Forget it fake every aisy bagasse unworthy of the woozy fairly that doesn't exist, which never That is no matter. It's not on the elemental chart is not My second concern noble aims, the gas innovate and I'm? The lawyers in this is fraudsters. Apply gas, where we educate, enlightened and entertain you fraudsters from back in time to around the world. What's up, what's up what's up my God, for Yeah yeah I've, zero. as we welcome the fraudsters

Just imagine the welcome to the shell who this is this is our pilot episode. This is what this is. All this was happening baby. The newest thing come in, we are passed about making fun of fraudsters? Absolutely one of the reasons I am so tat they were doing. This shows because I seen all these fraud stories start coming around till you with their nose the fire festival. I think this is, I thought I was quintessentially american and I thought this capitalism at work, but really the more I saw reading and talking with you by we realize it's like this is a humanitarian problem. There is the human condition lends itself to people that will just take advantage of others and take a badge about his vulnerability and I think that is what really is going to drive to show where we're going to try to talk about the people that are the fraudsters right. So after we talked about the two thousand and eight financial, HIV and Lehman brothers and all these places, but who are who are the Lehman brothers here

the Lehman brothers are those guys but like who are the people ever behind these things, the people and what makes them take what was happening in their brains, and we're gonna, do one apis out every every time. I would talk about a fraudster, really wanna positions can be you and me just chatting, going through a lot of research account the story of this fraudster. In another episode, we're gonna try to talk about who that person was through the eyes of the victims and try to interview those victims, organ expert, whether it's a journalist or a criminologist. We actually are friends with Doktor Michael Schema, whose a k the doktor fraud he's a great out. It's been studying the stuff for two DEC, more than two decades now, so he's a lot that he can offer, and I think this is gonna be a great way to kind of get an insight into what makes us so gullible too. That's not just about talking about who these people our but like. Why are we so stupid there? You know it's its legacy.

It's a humanity problem is always gonna, be somebody there's gonna be looking for something and someone that's gonna. Firstly, try to provide that for them. You do you do This is gonna help at all. I hope it does. I did that in ever. Does you gotta me eyes that part of the thing that makes for I pass was always people's belief and doubling down unbelief right this way that culture, or anything else right. It's like it doesn't matter what happened to me. I know it still true right exactly and I think either with the fraudster and chief, the oval office right now. There's a lot of fraud that we could talk about with doll drop in everything like that, but you guys have all heard this stuff before so will probably weight to do Those episodes on the big had me key line up once, but I think it's important no that like, if we can or more, of a little bit more information on how we are, but to be manipulated so easily, because we're not tat evolved. No, I look at me. Harry back, and I realize I'm an ape absolutely my facebook

It is like any fear. Both in dumb means, I think, you're, an adult posten me like misleading political means. Yeah the internet, lewd people buy into the I think the internet has also become this collective tapeworm that as throughout all of our subconscious dresses, and there were just sucking the life force out of us and influencing us in a number of different ways. The Athenians defeatist, upsetting the grating Riyadh in internet help facilitate fraud right because you can always be connected with other believers on their ferries and then also give a direct pipeline through like your phone now member, whether the United started were like hey. Are you a lonely guard? You like a misfit while the internet's a great place for you to build community and then all those we will begin knots Fourchan happened have at the world blew up, so I think you know our first fraudster is someone special that I think we all remember and love. Let's see, if you can get,

who it was not. You really want to know my baby one right. Let's take a look, We all dna tests are sorely searching for the matter of your baby. it's the one, that's very unpleasant! Ok and you also the one that had another girlfriend. While he was sleeping with you yeah. That's him, that's the daddy! you know that How the baby looked just like him yeah you're in denial, Kostiei up money level can suddenly, Yeah baby at that level of gin. The guy's can reveal things that you will never see by Europe now a barrier, your there or read it all. What do you know

eight zero, six, thirty, seven, ok, just before I get into who this person was, you, ve been doing this pilot episode and Henry has been helping us get it by dilated, get it right and one of the things that he said was that you need one sentence. Thirty seconds cops explaining who miss Clio was because you have to assume that your audience has no idea who she is and I nay Andrei nay, everybody knows whom is Cleo is, and so I thought. Okay, let me put it to the test. Let me go and ask people whom is Cleo, is gloriously. I'm talking about this pact. S I'm talking my present saint yeah reduce pack podcast called fraudsters are first episodes could be amiss clearly like whose Miss Cleo, unlike what miss cleat. Anonymous Clio is, if you like, not whose Miss Clear- and I am where people to acknowledge is clearly a real s. Just a relay supplement we're all here.

We are all men him. Yes, we are we about old state of mind that makes you think you're, not old workers like mid level. We are, we are made. We are just at that, like denial, old stage where all the to where, where creepy in the club, but where I sat at the club. Exactly we're not said the club, but then after the club we have a two day: hangover, yeah, it's just so that we can just wrap this up very neatly for anybody, because this is twenty years ago were taught two thousand one. We're talking like two thousand Workpeople Board in the late nineties. Realistic but a single digit years old cell Clio purported hers. To be a psychic. She was not a psychic. She was not jamaican sheet. Not have a real jamaican accent. She worked with this company, called this

kick readers network and she faked this psychic reading business with the psychic readers network to defraud nearly a billion dollars from people over four years. She worked with this company. They had a fee Eight hundred number that you heard in the commercial, then they mean you call back with a nine hundred number. Then they kept you on the phone for at least fifteen minutes or ninety five or whatever it is permitted, and they took your money. An anyone that called vulnerable people. They got owes lies on top of lies on top of lies and that commercial was crazy. You think that was an actor early person calling out of her shall wait, no exact. I think I actually think it was not an actor clear. You are very right that of course, the guy that

is not singing around for my baby- is unpleasant takes that's what this is Miss Clare, I just don't know to do I had, I am another man he's he's. Maybe the father he's gotta Jim you baby gotta gin like the daddy. Oh, my god. How did you know that you and your mom also had a gin? Oh she's, she's gotta, just she does have a gym there. Yes, yes and her mother gin, this is where the psychic power tells me about, did the gene is everyone has a chin and that gene is the negative energy? I was just talking about his Jan years years? Yes, roads must birds, these negative energy from your house, the Chinese, the g, but you must think about this we have never seen a man without a gene. That's why should marry all seek this man out

Stay on the line. Ok, I'm gonna, put you on speaker, found of your hair is Ray Del Harris is actually her real name and she was born and Sixtys in Inglewood California raised in a Catholic. Be in families and went to an all girls boarding school. Let's take this step by step How did Miss Clio the psychic readers network access resource services? How did they go about conducting this fraud starts with that initial commercial that you saw and it starts with the one eight hundred number one they call now for your free three minutes over Did you ever get a reading in three minutes? Justin, I've never had my psychic reading be only three minutes long before I think I think I've done in three minutes is make love to my sweet wife. that's very nice, there's nothing you can do especially if you are conducting or like Europe connecting with the dead or, like you know, the spiritual world, really

three minutes walk. She has a high speed connection. They sit. Let's just I believe she has ever connection to the spear. Well, that's great! Thank you! Miss Cleo for just being so efficient with your time and now you're out in later interviews us up, she said she didn't think there is a fraud here. They took advantage of her blah blah blah blah, but if you're an actual psychic, you need more than three minutes. I don't really care Rita, because sometimes the spirits are also busy when you call they had other people to haunt and stuff Elvis is like I'm talking to Jimmy Hendricks I'll, get back to you in twenty five minutes. He sexually Emily. Who knows if twenty five minutes the Spirit world many minutes, then the real world Do you know? I don't know how you convert spirit time to earth time, yet as a completely different things. So I what timezone- or they are not there to I've. Who knows it's like a Mount Olympus? Derek Oliver Harry Man, John we do know terminating despair around some of us

clouds to play harps. I go to sleep for the next hundred fifty years coma, so the one eight hundred number call this number and you be like all right, I'm ready to talk to mister like now. You can't talk to Miss Clay out. You got to call this number back and it's a one. Nine hundred number, we all know one nine hundred numbers. You have to pay for call back and they would still say you get your free first three minutes, but here's what they would do is that first, the first thing they would do with keep you on the phone as long as possible, classic phone scam Let's keep you on the phone longer than three minutes and start charging you for ninety five minute. So they keep you on the phone they're getting your name, your dress your phone number, your credit card info, all of this stuff there trying to get from you on the phone and the fine print on the commercial even says you know the first three minutes are free This is for entertainment, use only as we found out. No one was

We are calling for entertainer purposes. They were calling because had financial problems. They had romantic problems. There career problems to be were just lonely, lonely people- I guess the closest thing. The entertainment, a lonely person could get. People need a connection the outer even of its border, like loneliness, raise like our level of vulnerability this differently. My board re examined to entertain yeah yeah, and you know what the internet kind of like in its nascent stages in that point, as far as like how we are connected to each other, it was only chat rooms back that AOL, Instant messenger baby. That's it better than the ito did even have the idea of an in cell yet cause you goods call one nine hundred number and connect with sub idea. So when you call this line, you would, if you got an actual psychic which they would and I use that and with big quotes. They would just have a script that they would follow,

and they would try to keep you on for at least twenty minutes. In fact, the psychics themselves again bigger quotes on the psychic thing they actually were, instructed stay keep these people on the line for as long as possible, notably different than like a wolf, a Wall Street right telling people people on the line, Yegg getting their confidence getting their information yet exactly, and so, if you keep someone on the line, in fact the psychics, if they felt low an average of fifteen minutes per call they can have their pay docked. Fewer calls would be in to them all of these things would start happening They were actually in a place where they were. being subject to some? Some tough stuff is well. They were actually really worry that they could be losing their jobs or imagined that you're just try, make some extra cash like. Oh, I can be a fake psychic. This is not a big deal for me. I can handle this. But then, all of a sudden, all this other stuff starts happening right now,

Any shady organisation needs on top of it being run as a complete. Fraud is also sweatshop like pressure on the employees exactly so it's not just the people that are real beings of a calls that are being defrauded like the actual workers themselves and so get there not only were they taking your mail information all that stuff, but their stories, and you direct mailers after that added stuff that says urgent, Miss Cleo has urgent news for you. You must call in right now. So when you call you start thinking, oh my god, I gotta call right now, and you call Up- is one nine hundred number and they're just like all right. Let's ask: how are you feeling today and I HU, we gotta draw you out in the car and sometimes they would even refuse to stop the review. I came out, let speeded up they black. Now you have to wait for the spirits the combat,

I feel, is getting another fifteen minutes for the spirits to really get go in here. Yes, so it it's just really really unbelievable and so the psychics themselves are trying to keep you want for at least twelve minutes. Fifty minutes twenty minutes, but if you got if they held you on the phone sixty minutes they dropped the call immediately four ninety nine a minute. That's nearly three hundred dollars, for an hour call now and so that between the year Ninety ninety seven in two thousand to miss Leon. The psychic readers network made over a billion dollars, one billion dollars eating someone's address back to them. Slowly so when they were on the call, so you can imagine like you're on the car like a man. What am I going to do if they put me on hold at pretty either you're, getting charged again worried you get back on the phone, the second, ok, don't worry, we're gonna credit, you back the tea, but if you hang up you'll be charged for the time so just outright lice near and it's just.

crazy! They they told these cars that all the free minutes war expired. All will give. You will give you some more forty minutes. You just gotta, hang on and obviously not That was true. They weren't even try to be snaky. So if you also, after all this, you get your bill and its through the. Company Att is the carrier for this. So you get your bill and you see it's like ridiculous how'd. He dispute the charge you gotta call the one nine hundred number back. Would this brilliant scale is just ok, you got one nine hundred number bags, like all gay or you gonna, hold on a second tonight you're getting build to dispute your billing. Dubai So by his who now people are sitting there and there just wondering. Ok, what am I an and they call eighty and tea now and eighty

Tea would be like all right. I will give you a credit for your account, but then, once the psychic readers network Fit, that out they would actually go back and send you collection notices. They would go after you directly and this is where it gets super insidious. All these people with financial problems with romantic problems of career problems with just vulnerability. Issues in general start getting notices that their that their bill is being sent to collections after they are, been created by their own telephone company, so this is third so so disgusting and they threatened your credit. Unlike man, you friend someone's credit men, you might ask threatening their life. That's the key man, if you have access to death and this economy, you're gonna die Woodcock. That's the weird thing about capitalism. It's like they want you to

all this money. They want you to fish, efficiently, use resources and they want you to just be in debt. There's nothing more gonna be an in depth. Keep you are into the system. Baby. That's wildly for cash. Then all transactions by my house, brief case for the cash. So every time, I would call in there. just shelling out cash, all the time and apparel Miss Cleo says she was supporting these other psychics there were training. She was training new psychic. She was just doing what she thought was right here. The Yoda of Psychics, she ran a Jedi academy. You know she distributed her powers evenly. What does it really? Is that as a psychic only need particular sort of you could be trained like it's like you, gotta HR that yet a packet they show you some videos and stuff like that is now it's not a power in their admission, I, yet why is this? I like a weird muscle, you gotta exercise. Now you, as you can see, we are, we gonna, say

training session, I kind of believing psychics. I believe that there are people in the world that are able to communicate with different energy. That is out there. I know it It may sound. We are, but I actually can't deny that it happens. I think the number of people that claim to be able to do it is probably like point: zero: zero, zero, zero, zero, zero, zero one per cent of the actual people can actually do it. You don't know what you think if you're actually exists the psychic success now now now? Why not? You don't think we can a touch into tap into a different plane because If somebody add that power and had their power for real, there will be a god they would be a got. There would be a guy among the kingdom of God, but what's the hook? What's it like? I do a guy before, but I mean I think it's one of those things coming leaving in God in a way words like. I can't I don't know if I I don't know, if he's up there, but I know that I dont know that here

not up, there will remain like either there's a higher power of some kind. You don't I've done I'll Oscar. I found that there was a and there was an energy in the room and was the closest thing door. Religious experience I've ever had, and I could feel that energy- and I just got me thinking at the very least there's gonna be someone out there, those just tapped into their don't you like an otter grandmother. Just like feels things differently. Now, but I do have a on whose a fraudster book out of fraudsters always lag. Let me pick this up and let me do this for you in there is always a way to facilitate, backed up with us I don't want anything hostility, steal anything is still silverware. There was a comical drop this thing off to help you out real quick help me out. Do you bring it up at Thanksgiving ever where we had the Sab letter around stuff

so that is governed mizzen way, but that's like a really good point that it there is this impulsive or continuous nature to allow fraudsters day out only once they do it. It's like you bringing you can't stop, half a logical and that's one of the great things about to show what we do. The profiles are. These people right is getting a sense of ok. How did they get involved in this? How did they get into deep and then how can they a lot of times not stop even once they ve been caught? That's that's my back to me as, like my favorite part right, where it's like, even after the exposure, they can't stop hustling exactly that that idea. That no matter what s, the or of classic republican technique, never say sorry. Wages is like dedicate your life to being right, and in this sense, when you're a fraudster, it's your absence. right, you're gonna, see, then the fire festival we see that they are not seriously that Bernie made off with it. So you know it's crazy. To me, too, is that when the one Federal Trade Commission finally came in and made a rule against. They fought a criminal complaint. They find them far

million dollars and of that billion dollars that they had coming in. They said five hundred million of that you're not allowed to collect because law, those that money that they said was theirs was just notices for collection that they had sent out to everybody, so we have to see just came in and said: ok, you, you can't take half of that. That's like going to a bank robbing them of all this money and in the bag. Coming back and saying: hey you just I have of it all right. You could take them have you ve already defrauded people, you can give us ten more dollars back, there's a pretty sweet deal and I think that that's pie gonna, be an emerging theme that we see as doing this package of every episode. Right is like this degree of almost, like course, of government complicity in allowing these schemes to be profitable and after their worth the risk, because if you prosecute them too, and then you almost are like diving into this part. capitalism, that is understood to be fraudulent and that

we are agreed. That is, as this is, like the buyer. Beware type of thing: that's like it's, your freedom to be defrauded That is what it means to be american, navigating because then we have to take on all the other commercials that are selling stuff, that both flex yet reverse mortgages. Yeah I come on, we shall blouse. You meet well, well, sham. Well, that's you cross the line, a hacker, but that's the grit, the crazy thing people lost thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars and yeah. Maybe maybe it's on them. You know, but the freedom speech means we have the freedom to be manipulated and all these people got manipulative and there is also something that he said for and intentionally deceptive and confusing business practices should be illegal and justice. And that's exactly what the Federal Trade Commission came at them with one part, was this billing practice of like harassing people through direct mailers? One part was this wine wanted?

the number one nine hundred number Baden Switch, and that was the other huge thing you can't do the small print thing safe. Thinks free and an immediately charged them forward. Hathaway garments, like I don't know you could do that. That's not that's not gonna be right. She eventually came an actor. That was how She could have got into her whole character work and she was a playwright. I use quotation, marks a playwright, but cheat she tried to be this person that she was it. When I mean I know, actors constantly trying to embody a different person near and then there method. Acting there's eat out the Stanislav scheme method, or the miser techniques. If you will hear at Anders you be a fake, psychic ethnic origin, or the California, and then she moved to Seattle, where she ended up becoming a playwright and writing some place about women's empowerment, which is how she got.

a grant from a nonprofit advisory council. The Langston Hughes, nonprofit advisory council- and I think it's amazing about that is that links to use is one of the great Poets, amazing average American about that spoke to like the crimes at atrocities and the love and I hate in all these different subject matters that really brought this entire country up and yet they gave money to someone and they were defrauded buyer it's always like that that state, because eventually, there's no shame right. It's like links and uses the legacy all of our steel from that is shaking his head in his grave right now, but you know ray she wrote these plays, and then she started making agreements with the performers and they made put agreements to with all of them at south. She took this money and there quotes it's amazing that that she basically told everyone that she was going to pay them

did this play. They produce the play, and so it's amazing actors will still work for no money. Get your mother like ninety. Nine people were dream stable with exactly this is to bring our show mentality well, yeah, well, that this is the brain or show mentality, and she said after the production was over, she individually told people hey, I'm gonna. Get you this but I'm battling bone cancer right now, ouch as terrible using bone cancer. It's like I how bad it is. It's moving into a positive african american space in Seattle, a place where there is not a lot of that I'll come on. There's a tunnel black people in Sierra out, millions, hotbed of african american culture. There here, Sir Mix alive, the most famous waggeries, yellow like they delegate to the UK The community has tried to do a positive thing and I like safe space, you D, for

that under the name of links in use- and then you use bone cancer, it's like that tripling down on being a bad person re worse, camp when you need them to Dunkel on Africa? Where are you sure cap well Duncan point at our ethics heck itself? she always toy was only like a few thousand bucks relate four thousand dollars that she defrauded people out of that she's didn't pay people from, and what amazing is that the euro? The nonprofit was like, shall we go after them, but it's a nonprofit. They would have to get a private investigator. They advocate a lawyer. They have to go to court cases. They are out of me for she would show up to court all that already even before even go to court. already more than the money she stole there absolutely and that's the first taste that a fraudster gets and once they don't pursue it right, if I'm ok, the car. I got away with it right here if, if there were twenty hours on the street. You pick it up, yeah yeah sure I do too right, but

there can be a homeless person around I is worthwhile first, it is looking the other way. Maybe maybe they, are almost oars and sees me pick up money off the ground. I've gotta give it yeah united. We if we make eye contact their knowledge it as low eye contact. As I get you a sandwich this. This is evident, but I guess idea that I'm trying to make here. The point here is people get my all the time and then they have to distribute to other people to build something and that's what the entertainment business is run off. I make videos or small digital shorts or anything like that. People give you a bunch of money possible for that. That first moment, when you get that money, it's gotta be like, I could just run away. I gotta do whatever the fuck. I want what do you think it is about us? You and me, specifically right now in this moment that say, no were going to be honest. People rugged actually were actually pay these people,

while number urge its caring about humanity is part of it, yak basic humanity, and then it's also under like having some idea of sustainability yak. If I do this, I'm finished in this but somebody like this, like all, do this in a move on to the next hustle anything for me to its also, it's also the psychic pressure of of feeling. Shame down the wrong thing: they're right that the clause we have to bear like when I think about the Bernie made off so the word or any of these fraudsters that duties long for on these schemes or even even Miss Quail who went through it. Did this character. For decades there refer back decades Day care to OZ, Donald Trump, the fact that he's been in this character of a complete fraud for so long is amazing. To me, I can not pause. I can barely keep something to myself for a day well, if I do it for a decade that to me is so unbelievable I understand of terrorism, I undressed

and terrorism. You got indoctrinated when you're a key, some screw went lose you got brainwashed, blah blah you're insane person when I go kill yourself and everyone around you, I get it. You you bought into sort of weird narrative about that, but if you're a fraudster, you know exactly what you're doing is wrong there. Absolutely I mean, do you think she's a sociopath or just a psychopath sociopath? I would prior now done clicked abundant that level of shame, none other than clicks. There. No emotion, no motion, stone cold. Look. You right in your face and must say I am dying about cancer as you defrauded african american charity, African American Theatre, drew area is global. As an african American. He exact take your family America, it's so frustrating to see that have with a vague jamaican accent. Nonetheless, garages due to steal from Roma man,

you're, not immediately just never lay sociopath yeah I'd sucks, hacked hits close to Humphrey, yes deal from your mom scene. It that's crazy, take the danger is out, Take the dishes. Gallo Pisa go around Shelly some health care for gold they're, just like that. Like gas people care stopped, and even even your conversations that work, India, you know it's ok, without a how you doing you wait, let me get you some choose something. Things like tat nap. You thickly subjected work me so wrong there stop that Israel is a real and I think what what she did was just a classic thing that happens to so many people were They have the opportunity right, it's an environmental think we don't know necessarily. Maybe she was broke at the time. Maybe she really needed that money to do something else that you wanted to do so what're. There are like environmental factors that could feed into that. But again most people would just say yeah

there's environmental, fair. I could use this money for myself cause I'm broke or whatever, but the same time. I can't do that because here I'm not gonna be a pc, so after Seattle, she goes to Florida, a hotbed of fraudsters, and she joins the psychic readers network. as a psychic under the name, Miss Clia and Cleo was actually a name from the play that she did in Seattle. So there's like this great character. Baxter she's already written the character description. Yeah I mean this is one of her greatest works right now. This is from her production of waiting to exhale managing Seattle. Soothe Her head Trickly, it's amazing to me that she was able to do all of this, and should we go we gotta office job rightly we both have have jobs go to and we have bosses everyone's gonna boss of some kind. Wouldn't you love your boss, accountancy, hey you're, doing such a great

I've just you know, I mean we're gonna promote you too, like exposition right. She went to the site redesigned they looked at this fucking character. This fake jamaican accent we're like yes monsieur your it. You are the answer. This is. The wine that jamaican exit is so authentic and detection. let down the veil to them now. I think she came in totally method totally method. That's what I'm thinkin! That's! Why thinks you might be a psychopath? They feared that if Europe, if you're rain. Circuitry is that, but that you're, just that's where you're gonna be from now on, she came in robber, Downy Junior from Tropic Thunder guys in character. Did you did you like that? I'd I loved it. I loved as well as money is one of the funny things. Every grave is amazing

It is either and I think the presidency, like ever doubted, Junior, never stopped being that character it I d, I ve, never stopped that's disobey. So what she joined, the secondary, network and here's where this whole Miss Cleo Persona gets crew. It and what I love about this as a lawyer- is that this character is a character just like a care. A movie or like a comic book character like iron man or something is owned by Marvel. Miss Clio was a character built with in the psychic readers network, with the help of these guys, their cousins, Peter Stoats, and Steve Federer, and these two guys very tough to find any information on the, but Peter stalls has linked in page, and he said that he was president of the psychic readers that work back in the early arts, and now he does website design. I like it, has a psycho imagine this guy had a job in a view if, like what are your qualify

actions for the position. Why actually ran a billion dollars a year telephone scam, human briskly? Oh yeah, I was grey you're willing to pay five hundred million in trying to regulate our that had. oh it's just my. It was just like a balance sheet change here, I'll get to that in a second, but I'm itchy. She was at this place. She develops this character. They basically and they promote her too. Now being the face of the psychic readers network and the parent company access resource services has done a lot of these different psychic lines for they had other shell companies that were also psychic driven dad other ethnic psychic didn't work as well as the Jamaica, Miss Clia, welcome, ever Barn Door, Raj D, ha ha rod, recycled network, the the organ american psychic network didn't work river. Well, is it I met you got you got what today s name

Well, what were you was born a man. I know I don't know me do you know you dog? Oh really, she cheated. You yeah. I think she is. There are four main go. I argued me to their dad: is the zoo network. Oh my god you're. You really help me out here on a bluff August. I underline that we are now in Denmark as well yeah yeah. I exaggerate these. They they had all these terrible sagging members, but the Russians not merely what schools may a place on the wine. I like the idea. Russia, psychic, you Roger you you'll, see. Psychic psychic see you led the guy.

three cook you'll see outside your window. You'll see me with gun, pointed that's your fears not move. I am telling you your future you'll need the ads that stay online, so yeah go out of the lot of failed characters, but they found the one with Miss Clia. They found they founder and is what I find interesting about. Them is clear right as someone who still does did the character to her death rate and the way that she's treated even after the lawsuit after everything's revealed the way she stayed in character and away. People responded positively to that characterise our paths. If you go online and things like that right, she's always seen as like this pop culture icon. You know I I want to talk about this interview. She did with this woman, Gabby Benzel Love, Gabby, Bundle, Gabby

The gap is just some fan of psychics in general, a Youtube shell. Somehow she was got connected with Miss clear, but this point she is now not Clio. She is the seer s e hyping e r, the sea or by the way, good to actually know the number of aliases that miss Clare I had to use in her life. She was born. You re Del Harris ship. Clia than she was the seer formerly known as Ms Cleo Re Paris, Ray Cleo, Milly Harris Europe Clearly all Del Harris, you re Paris, Clear, Milly Hairs, Cleo Harris and Camelot Harris So very, if you have more aliases than the Wooten Clam yeah that you're, a good sign you might be a fraud is a good site. Yes, she was doing this interview with Gabby Bundle- and this is actually early and twenty sixteen you to this interview- shit

passing away in July of that year of cancer. Ironically enough is what she used as an excuse to defraud the people from the links to huge project of dying of the very same thing out of that's karmic. But if you're psychic. Maybe I don't know you see they're coming who? Oh oh, it's like come on now come on up, so she did this kind of like very legs. At a forty five minute interview, barium Deaf, what I like about it is, if you notice, if you watch the entire interviewers gonna, do clips by its forty five minutes, it is actually still a commercial. This is sure the year after that, court ruling? After all, these things have dissolve if you change your name after all, these things she's, still hustling all this stuff, and it is important to note that she can't go by Miss Clia. because the psychic readers network owns the intellectual property of that name, and that is

something to think about. She saw everything she got money for everything that she did this Clio character, was from one or for plays a character in it was named Clio and she took that and made into a character and just like, iron man, is owned by Marvel. The psychic readers network owns the character, Miss Clio scenario she had to go by the seer, which was very strange and She still was just Hocking items, and, if you're a real psychic guinea to sell that much merge, you don't need a cell. Allow merchant allow us not even psychic related merge again. It's like finding other, only epic, their lessons organisers of this right things market it does towards vulnerable population yeah. It's just if any one that needs help. It feels vulnerable that feels lonely that feels isolated. That needs help but doesn't understand the way, expertise, work, steer or just you know, work so just as she wrote this,

works Europe, many books. We have won the books here in the studio. Where is it? You have it over there giver of yes, keeping it real a practical guide for spiritual living by Miss Cleo, let's rate, have a little saved from areas where wages would like here, one little bit of their staff, maybe go the one. I marked that's even exe, go in there. So there such gold all over the place with this, that I think it's just remember now. She saw this book on as on, and I think it's it's like a lot of vice into your point earlier, you said it is like how they get used to just make a generic for that. Your brain fills in the rest of the way. It's ok, I mean marital vice, and it's like what the danger member about a relationship. Is that it's about compromise, who that's a real good point, But-

in that compromises should also make sure you, Sir, your own identity. That's a good counterpoint so dear to your point exactly right! Thank you for setting this up. So here's a quick example of this is again from keeping real a practical guide for spiritual living by Miss clear. This is obviously put out by radar. Communications looks like it's another offshoot of access resource services. She says, he's an example: a young lady, since your boyfriend says I want to get out of the house, the boyfriend doesn't respond. She continues. Let's go get something to eat. Does it matter where I just want to get out of the house, so the boyfriend take her to the park for a couple of corn dogs and a view of the sunset the girlfriend gets mad and calls him cheap. Why? Because she wanted to go out to dinner at a specific restaurant and the evening is ruined option honey. I would really like to go out to dinner. I love the crap cates at the peer crap, cakes EP appear: let's go there

the young lady has clearly communicated what she wants its just like. This is really good advice. It turns out when you need a specific restaurant should indicate that, when asking gas or also be taken to the park for corn dogs, is this really what happened is worthy? How far we fallen as as a society. Is a species I'm glad the does someone wrote a book there. Let me know that if I want to specific guidance from a specific restaurant, I should indicate that, but then veto Gabby, big e, you tell her. Heading journalists that she is for. Psychics asked her about politics and she actually we now this was again early and twenty. Sixteen this way, we didn't really have dropped coming up, yet she really was should commenting on the previous elections that have happened were Obama still in office and she was asking about the primaries and whose she basely Rina wanted to win in that

no sorry, race, for that reason that it was in the right place JANET words or do not turn out to be a way sorry to stop right there. Oh my god! Oh my god! Oh my god! Oh my god! Oh my god! Oh my god, are you kidding me? What happened? Did John Edwards as being a disappointment? Didion there being a fraud or something like what is he lying was lying to Amerika was giving a feeling of security and safety to everyone will actually doing the complete opposite and

complete monster. The whole time did his wife had cancer was cheating on areas. Also, stealing campaign finds Dealey campaign. Fancy higher this document. Terry. To do all these videos, Verde was Beggar the whole time to get a kid. What there may be our evening remember all the stories, whereas I like about it too, is that the psychic didn't see any about coming She saw those candidates like Azeri of em she's, like I went with the worst widened, because how strong my psychic powers are. It is like the quaint to set like em Republicans they have nazis. Democrat we have. The lying is liars, like John Adverts that Is the sin of the Democratic Party that they will just go hand you and the lizard tongue comes out- enables dwell and dine you and then all of a sudden like where the bodies bear the catalyst, the kind of the limousine liberal Guy Ladys, like John Embers member, his anti poverty was his scammer yeah. We just like this really great worthy issue that get that basically fell by the wayside and tell basically Bernie Sanders came along yeah, but

but you guys like he's doing. Nobody is also I kind of like stealing and violating the public trust in all these ways. You now again, I think you know I just realized. We're gonna have to do John Edward. Yeah. That's right, Patsy to John Edwards. There's gonna be a campaign episode John Edwards and Miss Clia, one of the best heads a hair in the business. He did have great here, though, what a great how to hear our man. He was like if you were like invent a politician in a movie. It would have been John Edward out now. raised ethics has a d like a serial killer, spin off of John Edwards, murdering a bunch of people but also running for office, but that she ended up talking about her path, you know she did come out as lesbian. She did or participate in pride as well, and I think that must have been tough, because does claim to have caribbean roots. She INA. We did find out that she was raised catholic and caribbean family, tough to say which caribbean cunt.

it was. I am guessing is not Jamaica, whereby our Bio would indicate Jamaica, four as part of our gimmick, but just to claim care biogas. I got this x in true rule by answers like it's another graveyards yeah, I river is from Barbados. I remember I took a trip to do. make with my wife- and I be in there, and we are at this resort and weird at the bar tender. There's Jamaica did obvious, sing in all these american songs. He was doing Leonard Scanner heard and Bob Dylan and John Denver, and all these things it is. I grew requests and I were Jimmy Cliff any just put his hand. It does not matter so it's like even

make in. Has that much respect for their own culture in their own country, where they're, just like now MA am accurate. Just like perform our countries greatest artists for you, fuckin tourists, I don't care who you are and in here is Miss Cleo. Just lowering the idea of jamaican culture and identity through their acts and which is so specific and just come out of. I get commodities again going in and out of it let us or like about it. Yet you can tell she's from Inglewood during several. If you listen closely can see, she does loses our accents fur, like sometimes the sick. nip again portions of the interview. But she just as I am I to it, are like it's like it's like. If you have for Chicago ranks, records and you were trying to then go be Jamaica. That's what she's doing Mr Love of Man Java, This is a gross clip of her actually talking about about those routes is, is it is a good one?

when I made that decision is ultimately meant that many of my family, that were more conservative Jamaicans were more than likely going to cut me off and so there was probably only a surprise with one or two that did not cut me off, but the balance I'd, nieces and nephews I haven't seen says. Well, I know that this day and age. Just me in writing very earlier for the most part of the current directive. religious vibration solely struggles in many parts of the world. We just accept any backing saw. That being said it, but you have to leave your own drew near, you know. Otherwise you die somebody now I run

is that you have to live your truth. Are you die someone else's lie and also like yeah? Maybe your family would stop going to talk to you after you conducted war, the nations largest frauds against America site, even that is that we go the eyes like the average is over those budget that should re over them. Five hundred already started the family level, someone who does these scams and does it to the dead the length cities of Europe also interesting right like when you compare the coming out and things like that sources interesting to because then it router and a community? That's looking for acceptance again again, it's in a way that she starts off in the black community. Then she started becomes a West indian when it sort of convenience Dan. She becomes like a lesbian me. I don't know whether the truth

duality wise, but I'm just saying there's a little bit of a pattern. Therefore, people black people are now going to turn away other positive black people which made her. I bet you, I bet you, she was afro centric pro african american black power. That theatre in Seattle is also that Seattle is also interesting as it's a small black community, exactly what you defrauded the lengths and huge cultural ART centre in Seattle Entity is descent about this, is that when you This much even the stuff I'll, be your own vulnerability when your own truth comes out its tougher we believe there are forty one, Take you seriously yeah. so here we are judging this person right now, because she's just lied about nine. What This is the one thing she was actually being honest and truthful about, but yet it doesn't fuck America she'd like that much It's like the sopranos. When Tony asked pussy on the boat deceive and fuckin exist. So then you know that it's just

it's just so frustrating when you use these kind of system. Systematic kind of vulnerabilities of people and am prey on them and then try to seldom your march and ambitious all the things that she goes back to again and again in this interview. She goes back to selling these thinks. She's got App now she's counts for these, like all of these things that she wants to sell People- let's, let's just go to that real quick sheet detox about that here. savages, very high. Thank you you're, all my goodness, yes or God that is so high tech. It's almost so high tech right over my head. yeah see ass or This year those people Some people can connect with you through the EP new

that's just the exact same scam. She did for the hotline that she told everyone here. She is probably with a cancer die, as is already right. She knew That she has cancer, I'm guessing because it she died not too long after this, but she is here doing the exact same thing in just a different media. There are the same thing: it's like you going this abba, then somebody's randomly writing to you some random person. In the same way, when you were calling to talk to Miss Cleo, you Talkin, Steve docketed somewhat. Unlike what about this point with how the internet works and how an app could work, you could be just type in LE someone, Anybody know way to verify sisler. It's like a legacy.

Clear is just like forgotten that she has an app almost and she's, like oh yeah, that debt, so I take its even over my I know, oh by the way, I totally respond to every message. Every business get everybody. I have no idea what an app is, but I also respond to every message on a book I suck Eric up for they'll. Probably just about seven months ago, I was not available, are accessible for people to actually reach out tat. Everything was private use and I still do amazing international base, which are absolutely about them I will be happy to make myself available tomorrow, be once again, people aren't really sure where- and there are some eighty alone- in that to be versions of me areas is very in people's lives was an irreversible was

oh come on you guys, they went invisible. Kinda thing right via its were, were making we're Cincinnati. Ok get really. He asked in those days and directly to the serious challenges of everything, tat seers. Why we hadn t sir, we have a few months. We have twenty six. third there and get the calendar. here may well be asked to leave us hurry. it is everywhere in the calendar is Wisconsin elected by me was taken by me, and so that was really a labor of love. You have got to be kidding me mugs on my calendar that she picked the food. They were curated divide me and

if taken by me, it's just just go fuck yourself Look like screen savers, age again, supplying tell us supplying jamaican toasters, it's just disgusting. What would she did hear edit? This Gabby bundle person what The hell is wrong with you. I love you. I love you. I love it just like it's great idea very nice he's yeah she's, just like the perfect mark, their rights, and how about the you two comments on this video phenomenal. just all people saying this is amazing- were so sad she passed away, though, is she was such a shoe, the truth, teller and all These other comments get voted, outvoted upward up, thumbs up thumbs up and then the one person like this jamaican acts is a fraud download or didn't as women defraud hundreds of collars out of thousand dollars. So I got right. One buyers, note Noah Boats, for that. No one cares She did all of these kind of like straight,

change commercials and all these different things? We talked about the french toast commercial that she did, but she also did this the Hake with comedy central, which I found to be phenomenal, it was a commercial for a company that had a right from comedy central. Let's just let us do that required here. Johnny Diary there. You know what the writers for that were just a couple of April, comedy of data, lots of fun, so good joys of working with comedy central or so what you re Gazette nothing I there's not a friends are wearing a comedy central, knowing says it's. A joy but If I were to four, so you can imagine

two like probably knew writers, maybe they're, probably the marketing team economy, central they got hired to do some branded content or something and this this cosmetic company comes. It is as we want to do a funny very over the internet with Joey Lawrence and Shinin Dorothy Amiss Clio. Oh my god, ass was that you know wiseguy hey. Will you get some celebrity german car but we have a hundred dollar budget, as that is so, let's listen just a little bit. I cut up a little bit. I just want to hear: have you guys here? Some of the height is like a two and a half minute commercial. I didn't want play the entire thing for you, but are some highlights from high babies. Gets me Miss Cleo, welcome to the benefit, cosmetics, flawless friends network- and I haven't come here today to tell you that you're going to win the lottery, but I did come here to tell you

is Mamma, you are looking good water. It's a nice ants, Hanukkah's you're gonna drive young man, while maybe you don't believe Leal, but I bet you believe TAT. Visions wide, sadly, brains, joy, Lorentz issue, I have to say that I did with I've. Always referred to Joy Lawrence is televisions white, chocolate. I I can't that in my lab Gazeta, IRAN over me now should be allowed. No one should be saying these, they know it to be saying any of this year. I was in a really bad place. I just run out a browser. Nobody was between me and then I called money for for so floors come on now I know: how are you what he thought to be a professional actors requires forty

compliments from our just to keep from crying. He is about to get real up anywhere is clear, knows what you ve been through shunning Dorothy. I love those nor the people in a Hollywood. This town will join you up and spread throughout me. Personally. I prefer out on that I like that, because it has nothing to do with the sketch adjust. Its use. lately gratuitous Doesn't necessarily make and says a woman saying it this whole commercial didn't make any sense. None of it makes any sense is just like a mess. I love this I want to know who ever wrote this. I want to know

if I say, if I ever see them, I swear to God, I will make fun of them to their face only regularly forward my lips to sketch. Does it make any sense it does it work? The jokes are weird super weird. If I were gonna get, I may if, if I would add these three celebrities, that has to be the joke yet like the fact that their not making a joke about this is like the end of the road, they can't be self aware in this sketch. That's how you make it funny. Nobody wants to see the joy Laura Strata be real funny, so benefits cosmetics laid launch. This like file as friends, network again, a psychic readers network tat like a spin off their opens. It opens a new one. Actual hotline even call to get perfect, as they say in the article perfect girl power. Pick me ups in time of need. which is actually which is less risk, as this is supposed to be a parity, but that's actually work Miss Clio was already doing. She was all So this is already telling people that their queens and that their sages and things like that. So it's funny. It's like it

Not even a miss coils scam is so blatant that, parity can't even parity exactly in people buy into they don't even like. Oh, it's so funny you're making fun of how Europe fake psychic even though we all believe that you are a real psych area. How does tat happened? It's dude! It's like it's like Donald Trump doing like the apprentice or something like that. I nevertheless, our views are real he's a real c o, but he's kind like making pharmacy yeah, but the danish Robin and its acknowledged, but actually hired in This is not apparent again, like he actually ended up hiring DNS Rodman to speak to North Korea. This is not parity is Israel. Yet that is a letter really get point this idea of reality. and the alternate reality that some people are able to create around them that other people buy into Europe, and I think that such a powerful force that that we don't

Steve jobs did this. He did this extremely well here, a lot of other big leaders, Elizabeth HOMES talk about her probably later in the season or next she was able to do that. People just by into your bullshit and then, as you said, go for the ride there. What you got em it's hard to not get up here and then I want talk about this taro thing in this or we wrap up this segment here on this interview, but I want to talk this terrorism. She did at the end of the interview which, when you and I not taro experts who I've never really anything. I've only gonna tell ready once or twice, but I was at like some warehouse party and bushwhack. I remember though, but I would look talk to someone. Maybe Henry or one of the boys get, can help us out here to see. If there is any car veracity unjust, her approach to doing because when we are looking at it, it just seemed like she was flipping cards over and saying generic things. That's what it seem like to me yet

like again we're not. Experts were not psychics when I any these things, but No, she is a dealer. And tell you, though, is that I want to start worrying about money. I start wherever possible to stop thinking. This is no reason to arrive. We have some really positive things up in this year reasons: Eads addressing planted twice or temporary, specifically overstepped. or a right, so I could say that you planted seeds two years ago and they're going to come to fruition now, and I want you to stop thinking about money. One hundred percent of human beings could receive that taro reading. Yes and please stop worrying about money, but through another twenty minutes, I read your fortune to tell you the rest some here, let's see five weeks, and that is what this into me suddenly Firefox, or something

you're gonna call me on the other techniques that reading clear. This is why I say yes, I don't use that worry of New York is for you to be a little bit more community with Europe by you need to talk to your feet more talk to make love to those beat connect with your, but I mean just like so I do take better care of yourself. I mean everyone does that everyone could take better care of unease is ago, better gives its account. Are we for this shit! This is ridiculous. Have our people just accept this as like? Oh yes, she speak the truth. Neither so you know I need to better communication with my body. I was just thinking about that, the other there you don't work here. What Ms Clio told me she told me to tee my body. I want to take their advice. Thank you, Miss coil you. Then we can t shirt mug. Yes, she is as part of the cycle and we think of her very fondly as as this person, that was just part was

flash in the pan. No one really got hurt that badly. She didn't kill anybody they're, not alone? Second readers network at the New York Times reports that one market It says that there are nearly ninety five thousand psychic businesses in America, generating two billion dollars, revenue, as recently as twenty eighteen, two billion two billion dollars in revenue. Even today, with all we know, even watching people like it might the tv psychics like Sicilian Brown, oh yeah, we watched her mess up on television yet another people that are doing these kind of like cold readings. Now we're psychics will go and, though, actually come in and the rest, everyone in the audiences Facebook Profile and those who are here, bring him out, but I feel like I've seen em seeing something senior your dog Senor dog Teddy. Oh, my god,

and there is great there's actually- and I think we will probably do this type of this in another episode. But there is a group of people that are gone. And trying to blow up these these readings in and have like these duties. Hot readings where there are feeding in fake information to their facebook profile, buying tickets to the event and trying to blow up the psychic spot, Classic Morey got has or she eventually parted ways with the psychic readers network. But the character miss clear as we talk about the beginning is still own. The second readers network, and so she still was able to profit from it. At the behest of the psychic readers network, and one of the things that will see was this babies, Miss Cleo is back now, silver where's we'd be ideal. I send you have something other than a knife, and a farm

Now I have a vision that you are going to take. That's more than Schoolma about my double registers, cinnamon maple syrup regional strategies back in front of your love. It now french toast crunch. Tell me sweet b of civil. Where knows yes in a civil war, is due dividend folks in spoons knives, oh very, open ajar, what force, not smart, Yes, Miss Clio. Yes, do u yours the flocks noses spoons to eat food, doing going. I can answer that. Yes, yes, we do, my god. How did you know? Do you eat breakfast? Yes, something but yeah yeah. Do you live folk s born to eat the bread

yeah generally, I would say yeah like zeros part of your breakfast yap. Sometimes you actually going to do this in this area. Where you know, I don't know you read that by guy. I think so I mean it's. You are getting ready to use the spoon, oh my god I've got to spend my hand right now to dip into this area with the milk in things and then put it just cause. We know exactly. How do you do. John, you ve gone a mere worded. It diminishes the bill. Gospel sat by doing ever jail. It's probably do you turn to contribute to the community, so Miss Clio, undecided readers are profiting from this character. Just like a marble. Comics profits from all

other characters, it's the worst Thor Movie ever by the way, solar and Miss Clio. So I mean the thing. I think that this speaks to like what elements of this stuff that we still see today is this stuff still happens, the loneliness, the looking for the financial advice that that's going to be more desperate as do this portions of the middle class become more marginalize, everybody's gonna be looking for this come up right and his eyes can be somebody take advantage of that was always gonna, be someone there, gonna see an opportunity? Maybe they you'd went through some traumatic thing when they are a kid or maybe they were. You know who grew up in hard. I'm in this is the only way to do it, or maybe they lived a life of crime from the very time they were growing. As a child. is all they know, but there is, no system to even prioritize on a societal level that these crimes are bad. We have drug offences, People are in life in prison for all kinds of different things that have nothing to do with crimes against another person, just possession of

eggs, wars or selling drugs of some kind, and now we got people like that. Big court. relations that are defrauding people or people like Miss Clio that can actually hold together or fraud for more bolted for decades and be complete, with another and another company and keep doing this, and still it's just ok. You hear that guy's put down the crack, didn't cubicle It's over. This is my new plan to lower a crime or go make everyone a white collar criminal. So I think that's lit, let's wrap it up with very clear for today. I think this is great. She was not a good person. If yeah there's. Nobody ever speak of a dead with someone never shows remorse, not in time I mean in the chief and defended the psychic than that Hotline movie. She was then she went by Milly Clio in that in that and she stopped

to make an accent. She's at those people are not the bad guys, even if they work great psychics, even referring to the psychic readers network, as a group of psychics isn't a Hare Lee in bad faith in fraudulent. Absolutely it's the that was the problem with the whole scam operation. It is the fact that they didn't have the powers that I have. Second, weren't as good as they weren't is often EC and totally real. As Ms Cleo I'll kick out their therefrom. looks like a game was not her level. There are, I feel bad for that she was upset about. It feels Beth. She feels remorse for those people the problems they would just not dissolve clinically jamaican theirs. If only they knew they had the light you gotta have the light. If you want to read her red cards, so I get up we're gonna talk a lot more about these different kinds of fraud. Miss Cleo, you re Del Harris rest in peace with great Is that having just Jamaica like what was the problem of the accident?

everyone in the afterlife is very upset with your Jamaica, Naxa, shooting going to any sort of part what you do. It's like not even my cool running level, of what he can. German The worst. It's like my impression of her is a horrible, but that's like that's how bad it is like a bad impression of her is still is good at her sent you either gives them as she's like a shitty jamaican fortune cookies, while the rhapsode up for our pilot episode in part, one of three of Miss Clio and the psychic readers network mandate it we could have wet fur. Ten episodes there's so much here, but there are too many fraudsters that we got a cover and this season, I'm so excited because you're gonna start to see connections between these fraudsters over decades of time, and so I'd like to thank the last podcast network, Guys Henry Marcus can marry all of team over there, it's great to be in the Pham. I wanna thank Marie Anderson, a creative collaborate.

An editor that I could not do. This show without her Emily Food scar, amazing researcher, Hazel, Brian or all star producer and, of course, my wife Cosmo, who has put up with me for far too long to make this show happen. Fraudsters is a co production of the last pike. that work and zero cool media will see a next time.