T.J. English is an author and journalist known primarily for his non-fiction books about the Irish mob, organized crime, criminal justice and the American underworld. His latest book "The Corporation: An Epic Story of the Cuban American Underworld" is available now. Joey “CoCo” Diaz is a Cuban-American stand up comedian and actor. Joey also hosts his own podcast called “The Church of What’s Happening Now”. https://www.amazon.com/Corporation-Story-Cuban-American-Underworld/dp/0062568965
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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A dollar shave club, Dotcom, Ford, Slash, Rogan, that's dollar, shave, club, dot, com, Fort Slash, Rogan all right. My guest today are two guests, one, the great powerful Joe ideas who is always welcome. And T J, English teacher teacher English as an author, and he wrote a book that Joey gave me many years back or the west is about mobsters in New York City, it's an outstanding, book, and now he has a new book called the corporation about these Cuban been organised criminals and It's amazing. The stories Guy has and in conjunction with Joey, you know Joe. We grew up Around these kind of people in New Jersey and New, a lot of the people in the book and I mean it's really, it's a great I've got a really enjoy doing it, and Joey's hilarious. As always, so please but not for Joe ideas and teaching English
The job will gain experience. My luggage, ideas and T J English We turned me on to you a long time ago. Mr English, he gave me A copy of the west is right. What year was that ninety ninety nine long time ago gave me that book, it's fantastic, really fascinating stuff. Here, first book I published was really west each year, ninety ninety how'd- you guys fun out of each other. He wrote a book, I find them. I turn me into a book men. Havana turn that was a small book, a fascinating ree and I was just blown away by and I went to a party one main that will really ages. Then I got you fuckin guys read of turning away option that that's fucking. That's gonna be a great book with you, sir. It broke down the aisle. How for death
took over from three different cities how it was going down in three different categories, and then I heard that he was writing a book about West New York and Union City Cubans. Why? I grew up and I emailed them- and I told him my mother had a bar. I grew up in that shit. He hit me back and we became friends. He came to a show yeah Joey reached out to me. You know, fortunately, when I was just about finishing his book So I had done most of the work and it was down on paper, but it was a trip. It was He will. He was like a character who walked out of the book, and I wish madame earlier cause. I had meant to many characters like him. It cities amazing place. Nothing, People realize it it's. One of those little enclaves happens to be Cuban is come off neighborhood, but it was Cubans. Not Italians
or was like Hell's kitchen, which I wrote about in the west, is which irish neighbourhood very intense neighbourhood, premium on loyalty, young, males, run and loyalty games on each other. All the time from the age of six of how we. How far you girls ran a sucker up. How for how far will you go for me? You know what are you willing to do for me? In a case, a house kitchen in the west easier we cut, our bodies was not Would you kill somebody from me, but why you make the party disappear and they test at each other with with the cutting up of the bodies and unions city a lot of it was- was political, some of those people. How anti Fidel are you? How bad Why do you want to kill in all Fidel Hand, help us reclaim are lost homeland? That was behind a lot of things, it wasn't spoken about alive, but it was sort of the hidden motivation. West isn't
Really fantastic book like you, you went into that whole sort of sub scene. Now it is a very interesting crime, infested area. While what when I try to do with these books is to tell the macro story, the larger historical socio political story, an egg intimate and tell the interpersonal stories between characters had actually live. The story, that's a challenge. You gotta find people who are willing to talk to you and share informed nation. With you, the tape kept quiet problem most of their lives? And then you, at the end of personal stuff. Keziah stories really are just human beings caught up in something that's bigger than them. And how long when you, when you write a book like the corporation, which is your new book or west, is any of your books. How much time you spend do the research and how much time he's been. Actually writing a book takes about three
Here's to do these books on average in an to those years is research, probably while here last night, So you do bring this to the book company, though that the publisher and you say hey. This- is what I want to write a book about a proposal. I do very, very detailed proposals. Further corporation, I did a proposal was one hundred twenty five pages long and it's a chapter by chapter break down. It's almost like a condensed version of the book and ass. You get more money from a publisher that way as in advance, because you are showing them the whole thing practically, they can see the the finished product almost. And also you know the movie interests there was movie Kristen this one, the corporation, based on that on that proposal interested was option two based on that proposal before even starting right in the book real. So what is the cooperation about corporations a story. The cuban American organised crime organization-
again in the mid nineties, sixties and exist at all the way to the end of the century and was led by this mobster named Jose Miguel battle. Who It's kind of a legendary figure in cuban american circles, because He was a hero from the bay of pigs invasion The the attempt to reclaim Cuba take back Cuba there invasion. Nineteen sixty one which was a disease, two for everyone involved battle, wound in law with the rest of the brigade when he got out and came back to the? U S, he was determined to get Castro and take back Cuba so he set up this criminal thing and it was based on one rack, primarily lolita than but the lottery, the illegal lottery for the lottery was legal. It was illegal and it was controlled by organised crime and it A huge money make big money, for the mob gone back to the nineteen twenties. Everyone
it's. The number little Ladys bet the number priests cops you know you can bet a nickel even better dime. Even can thousand dollars hugely profitable for whoever controls and organizes, while the Cubans, control and organised on the eastern coast of United States. From New Jersey and New York, all the way down to Miami and the guy control. It was battle, Annie, became legendary based on that they control the hold number cystic, as I know, there's a lot of Italians that were involved. They went and they went to the mafia. One of the first things battle did battle, had a cop, a vice cop in Havana, nineteen fifty's during the turnover during the year during era when the mob Joe you someone Havana Nocturnal with that book was about the era of the mob in advance in the fifties: Meyer Lansky Santa traffic Dante and how they controlled that until Now- still came along and spoiled the party and the revolution happen, and they got chased out of their battle
had been a vice cop in Havana during those years and he knew all those high ranking mobsters. In fact, he was a bag man who delivered money from the skin the casinos in Havana to the presidential palace so bow, knew how the world went round and he made those connections and when he finally gets to the U S and wants to start his own thing. First thing he does go to send to traffic contents. Has can you make the proper in order Actions from me, practicality, do seemed fat Tony Salerno in New York City who controls the numbers. Racket for all five families battle says: look things a chair in Cuba over the next couple decade, you're gonna have ten thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of Cubans come in to live in United States, they all better number that's a huge market! If you let me take over this thing and organise it, you will piece of you, will get your piece of everything and if you said yes
and so the Cubans took over and control everything I mean in New York City in the seventies and eighties, there were prob. You two hundred to three hundred Molitor spots, where you could go set the number. That's the Cubans collar Bali, too little ball and so they controlled it and They took care the the mafia and everybody was got fat and happy, for a while until it turn bad and they started killing each other. Joey when you heard about this book. This is something that you were very intimately involved when you, when you kid very come on you shoulda today. It is a hundred stories I could tell you was a thousand. I can't when he told when I read the thesis for this book. I just knew I just fuckin know in. I grew up in numbers When I went to catholic School on salaries MIKE, I came home on Fridays and salaries at the age of eight, I was sent to different locations in the city, the Bronx Brooklyn, and I will make fifty
I was gonna run errands run a numbers they'll tell this guy the first number, the days too, you know. So I grew up in and I grew up in a house where the book he would call my mother by three o clock now. What's the numbers for the day, my mother would give a fuck laundry list, you know and its various stay in this book. You also covers the mysticism of the number. So if I'm at your house and your daughter walks in with a hockey shirt numbers, thirteen I'll look at you and go Joe, give me a number from zero to nine five. Phone. I bet five thirteen. If I look at my window in the top cause five or six, I put five hours on five or six, If I have a dream about an eagle when I go down to the Bali, the spot does books that they sell books of dreams, and I take that book and I look up eagle if eagles number, eight
Eight thirteen! It's you know you! You will mentioning a couple months ago that your grandmother to number yeah grandmother was sicilian, sicilian people have the same. Every day they live ten Asian you raised the danger. Rogue today is the day made the number that didn't you. Article that dream that dream again we're gone by immigrant mentality that those three numbers today of God wants. God is real. What he says is true. My numbers come out of it What is my ship gonna come in then work. You work a play, Jane James Ramey wrote you a blue collar person on the way home every day by three thirty, you put the number it. That's it that's. We do believe in something like a relatively new morality and would Cubans it was very mystical, was tied in to
dreams and belief? The eye dear words, you bet the number and you try make your dreams come true. That's literally, were you doing it trying to make your dreams come true, and the Bali two guys the bully terrorised the ones who control it. There, the dream makers, guys we're making it possible for your dreams to come true, so they had tremendous stature in the community to move that we arrange Salva. So you work, Bt Jays pose a battle and you're an independent bookie. Your job is to sit at a brain, the lounge and westmere. From ten to three drinking and all day long people come an NGO joke. Gimme five, seventeen three dollars: you meet real three one thou,
three hundred three hundred and thirty or number comes out. If that number. When I give you five hundred, you get three thousand from battle, you give me two thousand five hundred and two you make five hundred off the top, and then I tip you the thing that battle did. Was he didn't? Take ten points? He let you run your independent action unless you call to him, you know it's very you watch the movie small, Maggie Work and the chinese people You're the drag, gray havoc and move rate movie what he says. You know four years. The Chinese will bring it in the house and they were solid that in our fifty thousand dollars. Vestment make you five hundred thousand dollars These were in saying that light. They weren't saying that why, because didn't have they couldn't bring it out? They couldn't salad, black people and spanish people bits lap, the death so
same thing have would believer fat Tony. So I know I know that he had a big thing come with the Cubans, but Cuba's Wanna put a better more Cubans, yeah. They understand the they want to put a better with a rather poor regions put a better. What a porter week is not a big thing. That was what the numbers it was that it was a community thing. That's a community! There is excellent. I would talk about the number to be like the lottery. Is some sort of a government funded Yang and it seems like it's got a lot of red tape official and there's no wiggle room that The number seem to be closer to like the community, especially with Latino specially what look here in which, in some ways the core of the community, the numbers Everybody would hang out you'd go to hear the neighbourhood laboulaye, like I e the Is the gossip in the streets he'd go near here? The neighbourhood gossip, yeah, I was in the end. It was never meant to be violent. Backing.
Cuba bullied was not violent, it was illegal, but it wasn't violent, and it turned very violent. Any in the United States to Corporation came so profitable and me we're talking about. Millions of dollars on a monthly basis, billions of dollars over the course of the life of this organisation, billions of dollars more than they could artists thing they had was what to do with the money. I mean it a day, would literally strap money to people as money couriers to try to get it out of the country to get it into a get it in offshore bank accounts and laundered money. They have more money than they know. It was a licence to print money which hugely profitable. That's what made it violent Then. You started having gangster. Vying for territory territorial disputes, greed greed took over and I very ugly knows this is which in Cubans between Cubans between the Cubans in the Italians see this guy battle was very
Charismatic leader, with some great leadership, qualities he'd been a hero in the bay of pigs. Invasion, save some guys lives. When I first heard that store, I didn't. I said I got it verify that maybe this is just the storing I told about himself to burn miss his legend, so found the guy so he saved, and I found the guy's two brothers who went with him to save that, the guys that he saved and I went to Cuba to the bay of pigs to the exact location where he saved these guys diverge fi this story and it was absolutely true, p in an act in a credible heroism. He, you save the life of a number of his platoon members. And so I was his reputation from then on. He was revered in the community. He was a hero and peace. Defended and even even when it in turn ugly,
He became a ruthless boss. Who was killing people left and right? He had his defenders. Because of his legend as a hero in the community, and so the power were that he had, but he also had this showing we talk about this tube and have this Latinos have this everybody has it, but Cubans have it desire for revenge. This guy You know the bay of pigs invasion was an attempt at revenge to get revenge against Castro and they were humiliated by that process and a lot of those guys from that generation had an unfinished agenda for revenge. So if you wrong this guy battle in any way, he was going get you, even if it took years and years of calculation, I mean they're stories in the book, but this one, who killed his brother name, Kalulu HEAT, it took nine years and twelve attempts before new. Finally,
killed this guy polluter. They shot him in his hospital. He was in the hospital they shot. Him had an assassin, I suppose, a male nurse in going to ashcombe shooting between the ice cause there, in so many failed attempts they work fail this time and that's in battle. For twelve years I mean took nine catch, the assassin, no, never We all know why bank just sort out I believe the assassin guy killed later because he was talking about having done and so battle had him killed, while here so that the revenge motive, their revenge, motive, kind of of battle off the deep and and somewhere along the line. He broke bad, so to speak, amount off. He was ever good and had to break bad by He started doing internal killings. That really had none do about business there all by revenge. Well did this: is it that happens, a lot with organised crime. People right is like they just get a taste of killing people. Comes easier and easier and then made there was
about murder, machine right, but Roy Mail yeah, you just click. We cannot be anything to afterwhile, that's another book he gave me wish. I was read nor those books on the road yeah does that was dish name for so many italian. I never really knew the history of it I was just trying to read all those books just saw when I went in an idea what these characters, who they were I saw a grown up. I saw these guys you now grown up. I used in the interesting thing about this book was talking to the bay a basis that they know that they will come in. I don't know where I come here. He put barbed wire salmon is correlated soldiers or slashed at sea,
as they were landing there was for battalions, I think, and two hundred and fifty one you know out when they landed. When there were clear light set upon the beach they know they landed a scam. They flip the lights on and lifted up, like a movie set right These guys landed Jesus slaughtered, slaughtered and an aid they felt they ve been betrayed by Kennedy. Yeah. You know that there were supposed to be air cover and the air cover never came, and why was that cause Kennedy Kennedy, he always had. This operation was started by the Eisenhower administration. And the CIA was a CIA operation. Kennedy inherited it and he never really. He always had mixed feelings, I mean it was illegal. It was a year an illegal secret, covert operation and attempt to overthrow a government they would, been seen as an illegal act in the eyes of the world. To do it.
Joe Kennedy was trying to do it so be done in such a way that it could never blow back on his administration and so he withheld air covered a crucial point in that in that war lasted three days, and they got slaughtered an egg and they got imprisoned and they had a lotta resentment towards Kennedy. I mean I go into the both go a little bit. The Kennedy assassination and the belief that a lot of a handful of those Cubans may have been involved in the Kennedy assassination, along with the Italians with the mob, because We're working hand in hand with the CIA That was one of the leading conspiracies outside of the CIA, killing him even the CIA killing him was a part of the bay of the bay of pigs can years and also the idea that he wanted to disband the CIA. There was a really interesting article. Recently there was dismissing almost every single conspiracy. Theory about the Kennedy assassination. They said it
The CIA wonders legitimate possibilities. That the CIA, while you can bet your ass, that if the CIA was involving Cubans are now now let me at home in the book you speak about Fidel's mistress. Yet he got only. I wondered whether at this particular moment she had gone to New Orleans AIR wanted Dallas? retailers very anxious, notorious figure. She had a child with them and had an abortion didn't have the choice, she's pregnant with Fidel, in fact Castro admitted as much. She got pregnant with Castro. She had she had Nepal motion. And then the CIA used to try to assassinate Castro. She had whispered to slip, him appear and she put it in her face cream and he'll dissolved in her face cream, and that was the pill she was gonna try to slip to Castro her her case
agent was a guy named Frank Sturgis. Who of being one of the Watergate burglars, see let things bay of pigs in the Cubans. The bay of pigs invasion is the key to understanding the whole latter part of the twentieth century politics in units It's the cold war because, is the alliance between the CIA and the Cubans ray as its head constantly throughout the latter part the Twentyth century, the Watergate, burglary fibre. Seven, the burglars were: Cubans Bay of pigs veterans, real they'd, been wrecked, who did by New E Howard Hunt. See I ate and who is one of the orchestration of the bay of pigs. Invasion was also one of the people that, on his death bed said that he was involved in this ass in any entity, yes, this, so the sea. I would come to these cuban exiles. The militant exiles- and I say, go do this operation go. Do this burglary at the at the Watergate, and then we go get go do this assassination and then we go get Fidel?
and the Cubans were always ready and willing, because it was all leading back to getting. It was all leaning back to get it ever see the images of what they said was E Howard Hunt. It was one of the people it was arrested. There was a series of there was a bunch of Gaza were arrested, other were on trains. Economy. Hoboes, yet are all very well dressed like that were near where the grassy no one is on the grass there's lots of rumours about that. Howard Hunt was one of those men there was even a reference that Jose Miguel Battle was one of those men, but that could have been the case. He was in the army and the time of the year. S army now so it's like a it's like a subterranean narrative, the run Through the latter part of the twentieth century the CIA and right wing elements in american politics use, the Cuban Americans to do all kinds of dirty, covert deeds and we're talking about terrorist activity,
sazen nation about ambassador from Chile right in Washington DC, blew up his car because he was sympathetic to Castro. A bomb planted on a cuban jet liner buying from Panama City to advance. Seventy three people killed innocent people, including The fencing team from Cuba, young people, dirty war. A dirty war was waged by the Anti Castro, underground in combination in partnership with the CIA, and this we know about it now because a lot of it has been declassified and its come out. We didn't know about it at the time it was taking place. Why the blood the plan just an act of terror, some against Cuba to ya to show them that it could be done to instil fear and paranoia in the queue the the concept was too destabilize. The Cuban got governments are they'd, be vulnerable and then you could take em over. So any any act against Cuba. I mean asking
My blood the plane would was is asking why? Why fly? and into the World Trade Centre. Right enough, Yes, I did a destructive act. The amazing how resilient Castro was humming, unbelievable, the guy's ninety miles away from Miami and just ran shit through the sixties, the seventies and eighties, the nineties, into the tooth as they say there was something like six hundred and thirty two known plots over over the course for funding to kill cats incredible six hundred and thirty two The hundred and one ways Guilford now is here, and he went out of here: how to train a New York. I know I can you fucking crazy and they check to see the other bulletproof vest on his like that. He took the train to the you at wow, like he's fucking nuts yeah, he was fucking nuts What makes this this gangster story of the corporation so interesting, indifferent, is this political context
the framework that all this shit was taking place against the backdrop of this desire to kill Castro and take back, take the homeland and anyone who is involved in that was seen as a hero within the community. Joy could tell you about that union City, New Jersey and Miami, where the hotbeds of the Anti Castro movement there were. Where was an organization and unions he called Omega seven one in Miami call alpha. Sixty six These were terror organisations, secret organ, patients. It existed to plant bombs plant bombs, embassies in United, you know in New York City. They would put they would put by moms at Lincoln Center when winter, when an orchestra from Cuba was making an appearance. They were trying to shut down any relate. His ship between the. U S and Cuba and governments. It was sympathetic to Cuba, they would, they would do actions against them
when I feel like forty years that, believe you mention four down the seventys and city like a joke. It is not a joke, don't you know you not only bring a month down. Could you will get mad now it was there any Pro Fidel support amongst Cubans there were some bad things would happen to them needs to follow. What about in Cuba Pro ass. India, oh yeah sure may was a real or was it out a few others real? It's real. I mean I've been them numerous times. You know that People made a choice in the resolution I believe would have happened with or without Fidel Castro. The guy who was in power Battista had taken over the government in a coup data. He was an elected, so he was kind of a fraudulent president and hers and ever since he got in people, lose
fraudulent president and Nevers attempts to try to ouster him and that's why he was the dictator. He knew they wanted the house to him. So he used the military to repress any kind of movement against him and it was ugly and the people rose up against it. That's what happened it wasn't so In my belief the revolution in Cuba happened for a very legitimate reason after it happen in power. It was revealed that Castro and change of our were Communis. He cast away very cagey about that during the revolution, they never talked about Marxism and being Communis, or any of that, in fact Fidel. Came to Union City Kay. To the United States to raise money for the revolution. While it was going on Galileo You say my five years, my friends mob. The ask releases. She says she still remembers taken the bus in the morning and evening City and Fidel Talkum too. Well aware, I'm talking to you, I don't Susan was gone,
While he got in a bar room. He got in a bar room argument. In our union city and he got arrested over what probably politics here was a political discussion so so, then the revolution in and you know, Humor becomes a repressive communist stalinist dictatorship but a lot of Cubans. The way they it is that was a choice they made to go with Fidel He did have. I think the Leah Popular many of the people following of the people, some people are proud of Castro. Standing up to the United States. Cubans are very poor. People and they take a lot of pride in the fact that even know, there's so much hardship there. That it's a choice they made to go in this direction. At least they have their their itself self pride.
Which is more in the CAN said in some ways about port Rico in Jamaica, Dominican Republic, all these other, trees in that region that are just as poor is Cuba. So? He has supporters he always had its support so he also had its detractors even within Cuba, Most of those people are the ones who got on rafts in to leave the island at great risk, themselves to do anything to get out of there because I realized Fidel ways so popular from within the country. You are never gonna, feel be able come down, so they made decision and go out in the ocean and try to bring the the risks of others swimming or sailing across the floor, the straits? What the fuck happened with CHE Guevara,
How did CHE Guevara all the sudden emerge as this like left this political icon, but in this really weird sort of clueless Sway like they really didn't understand. As background really didn't understand, we wasn't what he had done and the atrocities did he had committed, but these fuckin tee shirts that all these dopey liberal hours ago spoken things, it's fucking crazy. If you find out who that guy is you're you're wearing a mass murderers teacher like he was a fuckin ruthless cut and these people. Weren t shirt is Few symbol is symbolizes like lead poverty or freedom from oppressive government, or something like that? It's, but it was a long period of time- but you didn't have any CHE Guevara. There was no no discussion of it and then it seems like somewhere in the two thousands it picked up at my about eight let metabolism it was so personal for awhile.
I watch argentinian friends, but in the seventies it there was a rift between Argentinians Cubans That's how personally CHE as Yeas Argentina. Rightly there was a rift because of him because a him my Cuban is the fuck out really welcome that the fact that what is it, what is, as you know, the yellow they talk of de la la la Cosa still have led the way to live with it, tat whenever it like a beef and explain what Cubans would go off and city of Eu Argentinian Real, that's how deep date should human spanish? How did this thing the conflict, the fundamentalists. By from some. Why did the same idea? Why
just a regional regional thing and they there the double ones on this on the top. If a Cuban, what look look Cuba's the is considered that were the juice of the Caribbean, but Spain as one over on US people. My father's family was in Spain and I went there. One time never went back really get one time to me. My gram Why? Because she was talking about five like no tell them about my mother me hooked allowing african or feel Mamma. She, Spain is the colonial powers to colonial. Often often, Spaniards looked down on the Cubans and Mexicans ensures well. I will only one time my mom took me to meet my grandma like ten minutes, and we will call my mother, you find him while the came over, those will have broken bitch
How come about five five stir up my relationship. She was like my father's, your father's in a bid that, because she was from come away so this shit stick? My mom was a peasant from events, so she wasn't. My son had big dreams and to be met. You're you're, here Annabelle flogged view you fuck it ass. She made my mother move or whether we can put the dishes theses. Spaniard you're, my father. I offended just by the way Cubans speak Spanish, yes, but a lot of people tortured. What I did the office, I don't speak cuban Spanish. I speak as a core I speak. The spanish illustrates that Spanish picked up in your city that streets where women stammering EVA Mama anywhere. They give you a hearty about translating this. What I was tell people I'll talk in English repeat what I said: good luck in English here, it's fucking
hard. It's hard to remember what someone said, especially you'll. I was big in these long sentences- and you are translated, did a great job. So now I dont, but my spanish is instead give me five I was double them over a Malta means a nun. We don't say numbers in my rat, a tense bodies, I forget what is his name for year for everything. I learn how to speak. Spanish cod, oil bottled up either. That means keep guys but you better results. Blast ages. It. Yet I say to you quota paler than usual your batteries. I learn that street is this Bergen County Street. The non Oda loses Hudson Kites units I said yes, I work for my back y yeah by Dana. Are we talking Cubans in the? U S or I told you to review but programme. When I talk to my sister on the phone, I have no idea what she said. Real, I wish it gives me an address shit.
I await the eyes and all that I took italian high school. I didn't take basic spanish. I learned how to reach spanish house. My reading will differ things, but I learn how to speak. Spanish, like I'm ever going to Succubus person's house once and Union city when I was about twelve and they told their son- don't bring this kid over here? No more! he's a street violence back her. I was the streets by, I learned, I say in a game or they will all to dump sandal. I didn't learn that traditional Spanish My Spanish is allowed a hand signal hand oil. I see you up people that means watch Why human, don't fuckin that watch a lot. It's a lie: the street. When I was never allowed to walk home the same. Why would you do come different direction. Different directions, keep the car don't don't on my mother's operation. I could never just walk home on both
I walked into your gammon walk down just to see. If I saw suspicious now that smart Guy, remembering whom we when we were in San Francisco about fifteen years ago, we had the crew Tate Eddie. You me are you done, can read man walking down the street in San Francisco as we approach, I saw a drug dealer go down I hit our Aguilar religion that drug. Do you guys we're looking at the whole way, What are you thought I regos how the fuck did you see that right? Because I was raised by tat, I was raised to go and look for cars. I was never allowed to war. On the same weight twice a year because of the valley, the business. Now let me ask about that because, Is this an instinct you learn on your own or where you actually trained? I was when I became a numbers runner as a child. I was always my mom would put it when I was a kid and I can't even killed my mother put up a big gold chain on me. You know why
because she dared you to take her out my she'd, my mother, wanted you to take my change. I would have to fight real yeah, so I'm a one time Mr Softy came, and he looked at my goal thing on my mother yell from the window. The leaden touch your flock and Jane. Yes there. What the Glen now am, I dont withdrawn hooks red hoop and she was chasing and perform by yourself he's an only child, so was other kids there and the Red who fell through thing and some six year old, took it from me and my daughter went to put a head down. I go it so take it back, go take it back, and she just looked at me and the parent was like that's an effective way. Apparently she got it back in your daughter, don't have they hit my Fuckin house waiting in the wood, the mom other kid that took It was given. You show yeah, because this is today's America, my America, we don't come home,
what are the wooded mom, what you did to mom and dad too Glenville Fuckin Gentiles the dead said that an effective of whatever be the same them bitch you're doin, couple weeks ago, a little girl took the swing from my dark. Take the swing back back my wife, what do you do it? That's? How Cubans raise their kids? I was raised always have miser, because I knew what they did I was at a young age if I hung out with Joe Rogan and Joe Romans dad so Coke. I knew your role is dead, so Yolande, but I would never tell you. I came from out yeah right, my you know, here's the thing is if they wanted to get your mother, they dead come after me, The other comment was very common: again kidnapped kid. That's how you that's how you got somebody. Will that's how you get to everybody in the end. This is this trumped thing was
Stormy Daniels. You see what I'm things that she said. One of the reasons why she came out about this Sunday came up there in a parking lot when she was holding her infant daughter. I don't know if this is true. What she said someone came up to her and said I have a beautiful daughter, it'd, be a shame if anything happened to her mother, and I don't stop talking about President Trump. We was president Trump. The time stopped talking about Mr Trump and she was like oh fuck you oh fuck this and then you know, then she really really give upper animosity towards them manage it. Even in the narco worlders cases of what they would do, is They would do a videotape. There is somebody they wanted to intimidate. They videotape their kid being. Taken to school every morning being dropped off school picked up after school. Videotape the daily routine of the child and then send the videotape to that person,
say eyes. I need to know where your kid is every every minute of the day to what we tell you to do the fuck me, though never factory. I was never really and that no, I was never factors. I was just raised to understand what they would do with its consequences and I didn't was allowed to repeat it so when I would come to you and you would be talking about whatever. Even if I knew you were wrong, I would never correct sats hours raise our net correct here, even if I knew you were talking shit because how you know how do I know I would just at the fucking bar and talking about trying to fuck. I know my mom, and had nothing from a grown up. That's good and bad. That had good things for me, but a lot of bad things. One of the things that he touched upon this book was now only but Jose Battle, but the political corruption that came with it. In
twenty years and I have authority about balancing on. I am I wouldn't listen. The part thanks. If you paid me because it all bullshit, I saw it in a micro level. You know when you have in your president, Craig donations from the farm, and whatever we need small mayor who donations from the pharmacy, the pizza place, the numbers. So. I came from a society where those numbers will controlling everything and in Not Bergen Union City and Westley. Remember that shit's, a felony in Jersey, misdemeanor in New York, really numbers used to be. Mr me, as a matter of fact, they would call you they were good job. Look. We would say that, because the followed for TAT he would just Goin go you get a visitor. Have you got five thousand in your pocket? Give it Jamie clean out the
leave some paperwork at two o clock. I come my handcuff here. I take your money I write you a summons and bring it down to the station we giggle and then after let God I meet you around the corner. If you have two thousand five hundred on your give you one thousand two hundred and fifty and that's a cost of doing business It is a funny living good fellows when he goes. How can I go to school, but all that good bullshit saloon fly. When I left, I was the same. What year I saw what happened. I saw the legal system. I saw two cops coming in one detective once a week and one big guy, my mom would give Madrid an umbrella. Yeah. I don't know what my grandmother did, what how she was involved, but I told you in jail right jail for running numbers, shoot you went to jail because she wouldn't given body up. They wanted her to give up whatever the fuck was at the other end of the organization and so full slack six months. We always turn of like where the fuck is good
and still she is visiting her sister social visiting Aunt Josie, just no one number four maker in Jersey, Essex, five, less right and they put your own house arrest and you don T admit sweaters and shit for the fucking guards in jail where a lot of times battles with own the judges, so you wouldn't do any time you all you might get it. You might get a someone's. You go before a magistrate judge in and they let you go which fast to me is about. This is also fascinating. About the mob itself, as a lot of it is basically dissolved that, This came from immigration and This is melting pot of the United States and they are. From all these other places and all this org as crime sort of, It was running this, the cities in these coast, but most of it is kind of guy.
The wayside. I will. I would dispute that a little bit. I think traditional organized crime as we knew it and that twenty centuries gone by the wayside- italian, irish, jewish- that sort of assimilated into the system and has dissipated by new generations, russian against that are playing this out to me. And to make many childs yields? Russians Mexicans it happening and I'd further make the argument that the key Corruption that was created. Prohibition in the nineteen twenty sets where this system was created during a in the nineteen twenties thee. Alliance between the underworld in the upper world. The connection between the political apparatus, law enforcement and cork criminal rackets that Temple, was laid down during prohibition and it was an effect for the next one hundred years. I think that templates still exists. You of a newspaper in any
U S, city, large or bids. I city and what do you see on the first couple pages, some local, representative who just got indicted for taken money. From some criminal element to see that they got a law passed or that they got some municipal contract. That hasn't gone away. That still exists everywhere. What happens, is there to ebb and flow, certain rackets come and go. It was illegal booze and it was labour racketeering. Now it's narcotics, it was Balita at one time, there's always something you Know- is always there's commerce being done on a large scale. There is always room for corruption as long as there's things that are illegal with asean market foreign. Yet my higher wanna argument here right the big argument about marijuana laws that states as if they made it legal it would. Severely limit powder. The cartel and Mexico has cut all that violence outright. Basically, the same thing,
that was going on with Al Capone and everything during the liquor there did Tom would liquids yeah, because the criminal rackets feed the system. Now human beings are in all its fly. Human beings at every level of the system, dirty cops, cops on the take mean. Is it more difficult now for them to pull some like this, all its less systemic? You know I mean I mean back in the day. You know you'd, corruption. That was all the way through the chain of command. You know, and everyone was sort of in on it. Dyson seven five! Yes, I did. So you're here, interview my dad thousand this fascinating yeah, I mean you eat he and now twenty years after the Nap Nap Commission, which revealed that level of corruption yeah, I know you have social systems and you will have corruption,
you have a money making system like capitalism. You will have corruption that doesn't go away organised crime is the face of organized crime, has changed quite a bit, but the core of of that corrupt relations between the underworld and the upper world still exists. So is it the most disenfranchised sort of members of the community that the most recent immigrants like what? What is it that yeah I've written about It's a lot in two different books into journalism. I've I believe that in it it's the american story, this process es of going through organised. His crime and gangsterism before you become accepted as a full blown American every almost every ethnic group is gone through some version of it in the U S, Henderson, and is still going through. It is part of the american process. You get here as a group, your your cut, out of access.
Immediate access, anyway, to to power so you create your own path, and initially in these organizations it's usually those ethnic group preying on their own, praying each other that Caesar the first stage of this and then it becomes. Creating a system to tee to deal with the largest system, a corruption I mean, because it may go battle, what he'd do so brilliant by creating the corporation? Is he cried the path for himself with in American organized crime, which was control primarily by the mafia? and he created an alliance with the mafia that made it possible for the Cubans to have their thing and end Why below the radar and meanwhile Italians were get in bed, still left and right. The Cubans Cuba's this court
racing exists for forty years because they didn't really get messed with much. Why is that like? What? What was it the way the Italians like they were so flashy like, particularly when they got to God? He was there ridiculous, allowing Raymond's when pretty damn flashy too so seller, some of them. So for this could some of them. I till this day I detest nice cause. I detest, show attention to use, because I saw two I right now like I would love to talk to the producers of this film because they're gonna miss La Authentic stamped her. It will in fact have a present for you. I ordered you. The same shirt brew, fleeing war and fist of fury. Said that China's cube, when you when you're a success. When Tony goes and at his success, I I ran at Thy castro- would become a success in union city. The chinese teaching
your first sign success, but it has three buttons right, so you cut the buttons off and young which middlemen James. So it's Joseph James, Rogan in diamonds, initials you J, J, R S, okay and they leave they they they that's part of their either like this. So many little things, Cubans dead but but taken I want, for example, my stepfather brilliant brilliant in Bali, then talk on the phone, boy, you move for anybody poorly had his message is delivered them. In nineteen. Seventy, I'm looking at both EU gentleman's I'm telling you that one would not even have a conversation if there was a phone in the room when it was hung up, because in his mind, that phone was welcome tat right,
He was a genius if he had to meet Joe Rogan for a meeting at nine at five hundred and thirty in the morning he come and put a gun under a car. Just in case there was a problem with your bro, well how gear and you'd search them he would Huggin Tapie? back for a while until you will lose weight. Wait model here, but that feeling a pig right Juan when my mother died. He still had the same car at the end when and he D with five million cash. He lived in a four story: walk up, we died. One of his friends said when a miserable life to make money have to hide it. Like one would walk around with genes and teachers to save should every day, right and a wad of hundreds life is the hidden one one with single, so you daddy was broke. If he talk to you talk to you in English, once the cops camp may not be
I want you know. Who was the interpreter folly, attorney meetings with all those high level. Guys me really side, be it's cool, I be at home in my mom, go tomorrow. You have to go with child to the Lukas off the sand. The look and sand a local, basically look younger I dont Joe great to see you to bring him a suit. Of suit Santa Look, so the more suit. You brought him. The Betty was like the other guy, the guy that had the thing but Salmon treaty. Just like this generally have got our worrying. Ok, you don't interpret. This was how fast asked the conversation. Was you got bus, for conspiracy, a book Megan that's two years, listen than other than this judge she's a motherfucker. But thank God I know the prosecutor saute one among the three hundred thousand. We lose the for two thousand. You get a year for
Why thousand you probation do a year and a half way out and for fifty thousand he just give you a man. When you decide what you want to get back to me, always a pleasure to see you had a week to decide what you gonna do going back door, there's no stopping God is no trial. They think you're right it might my stepfather one o clock. What I know for a fact was: don't play games LUCA, don't blanket. Now there in a Joe. In answer to your: up and gold. Is they take your right it my step forward? The rumour was the did. They had a certain mystique because of the CIA could, now now in answer they answer to your question about the Cubans and why they existed for so long where the get busted king a case against battle. This is way back in the sixties. They contact the- U S Treasury department, because they figure he's not pay in taxes and they come
this, and they can make some kind of case against him, after I mentioned in the book, there's a case for the FBI, thinking about making a case against battle. This is way back in the sixties. They contact Us Treasury Department cuz, they figure he's not paying taxes and they can make some kind of case estimate tax violation, They got a letter the Treasury Department saying we're not going to go after this guy because he's anti Castro and he's a veteran of the bay of pigs invasion? It's right there in a in a in letter from the Treasury Department to the FBI. While so there were elements within the government that were protecting these guys, particularly bay of pigs veterans, we will not prosecute them, that's it. Got a good name for the character. That's can do any better, not up with a kidney major battle. Yeah. His name in Spanish was bossy, a battle and change it to balance a good one right. If your
you're a writer and a novelist you trying to think up a good name for the character. That's can do any better than I grew up with a kidney major battle. Guy did take window with snails major battle, major that The fucker too bad mother, fucker, nay, major battle It is mainly bad mother, Fucker man, you're bad. My luggage was Blackwell stay champion and the only reason why they existed very carefully- They have a system eyes Union city ran union city, become Jersey, City and Hoboken. University ran seventh street eighty eight street Dewie Castle, but the Cubans really controlled seven to forty eight street, organ wine and then, when you went to New York Avenue they control from fiftieth up to bath sixty street and they kept themselves and they have social clubs and in play com.
Outside, and if you want him to the boy they wore address very moderately before them were bookies and they only stay debt or three o clock because that's a number goes in. So you have from nine in the morning to three to play that number, but is also then called the singular them The odds are a little less that started about well I'll, see you at twelve and go give way Norma. Cowan MOB of buck I'll, never listened to that. But you get a mine again now go back to the book. Even better like a number Polina called, I regularly that's one number at the time and I'm you imagine put down a hundred. Thousand dollars on a number
Five is whether the number, the the put potential numbers talking single digital Luke. I could pull out nor relay at three digit, read that you bet three digit. So why would it be a single number or that was just awaited? Axiom virulence, yes, M a different one. There were different systems for development as a sort of way you could do about. Let's explained this where the number comes from. Ok, the total mutual handle at the race track is published in the newspaper every evening again and again in the morning. How, money was bet total at the race track. That day, the latter three numbers: that's too daily number so everyone has the same number for everybody know what it is as soon as it comes out in the newspaper and that's how its determined have you have done in visual numbers, and then you the early number with which is call what come out of Brooklyn. Sally on Brooklyn and then
have the late now. What's the New York Number Asthma number in the New York, none of the other side like what it would be based. That was decided, probably a hundred years ago by some by some, you know, guinea who rat who ran it for the Italians, and maybe it from Sicily, whatever the origins and the closer you couldn't fixed at how can cause gatling Ghana like that you can fix. It was because of that I don't know what the track is made out of exactly how it. How do you think the last remember now expect this out certain organizations like the corporation parlor reason people wanted to bet with them and liked to bet with them is They would have somebody at the race track. So the minute that number was posted. No the number so you'd get You don't have to wait until way. All yours, you had a car Sir Nobody remembers that you remember that t, J Ai, you done well
Georgia is causing one line. You gonna sit by a pay for them Thirty five say at him and they would run all right. Then I shall the drive the scorn and they give you the score. But what I mean you bet was the last so you have to sit there and take that all we have been mother. Fucker gave it to me. And then and then, when it came to them, saying the number the subway go buy. You just lost another thirty five set, but our whole numbers system, like my mother, was a degenerate numbers. Then she kill killed over the Yankees in the red. Sox wait, but her was the numbers. The three numbers do track, and now let's get greedy,
why don't we got all tb? May I now see this is where why don't we just got? Ile DE beat a really complete your fuckin day. You degenerate higher the brilliance of battle and his organization was he didn't do sports betting, in fact, by his arrangement with the Italians with the mafia? Was you get Molitor, you get numbers, but you get sports betting and you don't get these other things and so There was a there's, an EC there's an example in this book. Other of a member of the corporation who starts again spaniels wishes starts playing doing sports betting, that I wonder, dead about killed him himself, because he was going ass. Your dreams going against the rules governing the rules that could turn the mafia against them and bring the whole thing downright right. Is now in its your question about come out who, how they came up with that number you gotta remember, It's all gambling! This is the culture of gambling and now you're at the race track. Your bedding cod game here, bedding betting, the number so
its logical that somewhere in that universe, would be how the number was determined. So came from the race track right. Will you also have the porter rican water and that comes in Paypal? It's different! That's completely different paperwork paperwork, so you buy paperwork that comes loud, we take it. My mother would, by the whole fucking shit, it's like ten dollars a thing, but she would you by the sheet and what is it? It's a porter rican them now. You know that the corporation use the porter rican lottery to launder their driving sockets? Yes, oh you hit the number you my friend. What are you? Gonna went to twenty thousand the time they gave it to. Let me just give you Do you know that's how Whitey Bulgy laundered money rats, how Sammy the bull boy lottery tickets? so Whitey Bulge or one the lottery twice life that is illegal in the neighborhood one, the lottery he bought and activities ticket from gave money or whatever the fuck. You gave him check this.
Today's paper front page of USA today, confessions of a lottery scammer. I brought this along. I taught to hinder lottery scammed. This is a guy big fat guy tuna, pants sitting on his ass in Iowa somewhere, who was on his device, who figure some away, intrude on some algorithm and he started scamming different states scam. The stated Colorado out of four point: eight million dollars- And there is a total of sixteen point. Five boy, you can are good eighteen point: five million I'm thinking. If this I had scammed the corporation led by hosting legal battle. He be key, be dead. He wouldn't be on he beyond the obituary section legally says Here- was never intent to start a full, our ticket scam
is sentenced of twenty five years would not scam organized crime in this way or how do you, scam, lottery you figure out. You figure out how the number is determined and then you are able to play with it. You are able to pull with a tea in organised crime. You couldn't do our stand, that how could he isn't there? a random system, a computer program, or should it be a? He found some weight to tap in that computer system. To tat I mean to hack into a hack into an altered the number wow craze. While that is clear, what what is fascinating to me is this. You you're talking about early we're talking about about like that this was, it gave them an opportunity for hope, and there was a pause. Of the community. Earlier, what missing that the West Coast, the West Coast like off track? Bearing doesn't fuckin here, there's a few weirdos that go to the Hollywood part, but that's gone now. You know me there's nothing here. Are you it'll West Coast never had this? Does nothing here? There's no
thing like seeing that, like I saw that- and I saw what goes with it and it may sound Oki spooky than most people, but it's not These will be the people who are really really sicilian and people. Normal cuban when you're sicilian and that culture is women that you gotta and they tell you thanks, which is the Sicilian. Which, whatever forty one in sleepers member, he goes bring I bore to this lady, what sleepers, sleepers, is a movie about for irish kids. That lay there was shit because of one. I remember that movie about the four kids narrow plays a priests, priests, Bat, Brad Pitt. That's me: snow, grandsire. Ok, there, it is very low and move. We then they tat. They got the guy on leather men and he started back track and lakes. He was a gala by the CIA. Vowed now really said he will Lorenzo cocktail yeah. He later.
He it was a true story and it was not a base. But if you look at it one tool for those two kids supposed to grow up to be what I bet it wasn't it devotion to both idea, the two other pianos guys where we told him talking about what we are turning our which he you know in the cuban world is saying I want my kid. They got a catholic school right. If I play this fuckin number today, this is gonna. Save me we in a week when you come back, you have that hope, Garee Improv, just ass, I was gonna, be there, maybe just maybe it's a but its ethnic. Hope that comes back from your country? It's hard to describe you understand that, because your grandmother was a fuckin bookie. But if you talk on a daily basis about it
and why she would play that particular? No. My mom play five. Seventy those the last remembers my dad's gravestone. Yet I'll fix all four with some other fuckin hallucinogenic. She had if I'd like this I like this, and I know you know what you're looking good today. It will take a yardstick. Cubans look at and go. Can we find out onto fifty really does, as the last we number twenty you gave me now is still going on Folia. The damage is still going on here, man in a manner that is a kind man office when I was It was a time man obvious you would now. Stairs you had about bodega me, you ran the bulk data is to use and yesterday's paper. Always cell in the book of dreams. You come in, give me six all four five. Seventeen. It comes on three sheets of paper with with copy paper. So right away. I read the top one
give it to you. I keep the other one and the other one goes upstairs to the department. Where now there's a big wall Zero point nine on the war- and I part there so just came up and play to nineteen this and also there's a list that goes down, I'm aboard guy, I just work the boy six guys with full jail in number that I'm your yea Rogan Fucking Just put a hundred thousand that number, mother, said to kill me last week that sense Few thousand after my air, because I've got a loaded to create the union opium. You know what when I take this watch, but I'm taken five online Pittsburgh Pittsburgh Plain knowing. I can't take ten thousand on page Five thousand, I'm New England. That's not call the utopia I want to make money on the vague the ten points from you lose, and so, if you bet ten, thousand on somebody you, but five I allowed five. To another bank somewhere across TAT,
So this is how it it I mean when I was a kid. My mother had a bank in the Bronx and the guy that cook with black MIKE was a Vietnam vet, and I was five and you give me ten bucks you'll get a blackberry brandy, black MIKE cooked italian food. That was so fucking good. It was one thousand nine hundred and seventy, even if you hated black with you, ate his spaghetti, even italian for corn beef on wednesdays. He made cuban food, they have an office in every phone as little tape recorder with a wire connected to the policy can't call me to say, you played pneumonia, its record for combustion card way to take three So every hour the tapes come around those state to say and those get destroyed. The weak ass. That night after everything. Saddled with this see those offices in action here kid and I'm going to get cigarettes, and they give me a time
we'll get Threed I'll pack of cigarettes, I keep seven. Now! Did you ever see the money? Would it the moral of money that was gathered, I saw the money would be taken because that would be a sovereign location. I would be a separate accounting room now is also they move locations. Every week you off like to stay ahead of the copse for everyone you got a gala, Jerome images rents important swarm, every week we move location. So nobody ever get comfortable with three months at one place then withdrew months in another place, then withdrew three months in place, because now we have to worry about cops. You got away by again a little fucking copy, ranging We found out and Joe ideas they made forty thousand a day. Jamie Zella, two guys goggled at the top gun Intranet globular see what happens because they got two guys in the turf war that just got two guns wait for any, like you to come upstairs live what what it was you surreal. It was surreal. So in the morning is my mom will go. You wanna go to school Mama, that's your young, I gotta go
because he's bookies robbed him eat one now forty bucks, it's part of their now check this out. The end of the day. Every day This is going on in combating is growing every day, seven days a week. This system Joyce talking about so monies company in lot of of money coming in Kosovo, counting rooms, so the Today you got a lot of money like two three hundred different locations, all around the New York area, what they would do. Is they have people whose responsibility it was to come around, collect the money that money would go into a van and Van would have a police escort. It left New York City went through the tunnel, in New Jersey was met by New Jersey. The police who picked it up and escorted it from air into the apartment, where the houses
in union city where the money was crazy? Why so the cops got paid. So how can I tell you this at the age of ten? I knew this bag. Inevitably gradual limb, keep it to myself what most kids wouldn't be. It will shut the fuck up, setting where I was allowed to talk of my model currently in my world at him when, what were you? Sadly, we played handball of Malaga Little play with my uncle, but there was a young. You worked for a sports betting place too late as I got older, but when I got a high school I was such a loser with one and eighty stream, the guy's name was chair. Jose Torres the sun, I went on like a man. They were around the block to this guy named rally and Macao, and they ran a complete different operation from the club,
racial rally still around. If I had any balls with, I got put a bullet rallies had because rally was tight when my mother, my mother, help get rally start on an eighteen street. When my mother died, he got tight with my stepfather when my stepfather died, he took that money and gave it to my staff, while the system that money belong to me. So today, I'm still pistol but rather because I was a kid, I saw a rally every Fuckin bay, he gimme fifty bucks everytime. I went over those guys lived a life on a common base, life. So whenever they see Jerome come in know how many things I did your father coming Is one hundred dollars go, get your dick sucked. My mother would drive her crazy, but how much would you get from a two hundred to give me five to buy knives and forks and stars to draw people agenda, but that there was a very generous Jerome
you can't do that when you come over to my house with your daughters. I can't first thing is: they do is put a fifty desire. So the girls, no, whenever they come out uncle cajoleries, they get a fifty right, so the unite around they'll, come over when they What team and they're gonna go to Hollywood? Don't come out about the jungle jolly! Well, you girls gone, There's got money. Is fifty five people give me money because it's a common base business, the more like my mother, would hit. The number for ten thousand should give away really yeah, because that's the agenda, rascally bottom is part of the community. It that's the thing you are talking about the communal communal model and I think that was even more pronounced with the Cubans because of their history, a bullet in the cultural significance of Bali to go on back to Cuba at something They brought with them to the United States, and it was just you know,
said it wasn't seen as as a criminal thing was seen as a violent criminal thing. Now, what happens with closing, may go battle. Is it sir point nineteen eighty five he moves, from union see to Miami and he moves the hierarchy of the organization to Miami, but the money, still be a made in New York City, the organist Nation is as strong as ever and monies being made in the fibres of New York and its being shipped to Miami. Where this guy now lives. Like a gentle, farmer on an estate. He surrounds self, with Mammy trees. Memories of fruit from Cuba. He'd associates had the shake your yet there is a wonderful fruit beautiful, so he associated with his childhood. So the first thing he does is he surrounds his esteem down in Miami with this fruit. From his childhood and he down there now far removed from New York. Meanwhile, back in New York, a war breaks
now between Italians in the Cubans over this thing called the to block rule when the Cuban Italians form their alliance. They establish the rule that you couldn't oak. Nobody could been up a bully, despite closer than two blocks to a pre existing bullied spot somebody violated that rule. I don't even know after investigating the hoof who violated that rule, but I will go violated It turned into a nasty and arson war may started. Firebombing each other's spots how are the innocent people got? Killed? Man incinerate a four year old girl got killed it aim horrific lasted for about eight or nine months to something like seventy murders may be too five fire bombings are different, bully to spot it got. So ugly. It brought down the heat of the feds. Nobody, Ignore this corporation thing any more. So Brian allowed unwanted attend. Into the they know who initially started off, who violate their here. He became a snitch and told the whole
storing the guy who violated it I think I'll violated, but the guy who became the number one arsonist set up the whole campaign of arson. He became ass. A chicken and told the whole thing chapter and verse so Paisley's one cocky person just decided fuck this to blow. He was probably authorized by his bosses to do it over and Bernard spot will show them and then happen and then the response was well we'll show them go burn. His pipe a bird in the spot came out of someone violating the original deal. We actually locks aware that that was the reason. The first burning. How do they know the guy was started? The first today's had to figure out how to sit up about it here. Failed. It was the Italians and the Cubans had a major sit down about it to discuss it too I resolved to keep it from exploding into war at that sit down. They didn't resolve anything and after it came out. The restaurant, where the sit down took place. A dry
by shooting occurred in one of the Cubans got shot at the rest coming out of the sit down, and then the war was on man. It was on like battle said where, or with the Italians, that's what he said with with his people. And battle was ready for it tat he was good to go. I mean he was ready for that war. He seemed to want it. He seemed to cherish The idea that they were going to go to war with the Italians and so they rode on all these horrific and you know how they did the arsons they get. These mama looks to fill up a pale with ghastly not even a can not even a close, can and open pale, and you know that spill and they took that pale of gas and they walk into a body. A bully, despondently dump it on the floor and lighted on fire and who ever happened to be in there too bad for them, and people die a horrible death the guide incinerated. I have some pictures in the book. Tat are almost to her
Think I had others that we're so bad. I didn't want to use them in the book real you put something in that book. That really blew my mind. You said that in May eighteen, seventy five, seventy six in Hudson County were on from there was forty car bomb forty club out loud. I remember what bombings. Not all car bomb is clear and Hudson Kennedy from seventh street the eighty eight street there we have Bayonne Hoboken! That's up. There was forty one. Car bombings there was a time in the seventies in the? U S where bombings homemade bombs were like the preferred, weapon of organised crime. There were, there was a. Was a bombing war in Cleveland over this irish gangster. In the seventies it was, it was pretty common ITALY to bomb with the males, the guy gotten, the Sicilians of good,
they did make a movie about Danny Green was a movie called currently ongoing, heal the Irish another Redondo again, while they're doing the Irishman different movie, snowy staff man. Now, today things prize you when you were you, put mean obviously well versed in organized crime and well versed in these. Time is the dominant feel. People have when they read in this book. Is the dominant feel there had when I was researching, which was why don't? I know this shit right. I mean this is like really this. Not only a great story really interesting, but it's really important history. All this political connection, anti Castro movement in that role, the? U S. Government might have played in any idea that this criminal, spirits, see organization was allowed to go on for forty years, because certain elements in the: U S, government.
Want to go after them because they were afraid it would open the lid on the cuban relations with the sea, the intake ro relations with the CIA, the politics of it. That's that's it's not only interesting history, its important history too, Stan certain social Let call relationship between the? U S in Cuba, the Bay Pay eggs residue of the revolution that way. The way that shaped the cold war- shaped: U S! Politics we're a period of about fifty years. So I why don't I know this this amazing? This is like almost like a hidden history. I mean I knew what got reported in the newspapers. But you know you lift up the rug and you you look underneath the rug and used to get into the details of it? It is me me so aware that what we are receiving as information on a daily basis from the meat mainstream media and everything is a version of what happened,
there's a whole other version of what's happening, that we don't see and usually only find out about it. Thirty years later, thirty years after the Fact- and that's a good thing to know mean it sounds to me like this. Is I mean I've haven't heard a peep about this. We when you, this up to me Joey, I was like white acumen, organised crime, the corporation, what what is this like? This is not discussed. It just now, Well, hopefully, this will change. I grew up in it and I never talked about it because I said: how destroys we Gulf around- I, yes, Mamma s busy and wherever Laana shall I say in that I'll say it caused them away. You're, not going believe me and number two, it's not my. Position. I was raised enough for me to say yes, but I saw that as a child and then what made it worse for me was movement and what Bergen once I'm outta my berrigan, I saw.
What they were doing in union city and a bigger way, which is all political. I saw things that'll make it down drop, that's why I don't give a fuck about politics and then, when I see people talking about politics going to go up to me now, if you knew you were talkin about, you wouldn't say a word, because you have no idea what real politics means, how it works if it works like that in a microsystem. I can't imagine in a real. So I want to pay out now join. Let me ask you a question, because I join I connected when I had more or less written this poor already. If I come to you way back in the beginning of this out of the blue of suddenness T J English. I know you can you knew the west, so you knew I was you knew I was legit. If I had conquered Could you and said? Well you talk to me about this history? Would you have done it with everything it would take us away?
did the briefly, so you would have been ready and will I would have told you now you see what's interesting admitting I wouldn't know, because somebody has I hear this flocking story. He opened up the door for me have a responsibility. Now that I have another story that this. If he does, I have the nuts and bolts of how this work have you thought about. In addition to this, I think There's gonna be a number spin off books from this. This is really book that comes from this. We'll tell their personal shot. I will end up dead, really I will in the bed not because, because of what I'm expose our way, we know who did it and in an inner we know was. I grew up when I was growing up the power in that, as in county was the waterfront idjit.
That picture in New York City. There people see thousands of people died for that water fund. That waterfront was controlled by we wine, but I really want a piece of it and not buried in one piece, so my eighth grade teacher was the we hope may never teach her. There was a man. Why would your teacher the marrow of tat? Why why why Who's about to a teacher was the mayor of a fuckin town. At the same time, I did and guess what at the end great. The anxiety have come in and poor mother. Really. Eleven years ok, what's he doing, he was selling the war. He all that They knew that making miles there's a particular family. I will not mention with his I will make three four or five and they were buying that prop
no change of sixty by that, probably up in the sixties. They were posing as politicians, they chop up thirty million a month between four and then sell it not at all. This is from all the pomp, probably they own Hudson gap, a board, Everything Jersey, city, whole milk, but they make their profits selling it. No, no, they made profit renting it all renting saw before them before brothers, troubled, thirty million legal there, always every month, a job or thirty million. So I saw from not Bergen my taste. I was about com, I'm boughs, and he was a cop. He was a cop. I I got invited he opened up. Home to me than his Sunday, the one that was my age. So I became a pseudo son. So here I am with the Cubans during the week there talking about numbers and drugs and everything and I'm grown up cops house, that's also the driver for the mayor.
And he would do whatever. I saw em Hank of those and draw beat Zeiner men. They call the veni the towards they call them combine the torch Marzano because his job was to burn your building. Now the last one he bird down. Kids. Will I missed amidst the smoke these his ten dollars? Who can ice cream qualified apartment? He never call. He fake the heart attack not to talk to reporters first thing you do. Is you say, God Attack, because you have to talk to reporters days to get you stories straight with the attorney that you have. No. Idea what I know now now. The reason I ask so the question about what whether he would have been willing to talk is a lot of people. Reached out to me early in this book process, the them the moon, the movie. Rights are options before I even wrote the book based on the book proposal and I got a lot of media attention and I started getting emails from.
Nieces, enough hues of sons and daughters of key care. Actors in this story- and these were people like Joey who had kept to personal family histories, bottled bottle that you're like tat and talk to anybody about it, and now they saw I was doing this book and eight and I needed to get it off the chest they needed talk about it I would go. I met these to these two. Who were daughters of one of the guys who became a snitch testified against the court racial family went into the Witness Protection Programme, these girls are never talk to anybody. When I met went to meet with them in a bar, they weren't even sure they were going to talk to me. We were just meeting to talk about whether they were going to talk to me. I got to meet them, they talk not stop for three hours once they thought they could trust me day. Just they couldn't stop talking about it, They had all the stuff they needed to get off their chests. We were raised not to say, oh god, oh god,
The first rate I saw my mother was five. They Sammy on a couch raided. My mother had already drawn the cold what about the little lady downstairs. The landlord, had already called the cops around the way out the door. We lived on the West side terrorist facing new jobs, busy and lay down stairs. She would pay her rent and tell her hold this bag. My mother, through they came up upside down. They asked the silly with aviation ADHD. We never got right it when I moved him a bargain, haven't yet rate before I read it, the flower re become my mouse annul. They amount to clean the house. I'd wait my mom Mcdonald, clean the house and come over here and what you see what's gonna happen: cocksucker The rest of my mother would walk the comments of with my basketball right past the cops, and it was that there was. Daddy's. While do you wish you run into Joey before you start right, there would have been different book was why I enjoyed this book. So much is because no,
but how much history this mother Fucker dropped on you he Let you know who holds a battle was he kept you remind and whose? How is a battle was that? for us it. He never got away from Jose Battle, and when you read the book, no matter What type of person you are you kind of Madame Jose Battle, but this about who is a value life cause you. You want that guy if you knew I was a battle, you do that he got metropolis, I'm goin out there. For my men, that's the guy! I want with me all the time when we have this fuckin idiot. He gets Canada if the ambulance caused by this guy, actually went out and saved a guys, so he had that cuban loyalty. That add, Castro. Cuban shit that big so grow were not. There were so many things I was on my desire. I wasn't even allowed to talk about.
Now here's how ruthless skyward. Let me let me live. Let you answer the question now. Do you wish that you would run a joke? I yes, I do, but out the thing that fears me. There was so much research to do in this book. If I would have met Joey, I would have gone down Arabin hall with Joe stories and that might have taken me off, specific research, I was doing So I almost Joey's Joey's thing is like a separate thing. It's all! like a sea equal to or a sub or sun, the son of the corporation, sort of spin off of it, and there is a lot of people, probably who have their version of it like Joey, does that they could tell so yeah, but let me say about battle Joey soon, a very interesting thing, how charismatic he was and how you, partly TIM and admired him, which was it was the case of any good leader right? That's what you want from a leader, but here's how ruthless. Was this here,
a guy in his organization, Ernesto Torres Earnest, Steagall. Who he met in Spain. Battle was on the run in Madrid for a brief period of time when he been indicted on gambling charge is never a bunch of Cubans living over there and they all hung out together and hee hee. Discovered this nineteen year old kid named Ernesto Torres. Who was a sort of an orphan and day he tells the kid he's got a mentor. The kid one day tells the kid I got it come on over this afternoon, the apartment I want you to watch. He owes me ten thousand dollars on, went up scared the shit out of the sky. I want you to see what you do, how you reed somebody who owes you money show them that they can play around with you, so he's waned. For the guy to come over battle any sit in his apartment. Here's a pop pop from out in the street. He goes down, he goes out let's take nineteen year old- is there the gun in his hand, he shot the guy in the back, She is a cab arrive. To meet with battling killing him and he says
how do we know Godfather says you'll never have a problem with this. Guy again I took care of it. A battle look I'm going you do you just cost me ten thousand dollars. I didn't want the guy dead then again he looks in earnest. He corny thinks I can use. I can use this guy, I can use the sky. So Ernest Eagle becomes what he calls his prodigal son, grooms. This guy too may be the next godfather when they come back. The new jersey and come back to in city, he he said this guy earnestly go out there, and no one else in the corporation can understand battles affection for this guy. They think earnest equals thug. He's a killer is three. I'll get. The organisation can use guys like that, but you don't put it in positions of authority battle scene have a soft spot for this guy. He makes earnestly go a banker. He makes the. Their bankers, bankroll put up, thousand dollars each so that our nestico can be a banker they don't like it.
Most of em, don't like it, but they go along with a couple of em: don't go along with it earnestly going. Of the brain to be a banker. He failed miserably as a banker he's humiliated. By that So what does he starts? Kidnapping bankers from the organization and hold it? for money very self destructive thing to do. He turns against organization. He goes rogue one of a me shoot so Banchorie kidnaps enshiu terms to be paddles brother in law. Debate. Please come to Jose Miguel ballet say you you created. Is this fuckin monster? You brought kitty, and you create them. You gotta, take care of it. Battle being the man is realises, that's true. It is research its ability he high. Is a few assassins to try to take her in out. They bomb is car in union city. They try to kill him can't get the job done battle, decides he's gotta, do the thing himself, by this time earnest Tito's fled to Miami hide and now, with his girlfriend in opal, aka battle gets together
his brother, one of his brothers and another assassin, Chino Koona, and they go down to take her down to Miami and in the middle afternoon they burst. In this case they find out where you as a person is apartment. Engage in a wild shoot. I would earnestly call- and I shoot him- it in the closet of his bedroom battle goes and gradually by air and shoots unripe ripe. It puts a bullet read between his eyes. Now, that's a boss I mean, aside from the horrible each of the act. That's a leader! That's a guy takes matters into his own hands. He wants some die He goes and Does it himself and uses that as an example for the organization he comes back to the bosses. The bankers in New York. He says you know, I have a problem with with our new anymore. He says you know what he died. Like a lion. He fought to death, he empty, fattened need empty is gone, and then we shot him in the clause so
he's telling all the bankers. I still admire the kid he fought like a lie, but I took care of it and you know the other daughter believed bullied. Bankers weren't were in all of this guy cuz he had a certain ability to do that to date in have does in the book polio. He and his pictures in the blue light? What was the logic to take this thugs and turn them into a bank or in the first, He understands why Forum Battle was a sentimentalists he took in stray dogs. He drive around this. He drive around and needs The dog industry need open the door and it's a common. If the dog commie took the dog in and it is home in Miami as a state in Miami had like twenty five stray dogs in they said earnest. Ego is like a stray dogs. He had a sore spot for the kid before pistol, quick on Cuba, the dog,
some might say, Lazarev Big, simply and care. When Michael Vick got convicted. There was a lot of jails. He couldn't be centre because they had not acquire population and then I'll play when it comes to dog, because their devotion is to Saint Laszlo Way, Saint Lazarus, who got these one to crush Tat is licks and then wrote. The devil battle was allow. You broke I would say that what are you bring Irian Jaya ideas on Iraq? As I love these motherfuckers and fuck you, you got a problem for Eu Usa. That's what was he was very loyal and and until you turned onto your tiny, but you know they almost cancel the sopranos to HBO got really pissed at the Sopranos and episode seven when he drives his daughter to the school and he kills the guy. Personally, because HBO felt that bosses should never do heads that was
He did that all the HBO phone HBO without they went at they went at Chase factors Ross Green Bernier. When I chase and said we'd all tank in real life- a boss- maybe when he picked up a guy by his neck, when he drove Whatever willow, the college that HBO threatened the sopranos, not the air that episode to cut that, make somebody I'll kill the guy that wasn't the only guy was because they wanted tony soprano. These two wanted him to be some sort of a hero, the United States. It is clear that one of the gas hands clean there. No ridiculous Cosette was one of the more appealing things about them show, but I'm sure he was a murderer, but you still like that the end did he kill polluter. I too was right. Tat such a brother caught his leg. Alviella me tailor them on fire. Tell you the plumbing off. We require the police story, police, killed battles brother, his youngest brother, in a dispute shot a minute
bar in Washington, I'd marry public murder. I mean it and in so to the battle family. So now go battle? Is can livid and at the funeral and unions, he gathered his men together, nieces and I want this guy's. I this guy's head on the wall I want. I want to build a Mount disguise head on my war and what's out ahead on this guy for a hundred thousand dollars, and this is seventy. So you know that's volume, millions problem, in dollars earnest because the one that takes on earnest take on another assassin are the ones that take on that contract go out trying to get Kalulu? I mentioned before. There's there's something like a nine camps or twelve attempts on poor loose life. They had a shoot out in central park with machine guns in the middle of the afternoon. Only share guys when machine gun shootin within our mothers would baby carriages and stop pollute
got shot up so bad. He loses his leg. He wines of having to have a prosthetic legs. They still go after pollute one pollute goes to prison. They hire killer too, to stab him in the prison yard. Twice to several times. And he survived that. He keeps surviving a he survived, so many these assassinations terms they they think he's not human. They come believe that he's got some sent Santa Maria Spirit whose protecting him so you think someone has, as I was sure it was here for this. When youth Have so when you think, has a Santa Maria Spirit checking them. You have to how true that, with the Santa Maria Spirit of your all, you have to have, we call them bay, where you, where you, where you Create a kind of voodoo energy to kill this guy, so they so they contain. Go after pool of finally battle, as he did with Ernest Eagle says. We'll take matters into my own hands. I'm one of I'm gonna, be there on this one.
Find out where Palu is in the Bronx and they go. One night and they trap him. They cars come from all sides. They trap him. He gets out his car, they shoot him in the street and full of eleven policy falls. Industry bleed being loaded with gunshots Lasting, he sees is Jose Miguel Battle, standing over him laughing at him, and then he those unconscious in the street. They think grey he's dead or almost ready to celebrate the following morning, they find out now Palu was rushed. Ass, Billy's, not dead, he's recovery. Now there side themselves what cornea they ve tried it. We have tried everything, they say you know what we're not going to give up higher an assassin dress him as a male nurse. He goes into the hospital shoots. Pooh in is in his hospital bed right between the eyes, and I got to get the job done.
He was talking when you were gone about how if you ve felt like a guy had a century, a spirit protecting you had to have your own sent to reinvigorate to combat yeah combated, Santa Maria became a scam After a while, I was raised in Santa Maria from the age of five. I had little to Durban sit on my dad died. I was weak. I didn't. I didn't put me in the Santa Maria B which doktor explained century to people who don't know it's a religion that originated in Africa, Nigeria and then the slaves broader Oda cuba- they hit it from this plantation owners through Catholicism? So that's why? there's a lot of cross is kind of a mixture of am again and catholic religion without five? I was brought up two hundred forty eight stream is lady havoc coffee, a dog, and I love the coffee. I loved dogs and I was largely term so I was playing with a dog. She would talk to me. I fell in love with this woman. I found lover
She was like my mother and then, as I got older one that he asked me. Do you want this? Do you want that? Do you want to get a language which is the first one? a big, wild or Goom Yo Romero. Those are the first thing. Is you get and you put him by your door and they guarantee you know you safety. For me, it was health that big black woman is my God. Jerry and then after When I was six day finally said there was initiate me and my mother, because my spirit took me: father. Why so they wanted my God mother. They want to me- and my mother be twins in this the reason I made saved on origin, forty, eight Streton Broadway, and but for me it wasn't the b a killer. With a be anything like that, I can't carry guns. I can't go and caused a strange boy. I cant do business with three people
I can't say I hope Jamie Fucking gets hit by a car, my lab to say all those things I don't use it. The way, the late. Seventeen do business with three people, because two of them up against you and that's the same thing that happened in my kidnapping, I rob somebody with three people. I can't stand. Look in my life now look at my life when I was right about my saint in my head is controlling that's why I was well Whitey should, on Mondays it's a damn slack You always were a white teacher on Monday. Look in my shoes. Why thou wipe away establish. Shall I walk on totally on my MAC. Every day, every day, every day ice Still very sad in my head I wasn't when I was doing a coke, because I knew I was allowed to what happened in the in the MID seventies, Santa Maria was, I would pay You tell me what you want here hear: what's not a big,
Cargo come in from Colombia with twenty kilos. What with a saint say I do it. Fuckin religion, then I'll fuckin train What blow These are people got enamored saw, it was like Ino procedure. I want to kill your Rogan when we put a spouse is supposed to write your name on a thing and then take a pound and put it in a town like there was big story when I was a kid photography, one of happy story that he's in a book he's omega mega. Seven. I didn't know this growing up. He went to court one time and his godmother made a powder and before the judge went to make she's played the power of the thing
The judge fuckin couldn't remember what the fuck he was about to say this. Mr case ass, she became a star. Every fucking criminal wanna give thousands bowers clothes. The powder would like a thing they made. There's a movie they called years ago. It was the devil's advocate with with a reasonable chino here and there's one scene where the ethical protect the guy, the guy's, a Santa reignite New York is pro too cute because he's killing animals without a license, and he goes this he takes a tongue out, he puts the tongue Valley blasted tongue would like and they does. He asked a guy was the judges name and the judge gave his name He took the time, a role it would nails. Pull away and they go nowhere. Tomorrow, the next day, a court, the judge starts to Fuckin talked, and he goes into a coughing spring. He kept I talk now. That person looks like a hero. These war
subtle coincidences that these flock is Pigs were fuelled by now, So now I want you, gotta have a big we, Joe Rogan. What does the saint say? You get four pieces, a coconut you through. On the floor. The saint say this is gonna, be a weak lemme, give you twenty five. Hours from now drug dealer started doing it with Noriega got busted, he had Santa Maria and his closet, Dell was well known to Santa Ryan's closet is doing well, they ever you have especially on and you have an altar. I made a promise when I live in that department that have got if a button. I got me a house, he had his own room. Go to my house. I say this in my office. Realise me all I heard in out I'm not I'm an author, and I also have a view. If you get into the cuban thing you it will get. You know, get you something for me and I had I haven't or have you haven't? You have to have a wise. My recent oration Lou I want to do this.
It's a belief system. Why did you do cause? You can't really understand culture unless you embrace it on some level. You understand it and live it. Unless you continued even after the boy all you guys had people talk to me. Through college. By u turn hard to permanently people have done, my readings may have mentioned you in my readings, will do you around the bureau but allies son all away the end was, I mean, but the lies, an old wise saying he has twenty four different passages. He goes my passages or oh yeah gonna. When you don't want around, because they were supposed to push on going ahead, but to time me down, I was, I shall son, go means thunder. Whenever you see done there, shit that's Chung grow around jungle was a bad and a woman. You
And kill mice around him, they beheld them because a mouse walk about. I woke up and oh it's funny. Looking man, you have no idea, Ngos, the drum the Congo to which the thunder you know, summoning the thunder yes or they put above ally my head to calm down, I'm not supposed to carry weapons at knives army. I take it into arguments. My mother- and I say this tomb she's, just a whore she's, just show me the horror of the saints she gave him a kid. So yeah my raise. If you have problems with you Stop Michael, you want to have a kid. You have the whole truth. You know, but the women saints off worse than the male sides. You don't fuck around with the women saints because they will find your world I tune as you probably Mary, Magdalen, yes, and yet my yeah sent a message from my mother Mama than do my mother died. You know He says that there is another side to the story and feeling,
I told him that, alas, we a slight like my mother head May for years they sent me the sacred heart schools. Boys. Yet she sent me that a good education, but she said Meda. Because a lot of shit, you don't want me to say that that and when I got a catholic school I was introduced to it. Things are not introduced in one night was the end of union city. The end of that political era. Where everything was running. Smooth came to an end like seventy six. That's an allegation started to come up because it was two cops that would shake my mother down very decent people. They come in. One night came well dressed, would have a drink talk to my mother and spanish, my mother, Freedom, it was a price of doing business Now here's I knew Joey was legit because when we first started communicate, he mentioned the name of one of these cops and thy name is in the book fragment here, a well known cop in
and union city at the time. So I knew right away. Joey Frank Monica to your house, and you have to wear a thousand only other times would make it to the police station so my stepfather one want to kill him. He canvas data wands elected to twenty five that was like for you know like when Tony Montana PICS Michel finally goes what is a Cadillac committee, you could put a push the best portion, oil and then eighteen. Seventy five Cadillac makes to a Cuban. Take the Catalan because that's that's a screen. That's that's what it is to be flocking, mighty when Mona took DEC lack from one. He then show by after ten years he wanted to shoot at Fa Cup, but that cap a clue car there was a dirty cop and he always busted my mother's balls, but he wouldn't come in for the shakedowns was to other guys
then about seventy six. This geisler come I'm gonna. Look like light. Your Morrison Cuban go looking endued with another white partner and they would come in and they would yell at my mother and my mom had up the bar the pool table on the back, and then she had made office if she had to take a number or somebody while I plan on, but she read them upon, she owned a building, so she ran through the apartment upstairs the wind to the back, so you could be following the same to you, so you could she's on the back office. I was not back office one day, they're yelling, but I came outside this cop was pressure. My mother saying fuck you. We know what the fuck you're doing. We want money now at that time, in the city ran from seven to forty eight street. There was a bunch of bars with Anti Ojo CAFE what data the other tat way of artist
a brain be. These are all well known cuban bookie spot, and this guy started torturing Cubans and accuse like what duff fuck has got what we pay. And also this guy, but what best the Cubans off the most was that this guy was cute as neighbours Nicky Gerardo. And he was going or whatever and just kept on one day I'm used to go to Mckinley School and I would walk up to my mother's bar and one day I walked up there and every one of those cuban owners were in there drinking fucking, yellow. Anti Castro. Should there was one way before the surprises name with boiled leap it that means sad pussy He also club monetary. Firstly, now in unison, we also have to remember: there's a bar call, the bottom in a barrel, and if you read any mafia books, the bottom of the battles and remarkable it. Its were had Rihanna Dominic, my Tegghiaio and Nino Geigy. It's right.
I am very glad that this was going on in unison, used real fog, big deal real now focus deal now before we get off Santa Maria I told you a story about earnest eco right after People got murdered and searched his apartment. They found a bunch it Haiti been taping phone conversations with all people around him any tape, some conversations with his mother pack in Cuba and is take on new. He was hung a hunted man. He they had been attempts. He was hide. Now in phone conversation with his mother three before they got it. Talking with his mother, and she says I I know I'm worried. I know they're trying to get you. I'm worried I knew when I do a ban to try to protect you and he says, yeah I need it in all. He says I'm caught in the middle of a war of the saints caught in the middle of a war of the saints, and she said- need some name names for my bembe
and he names the wasteful. It's a a ceremony you know a ceremonial summoning of the spirits for one purpose or another and she was above, allow priestess. So he gives her The very people were after him posing Battle he says nor cornea. He names the people who are trying to kill him. So there's mother can use those names in her ceremony. So when the cops fineness obviously the the Bombay didn't work cause they killed. They got to artistic, and kill them, but on the other hand, when the cops found this tape, it was like earnest. He called speaking from the dead and fingering his the people who killed him. And they were able to use. That is evidence. They knew exactly who killed him because of that tape. Conversation with his Bible out, so how the fuck Hu, I fit in the Santa Maria. What would it
You want a couple years ago. I rather read some guy told me that you have a couple stronger but allow people in your life and that's definitely you your old wise, a guy you're violent, very control. Your lab more control than I am which is, moreover, I glean poison Chango face phase. My my valet, my main thing as are ya gonna Jago How was the young obatala he's the one that took a short and wipe it on his chest with red and they asked him? Why did he like to kill him? He said because blood makes changed something stupid he has, but I don't practice that I don't nevertheless, very calm, but one Mondego season, a ban as mother fucking mentioned then mention your name Maybe they don't need to mention these once they tell
May I already know what they thought. I really know what you're talking about I still go get readings Miami next time, a lot of my God see. This is the real thing on my high still violent this there is nice to follow. You ask me why I would still following its because once you get to it, the standing of the idea that there are certain spirits within you and they The Irish is represent different spirits once you, I understand that. That's not some you throw away. Even if you don't follow the religion anymore. You still do you still have belief in that still believe in that saw. My Irish is illegal. Why illegal, or is the Saint ISA trickster elegant, Two trickster plays. Tricks and all so the saint of passages, so people what Elegua, above their door, cause your passing from one room into another room, And so you again, if I would that spirit and that becomes part of your identity, but you can't whistle in the house why
Did you have you can't whistle in the house? I don't want. You can't go in there because your leave, so you can't walk away. You cannot with no. Why, when I was a kid I sit at the table, I do with my mom, which go touch that fuckin table yet wake your fuckin head. Regardless. Now Joe, I grew up in it. They made the same thing to me like the one when I'm a saint was in November and they dig up in the Bronx River, so they had a break the ice and there was dark skinned. Cubans and I'll, never forget that they rip your clothes off and then they take that whatever you're saying is they hit. You with the number of water should be the same thing as five. You can hit with five things of water and they dry you off of your free
and when I saw him my mother's closer, I was about five, unlike fuck, you, black motherfuckers, what I'm down bronze above to chase me and bring back a lot to do in its an all night ceremony, light on a Friday of trade, all our twelve hours now homer weep and then Sunday is when they read your future too, and then for a week you just live in the corner white. They paint your head, you Bob Why have to go back to school on Monday baldly? Had they say he's not allowed and hear what a hat my mother gave the principles more nickel and I was allowed to wear that hat from nine to three, but then at three I had to go home and change into white clothes for a year. For a year and addressed some white for a year year. So like clause. I would just have the way we want to do. I go where those White South white teacher does. I was a kid I can't keep warrant, but on wider with them a ribbon shit
So now you have to grow back. So when I walk into a desert, Thomas Santa relay real huddled deal with it at all, because it's all the same thing like everything else. Now I it's a bunch of white people, grow up in. It was a hot black eye and they want to really just such data about Sperrits video tech. I saw video my shame on them. It's all confused as I know, the white chicks that sucker hidden dick when they got a hot yoga. Guided diagram. Big rum is a pig, but your white checks would promise flavour and Emma pepper from certain that he gets to me inside you stop that fuckin dead, Dick smells like harbours, chair dinner.
What it is, and I like I've, been invited. The two bodies first time. I want you those who welcome the dude from that play the army. I pleaded Amy Forest fires, waited for serious aunt, Izzie, vague, real chicken One Miss America, freedom pussy from behind the Ladys in this area, Vanessa yeah, it's not my salary. I grew up with acute. Say three shut, you different Santa Maria, because its Asher Cuba is it mexican influence on, and this is why do we sit on its own behalf, my god legit dance? Moderate now will you that are as its very watered down and look at the guy from technical Lover. Forest Whittaker, dressed up like like fuckin MA, x ray I don't do Papa played a mob hum Larry. I came up under very strict shut your mouth, nobody,
did you know you fuckin business Ladys to fill the gap there is a war it was this that this is what it is here Moreover, averse data like whenever, The guy, like the guy that gives me the reeds, is tremendous TAT, this man to man, tremendous Really tremendous! I even took Duncan talk tremendous you took down good tell Russia yours, we had him on the pact. Gas and everything the problem with him, his own, like his the people around Europe, has to make people. I don't know what I'd do join this. I knew well get me solving bright young man. When I knew I knew I liked it My mother was to do my God, mother. I, and it was my relationship with their effect mother could even say it to me from my grandma when
when an eighty five I might when when I moved them with the benders, I couldn't bring myself to reassure them that fucking dalliance, so I left it with this gig. I may Martin the fag Munting a month ago so sold coke at night he was seamstress seamstress in the daytime for a big New York play. When I was a kid, would go to sea, be Gb Semi, nine, so called use, These facts walkin around today, should give thanks to morrow if you was kidnapped, that black eyes back in the seventies, because he was gay, but I like mine, I ended up my I left my saint Martin and Years later and Robin Mine Michael came flocking Hale, so my God mother asked me mainly in eighty five ways. You sank on their minds house. She goes, you know, you're not supposed to have you seen through the gay man's house. I'll go, get em, listen to me, and it was all my grandmother again at a mainly fire. I did. I talked Duncan about Santa Maria and some come.
The approach me from London and I did their Santa podcast, I got an email onto it. We know who has you saints therein in Miami thirty, four years later I flew to Miami. I got my say flew to get em. I flew together Coming back, my God mother got into man on a bus, wow, so six cases on a bus with all your future. You stuff, I got my notebook and if you look at my love book up in my notebook next, reading your job before really oh yeah, so you you you, you believe this something to it. I tell the age of eleven. I thought they were Butscha, Hocus, Pocus, mother, focus, but there was a lady on twenty six and central, and I grew up with her kids. Her husband was that big book on an eighteen street
and once a month she passed despair and people go like ten. Eight people were invited. Agate tell this cop was eating away my mother, personal, my mother, laid off and nobody. My mother was a shoe tat, mother, fucker myself. She issues that type of cuban woman she didn't like being spoken till. I wish I could see it in the face of a z. Why one night we went over to this way. These Barney
This time I saw the lady drink a bottle of fire water. You know that hundred and forty proof. I would do anything. So I thought this is bullshit. This bullshit this is she empties eyebrow daytime. So at night I would watch her bottles mad. The label like they were sealed because I had my mother had a bar, so I know there were seal them by this. Woman would pass spirit and then tell you what to do and what not to do on this particular night. She went unto my mother. She goes, I know, what's bothering you and she took a white dish, a white dish that was just there. She did
Campbell. She turned over. She went like this. This circular motion on the camp was ten or eleven Jerome at that time, but I believe I don't believe in Dick. I don't believe in Dick. I believe, Jesus out your fuckin story. They die, she flitted over the dish and it was a circle with a guy that look like a b and she goes. This was bothering you and my mother knows yeah. She goes as she broke the dish in seven days or never bother you again. Four days later, we'll get up. Nicky Gerardo was his name, they shot him a thousand fuckin times at a place called wrapping old taxi. It was a front. There was a taxi thing. That was a front.
Were cocaine. They deliver cocaine, rapid homage quick. They never had a customer in their caps mega collation. They will wait. Listen when you told me about you Gerardo. They said they got, the witness wasn't. No witness was the use that he caught some sharp. Why? Because he went by its side of the euro. Why is it also that come around the start collected from Jack? How corrupt the sustained the papers. They said he died a hero that he was shot by a street criminal and he was given a heroes, peril Joyce, as he was shot by other. Why no they know they are. New York city was that dirty. Did you hear this when you're doing your research? Now I did it. I told her. I M told me- and I did some research on it- found out that the guy I the public account of what happened. I was quite different and with how joy described those cops, because he has taken full and that's what I was saying before about the what then,
story. We see on the surface and then the real story I see. I know all those like the half of that political. System mime in his book. He has Section, where you actually see battle for a police station and to make pay off light, that's how easy you know, battle, got arrested in North Bergen in my hometown. So I called one of my friends. I go. Do some research on this if they never even put the cup song, on the town he owned, the tie on the mare and police chief and, if you all, during the day, only went to prison eventually for taking money from the gambling from yeah. Oh mayor will Jamie when you got a minute No man has ever left Hudson County if it's not through prison. The mail, the fact Guinea
die because it was a hundred pounds. Every other man ends up in jail effect. The merry union city is up for corruption. Charges as we speak, and this is what thirty years later read that a recent it's never stopped Joe Rogan. It's never stop. That's why? When people Tommy stories, I went my now and also this is when you say, organised crime is diminished. While the east, we talk about organised crime, bright, it still air it deeply rooted in the system and certain jurisdictions, and it's not gonna change It is crazy to me that you got so deeply entrenched. Reading the story that you start again in Santa Maria, I was actually I was married to Brazilian for ten years. They have their energy, is no centurions Club Macomber and what's different about their rights was exactly the same. They have all the same saints it's the same thing same thing, because a slave trade came through Brianna Africa, Catholicism mixing, they did
Just some music is different to cure, It's a rumour. All this wonderful. Rumour, music to you here, there's a whole bunch of great me, it grows up around it see. You were married to brazilian women, get divorced to keep their religion as though it happen. I can't go to places like Human Brazil. Can I get so inflows? Stan overwhelmed by the changes direction. My life real. I went to Brazil Life the first full day I was in Brazil. I fell in love with them. Woman? Did I married and lived with for the next ten years, while When I go to Cuba, it's dangerous. Because I'm so seduced by I'm so intoxicated by Havana by cuban culture. What is it well, first of all its,
Most sensual place. You can have an is the most sensual place. I've ever been everyone flirts, the women flirt men if they're married or not married the floor with you, I suppose guys flirt to everyone. Learn. There's like sexual energy everywhere. Sky and in the climate is just kind of soul, tree and and and sensual the music is makes your body move Joe. Would you let me play video for you to show you some dancing in Cuba sure when women dancing you, they cover their pussy, because what I'm trying to do the whole dance is me baby knew it was the prettiest things you ve ever see your life is meat coming up to, with this movement. Like my planet, like you, while I was getting nowhere with yellow
was gone, what s way before the pike ass. He was tightened so how to play the puppy. This day, my pants ass, and once he heard- I could see Nigerian alive even got up and kicked his leg, one time which met with IRAN because it saw and better than your culture, but in cuban dancing I'm covered up to you and every time I come up and avoid this. Well, I guess you gotta come which arouse, but the whole time you'll be covering your pussy, because on the EC shades gonna grab pussy Harvey wisely would do for that here's how I take it by the way. What is this I I love. I love afro cuban music, latin jazz. So I'm hosting I'm curating and hosting a latin jazz series in New York at a bar think, every Thursday night
J, English and is aware jazz explosion. So I had to choose the music. The musicians perform their and I added I hosted evening why you do this every week, yeah, what we're going to credit try to just keep keep going indefinitely. That's phenomenal So this to you was a natural subject to sort of growth, So while I had written, I published a book Havana knocked turn which was about the mob in Cuban Fifty's I really got into it then made numerous trips to Havana Fur, extended periods? so this book was almost like a sequel to the air was a nice waiter visit that culture pick up the thread of story because this one is sort of an answer. To the end in Havana, nocturnal. You you ask yourself. So then what happened? What happened after the mafia got chased out of Cuba? was their response. How did they take? I want to show you this eyes to, by dancing
what does it say glove? What's the name of the law on call? Well, I call this woman. What see everything what gives over visit. So watch all me always about ninety watch. A movie so the news about genes about always with your things what the grandmother was so different answers is a seduction register Doug here they're. Both there. There. They are engaged in a mutual seduction. This is crazy. Ants Jimmy was the name of this show it to me. I say that will encourage the rhythm. One goal is to read you a la montaigne dodging them. La more w and manure keep us more new, Tito's em you and
to you, Aren t o s De Matanzas Matanzas is the province. Flower watch how she grows a pussy every time he comes close. Now that mute, the rabbit grab it and she black here, they'll fuck, aware that's Larry is so the drumming your hearing and the use of what is called the shake array that gourd there and chanting. That's going on that you would. You would hear all that in Siberia ceremony wow this grab Pussy shit is aware: Larry's hilarious. Yeah. He clasped her hands is jump to a king regionally, but he's protest check in how we doing down there like he's gravity easily squeeze, and it is what you aren't. You just play what he just threatened grab and she grabbed TAT lay hilarious. So it's very playful flirtatious right that this is the key
sure that's cool, you know it's funny inmates in any five I lived in a building and fourthly, was a panamanian woman and she told me that she went to Cuba ices, a young girl, and she was a surprise what was going on in Cuba? There is God's punishment, she was. It was such a disgusting fucking place, and then it was weird couple days after I'm told him a dj somebody on Facebook. I did a joke from my c, so special about club, thirty, eight, the honour his name was woolly vanity and his claim to fame. Was that his grandfather had the biggest dick in Cuba. I grew up with two kids out of the claim to fame one of them. His dad was the best pool player, killed and American to go down and he beat the fuck out of that place Chicago When I was the other guy made. The fame was that his grandfather was two guiding godfather to who had the big dick and they com Superman. Sadly Saturday nights
club, thirty, eight. In union city, he would on salaries he recreated and he had people come down a belated calmly showed ten dollars to get two hundred people. He would get some coat that chick tire up to Cubans like that, would play the Congress and he comes in fact the lady in public should go crazy with the biggest dick in the world and in my job, fucker in public that was Yang within a whole lot show that was a public function, but it went all the way back to Cuba to Life fifty. Five, like the name of the place, was: Shanghai through the Shanghai Theatre, any and then the godfather, to Michael takes they take Michael there, nor suddenly goes out and ever found this place. If it wasn't for Johnny. Oh that's when Michael finds out dad he bitch
so it showed a guy wouldn't event simpler. If the guy with the deck was also the greatest pool player cause, he could use all my God is a year that will be perfect, so they did this article about two weeks ago time my facebook and it's called and searches Superman Jerome him. It was the most disgusting I would rather my life that these white dudes went on a fifty year. Looking for Superman the legend of the guy with the big dick, the fact Duval went to Cuba to the location, even though its close just to see what it was and what the story is, that says Americans will go down every week, and that was our first time to see this big black cuban dude fuck, the shit out of some poor white chick. Yelled and scream the place was sold on every night. I mean the guy was a gardener, the article, Satial of you could find it's called insert Superman and they is
there is still a matter of Diana, but wait came out the same week that they said that what are you fucking prettily? They no faith. Three that's why they call of Superman afraid of eyes? I saw a video of super when I was researching Havana Nocturnal I found out that Santo traffic country had a lawyer named Samara, Ghana, since deceased SAM we're gonna used to take a lot of super videos when he'd go down to Cuba. His son whose currently a lawyer in temper told me that he had super footage of Superman that his father had made in the fifties. Super Can a private sex show fucking a girl, and I said who I got to see that? Could I see that I mean, I think, that's the only existing video footage anywhere of Superman yeah, but I'm not gonna give it up, that come to tampon and I'll show it for you, Sir I go down there I'll. Never
get he's a lawyer to he says you gotta come at six o clock after the after the off, This clause is so then we can watch it, and I they're in the cleaning ladys to wear. So he brings me in the car. France room. Where he's going to show me the film: are we going to sit there? Wait till the cleaning ladys turn because he didn't want to go. My mother click, while the cleaning ladys in the room. So puts it on the place off completely empty any Those me this footage and his father had scored it too, like Bognor. Beethoven like triumphant, classical music and its etc private show its in somebody's home. They had sex salons in Havana, where you'd goaded like some rich persons house, you pay some money, you had cocktails and then when it clap in a certain time- and you know that was time for the show and everyone would- sit down and Superman would come out and he Hugh. He fought this cuban woman who was who was small. He was big and she was small and he
Spangler from every conceivable angle. The least sexy thing you ve ever seen in your life. I mean it looked like it look like some kind of torture, really And I was it, and this guy had this footage, which is probably worked. A lot of money on big was dictate. The deck was big. Wasn't no. I say that because it wasn't like it wasn't: a mature was even the biggest take I've ever seen. Bigger than my debts bigger than norm. It was bigger than the eyes today. It's almost like athletes like if you go back and You know when Jim Brown is playing football. He was very impressive, but was he Herschel Walker? You know I'm sound like athletes, Today's era are different and if you go back, and look at John Holmes yea at a big dick, but was it Lexington steal? You know like these guys have bigger dicks now for the people.
The board vast people growing the thing that freaked me out of my human species. We re lands in advancing the ten everywhere about Santa that I'll enjoyed from your first book of analogue turn. I wanna tell Jonah stories that one time Kelly went the cast Cuba as a seller, and they were having some type of meeting before him can become a focus right, legislative and that they like what the fuck is wrong in the sample trafficking because I know exactly what you're all come up and they tat the man Michel than they bring him in a room keys. Embellishing this a little tell me just what I remember. This is better. This is what I remember. I read that I guess Santa he's. Sick them onto women Cannon, while he set up, then filmed if not only three way. We know that film it now they were state aid which they had film that they said they said
up in a room with a two way, mere and watched it happening, and then one of them turned the others had shit. We should a film is. This would make great blackmail material. I saw those kind of a freak Press alt, J, F K years at a very curious, the freaks writer while, but you gotta, keep in mind, he wasn't married, he was a young senator. He used to the senator from Florida name, George Smathers and the two of them would go down to Havana, This is around nineteen fifty five, fifty six when the whole thing, in its Hey day and now a big part of Havana, politicians and businessmen, we're goin, junkets, to Havana, like in all paid for by the company weakened retreat go to Havana and they go to the sharing I theater and aid. They have tourists sexual tress and they go crazy and it was out of sight out of mind, it was the original. You know what happens in Havana stays in advance. It was all different country. Wasn't gonna make the newspapers, so
go there and they brought elbows with central traffic, guaranteeing admire Lansky and they loved it. It was exciting it wouldn't it. Do them any damage back home. You know it's amazing. My mother died the seventy nine and when I read that something if I call my head differently or if I wore like a Norman shirt, my mom will go to you fucking raw, and I know what the fuck are you talking about caution when there s a way, always only around godson ROC had so little money gone, and I know what the fuck you Ok, but she told me she died and seventy nine. My mom told me making seventy eight flat out my face that fuckin he was gay ass could be, and, unlike you know, what I've heard- I'm sick and tired of you fuckin Cubans, because Cuba's like these Tommy, I was a kid that they smack Bruce Lee in Cuba, one time that
They taught me shit, one of my uncle smack them. The first Cubans a lie to you. It is the fuckin fuck, with you I thought my mother was fuckin. Mrs Roth customers is gay, his dream a bill and I got what the fuck are you talking about. You sent me. They want a problem, when I was little girl rockets? come to Cuba, and we would all gonna hold tat. You, like Michael Jackson, goes all doubts about a claptrap aid should be kept outside the window. Where would be their light weight to see rob cotton, but the hotel guy would tell He was up there in a room with a man, and I would my are you from like, I didn't believe my mother died. Seventy nine. Eighty five rocketing comes on, says, he's gay, like however, with just a hiding place for people, your mother, noted the Marlon Brando- is Fuckin Richard prior now What about that from this article? If we would have growled down little bit. It says it that they asked his neighbours, the neighbours will I now he was bisexual and, though
when his number one guy that was known every time he came to Cuba was mile and Brandiles Mile and random walking. They were to show girls and inhuman falcon submit. What led by themselves while Brando love the music. The neighbourhood, although played by Congo's, although he was really into will price Why is the same? The back, then they were doing so much coke that everybody just fucked up everybody. Some crazy he couldn't make Jagger flux and violate the law supposedly area. That was one of our major errors. Wife said she caught David Bowe in bed with Mick Jagger Ideological Glenda wanted to fuck you up the actual road sanely end of either the lot of cold weather border fuck. Another guy leaders in the in the story, Brando, who was bisexual, took off with Superman ditching the dancers. So brain was bisexual. Tia I heard he'd he had died of gangrene, gangrene and here it says he was infected here. He died with a lover from sex
He slept around but gangrene from Sackville someone how hard you gonna fuck to get gangrene, maybe fuck this chick. They got shot me ass. He might have fucked animals together yeah, why yea yea Brow, cube was dirty. It was dirty odds elements our most as another that whole society that he hasn't touched, and I now he knows about and that's the abattoirs aside. What's up a common, that's a complete had stood that's the brotherhood of men in Cuba. You'll see illiteracy and I'm a guy. You know you're dealing with them. Talk they advocate. Did the data giggle data on The main language of men I fought with you a couple years ago: you will live in Colorado and I shall keep what a balloon, and I call you
balloons, and we can you come up to an AMA calling calling his nickname. You got a different situation, he'll pull you aside and go. I don't know you and don't you ever fucking call me that outside the circle again and when they get mad at you, okay, to prove their manhood speech in throw you on the floor, pull your pants down and slice your ass with a straight razor. That's worse than fucking a man one did that the two or three people at my mother's wake guy couldn't come in because one and sliced his ass- and I don't know this guy- took me the baseball game then that's the thing that only pussy they can't be in a room if another man is gay in the room, while oh yeah, well, guess what your Romero Tommy, what its dissolved now that this gay men and about fifty years ago, brow, brow
some people would call that advance Joey. That's progress was that that now there is genuine, well yeah yeah. I know it's a little surprise had rain, but fifty years ago to have acquired. When are you have to be on your best behaviour? They don't speak spanish from, for example, brutal me. They have their online to have their own language, and I know it. I know it when they have their own language in Spanish. It's it's like a patois. It's like a pact locked based on African Moreno in our society. And has some years in it. When I owe you won't even ass, my brother in that thing, what's organization of this group Minnesota's? Is it hello shore there, the men of Cuba, they don't even eat pussy, that such data and that the men and other men of Sunday. There begging why the big in prison systems brake assist. What's here, thinking fuck other man, oh yeah, I could give you I got a you know
but Joe you Josephine, it'll, get away and put lives to bite away at I'll fuck you and you're gonna suck my dick vital, ever flopping think you're, gonna, flogging kiss me a touch they Beecher you can set up you fuckin whore find somebody else, but you can't be my interview by another man. He had said about war. If a man wants to suck my dick slums, I'm among one about ploys Toby, I suck my dick one time when ice cubes and his mouth it was Tremendous, what are you talking about what I was the fourth gray I around. You say hello, a certain way yeah. What I'll show you an abattoir? Video about a b, o k you re heritage Maybe a k you,
casual abacha. What is our strategy? Fraternize plenum, there's a bunch errand to show you that the dance, what is the one you have to see how they dance, how they move About why you rubul, whatever now such matters everyone's gonna. Second, one. And so these are just serious doubts when an and then put it Y all I, U Ba enemies. I will see what comes it's also african basis. Also musical element right there lay there you go. Ok, let me show you what requires they're all dressed in white arrest in way still dressed in white. No women allowed no, nothing some of this Jemmy, so we can hear no women.
That is what we say. A woman who would dance able danced so you see the women the right. See how the guy shows up. That's an avocado, a look at this fucking beauty. The colors are white and red right. You will see red, that's the guy this that there, the. The tin man from the way it was there. The You know just saying that could get blade they're gonna lose your elbow kid, a bat again, a bad you. You could suffer like this, making fine of making fun of it. While if I see him, why that's how I do I just got up touch elbow touchy about, while and now this actually game in Thou, which deluded so much
Ben deluded over the years, but one what I meant was an area. There were two other clause but tat all into Tito Latin Band the queue that Congo put the singer? He was about I thought you were a buck. Why you? Just there was a code, the way you very manly code. I come over here this Gay man, and he I call you out of the room. They do me a favor get that why the fuck out of the room were not. You can't talk to me. An approach from a certain way. So is Cuba experienced a lot of progressive ideology leg? Is they changed? The way which very progressive now wish thoughts what caused this. Because they really devolution revolutions programme requires changing thing from here, but their progress mean they're, so isolated Lydia. The internet right. They don't have the internet. Now I think certain ways of getting it now. I think sir see I can get it here and there not great, it's frustrating,
when you go there. You can't it's what's nice is you gotta Havana and you kind of disengage from modern technology? I love it. I mean you couldn't live there. Could care really do business that right, but you just kind of kissing Age from, and is it easy to travel there now? As far as I was even America here, gently like a Motherfucker Jihad, Bellew, like I'm, a volley galofta Solaris yeah, I remember when I was a kid like we had a cuban cigars like a big deal. I dont tell anybody with Cubans, well that's still at still illegal knows the alarm over some of the embargo still exist. You can have some cigarettes you're allowed to have some cuban cigars right, you ever like. In view of what is the amount of I think you're allowed to have like ten, you can bring him back here. You can't sell em here here or if you can selmarie sell Mary cancer, something someone that I'm happy raises book because I knew The story was out there. Just like we haven't even touched.
Was raised by a mega seven guy, like he grew up with my father. So I told Joey when I first met him and I we sort of almost done with this book. I said big when you read it: you're gonna need to sit down because for a guy like him. He knew a lot and I knew, would come across names that he knew but there's no way you could have been part of this and known the whole thing right right. So you you you knew who had I, you know his bag. I do he didn't know tat. He was a professional assassin for omega seven. I knew tat I ve killed. My mother warned me my mother used to go when he picture preschool. Please don't get the column. Does giving one, may not away in a people new battle. They knew some things about him, but they didn't know no one who is part of it they They knew the whole story, but there's no way you could have had an old you couldn't blew my fucking. I went to a dash of my daughter, I came home, the book was,
waiting for me. You know Amazon drops off in front of your house and they had ripped it, and there was other kids and other moms of my wife, and I don't like Denver's put it in my office and when I opened it, I saw t and monchy my fucking need like it hit. He kept texted me as I will agree on at twelve o clock at night, and I go. No, he I am, but I didn't know that this guy, I used to go away every six months and his wife was tight, no store at, I told you would play cards and I would put tighty whities on dance of the women that have double shots of tequila and make me dance, What was in that book name is in that book, for my mom died. I gave me my dog. I couldn't take that dog You should go to Nina's house on 51St street and crying the dog house like that. This is my dog. So soon, as I saw you, I knew he was onto something because stoppie was my father's friend and he was Pappy
come visit me every week, just because he was my father's friend and give me fifty bucks and take me to the city to get haircut. But this claim to fame was in the seventh grade. My mother told him. I don't know what I'm going to do with him. He's got some fucking girlfriend. He won't even talk to me and gave me a capsule and right in front of me, filled it up with coke I said, a push your driver for factories tat. The men did. He was the text. I remember getting from you as you are reading the book. I was getting it every every every thirty minutes. You should get attack from him, be another names. I can't believe you have this name. Finally, the last one was the text said, nay, nay, Carnero with an exclamation mark in a calm and said you bad motherfucker that he gave you cocaine where the fuck is. I go to my driving music. She fucking smack me. She goes don't you have a fucking take drugs from
Many wouldn't did it pleased to go from Canada. Pigeon. The elite they'll be pleased Guph on Canada, pigeon tell and they would Guph want him for my mother. You know he could be Koko's praise I tat the men did. He was the text, I remember getting from you as you were reading the book. I was getting it every every, every thirty miniature. Should I get a text from him? Be another names. I can't believe you have this name. Finally, the last one was the text said. They could arrow was an exclamation mark and a communist head, you back! motherfucker. I couldn't believe some of the names are in there and I know that the EU it was, must have been emotion. I said I was crying because there was to banks, I was going to do is rolly and Malito and their partners with child Miguelito. People used to go from here to Pigeon Toe Guph want him for my mother. You know he could father.
Hello is Duke me: a hundred bucks never seen nobody had a party rican wife. His name is Marlena that was fucking hot and I guess the name Marquez having an affair with her and he went in the name. They are the large ones I never loved. I wonder when the book came out. I got a call from battles law Let those shot make Guerrero underfoot. He won right that a ban that Joe it bigger and become the wild West. Scared, like union City, had become. If I shot Jamie, I know personally come Acme's job becomes a like, there's, no cops There was no captain bill and it's like that today. Still I don't know about another. This was this Heaven. These were still corruption year. They robbed from fuck them every day. When I went home ass, we those problems and not Bergen right. Well, I was home I stated edge ones and even loved by one. When the book came out, I got a call from battles law
time lawyer, gaining jack, Bloomin felled, wonderful guy interviewed him numerous times for the book new battle as well, Has anybody send it in a number of different cases over the years new allow What about him sent a book to him. He call me I don't know that. Well, so he was a little. You know stiff and first we corrected factual things in the manuscript and any guy. Required. He said This was very. It was very emotional for me to read this book. He said cause just Kinds of things kept flooding back, you would use a name or you describe an incident. And all of a sudden it would flood my memory same thing that was happening to you. When you read it the little, retail would go. Oh, my god, it was almost like an out of body. Experience that's the adds to power literature. That's the power like losing yourself in a book to wear
engages your memory in your imagination that you're almost reliving it. As your reading. You talk about thirty nine o one Covey Boulevard, Homeward Charlie yeah project, only basketball game. I want those projects. I stood at seven in the morning and shoot three hundred juncture. Is to be no body there? So imagine your reading a book and you come across added dress in it. Like remind you of what he is saying, it was down the block up, the blog found the body was Bonnie Murray's and not buried four years or you have read out a beer five in the morning, you, whether Ernie's, The Danone would go what the fuck you want. I won't be ready I right anyway, and we can create. Back so that uses s. We're gonna motion for tat very, would sell your bills and there was a call this beer in town that was his reputation last year when we were in high school five and the boy purty open up you fuckin speck fuck. You
open up for you, but I leave, while four cases now want to get the fuck. He would always say that too, but I grew up in those projects that had lived there. How many times I went there to play basketball with an early it's probably a personal friend of the measures, yeah. How are you I mean? That's everything was connect Joe, and I both know Joe, doesn't remember about who is running North Bergen at the time and like I said when my when my I became I fell into that house so where they live, they got his kids. I got they were real talents, So the understanding of how the I went, one of the girls get I get. Who does that anymore they got a motorcycle. I got an indian motorcycle if they went to monitor for the weekend. I got the marked out for the weaker if they got no show job, I'm Russia, I a man with Harris ran when I was in the seventh grade. The janitor hey them does now that would get at it.
All the desk on top of shit and they'd be buff enough laws, ledges want bass and we'll get mighty thou check Are you ever do anything I'm going MIKE? I do. I know You are connected, I know I dont know what I was caught. My boss, I am I did what I wanted to whilst Listen was wrap this up those books out right now, the corporation J, English and, like I said, the west he's a fucking great book once you get done with this book over that book too t J. Thank you very much. My place is gradually to read. The thanks for Avonlea is really fun. Potash, amazing, amazing, stuff right. That's it thanks everybody for tuna into the show- and thank you, our sponsors thanks to square space go to school. Space dot com for a free trial and when you're ready to launch use the offer code Joe to save ten percent off your first purchase of a website or domain that square space, dot com and enter the code. Word
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We did it fund by gas, and I can't wait to read a book of very excited so why things are ready for tune in tat glass of eager tomorrow, diesel areas and that should be fond. And he has a new network special criminal law of the sea. That, by.
Transcript generated on 2020-03-11.