This is the Jacko underground podcast number twenty seven sitting here with ECHO Charles some. I've known as ECHO Charlie to failure. So the last one of these that we did- we are talking about this- this psychological study called the monster study which is really messed up and also kind of shows, the kind of influence you can have over another human being special young, malleable human being but then we were talking to Hicks, embracing the other day on the Jackal, podcast and um. He was talking about How are you how he overcame claustrophobia? He went to the Hickson Veto and I I I know I kind of wanted to say somethin during the bar guessed, but what a sidetracked apart gas, let's face it, we could out of forty five,

maybe one hour discussion about year, experts claustrophobia. So I figured I made a will know we get on here, we could talk about Europe, the cross, a phobia which were pretty gnarly, and then you got over it kind of, I believe, were you up What was it like? What did it feel like United to train, and you sometimes would tat out from not a submission, but just from claustrophobia, yes, well yeah, I had a guy you're, my dunes and he would we roll and I drove with everybody so that by the time he would show up cuz I drove people. Sequentially, hey you coming. You do five hundred and fifteen. You come at five hundred and thirty. Whatever by the time the skies showed up. I would be so sweaty and he would He only probably road with me three times because after that he didn't want to digital media by he

Remember him just getting so angry! You know, I'm raw side round mounted or something which japanese tapping two sectors book get off me. walking around the map angry you know what I'm saying is anyway claustrophobia, but he expressed it through anger and frustration, but just really just anger. He hated what were we well funny as this? Could they do think about it, because it that you know like we see in the movies or whatever or you hear about people, and they have a really bad like they can go on an elevator or like in a crowded space or whatever, where it's not? It's, not even that. Not that at all. More. The idea that I can't I can't get out of here, like I can't move. I can't get out of this

height like me, space yeah, listen, reminding me of animal choir story about being in the torpedo tube with water and and a wig and three other guys twenty one inch circle by the way. I saw comments that we read that the twenty wanted circle that's size of echo. Charles, is Yemen that us, alas, a little that's a little do Buren ear and saw even that I'd, feel it with water and stuff. Here, that's crazy! Here's! The thing that would always help, though, is if I, if I had something, also my mind like if I was doing something about a job to do or whatever then it day takes it away fully. So the times are felt in a really had to like milk, and so did you two right where you really liked Jujitsu? Yes, you really did you do everything, but that so kind of had to force yourself to get over that year and you

there was only a handful of people that I felt it with, though, when because your side, modest freakin, is not only. heavy, could you put a bunch of extra is on your side control like the heaviness like when you walk random, two thirty or whatever you don't feel like it. There I've had guys who three hundred pounds that their sight controls, not that, like hard you know just your regular side control, not the kind like your training elbows live like that. Just regular resting side control, whatever is like heavy. It was, it's about the physical feeling is more about them. though, feeling because, if They would like a really new digital guy anymore site mountains. Two hundred seventy pounds I know like when it I'm I can get out of here. If I make it a point like I'm gonna get out, I can get out so whatever, but with you. This is not like that. I can be like, like in my life can depend on it and I probably won't get out of here so and then to mention and probably tired or

will soon enough for energy. Little short on little short on breath like honest thing and you put it all together is so I feel like I'm working on a very specific technique to get out of sight control. It won't affect me it's weird because I'll be work on that technique, but if it fails a couple, I'm sorry, I'm just left with a side control them like thing yet feel it for sure, but has a lot to do to your kind over it on time over yet for sure under hundred percent I have a problem with that, the test the earlier future, if and here's the thing to hear the weird thing. It's also so remit don't worry, you thought I wasn't over it or you may be thought it wasn't. You wanted to clinical put it to the test, and you did this to you. It's like it, showing you put your feet up on the wire to make an extra harry and, as I feel it physically, but I didn't feel it mentally. Almost like the maybe your cured I felt like them.

where you're trying to do it to me- and I know you're trying to make me cost for the lesser works I feel like if you just like you just like ok, you got the position and let me just the ear to set up this set up that I'm, like men, there's no escape on this thing can see your dedicated to the site, control for the for the personal purpose of having this identical for reason, and then I no choice because you're gonna hold it in when it might neither you put your feet upon the one you like an echo folk inside controls. I controls that mountain or you got determined yeah like guys like me against you now, so I get to the guy. It's like. I have another job to do, but piano anymore. I don't think I feel like what you after heart, but I think a psychological is, if you start thinking about it. Thinking about the fact that you can't move. There's some parable about you're in this village and there's a part in the village and

can stir the part through the night without thinking about, and they tell you what you're not allowed to think about than through the night. Turned a gold, and so they tell whatever the thing is it not possible? I dont think about the waterfall If you think about the waterfall won't turn into gold. And so everyone goes out there- the stern the pot and they think about the waterfall- and they don't typical, But then someone shows up- and they say: hey just turn to this bottle night. They don't tell him what did not think about and then I go in there, they start do not pay attention to it. It just anything Any things like that right now, if you dont noticed someone if someone's is pays that noise, bothering you I was even now I couldn't hear now. It's bothering me, so you got learned not to shut that party or brain off and just just fixated. Other things not get focused on the fact that you can't move your arms near when there's a waterfall, he became Hickson brought up a good point, no which-

I was impressed that he had this mindset so early where you'd like he felt the claustrophobia from the headlong time he yet many goes like works on it in this like crazy way at how twelve years old. Is that only twelve, usually a twelve year like I've, never been again avoid deadlock next time you know, but I feel like one year I am more like in shape and breathing hell, since stuff like that, and then the more you uniting the more I roll with you, the more yet the less cost for we feel run on ice, wondering ran up. yes, let's wrongly opportunity to get some interesting unit, a jackal, an echo, a huge fan of progress. I appreciate everything they use it since listen, I went from being a high school dropout to maintaining a four point: no GPA in all my college classes or working full time in training at least three day

We can jujitsu dreams to pursue a minute. I have dreams to pay. Sue the military. Once I complete my associates degree- and I cannot thank you enough for the motivation and mentorship that I received from pockets with all- have been set, if feel, are I'm lacking a strong male figure in my life? I'm a merry. Twenty one year old female abolished, biologic father isn't in the picture. has been as paramilitary and struggles deeply with depression, is very mentally unstable struggles with wanting to end his life. Often I feel like that have strong male figure to lean on when I need help we're advice, a truly want, I truly

what what Dakota Meyer spoke of? Having with you, someone, I know I can call entrust my question is: how do I find a fatherly figure as an adult is something I should let happen organically through Jujitsu or in the future through the military? Do you think is something that I should just forget a move on from. Instead, if it's something I should pursue actively, what does that look like tangibly? Thanks for your awesome, so he is where I think of mentors- and I have talked about this before you- ve- got a kind of build your own mentor in life and the chances that you have someone that swooped down to mentor you the job that happening in Vienna over way hijacker how you doing I'm, I want to be your mentor. Well great. You, experience in the things that I have always want to do so you're gonna be a good mentoring, so that is a

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