In this second installment, Steven has three more conversations debating Affirmative Action, including a UT Professor of Hip Hop.
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Yeah. I think the best do and should be the one who gets into school. I agree so again we going right at the beginning of this thing. I said it's not races and now I'm clean. Maybe you could be here is a lady, instalment of change. My mind where we rationalize our positions on controversial topics in our last instalment I sat down with Tina, discuss affirmative action. You can see that by clicking video here and in this episode we continue in that vein, with three more conversations, including one with a unity and Princeton professor of hip. Hop remember to let me know what you think about affirmative action in the comments Bluff and, more importantly, what are your thoughts on these conversation the transpired? You all right enough talk, let's get to our first conversation meet them, then. Is it yes, Stephen nice to meet you VE, handyman, shooting and a little bit, so I can now separate my shoulder region, so I don't know how familiar you are if it all with what we do here with this programme.
Especially taking providing. opportunity to rationalize our positions on similar controversial topics today is affirmative action. This is by request here at duty. I believe affirmative action is, by definition racist, not a fan. disagree with me, you're more than welcome the chain from my well. I think we in a perfect world, I dont think you should exist, but we don't live in a purpose world. You know we have marginalize these communities. We need help to bring them up, bring him up to the middle class so that they can help out the other members of their community bring them up, and so that we can eliminate this kind of poverty, inequality that usually ties of So I think affirmative action is a great way of helping get ready. Ok, so you say it's a great way, so it sounds to me like you said. You believe that it's the right thing to do and you believe it's an effective way Why do you believe it has been effective? I mean, I think those communities, those
choice, committees are moving up through the classes and is there getting these college education that they can get because of affirmative action, so you believe that when you say marginalized communities hope I want to be clear to you mean asian Americans. Do you mean simply black Americans, because there are obviously marginalized communities who are very anti affirmative action. Yes, I mean, like all minority, ok, so How do you believe that affirmative action, for example, is effective in helping asian american students, because Many of them would disagree with his lawsuit against harboured because of the unfair standards. why to them. They are not applied equally to block applicants. Well, I think you know not. All of them feel that way mean there are some We only have to think that its fair, for example in the documents were revealed from Harvard and on average in Asia,
I can student was required to get a thirteen if the USA tease versus the black student, who was required to get an eleven hundred. Now I dont think it's fair, but again I think it's not about being fair. It's about bringing these committees, because I mean- african american community has been marginalized more than the asian American community. I would say so it should be based on how much marginalization, yeah How do we first up before we get how effective affirmative action I guess how do we rate? That does not mean a Euro Asian Americans were more recently putting in internment camps and we had the asian immigration Menachem using nothing like slavery, ok like but is far more recent recent by Every has lot had a lot more of a lasting effect. I mean ok in terminal you know their awful the community bounced back from that of me, more people when more people came out of interment camps, then went in. So it's not.
But slavery. I mean that is just scarring for an entire race. generationally like even three four five, only generations removed as opposed to internment camps. Yes, Let me ask you: do you think it's right that, for example, and asian american Fee, EL student would have the score higher and the essay tease to be admitted in comparison to a white male student, I dont think its rights. But again I just think that's what's gonna happen because we live in, well ok, so you think it's ok that female Asia. American students have to do better than not only black students but have to perform better than white Americans, and there are no words asian students actually are unfair. we treated in comparison to White Americans you have to argue. I suppose that Asian Americans have been less marginalized than white meals. I haven't seen any numbers that prove that,
I mean, if you just look at the numbers, for example at Harvard, and I can show them to you afterwards. The average scores were required to be admitted. Entire education, Ivy League schools with Asian Americans was thirteen. Fifty with white actions was thirteen ten with black Americans, it was eleven hundred, so an asian american female students were on average, be required to have a high, as eighteen, scorn, higher performative metrics academically, then a white male, These are the consequences of affirmative action. Again I haven't seen those ok, but let's assume that I'm not lying. Where would you up on that score, how it goes ok, so forget about the Asian American, the asian females? They can fend for themselves, so we'll get to black Americans. So you that affirmative action is a good thing. It's morally imperative. I understand that I disagree, but you believe it has been effective. Ike, Americans and you said, because now we see them having more.
Less economic disparity. You. My correct I'd like to hear you kind of express your position volubly affirmative action is we're on. Well, I think it helps them get the education that they need to do. Well, you know this economy, I mean because you gotta have like a masterpiece immediately, basically a minimum wage job nowadays. So I think it helps. Having that, especially when a lot of these schools, you know I mean you, Itself has been like you know, targeting against african american students, and we have a monument Robert E Lee back over there, not especially something really welcoming so, I have they been targeting. African Americans are not familiar with that. While there is the whole article actually published about how they used test scores to target african american students. How so I am not entirely familiar.
while not familiar either side being sure to hear that you that that sounding it should be a national scandal if a university, specifically targeting Black America was in the sixties after they were forced, ok in a sixty someone not not currently, ok good will mention that you bring that up. There are fewer, because he brought up the idea. That african Americans seemingly having and better economic metrics I don't have any data to back them up, but there are We fewer black Americans admitted to universities today than there were thirty five years ago. Is that percentage wise or is that just now as a percentage of the population in total fewer today than thirty five years ago, So it's in that maybe affirmative action hasn't encourage overall enrollment, but we have seen is worse. moment of standards for black Americans on campus. You know these are these unintended consequences? The soft prejudice of low expectations, for example,
lack Americans who get admitted into a law program us he's hybrid laws. Example there four times as likely to fail to bar exam. Even though they gone to I? The school in Generally. I would argue that black and being admitted solely on the basis of race, as you advocated with lower academic Florence metrics and with a bar exam which is blind, there is no racial bias there with a lower academic from metric outcomes, and there are more black Americans who drop out fifty percent, a black Americans on college cameras in higher education. They make up the bottom ten percent respectively, because their mismanaged against peers, who had to be more court, fight to get into the university and that creep. To wrote, a real problem and a higher dropout rate in a lower performance outcomes? For them? Could you see that is maybe an outcome of unintended consequences for affirmative action? That might mean not so effective, I guess
I appreciate that I appreciate you may ass. Well, you know, and I would like to see here's one they wait understand. I would like to see all Americans do better and I certainly would like to see the outlook economic outlook wrath Americans to improve just as much! I want to see it improve for you or white Americans, but I dont that's a predicated on racially excepting people, the college on the basis of race able, thing? It's immoral to re, Cecily, implement college application or acceptance policies be The best indicator that we have are certainly the most determining factor as far as ones economic success. Academic success where they end up in prison has nothing to do with a college degree. Do you notice, not the single greatest socio economic indicator of future well Employment, graduating college is Zeus, experience having undue apparent household.
having a mother and a father who are still together. You know that if you, if you graduate high school, and wait until you married, have kids with a ninety percent chance at u dont enough in poverty over seventy percent. at least middle class or higher. The social mobility in this country is unheard of for both black Americans and White Americans on the problem, and we see this across all races any time you do. A single parent, household and Morocco Bomb Express as well beyond this research papers. Likelihood of ending up in prison is exponentially higher the likelihood of behavioral disorders, the likelihood of not making it through high schools exponentially higher interesting The nineteen sixties, we're single parent households made up less than twenty five percent of all black households between ninety. They make up almost eighty percent holds household its below thirty percent, that actually would explain, Economic disparity, far more than
the idea of affirmative action or its implementation therein, but I'm not sure if that's the only factor, because I feel like there are other factors that cause you know people to separate to have single I agree I agree. Can I get presenting my case as to why that is It would be actually policies very similar to affirmative action, but we palace like the Model Cities Programme under Lyndon Johnson. The modern well the programme what these are implemented in nineteen, sixty that encourage and financially incentivize people to be single parent household That's why you see such a strong family household demographic for black Americans nineteen sixties degree two eighty percent are fatherless householder, single parent household, there's, an echo I can send them what the current welfare system to not be married So I mean like because it coming we can collect if you're married, though you get tax breaks like that, you don't get
that doesn't that doesn't counterbalance the single household benefits that you would give him a welfare programme, the current welfare programme. So I That's what so alarming to me about affirmative action right, because I understand in principle the idea of model cities, the idea, the welfare implementation we understand. There's this is practised so the Voting Rights ACT and cordial civil Rights ACT in the cities as well, I understand that they were to write the wrongs of previous generations, but two way that the way to write the wrong of previous generations, which involves systemic discrimination against blacks. I think we agree now involves. Systemic discrimination against other people are certainly systemic. Targeting of blacks for specific programmes right so they created the model cities programme that created the modern welfare programme which incentivize single parent householders created more economic disparity than we could have imagined and that is very closely mirrored by affirmative action. Its trying to write the historical wrongs of blacks, not making up enough of the campus fabric in the past by implementing racist policy is now
in its having very much the same effects of black students falling behind of cream racial tension and unrest and actually lowering overall performance metrics? so I would argue that so not only immoral, because its racist but results wise just as welfare and the Model Cities Programme have had detrimental effects and trying to write the wrongs of the past. Affirmative action has harmed black Americans, let alone Asian Americans in trying to write the racial discrimination of the past, and that's why I think we need to do away with it. So, just if I may ask Shorty, you think we should do to write the wrongs. and since I don't think you can write belong to the past, I think we can do. Set the best path moving forward towards a future. and we have seen states that have basically been away with firm with action, you know it's interesting. Some minority Roman has gone up. Someone already Roman is gone down. There's really no correlation is actually been relative, relatively evens out Affirmative action hasn't had not much of an overall effect
It does seem, as always, have an overall effect on their being fewer Americans on campus over the last thirty five years. I think we need to do away with it and stop focused viewing everyone through the prism of Lens and drew them to the prison of. intellectual diversity and performative contributions. I think would be fair to Asian Americans. I think, would be fair to black Americans and I think it's the right to do an affair, Thank you so much been a problem. I appreciated and thank him sent down brother from the parliamentary man Pritchett body and is always if you want these videos to continue. Please do consider joining my club louder with credit outcomes. Last month, eleven sixteen and annually for students veterans active military. You get this
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in professor of hip hop rough veto. Sir, are you Stephen, which roughly ruffian rough, I feel ruffian needs to do I like ruffian, because he had a little bit of little bit of spunk a little bit of attitude. He was alone because allow ratio is red. Is it was one of those rare to pursue brain new? None of these people looking good. Ok, will these legally certainly better than she saw the AIDS and shoot food? So unless you are a professor of these new pussy, while indeed set here, you t ok here unionist. Ok, whilst we teach hip improvisational posting a puppet you two years after this to thinking, maybe show me something good, but would you would you I don't know I'm very wide on very well, let it but I'm a good I'm good at some things, but my mom says in advance, or so I gave it to the exact deluge than the government you ride. So professor Raphaelites familiar, you are at all with what we do, so it's basically happening to sit down, hopefully have productive civil dialogue where we rationalize our position on perceived confrontational issues, the ideas to kind of disarm some some blood in issues at people often yell about rather than talk about, and so today this was requested from security as a topic, informative action, specifically as it relates to applications and acceptance college campuses. I believe that a firmer action as a policy is, by definition, racist. I think it's wrong and I dont think that its work. But if you disagree with me you're more than welcome to change my mind, professor will initially I was curious about what this whole thing was racist, having much information them. You do about it this morning, a black professor, you no more experience tat. My first roasting is, by definition of actions
to allocate resources to those under religions have been game discriminated against on that's already, of racism. discrimination against people of any one based on race is racism. It starts with that yesterday evening, the playing field you allowed, those resources are speaking, be distributed, don't get them and I think everybody across the board now gets a fair chance. That's something there is here I don't know that I agree with you in a sense that term, when I say racist, I mean, if I definition I showed this amount doesn't make sure so that you don't think I'm being cute. I don't necessarily mean
racially negative, but very few prejudice and discrimination are right, and so from of action in responding. I agree with you. Everything you just set in responding to systemic racism has now created a policy that has systemically racism and specifically, either includes people based on race or excludes people based on race, notably asian Americans have been disproportionately affected by formative action negatively, I'm sure you're, where the law suits that are happening at Harvard. So I understand we are coming from and I think that it's a virtuous goal to want to correct the wrongs of the past. I dont believe it. The right way to do that is to then implement more systemic discrimination, whether against Asians and White Americans Mexican met black Americans whatever it is.
and I also would argue that it has not been effective in achieving the results at once. So, even if it's a virtuous goal, if we agreed that this idea of sort of to use the term is someone is early or reverse discrimination against other people with preferential treatment for black Americans. If we agree that that is morally correct, it still hasn't had net positive results and in many ways its head net negative results for Black America's. I can agree with that. And you can or can I can? Ok. Very nice is not a very good at a little bit and I have to go back to them. They see one of the new statements. Two wrongs do not make a right right right, but same time? Man there because I what you said: It has not made a major difference. Ragged, it only benefit people, a certain percentage of people which then still leaves a chunk of railways, people out
it's not! It's doesn't it doesn't allow everybody right. That same kind of privilege is also the right would, I want to say, is share you had some one. Is someone brought this up? we have some kind of disability right when the physical disability or mental familiar and again, this will back some when I was black and white embassy you before something I mean. What do you mean raises now? I dont be with all of the things that, of course, is point groups. It's no longer raised its now. What I would call xenophobia
read of something different. You understand, there's more than just that everybody has a preference, something they do not like it. Just so happens to be that the human vision comes in Africa, perceives it rises, and so they are sure of some people, not all people for them. I don't think you're, afraid of me being white a of you being black, I had hoped knows my character rightly says: I'm not afraid of you right.
What I've gone in places that created tend to where I am afraid that the innocent replace ray and not only because of what I look like short, because I'm might percent intimidating you right right anyway. What's interesting, as we just brought up, is actually an argument that people often make for racially segregated schools, because, for example, we see that sex limited scope, like all my schools, from all girls schools they perform much better and the reason for that is because I don't feel uncomfortable either, not necessarily being a minority for a long time. We assumed it was because black people are minority, immigrant, uncomfortable and a lot of white people. But then we find the same thing was true, even if you had a pretty mixed student population and people sort of being an environment where they feel as though they don't have to worry about in sensitivities. Offending people for this sort of xenophobic mindset, as you use addressed, generate more positive outcomes, and all boys are all girls schools, and so you have some racists, you say: well, then we should just have segregated schools completely, and I know that that is not at all. What you're advocating this when I am advocating. It's just interesting that we take something we both agree and say. Fear of any one based on race is bad, racists say because its natural, we need to implement segregation and that's what we ve seen historically, and I think this is in my opinion.
Version of that is what we now know is affirmative action, because it is excluding people based on rates and in, I think, that's wrong with you You know me man is hardly get the whole idea about the definition of race out of my head because it came up in the seventies. Only short so with talking someone who's to say, The political background level differ. Their educational levels different right saw horse on a nonsense is a lot of things. I want to say thank you to all outward Africa. We have time to get into a university proceed is universally this, for instance, Sir, we kind of student in place is you can deliver work
expectations at the university diversity is, it doesn't work when I knew you I'm not going to allow you must move, because you don't have what to be right regardless, as in my short affirmative action, just the opposite. That's are now saying you're, saying you don't have to what it takes to get here, but because your black we're going to admit you, even though an asian kid worked harder and got better score somewhere along the line. Someone said: there's not enough greatest people now again? Go back to this thing I don't think he's racists, but I do agree with you: and what you said earlier when you're not talking about black and white terms about ok. So if you're not smart enough to get into a certain place, then nothing is
Imagine in that way is only going to cause more problems right on a large scale. Not only the people want to get in this news, not not appearance of those people who want to get in this, but when that it's how you got a race for people who are now now have a problem with that and they create this possible. It's not fair ray what it is and so on all I'm not talking about Aramis. I'm saying I saw your same like, for example, white students or asian students are saying way HANS. I can. I got higher and the essay tease into more extracurricular. It's not fair, that I went to a black eye and then make a big fuss. I think the asian kid makes a fuss rightfully because it's tough right now, it's tough to get into account as an asian American. I know what I'm saying if this who says you have to have a certain criteria it in. What's with the problem with that, that's ok,
right. That's that's! What's supposed to be what you start saying that? we now have somebody money pissed off because they are, I assume that you, your leg, you had what it takes. It takes to get in there right right. Some parents are mad now because they believe that you belong This may not so now this affirmative action thing kicks in. I believe the problems before that, so like to go back to what you said before, and I agree with you. I have no Romania school saying this is The criteria for you to me to be eligible for the school right, I think we both agree. My problem is whether its white, asian or black, when that criteria includes and this race and that's what affirmative action is a action isn't union. These test scores unities, extracurricular tricky. We need this essay, it's you need all these things
and you also need to be black and let's get on top of it. You also can have a lower scores if your black, because we expect less of you, and I just had a grocer now with May growling tina- and this is just you know- I can privilege white guy, but very sad rice. She was single. I think I've benefited from affirmative action and she was that everything she did. She came from long view, went to a small school with and have a lot of AP programmes. She did no extracurricular road, and I say a symbol that sounds to me. Like you weren't spot here, you ve worked really hard and she said yeah I'd like to think so. I do not think that you deserve to be here. She said. Well,
I think so, but I also think it could be because of affirmative action, and that's it that's so sad. It so said that you can work so hard and because other people, maybe didn't work so hard, but got in really based on tokenism. You rob that girl Tina of her self confidence in earning her accomplishments. So I agree with you that universities should have set out criteria. I just have a problem with that criteria, specifically involving race and its negative results right. So so what about the idea of having more diversity it is global system is another way to leave its diversity, make it a diverse programme. We want to make it the university it now. It doesn't look like this, like that. You know everybody. Now he has access to get into this into this links with its job of equal opportunity. With the same thing, innocence no cause. I don't have a problem with diversity occurring naturally, based on the premise of equal opportunity sounds to me like we are talking about, is equal outcome up? Let me ask you: why clarifies why misunderstanding when you say diversity? What do you mean specific link it if you, if you use ninety percent way, any undertaking qualified to get any schools or people their background? We need to do something, but that's not what I want to, because that's what happened what's happening front of action is the opposite of the one I make them unexplained, something: ok, ok, right so policies. The university is all right. This is needed that make it simple universities or someone says something in this system. Some some says this light needy element, so the school implements some kind of system. It says,
let's reach out to do smells like right to do that and then sold them Asians or scoring, or they are I'll find to be in place now that school. So how do we get more that do you knows? How do we diversity into the programme? So if your target will be more rational negotiating yeah, if those people are not getting the qualifications of the schools that it takes to get through school in something needs to be applied for that to happen. So
school milk quota, affirmative action sets data. Look as I support the idea of racial quotas to promote racial diversity yet, but I wouldn't call it I mean I just wanna make sure, as you just said, quota year, yet I wouldn't call racial, ok beak. So what would you call specifically allowing a black person in with lower credentials because their black, if not racial? would you call back of him in what you say is offering an opportunity that someone would never have the chance to do that kind of what they do in the chance I mean the same criteria, so I'm able to make their essential. You didn't come from a place where they grow up in an environment that doesn't allow them supported to grow within environment, to move into to be surrounded by the thing it gives them a certain kind of now with egg in it
They can learn these gonna get into the school we do. We take test sometimes come as a black person in schools would entail a block exemption from what I understand. We take drastic indoor Rachel dolls, I'll bet you ve always been that we take these debts to get into a certain place. If I fail to test man, I gotta go back you, but how do I learn? That's insane you haven't of my people and how to them too, how people learn to take test the Ps Buckingham into to get into the place if it never going to happen, and we need to watch already happening. So let me let me address kind, your point, so you were saying schools entirely. Why? First off, I disagree with your promise of diversity for diversities. Sake is a virtue. I don't think so. I think that intellectual diversity is more important by the way, that's much more lacking on campus than racial diversity, intellectual diversity, manufacture of forty percent of all university campuses with not a single republican or conservative professor at all, forty percent. You can't find forty percent of any schools. I don't have a single black professor. You can't find probably five percent that not a single black professor or a single lesbian, professor, so little actual diversity is more important to go. To that point, you are assuming you're, presupposing schools entirely way, which has never really been the case. By the way. My fact, black enrollment higher tier universities, Ivy League, is a lower now thirty, five years ago, pre affirmative action agree, so affirmative action setting net negative effect on black enrollment at higher education. So I don't have it with the premise that it's all right by design. So I can't possibly agree with the next premise, which is we need to create Ex percent quota black people by design. I can't because it wasn't right on the thorough majority like people, just like it's not by design that Asian Americans second disproportionately face discrimination, and I dont want to compare discrimination of black Americans to Asian Americans, but certainly internment camps and immigration policies against people from China were very, very severe. I dont believe that they should now be forced to meet higher standards, even though they face the same kind of district, systemic determination solely because without any quotas they were outperforming like people. So an example right now which idler racial diversity, a white male- can score lower. So we all go. Ok, it should be ok for a black person to score lower than an asian and getting to sing university ESA people. I don't agree with it.
The unintended consequences are an asian female right now has two score higher than a white man solely because Asian Americans have typically performed well and standardized testing. They have done very well with extracurricular, as you know, the reason for that they face discrimination. They faced extreme poverty and first generation immigrants, they very strong nuclear family households and a strong emphasis on that- and this is something we talked about before, with black
Americans. When you look at this need. Ok, why are there fewer black and release right now in university? Talk to universities and before, especially when you look at the fact that a black female was a higher education degree, will actually make more than a white, so the gap is close in certain ways, but the disparity comes from lobbyists. Who is doing what the single biggest socio economic indicator is of? It's not even close brok of almost have this. Every cent that we have reflects the biggest indicator we have of whether you graduate high school. We, whether you end up in prison. Where do you go to college, whether you make good living, whether you have healthy relationships, dual parent households, mom and dad still actually engaged in household black Africans in the nineteen sixty had a twenty five percent single parent household or fathers house already today, that's nearly eighty, compared to twenty five percent with White America, thirty percent with White Americans and much law, rotation, Americans and Latin Americans. That is a startling trap.
That will put black young men and in extreme disadvantage and a lot of us. We have to ask why the reason why was because of your Lyndon Johnson to remember this, my debts from Detroit as well, the model Cities Programme started in Detroit and the Welfare programme, which incentivize single parent household and was marketed toward black people, and so you go from really strong family structures in the black community, much more so than white community for a long time that slowly degraded until today, and that's a more important economic and social factors that even higher education degree and we're trying to correct it with affirmative action at university by the ten. The problems already begun. We're trying to correct it with affirmative action, which very much parallels the model cities in the Welfare programme and that its trying to write the wrongs of the past with systemic discrimination towards the few,
your people and other races, and that's why I don't think that its morally correct and I would presuppose that's why the results having yielded what we thought affirmative action, why didn't you just is but now I'm starting to think more about how many could be could be raises. What can you affirmative action, yes action, your saying it can be raised in pointing out that it is now a question tat what I was curious about it when we meet in the first place, I didn't think it was put in these things in place. The way you sing them could stand side by side. It is
It is it depending on how you look at it. Who are you? What kind of over me do you have that these things and you can say that both these things stand side by side and in comparison, young, yes or no gear, nay, the bad right equipment. The member this study was a study in New York. Where the black white, basing his wits same school white, scored hired an easy was a black second. Women, none silent while flags asian doing summers. Over a four year period, the Asians went to school and study, read more done summers. They were first Is in Asia? Is black and white by the end of the will you period, it was light, lacks yeah
somewhere along the line, something changes and would be the fact that no one's pushing if it were pushing lag, he's getting you outside of the institution, fatherless wrap, it could be read. Stephanie amateur mean come from the company lop ear and house, just a mom yeah, quick ahead with Working Levin, seven, three eleven of these crazy, that's a very impressive and I'm sure I understand you're statistical anomaly, because a lot of black men who didn't have fathers they didn't ended, they ended up in the system, so to speak frankly, did creates real bad off our friends who that, led to this day, I probably name above five not even then three three, it'll be all right.
Let me ask you: this is a personal question: how much compared to cause you're professor successful each can see, teach at Princeton as well or here in person, and then you teach here. It reaches ok, so heavy onto for India and while ok so very accomplished, that's not statistically, very typical of of by the way, not only by people, but why people without that's why people aged and we will have that across the board. But let me ask you this: without successful you are and what you ve seen mentioning friends have ended up in prison, which is which is tragic. It really is true and I think, there's a whole argument for prison reform and actually very happy with Donald Trump has done with nonviolent drug offenders, letting some black people free, which are the big deal anyway ceremony we'll get back and I'm getting sidetracked. Now how much of an advantage. Do you think it would be compared to everything else, affirmative action, welfare problems? Any other government program that they created to try and help black Americans.
Would you agree that having a dad in your household who supported you would be a much greater factor? in your ability to thrive as a child, then a government programme having a dad there. Who is there for you and supported you how big of in impact you think that would have made unless you're mad, because the variables of very different this is it It is no longer here, but he also William. I like right my father was in my life. I may not have made Sidney you tell me you didn't take into the relevant. He took whether he was in the house are not. There is also a job. You need to do it. Well, ok, I'm assuming a good support of fathers. What I'm saying, if you had a good support, a father who took care of your mother and took care of you in house how
Jim and advantage. Do you think that would have been compared to your friends. Incredible then, and I will say a statistically that's an advantage, and I reckon I just when we talk about privilege as someone who is whether canadian French Katy intimidate, want to try it anyway to me when I look back- and I thank them for me having a mother and father, you made such a big impact and when you look at the statistics across all races, its consistent, why kiddies onto what, without a deadlock as other issues, that seventy seven percent of like households, don't have adapt right now and the problem begins long before they get to university? And so then we implement these effectively racist, racist matters and university in quotas to trying to fix the problem that was created by government programmes in the first place. As my point, you know it's featly unintended consequences, the ripple effect of creating a real problem of economic, sparing. No real quick welcomes in mind when you say that, like you said that something was not by designing a university because it was all white, the only way I can agree with your argument is: if it was all why only by design were they policy centred around me. Why do you look? I know what you described in right now. If we go back in this, is this I can't even get into. I can't pull from this stuff right now with my head is all over the place with his hat in expect this, but if you look at what was set up in in definite american communities is certain terms. It is six these late, fifty sixty seven, these it was to disrupt the homes,
yeah that we the welfare programmes of models that these programmes here you know animated windows, CD. I'm sorry, I think somebody was to see many people illegally argument Lyndon Johnson. Did it deliberately media the amiably that do was that it was this design was designed to set up. Things was happening today right and there might have been some programmes that would put in place implemented to disrupt that, but here's the thing right it was presented by Lyndon Johnson as a gift right, it was presented as a pay. We're gonna fix the problem of the past. Lament welfare, we're gonna, do central arise, planning right right, very similar to the way a form of action by design is presented as a gift. If something was get critically,
it becomes enabling in that's what that was, and so some things that would then be implemented in two systems are enabling an opponent of action may just be that think. Big have some kind of it lingers men yeah right. Can they want especially a menu you? So you boys, your path like becoming a professor, have because you I'm sorry what comes to prefer milieu west by the way is this one here in household friends, so drugs? They ve been analogy to me. My mother was very strong, and so she thinks she has expectations of mere child. I was told to do things in expected him to be done. We see cable right, that carried with all my life, and I watched my friends grew up in the same one, parent with mother,
we got into the street, we did whatever we wanted to do and they would home and they took whatever they had no street into the home. I left that shit outside cuz. My mom was going to do what my dad would do. Kick ass. so I had something to have a standard delivered. French, canadian moms very similar. In that way, I'm slap me around. I'm not much com would allow these White Americans a time out of it. That's what you got. What could they have reason to french Canadians, so I didn't go to university. I couldn't some stuff, but I didn't really universe.
I had my hands, whose three very many aims at creating character for me, a lot of what was right or wrong and learn how to decipher between the two to get what I needed to give to watch it. Also, I kind of stayed away from certain things at any trouble and if they get in trouble, I knew I was getting in trouble, because this is the streets because degree, go to college, is already becoming professor studied thought. I was holding a study on my own or read a lot of their got his red allied with the information, and I was learning in schools. This wasn't set up for me in school.
With a place to go and work, devise standard and get out of here. Don't what am I supposed to do likewise? What everybody else is going to cause wife, kid chapter, nine didn't anxiously. I wanted to make things that I was very create greater and so now the same same white. I thought I was wearing disabled because I was bored men same thing with good talked damned time and wonder why people I was in a second great leaning on the sixth grade level right when I'm with the second rate plus two bus into into the whites. My dad was in Detroit after the riots with that worked, like a charm. Didn't integration pricing system, another example of unintended consequences yap. What now now with me as a child, not knowing what to do where we're going. I took today as punishment. to too much put in a corner to read as one Smith,
It's all into much read books I was Right Chinese, it's our languages are Mandarin? I don't remember that just any China is characterised. Do you know why you're right in no way with this is cut out, it would have been just had a really races, professor at your writing, races shining eyes. Just a scarlet raises ethical, because I was the only Blackie right is the one that was getting in trouble. It's like you, picking on me Rachel. I was telling doesn't like that long run completely Looking back it was you this creating tools punishment? That was encouraging activity and
turning destructive behaviour in the productive ability. Yes, I went back and waited. There are great that put schools do couldn't class hanging out with the wrong, roused the whole nine right, and I remember that day. That's where I should. Never has the kind of person I'm so anyway. Long story short somewhere in my head? I stopped stuck with me, man and I live. Red things, and I was interested in equity, deprived
Can I ask you a quick question: can an interesting you said so that happened that for teacher, that was when you are going across district in the new? Yes, so it was a teacher washee wider, which you like my old old way, women, namely its own white women, know who you thought was raised this issue with you realize she was. She was actually doing things it to encourage me to be better and then, when you went back to schools where teachers are primarily lack, no, they like to didn't. Take care of. You see. No ok. This is softly. Niece cheese through school to get out right is it
The punishment, despite the fact that there is more spent spending in those calls lotta people. Don't now there's more spending in the inner city, schools it just the same thing in prison are sold. So what did they do we get in trouble in schools which nobody? Nobody can you hear me sit there with your head down? Don't knock industry struck, my teacher, you know that I have a similar story so that it was in the fourth grade, and I was you care about. My threats. Cannot it's gotTA, Mary Mary? That's how I got enough and I will get back to what happened was I was force, has infringed Canada, you wanna talk about discrimination, they actually something called the language police or if I open my name is stealing two thousand Stevens Dire, apostrophe ass. I could be fine and put in jail because the french writing ass to be two and a half times bigger than the english radio. That even now Canada's an english country but French is is a website could act as a french province. It would be like Texas, saying there's a language police. You have to speak Spanish and you have the right all your signs in Spanish. So not only that, but if you have a single parent born in Quebec, you have to go to french schooling, so I do speak. French English. French is technically my first language because I learned to read an islander even right at first, but I think in English and I've I've lost one of my French, so what happened was in a third rate fell so far behind, because I was doing math and geography and history in french right in a foreign language just because I'm almost french, and even though I bet that was one of the troika so because of some kind of a loophole they found. They got me too, in the middle of
Third Gregg, not women middle of first rate, the Emmy switched over Complete. The names is too from Israel to miss. So she was an english teacher. Friends teacher was very nice, but that's all Learning disabled, like borderline, retarded move to an English class, Fernando Matthew in English. In this lady miss she was, I want to say south indian really harsh, really strict. I did not like her, so I came from a nice teacher who said he's learning disabled. They sent me to a teacher mission. HU. A lot of kids hated TAT was mean, but she state after class and taught me long division as long as it took shouldn't do with a smile on your face, but she cared wrench unite. Asian said your child is not learning disabled
Actually! She said you tell my baby hd, but since this is the language thing it had happened, and so just if sing them that you know it, it really does bridge that racial delighted is about actually helping people wanting to better people, regardless of where they are, regardless of their race and that's my problem with a form of action on campus. If it's not lined like your white, professor was arranged racially blind and she was helping a kid. Miss was just how a kid format of action, says help the white kid how the asian kid you have to help them
Canada and that creates new their sister. It also perpetuates the idea you have to just do what you need to do right to play the game right. This is good as everyone else, so I guess I interrupted. But how did you become a professor without worrying about the interview I started break you tonight anything would break and instead of bringing in eighteen, eighty three and it was doing, knew at the time. So simple long story, short man, I just study, didn't have performed in either with the diversity of this company put about. There's council states that he laughed Philadelphia and from that point on, I found something we engage all the time I can make music dance said designing and all these things it at this stage, this empty canvas will need to do it. I had been learning in this class right and so understanding that ninety three study it only to those persons who doesn t just found myself in different places, they gave me an advantage. I guess, there's gotta be a weird started prince, unlike what we need here crimson he pop my boy. So they call me and said in a couple of times, isn't something like do you turn them down a day, really measurement why people's faces a deal?
but I feel I had put. It took to be pressing grown up, our present harboured person harbour prison, Harvard right and now, I'm here and even a college degree. It was married base because of what you'd accomplished. Yes, actually again, that still merit based power setting would be to you, for I would imagine that an hip hop rights and exclusively eighties, probably largely black, correct, blacken won t, know what to think came in and said to many black hair professors. We need to have more white hair professors and then he said, but that guy sucks were narrow. Yet, but you know there are problems. We have lower expectations because we know why people can dance, but that doesn't even have. It would have been worth because this would have a certain standard. When we have the green, you can t level three degrees, it could study or know someone did. They could bring entities what they needed to tee right so worldwide people that the income from the background teaching of those classes and eventually schools. This felt like we need some,
some qualified people in writing you to do what they need to do, and a couple of has has many has has a couple honorary Greece now, so he doesn't have a degree either, but he managed to do what it needs to what what needed to be done many here, because the history of her pocket at Princeton, but let's say where well when you were touring, was mostly lacking. Nineteen out it would probably piss you off. I would imagine if they just started hiring like eyes to diversify, who weren't good dancers. You prohibitive said men, that's not right, because someone else is a better dancers losing that spot rule. But if you need to get to that point rights on you know what I'm saying if let's say that, where an audition cannot say you were there and see that you're high level superbly rain on a lot of additions. Now, apparently, ok, but let's say he was in your right, like Google them lacks the again. because I want to know not even it fit. The bill now
We're going to place said the cask, recasting call would be guy. Would White beard booty, Sir Red sneakers, Glasses appears exactly. What I would would be wearing, coincidentally yeah and according to their job, is completely opposite. Like blue eyes on here looks like we can put him anywhere we needed. So that is what becomes the visually. I ve been able to identify hip hop with that thing, meaning that in sync, as what happens here, and is still continuing short some of them, but I think we re finding common ground. We both agree in that instance. The best answer should be the one to get a job, and I wasn't a case to answer. The best student should be the one who gets into school. I agree so again, legally in areas at the beginning of this thing I said it's not, and now I'm thinking, maybe
the little neighbour with more information about these things on the table, and we both I have no right or wrong is how can you prove which way, Ok, what's so we both have something to think about, Evidently, man I have definitely does it show me that they have our thanks thanks, you listen thing. Helen was he's a professor of airport. I gotta do so you go like this is go up and down up and everyone can grab hands right. What do like a big? We have advocated away grab, hands, come on now, really the wave giant. We will start right here. We grab you gotta, make driving or difficult my security security that will do the rest. Ok, look what were always look at this
how about this all different races genders the power of damp. That's called the affirmative. We profess, professor, roughly. How can I appreciate you gave it unless we well. Thank you the present legal isn't? That was surprising. Maybe it was too you. Ok, next Ali fortunate Ali lay democratically ok, I got two hundred. Ok, forgive me for not allayed. Yes, Stephen. Forgive me if I don't pronounce a correctly showing a sip of water before we start on very thirsty everything, but of silence. May myself I want to make up your mind.
This french Canadian and she just doesn't pronounce anything properly. So I can announce it for she was cross in Nagoya frame, seeing just put that on their. So I understand so allay. Ok, I'm closer familiar. You are, if at all with what we do with this programme. Ok, you are so typically it's it's ours to finish. Ok, that's it! it's a chance to sort of rationalize our positions and controversial topics today by requesting beauty is affirmative action I believe that affirmative action is raised, by definition, then it's morally wrong and it hasn't worked. If you disagree with me, you're more than welcome to change my mind, I mean I think that calling it raises. Is it like, I guess, the correct term, because its policy, those instituted in response to social inequalities, experienced by different, like disadvantage,
he's disadvantage occupational groups. I agree with what my judgment lecture. I agree with what you just said, but it still racist by definition, an existence but look at what is one make sure where you could. I understand that what you're saying as racism generally has a negative connotations. And I think it from the as a negative connotations. Because of its results, but I'm using this definition of waste from here racial prejudice or discrimination by definition of What action is discriminating against members of specific races? based on racial identity, they might be doing it for what they believe to be an altruistic reason which I understand you agree with, but by its definition, it still is sclusively based on race, easy. I don't think that it like, anyway raised from getting it affected into a universally Chertoff, I mean if it can lower the pool of acceptance. Space that are universally has because it designates
a certain amount for different races. Nobody doesn't like exclusively sale or it doesn't like kind of like giving We are applying to unity, you're not gonna, get the night, because your way nobody could because Unblock. So. My point is this one, I'm sure you're, where the Harvard LAW suit, but Kashmir clocks. We have planes going over a little bit difficult. So sorry, if I get this really close to your face right now, for example, they look to accept people based on race, specifically black Americans and Hispanics, at the exclusion of Asian Americans and White Americans, particularly asian Americans. So with the same performance standards or even better performance standards, they will exclude Asian Americans based on rates, because you mentioned earlier. You said that you are right. I dont think that minority rights communities that are socially disadvantaged throughout the United States, are growing world or wherever and
kind of awaited. Do that because people that benefit from affirmative action tend to graduate from college more than people dont benefit from it, so it helps like those people that are. hidden in that are more knowledgeable in, like their area study than other people from their seem razor missing. It probably one do as well, because the data yeah imperialist, not the case. Basically, there there are fewer, for example, black Americans in university than there were thirty five years ago, learning that graduation rate has dramatically increased university. That's that's across the board: But there are fewer unroll, ease and higher education of black Americans, and there were thirty five years ago and actually through regulation rates are lower and his men effect. Performers centres once they are in college, is far lower for black Americans, for example like a black american law school right now is for times more likely to fail the bar exam. Then a white person, that's not
didn't used to be the case in it. That's into because for me that that's because, like the different Disadvantages face when they grow up. So you believe that a black american and twenty nineteen faces more Systemic disadvantages than in nineteen? Sixty nine, maybe get a night sixty nine, it wasn't that they graduated more. They pass examined more einstein. Systemic. I just think that, like even through history, the way that the laws and policies in the areas of restructuring. The hedges hasn't been beneficial to african American you right after they got out like slavery. Well now you have until now or not I mean up until a Contemporary America like a few decades, the whole civil rights era of that, but I believe that things have improved for African Americans systemically they still are like
logging in the race in again how? So, how do you believe improve, and how do you believe that there are lagging? I guess I mean because we talked about graduation rates have increased in the past few decades, but that's They haven't forgotten what we can do that, what you mean for giving graduation rates in university or even high school, because high school education we haven't lived, declined. Well, that's also because the economic disadvantages that they face, like others, in how they their rules like less Funding India's exactly but there's action, significantly higher public funding of public schools in urban areas? For example, in Detroit where I was born right, when my dad was raised of the machine for a long time the average person for spending in Detroit Schools? Is, I think, eighth in the country? At one point I was like top five: Washington DC in areas that are primarily black base. spend significantly more per pupil in Detroit about fourteen thousand. It's a lot more than national, but certainly more than white people, but the graduation rate is, I think, twentysomething percent for black.
And so the spending doesn't work. I it's not say about spending like problems going up financially at home, so they won't be as like ready to take on my high school level forces as like someone, that's not experience. They ve been on after work when they're like fifteen sixteen, and why do you believe they face consider that are not facing that schools are not facing systemically, but you're saying there facing economic Well, that's not experience. They ve been on after work when they're like fifteen sixteen, and what do you believe they face? Consider that not facing that schools are not facing it systemically, but you're saying facing economic disparity disabilities at home. Why do you think that is? I think it's just because, like how the extraction of like racism Missy's isn't it, It's like what wow I'm confused and irish. I'm tryin understand your position because I'm kind of civic. Well, if you look at the economic situation with schools, we both agree. It's not an economic situation with schools are public funding, that's not the case, so I said it's at home, so if it-
home. It's not structural! Why do you believe that there are more action? make disadvantages, Americans, for example, at home, because when those parents, when we got that education, I guess at the same rate as other white, waiting for an asian origins and others to sit in the past. Here is where, in the past few decades, the trend has continued in its bettering numbers. I don't think that affirmative action is like racist or is it It's like. I don't fully understand, but I wouldn't I would disagree with you in that the trend has gotten worse since nineteen sixty things worse, I think it s front.
Empirically has for black Americans. Actually, the economic disadvantages, I've gotten worse for black american children than black american children in the Sixtys and Seventys towards today they had more funding publicly theyve affirmative action at school. Yes, although things they get more money through public funding, one percent we agree, but at home personally they do experience a disproportionate amount of economic disadvantages compared to white families, oration families, a game that goes back tonight- that spending not having the same opportunities. White people when they known or less on it. I'm saying that more opportunities, economically, they get more spending on their schools. They have more applications and of the basin affirmative action. Do you know why you know what the biggest the single biggest socio economic determining factor is in the country bar none according the Pew research, accordingly heritage according to parochial bomber? What if you could pick? One thing
That would most significantly determine your economic outlook. Your Outlook, your fine, your personal outlook in relationships. What do you think that would be you mention it single parent turning to parents and out women get that also goes back tonight. I guess different issues, it don't mean single parent households, like that's injury, but one thing is, is individualistic, but why do you think we ve gone? from the nineteenth sixties, which short of you brought on right, pre discrimination and in answer to the voting rights. Why do you think black Americans went from only a twenty five percent single parent household to nearly eighty percent today and that determines you being more poor that determines you ending up in prison that determines you developing depression that determines you having a successful marriage of your own. Why do you think that not individually statistically overwhelmingly. It went from only twenty
five percent Father s single parent households, to nearly eighty and is not reflected in asian households or white household. It is now important. No, I mean if, if if we really, why do you think that's? Why Nancy. Why it's happened, but I wanna before before and ask: would you listen? You don't have a statistics, but all I can offer them to afterward. Would you agree with the general premise that the dear of having a nuclear family within a mother and father supporting children is a huge influence on their success in life and a huge advantage. Ok- and let's assume I'm not lying on the statistics that black Americans have gone, some very strong nuclear families to say, no parent or fatherless household. Ok, let's assume we both agree on so well. We both agree, then, that it- important to observe that problem and say: ok
can we reverse this trend, because that would do more than affirmative action on campus or more than public school funding? We both agree on that. so the reason why is because, in the sixties, as a way to independent. You ve heard the sort of knowledge. The pendulum swings both ways. It was discriminatory so to try and correct previous discrimination is served under Lyndon Johnson with the Model cities programme. Actually, Detroit was picked first because it was the wealthiest city in the country, the nineteen fifty so gum program centralized urban planning started in nineteen sixty and a modern welfare programme which incentivize encouraged single parent households. So in trying to correct the systemic oppression of the past they instead, A policy which I believe is racist by definition, to fix it moving forward which led to unbelievably negative economic outcomes and socio economic outcomes for black Americans, and that is mirrored very much by affirmative action on campus to fix what happened before, lessons do Institute,
a racial exclusive policy going forward. My point is that in the economy at large. When you look at the welfare modern Welfare programme, the Model Cities programme harm black Americans irreparably for decades. And a form of action. Wishing the ripples of doing that exact same thing, you see, I don't think that a firm enough action caused that or I don't think that, nor was it would cause. The single parent house will differ is: is a modern welfare system, I don't think that affirmative action is like never negatively affected by black. Americans are hispanic Americans because it's given the more opportunities to go to get a better education and get a better job, so just within that, like they're statistics that prove that people like I get how I said earlier, that benefit from affirmative action do end up getting higher higher paid jobs.
more intend to do better than those that didn't benefit from no not really economically, and if in, if it is, I would say that the successive show its negligible and its much much much smaller than had we not implemented. Big government programmes dating fabulous and single parent household. That's my problem. That's my point. Is it mirrors the same big government solutions to prior discrimination on campus and it's only around and that negative outcome, and as far as having positive outcomes. I was a stock tongue latina about this you'd make more going to a trade school. The idea that that a college degree is a determining factor of your economic status is just not true. Today I mean yes, because if you want to be like a professional, your lawyer. Doug Unita GO swimming short, able to church lawyer or not, but I do agree that sometimes a college degree in specific areas doesn't really right.
If someone, so I won't understand your premise: let's use lawyers, an example. Do you believe, because it's actually very specific example, I brought up overall specifically with black American, since I ve been talking about that fifty percent like students right now in higher education, the bottom twenty percent decline in law. Fifty percent the bottom ten percent, Och student right now in the United States is four times as likely to fail the bar exam. Now that happens after university right so I've already got in the bar is not racist, the universities and racist. Why Do you think they are? failing the bar exam at such an astronomical rate in comparison to Asians and White Americans, because again how they grew up and howling, since they were raised at a disadvantage compared to Latin America and Asia, and that doesn't like? I don't think that, because you re disadvantage, then they should not be given that, like affirmative action, because an affirmative action does help them
but it does it at the end. It doesn't and its fail the bar four times a rate of white students that not like you talking about like African Americans in General on college campuses. Yes, they perform very poorly on the objective metrics afterwards, because their mismatched with Asian American, like that general back. If you talk about like Americans that benefit from affirmative action yet another it's an equitable and it is at the expense of other people? So that's what goes. who had being morally correct jubilee, for example, what certain I asked Do you believe it is morally correct that an asian American should have to get like an agency right now applying to let's say harboured, has to get a thirteen fifty our cities to be accepted when a boy, student. Only eleven hundred yet will give them this morning that a black sea, where he's many faces like racial by his when taking the acidity through like working languages, I mean it's like both of its organisation zone. I mean
They want to ask you this. Do you think that its fair that an asian american woman has to score higher on the essay tease then male, because that's a consequence of affirmative action. I mean anything. get me to like measure fairness or because obviously like every single side of like a political issue or like just an issue in general, is going to favor one side or the other in some way. So it's going to be like a pro and a con to like each, sure I guess not always hope to see what it lets. That's interesting say favour aside. What does that mean by definition, favour favouritism? It's it's not that it's favouritism! It's I'm just saying that ok but unexplained from because in favour, and I wanted to explain why I disagree with you. So That's remove favour. You said it new policy will favour aside. So what did you mean to say- and I mean like any say it's just my friend- I just mean that like any like, for example, ok, I lost my turn.
So asian Gimme, hot coffee and throwing her friends face. I know so generations in white. I don't think they experience the disadvantage that, like Hispanics him and black people expensive going through through their childhood like internally camps chinese immigration policy now he would in turn against, isn't like the same thing as like. Like these, brains of of wasted, latino Americans would have latin latin american immigrants experience, so the on par with internment camps or bans on immigration from China, which we experienced for very long time, would have latin I can experience even comparable to that. I can't think of anything I mean I'm personally from Mexico and, like I had to come to United States, because, unlike the joker to violence in Matamoras, we take. We don't mrs willingness to explain something- I guess you're in the: U S, but no you but I mean like. So why would it be our job to correct the wrongs of your terrible corrupt,
Mexico waits acting correctly there like wrongs, it's too, to give like, I guess, a fair chance for these people who up disarray. just about fairness, furnaces also like trying to give everyone the equal opportunity yeah that's equal opportunity. I am stressing equal opportunity. You are stressing equal outcomes equal
fortunately means we only accepts the people who perform the best buy metrics period? I dont think that spending screwing up get equal opportunities as complete waste and really so. You believe that latter that Latin America, what's latin American, could Latin America's tells a latin American Americans. What's a term, we should use mexican Americans, latin American Americans. You believe that they don't that they face. They face more systemic discrimination in the United States. The nation amendments I mean because I look at them and here's one thing is really important to me. I look at Asia. Americans were citizens who are putting internment camps wrongfully. I look at chinese immigrants who wanted to migrate. He like here legally and could not for decades, and I look at Mexican Americans who come here illegally and then are granted amnesty, and I say that is a much greater advantage. Then an asian American who is not even one generation removed from internment camp or barred from migrating to the country. S very fair. I just think that I guess asian Americans don't facing civic as
exist that make inequalities than light. That's your Spanish, because even the whenever, where you want to get a job or you're getting one legged and you want to do a position within ten seconds, the interviewer sees that, like you're, a black regional spanning like me, Have these values, tourism that applies translations. I ain't that they actually have a positive, ok I can tell you where they don't and applying the college. so you are talking about first off potential, anecdotal situations that you believe and is not simple. by data. You believe that when interviewing for job interviews, Latin Americans or black Americans might be viewed unfavourably globally I'd, let me just to some yes or no report. I want to make sure you understand your position here. Ok, because I want to see where we disagree it seems we are seeing that you believe why not for a job, a black, american or latin american men.
Face and personal discrimination that an asian american woody- yes, yes, ok, You believe that there is no empirical evidence to support that now, we respond with. I would can't you an example where asian Eric absolutely do face systemic observable discrimination and eleven not seen by black or latin Americans, and that's when applying for college It's not a! Maybe it's! We know that their discriminated against I mean. Is that that's right I mean I can't really answering the question, because you can't explain what you mean by yes,
and no so look at an asian American right now can apply to the exact same universe, apply right here. They have to score higher and standardized testing and they have to have better performance, more Xxix regulars than a black American. They will be discriminate against because they are age and american and they have to work harder to get into college for their not being discriminated against. The other, like me, city group, is giving like it's only again. If I do ts discriminating in white agents, judge and harboured is specifically that's the lawsuit. Yes, they are that's my point. Yes, they are, I just don't. I don't see it as like discrimination towards them. I got up and see it as a reverse racism or whatever I did servers racism, but like racism. to say: do an Asian, you have to get a thirteen. Fifty and tenacity and then say it was black person. You only need an eleven hundred, that's racism.
For me. For me, it's like us. Can you understand why you? I see that as racism and many asian Americans would see it as race. As I can see the point in, like maybe a format of action needs, I guess improvement and like, They need to make a different kind of Canada benefits. Everybody and not just like ethnic minorities are disadvantaged right. That's interesting! How to implement that. What kind of a as opposed to it, action now, which is based on race, this interesting with explore that what I think would be the best way to do. I think that we need to focus on how you return households and, like all that, going on. I think that education systems do a poor job of educating kids. Even making pumps was an interesting, you? Don't mean you realize that sometimes those kids don't have value systems all systems implemented in there? I guess your household, so they need to be
That is the middle. I want an assurance that you're saying that Black Americans and latin American Americans dont have values instilled in them in that house. Oh, no! No! No! It's not that it's how you are talking about single parent house and how some that's a big. You're like economic status and that also can determine how are we see how kids grow up and where they have like if you think, if I use at all or whether they facing emotional problems and all that like that, must be taken into account. two x. In other words, if you would like to see a system where, let's say a white, I can see some light. White trailer, trash trailer park, kid who, have a dad and has an abusive mother who went to a really crappy school in a rural area. Should be admitted before
SK in American Amendment, whose families very wealthy? I don't think that they should be immediately frightened that, like public schools need to change their way of, I guess teaching, especially like an elementary school, where, like minded like child framework, things like different ways. You link La Massimo using changing from it of action and what he was doing much India to socio economic status rather than race. No, I You still think it should be raised. I don't think I think that it should be like something more to socio economic status, because that's because someone Affirmative action doesn't even benefit like disadvantage african Americans, it benefits people remember that or disadvantage white american, yet exact, more disadvantage asian. So, if we're talking about like disadvantaged people in general, I think that from an action should shift towards. Like, though not mistake, you said rates
economic status and right so we should have a lower standards, for example, for let's say an asian american or white american poor child from a single parent household, then a wealthy mexican immigrant from a dual parents hold so dear? monsieur economics as we give preferential treatment to the Asian or the white person. In that case, we now it since it just because they grew up in a disadvantage ways. They will have better education and healthy person, right, ok, so we believe we should change affirmative action from re space to socio economic path, and then we can. Fixing socio economic problems like doing away with welfare completely so that we actually start de incentivize in single parent households. I agree that we agree with that. Ok, you! I know that I know a lot of a lot of latin Carson Maxine American is allowed? Ok, does Egypt isn't Mexican is a pejorative if we,
an extra Americans not offensive. So because the I know, your friends. I know mexican american households place a strong points after on family values, and have big families and often have mothers and fathers. Fifty, oh, do you exactly do they live in the same house like nine trucks in the driveway? Indeed, we do you think my mom she's she has accepted. We are likely to get anything because I'm like one of the youngest cousins yeah when she entered my older brother, that's something they also used to live together so all only when all the cars and the driveway and on their colleagues in other areas in Texas, recycle cases. This is clearly mexican area because, like fifty cars out in front of this house, ok I understand- and I do understand to that many mexican Americans who come here and want to work hard yeah. I have a problem with the welfare system as it exists, and I think we would find some common ground on that, because often men,
Americans don't benefit from us in welfare programmes, sometimes culturally, because of a sense of pride, and they want to work for it, but there also, it could be argued, a correlation between that and stronger family households with mexican american family immigrants, and that's why I think that maybe you see, for example, yourself we're your parents. First generation argue first generation mexican immigrant me! Ok, you came here, So there is actually a statistic kind of mentioning that mexican american immigrants first generation their children do better than, with black Americans, immigrants or black american type, even born here, then their next generation does and again that could large to be attributed to strong families, which should be part of that it is united in its technical defects. My point out like having those sitting of Green House increase
twenty percent for a year and block american soldiers, mixed marriages, tend to put a focus on family values, making two thousand white like personally, I kind of really driven- and I do not like you said that the hurriedly determining factor behind a link into depositing schools that kind of not improve teachers aware what different problems that we face and have a general way to teach kids writing more nurturing the problem of it, as it would be seen as judgmental ran right now we can teach people that mommy and daddy are the best way to raise children, because some people get offended, even though we know that would have. Let me ask you this and when you list could be mentioned, affirmative action and not to know whether you have or haven't benefited when you think of all of Europe, privileges in your life- and I think of all my privilege and item in the sense of white privileged mean privileges blessings when you think of them. Can you think of anything that has benefited new more in moulding and shaping? Could you are then having a mom and dad
probably one of the biggest determining factors so What I'm saying is, rather than throwing things through the Prism of race on campus after the problem. Let's try. Focus on that and I think a lot better outcomes across the board, We disagree on somebody. I think I'm glad that we can agree in spirit, and I predict how are they supply? Thank you how you so much appreciated. Are you sure you, if you like this instalment of change, my mind, click on one of these other installments playing in a box? It's the only way you can find it because if you search it and may not show up because its controversial in Youtube wants to discourage that the controversy To change my mind playing by the rules, you just don't know what they are subscribing to notifications.
Transcript generated on 2020-06-21.