With the good news about the vaccine, the question that faces us (and the podcast crew today) is how will the politicians who have exercised such extraordinary powers over the past year behave now that they should no longer be used or necessary? Once they've tasted the sweet ambrosia of control, can they give it up? And hey, notice that Biden now has "kids in cages" too? Give a listen.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Welcome to the Commentary Magazine Daily Podcast today's Wednesday February, twenty fourth, twenty twenty one, I'm John Upwards, the editor of Commentary magazine with me as always: executive, editor, a green waldheim hygiene, Senor, request rose high, Christine I John and Associate, If editor, nor Rossman High Noah our Noah. The news is that the march
flying off the shelves. It s you so much people. We had such a fantastic response yesterday, to the first day of the sales of our t, shirts and sweatshirt, and toad bag. At merge, Dots Commentary magazine that com I'm coming over, welcomed but keep it common. I got recognized ass, her coffee mugs in the future. We ve coffee, my request, I would like to die in image of Platos Cave on a t shirt at some point. I guess that's it. Yes, we would that's all question is: is at the more successful this proves more phrases, have we heard him and the drinking games with he dropped trial, upset them permission structure. As someone sent us a fan, sent us all illustration of three like voice bubbles. Saying, hi John High John High John, I wanted mailbox in Europe in your manual
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I keep the camel burning, t shirt. We have a crushing morality, t, shirt and sweatshirt and we have a toe bag and we have just a common Harry Logo T shirt, that's really good cause. It's one of those Haines T shirt, things that doesn't have like an annoying label in the back, and it's nice and commentaries kind of like a kind of net, a kind of like us, it's really cool, so it's very exciting and them. I hope you also he has excited as we are. We are not as excited to talk about all of the crushing morality news that we have to talk about today, because there's like there's like no good news there I mean there is good news that we remain
in a situation in which we should all be looking forward, an optimistic about what is going on with the virus in the vaccine as a person with co morbidity is, I got my first shot yesterday. I got the Pfizer shot yesterday at aqueduct, race on the queens, long, island border, very say. I've never been to aqueduct racetrack though, and open to any racetrack John get the shot actually out on where they track is not well. Here's the thing, the room: where you get the shot is I guess the room where the wind those are two by the tickets. And then there is it's! It's it's it's indoors, but when you look out, there's the track, and so I guess when it's when it's not winter, was they open these windows and so your serve it? It's like it inside outside area, but I've never been to attract.
For, though I have seen guys and those eight hundred and fifty thousand times- and so I was very, very excited to be there. I got a little a little pain on the at the site. Cuz, it's a deltoid shot. It's not it's, not a vein shot, so it's up by the shoulder, but it was a very pleasant, very easy, delightful experience strongly well set up a New York state site. and I was you know I was very determined to get disappointment got it. Other people are not so fortunate. The system is all screwed up here, as it is, I think, a lot of places, but so I'm am optimistic and everybody should be optimistic. The numbers are. Fantastic, there is even a debate now going on because, as of now because of the last five weeks or something
I got the majority of shots that are being administered in the United States in the vaccine. Are the second shot are the second dosage, not or people who have already been I've already got in the shop? Which of course raises this question, whether or not should we be prioritizing the two shots three weeks apart or should we simply be letting everybody come and get that shot, because, according to least Pfizer's numbers, the shot effectiveness without the second shot is still extraordinarily high and the like eighty to ninety percent, but that is the that's the
that's the story, and so I that's very optimistic. However, what's going on with the bible ministrations, not very optimistic should not make us very optimistic, and what is going on with you know of with RON is not to not be making us right after mystic and some of the other things that are going on to make. Is that optimistic? So I'm trying to say is trying to correct myself and now I've corrected myself out of her out of all all good sets. yeah? Don't talk yourself out of a good time that done there is some concerning news on this rising you're saying now? That word were the majority of those is our second those, but only for four million people have received? The first does right of twenty million people have been fully immunized and The daily rolling average of vaccines is beginning to decline. Precision
sleep over then it's been sustains now fur since about February fourteen but there is still running, I was the outward. we're running out of supply, Elsie is apparently has. Why were two things happened right, one is that the storm disrupted everything last week and so that the average daily number like like decline, precipitously and because of the storm. Apparently supply is now way back up and all the Johnson Johnson NEWS is good, rather Johnson Johnson vaccine is as effective, with one dose as Pfizer Madonna with two volume, It says that the first doses is roughly as effective as the second does. It's all just about longevity right of innovation. The supply issue has presented some challenges. I think for local governance. Words were in the northeast are focused on the northeast and done
New Jersey in New York. I am and where you guys are have their own troubles, Christina NO at Washington DC as but Connecticut, a regional leader and its something rather novel its switching over to an end. monetary and model of eligibility based entirely by age. So, in a place where I not. You have groups a one. Eighty two, eighty three be one b to be three. I don't know why we didn't just go with a b c d, but it's all based on yours, that is near eligibility and it none of it is actually monitor very well. You go in during your asked, a series of cities, demanded it questions and answer those questions to the best of your ability. Nobody fact checks you, so we get an appointment. You can get it the vaccine which is probably how it should be, because the objective is to get community as fast as possible, doesnt matter whose army goes into that's. What's one less arm, you have two inoculate impact in Connecticut is missing
essentially moving to that posture. Florida has been doing that right as I think that in Florida Florida does it by age. Israel did it by age, it was this notion that we had to priority this all started with the notion that we have to prioritize healthcare workers that healthcare workers need to get first, so that they would be reassured and am do their jobs at hospitals, at nursing homes and with people without bill. You now fear of of infection, and so that was the original notion was An emergency they have to get it first and then we started getting into the well who well should get. It first differ establishing the principle that some people should get at first. Then, of course, we get to that our great bugbear, which is the teachers let's, let's let teachers have it early in order to facilitate the reopening of schools in places where schools are closed and now, of course, we have all this anecdotal.
Information that, despite the fact that teachers have moved to the front of wine, their unions are still demanding that schools be closed and, of course, for reasons, go beyond the existence of covered nineteen like mould and buildings, and you know a bad ventilation systems in general, which just gives the lie to the notion that they want to state that they that their staying home, because their fearful of getting covert, they're just staying home because they want to stay home and there's a third principle at work, and certainly in my city, it's been thrown into high relief and has led to unfortunately, a really awful system where people who want to get the vaccine just wait weeks and weeks in Cancun, appointment and that's the equity stuff. We literally have public health workers banging on the doors and certain neighborhoods begging people to get backs needed in and being refused where
In other words, you literally would get up at the crack of dawn and stand in line anywhere in the city to get a shot, their armed, Cancun appointment, even though they are over sixty five. So now we ve just move, didn't we also have the one? b c d e f g tears we're in a two year where people, who are under sixty five but have pre existing conditions are supposed to be able to get the vaccine and we are having these same problems there's like. Well, you know what is what is your be? Am I you prove what you're Burma? Is they around. It was set at twenty five pm I've. Twenty five are over and get the shot. Now it's at thirty. It's just all made up like that. There really is no true public health messaging going on here and that's why I think age becomes something that even even in the face of frontline workers having priority it is simple like if you're this age, you get a shot than the next. We give you this. Is you get a shot right? So what alternative? So? What I don't understand, and is why couldn't have been both and eventually was about in a lot of places, which is that they created this
further the lime healthcare workers saying why couldn't have been fragile and healthcare workers and poor? pull over seventy five and then front my workers and people over the age of six. I think a little bit like like an airport where they say that you know people with small children can board first and people in first class. The board first, and that line that first class that that line remains open for people to enter, so a bypass the longer line as they left the other groups in, but they let the other groups in and that that was always the missing element and where we start getting into the question of the hunger of public health officials to send an and government officials whatever to socially engineer whatever they can whenever they can right cause. The whole idea of this analysis areas system that knows talking about is that it is not game of all
you're either sixty five or you're, not sixty five. You take out your driver's license and you shall have your ended if your sixty four come back next week is not complicated. All of this stuff is complicated to the extent that, as I said, I have a co morbidity. I have an app from my you know from the floor. The hospital with a system that I'm pardon. I went through all process to establish there was an area in the apt that I could show when I showed up to get my appointment. That said, I have this condition. I showed up. I sat down at a desk. I gave the guide my form. I was in the system of appointment, he's And what do you have? I told them, and then I said do you wanna see another proof from my hospital these, like now. there shouldn't editor be should be because it doesn't matter who gets it.
So everybody another senators matters with people over seventy five because they are so clearly at a wildly enhanced risk of getting right so that that mattered but check someone's over. Seventy five is no big deal, particularly since you can do a lot of visually anyway, but they cannot help themselves. It's that term. you know it's like why shouldn't I pick why my Andrew Cuomo pick who gets to get the vaccine? Who does that's the fund of being in government? Why shouldn't restaurants open at twenty five percent capacity, as opposed to thirty three percent capacity? I get to pick you up at this credibility risk here I mean we talk yesterday about the extent to which public health officials and keep the CDC are making absurd recommendations and some folks,
on the centre left are actually making a pretty compelling argument that this is what they always do, that they always make recommendations that are. excessive and, founded on data, but data is that's fluid and, like ten years later, little change like you this year. It's not eggs next year, you have to eat eggs, we're gonna get cancer and they make this this recommendation is pretty often and what happens as you substitute, you're good judgment. You wonder stand what's happening and you either here, too those recommendations or you do not based on your own. Your risk assessment, as a british conservative idea, it's one I like and when I have here too, and I think probably will get back there to a certain extent but the obstacle, as everybody knows too, resumption of of real life. For the vast majority of people with children, a public school teachers and Christine identified something I will go into the somewhat Christine to talk about this briefly, but on timber
running over the Washington amateur went to a protest. A teacher led protest against reopening school as one very revealing quote: You will not sacrifice our lives, disrupt our communities and endanger our students for what test scores or a few folks who want get get their free babysitters back, keep the schools shut, I'm not using the word baisers. They are This is the second time that we have encountered an individual. An unguarded moment in the educational establishments describing their vocation as babysitting. I'm not saying that you're saying that gathers the school board California rightly are they all had they all heads they all had to resign because they got caught and zoom saying you know a few be met, we're gonna about all. You want to do a smoke pot. Make me your baby sitter. Will that put the protest at the princess?
TIM Carney word about with him and I believe in Montgomery County Maryland, which is like, I think, right now, fiftieth in terms of reopening schools, which is our position I hope is a republican governor and but he's been fighting these unions and he's also fighting what one of things is frustrating is that we were so now, a lot of appeal to the public that the opinion of parents about whether they won't reopening in and the lot of unions and alive in individual schools. I know cause I've taken two of these four, my kids we are sending out surveys to parents asking do you. Return to school, but the surveys themselves, the ones I took- were heavily weighted to keeping it either closed or hybrid. They didn't give you the option of even selecting for five days a week, totally open so you're, seeing a lot of appeals now a kind of way of framing it putting the onus back on parents and saying actually most and so one can back we're just protecting the parents address here, which is not true,
it does not support the illusion. It does important if you just serve the general population, which has not been the metric you should be using, but among this cohort the teachers for the most part educationalist out, materials their their demand is kind of rational. We want to be vaccinated first, too, it's, not something you can object to really without diving deep into the data just demonstrate. Why not but now we're getting more and more evidence that this is a fig leaf for cannot that they don't actually want vaccination first there, just it's just another goal posts that will be shifted in the wind when the conditions dictated Christine. You have. You found some evidence to that effect today from The good folks acts. Yes, yes, it day, there's an article now that bringing back this question of how dangerous covert is to children who can t Even if there is symptomatic that there's this x Dreamily rare- and let me just say that phrase again, extremely rare syndrome that that some children have developed
leads to in some cases, hospitalization. We felt it was even had a handful of death, so access shows this graph, which shows the regular covered rates and, and then it shows this flat line, the flat liner, the pediatric This is but the headline for the peace was all about the dangerous surge, Keeping and looking at the flat line and speak no sort of em the flat line as far below the other guess. You owe a great blow their adult right. There there's the adult short, which is sort of like in the middle of the x y. You know that the charter, the X Y access and then the pediatric chart is down the the zero baseline right and long. The bonnet, a flashlight it is a flat lie if any bit up from zero and they want to get a number two right. They only give you the percentage like this is this syndrome has doubled in the last month or something like that, but they dont give you the starting by double, can be from one case too to it can be from fifty cases too
They there's a reason there not giving you the wrong numbers here, because it doesn't suit the narrative and the narrative continues to be. alarm ism fear, let's all stay hunger down. Where will this is the interesting thing about using your own best judgment because a fly it the rubber meets the road to places you are bias towards letting people use their own best judgment about how to live their lives. Or is it not because that's what I'm talking about here when I say Andrew Cuomo wants to say who gets the vaccine and who does it? can say, philosophically that's because it leaves the expertise, everyone, a slice it, but the simple, The matter is that he is in his world view. That is what government is, for. It is the distribution of resources, in a manner that is that he deems or or is deemed by the body politic to be fair, equitable, reasonable want to slice, it
there is the idea that that is not government is for administering the task of government and leaving people alone for the most part to govern themselves, and this is the difference between the red and blue state models. And this is you know it's where, where and on any given question do you immediately say here is ex thing: what is government going to do about it or what are you gonna do about it, and so what happened in the last Here is the empowerment almost to a degree and unseen- certainly I think unseen in our lifetimes, with the exception of a couple of months after nine eleven, empowerment of the idea that government needs to intervene in people's lives to keep them safe by. saying where they can go, telling them what they can do on a daily basis,
saying whether or not their kids can go playgrounds and now, of course, the big issue which is schools and now the distribution and dissemination of the vaccine. It's also predicated on an assumption that you're an idiot that people are stupid, I think so it all. I don't think it's that its was predicated on the assumption that people will make decisions that are in their personal interest, but not necessarily in the common interest right, I'm sorry, you were nobody. Just Elsa anew see emigrant thing about a crisis Herman, or an emergency is that it brings all those. As knows describe and before you know like there there's always and in non crisis time, sir? These govern? recommendations and they always successor successfully contradict each other. You know the eggs, your good, no ads or bad will kill. You
and whatever else, and that we see we now we see now that the recommendations are made flesh, because with the emergency we see the shifts actually being instituted in real time and it's crazy making right, and so I think, the central question we have now, aside from how we're gonna get back to normal, is how is this assumption of of radical authority? the part of centralized government figures at state level- even never, never really got to this point, the national level, but could? How is it going to be pulled back because one To get a taste of that ambrosia? You know.
Suddenly a god and you get to drink ambrosia and the ambrosia is telling people what to do for their own good. Unless you think that's wrong the way, we think that's wrong. I don't know how you it's gonna, be the either we see In New York state this this this movement to retract Andrew Comas, emergency powers because of what happened with the nursing homes, is exactly the right measure to take. We still have it's gonna happen, but what about elsewhere? I'm an elsewhere. We have this effort to recall Gavin Newsome Right of Georgia, There is a similar effort underway in Georgia, legislative land. Georgia's Republican governor says objecting to it
it's not an ideological and right and in that sense right so anyway, I just as it is an interesting wherever it it's a telling moments, because the odd thing about Donald Trump, the fascist stir who wanted to control and in a democracy, and everything is precisely that he did not want to assert emergence. national Violent reactions, trump item on their national now mandate, already didn't put down a national state whole border whatever it was like. You know that the the discontinuity between the rhetoric about how what was last year and the reality which was the trump was irresponsible, and I think he was council, because he was
so resistant to asserting now serve a national crisis and the need to manage it nationally of it. As long as it's dependent on unobserved conditions and an empirical assessment of prevailing conditions in the state of the virus and I'd like a cycle and urban schools too much. But it's really indicative of a sort of mindset that's on display here The issue that I watch very closely isn't how many days your open once twice three times per week, shifting long weeks off weeks. What have you it is closing at one p m, as opposed to three, because the logic there has been shifting it started with the resulting in others. This big workload that we have to do now, and then it was all will kids candied luncheon schools, because I had to take off their masks and that's not dependent on exceptional conditions. That is simply superstition and paranoia and
to be throttled out of the people who adhere to it? But you can't through Are there because there's a guy, it's gonna go away. If ever there you have it there, but throttle ass. They are, I know, yeah you're saying we should throw wildly us right well that that's where, where it is truly becomes a challenge, because if you, if you live by the principle that new, should you should be plain responsible for yourself and self govern, and you have a kind conservative mindset in opposition to the to the kind of technocratic elite mindset, we ve been talking about you, you cannot leave the, your life by your own values. When the schools shut down and say it's unsafe, because there's no, unless you can afford to send either you have the time to home school, your kids or you can afford to send them to Let's go it's a lot of people, don't have either those options, your stock,
your avenues for protest or limited, so I actually I'll be curious to see because a lot of the parents I talk to her and talk to quite a lot of parents from all over the political spectrum, and no is right that these in these issues are action. Coming by partisan, an interesting way. Allow them. since I have talked. You are resigned to the fact the kids will not get back in school this year in places like you do see where they haven't been school for your already But they want to know what the plan is for next year before the summer begins. They. on a commitment from these teachers and these school administrators. And from the mayor of that, this is going to happen in the fall and what it will look like in the Will it be one day a week or not, because a lot of people going to leave the schools and system more than have already fled if they dont know what the planet's there is not a person in the United States with school age. Children who does not have the deep personal experience.
The circumstances under which we are living, they are studying and they are, they are going through. Their lives is not disasters. Are they resilient? Yes, can they recover from this? Yes, can their educational or come from it? Yes, But if what is going on is largely unnecessary, then this is just like brow. king, somebody's leg and say gavel: he'll, ok, We owe you know little he'll be fine, eventually, just make sure they sit still for two months and double let the letter, but it's more like to re breaking the leg every six months in Hell. It's like we're, just gonna keep breaking it and you can't complain about the banana demanding sympathy for the leg. Breaker gone army suffers forever stressed when all the leg breaking right. Now I wanted just our
therefore, as always got it I just want. Might some Abe aim of the of the four of us ape? Doesn't have kids? So let me just ask, since all we ever do is talk about schools and the Euro, new point out some up. What are the other? I bet, I think, serve like restaurant openings or have this weird similar quality, which is a wise at twenty five percent capacity is a twenty five percent of as it gives you know to be fifty say, say: twenty five is it'll be fun. the or is it I've just make up a number, and the imposition of the number being almost arbitrary is the point that the fun. Well, you know Irish, no science, it's just. I am the law, not twenty. Five percent is it's where they can take her. They will tanker. But another is no there's no leg breaking a metaphor that apply
in my case and say restaurants, but I would say in the case of rare for on owners it's worse than that, because the leg will not get better. It is it is. We would we wish. You are risking, losing the leg and sorry or not that sorry right. So that is what must I got very explicitly, but that about restaurants, but it has had something to do active, presented several months ago, presented with this graph of where transmission was occurring in restaurants. Absolutely- and we said, was we animal But why is it? It makes up a very small percentage of the spread, but it's something we can control private. That's an angry disperses lank break is like he's allowing angry into sudden and just let it yeah right now, that's a right to the leg has to be appetite. Get him. You know I mean the one thing that makes this tricky, of course, is the the nature of the contagion.
and it makes a tricky because, of course the snow since, like while you do what's best for you now, you make a reasoned decision for yourself. But of course it's not that simple, because this is egg, a contagion that can affect everybody so, for example, What are we gonna do if forty five percent of the population refuses the vaccine I mean I don't know we do everything you can. I guess you can't make a mandate. Pray that everybody, the United States, get the vaccine, you can. make it mandatory that everybody under the age of eighteen get the vaccine, which will which can substitute. For add and create a new form of heard immunity. Once that happens, if that happens, By getting the numbers up to seventy percent through the through the population of people who are minors were not there yet, but I that that's where the problem goes, and then you get this weird version of it. Like coal,
does say. Ok movie, theaters can open, but only a twenty five percent capacity. Then, as I think I mentioned yesterday, like you know You know me we Twitter is like they shouldn't opened the movie theatres, don't open the mood, I'm not ready to go back to a movie theater, and it's like well the hell with you like who the hell are you, but you see they. It's not white there, because should movie theatres proved to be super spreader than the person who doesn't go was as much at risk as the person who does and therefore you can't open them. That is that was where that was the production. That reason is the reason that Andrew Como can still be ever Como year after this. This is an argument for the cheered stratified Attica society that I'm so irrationally terrified of, and there is a very serious argument in favour of it. It's an arena is being
even in policy in places like Israel, which is that if you have a population as large as forty five million people who won't get this vaccine is a very real possibility. The virus Vulcan. Need to transmit within this population mutate and involve beyond the point at which the protection exists in this messenger protein or the Johnson Johnson vaccine, so will just be back to square one, and the answer to that is to create a passport system. where the new regular life these private institutions administer there are rather observed that people who can prove their vaccination and offer services to them and don't to people who do not wish to vary, careful inducement to get back separated and I find that to be rather chilling on one level, but in another level, as a public good, see matter. It's the horrible idea, I'm done very torn over it wits, but it's it's a here. Aren't I mean this? Is universal
going into the kind of amateur stuff units science the wish that we should never a mess around with Isn't it likely that the subset of the american population that wouldn't get the vaccine will also generally be more risky and social and whatever and and and actually run, tat to her immunity anyway, Another problem that rusty earlier, because they'll get yeah they'll get and I had a little. Have the anti bodies in the getting gets pretty hysterical actually did that if we had professional, humorous or capable of seeing things that are funding anymore, they would be lamp putting this because its tits circle there will be it in the way. their future. There's gonna be two sets of populations in this country. One percent of one set of populations whose out their enjoying life as much as they possibly can. Which is ongoing, even as we speak, and another population, that's terrified and his waiting for public health officials to give them the opportunity to go back and enjoy private life and those two
populations are going to be distinct. Wished by their willingness to get vaccinating, the population that is not vaccinated is the one. That's gonna be enjoying life. Well, more vaccinated are gonna, be sitting a home, so they are killing their long. So they're playing along game is what you're saying I mean, I think the weirdness as you have these too weird populations, you're talking about to wear populations. You have the population of Anti Baxter's, who believe that you know believe on the basis of largely on the basis of a manufactured, false retracted study about autism and vaccines. That was that one of the great science scandals of
last hundred years believe that vaccines cause disease right so that you have this population with its twenty years. Since the publication of the Andrew Wakefield Vaccines cause Autism study, I think it's worth it was. Ninety eight would like took twenty five years and the consequences of it remain and their growing there, not retract it. You know they tracked, and everybody knows your doctor says this in that it doesn't matter people have made up their minds that I know well Maybe we should spread it out. Maybe we should you know they shouldn't get all the vaccines. Are babies shouldn't get on the back seat at once, I want to spread it out why I just want that I'm their mother and father, like I know better, what's better for my kids right that kind of thing it's like that's risible. I want them to get it, but I just want to get and over the course of a year, even though, where did they get that idea?
from some message board. You know from some Anti backs message: where, from Robert Kennedy Junior I don't know where they got it right. So there's that population and they are the population, the police, it's all a hoax. an end everything's a hoax, and there is no current of ours to plan their make it all to control Us- and I just we'll go out and enjoy life, so there you have. This can mirror image of what you're talking about, which is the people who are gonna get vaccinated because it's a hoax and then the people who think that fact genes. Are the most dangerous things on earth and will kill you and therefore they won't get factually There is also a kind of a middle middle and group of people to, and those are the people who are scared, not sceptical vaccination. Butter like I'm gonna, take a wait and see approach. Maybe they're not high risk. Maybe they're, not oh you know in the elderly population. They just think I'll, get it when I get it, but until
I get it, we should still be allowed to start turning to normal, and it's that group that I think has been most negatively affected by the poor. Poor message on the part of first at the top administration and now definite with abiding administration and Munich Anthony voucher messaging of late, which is that, even if you get the vaccine, you can't go back to normal those people here that and think. Well, you know I wasn't right to get in the first place. It's probably gonna, be mind. If I don't, I just want to get back to me. Also, why bother if I'm not gonna, be able to get back to normal with the vaccine that that there's a vast middle there of people who who believe in vaccination for their children. Who are and time boxers who don't think there's a pandemic buttercup like I don't know that messaging is really harmful to that group of people, I will say one we're taking them. We got up, we gotta do do a spot, but that Everybody in America isn't isn't like screaming that they need
seem right now is kind of weirdly helpful because there isn't enough vaccine and their own enough appointments and there isn't enough supply. So the fact that there are that there are costs or pockets of resistance at this moment some helps the administration of the the the I've, seen because you don't have like people literally like when standing outside vaccination sites with torches and bang on the door demanding to get. At which virtually alot of people were doing in the first three or four weeks of this, because it was so maddening to try to get an appointment right and so now for example, here where there are no appointments. Maybe That's a terrible that not everybody is rushing to get an appointment. The question is what happens in April right, but that's it. That's just a weird aside note. What isn't a weird side note
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he's getting a lot of heat from his left flank for putting kids in cages now and I'll cages, their containers, shalt thou shalt arms. The shelters that looks suspiciously like shipping containers, borders, column, shelters for the for the second argument, and what by an administration is doing is comporting with the floor as settlement, and we talked a lot. About this three years ago. I can't be the only person who remembers this. That's a lie Mr determination in the ninety nineties that prescribes how you handle children who come across the board with families without families, unaccompanied minors balls transferring over two from the age ass to the health of Humans Services department, sometimes it can be kept ended in these containers are rather, there was the whenever there were calling it. I had a processing and then their transfer it
but a family sometimes, and sometimes those families are illegal immigrants and they don't respond to calls and that's how you lose them. I mean we had this whole conversation was a big deal. Trevor administration got wrapped over the knuckles, deservedly for trying to use on separation, child separation as its term but it was existing policy. It was policy for a reason because of the settlement. Now it can be change legislatively, Congress and go to work and figure out some sort of a stop gap that keep families together. Just Floris. Omens, Anita while also improving their conditions, but converse doesn't want to legislate. The whip been aware of this for quite some time. So you have people like Alexander Cause. Your court as whose pounding the table over how did by the administration is immorally mirroring the Trump administration here, but She could offer an amendment any time she could offer
I'm sort of a legislative stop gap that when they would fix what the mining illustration has to do here and Democrats couldn't probably should but their disinclined to pursue that, because the remedies for this condition are not so clear cut? Will she is she, in particular, is is very annoying She had she's built a reputation in the kind of flattering Netflix documentary bringing down the house or whatever it was called de featured in a whole section of this, where she was choosing campaign poster in one of them was like said, a bottle ice so hurt she's, always on twitter, in and from the time she started campaigning she's about abolish, eyes, abolish eyes and the others. This moment where she looked at the posting is, though, that looks gangster like this is part of her. Brand management is to abolish eyes and she said in her. You know twitter, a stream of consciousness thing last night. You know I gotta go excuse, you know this is her gangster persona. Has she but
not introducing legislation to abolish ice he's. Posturing, and just like you, posture during the trouble administration, when you go down to the border in all white and wept at Genoa, ETA, jailing fence. You know that the binding mistress, unjust, reactivated one of those border facilities increases, brings taxes that had been used by the Trump Administration to house. I think particularly teenagers come across the border. It would help everyone if there were some thoughtful pollination by some of these administration officials as to why they do things the way they do not just the settlement, which I think was really helpful- that no reminded us of but also how difficult it is and how dangerous it is for these children who come across the border, particularly unaccompanied just release them into the country. This is not a good idea. Some of them are actually brought here for nefarious purposes. Some of them are brought here, hoping to find family members, but with no means too I'm so there's a reason. We have a process in just the political fostering the trumpet was awful, but so is what the progressive left is doing. Now we cannot
a country without borders, borders exists and if you compare our border management to what a lot of countries and in in Europe. Do, for example, we are downright. You know, open borders compared to them, so I think it would be helpful for people better perspective about why these procedures are in place. If we're even gonna talk about you This is one of those situation where there really are bad and worse answers, and that's it Linda. Unsurprisingly, the Trump administration did a horrible job in articulating what the nature of the problem is here, which is, among other things, that you cannot put children in. Prisons essentially aware where adults are and The Obama administration faced all sorts of problems along the same lines, as a matter of deterrence. Brac Obama when he was president, didn't make a speech saying, do not come here with your kids.
you lose track of that we lose we lose track of thousands of them every year, a hum- and this was kind of considered, a sort of like I'm humane warning, you know it's in some sense, right and just session. Said the same thing in a much more negative fine, but it was the same thing. don't bring them here. You're not gonna like what happened right when they come right that that as the now that was the other way of that was the other way of putting it, but the tour Actually, the same battle was at the guidelines decided and part of the meat. The messaging from a popular culture perspective. The only message you hear about people bringing their children over the borders. This kind of you know, spiralling. You know, courageous tale of people's doing everything they can to get to this country, which is isn't untrue, like I think it is actually an act of bravery, encourage people to try to get here bent
risk their lives and their children's lives in the process, but I think there's a weird sort: there's like the Hollywood version of you know how we should reward anyone who comes to this country. That way, and that's actually the version that the progressive left acts on when they talk about this problem and then as aids that there's this reality, which is not at all a Hollywood happy ending for love these people they die in the desert. They drown it's it's horrific. I mean, I think, the Bam worse option problem like the the incentive structure of being America with a sub continent, on our border that is not working. I mean what are their seven or eight nations and Central America only Couple of them are serve
functioning wake places where you can grow up and have a stable life and raise your kids and all of that, and so your ear ear. In a situation in which There is including building a wall whatever there is that the incentive for people to come here involves us existing and them existing. You know there is no answer to that problem except managing it, and because we look at trump- and you say, Trump did a horrible job of you know, messaging or cervix play what was going on, but of course he doesn't think so, and I don't think so because they were sending a message to their the people who already agree with them about. How this is all horrible and and legal
illegal immigration alike are horrible and their destructive and we don't have a country because of this, and so there people heard loud and clear and we're fine with it until he got wind of the fact that they were doing better with Hispanics in run up to twenty twenty than he expected to, and then he started soft peddling. The anti immigration message in in em in the run up to the election. But there is no good answer here what they put their things you can say from policy perspective as if your Republican, who wants to encourage legal immigration, which is something every you thoughtful Person in this country should encourage, because we all were immigrants at some point in our path is, is unique, there there actually clear things you can do. One of We saw during the last quarter. Crisis was that we didn't have enough judges and administrators facilitating and processing these claim, so people come over there and
recommended they want to stay. They wanna work, actually the ones who come here wanting to become Americans, it's very difficult for them to even do that. So the processing of how they got over here. There is getting them in the system. There's all this. If we did not have enough judges literally to process asylum claims that too, to assess each person. Andrew! You could throw money at that problem and create an administrative mechanism that would allow for better processing, which would also then, hopefully, keep families together or at least expedite the process. There are definitely boring practical administrative. You, no good government things you could do here, but nobody wants to talk about that. They want. Talk about closing the border if it to appeal to a certain part of their base or abolishing ice to appeal to their partnership is in its useless conversation. Get your talk about mitigation strategies, management, stress, Oh geez that accept the reality of the circumstances that we are living in and is not where the conversation is rather come.
station on the right is, they must be stopped. You you say everybody in this country. You know thoughtful person These illegal immigration that is not true, Stephen Miller, does not believe in legal immigration. That about menstruation tried to draw down legal immigration numbers to almost nothing at a time. We were at full employment, like even the argument that the that legal immigration was bad because it held their wages. that made absolutely no sense in the context of twenty nineteen and yet there they were doing this because they hate immigration. Yes, that's true: there don't just hate, illegal immigration and so you know, so, there's the hatred on that side, though the hair on the other side, it Let us all in, total amnesty total social support rights?
have you ever Sarah? However? Sarah up for ages s secretaries, you said yesterday wants to provide health, Free Healthcare Medicaid, essentially to illegals and blanket amnesty and and and free healthcare, so the United States, and becomes a giant social service agency for people who are coming crossed. The border you know Now we come to any even were mode consensus on on any this, but that's why these things like the idea of a giant tell immigration reform bill, or something like that is in saying there will be no giant bill on it. We have no national consensus on this, but you can manage it better because you can manage anything better than the way we ve been managing it. far and the other thing you can manage better is your lying shopping, we're all doing it. And you know,
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stones, but he's sending vaccine to allies, far away allies, it Honduras and a couple where they ve sent five thousand doses or something like that. But what about the Palestinians? It's not vaccinating the Palestinians. Now let us discuss virtues of those two things. I'm gonna stop number one half of the population of Israel, What has now been vaccinated or a bit? Maybe more than half twenty percent of the population of Israel is arab. Ok, they are included in that number, so they are not palestinian precisely because they do not live under TAT under the authority of the Palestinians, they don't live on the West Bank. They live in Gaza, but they are I was standing in Arab and they are being inoculated at exactly the same rate as everybody else in the country. That's point number one point number two: is
Under international law and the framework of international agreements that are still abiding the Oslo Accords and others, Israel is legal, we and morally not responsible for the health care of the Palestinians who live under the aegis of the Palestinian Authority or Hamas in Gaza? They are not responsible that that that is a sitting government with its own governance rules and it could have gone to Madeira and it could have gone to Pfizer and bought vaccine for its people, and you know why they didn't cause. They stick because they at their awful and terrible and their death called, and they careful lives or dies, and it is not Israel's responsibility to keep the Palestinians alive when their own government looks to look, you know, doesn't care whether they live or die. That said, not only that but
This is the final thing. Imagine a system where israeli doctors fan out across the West Bank, with needles in their hands set up tables and say come here. Let us vaccinate This is a polity than has been told for thirty years that Israel puts point and then the water poisons their wells gave Yasser Arafat AIDS. This is what is said about Israel in the power. You think anybody you think those people are gonna go unlike what is really doctors to inoculate them. When we were talking for months about out,
merely the whisper of the thought of the Tuskegee in another, the area, the experiments at Tuskegee, Tusky, ensued and others that this is what is causing a hesitancy among african American Skip vaccinated, you wanna multiplied by two hundred and fifty thousand percent. That's the palestinian attitude towards is: is real and really doctors, eight. So the thing about the times article is mentioned. None of what you just said regarding the international situation and end the palestinian leadership that was, tiredly ignored everyday all that as for the central premise of the of the of the peace that Israel is seeing vaccine diplomacy. Essentially, I think that is great and explains exactly how it. thinking along those lines, has allowed Israel to go
allies steadily the rate are over a very long period of time. Don't give us a heart I'm about nonsense, and you will find a great ally in us. We will we What we will do great things for you: we have the technology, the ability of the good common sense, too ally with people who wanted to stress. Go for Israel also by the way made a deal. controversially, but made a deal with Syria to send Syria doses as a form of ransom for Israelis who are being held in syrian presence at this. Despite is, it is an important jewish value. The ransom of captives is a is us Central mitzvah in the inn in in and enjoy dating back. You know millennia, and so,
What happened here was that baby Netanyahu had the foresight to buy ten zillion doses of vaccine, and so They they have a surplus and they're they're gonna use the surplus as they see fit, and why shouldn't Honduras get the goddamn vaccine? Is there something all with Andorra getting the vaccine? Now I thought everybody was to get the vaccine. It's just nauseated. But I am happy to report as we as that just across the transom came the word that the New York Times has issued a report official report from its publisher, its chief executive and its negative editor, committing themselves to bring about fundamental changes to the companies workplace, culture in an effort to make the newsroom and other times device. More diverse and inclusive. The report says, after several months of interviews and analysis. We have arrived at a stark conclusion at times difficult environment, for many of our colleagues from a wide range.
Backgrounds are current culture and systems are not enabling our workforce to thrive and do its best work. This is true across many types of difference: race, gender identity, sexual orientation, ability, socio economic background, It illogical viewpoints and more any illogical viewpoints and more I wonder, who loves? What's those are the Sami people like us? Does that mean people who you know like want us to in Cuba as Robin to Angelos. Follow up to white fragility should be times fragility, because that is basically an admission that their their people they hire or to emotionally fry to actually grapple with tough ideas with which they did cigarette here's a here's, the thing that might be encouraging in this, because I just I've skimmed this I haven't read deeply in it. By one of the things that this was designed to address according to support his quote. This work should ultimately render the informal practice that some now call a sensitivity red
Obsolete and the sensitivity red is essentially giving people who were not editors and editorial veto over content, that's published in the times- and this is perhaps in to sideline these informal practices that were established. During the twenty twenty. More ok that, but the cynical take on that day, the crushing morality take is to say there actually bureaucracy arising the sensitivity read by only hiring people who will, by definition, read everything, was kind of a good activity vacant higher whoever they want, and you know what I've known people work of the times for fifty years and its a horrible Placed the work it's mean, its nasty, it's got a nasty, weird workplace,
Hostility, the in fighting the ugliness is, is a very real thing. It's ebb and flow, depending on who is in charge of an under what circumstances, but you know fight, so they have now created the conditions under which they are now admitting that they suck so good. You suck and let's see what it's like two years from now after your grovelling, active kowtowing here too, the Bob let's see how worse, you're gonna suck and that's not crushingly morose at all, because let them let them enjoy the of their labours and the fruits of their ideology. Let them let them have each other. You know I'm gonna sit back with popcorn, that's all I'm saying and with the had Willa remember, merge, DOT commentary magazine dot com for the crushing veracity, certain sweatshirt, the kid
have a burning t shirt, the toad bag, the teacher, the commentary lover, T shirt, will probably have more products, the more than you respond favourably to what we have just what out so much commentary magazine that come thanks. A lot for listening for aid Christine oh, I'm jump onwards, keep the camel burn.
Transcript generated on 2021-07-27.