillion dollars and more federal spending. When economy is booming and job. you're being created at an unbelievable clip. As about the soul of the nation, that's what it's about their transformative power of that spending. I think the message they did. They ve been signalling that all along, I am just practical, but why would you have to transformed the nation. At that point, the nation was, the nation is back on its feet, I agree with you on just saying on authority, they're gonna make, I think article that is. This really is an interesting point. Is that we don't. None of us here think that the infrastructure as bill as it is structured now, is going to pass right. None of us so Their essentially arguing that we're not gonna have economic recovery. We want in the absence of this bill, even as its ongoing, and it's not going to happen as in structured so we're going to continue to have this economic recovery. In the absence of this pristine infrastructure
so they're undermining their own argument for their own? said that new. Thank us for the economic recovery. because it's happening in there in the absence of their desired proposals exactly so think about it. This way go back to two thousand and nine a bomb gets. A trip gets two and a half trillion dollars of spending in fourteen months from two thousand nine to early two thousand ten, because we are in a gigantic pit. And its end, he gets it and by November he loses sixties, We seats in the house and only doesn't lose the Senate because Republicans nominated for psychotic x. You know, India, aware in Indiana, in in Nevada and in Missouri Right, and so those of those elections got localised and they didn't
with that they would have won the Senate. Had things been had had there been more rational candidates in those seat but the economy wasn't a sore. The economy was a disaster. There was a very was very hard, even even the health care are you mean had something to do with how, because everybody was for being so much. We needed to make sure that there was national healthcare, because what the hell was gonna happen. to everybody in the wake of the terrible, great recession, he's gonna be made. This argument in the midst of a gigantic economic recovery- it just it, doesn't that the messaging is contradict. he's gonna, wanna, say happy days are here again because who doesn't? Who? Wouldn't it's not contradictory? if you, if you frame it as the I've seen hence of them doing already. As you know, look we got this ring.
we're coming thanks to all of our covert relief money that we spend, and now we have to try to use this opportunity. That's the bill back better part transform it. We got to spend more money, not because if we don't will just fall back into a bit, but because we are such amazing Americans that we can do. That is right. We can we can transform it. We can all Dr Electric cars instead of using those terrible Gaskell's, as we can do all these things, because we are basing look we're getting out of the trust I dont think is contradictory. I also think remember what stuck with people who decided they didn't like. Obamacare was at any of the details of of the policy. It was the fact that the website didn't work when everybody tried to love God and that they were told you're gonna get penalised if you dont. So there was this horrible stick element that power and people remembered and but that's not fair and when they, when, after it being touted, is the saviour of all no healthcare apart problems, the basic website didn't function. Those are the two things it stuck in people's minds and I think, if Republicans to get their act together, they could find stuff like that in this infrastructure. Bill
Well, that's very important events of the electric cars we should talk about. I've got to go to the yeah, but let's talk about the electric cars for a minute, so they're going to spend. Fifty billion dollars on electric car summits can be purchasing cars by the federal government, which has again fantastic, that's really great, so, basically you're gonna privilege, the automobile and three by buying cars at a time when, as Noah says, like car prices already going up, because there is a shortage right, so fine, so you're, gonna privilege, electric cars, you're gonna, build charging stations. You're gonna do all this and do all that who buys electric cars. You think work, class people by electric cars can be subsidies for electric cars, so they go down from eighty thousand dollars to forty thousand dollars. No no person who needs a subsidy to buy a car gotta by an electric car. That's a luxury good! You are subsidizing, a classic you're a good out of some. You know misguided understanding that look at
cars, maybe the wave of the future until they can be brought down in price. They are not going to place the cars that are run that run on gasoline and yet the minute, it's like franking another minute that electric cars are profitable, There will be ten billion entrepreneurs who will who will you know on their front lawns, put up a charging station and you'll combine you'll pay them a quarter to you, their charging station for five seconds. So you can your car, another twenty miles. Right I mean we don't need
it also mentions for this. Its it really does make sense out there are. There are going to be a billion of these things in the bill. The question is: what is the transmission point for the stories that are going to come out that are going to create the resistance and that's what I dont know, because that's where the report that this is a test of the Republican Party and the conservative movements viability? Are they headache where they so corrupted by the last four years at all? They really care about? Is whether or not you know Brad Raffles Berger is punished for his disloyalty, but do they actually want to stop the rise of the second new deal and
in a mass of inflation and the and the empowerment of the government and end that's what we need to watch out for the other thing that we need to watch out for his our backs. Let's face it, our backs. You don't want a bad back. Everyone's been sitting around the for a year now and you know Lombards bad near knocking off size, probably in all that, so I want to talk about the exchequer to talk to you about it all week. This chair, they sent me fantastic desk chair with patented dynamic, variable lumbar support else. My lower back
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Russell figures on the rights to serve as reminders of how awful in monsters and horrible Republicans where they could come from anywhere and be anybody right and we have. We have our new one is Matt Gaetz from Florida, currently in mashed, in a very confused sex scandal, because what it started it was, he is, you know, maybe sex trafficking us as sex trafficking, seventeen year old and now it's he gave people he. He, did something with apple pay and then and and and slept with women seller using campaign funds used campaign funds to pay people was ok. Mr miss the campaign funds part, but it's also like okay, so he he and he showed make it
trees of women on the floor of the house did is colleagues and nay they make it all hoping women you ve gotta, get the hooligans in very good. That's what makes it we I despise Matt Gates. I think he is everything that is wrong with american politics writ large, small and medium and and and I'm happy for him to be destroyed if he deserves to be destroyed. but the stories weird, because there is this bizarre detail about how he's being extorted but apparently being extorted cause. His father is very rich, and these guys in Florida wanted his father to pony up when he five million dollars to pay ransom. To get
Robert Levinson out of a RON who we were told his dad. This is the American who has you know who disappeared into been a rainy imprison twelve years ago, and we were told two years ago is dead and they wanted to figure out some way to get money to pay the ransom him and there and they went to Matt Gates's father was apparently very rich and said you know they give us to answer our Levinson or we're expose your son, sexual peccadilloes, or something like that. So somehow get a feeling that there's something here. That's true because we want where on earth would this come from, Robert Levinson, in IRAN, the ransom money like you couldn't make a bet gates, couldn't even met gates, couldn't make that up. So I don't know what I just said:
daylight for contacts you asked: where does it come from the Florida Panhandle? And I say this as someone who love you know I'm from Florida, I will actually have family in the pan and also I'm not. You know, trying to snobling say there. It's terrible, but there's some crazy self that have a simple for prevent indolent. Actually, he strikes me as much more within the range of normal. If you see it from that cotton to x and, let's recall, actually get the Florida background is important, because this was a guy who not that long ago was throwing his support to jump up and then heat he he up Tunisia, Clia, imbracing tromp any seems to have also embrace the trunk persona Trump approach, the whole, those back. Ok, so so we're too about this now really talk about this story. Just keep shiftings as of now Matt Gates is like a is a is a disgusting a creep. You know who, like red, Mule, stresses the game and is showing naked pictures of his girlfriends and all that what what exactly it has to do with a sigh
scandal involving minors and the violation of the man acted, these these things are not comparable but, as I say, I have no truck with him but whatever. I also notice that this is going on when what happened on Tuesday, the New York Times reported that Andrew Cuomo used staff to write his book for She personally got four million dollars in clear violation of New York State LAW on the use of public officials, public money public time. For private enrichment and, of course, the continuing scandal of his brother, the CNN course Gettings Special treatment from New York State, else officials, particularly in testing when, as I recall, no one in New York state could get a call test and now we're talking about data meme away. A lot of us are talking about that, but you know how convenient that the actual
oh scandal involving the governor of the third largest state air, the fourth largest state in the United States, and the hero of the of the democratic pandemic. Somehow now takes a back seat to this back Densher moron, Blithering Idiot jerk Idiot Ass from Florida, who was a human embarrassment who wanted to quick who announced before this happened that he wanted to quit the house I don't have a show, a news max and that's more important than requirement. I do love the irony that Chris Cuomo turns out to have been the first Excelsior pass holder. Evidently re like you got access all kinds of stuff the nobody else could get. No. I agree with that. In the end, the look Matt MAC Gates in some ways the much more extreme version of the kind of Alexandria cause your Cortez politician style. That's me these are people who are actually more like cable news, home
Tor Instagram influencers who happened to hold a seat in Congress like gets, that's not really fit, their power doesn't come from their position. It comes from their profile and he's play that to a t or gas mask on the floor of the house, and he does all these he's a stunt politician and, unfortunately, I'm does exist on the left and the right. We ve. We focus a lot more on the ones on the right to point out. The other stunt politician on the right, Marjorie Taylor, Green spent instead of veto yesterday discussing the infrastructure bill, was posting videos of herself doing cross, Fit pull up in stuff, meticulous its performative politics. That has nothing to do with the serious issues have to count the love it. Yet the czech people love it, they love it. I mean who who loves it? That's what I don't. I'm sure people love it plenty of them and then and then people are horrified. Then you know it's like it at its that weird thing where half the people
my daughter is sending me. I was sending me clips of it because she's like what the hell is, she did my daughter's like sixteen is like who does a pull up? This way I mean she's like doing this, pull up in this bizarre back. Words. Fatted grass fed pull up. It's ridiculous Gara the doubt that that way could about a promotional wave. I have no, I don't. I don't have any idea out an. I do want to read one thing before we go, though, because I get a daily mail called the Daily Trump report. It's like something I was put on. Okay, so we're talking about mandates and a large retailers and the people who control arm. You know who it was, who dominate the republican conversation right or conserve, conversation daily, Trumpery, dot, com, comes from Wentworth South Dakota have no idea who it is has added to this list. I just want to read you their top stories today, because this is what the question comes down to it, which is probably can party going to take up the challenge posed by Biden, which is like a giant.
softball being lobbed right at them that they give her the fence. Are they gonna go into Michigan into it's crazy town, land and and screw this up top stories on Daily Trump report that come here is why the Freemasons are demonic and evil organization. Timothy Dixon says Joe I'd knows. God is numbered. His days, yes, the Nike Satan shoes are real, Michael, entails new social media plus, form Frank will be able to hold over one billion users binds dog pooped on the White House floor and video shows Biden almost
falling down the stairs again and then she could. At last I connect the dots I'm just saying the light like like look. This is very serious business. We're talking about you, know massive unprecedented increase in the size of the federal government and, as I say, deep, profound political opportunity for the right to get at sea legs after the disorienting experience of a twin, fifteen to twenty twenty, and then we got this got Marjorie Taylor, Green, doing pull ups and we ve got the Freemasons are evil. Michael and L is gonna, have a billion users and binds dog pooped on the White House WAR. Imagine that letters almost quaint, though I'm just old enough to remember the time when that was the sort of unaided feedback you got from crazy people in the mail,
They put a stamp on it. They would they put him pieced together, magazine, clippings and mail it to you in the days ramblings would be the unlimited thoughts of madmen who would otherwise not gonna get a microphone or a platform to spot the sort of crazy stuff and all those gatekeepers are gone. So the feedback mechanisms that people have now or these platforms and those platforms catered crazy people so the crazy person whose piecing together the magazine hostage letter that to get in the mail and ninety. Ninety six now and the show, and you have to pay attention to him. Yes,
You believe that vacation did not mellow. No, I think we now. This is a good thing. However, it look. It's like like men, like you, said you of the culture war is real and I just want to complete. I want I want to finish podcast. I sent you guys this yesterday is a book review in the New York Times near terms, Booker view most important publication, for you know the world of books in the United States and possibly the world a review by someone they Betsy Bonner of a book called girlhood essays by Melissa, feeble So here is how this begins. Nearly a decade ago, Melissa fevers reflected on her decision to publish her debut memoir whip smart under her own name and not a pseudonym quote. It didn't stop people from thinking of me as a former sex worker, who also happens book about it. Instead of a writer who happens, tell the story of her own experience in sex work. Unquote, nobody district That's feeble semi, more her
thousand. Seventeen autobiographical collection abandoned me about a toxic love affair, her birth, father and the sea. Captain who raised her. It was a fine. For the land, the literary awarded on many best books of the year of lists. The former professional dominatrix now teaches nonfiction at Phoebus as ambitious new collection. Girlhood comprises eight essays about growing up in a female body that reach sexual development at the age of eleven. It was a race that I, Without trying she said and to win, it was the greatest loss of all. The book is a feminist testaments survival years of dehumanizing sex with boys and men, harassment by women being stock drug addiction. In what you described as a growing certainty about the ways in which I have collaborated in the mistreatment of my own body story, she tells us not just her own feet. Similarly many other women about their sex lives and incorporated these testimonies into a far reaching narrative. So my power,
it is. These people are all crazy, also thereon. Crazy. We had the thing this earlier this week with the CNN story that said, nobody knows, what gender anybody is at birth. Despite a restatement of fact, he as a fact, we talked about the transgender athletes thing where this idea somehow is that conservatives have start heads Services are making transgender ism and athletic some issue. Conservatives taking this an issue talk about gas lighting so, like I don't wanna be given this
still think that by the administration needs a luxury of logical cover story to to advance the selling of these bills. I think that there is a there is a civil war going on in this country between madness and not madness, and that this is the ultimate fight. There are crazy. People on the left crazy people on the right and their extremism. There misunderstanding of human nature, their attachment to conspiracy, theory and and and and and sort of the worst kind of characterisation of each other. This is the fight of our time. This is where it transcends. You know some practical politics You know how around nine eleven and the war on terror began. You know people would say, look
have been at war with us, we're just we're just joining the fight, the that's that's what we yet to come to that moment, The apparent worry us I will not let a war with them Noah go. come vacation. What did you come back for? Why are you coming what what do I do this right. go back to the beach. Well, all I have to say John, is that you live in New York state where you're beneficence governor has legalised marijuana, and I think it's time for you to join the party, because I don't know how you're gonna get through this. I don't know that. Yes, we but your governor gonna legalised marijuana. While we did in a referendum last year, my stay at my state has been unable to implement this, and it's been, very hilarious saga, actually because every interest group is trying to get them into the trough and they can't figure out how
to accommodate all the anti discrimination groups in the process. Save legalizing, because its there's another stares at their civil rights Groups are showing the state for some reason, because they're, not a part of the native sufficiently represented on this committee, will have you said this referendum past and there's just they haven't figure. Haven't figured. I hadn't expunge won't convictions which is known does social justice issue listening in a nice, but they haven't figured Actually honour the terms of the referendum because of diversity, consultants basically use, on account of its industry. By the way you knows, joined the cannabis industry, John Vainer, the former speaker of the house, who has a pretty astounding excerpt from his a memoir, which are you going
published Tuesday in political this morning, which I commend to everybody, because you basically never read anything quite light. The summer for pilots everything you want a former politician to do in terms of candour and vulgarity, and them it's it's kind of jawdropping. Of course, Marilyn camels, baby, Abner, low camels and apparently now can't of this. So from from from speaker of the house to a pot dealer in them, I was six years their sexy american storage, truly, two beautiful. It's a beautiful american story that you know grow back better. I guess that's what we're, who, with purple lamp, Your window sill anyway welcome back Noah foolish decision to return, but we now we need you, so
happy to have you. Everybody have a great weekend if you celebrate Eastern bravely sterling work were steam and no at an able jump up or its March of Commentary magazine Dotcom merged our common timing, using dot com for that. For that new mug, the t, shirts sweatshirt dead, the toad bag merged, cometary magazine dot com and keep the camp.
Transcript generated on 2021-07-28.