So maybe, we discuss on today's podcast, the most honest 2020 choice would be the one between Trump and one of the left candidates in the Democratic party, Warren or Sanders—because it would most closely reflect the state of American politics. Also what just happened with the Taliban and what is going on with impeachment. Give a listen.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Welcome to the commentary magazine podcast for Monday September, ninth, two thousand and nineteen. I am John Podhoretz, the editor of commentary, the seventy five year old, monthly of intellectual analysis, political probity and cultural criticism. From a conservative perspective, we invite you to join us a commentary magazine dot com, where we give you a few free reads and ask you to subscribe, one thousand nine hundred and ninety five for a digital edition, two thousand nine hundred and ninety five for all access subscription, including our beautiful
your mail box eleven times a year with me, as always in Washington, senior writer, Christine rose and high Christine Hygiene, and here in New York with me senior editor, a bring all high ape, I jump and associate either. Nor Roslin get your guys titles right without hesitation next time OM having Joe Bied moments here. My now a high, I got ay am.
So I I speaking of Joe Biden, I am umgood rearranging things from at what we literally talk about thirty seconds, poor we be on the air about what were goto. Do this sah, it's worthad, noting that Tem, the Sebious NEWS, Hawe HAZ Ab, a pull out of the eighteen earliest primary states for Democrats that Shose am for the first time in any pole. Ah, some one in the lead above Biden, that is Elizabeth Warren, is a twenty six per cent bidons at twenty five
cent across these supposedly eighteen, the early primary states siscissa a yoke of Paul, which means that it's done entirely online with a panel, a meeting people whoare they go back to over and over again for their responses. Itso, the very large numbers like fifteen thousand people, which should mean that it's more credible ah, but there have been a substantive and the manipulation problems or would appear to be some problems with poles like this. In the past, a the fact that it does seem to be out of phase again with the general range of democratic national ppalling in a which still the real cler politic. Saverage ithing still has Biden up nine or something like that. I'm
You should give one pause but its, but it's interesting unlesson thought that Bidness Slift it's that warrant, as gained at particularly as Cacome Harris's. A surge has a completely ended and the whaeeverat number of people were going for her and our back to like susad like six per cent and so therere like seven per cent. They seemed mostly to have e created to Elizabeth Warren. Tat which my guess makes this Thursday night abayed the one night bate the first time that Byden faces off against Sanders and Warren. The most important political events in world hist im. So what are we me? Will tall weth Thurstay also bits of what are we looking for? We give him these facts o we have more
and you know cementing some kind of you serious challenger position. It appears in most of the polling lately sanders serve holding fast wherever he is, but not gaining, even though his supporters seemed very passionate and bitineg, a sort of like I maintaining where he is. But all these questions being asked about his a mental vacuity and and general Fitnos Ye B, I mean bide, may not be slipping UN statistically, but a therei. The chatter has certainly increased OM terms of Inow upeds and pieces about a questioning his mental capacity. Certainly he would if, if, if that weren't the case, he might be in a better position to pick up of those who are OM.
Leaving accomplice camp you I want to challenge the premise I just don't, but I think that bite and is in a healthier position in the national average of poles and he's been for most of the race. Actually he's had a bit of a bounce over the course of the summer over there could does the spread of polling, and even in this CBS yoga Paul you go happens to be one that has. It bears a strange house effect which seems to be favourable. The warm, but even if it is a myth that, when the pull itself shows that Bitin his ahead in South Carolina by a thirty point margin Burney is up over everybody in Nevada, with Elizabeth Warren in the teens, ah Byn, the still
id ers still leads and Iowa outside the margin of error and in New Hampshire, where we have Elizabeth Wern leading. It is by a single point, with Elizabeth Warren, Jo Biden and Burney Sanders at twenty seven, twenty six, twenty five respectively, basically satistically tied, so I mean thiss- is one with a lot of Kavya Wut an in classic pulling a Mary palling rules should be that Warren should be handed now Hampshire that it shouldn't it should be taken off the map, because she's set her from Massachusetts I amn't a univarlsion, Massachusettitios tolz of Horn and Leeder and That's right, but I'm saying in classic terms. You know your member in nineteen, ninety two one New Hampshire, I and- and it was dismissed because Bill Clinton came in second, which was thought to be much more important because since Songus was from New Hampshire, New Hampshire, lives entirely embraeze on the massage
It's media market doesn't really have an independent Mede market, except for two newspapers of which I assumare weaker now than they were. Then that am ah you know Massachusetts. People are given Ernest, it's assumed to be a favorable state for them. Romney. No one else serve known competed in New Hampshire with Romney. Really and so, warrent's getting a cob, weird Gimme an mean she should be walking away with New Hampshire and she hasn't been walking away with an answer. There is also good a be I'll, be interested to see on Thursday night if Bhidon goes after her in the same manner that you know the story in to days near times, went after her for her hypocrisy about big money fright, she was happy to go round: IND, collecting fat cat cheques from big business spet for years and to put him into her Senate campaign and then transfer those over their presential campaign and once had enough of a war chest. Suddenly she became a small dollar individual donor. Gedden in a rail against Bicg Business, a
curious to see if he attacks her for that, it's a legitimate thing to attack her for the hypocrisies is obvious and glaring in her explanation for Hership, is not persuasive a so I DA be Gelen. That's what of things I want to see if bide will go after for doing. I would be alarmed if I were a Democrat right now about Warren, for this very simple reason, which is that she ai? This extremely specific, extremely firm statement at the global warming Geontown town hall that she would ban all fracking everywhere, hydraulic fracturing with natural gas extraction every
on her first day as president, and what that says to me is goodbye. Pennsylvania, Pennsylvania is a state that has profited immensely from fracking will continue, providementally profit immensely from fracking. We talked about this on a previous show: how on earth you can. There is not there's almost no scenario oe of the Democrats, winning in which they do not have to win Pennsylvania back ah from tromp and tha. You know he can just spend a hundred million dollars. I in Lana thing she wants to destroy our state economy and Thisli. The Climat changed Town Hall was disastrous. Just from the perspective of people who support these ideas on the the Politica town. A the political piece was illustrative of this. I forget exactly what it was with the framing of it was how Democ
had played into Republicans hands, there's no greater admission, no more comprehensive admission of failure than to say youre, giving Republicans ammunition, OM with Essi mean between them that and the town hall after Parklandthis. I don't know why anybody participate and see an intelsalt als they are disastrous for the advocacy or every minor candidate should participate in town halskis. That's the only reason there in the race writes just to get some air time. I be right now we're. Basically it's now down to a three person race in the democrac field. Ah, you've had Thee Scandidates, who have been in a like Jub that sitting there for in almost nine months, seven one six months: nine months who aren't happening in o bookers, not happening Harris had her moment. She's not peling am butt. A judge has had many moments and clearly not happening an my outs ive, a small. You know, though influential cohort am unless
thing, unless one of them can explode outward with the races. What we see its three people ah- and I, the guy at the TA byden- is- is going to benefit from the fact that the two others are our arclones of each other except except in terms of them, gender. So Ah, you know e the town halso of the town Hall phenomenon, the Elg Bty Hue Town Hall, which I guess is next month or later this month or something unseein him. I will be the last moment that Alli these people will have to get half an or to you know, I ly yo Rong. It is a complete mede of vexation. On Elizabeth Warren, I mean, depending on the pole, that you chooset like fifty. Ty of Sanders ahead of war, here's what I will say Warren had such a disastrous opening of canisacy. I mean that in it
is impressive, that you write in her ship of the day. I actually, I think we said at the time I don't remember, which one of us set up, but we said, like maybe she's lucky that she yeah. You know she got her ya out, and you know in January and February, because then you know people it'll be old news by September, the stuff with the beer with her husband and the beer at, twenty three in me proof that that yet out, three and years ago there was a native American in her genome and whatever I mean it was just awful Han. You thought my god she's just yo know. This is just the worst political. Date National Debut ever and she head down and just kept going and received a huge boost as as no saying from from media, I mean in a live
Theyv been pushing her and yet us they faund it that I heard a Hinit. I think they would have been perfectly happy to shut her aside. Had things continued to go the way they were going, they would if they would have served a dismissed her in oh I mean you could just as easy one sayngas he could just as easily craft and narrative a round of Burney Sanders come back the ban, because he is routinely topped her in a variety of staples and national poles, but that's not a narrative, ok willing to crack here's. Why? Because its he understood to be, he should be the next in line red, that's the classical! He challenge Villery one twenty states, I Hou she had always got a fifty million person mailing list, thirty milln people voted for him. He raised two hundred and seventy five million dollars. You know in in hard money Blah blah blah like the idea was he should have been. He should be more formidable than he
right that right now, that's yeah, that's that's the argument and Still she stilld the running on a you know. Bisqus, basically saying don't a. For a Lightn o, don't choose for electability against tromp, which is not a really great position to be in to sort of say. If I still don't think she's overcome this. This elect bility likelihood gap among Democrats made they look at her and they might like her policies and thinks she it's great and she's a woman, Et Cetera, Cetera but they're, not convinced that she can be tromp an Theyi'R deaden. I dont the numbers moving much in her favor in that way, unless, of course, you don't Bui MAR as and disaster Ners Okaysoget. If it's, the three them and nothing else happens right. So I Inbitean has a disaster Iap o he does he Wickd Perry's on Thursday night or something you up falls off the state. Whatever is that yeut of both eyes get an aneurism in the go hemorrhage
know what I'm then you have this thing where bidins get a gitn, a bidaable collapse and the we're back in the o, my god, like the races between you, know, The guide LE honeymooned in the Sovi Union and the woman who lied about being a native American like this is ay at and you then it's October, and that's where you start getting into my fantasy Oprah Michel Sinario, because you know I know the Pii know the head to head says that they'll be Trump and maybe they can and may know whatever, but but it doesn't feel like that right it did. And on the other hand, so wouldw what they are waiting for. I somewhat warm as waiting for is for Bidin two do things that will suggest that he is not electable ah and the
I will. That will do him in I'm, not even sure that would do a man. Actually, I mean doesn't listen to rain alot, very familiar to twenty fifteen two thousand and sixteen that's just the same narrative, that of a you will implode? I would write a engineer that Tet not to do anything worth to accelerate that it's like a marxy in theory of historical inevitabilities, just Cenn he's goen a collapse of his own well well. Yes, I I ever come last week in which I warned them: I said you know o dad. Don't make the mistake that that people like us made in thinking that tromp couldn't be the nominee, because something would happen to stop it once took the lead in a July of twenty fifteen. He never surrendered it so im. The one thing you can say about this Yuke of Paul is that Biden has in it alone surrendered the lead. Now it's not a national pole.
And it's a weird poll a, but it still e outs still result, so it it. You know it clearly. Um raises the sakes, the real question: here's my question for viewed Christine on alecability. So let's say it's November. Something like that and Warren has said that you know she's got a ban. Fracking and Stander says that you know all poor people should get a free abortions from the United States to save us from global, overpopulation and weird stuff. Like that. And I'm at what point? Do the media, who seemed to be a eager to pomp the anyone but Biden Scelario start getting more Read that Sanders a Warren e might start pushing Byden in a weird sort of way because they start buying into the electability of a most m a lot upon tits.
Like this right, Frank Brownie, you now serve Eugene Robinson, their pay by liberal Pandit two are basically just shut up and get behind Biden because you're being crazy- and this is the best hope we have right. So, but that is not in the deoted, the general tenor of the press over the last couple of weeks. I think that is their to shift Thoug as we get closer to the fall, and you emming their Bett and opinion pieces here, and there they've been popping up um, showing that most of the democratic primary contenders or bracing policies that are wildly ununpopular among Americans, even among their own voters. You know the the decromailizing, the border n at a for all venica for all and the only thing that they're ALD Tauting Enelizabeth Warren. It has embraced as well as free college for everyone, but I would think for the moderate swing. A suburban women voters is a littloe scepticism about free college or to meet some one's going to pay it's. It might not be the students, but
the price tag is still there, so I actually suspect will be seeing more and more of these a back on the the more radically the radicalization of the democratic parties. Adgenda thats occurred during this primary a because it's not sustainable for Ther for the voters that they need to hold on to in the when Whoever their nominees goes up against. Rhem will you know, but can, in a general election, play a kind of Centerest game and am a Warren and Sanders cannot credibly exactly do anything resembling an Etcho sketch that there's right. They are completely locked in right to that Oll street. What you have, then, is you: have this the and be thin that sense? It would be a
honest result, PRI Fer, one of them to be the Nomineke as then you would have the polarization that is actually D. That is actually the governing fact of the political life of this moment presented to the american people in the starkest possible way. Right are Youa picking Trump Orados is Trump's personal extremism, Andt Unow, verses. There see extremism a eat other, and then you have a kind of equalization. Ryther fitsanders, that's two old guys, yelling at each other. If it's war anden, you know it's a sort of Udo, a leadest a
A letest professor, who comes from modest Sthock verses, a populous, rich kid who comes from not modest stock. A and tha view, therefore, would have a kind of the the race that actually resembles what choices we are being posed. That Biden, where the reasons Thof Bide may think, is attractive theoretically or at other canthey could have been if they could have emerged like Clobachar, something like that is that they that they make it possible toa ed that choice. I you hit thee, you can retreat into some more comforting notion a third notion that you're not either Ecomy commie or a fascist, you know and then that's that's enough. That's all that's left! I that the free college thing I think is is just simply has to be understood as the though the liberal to left theory of the race is that
A you need to generate, ah the coalition of the ascendant right at the poles. This is how you win you gene enormous minority turn out. You generate young people, togenerate the two thousand and eight coalition in twenty twenty, and that means young people who are you know who don't, who dislike trump, two to one or three to one
some number like that. So you want to get them to the pulsa that I's a simple pandor right. Its woollput will pay for your college. Ah MA and- and you know you shouldn't- have to pay for anything, and you shouldn't certainly have to pay for this. Ah, and it's just that, it's like go, it's like a kind of thumb, yet it's a direct hand out a to a to a voting block. Ah, although oddly enough most mostlhese people will theorecly would be out of college by the time they could pass something that would make their college free, so they wouldn't actually get free college and that's what dead forgiveness comes in. That forgiveness is all another form of extreme. You know extreme pander and learon shaded the Theron Sfermer ground, their Det college Stin Londebts are forgiven all the time. A the Troub administration, just forgave s, Sudilon to own
comes sort to fault, but not all of ET. We've also increase offered the opportunity now to investigate the forgiveness of medical debt for qualified debtors, I'm Ventiuale in a work theway around the credit that, because that's really where all the debt is and yet you have a really good case to make firm there. Why you need credit that, in order to establish credit, there is a logical inconsistency in the notion that you should forgive student debt for college, with making college free low just laid out, which is that one of the reasons that you want to forgive student college at is the college as a ship that that that these loans are a sham, that they have burdened people with unacceptable expenses. While they have gotten thing out of their time university and stuff like that. So part of the ideas we well ahead of inflation rates right totally and tell it to market signal.
Right, but it's also that they don't that that the the college benefit for somebody who goes to a bad college and studies, nothing and gets out of the college, one hundred thousand dollars and dad or seven hundred and fifty or whatever, even if they go to you, know, serve community college. Is not much it's not appreciable, but also, I answer a wealth from which ripple Twoo relatively richubie. Right. So Alln I'm saying is that is that the real, if you really ito to be serious about forgiving college Dat or student Dhat, you would say
we are doing this with an understanding that the notion that is being pushed that every single person America should go to college is of isape is a a is a scap Thas. A terrible idea has been as damaged. People has delayed them on their track to adulthood, has made it impossible for them to learn a trade because they are not learning at the right age and all that, but that's the opposite of what they are doing. Their sing o K. We will forgive student debt and we will make college free and we will pik out a that doesn't serve a follow entirely but um. I'm in the real issue here is, you know, they're all yet they're all crazy and the Democrats re open their promising crazy things. Thap that, but you know again, one could have said that about trough said Trump Trump Trump spent twenty fifteen twenty sixteen proposing crazy things and that didn't yo on', impede what,
did. It did not make it impossible for him to become president. Let's say you know. Ah I came a remember some of the crazy things that he was. You know I'm Ewere fortunate in so far as that you can sell out o crazy things and then just then the logic of the governing in the United States professiors for actually doing it, like banning fracking by executive order, mean that just isn't going to happen. Yeoughed so I mean wle have we can sit around and talk about. This thing that has never going to happen Y seems lie kind of waste time, but it is valuable to at least investigate the philosophy line at a Sinething Woas like that o muslim registry or muslin datapase, and the only value there to talking about it was to investigate the psychology that would produce some kind of proposal like that. What will the other thing by the way, interms appalling as their two major poles this weekend? That show overwhelming support for some forms of gun control?
of an overwhelming support, particularly for background checks, which I think now register like ninety. Ninety per cent am, with the majorities of all groups, all ages, all itiologies. All everything else and then also enormous support in the eighty like a round. Eighty eighty five per cent, four, a a red flag. Ah you'd, have the idea that you take guns away from people who, like the Parklin Shooter, make enou seen. It seems evident. Tha on their wther other way. Mewbent at MOUT Noah is very. You were very fortunate that we have a constitution. There Fance us Ye Ae, feeling things length wildly over interpreting the a Interstat commerce clause to make private sales illegala Acry els of a legur at you're, Imprict you're, presuming that the constiution will be read that way by the Courtz iig anyway, I'm
so ordinarily, the Thingabout's gun control since nineteen. Ninety four has been that, no matter what the polling says: you're stupid, to push gun control, if you think it's gon a pet, because it only activates, you know, gun owners and- and you get no credit for it- for pushing at and failing I, if you're, if you're a gun controller, a Enmio Democrats blame some of them, the loss of the house in Nineteenen, a cent nineteeny four four because of ah the the fault, weapons ban and stuffed like that. The question really is whether numbers like this. You know I a a nerve, a people who are not in Unoserve like firm Gun Staythat were like not firm, Guidont now top my head, but I got a fivid figure that the numbers were similar and to an
Irteen not like this. I mean that it's always when you say: should you bar military style weapons, a majority says yes right and people like background checks, but the question is whether the the anarray, its Inscrurn position or whether the Plato's cave game of being afraid of gun owners, so motivates Republicans, TAT, thelblocked or Mexicol that they'll block anything. Or is this something that you know a minithick of? It's not a at this moment if it's not a torneyg whyn did think, I think were probably headed for one on that and in terms of being a m afraid to to aggravate cononors on that Immedate, if only just because since a bigesino, twenty thirteen anter tidler when they m the a Gil Ye Tlis when I was how Yeh YF no is the effort too.
Sandy hor, the sandin? The thing I ui at legislation I ye manche to me and a mention Timy Woll us you know I int comparatively a lot weaker than what Democrats or visioning now there's been so many size mass shooting. Since then I mean I men. The real issue here is is: is this question of whether or not amino. Oddly enough, I the idea that the other can come for our guns if they would honestly, if Democrats would nod be craze, at this either Tho words like if they said what we want our background checks. We want em yon knowt, we want a van semi or it a wee. We want a prevent or impede or whatever tha the sales of certain types of sevi automatic weapons cause. What you need, the that for hunting its offerathin like that, but would you, but when you sail the Suffo men but Bettor workses and mandatory bybacks, which macintly
n confiscation right. Then you go on my god. They really do and tik they are they anly to hat. To take our goat. That's that's the problem that I think thee the progressive shift. The more progressive shift in the Democratic Party has prevented those kinds of discussions from occurring am, and it's it's just the left version of. When you know the wildly proenoray folk say you can't regulate anything about guns, a meaneds that there is no but no room for compromise, and it's it's that the Betto Commons were hilarious because he was phasically sanctimoniously going around talking about how worgan his seas guns and a EE that does read to people who are very prosn amendment as Yetho there ging to come into my house and seize my private property on a law. Budding citizen and the constution protects my right to own a weapon Mamy. I hear that in his rhetoric and Theke the Kun of the the Self Ous tone of a lot of the left discussion of guns is exactly what prevents even those tho sort of MO
suburban lady voters who were always talking about, but who will be Cruciel in the next election, who were Crucialin twenty eighteen, the prevent you know that they are the ones who that's the message that WAN here I think, Amit Better work was, I wit, a congressman for six years from El Paso. Will you suppose the percentage of God ownership was in his district like if he were still in the house wunting for the presidency from the house. He couldn't iubly talk this way. I mean that that's part of what's interesting like he could even say this is my Distric, it's the most horrible thing ever blab a blois, but you know it's likely it's well over. Fifty per cent of the bino of the people in his district have Dones in the home, and- and that's where they are, you know, am in places like Texas, near the binou
border am Idunno. I it's as interesting me because the pulling suggests that ah well structured legislation could really push everybody somewhere. But again, even the Red Flaglaws are just going to be inducements for states to create these laws. The federal government doesn't have that authority right. Well, the wre. Bull it it. It doesn't have I'll get wiy about. Fegarbid has some authority over his Linley Gorat Linzy LAW, Lindseys a push bon sa Phor government does have some authority over guns to whant one of the few, a products that the Phero government had some authority over there's actually agency that deals with guns ah or was a men. It was now subsumed into homeland security,
Yeu there was that there's a federal band on from nineteen thirty, four Ave aout, his Osing Wy Pus, isn't about a background track. This is about identifying an individual whose mentally unfit and unstable Aman has to be a judge as to make that determination. Right, but I'm saying the FBI. That is something that is something theres. Federal roll in it if it could ever happen, which it couldn't there's a book out to day by Ino the Father of the meadow, a one of them, the victimsof of parkland. You know who was basically the book is everybody knew that Nicholas Gruise was was, was a firecrack. It ASA was a piece of dynamite waiting to explode and for two years nobody did anything and if somebody had done something they would all be alive to day, and I grant you the wed that Red Flaglaws are incredibly problematic, and yet there is some there's a logic to what was
set there, you know that we don't really I meaning we just get out to you. Just throw up your hands and say you know there are two: there was two years of red flags. Had nobody did anything and then he came in and shot the building up. I don't know Christine Ale, you. I think the other thing that one of the other things that's always missing. When we talk about gun deaths and be of the amount of media attention that mass shootings get, which are a small ginow to small number, a percentage wise percentage wise. You know more than halfinings eroun. Sixty per sixty percent of all death by guns are suicides Higher this year, as seventy Tiadus AR crimes of despair. Exactly the death of despair. So I think, if you're again, if you want to have an honest, a by Partis an discussion of gun and deaths in this country and the risks of guns. Then you have also talk about
till health. You have to talk about these deaths of despair. You have stuck about suicide and nobody. I don't see a lot of people doing that. I see much. Partisan a poor debates about the anarae and- and you know on on the left side and on the right, you know there's a similar unwillingness to talk about the dangers of gun, even lately owned guns in the home, and I think, if we really Wen Forward a past the bickering on the gun to bat. We have to talk about that cause. Those deaths are rising. I mean, I think, that the real dish you hear is that a it is very hard for liberals to deal with. This issue was of public policy health issue because of the of their embrace of extreme personal autonomy, of which, if you think about it, the logical and conclusion is have a right to commit suicide right. That's the! If you have total control of your body. If you can be whatever Gener, you want to be, if you can be whatever you wante could do anything to yourself. You could do as long as you inturting Bu Health and all that than that that,
the there. There can be no OM that there's no way to then say well, ye accept your wits, you're, not alav, to kill yourself because you. Why not? I mean Lewesion think that the Red flag laws take as their assumption that mental health is a part of this discussion and should be ryh, ad mean anywone. If you support Weyre being able to flag people as potential violent risks than your, you are by definition talking about their state of mind in their their level. Have we have wiv, we of thousands of people now supporting the act of Inev, cutting things off of your body in order to claim that you are the agender that you're, not so? Ah, that seems to be perfectly permissible. So, with the do Ah, that's all ye. You could also say that's a mental health issue that were refusing to deal with
Onsay and Tenna, I think, on the right yathey that the whole notion of admitting the idea that we weat guns, don't kill people, people kill people right. So that's the key statement and yet the act. The whole thing is that at with, if somehow magically there were no guns, obviously fewer people would kill themselves and fewer people call themselves another cut, because I it's the easiest, possible wated to do this. Edocus YE stabbing your erch of a stag yourself, twenty times a ve in order to commit suicide anyway, let's some. Ah, this is a terrible. You know. So, at least you know, nthing, you know, but healthy people is that they brush their teeth. Has that for a transition, a
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that it was not going to happen. The Taliban, then were Camp David and they were GEN, announce a big deal with the Taliban or something like that. Just you know how to be. You know, three days before the a eighteenth anniversary of nine eleven like couldn't be a month after two months. After had to be now am and an end at Trump proudly tweeted. We only know that they were coming to Camp David because because Trump told us in a tweet that they were coming to Camp David. He cancelled the trip because there was a terrace bombing on Thursday in Coble that I only killed a american soldier and others, and so you know the Youm. Can you believe that the taliband killed some
And we can't have that. So that's the end of the negotiation that has been going on since tromp decided that he needed somebody to go in and make a deal so that he could announce in twenty twenty that he had pulled our force Wis out of Afghanistan. Ah. Don't everybody jump in all at once on the jaw dropping nature of this notion? Lut, we we hended a piece negotiation, because terrorists killed people in a terraced attack. Ah, that's what happens? That's what they do, and so, when you sign the deal, then you serve hope against hope that they will somehow be rewarded for not doing it, but they're not got a deal act that way until there's a deal signed. There is no deal to be made with Talban Taliban. We heard about
the t, similaro types of effortsth during the Abalme years. I was talk about negotiations with so called MO. Rit Taklban um? The problem is, of course, that they are fundamentally opposed to. U, as tey are fundamentally of is date day, they are in a in direct opposition to all the Americas. The United States goal. In Afghanistan am course Trump One a A lot of people want out um. It may, in fact, be true that this is or we cannot win, but it is a war we can most definitely and very dangerously lose, which is why we cannot actually, but why we shouldn't pull aut for an aside from whether or not we can. We can get a deal with the Taliban. The tallmot cannot put, we can lose, I'm in the Senset Te Towbank in once again a host tee Rist who will plan attacks on Mery
and our allies and will, of course, am undue all the a actual progress that U S, forces and men and others have made I'm enough ghavistan. Over the years we were pasically had to reconstitute the televan. In order to Asomenton Uchiate with a lot of these people were in Guantanimo Bayk lit the people were to Gost, remember the a talaban five who were released for in exchange for bobart gall and they were swimming the ones the ones we saw Swimminga, happily, whose right they had been released. They went to straight from one tonm obey to Delho, for negotiations was only koliolzad and were surprised at were not speaking with representatives of the talaband Ofr, the es for signing the first walls
tar to know what constitutes the telepane at this poin I mean sir of Alusa. Malcom will sow the stories that we rather the stories explaining. Why thet that what WY the negotiations end Ittham were not really about this terraced attack. Obviously this one, this one attack ar that it became clear to America, negotiators of the people. They were ingotiating with head, no control over the people who actually are fighting in the fihilt who are doing whatever is that they will do ah and so of it was a. I don't think you can here's the weird part, so people are tasked with finding a solution, rights, others zalkalizad this you know, but most the american diplomat, with the most thankless jaw,
In the history of jobs is sent to make some kind of a deal right and so he's got here. Is that he's there, the afghan government's there in the towel there and the afghan government says you can't make a felvam and he you now basically has to put shutthem them to one in order to try this and he's got a fine negotiating partner. So what so? You do? He did what he did, what a America Diad in ninety ninety three and what Israel did Parsley Magtenet, which was allow Yasser Arifot to leave tunus to basically come back to the West Bank to become a negotiating partner. I'm they made him the vocal point, even though he was no longer had not lived in or Palestinians for many years. So
sort of the same idea, but without any operational authority. Well, indeed, of Cour leave it to trump to add what is usually within any administration near the power struggles that go on. But in this case it's between John Bolton and my compeo about who is vision of foreign policy will dominate, leave it to trump to just completely blow up, even those normal sort of power. Skirmishes. He's: got the talaban calling his credibility into question because of the tweet storm. I mean that it's just this idea that an I think the tators, who pointed out that it seemed like tromp, en to have another north career a moment in Ond er Thos made for t v. I'm look what ih've done. I'm so amazing moments of inforeign policy that as soon as it looked like, was at risk, am in that his kind ofcredibility on in that setting
would be undermined. He just called it off and completely upbending these extremely delicate negotiations of thei. Going on I dont look. I would thank God he called them off. I mean not that I think he deserves. You know deserves blame for having insisted on attempting them or something right. They shouldn't invited I'm right date, but I should not have one that that and the negotiations themselves as the apron, no both say like them. The negotiations were doomed to failure and pop party that I would say I mean to be a Neealist. I would say mine, so pull out. You know ye et get ot Prtt putting some kind of lipstick on the pig of pulling out is a fraud loud and see what happens. Go. Go ahead. Fine, you know we we, we know, we ve invested eighteen years of blood, swell, sweat and tears. Their say it's Of say, we're done. No democratis can attack you. They are all they all want, every democratic, a
Sal Cavt Wonce, a pullet from Myf Gast and Soll, pull out and see what happens because negotiated deal. The same resides, no, I think would say the samord you have. The same result will will will take place, which is that there will be at you. Kno the civil war between the Taliban and the afghan government, Accelerate and, with the very likely result that eventually the Tal then will take the country over again so go ahead. I mean you know if yort, if you're too chicken to face that is a possibility. Maybe don't walk around saying we're end. This mar M in their sin, fun ment. That is illustrative, I think, of a broader dynamic when the president announced that he was calling off this summit that no one was aware of Norse can be Taleban in Nuw as soil before nine eleven was hailed as a great victory in a moment of real courage from his republic. Supporters, uncle like Lizscenie in the house and that sort of
darkly humorous, but it's also indicative of the fact that the Republican Party Writ large is not supportive, of retreats is generally more more extroverted when it comes to foreign policy than I think a lot, and we talk about this, not back office, Then a lot of the influential opinion makers are on the right, then a lot of the people who are supportive of a populist Turnd toward the rootdof. The republican party are't mors, far more amenable towards an interval. Foreign impose than I think the average rank and file republican Voteris. I don't like surrender, they don't like defeat a They don't necessarily know how to win this thing, but they do want to lose it and that's what that looks. Like ah and Nhat, I think I sa- is an under appreciated, dynamic. There wir the Thea indian elite on the right- are much more a supportive of a restrained, humble foreign policy than I think their voters are oh case, so
I maybe that's what Trump in Tuit it last week. Unless somebody basically said luck, we got to stop this, I mean now. I got to tell you mister President. We have no confidence that any that that the people that were dealing with have any even connection with the people
were fighting on the ground a hossible, but in also North area example suggests otherwise. But it's also possible that you could have a narrative building around the presidents overtures too a bad actrors hostile actors around the world for which he gets nop no substanto benefit, but I mean I will say this, which is that you know whatever it is that gey ye that the Kim has done in North Carea is not involved, a the harbouring and collusion in the murder of thousands of Americans and Trump. You know its one thing to say whale. I can deal with this kid and we have tho say he's terrible that he hasn't killed. Americans and now we have the opposite, which, as we would we would be having you know, I m it's an interesting contrast with the pialo and and
an Baroc and at Clinton and Rubbinan, an our thought or even which is like o ka. So we were pushing the Israelis to make a deal with the piala which had killed more Jews than anybody. You know no Sainse hetler and they it and we were standing there saying all this is the greatest thing I ver right now we're negotiating on behalf of a third party, meaning the afghan government, theoretically with people who were directly or indirectly responsible for the murder of thousands of Americans, against whom we have been fighting a war. So the optics are that the president present I is has Geen
come these a killers who also you know, destroyed cultural patrimony, and you know I you have destroyed this stat, the fifteen hundred year old statues, and you know that, murdered people and stadiums and did all that to e scannies and then murdered? Americans am and Murdy Americans that we were being with and we've been funnyng against eighteen years. That is a bizarre optical idea like once. If our people are not killed and it's another of our people are, and you can make peace. You know, but you don't do it. You know president's retreat that Usy, and this, I think, goes to an issue with tromp an his political judgment that was I think he may have saved himself from the worst by calling us off. Why did he tell a
that they were meeting at Camp a that's what I can't fathom he did not have to say they were coming and I called it off. He could have said because I think not Many people knew was happening, could have said I've direct are negotiators to suspend negotiations out. You know, because we can't trust them and that's what's happening. He one who unilaterally told the world that he was inviting them into. You know: Cococton the Cococtiv Mount Erhowers pronounced Kittokin Nowing's a arland what Howard, but he gets Tattack an et. Ate Thatsp, yes, and to you know to be at the president. You know catcan private retreat, Whe. He and we wouldn't know that so he's pull judgment is bazaar. He caused this entire stake. If he had said, Look were negotiating Wist
negotiations ecause. This American was killed. That would be fine. Nobody would and in fact we would praise them. Like everybody else, Wold pray he's it's the camp David Aspect of this that is so unnerving orn't, even o that it's political. Do. I think it's personal, that he thinks that anything worth doing is worth making a spectacle of. What's well put, but does that mean, including suspending Yething, that you're doing guess? Yes, he was well that proud to try and and ten proud to too henoted T pragmatically turn away from him or something s that thing Lise asked the can't yet but It'Is Tere Camp David component that don't buddy ARI you're oll. I think you're owder having ogliness to be old, English ogered Christine I just Ta Gore Ofer thinking it because this is his twitter purse
his twitter, a id expressing it. It's the same impulse that led him to attack John Legends, what he colloured filthy, mouth, wife Chrisino'. He it's the same, he's in the same register for both, which has long been a problem of his of his a exercisof power. But I think that's why youd think it through it. Didn't even it's like when he relestesd you know military, intelligent, satellite, timid. She is didn't think about it like go, of course, on the Preson. I can do what I want. Oh and you know what you should do. If you are an american within the sound of my voice, you should be using Harry He have been shaving for ever five thousand years, which is a terrifying thought, as from they used flint tools that use sharp teeth. Copper razor, But you know in the emigrate of comes down to the simple, sharp, durable blades. The ancient Greeks didn't need flak balls are heated handles, and neither do you. That's why Harry's doesn't add features to their razors. They focus on the qualities that actually matter for a close, comfortable shave. They never upcharge you
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Wated Hergan on TA candle fur, a firm grip Blaid Razor with a liver heating, Stripen term er late, rich lathering, shave jell with awl, the keeperskin hydrated and a travel blad cover to keep you razor dry. These aund the goat, go to Harry's dock come's lasht commentary to start shaving better to a so as the house is back in session to day or tomorrow, some like that and apparently the res s has not stilled a democratic hunger. A for some faint at least toward impeachment. So we read that the House Houstoditiary Committee is going to push full bore into questions of hush money. And emoluments and other stuff which means I guess that they are moving on from Russia, which at least is a ye knows in advance of some sort, ah, but I guess this either the fact that now more and half of the House caucus supports impeachment or supports begin
in inquiry. I don't even know what the hell they're talking about that's by design, but yet ha is some Fook. So their various ideas being flood. Apparently one of them is that the House Judiciary Committee would vote on articles of impeachment and vote to impeach a but wouldn't send the impacient reports of them floor of the house to be voted or by everybody else. They would just do it and they could say that the House Jeusure Committed voted articles of peachment and said that he should be impeached ah Which is kind of what happened with Nixon but of course nixs in them resigned, because he to do that, it would pass the house and then I would go the Senate. He would probably lose a trial am so why Boawe, as will we make in the staby or the one? I wanted to talk about this nor
one particularl, but but ah we'll ay it. The gots in was you can enter that if thin get's intersting that um a Y. Plosy has still not said anything in favour of this idea. Write Ame, you cheese, she sort of fu. She is not in the same page as as Jerry Nabler, who has been talking it up now. Ah,. Insist rang were recently. Why me, maybe I think, no said this is by design, so maybe the the answer is that the democratic caucus should speak with many voices. Are the house do share? It can make an impeach, but the full house doesn't have to impede there you know this. One can do this. We, the intelligence, may do that and all this, but but the whole body will not have to move on it. An. The simplest thing to say about this is that there is going to be an election in fourteen months and therefore of the american people will decide whether remove Donald Trump from office or not.
Then, as we have said many times, the the if they do allow the many voices approach in and they even bring article improvement to the floor, but there's no vote on it. You can see the Trump campaign add that will be made by that. It will be either because they're scared of me. There, too, scared to put it to a vote. As they know, I'd win or its I'm it's a witch hunt. It's unfair! I mean either way he could spin it in his favor. If, if that, if they do that or you can try You I should say which I think goes to the polarization point I made earlier of on the pocass, which is that you know
the honest way for this country to conduct the twenty twenty election would be Sanders verses or war in verses Trump, because that's really how the politics of the country works, and so what you would have is a kind of a blinders. If it's not that way, because then you could have this con deniability rihte, like Polozi's deniability, hear her caucus once to impeach him, but she doesn't ah or she is trying to protect them from their worst impulses or something like that, I'm that got an unbernated fire under the issue
the week end with this story, which frankly seemed a little inflated about these, a stopovers of a tes scottish trump on property involving refeeling in a local airport. For you a say, a er force on Flightsan in the the controllers of the pilots, Tayd spending the night in a Trump property, and that was it's not that the local airport is in the problen here that the Trum Property's proximity to it is the problem in the air forces sortr of given Sime palidity to it by investigating the extent to which this is O brought practice and whether their propping up from properties. I think that id think the accusation, frankly in the original or
rning was a little overblown, but Zalick ERS, nothing there and the Erportastry AIR forces treating elegance there's something there. So I mean that sort at takes you back to the emoluments issue, which is probably the the issue they should have been focussing on from the beginning, because if it's not the federal government, it certainly the Republican Party, the apparatus of the Gaio P, which is propping up bottle trumps, act, a interests in of financial interests and properties happend for some time in its pretty out in the open, I'm so goun in there's Thirs there's hay to be made there, but that doesn't change that Inamy Coul thet were FE to Onowin, don't il in Peach bet, Thut. Isn't there I ijust. Can add that I think Noah's absolute right? I think, for a long time, I've just wondered why Democrats haven't been Savvee enough to come up with a better way of ingabout emoluments. Nobody wants to hear the word. A monuments out in you know a Eric as it were, because it doesn't make sense to them. But what does make sense to a voter? I would think is saying this president is using the power of his office to line his own pockets and those of his family members. While that message simply put, I would
powerful. I agree, although here here's what I would say about that, so let let us assume that fine, so Trump's, probably not worth for a billion dollars, is only worth five hundred billion dollars or whatever, like that. So, according to what we've heard in twenty fifteen or two thousand and sixteen federal government spend something like one hundred and twelve thousand dollars at Trump properties and last year was five point: nine million. Okay. So obviously that's a huge increase its not if you can, You know assume that it's just you know, happens tance. On the other hand, what does he need? Five point: nine million dollars for id mean that that would be the answer. As YE's house proud, he loves his properties. He thinks turn very fantastic. He loves his hotel in Washington. He thinks everybody should stay at his golfing resort, including the g, the the G twenty, where the Gade Whereber.
That was to go there. You know so makes all the money big deal. That's not why he that's that's not what he cares remember he's somebody who, who is in the most of his apolitic most of, is Irchin there most of his life was spent. You knowt the dealing with a billion dollars in debt like it's otthat, he needs it and he he likes. I cas it's, it's what we called Cavode in Inhebrew, which a serve like in our being paid a obeisance too or being given pride of is I'm I so now hards to get it wrong way. Looking at it, he doesn't care about making money. He cares about losing money. He doesn't like to shudder properties which well the indications were in that story of particularly about this very stressed property in Scotland that it was facing some hard times. I mean nobody likes the close of property, but exclosed close plenty businesses in his life includie
most of them. No, you body, sail's the plain the water, the magazine, the game, I a an continalbraend that they operat the Baw League Wat TE won't a Mittit. But isn't he allso just going against the norm of the Presency, which is you don't cash until after you leave all the hoary. All know that that happens, that he's is kind of refusing to play by even that small rule. Yet. Sapped. Okay, honestly, I don't think that this is any parallel, but you know I mean how much did Obama make on royalties from dreams from my father during his presidency thirty million dollars, forty million Ty, how many schools adopted he dreams of my father? How many I mean how many copies of itself sell during his presidency? How many countries bought rights to translated into you know into their languages? that you know it's like. I don't I I don't care, I really don't care about this, issue. Whether or not people make a lot of money or don't make a lot of my
I'mder saying that Enow Maya, I think a moluments would have been a better issue CAS it's easier to says just TE rich guy trying to screw everybody the same WY. All rich people do in that kind of populous way. I I just don't believe that he has structure, you know the abserd from argument that this is all about money. That's ridiculous! You know, your Preslu, Nited States, Yeu, know six million dollars. You're Yoand mean what does it mean you're living rent, free and I don't know you're living rent free in the white as he got all, are all this together. The entire federal government is there to protect you. I don't know At some point, your psychology is going to shift and you're going to say out. This is that's all. That's all nonsense. I think I don't know
and with that weple Dring, we'll bring this to a close. So Foraviously wasn't angry Maud than little Roughon him. John pudwards Givn. Hi Bnmm.
Transcript generated on 2019-11-29.