« Commentary Magazine Podcast

Tax Time for Trump?

2020-07-09 | 🔗
On today's podcast, Washington Free Beacon editor-in-chief Eliana Johnson joins us to discuss the possible fallout from the Supreme Court's ruling on Donald Trump's financial records. We also weigh in on the fight over reopening schools, Trump's missed opportunities, and the sorry state of mainstream journalism.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Welcome to the Commentary magazine Daily Podcasting these Thursday July nineteen, twenty twenty, I'm John purports the editor Commentary Magazine whip that offer that you heard about over the last couple of days. One dollar, four: the first month, if you go to commentary magazine, dot, com and Subscribe now. You have two options: Digital only or digital plus are a monthly magazine in your mailbox eleven times a year. Please subscribe, you know you want to know you sure you know what should happen. So this is the moment. This is the time a dollar four, the first month do it with me as always executive you're, a green waldheim, a John Christy,
Rosamond no arrangement are both off joining us in their stead. Is Washington, Free Beacon, editor, Aliona, Johnson, highly ANA Einstein, so breaking news as we start, the Supreme Court has ruled seventy two with both justice cab. I am just as gorse such agreeing with the majority that the Trump tax returns must be released to the Manhattan district attorney. This, of course, is a now multi year case Trump managed to push the whole issue
of his tax returns back and back and back and back and now it's broken. The question is: why is it good that he pushed it to this point, or is this the worst possible time that it could come out that his tax returns could be could become the subject of this a subpoena for a by a hostile district attorney in Manhattan, who is himself looking to steady his own. Position on his left flank, pollyanna? What do you think it's a good question? I am for the first three and a half years of its kind. It really seem like trunk was the luckiest. I want a lucky you guys in the world I starting from his election and the fact that
I really had been no major domestic crisis on his watch. I think most other president's weathered something like that. I had people express concern to me that ok, it's going ok, but this is why it has prepared for crisis will now, while we are both be real domestic prices of Verona virus and this potential political crisis. But I actually think that by post get this far at the american people know. Who trump is? I think they have an accurate view of them. I think of you ass most, they would probably say the guy's cheated on his taxes. It pardon. To imagine that, what's contained and in his tax forms is gonna really sway the electorate in a significant way. I think the electorate is gonna, be thinking about what is their bank account and forlorn look like, and what is the economy
look like and how has the president handled be pandemic? I think it's mostly bad form its look, it's better if the decision itself as bad, because he's lost, again right and he's season and losing streak. So rigour, less now of of the contents of the of the tax returns and I suspect they won't be muttering to him either he's already he's already sort of suffering and additional hit, and there's also, you know, there's something that that all political discussion has been characterized during the the Trump years. Is it served? There's no issue ever gets finally resolve. Let me to get sort of resolve and then there is a debate about and then it then people kind of fight back in there and its its Business is never a final wrestle. Lucien, probably this this is. This is a Supreme court decision now. This is this is
This is a decisively resolved against him and that's that serve a new thing: ok, speculation. What if he refuses to go along? This has always been The issue with litigation involving the executive branch and the judicial branch they are Co. Equal president, is not actually subordinates, to the Supreme Court, though he is not above the law, but he is a little bit kind of but the law I mean he's not exactly above the law, but but he does not have to bend himself to the other branches by by definition, and, generally speaking, presidents and the Congress have have shied away from really really too
thing these limits like they. They walk up to the very tippy toe of Vienna, like plunging into a constitutional crisis, about the separation of powers and then there's an go she hated settlement and they negotiate over at em. Don't dont really confront this central problem. Structural problem with The way that the system is set up, precious does trump one o observe that nicety or Is he going to go down saying I'm not releasing those returns? What are you going to do to me? How can you make you can't make me send the Marshall of the Supreme Court over go ahead? Your remedy for my misbehavior is impeachment and removal. That's all you got so. Okay, I'm not giving over my returns. Go ahead. Congress impeach me and remove me: try it again
it's possible. It is it's in keeping with the with the lack of finality to these things out, as I was saying at it. So it's also in keeping with with who Trump is at the end, it'll it'll spur. All the criticisms of these version of ie good working order. Of our democracy as a response playing with my scenario here, where I think it's a possibility at the the administration really is taken, namely confrontational stance. It could towards Congress and there's no reason. I think that it wouldn't towards the Supreme Court, I'm sitting here waiting for a Trump tweet, given that his two Supreme Court appointees ruled against him in this?
is, and has already been a little bit of disgruntled men. I think about the way that the chief and Corsica ruled in some of the decisions that we ve done previously, and I think that was really trumps winning issue and twenty sixteen and I'm interested to see if he tries to deploy it again or if he attacks has just be now. You really need may because you know now what now that liberals give out have got memory. I don't know I mean it's an entered, that's an interesting, got memory, I don't know, I mean it's an inch, that's an interesting issue right that he it's gonna, be hard for him now emotionally per finally to say I'm great, I appointed gorse agenda courses. Cabin I stood by Cavanaugh. I was there, I didn't let those liberals taken down with their false talks, accusation and
Can he bring himself to do that say in the convention's speech? Now here's Now. Ok, so he's gotta debts. We run one after the other price. Not slightly cannot rise above its out right cheek. He doesn't personally, I personally as its tax returns, but there with this was about whether they accounting should really some rights. So I wonder whether how much controlling has over the release Ok, so I again like I might certainly no no expert in this I mean there is a. There has been a hard and fast rule in the course of american history. That tax returns are the among the most personal things that exist on earth and that they they are always in the personal control of of the person who signs them and not
control of the idea that it would be a violation of I don't know the hippocratic counting, south or or privacy laws or whatever for this somehow to go through a third party adona. Maybe I'm wrong the end. I haven't read the decision since it came down. Obviously, while we were talking here pretty much, I just think it's an interesting thing. It out, you know as a gamble. Of course, Trump could treat this as nothing by which I mean saying I'm not gonna, give up papers. Take me to court is something that he has done: seventy five thousand times and life before he was president and then he loses a case, and then he does what he asked do you know dilatory tactics using using the legal system, as it is a myth of delay or progress or attack, or whatever is something that has been part of his playbook in May
be at the end of the day. We give it a shot. You got three years. You got a delay of for years out of it, and then you lose a menu, then you get than you do it. You have to do. Well, I don't know I mean I think it's just that pre White House. I think that is his thinking. You know, but the stakes are no different now, and I think you know Ellie on his right about. Do you know that the personal slights with him for Trump this goes to the top of his agenda. Frankly, this is now think his his obsession that beats out the virus de economy and and whatever else. For the time being. I think I think we can expect a flurry of tweets and off the rails comments. So what what interests me? now again. If we play at the scenario is what would report I mean, maybe
This is ridiculous because we don't know what has come to us all. Those in this house. I am not going to give up the as you know is already is already just uh. You know what f, but what? If this really could be the moment which Senate Republicans decisively break from him, because I don't know what possible advantage there can be. Particularly if Democrats another say what are you talking about so they seventy two decision, it wasn't the liberals or the conservatives. You have arguably the two most conservative guys on the cord, the ones the Trump appointed saying he's gotta give up his tax returns. What possible defence could any Republican elected official make of this behaviour? Because this isn't the Democrats go. Ok,
I did say, bands of the New York dare them at hand the secretaries off his going after him, but it could have been a could have been somebody else, and you know I don't know I mean I just don't see how he can hold Republicans together Not conservatives are not his own backers, maybe he can with them, but I mean it's a well unnerving thing here. If it were five to four, it might be different rights at work if it were Roberts and the liberals, but the fact that you know we can assume that this was a hard fought internal discussion at the Supreme Court since it took till July nines for this thing to come out and that Roberts worked very hard to get gorse H M Cavanaugh in particular to come on to his side in this matter and six
It means, I think, probably that the argument is some kid I was is pretty serious. I mean I trust the Lido and Thomas, both of whom dissented not as partisan but, as very you know, there's people with very firm legal, presidential opinions and since I haven't read the defense- I don't know about this either, but we can presume that they are there a serious arguments against it if they're dissenting, but seven hundred and twenty two is the notion that people are going to judge roll over and say this is tramping treated unfairly. That's that's! That's impossible! Rodya! There's! No! There's no principle. Let's
he care other than Donald Trump penchant for personal secrecy right, I think that's right. I think there is a possibility that you could see Republicans break for man, I'm not sir. You know before right now. What is that that would be electrically bad for them, but you now seems like thirty rock band Am I don't know how much worse that can get they order cross drunk? I m right promised there. You know you ve seen a few them start to do it on the confederate money, Staying at the president's wrong on this and use miscalculated. I do think the president's best,
she's gone in the election, our school reopening and the way that he handle has handled the the protests and riots, and I don't think he's I don't think he's done. A very good job of the latter will see how we handle the former, but those two may seem like the issues that are regular. People are thinking about and caring about because they want their kids back in school and many have seen their cities damage destroyed, Speaking of the school reopening Betty divorce, the education secretary announced that people who live in places where the school system refuses to reopen will be able to re the money that the fellow governments sends to statement qualities to support education to do to find an alternative means to school their children. That seems to me
we have extremely commie approach, particularly given that I read yesterday, the section in this report issued by the Biden campaign of thee meeting of the Biden, Sir, endures. Let's find common ground task force, it's a hundred and thirty page report, issue by issue on which they release their fight, the release, the things that they can agree on. And these schooling, one is really one for the books. I mean it is a charter. Schools are evil. You know, teachers should have everything. Nobody. You know it's every bit of pc there can possible. B and basically surrenders all agenda items to the teachers unions in end in a systematic way that also attacks the anyone who has a contrary
thinking about how to run education. I mean p it. This is a document, no one. GonNa Biden isn't even like sworn to uphold it or anything. That's also weird because it was issued. If you read it, it there's a link that was sent out by the Biden campaign to a Microsoft. Word document That's how you really is a pdf from Microsoft Word and there's no letter head, there's no like Biden for President Thurston there. It is just like it doesn't, even though it looks like a draft of a term paper has no header. It has no foot hurry it. Oh it's very strange Lee high school. You know like where the teacher would send it back can say you know where the fuck are. You didn't indent the headline properly. You know whatever
but I think this is reminding me that might my dad taught loss will briefly and he had a- I believe, the brief submitted then, but the cover was construction paper with friend laughed it's cool, I mean in in in in terms of an official document released by you know, by the presidential campaign of one of the but the oldest political party on the planet. It's pretty striking that that this is what it looks like, but it does open. There is there is a big opening there. Of course you know parents of school age, children are not a majority in the United States. You know they debt them their most. People are don't have school age children and this is not an issue for most its ambition for a great many people, but it's
an issue for most, and maybe it can't really in a break through the wave Aliona, it's an issue person casts wrong. I think you are unimportant constituency that the president has lost and that you might have a chance of winning Mcafee coming. He has taken a strong stance on this, but we gotta see what happens between between now and the timber from it. As I said the other day, I'm still puzzled, because the divorce thing is the first practical suggestion. Of what to do as a counter to this sum on rush of the idea that no we can't possibly reopen the schools are really open them part way I'll be in school two times a week, then they'll be home three days awaken as we
This is what do not build? A blog you announced, and what we know about the New York City, schooling and Fairfax, county schooling and other places is that there is no education. There is no remote learning like my kids who, but a private schools got had real remote learning, which, was difficult and unsatisfying. An eye is not anything that I would recommend, but the schools move Heaven and earth to create a system in which they were effectively and in virtual school every day. That is actually not the way schooling is in the vast now in the country and in fact, as a whole, equity issue, because how can you do that? How can you have virtual learning when some kids aren't gonna have access the internet won't have computer? there's only one computer in the house and parents use it all of that, and so, It's not fair to have remote schooling, because there will be a happy.
Have not divide in the remote schooling. So therefore you should just send packets of paper home or said packets of paper, as I am clear how they get printed in oak is what have you done a printer at home and then, of course, there is the fundamental issue which is kids, don't get covered and adults do and we are closing down the schools to protect adults and not to deal with the issue of where children go every day, not in every I gotcha education, but two took to basically be taken care of, while parents work that there's another the sugar to, I think, which is it if claim is that socialize why in a school setting is a danger for spreading the virus and making people second, potentially dumb, killing them wise it safe for two days. There is the question, I you know
if either it's either. This is this. There is a real bad practice of get aren't I can I can I offer you the defence, so the idea is that the reason it has to be two days is that they can create a socially distanced classroom, but they can't do it with everybody in the classroom, so they have to divide up the classroom. Half the number of kids in school, at all times in order that kid's be six. We depart I'll say the teacher is both every guy just different. Yes, exactly right but you'll be you'll, be in group, ay and you'll be in group, be at one week, you'll be in school two days and home three days in one week, you'll be in school three days and home two days and teen be will be in school in the opposite patter, but that teachers will stay the kids won't. My solution has been that the
it should go to school, my teacher should stay home and they should have big screen, and then the teachers can teach remotely- and you can have like twenty two year old proctors in the car- as for making sure that the kids don't kill each other. When you know all we ever here is then people have said to me: oh that's my practical, but then we here like while this is gonna, be a schooling year like no other. Everyone's gonna have to be comfortable with the fact that these are. This is a situation precedent. Did not like any other. Well then, if that's the case, then I don't know why the idea of having people were at low risk for them. These being in the schools, monitoring the kids? Isn't a solution like any other, that's not satisfying, but is one way to handle it
you're right. I also think it gives the opportunity for the president to take a stand against the teachers unions, who constantly say therefore doing what is in the best interests of the children are all about the children, and I think the administration should come up with a creative approach, because there is a fair amount of research showing that being out of school and having their social lives. Constricted is bad for kids right. Well, I mean that's me, part of this, but it out it does require a systematic seizure of an issue and figuring out how to ride it and push it every day, which is what a really successful political campaign can do. If you take a bad like a like a more symbolic example on a practical example, when it became clear that Michael do cock,
the discomfort with the pledge of allegiance and nineteen. Eighty eight was something that was gonna bite him and the race was very close. George H, W Bush has campaigned largely in the hands of Roger Ales, sent him every single day to a flag factory to this to it to do things seventeen twenty one days in a row. He went to flag factories you what the flag, this flag that had said the pledge of allegiance and relentlessly here murmured the issue because they saw their opportunity and they took out and they talked about the pledge, and all this now, as I say, that's just totally symbolic has no prior had no practical application, but it was the culture war issue of the moment and Dukakis was slaughtered because of it right, so the Trump campaign were it competent, could take the opening. The schools thing and figure in some way to talk.
Only about this for a month, I agree- and I think also an opportunity for the president to take a stand against the media. I mean I've jobs with some of my colleagues about how reporters attorney, and like far monitors who believe their job is to point out whose wearing it and who was wearing a mask as if you know, people can't noticed that on their own, but it's you know. I think that in many ways the media's handling of the virus has been shameful, including that back at the White House never got credit. There was never a ventilators shortage and they they do have successes to point you, even though, even if there are a lot of pillars, whether their job is to be changes in their presentation of the back, and they should be doing that. Well, you know, that's, that's they should be here. We are
because they're only getting more tendentious as the hours passed, that's their their more tendentious and they are built up putting their fingers on the scale and not allowing aren't they getting punished for it. I'd be putting out a campaign, video the press, talking about the ventilator shortage, and then you know some people who were treated successfully talking about thanks to the administration, but you don't hesitate to say and fairness Trump did hammer the ventilator issue for a long time after after everyone dropped it. You know he was be was deep. He would talk about
how would the he's the ventilator, king or or or the U S is, are, however, one advantage. We have such good ventilators that we're we're shipping them to other places. No one bit, you know right. Well, look I mean we are we. We now have to accept the fact that, from the covert matter through issues of school every thing that touches it. The coverage of what is going on is going to be disgraceful right now we find ourselves in a situation in which we are told that there is a horrible pandemic about two over wash the country based on increased bad statistics in some states like Texas and the,
The death toll in Texas, the other day was like sixty seven. Ok, so you know when New York was at its worst more than a thousand or to the people are dying every single day. Right and now you have these cases. It's like there's an increase of twenty two percent over three days ago, except that the actual number is ten or eleven or twelve people. We are told that this is where we are seeing an increase in the case load a decrease in the death toll. Now that may start shifting and when it starts shifting the fact that states will detail. I imprudent fashion, start shooting
down there bars in this than the other thing will be. Will it is fine and has been happening in response to events, but we are. The coverage of the virus is bad and it's bad in a way that is completely controlled by the fact that the worse, the stories are the worse. It is four tromp bout that that's on Trump, because in theory, a crisis should be good for a president. Crises are always good for the executive because if an executive can provide minimal comfort or minimal leadership or something where people will want to listen trump screw that up and now
Oh, he is on the downward slope with that, and this is just an everyday distortion of the facts, not to say that the pandemic is a terrible or the horrible things can happen but they're not happening now and as a misunderstanding. To say that the increased case load is itself or the increase positives are our as itself A sign of disaster could be a sign of the opposite. It could be a sign that we are hurtling toward her. Community and that enormous numbers of people who get it have no symptoms from it and are going to give it to other people who have no symptoms from it, and that this will be a faster way for us to get out of this. I agree- and you know there's another side to this and there's interstice that there's something else. It makes me think that they be heard immunity hypothesis is, is a good one
the story about the New York success and we can argue against set- you know easily forever, based upon our massive death toll. But so now, even in our supposed success, five hundred two thousand people in New York State Arbed, are testing positive every day. That ranges from between point eight percent of those tested to about one one point: eight percent of those tested- that's let's say roughly fifteen thousand new, you people in New York testing positive per month. That has been steady. That is not. That is not. That shows, as actually no sign of decreasing. That has been going on for a long time. Why is that so? Steady and cumulatively, over the course of my fifteen thousand more infections, a month in New York, that's a whole lot of new infections, actually right and
so is it strikes me that, as everyone has to say I'm not asking you now just no expert, but it strikes me that so the Ours is here in New York still forcing its way through the population of those who have not gotten it strikes? ITALY at us at the same at a steady rate right now, the nightmare scenario it seems too as that is the New York nightmare scenario, which is that follows this pattern. Lotta people are getting in here. And no one is dying anymore. So what that suggests is that the virus is incredibly opportunistic, the dangerous in its ability to get at people who are die from it for other for reasons, co more bidding he is whatever you want to call us, and that here in New York and particularly in New York City, the stuff,
or it may be, and this is sort of like a horrible way to put this, that everybody who was gonna die from it has died from it and then everybody who is getting it now is not gonna die from it and almost everybody who gets it isn't gonna get sick from it either and the danger, of course in the country is that this is gonna happen everywhere and that, as a beauty said, Maybe the story is that there are outbreaks that are gonna happen, sorry autumn place after place and that the whole notion that Well because they were admiring mask or they open too soon or this or that that it has a spread pattern where it simply kind of has a geographical, we're geographical effect, and that it goes to Texas and went to Arizona, but it hasn't gaunt Missouri it's in its in ITALY, but it's not in Germany. You know we don't, but that eventually
go everywhere and yet and maybe enhanced knowledge means that people gonna die less and less from die from it, meaning there there it things are gonna, be a lot better because they know not a ventilate people. They may not to put people on ventilators. I know put upon their stomachs and stuff like that, but none of this is susceptible to a public policy solution. Masking is not a public policy solution I mean. Is, I think it? It's. It's a low cost, probably somewhat high return solution, so everybody should take it just as a standard for caution, but there may be
my answer to this question and the coverage is to say: oh my god, the case load spiking and if you had said in March that the caseload would be spiking in places with a very low death toll people would have said. Well, I guess that serve what you need to burn through the viruses for every Choquette test. You know until there's a vaccine is what other choices there. I think that's exactly right and I'm in a baby, and so you know just Justice first happened in New York seems to potentially be a depressing model for four spikes elsewhere. Then the sort of the post, the post mass death toll version- that's happening here now. May the future everywhere else too, which is that it did the virus GIS slowly makes its way through the population after after hitting
the most vulnerable right. Then again, that's that's when that's that's called the success part of the of the spread of freedom sent an email is going doubling back on the media coverage been shameful and all that about schooling and the media so sure brought this up before. But I, bring it up now pointing out that? LOS Angeles Times, did a very interesting. Story about the Ella, unified school district survey of parents who all were to respond asking how they felt about children. Returning to school. Fifty nine percent said they were ready to return that day under
any circumstances. Ok, what was the headline the early times put on their story? This was June. Twenty ninth swaying twenty quote: Ella Schools, reopening twenty percent of parents. Thirty six percent of staff are not ready for campuses to open. So the survey said sixty percent were ready to send their kids back to school. Under any circumstances, the headlines Ellie Times was twenty percent. The parents are not ready for campuses to open. Like me, I I mean to writing. Add mainstream media story, as long as we're event in debt, because as long as we're on these onion, like actual headlines, yesterday, in Bloomberg, opinion.
As a story, the headline is, I'm reading it. A lower cove at nineteen death rate is nothing to celebrate. Well, you're, very happier, if that, so that is not. If that's not, if that's nothing, to celebrate. Its there're. You know disastrous by by the left zone, lights the worst public health crisis to hit us, then there's nothing. Despite right, I mean it's like nothing. Good can ever happened right. Nothing is good, so What were the story of the last couple of days and Ellie out? I know you, you ve done some writing about, discuss it. So juicy that's hard not to not to cover it, but so they Apparel Protection ACT ever when you got the money from the Paler Protection ACT, is that now public who got money, so it's like all Doktor Phil got two million dollars Dodger velvet,
a thousand his son bought a ten million dollar house like these. Two things are connected, like his son took the two million dollars amused at as a down payment. The peril protection act all point about giving people two million dollars for the Peril Protection ACT was so that doctor fills company, wouldn't lay everybody off work for doktor fill, and it is apparently worked because thee unemployment rate when staggeringly down after the first horrible month before it passed all of that money is being used exactly as it was supposed to be used. Green Briar. The green bar hotel, owned by the billionaire governor of West Virginia
ten million dollars? Will you know what no one got laid off at a hotel, but no one is going to eight if you ever been to the growing briar its gigantic, it's like two thousand rooms and two billion acres and there was abundant. So big there was a there was a post nuclear war bunker at the Green Briar, which is where the president and the cabinet we're gonna go in case of a nuclear war. That's how big the Green briar is, and I quote again short: ok. I stipulate that many of the people who got the money used as intended that a certified and not lay off any workers at Bay, look for other sources of apple before taking the money, but I believe there are unequal, if not greater number of people who lined up
The government trop use their connect, wealthy people who did not need it and use their connections to get this money. I would point to some of the private schools in DC in New York City boyfriend, squawk fifty million dollar endowment took between I've been ten million dollars. I actually would like to know how did their revenues decrease during this time? How would they have been hit by the virus and then that George, some prep were cavanaugh and work with both when they took money in their come into? The times was well. The New York Times was well. Our teachers have chosen to work here when they could have made more money in the private sector.
Or in public school? That's not with the money was far and I, like you know they give the teachers raise ok now at a blow to give you the push back on this, because the whole idea of the Peril Protection ACT was if you met the criteria and you could get to your bank or your accountant to fill out the forms they were going to do this no cars in order to throw the money into the economy as fast as possible. I dont think there was any there's no connection. It's more like commentary got money from the Peril Protection ACT where a five or one see three non profit. What do we do? We apply to our bank, the minute that the bank was had the paper work. We feel that the form we don't have many employees, we didn't get very much money, but we were in a position where this was right. There.
And we were far the law as written and the laws written was do it. You can not to lay people off. If you use this money to support your payroll, that's fine were we somehow are where we are people obligated not to take money as a patriotic act somehow to serve like. Get out. Take one further team when the structure of the law itself militated against that very attitude, was it doesn't matter who you are? I don't fire your people and we will essentially subsidize their employment for a couple of months, also a inoffensive John of that point, when this all here
up and no one knew no one could say what what the actual damage would be coming down the pike we did know how long I knew, how long and at what what their fortunes would be in the coming months, so brightly lit with button. I do think it's juicy and I think it's worth. I have nothing against the stories. Ok, I really doubt because I think it good that the public knows where the money went where, where public spending goes particularly when you have a gigantic unprecedented and probably never to be repeated. I hope never be repeated thing that happened here, but remember the it was was there's something that could be done in order to prevent thirty percent of Americans being out of work, and it turned out that if it worked, I think I mean, then a plumber wait kits close to sixteen percent and then went down to eleven because of this in future,
of money, and then we hear the other problem is that there that the unemployment money six hundred dollar we guaranteed unemployment money which still going on, maybe having deleterious effect on reemployment, because people can get more from unemployment that they can get from a job which is always the the danger. The and you know the m the unwanted consequence of
public policy that seeks to subsidize certain types of behaviour, for compassionate reasons is that it can have a negative effect on a tell us tell us about putting on the spot, but tell some stuff that you're particularly proud of that the the free big it has done over the last couple weeks that people might wanna go. Take a look at its a great question, an whenever you know the beacon we really devoted herself to covering this. Attempted boycott of Facebook and I'm proud of a peace via by former commentary writer along a good men who noted that these companies that are boycotting Facebook because of professed hate speech, continue to market on russian social media platforms forward parameters and my a you know: the goal in doing that is really show how insincere
these companies are that they view this, adding ultimately as away do inoculate themselves from criticism, and they don't have any real convictions about about hate speech and also in other singing of wise. We had yesterday one of his dark with in saying that. Actually We didn't pull tat. I may add from Facebook forces to spend more money on advertising it SAM. You know it's inefficient and but we Don't look at the November elections. You just give the gave the game away that this is about the election in November, an attempt to put pressure on the president and get him out of office and to create some backlash against a platform. Then I think a lot of Democrats view as a contributor to his re election,
and I am also proud about an editorial that we did on the radio and the disgrace of its partnership without sharp in on the Spaceboat campaign. So I think I want people to those things that was greater than that editorial, which pointed out that you have this sum: jewish shut. That own does not the right word, but jewish managed cut right, accompany managed by by bark sucker, Berger, a Jew and Charles Sandberg Adieu and eighty I'll partners with Al Sharp one of the most notorious a leader of a up of a servant, implicit supporter. Programmes in the early nineties and a leader of a boycott of age, Sean Business in Harlem indictment before that led to a fire bombing in which seven people were killed and this soon Jonathan Green Black of of Adsl seeks to partner with in a
idiotic war against Mark Zuckerberg. There are many problems with Facebook. We ve actually published a big piece by Christine Rosen about what's wrong with Facebook and what should happen to Facebook in the future. But there is a delusional fantasy. In my view that in our Facebook through king bridge gonna. Let all this elected Trump and fundamental let's not just that. It provides this ridiculous excuse for Democrats to explain. Why was that there were? candidate in american history lost an election. She should have one but also gave the gives unwarranted status to the Trump campaign and its people and to Brad parts
in particular the digital manager of the Trump twenty. Sixteen campaign was now the chairman of the Trump campaign and twenty twenty and is obviously awful at his job he's terrible he's the one who was planning the rallies he's the one who can't filled the stadiums, he's the one who falls fur tik, Tok team Korea saying that they all want to come to two outcome: two o clock, but go to a Trump rally areas it out. We did not even have GEO location technologies figure where these signs are coming from up. He lies trump about his own polling, so he'll, look better and add so Trump also believes drank the
who played about how Facebook got him elected and Soda Jared Cushion are obviously and their there. They are having Gavin handed over their campaign to a guy who believes his own propaganda and therefore is you know, miss half thing mishandling this re election effort like Things have been mishandled, I mean maybe again, maybe I'll, be very embarrassed in November when, when when Truman, feeds doing, but I don't think that's the case. So is there anything else we need to weigh so we attacked, I, I sort of attacked a blog. So that's that's important. I'm an owl tack! Em just write off. Can I just point out that is our friend cow, my markets points out and. Ike that story about allay. They did a survey of parents about what kind of schooling may with
one in New York in the fall and they conveniently left off go back to school. Full time that was not a choice that parents were two select in the survey. So that's that's! That's that's where that goes. The only hope for your kids now is that Andrew Como psychotic loathing of build the plaza, led him to overrule the blue as it announcement. The kids will not be going back to school, accept part time just screw with the block. Yeah you damn condemn violence, I'll be ok, I gotta go. I want to conclude with discos we talked about this yesterday, but as a guest. I think it's variable, as you watch cancel culture as he watched the the the radicals eat. The liberals, as you watch met again.
CS getting attack by his own fellow staffers for making them unsafe for signing a letter with NOME Chomsky. That says you know what free expression is pretty good. Are you, horrified or you enjoying it immensely off off, and I think me inevitably, with these sorts of movements, there is overrated and I think that is happening now, but I also think- and- and I hear this from young people- I interview which is really striking to me- you know when I started in conservative journalism ten years ago, whatever my the goal was to end up in the mainstream. That was success. When I talk to twenty four and twenty five year old kid
Now that is no longer their aspiration. They don't believe that there's a place for them in the mainstream, and that's really suggests to me that these institutions are destroying themselves from within and we're gonna end up with the left media right media. I dont believe the mainstream is viewed as down the middle. I more repulsive very interesting point in your own career. I think speaks to this right. I mean you when you were in the mainstream and you decided to serve, go Why, in the world of more conservative worthy illogical journalism up, then I think you did so out of a very firm propitious moment. It was our luck. The good timing was left, but I did see this happening and thank you now not really would have been a place for me there. But what I'm most struck by is these twenty four and twenty five year old, Hugh
haven't yet jumped to the mainstream, whose career goal is no longer to end up at the New York Times or the Washington Post. You you know it's interesting about this- is that the difference between the left and right to media that were true ending up with it at the conservative media. Recognise that this is the conservative media. The left me I still think of it as the mainstream. Well, I'm not so sure about that. That's I think. What's interesting, you describe this pattern that you know what you wanted was to be in the big time right, that's serve ambitious people, don't wanna be off on the side. They want to be in the mix in the most prestigious place, which often means that they would make them less money. They could make In their profession and gonna, get famous and all that six,
seven years ago as the digital market began overtaking leap, print market and as digital Spare began seeming like a kind of talisman It would come out of the digital world that you knew how to set up an rss feed and end and have a bad man. Does in your own website, and then you know, do great Essie, oh by yourself, and all this that these places the times opposed others hired people, young people, twenty three, twenty four twenty five years old, whose life ambition was never to go, work at the New York Times or the Washington Post. They never read the New York Times over. They didn't grow up with this see now the attitude that job. Abrams and famously said what did she say, but the New York Times that it was like it was the religion in her household. Did your times was the God head?
Jill Abrams since household in queens when she was growing up. These are people never read the times. I met rhetoric, but these are people who never read the times and then they go to the times and what did they do like they're, not afraid there? Not it's not like Oh my god, I can attack the executive editor like how will I end up getting a position in the London Bureau, because that's what I always have to go to them London bureau. In order to go to this and then you come back and you can work in Washington and then become an editor and then maybe you can end up. As you know, you know, as a as a Top editor at the paper and a real power at the paper, but if that was never your ambition, we can getting, and I think this is the sort of institutional decline that we're seeing all across the country and in lots of institutions, which is that these institutions are because their leaders dont exert a lot of power Dave given
I think what they used to do, which was to shape people. You knew all within writes about this compellingly in his new book, but yes, musical, the times and want to rise within it and be shaped by its more is by it, because because colleges are also crumbling, they no longer pretty. People believe that they should be shaped by these institutions want to be served by the right solutions are made that point of the. U no part of the ultimate thing is young people who were savvy about what their lives should be like wants to learn how to function inside the worlds in which they think that they can make a difference. Orb were plough
a fertile fields or something like that and you dont come to that fully formed. You can't you can't know you know a particularly in journalism. For example, you know I was never a local reporter I never you know I never had a job where I had to go. Do you know like climbed through a window together, Phonograph like Russell Baker, talks about like a dead kid you know or serve dude cops or anything like that, and I am not have I'm not a good reporter as a result, because reporting is not. You know something that you springs from Zeus's head like Athena. It is up.
It is a laborious skill that you learn over time. You get more comfortable with you learn skills. You learn how to talk to people. You learn how to Ex Esq extract information from people, and it takes time we use the phone which kids today right here there no phone have yeah yeah yeah or you hang out at a bar where the cops hang out and you buy them drinks and you get them to talk to you or whatever you do. I mean there's a whole history of learning, skills, communication skills and writing seals, and all this and no and people are No longer don't longer. Look at that as something valuable, which is one of the reasons outlined on it there's a very weird thing in the times today that I understand what I think is a sorry that suggest every problem with content.
Pray american journalism there's a story about a case in Missouri where man is arrested because he hit a twelve year old kid on the street for and on unwarranted reason So the story is the kid who is an african american kid was wrapping with a guy who was either taking a video recording him wrapping. It was before midnight on street and Saint Louis, and this guy gets out of his car walks over the kitten punches em in the head that gets back in the car and drives off and they arrested the guy. So that's the entirety of the story, tat. Nobody knows what who that so, I'm trying to figure out. Why is the story in the New York Times AIDS, a local?
it's a story in a city, one thousand five hundred, but whatever it is one thousand miles from New York. It's one kid one thing: it's! You know it's kind of horrible to think of a kid getting punched in the head by girl gets out of a car, and then I'm like what. Why was a reporter on this? What's going on here? I think the story is that they probably thought that the guy who punched the kid was white and the kid is black, except the guy who punched him. It turns out, black, but the reporter was on the story for a day or two. They rested the guy. They had to do a story. The story has no literally, there is no reason
to read the story, so you have to go back and try to figure out what the idiot logical angle was that had the New York Times assign a reported, a cover story like this when, in its own city, terrible things are happening to kids every single day and they are not assigning reporters to them. That's a the New York Times. Doesn't these recording reporting a story about a single kid in in Saint Louis? That has no larger significance, so you gotta figure out what the significance is and you go back, and you know that what I'm saying is probably true that they thought there was a racial element to the to the case that there is not the guy's crazy or ignore the kid or he was annoyed by the Song
or he was high as a kite right, I mean what what are the other choices in everything it at the significance of the Washington Post report on some random woman's hallowing costume. Of course, I know that you know that I forgot. The significance was the date that the post was covering itself right from the charge that it did not sufficiently investigate the evil Halloween Party thrown by its cartoonist Tom tolls. Someone gets in touch of them, said Tom tells at a party at which a woman came in black face and Tom tools like it wasn't me it wasn't me it was this other. This woman, I don't even lower than he wouldn't say who she was because he realized he was gonna, ruin or life that he had to say because as bosses insisted on it, they namer she's fired these two women get a glamorous pose shot in the washing
imposed after having abuse ter at the party. Yelled screamed at her got incredibly nasty with her and she ran away and was in therapy for two years for having tried to make fun of Megan Kelly, and that's why the posted it but there is no new significant garbage celery by institution, but there was no that's why so I say you have to like double back and trying to figure out what purpose of the story was. Why was it assigned? You know why? Why did it happen? There's also when just taking me talk about how you know that the work that that that the willingness to do the work and to be shaped by an institution to be a reporter. Not only was there a willingness to do that at one point, but the whole idea of being a reply. There was a romance in a sexiness too, if that, without with that was that was the sort of romantic position to bid to have in the media and that's gone, it's all
It is now about slinging your opinion. That is the bad as these sexy position now. Ok. Well, so I think we have reached the end of this totally rambling, an incoherent scouts it by thank Pollyanna thanks so much for joining us for the second time. Thank you got a lot of fun For the absent Christine and Noah, and for a green while them John pot hordes keep the camel burnt.
Transcript generated on 2020-08-02.