On today's podcast: What happened in the Bill Cosby case? How best can we discuss the extraordinary life of Donald Rumsfeld, RIP? What is ballot harvesting? Will people believe elections are fair ever again? Give a listen.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Welcome to the Commentary Magazine Daily podcast today, is Thursday July. First, twenty twenty one- I am John POD words the editor. Commentary magazine with me, as always senior writer Christine rose high Christine again. executive, whether a grim all job,
and associate editor nor Rockland High Noah hijack. So I want to start to out just talking briefly about the bill cause be case and the fact that the Pennsylvania Supreme Court has ruled that he has conviction was vacated and he is not. There is no possibility of retrying him on the charges for which he was convicted, and it's a very interesting case is, of course, if you presume that the facts, the facts or not in dispute that he drugged and drugged women and then slept with them against their will, thereby raping them. Ah, you then have to get to the question of why this decision, and if you read the decision, it's very.
I don't know describe it very definitive that the case should never have been brought in its some important. To look at this and not say well, this is just another case in which women are being listen to words. You now add judicial, some kind of weird judicial overreach, or something like that. This, the facts of the case which are interesting, are that the district attorney in Montgomery County Pennsylvania determine that he could not he. It was unlikely to impossible that he could secure conviction of Cosby on criminal charges in two thousand and five or two thousand and six with his accuser, Andrea cost, stand so he made a deal, the purpose of which was to compel Cosby to testify in.
In her civil law suit and other civil lawsuits that, since he said, you will never be prosecuted for this crime. Cosby had no right to set to take the fifth amendment when he was deposed in the civil law suits, because he was shielded from criminal prosecution and then, after other publicity in the case came and therefore since women came out in all of that. One of the this district attorney successors, as this would attorney. Basically, several that deal doesn't apply to me and use the information from the civil. The debt depositions caused these own testimony in the civil depositions he had given women quality, given them benadryl in particular, who in diet and convict him on these criminal charges and the what the with the Supreme Court set is
He was an ass and denied his fifth amendment right against self incrimination, because no no personal ever have. He would have taken the fifth in the civil depositions and only did I do so because he, have no legal right to do so, having been shielded from criminal prosecution, and when I use here that a red that, despite all the controversies and everything you can, I have to say to yourself that this is it. This is a judgment that has quality of the kind of thing you want. You want judges to To do when they are asked to decide these kinds of cases, because it's not that this could happen to anybody, but it could kind of happen to anybody in a in a in a weird sense. In other words, use this thing.
Happen- and you are- you are given to stand that you have no recourse but to do acts as long as wise and can happen to you, and then why happens to you, because you did acts an end so that that could apply in almost any case, particularly when it comes to constitutional rights, and so while it is a tragic day for the and though he did serve two years in prison by the way, so it's not as though, if you were looking in saying he got away Scot Free, he didn't get away. Scot free did serve two years in prison while he was awaiting this appeal, but that's my take anybody wanna contradict me. Why does not challenging interpretation? I agree with it by in its worth, emphasising that prosecutors often make
deals with people who have broken the law and on terrible things in order to get a bigger fish with they did this in drug cases all the time, for example, and then those deals actually need to mean something even if a new attorney general comes in I ask you to come, then you need it. The people who make those deals need to respect them. Even if a player, change, so I mean I built. Cosby is horrible, rapist and horrible human being, I will say that the praise he got when when the decision was made from Felicia were shot his his former MRS Kauppi, who played MRS Cosby in his. in his eyes come was a little jarring. Considering she's, the she's been recently named it to a very big position: how, university here in DC, so that was jarring like I don't think we need to talk about how the whole all of that
just a rate against him, or some sort of great injustice, because its clear that that this man was a predator, but I agree with you John. I think it's actually shows that there is some integrity in the system when judges uphold these deals, even if they did us lead to someone like because believing prison. It also shows, though this leads back to our conversation yesterday. This again showing incompetence on the part of the prosecutor first place, who got it wrong. Right is sort of exactly of the class. The weird were discussing you do you know Well, I'm not sure about that. As the question is, what was what were his motivations? Where was the motivation to eat? I wanted to do something competent are worth was motivation to be the prosecutor in a morally righteous enormously famous case involving one of the most successful
entertainers in the history of the United States what do they would get overturned the known well. Well, I mean it took you took a long time for it to get overturned and, generally speaking, I think that despite Felicia Shots, we're defence- or you know, celebre should have his of Cosby release. I think the general idea is that the terrible injustice has been done to the victims, which would mean that the prosecutor did bring the case had done justice to the victims and this, and so therefore he remains at least you know on the Thus, on the plus side of the ledger, ordinarily, you would say it's a terribly embarrassing to be a prosecutor whose most famous and most high profile cases thrown out as as them. As again as definitively as this case was thrown out, but on the other hand, this was you know the greatest me to moment right that serve the that that in
are steam conviction. And so he may not be feeling the same way as you do that, in our view He did something noble you know and that debts assist judicial activism better. You know that caused this now very easy them to see. However, what people are going to say, I think well, what people are saying is. Is this is happening because past these russian famous? That's that's that's right and the social media? Now what you know there's a sense in which that is that has some lenity to it, because I'm It knows how much money he has spent over the course of this appeal right. Remittances are probably two years full time. You know alone,
illegal effort. You know thousands and thousands of ours, of of law, of lawyers, time that must have cost. His too must have cost him milieu upon millions of dollars and other people, just don't have those. Resources Of course, you could also that make the claim, if I'm right about this, that that that, if the pencil these records writin says the case should never been brought then it was only broad because he was rich and famous, not that he got off cause. He was rich and famous, but it was you know it with a case of everyone brought because it was because of his wealth and fame and the does anything. idea that that that tat whatever other anyway, it's a it's. It's it's a complicated things. Nobody wants to defend Bill Cosby, but you know the the
Nobody likes the fifth amendment ever everybody hates the fifth amendment, which is why it is so necessary rights are one of the most necessary things in the constitutional. Indeed, him at all levels. besides her what, among other things it prevents it. It prevents torture, writer minutes away of its a way of making sure that torture doesn't doesn't happen in order to coerce confessions, because the ideas Confessions are often Emmy. I'm a lot of the cake, high profile cases where there are big, hey, you know things or vacated like the central park. Five involve confer shows that are then determined to have been co worst, also kind of an interesting postscript to some of the meat to moment discussions we have had over the last year or so there. It's a reminder. I don't know whether you call it a good one or a bad one.
But you know moments of cultural reckoning, don't always lead to dramatic legal and policy changes. Rights are there, so there are a lot of the people who will be seen cases not just the people I built Cosby who get off. The out prison, but we'll see cases where men who were falsely accused are wrongly accuser or whose Rep, decisions were damage will soon when there's some of those cases working their way through the course of the so this, cultural reckoning moment of me to is having long term, sometimes unintended consequences when, when it works its way through the legal system this will to follow up on some of these cases, disorder measure and assess how much of the demand for change was actually met and how much of it was just more. You know a kind of reaction that that is the spotlight can, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's gonna change. The issue- and I am this- is one of those cases. I think that has a kind of leaves people feeling the limb Did you ask about the power of the movement right? Ok,
to move on from this, to something more ability say elegiac Donald Rumsfeld died yesterday at the age of. of eighty eight and if you read the if you ray. Acquaint yourself with with with rum, is life story. it's one of those questions about whether we will see has like again now there are liberals and you know, the anti war, people and stuff like that who want to sail. We shouldn't seem like again because he was so months- is so terrible because of Iraq and Abu Ghraib, and all this all that but story of Donald Rumsfeld is that he is a guy who
In between, in our except for a brief period of relatively a course of life, referring time in the private sector, a dedicated his life to his in service to his country, both as as as a as a soldier as an elected politician, then as a staffer, and with a just an astonishing resume like there's, there's almost nothing like it in the annals of american history. He was you know he. He ran this equal opportunity programme in the White House under Nixon? He became ambassador to NATO. He then was at the age of in his thirties. Was the youngest chief of staff to President when president for it made it was chief of staff, then present afford made him second,
very of defence, then Ronald, Reagan than when it's private sector than Ronald Reagan asked him to be while Reagan's Middle EAST on voice and then, of course, he he ended up as as George W Bushes Secretary events for a second go round and found himself in a very interesting position, which is that he was you know he was in his seventies and he was determined to not to serve like maintain the status quo but to abandon and to revolutionize the Pentagon to get it out of its own, hi ways make it swifter, faster, more tactical and and Sophie, a change agent at the top of the food chain in a very
forcing way in his efforts to modernize and revolution has been. The gun were then interrupted by nine eleven and everything that happened subsequent to that but that was his passion that was his. His idea was that we needed change how Americans fought wars, and we did both in part under his to religion in part because of the ways worse had to be conducted in Afghanistan and Iraq and at one of the gravest or most interesting injustices done to him. Is this idea that he was this you monster? who created the inhumane conditions in all this, and based on almost everything that we know Rumsfeld was not a cheer leader or, at least brave or an emotional leader com
thing for us to invade and take a rock like that, actually wasn't, there were people under my Polwarth Woods, supported that he was much more interested in this modernization programme and, and it was frustrating according to Bob Woodward's. Accounts of of bushes were fighting, which of course, came directly from the mouths of like Colin Powell, who is just like emptying his. it was as filling Woodward's out books. You know who's like rose homo, say anything Rumsfeld doesn't won't. Take it won't, take a stand. He doesn't have an opinion about this. He would present Bush with negativism positives with good things and back. Things all the while saying. If we're going to do this will do it as well as we can and all that, but but but.
this was in a weird way. It was not his war and it became his war cuz. He was secretary of defense, but it wasn't the thing you know he wasn't like. You know some kind of idiot, logically driven you know the doktor Strangelove wanting to you now wanting to have the United States take over the Middle EAST, but he did his duty. That was what the president decided to do when he was going to fight the war as best could and administer war ass best? He could under under increasingly difficult circumstances and complicated circumstances like the fact that, because Turkey denied us the right to move the the move army divisions down from the north that created the can Sean's, under which much of the iraqi Army could slip away, and
and was not defeated but but slunk away and then joined the joined. The resistance forces, there's nothing. He could do about that. That was a geopolitical circumstance and they fought the war as best. They could and I'm just saying that in his life he he was a profoundly selfless. He did not seek. Many briefly ran from in nineteen, eighty or ninety eight, but he was not. He did not seek the spot that wasn't what he was about it's an interesting model, because I just don't know that we know he wasn't it. For the furtherance of his own glory. He wasn't actually there to create power that wasn't his that wasn't what he was about
and so I dont know that dumb people like that really exist that much anymore, I don't know, does anybody I'm sure you do, but he wouldn't they do that. You wouldn't know about them. You wouldn't hear about focusing on making many acts of themselves and landing on the front page which still awake at attention these days. For me, you know very well. I was quite young stone college after nine eleven which career trajectory that landed here. Don't Russia was an immensely comforting presence of profoundly competent presence and the Pentagon at a time when all eyes are on the Pentagon and the execution of the invasion of that understand very small footprint, coordinating with the with the rebel groups that the northern alliance was a tremendous strategic feet,
Major combat operations were over by the end of two thousand to that was not something that anybody predicted would occur we talk about Afghanistan, allocates this ongoing horrific tragedy. They may be on that, but are pretty well elaborated on. I don't have any an unadulterated thoughts are unspoken thoughts on Afghanistan unless we look at this a lot of hindsight at the time. This was a profound victory and one that was so that was I welcome, in my view, and even during the Iraq war, run two thousand flourish when things get really Harry in Hamburg, He was nevertheless of much more capable competent presence on the stage talking about these issues in my view, even the President, the United States, at the time showing his national security adviser, certainly not a secretary of state. I took my keys
from Donald Rumsfeld and he fell on his sword in two thousand sex. In my view, perhaps a little unduly. He was sort of sacrificed as a result of the in November. Two thousand six elections maybe there was no other alternative, no recourse, and certainly the the search that we pursued afterwards was an effective political, but his reputation was pretty well tarnished. Among Republicans by that point, in a way the pit- it has never recovered from, and it was something of an injustice. In my view, he was I you know just in the broadest sense. He was a serious person in the halls of power in a way that you haven't really seen in depth. At this point, in you know at least there is no longer. You know it's at a time when it is now suspend this parade of sort of second rates to two clowns
and there is just no reason to have any faith in so much of of what you hear about very serious and complicated details of state craft. I think in just in that very basic sense. I fear we won't see his life again but, in my view, be met. Not Lattimer has an interesting, impetuous area about him. Political, that's worth reading Canada. Talking about what you mention, John, that he not sing it. again mean someone who, basically is no said, felony Odin and resigned, but never complained about it. Didn't didn't score settled
He wasn't an idea log in the way that we think about the logs and how they behave today and whatever his views, his personal private views about either how he was treated or what he was told to do. He kept those largely to himself when he was performing his duty and he didn't have contempt for the little guy. That's over friend who worked in those working the Pentagon for a long time that the respect that Rumsfeld showed not just his peers and superiors, but his subordinates, and that's also something in Washington. It sounds like it. It should be a no brainer and it is for most decent people that in Washington DC, it's always worth noting in praising someone in power who believes that way, because they are too few and far between our maybe he did not suffer fools gladly. Yes, he was very curious about the fools that he did not suffer, weren't the secretaries or the little. They were
the mid level and high level bureaucrats. The mediocrity is who rose above their station and then were faced with this incredibly difficult set of challenges and in his view, the Santer now, of course, about the bush. Unless the Bush administration, in his view, kind of just thought they could skate by or they could serve use the same. You know the same old way of doing things and he complained in that the Pentagon that people talked in garb. They known garbled jargon. That was that that that was intended to make them look good and expert, and confuse anybody to listen to them. They couldn't think clearly they didn't speak clearly, they didn't offer advice and direction. Clearly and again, I think the end it wasn't just into doesn't sexually fell on a sword.
when the Abu Ghraib scandal head- and it turned out that there was this nighttime shift at the prison that was abusing these prisoners- he offered to resign. There, of course, testified before Congress famously about it, and he this was maybe five levels below his station, this was a this. Was that an employment issue acts in Iraq at a place in Iraq, where prisoners were kept. and he accepted responsibility for it. I mean he said I don't you know. He said he what he would have he would have accepted it. Had Bush accepted his offer to resign on the grounds that that, if that was what it would take to restore american confidence or to make sure
somebody took responsibility for egregious behaviour. He was willing to be the one to take their responsibility, and Bush said now that it was not it was. It was inappropriate wrong too, to check, switch horses in midstream, strictly in an election year and all that's also part of the kind of honour that he brought to the job, and I think, ultimately, the honour that he brought to the job as it wasn't just that he oh it was that he he didn't come out and say I never wanted this war. I that's not what I wanted, or I wanted to go into the caves of Tor Bora, but the joint chiefs stop me to get been Lawton, but the joint she stopped me. He didn't do that and he could have, because I think it was mostly true. Ok, let's pull back from from these sum up
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into this is regarding Arizona, distant areas on his voting rights, love, Arizona, precluded by statute are prescribed by statute. The proud the press practice of ballot harvesting. The supreme Court ruled in six three decision, partisan decision that this did not violate the voting rights the intent of the law when it was past was not too disenfranchise long. Racial lines are along ethnic lines. It was simply to prescribe this practice sounds to me like rather just ruling, because this was a practice that Republicans in the railing against for quite some time. But Democrats too, do you remember, a very famous race in North Carolina night, ninth congressional district in twenty eighteen Where republican operative. I was indicted for Miss
gambling absentee ballots. Valid harvesting allows you to give your ballot absentee ballot to a third party who was submitted on your behalf to an election commission This ended up overturning the selection. We talk a lot about confidence in elections and the competence of the people who administer them, and this is one of those practices that The complicated says, easily manipulated and has the prospect of allowing for fraud that undermines confidence in these elections. It seems to me, like it's a practice that doesn't need to exist Very much like you don't really need to have the days of absentee voting, no one's disenfranchised if you have thirty Is it absent voting is one of these things where democratic convince themselves that all the all everything in any that allows you to about access to a ballot whenever you want one went out we want one is necessary and vital and they offer
The arguments that they made again spell harvesting this morning when this ruling came out, so it strikes me as just a purely reflexive partisan, knee jerk response the conservative majority here, but it also seems to me like a pretty valid decision, a good decision that ultimately benefit not just Republicans and anybody who is interested in the fair and free conduct of elections, but democratic it. It might also be serve. I assume is a little bit in it reviewers nor a warning for Attorney General Merrick Garland, whose file this lawsuit against state of Georgia for similar sort of a king our claims about violations. based on race about Georgia's election laws that obviously just starting, but it doesnt bode well if it gets, if that makes its way through the law courts an end to the high court. Given this ruling and that lobbied by the way it is kind of
Ridiculously bad, I'm not I'm not a lawyer, but even I read it and thought what this is really not ever persuasive argument that the department justice is making year. Mainly the central attention of the majority opinion from I can tell is that if the law was not passed, for the purpose of discriminating racially. You cannot say you cannot attack on the grounds that it discriminates. Racially that has to be a conscious and deliberate voice that you are changing the voting rules in order to limit the franchise in a way that that uniquely harms
minorities earn the scale whether this is actually be. No african Americans, specifically ballot harvesting as a trick. One of the reasons that this is an interesting case is that what happened in twenty a team was the California past affirmatively passed a ballot harvesting law allowing people to collect ballots from you know from third parties and and and the Democratic Party was prepared for this, and the Republican Party wasn't and in congressional actions. They, they ran the table in California through ballot harvesting. They got hundreds of thousands of boats into system by saying not a wild outcome, pick him up and take them and bring them to the to the poles? Who are you
as evidenced by the way by the the results of the twenty twenty elections, where in twenty eighteen Republicans, were wiped out of their ancestral homeland of Orange County and subsequently return to power in substantial numbers in twenty twenty and race, when the top of it lost by significant margins, and why did that happened in twenty twenty? Because the Republicans were prepared like you, could only its Thee analogy? We use often it's the bug supported by the indefinite cartoon. You know that that that Daphne, that wins, the contest for applause in the theater. By swallowing the dynamite blowing himself up and then bugs, but he says Daphne love you they're screaming for more, and he says I can only do it once you can only do it once you can only pull a fast one and then it's like Oh I'm, not at the wool pulled over my eyes again, I'm also
blue ballot harvesting, you do it, I do it it's neutralised, so the funny part is that yes, so now there is that I think there is a logistical and practical problem with ballot harvesting, which is that it it does make possible much more possible for there to be voter fraud. Obviously, since somewhat someone who was not an official vote counter. Is it not
member of the postal service or something like that is collecting ballots and bring them to another place, and so you can take it empty ballot you could take about from somebody executed. You could stuff the ballot box that way, I don't know what controls they have over this. I'm sure there are some, but you can see why it's a problem and if it were, if it weren't it part of the thing here is increased our. What word about this for commentary and his really brilliant essay about Republicans. Fearing voter turn out. That Democrats believe, I think, somewhat falsely that anything that allows for more voting will help them and Republicans now have come to believe in part because of the democratic belief that that that things that restrict Boating
help them, and there is almost no evidence to support this contention because part of the evidence is something like this ballot harvesting case or the case in California, and if Republicans in the river the Cavalry Republican Party hadn't been morons and these campaigns, don't be stupid and have been paying attention. They What do you know when they heard the right consultants who weren't, who like came from California, to what they were doing? They would have said? Oh, my god, you know there's ballot harvesting. Now we should probably be doing this, but they did it, and so you know Everywhere because saying that their own interests, with a little off topic at someone can gentle but its related ends or audience needs. An update on this issue is related voting really. Developing New York City John, you pretty yesterday- that there would be no known to recount. We were. We wouldn't get your numbers. We did with a new numbers from the Board of elections yesterday afternoon rubber,
I said we have like a hundred and how about how? Many was a hundred thirty five thousand. Let me five thousand and thirty. Five thousand dummy ballots in new to re, run the numbers and it, and they came up with precisely the same result that they had to. the decimal point. The same result that they had previously and everybody said was, did make a lot of sense and was probably kind of lot right. Well beyond your thoughts, thoughts on that one. I honestly I it make any sense out of this. I'm an I said yes, for I thought that they might have to re run the election, because I was an entirely sure how they were going to segregate the dummy bow What's the hundreds art from the from the other ballots, like the dummy ballots, constituted something like one hundred and sixty or one slash five of the number of of ballots altogether. So how are they gonna and how are they because what the alacrity, but they did it,
the least low institution, my dollar. Suddenly they just remedy, This problem over the course of twelve hours they weren't overnight, they're going on vacation yeah. I don't know, I don't trust it, and you know it at the very least in terms of making sure that you know something. untoward, isn't going on here. There is a candidate and Eric Adams, whose future is now at stake here by this incredible surge in in in the in the rank choice, voting numbers for for his rival Catherine Garcia. he has no reason to leave this enough to leave us alone like what we will see. What's gonna happen once the absently Balance are counted their hundred twenty five thousand lamps T ballots. She Mr Wynn, I think about two thirds of them in order to overtake him. If my counting, it is right, she needs at their Twenty five thousand ballots out shades to have a she needs.
Eighteen thousand more than he does so. That means that she needs, like I sixty five thousand two, fifty thousand something like that, which is a pretty soon damsel Margin and so she needs two thirds of them or whatever. I can quite figure out what the numbers are and and he's not gonna, just take it lying down. If they say I will she she's one. You know she's now emulation him nor a she. If he would mean that right, that's the problem with the with the massive screw up right now it rights it leaves room for everyone to tat lives. There are two points I was listening to. The took to our friend Chris STAR walked on the dispatch, podcast with them with another friend of mine, a Stoddard, an end
it was a very cheerful up, beat Pepe kind of guy turned and and of course, with somebody who said like Republic in this peace for us and Republican shouldn't fear voter turn out that fine. He he said you know we are. There is a not inconsiderable chance that the twenty twenty four national election- I will fail that there's gotta be so much so many counter pressure, so many so much paranoia on the part of both parties about the miss behaviour, tricks contacts and in our behaviors of other parties, and that some of these new laws coming into place and whatever happens that you could have a result in in a presidential election,
That really is genuinely in truly is not acceptable to anybody or or that the result is not definitive enough to say. Ok, this party won this party lost it's not like, because the hanging Chad's in the Supreme Court or it's not because of the problems in the electoral college or it's not because a false claims of election fraud it's going to be a kind of combination of eighteen, different things, and you really could have people who genuinely and legitimately, do not believe even legitimately, but do not believe that the result of the twenty twenty four election. is certify able. You'll have fights
or whether or not a lecture should be seated. You'll have faithless little have all of this, and you know Chris said again in them in an interesting and uncharacteristic tone. that once that happens, word nearing the end of the american experiment like if you cannot really not until eighteen, seventy six in which intellectually united States. Maybe two thousand, you can say the same, but its trickier. One election in eighteen, seventy six there were hiding some hanky panky that led to the the some who should not have become president becoming president because a political background, deals that then led to the writing of all kinds of weird and incomprehensible laws to ensure that that never happen again, and so this is worrisome like you know, you keep this, keep the
keeps happening if, like every year, there is gonna be or every six months there is gonna, be election that is called into question and they're gonna be state legislatures, either. Writing these restrictive laws or writing insanely a restrictive laws to counteract the restrictive laws written by Republicans Where is that going to leave us? I mean I tend not to be kind of like a like a diamond Bloom guy, but that that struck me as some as a as a scenario that one should serve take seriously now and add to that the deed likely knew the preview we gotta, how platforms that from whence everybody gets, their news and all their information, preemptively censoring certain arguments about certain elections or preemptively declaring off limits any discussion of something a candidate said or deeply forming a particular candidate or particular, but I mean that that adds to the sense of chaos which,
think then fuels conspiracy theories and fuels anxiety and fuels. The mistrust that that we saw that we ve seen quite a better than the last four years the borders, is of course, I'll go ahead in the universe. Is the promised, compounded by the fact that any attempt at a remedy what has to come necessarily from within the system that people don't trust. You. I'm so they answered. The key thing here is that I think Trump legitimately sewed mistrust was illegitimate, The work has been stolen in the past. Tense has no right. Fair enough is contained today, though, illegitimate this mistrust, mistrust
in the New York City election. The primary election here is the correct posture. Mistrust of you know of of simple political competence, which is what a you know talked about before in the cosmic case that some political, but whatever is the right response to a lot of things that that that they go on. So where does that leave said leaves us have a very weird position, which is that maybe we should be mistrustful of these elections, and suddenly you know it's like the honor system. We, I agree to accept these things and what happened
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but no hidden fees cancel anytime. You didn't start your business because you wanted to spend time on hr compliance. Let Bambi help get your free it or other. Today, gotta, Babby, Thou com, slash commentary right now to schedule your free h, our audit, that's Bambi, Thou coms, less commentary skews me spell Ba em to the bp dot com, slash commentary. I guess one Ass quick point to make there is a very interesting pew, has done a study of what they call validated voters, so they ve they ve gone back and try to track people who voted in twenty. Sixteen who didn't voting twenty sixteen and who voted on twenty eight June and didn't and who voted in twenty twenty in didn't, want twenty twenty and it appears clear that the voters who didn't vote
two thousand and sixteen made the difference in twenty eighteen coming out and voting for Biden and those voters. Voting for Democrats and those voters showed up again in twenty twenty voting. I think it's three hundred and sixty two two slash three for Biden and that that that is how Biden want that Biden won, because that two thousand and eighteen turnout was in fact predict of a surge in interest. Among you know, Democrats are Auntie Trump or whatever it is that carried over to twenty twenty and made made the real difference. The democratic party did, in response to Trump expand out reach and only in the hispanic community. According to this pole did trump do do the same or this study whenever you want to call it other jump, also narrowed the gender gap. Interesting.
It shows that more trump made some gains among women between twenty sixteen and twenty twenty, but Biden gained those suburban voters their parsing. A lot of the pew verified voters of his interesting, because you see even among the his, hispanic voters were trunk you'd better and- and I think much must. The shock of a lot of Democrats did better than Edna. He had previously there's a big difference between college educated in Non College, educated, hispanic voters and and islands. Not doing you know you did pretty well with non college. to get it white voters, but non white, Non College, educated borders or group the buttons really not speaking too. That's also the group that recently elected alot of whom elected atoms, and you are right there is a group of what Democrats have long considered a core constituency for them who aren't voting down
practically loyally on every ticket. I think that's the group. That's a group! There is a need to wash certainly for the mid terms in and going forward for twenty twenty four, which speaks of this question shows that a democratically viewing everything through the Prism of Race classical Democrats. Have you things through the Prism of Class are left to severe things through the Prism of Class and they are now viewing things through the prism of race and identity, and all of these results suggests. The class is the tell that people want to say that an educated white twitter for Trump for racial reasons, but if, but, if less educated, white, less educated Hispanics unless educated black, Our voting for trump and higher numbers are deal you know are like our are more open. More interested in this message in these messages
then class trumps race and then that identity terrorism is a is a bad bargain. For Democrats. They made it maybe inescapable. That's now become part of their cultural dna, but they may not be able But I ve made it may in out if these, if these positions hardened If Democrats continue to fight a culture war that there's no relation or has no no plays no roll in the lives of these people- and this is their focus and maybe even offensive to them, particularly on gender and trans issues and stuff like that, then- they are good. Oh there, their understanding of the electorate is is is getting increasingly poison. Well, you ve won these two elections. I mean it's toxic, as you said, is positive, because I think it really does have the potential for toxicity for them and you get. You can see glimmers of that
I didn't binding bungling over the Word latin expert, insisting on using it- and you know. On this idea that what they are telling their own can stood. Historical constituencies but if you don't embrace all of the identity and politics and racial politics, that we do your suffering from false consciousness. Right I mean if you, if, how dare I his panic person vote for Trump? He wanted to build a wall like that's literally, that that the extent of their argument, your input, you're you're, suggesting that these people can't think for themselves and decide for themselves. That's condescending, that's suggesting false consciousness, and that does encourage a backlash. Among those words, what it's you know, it's telling people what they should care about, which is which is a fatal mistake, a thing for a political party
as a fatal mistake for everything, but this pawkins love to tell you. What would you would you should think about, and we will do it do so again tomorrow about we're done for today, Sulphur Christine EVA, no I'm jump on words, keep the camel burning Yeah.
Transcript generated on 2021-07-26.