After he's out of office you going to arrest him. So there is no opportunity where the president of the United States in run rapid in January the end of his term and just go away Scot free. The department of Justice does know what to do with such people drop it still able for everything you do, and while I was in office as an ordinary, showed us unless the structured limitations fill our before every day. You did What is on offer. didn't get away with anything. Yet here we have a criminal justice system in this country we have civil litigation. In former presidents are not immune from being accountable by either one.

Good Morning welcome the morning Joe Senate, minority leader, Mitch, Mcconnell with the not so subtle suggests, and there are still other paths to whole former president Trump Accountable, despite his acquittal, Saturday, something even one of President France. Lawyers pointed out during the trial, we will look into possible. Metal in several charges? What those could be? This comes after the United States Senate. Did it quit former President Trump for a second time? This past weekend, a five thousand seven hundred and forty three verdict ten votes short of the sixty seven to thirty majority needed to convict. Seven Republicans did vote to convict. We will to dig into what the future for those seven Republicans were already feeling heat from a republican party still grappling with whether Donald Trump will be its leader and what the end of the impeachment trial means for president trumps, ambitious. agenda a busy morning Mitch Mcconnell after this vote, to equip tromp suggesting the former president still may face judgment in the courts will get to that.

It is Monday February fifteen President's day, I'm really guys Joe in meat. the morning off joining us this morning. Whitehouse report for the Associated Press, Mr Jonathan Lanier, professor at Princeton Universe. Eddie Glad Junior see news. Capitol hill corresponded host of way too early Casey Hunts, Rogers Chair American presidency at the Vanderbilt University historian John, meets him. He occasionally unofficially advises president by and founder of the conservative website, the bulwark author of how right lost its mind, Charlie Sites, morning to you all a very busy morning today, Charlie begin with you, because you ve been talking in thinking about this a lot not just over the last couple of weeks, but over the last four or five years. What Donald Trump has done to them. a working party what he means for the future of the republican Party. You called the on Saturday, a defining vote for the party, what those senators tell you on Saturday

Well personal man, respect for the seven that voted to condemn, but you think about the votes that Republicans take Let me get seventeen two two hundred and forty two basically say that Ok with what happened on January. Sex is down trumps party, but worse, you think The last four years and republican parties We essence enabling Donald Trump looking the other way for the racism and xenophobia, the lies, the mockery of the disabled and women. All of that, but now they ve look the other way too sedition, vial this anti democratic authoritarianism, and I thank them His party is likely to be the impeachment damage both down from Canada. but in party, but also changed from coming inside she's. The Republican Party for Republican Party now has a large constituents who are violent until we talk a lot about cowardly

publicans, what one of the reasons why the cowardly is, because fear is a major factor now right, in politics and republican politics, and I don't think that's gonna go away. I think that many of the right wing extremists who invaded the CAP n Wegg feel emboldened by the boat over the weaker and I think, you can see the Republican Party continue to contain. To unforeseen. Unfortunately appease those back, and so it is the transparency which is not new, but I think it is in some ways worse, John meet him. There were seven Republicans who voted to convict a couple of surprises, but most of them either just one reelection or retiring. In the case of pat to me and Richard Burton which were already now today will face censure from the Republican Party in his home state of North Carolina so a serious blow back on these boats in back home from Donald Trump himself from men. Said the mega movement who have said you crossed this present? You betrayed this president. Showing

still even with him out of office, there is and will be, a price for stepping out of line with the former one term twice impeach president. Now, if I were Senator Bur, I would embrace that you know and in certain other something here. Sometimes we talk about obituary management, those seven folks just help to their obituaries, a you know you I think about this. A lot when you see we're in the bed. The point in the actual aerial cycle, where a lot of folks involved in Watergate are moving on, and it is interesting to see what is it that you are remembered for I'm sure Senator Burs, a lovely and I'm sure he's done a lot for North Carolina in America, but I promise you that the thing right now that looms largest is that he decided work institutional republic, not a cult of personality

and in many ways that that's what that vote was about the interesting thing and Willie. I always hesitate to offer any advice to you because you haven't done well enough well in your life and career, but you had sing slip of the tongue at the top of the hour You said we wonder what this will mean for president trumps, ambitious agenda and It's a sign of the ubiquity, the ongoing ubiquity of the former president of the United States, and I'm not arguing. Therefore, we move on one of the great mistakes we made in this country historically, is that in the aftermath the civil war during reconstruction. We did not hold insurrectionists rebels accountable for what they did, but pray on this president's day. One of the things too about is we do have a different president,

and eighty one million Americans made them what I would view as the right choice in November and fifty seven United States senators not enough, but fifty seven nice day senator said that this man was the former that was guilty of inciting insurrection against his own government and that fifty cents, Forty three number, while not determine in a constitutional sense is not probably not that far off from where the Entry at large is about the Republican Party, and so this this is Always bailiwick, not mine, but if it, if I were look right now, and I was making not in ten minute terms, which is what they are doing. But ten year terms, feel an existential crisis.

I'll Senate minority. Earlier Mitch, Mcconnell Casey had a strange moment where he voted to acquit and then gave a speech on the floor to his colleagues laying out all the ways in which President Trump incited an insurrection. He said he voted to equip because quote: we have no power to convict in disqualify for office holder. Who is now, a private citizen. But here is how he couch that in that for speech,. People, whose farmers build. I believe they were acting on the wishes and instruct their president. And having them alive was able we're saleable consequence the growing crescendo. False statements. conspiracy, theories and run probably which the defeated,

kept shouting enter the largest mobile phone on planet earth. There's no question the present crop is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. Question about January search was a disgrace. American citizens attacked their own government. They use terrorism to try to stop a specific piece of domestic. They did not like President drop- is still able for everything he did while he was in office as an order sheriff didn't get away with anything. Yet speech. You got a load off his chest, obviously, but unfortunate you put a load on the back and Republicans. That's Each year you will see and twenty twenty two campaigns, our demands,

if you're republican running Arizona, Georgia, New Hampshire, where we have a chance to take back the Senate. They made playing sinner Mcconnell speech and asking you about it as a candidate and imagine if you're in combat republican they're gonna be people asking you? Will you support sinner Mcconnell in the future, so I, like him, sinner, become he worked well with President tromp. I think his speech is an outlier regarding how republicans fail about all this. Casey, as you know, the kind of flirted with the idea that he was open to voting for conviction over the last couple of weeks, he stopped about that. He signal lead and leaks to various press outlets. Was there really ever a chance that Mitch Mcconnell the majority leader? The republican party, was gonna vote to convict President Trump Willie? I actually do

think that there was. I think that the challenge and the problem was that there were enough others in his conference that made clear to him that they would be willing to follow him down that road. I think it's possible if he had made the key is behind the scenes. We could have gotten to seventeen Republicans, but that's it Well short of half of the fifty member republican conference, and so, if that's how Mockery had voted. He would have essentially not been able to remain, the leader in this conference, and he decided that he actually did want to continue in that role. and so this is why an end again I'm just trying to explain to everyone. What the thinking as much conall is all about power, politics, and so his vote was about retaining his power insiders conference inside the Senate, and his speech was about trust to get power back for Republicans across the board, because he just wants to win in

Twenty two- and he knows that he can't do that in, firms in swing states if they embrace what Donald Trump has done and what has happened. They cannot. is. This violent rhetoric, because, while yes Donald Trump brought new people into voting. For Republicans. That group is, Ill, a relative minority mean there would have been millions of people who would have voted for whoever the report Now many was whether I was George Bush or market Rubio. So it's a little. ingenuous when people say: oh you're, discounting the votes of seventy plus million people, that's not the case in the people that storm the capital a hard core version of President Trump supporters, and many of them may not go to vote for any He accepts Donald Trump, so if you're Mcconnell Looking at this, in your saying, I want to govern again. I won't I figure out how to get people to trust us to make policy again, and we can't do that without absolute

Condemning former president tromp and what happened on January six than I think it's it's so important, just to realize that thinking about that speech. We we have often we often cover government is weakens versus Democrats once I verses and other side that bad idea has come under a lot of criticism in the last four years and part of the reason why that's true is because rejection we could have given? Most to the speech that Mcconnell gave, Nancy Policy could have given most of the speech that Macao gave people who are serious about trying to govern the country and who want to think about it in the terms that John Medium is thinking about those ten year historical, their own obituaries Sunday. They all agree that what we saw happen with President Tromp is outside of the norms. It's not acceptable, it's not american and have to mince words. There are Republicans and Democrats who believe that to be true, so

if you talk to impeachment managers were automatically dean. One of the house managers little but later on. This show over the weekend we'll tell you we made our case and by the way, even some Republicans who voted to convict said that the house managers made a good case, but they said they couldn't vote on technical. all these now there were, of course, a group of Republicans who had their minds made up well before this trial ever began, but the, The matter is the case was made. The timeline was built showing incitement of insurrection and Republicans couldn't bring themselves to vote to convict absolutely Willie. an onion. I understand what Casey's saying here and that there are republicans who hold that view We know seven people took a risk in terms of their own political career. Some of them were already not. They ve already decided that I got run again, so the risk was minimal, such minimal in some ways, but I think one of the things

we have to say is that that there is a cool there is there was a collision of two different America's that was evident in in this trial and that it wasn't about the facts: wasn't about guilt or innocence in some ways it felt it at least to me about the defence of a particular way of life, alongside of deep seated self political interest in and those things mix that become a deadly mix and interesting sorts of ways when it becomes when it comes to the safety, and insecurity of our democracy, this collision of two different America'S- is something that President President Biden will have to address. How do we talk the underlying values that connect these to America's. How do we begin to bridge? Because what we saw and what I am hearing out of the mouth of Senator Lindsey, Graham R folks, who hold a different view of what this country should be. And the trial of what we are in some ways in the trial, reflected that- and you know what it reminded me of

It reminded me of those trials in the context of the nineteen sixties in the south, where there, no concerned about guilt, no concern about the facts, only a defence of a way of life, that's what I felt. That's I saw, and we have to figure out how will want to address them. Facts were undeniable: they lived through them. They were in fact witnesses to the crime. You know the Le Maire Joe Biden, the White House, the press shop has taken pains over the last couple of weeks to change the subject. Whenever impeachment came off saying there focused on the code, relief bill and everything else that faces a new president at present I did way and on the acquittal saying that statement on Saturday in part quote. While the fight vote did not lead to a conviction. The substance of the charge is not in dispute, even those opposed to the conviction like Senate Minority leader Mcconnell, believe Donald Trump was guilty of a disgraceful, dare election of duty and pray,

Italy and morally responsible for provoking the violence unleashed on the capital Biden added this sad during our history has reminded us democracy fragile that it must always be defended and that we must be ever vigilant violence and extremism has no place in America and they Each of us has a duty and responsibility as Americans, and especially as leaders to defend the truth and to defeat the lies the statement from President Biden on Saturday so Jack a mere in some ways. It feels to people around Joe Biden like today begins the I'd administration, the cloud of impeachment that hovered over the first couple of weeks of his fur, the term here is gone. You can turn the corner and work on covert. Ninety relief, it really Joe Biden friend his entire candidacies, rebukes Donald Trump. They were careful throughout his campaign. Not just react everything Trump did they had a solid message: they wanted to return to normal, see returned to making it

what it always has been. What they wanted to be again- and we have seen at Saint Approach during this trial- were by May a point of saying studiously that he was ignoring the treaty was not watching it. Life course he was briefed. He saw, saw, highlights, but try to focus on the business of gum as much as he and his staff and Senate Democrats said they could do two things at watch. The trot could happen, but yet the White House could still respond to this pandemic. That has claimed nearly five hundred thousand american lives at this point they have worse, acknowledge privately this distraction. There was a moment on Saturday when it looked like Democrats, we're going to have witnesses in the trial extended his trial days. If now weeks, where there was real concern that this will continue to linger over. The administration would slow things down. It would put in jeopardy the timeline to get that covered relief bill done by MID March, now the White House. They say they didn't call over to the Senate and that the deal was struck, we're just and so I was submitted to the record in there was no witnesses and therefore the trial in IRAN,

Saturday anyway, so you're right today, the Biden Camp believes that there they can sort of start. A new he's got an aggressive schedules: weakest first official trips for travel, a town hall was constantly a visit to a Pfizer plant in Michigan later this week. His first virtual international summit also this week, and he is looking tend to move forward without everything being about President tromp, but there's also a limit here. They recognise that as much as Biden has wanted, bi partisanship, the Republicans seem like they're playing ball in the vote on Saturday reinforced just how bitterly divided this country is sure. Seven Republicans voted to convict President Trump by far the most any president has faced from members of his own party in a conviction vote, but this time. What's remember, Donald Trump famously

add that he shot he felt tat. He could shoot them on Fifth avenue and his followers would stay with him. Democrats now believe they charged him his words with leading to the deaths of five people, not one on fifth avenue, but five and the capital Republicans for the most part stayed with him and if our already sounding words like they're, not going to break with Donald Trump anytime soon, and therefore potentially not really help out this. Why house that's a concern? Joe Biden still has the fever. not broken. They don't believe there is clearly no break with president tromp after this impeachment boat, everybody stay right there, they're gonna, take a quick break still ahead, would calling with so have changed the outcome of the trial work here, how the house managers d their decision not to press that is for signs of progress in the fight against scope and the latest guidelines from the CDC on how to use, if we reopen schools, while they're not satisfying many pair

it's your watch him one day I'll be right back after a year of her Breakin hardships covert. Nineteen vaccinations are now available, but you might find yourself asking a lot of questions like. Where can you get the vaccine? How much does cost him. Do you need insurance, and are you even eligible One sure way to get your questions answered is to go to plan your vaccine, dot com and interactive tool, powered by NBC News and Comcast NBC Universal Burial find a state by state breakdown of where when and how to get your covert. Ninety vaccination make a plan You'll be ready when it's your turn go to. Plan Vaccines are calm today. Why didn't you vote to acquit I'll drop

but you cannot preach a former president. That's why we sort of unpaid tremble. For what I said, we couldn't well that logic pretzels out But what do you really think of Trump he's guilty of one person I ever met Evaporate city state boxes. Ass up now hold on that and monarch Parfois cracker crumbs, and here satellite lie with his take on Mitch Mcconnell after the vote on Saturday On Sunday, Senator Linsey Grand the real senator Linsey Grand set on Fox NEWS Republicans cannot take back Congress in twenty two. We too, without the help of former President Tromp Senator bilking city of Louisiana who voted to convict disagrees, is what both senator said yesterday

I spoke to him last night. He was grateful to those lawyers appreciated. They help at all of us, provided they know, he's ready to move on and rebuild? The republican party he's excited about twenty twenty two and I'm going to go down to talk with him next week play a little golf in Florida, and I said, the president. This mega movement needs to continue Do you, like the party trot plus the way back and twenty twenty two? man some folks, but I understand that. will. He remain in force in the Republican Party. What does that mean for the Republican Party? I think, is force wines. The Republican Party is more than just one person so Charlie sites? What an interesting dichotomy here inside the party Republicans made pretty clear side. They are, with that vote Saturday only seven of them voting to convict Donald Trump, but build capacity. Stepping out and voting guilty NASA

we don't really need Donald Trump as much as some of these other senators are telling you we do, what do you think Lindsey, Graham, is really determined because punch line in american history, isn't he but look. This is this. Is Would it be the defining the defining face of the Republican Party going going forward? Treating the capacity is right in the sense that when you get into the general election year it this party becomes more trumpet they're gonna continue to lose exactly the constituencies that have lost them. RO the centre laughing the drawbacks representatives, are going to continue to see an exodus of moderate, reasonable principle report they're gonna be losing in the suburbs that will continue to lose women, college educated, and I think that you're going to do Donald Trump engage in a revenge. Tour then

he's going to make good the split in the Republican Party even worse, and I do think that the mission cow speech was extraordinary meeting was clearly to base with clearly hypocritical, but he did step up. I got some things off with his chest and and then he made very clear was The dogs from me I've been acquitted, but it was not exonerated that he is still deeply damage. So here's the question you have These Republicans hid behind a technicality- none of them with exceptional wings, Graham defended Donald Trump, were praise down damaged goods? So it's going to be somewhat difficult for them. They will be able to without because this is where they are to turn around, say yes, but we support Donald Trump. We can be good for the country, mainly staff or more years, so this We ve been interesting test for this political party. Here is a real gap between you. institutional republic, party lists outlined by MRS Merkel, which is this move on from from the base rate

For the moment I think is sticking with without dropped by twenty two. Two is going to be a republican civil war, and I think I can have a problem in the general. Actions give they continue down this path thing to John major listening to Lindsey Grand speak there and over the last couple of weeks, you go back to the night of anyway, six, the knight of the attack on the capital when he pounded the rostrum and said Count out enough is enough. You quickly counted himself back at the side of former President Trump Where do you see this going that, whereas this divide, this was highlighted a couple of ago. In an interview with the Nicky Hayley and TIM Alberta, where she made a point of saying, we to move on. We shouldn't have followed president trump down the path of the big lie about the election, she also in that article over the course of a number of interviews, praise President Frampton has praised, and previously, in fact, a couple of weeks ago said we need to move on from what happened

on January six. This is that tension from people who want to run from people who worry about him running people who think they need his support if they want to hold. To win a new office, how does that play out with Donald Trump in the background? Yet no you view the laid out actually right or looking at CERN. Gram and the shift from the night of the sick two to. Whereas now reminds me of this, the bitten Tom saw You are aware so you're, says and evangelist came to town? Who was so good that even then was saved until Tuesday, the others this observe the theirs? brief brief enthusiasm for for conversion win.

The holding and keeping of power is the organizing principle, then everything else becomes a means to that end, and that's where human nature. tends to be, and it is very much where this had heard this phrase before, but the trunk plus idea, which Senator Graham said that, if that's the principle, then it's it's, it's not and a politically irrational thing to do what the Republicans were standing by trying to do. It is in fact politically rational the reference is, and this is what so interesting for all of us is. It may be politically rational, but it is. institutionally derelict and and I'm going to be very careful. But the way I used this work, it's morally its moral. a derelict- and I don't mean this in a wagging your finger way more

the root of the word moral is is not so much about right. Neuron is about custom. It's about the way we conducted, selves went when, after said in nineteen, thirty, two that pre eminently the presidency as a place of moral leadership. He meant you said a certain town and you you create an arena in which certain behaviors are acceptable and certain behaviors are not- and does that doesn't mean it there's all agreement its this is not about cancel called, This isn't about any of that. It is about the report, and lower case are arena in which we debate our differences and what the Republicans with tromp have decided, and this is not a partisan point- is purely a clinical one. is that he is key to their holding in keeping power and therefore it doesn't matter what he does, because without him

and his approval. They will not maintain their place in the temporal political order and that's because their over arching goal, and I don't think we have to over think this. But I do think is important is to remember that there is a vast part of the country that a Jew decade, this in November, and it's a sign of of of of trumps warping capacity for the country that we tend to free, that Joe Biden, one. The presidency with a margin higher than Harry Truman's higher than John Kennedys higher either a bill Clinton's. It wasn't me equally close election and modern political terms, and so I think too,

go to Lincoln a little bit here, since this presidency will have a full fulla dork fast, which is redundant because I'm done talking We have to decide for ourselves somehow some that we have an end. Is it's hard it's hard? we're doing it right now, right here? We are at an and I'm not saying, and we should, because, if you can't, if you don't talk about, and illness. If you don't treat an illness, you can't fix it right. You can't hear it. I would suggest to fascinated by fascinated by the seventy four million Americans who voted for trouble. many of those folks are unreachable. how many of them in privacy of the voting, both because I want to tell pollster. They don't want to admit to all of us that be, they were wrong and their rethinking this. But what part of that? Seventy four million are oh

to reason and evidence and opened a chain seeing their minds and if its twenty million that's a pretty significant shift in american politics and the question of a secret vote in the United States. Senate. What that might have looked like an updating, my John Mitchum Bingo Card, we ve got Huck FIN, Sdr, Lincoln and Obituary management and its are its early in the morning. Still, we are a long way to go in this game. John K, C, a Wall Street Journal editorial board calls it trumps non vindication. Writing in part the statements by said, Those who voted to acquit make clear that he escaped fiction, mainly perhaps only because he is no longer present. Mr trumped dishonest challenged the twenty twenty election, even after multiple defeats in court, clearly broke those bounds and culminated the January six riot Mr Trump May, and again, but he won't win

another national election. That's the view of the Wall Street Journal Editorial Board. Is that the view Casey of Senators fifties forty three of them who voted to acquit? President drop? In other words, don't they all believe. They Donald Trump will always be there and perhaps may run again now and twenty twenty four theirs, questions here Willie, I think the Wall Street Journal editorial answering the question about whether Donald Trump could ever win a general election and become president of the United States again, and I think it's it's likely that the asked majority of the republican senator who voted either way, believe that that's the case and these just and by Mcconnell that their there be criminal maybe criminal liability here and that he'll be held accountable, underscores that reality, but that's a completely separate question from what happens in primary elections, and this, of course

This is where Mcconnell and Trump are likely most at odds, because Donald Trump still incredible sway over the base? Voters in the park, is Charley was talking about and a lot of those who are the ones who vote in primaries so that base and if Trump is choosing primary election candidates. That's a legitimate threat if you're a member. Of the Senate. Who is up for election soon and its Why only one Republican LISA Mc Caskey, who is up in twenty twenty two for reelection, voted to convicts president drop. Nobody else who was in twenty two voted to convict, because terrified of such a price, a challenge and its partner. Why Mcconnell is so focused on this, because if he gets a bunch of very protein, candidates who are into conspiracy theories, then he's gonna have trouble running them against Democrats and Jonathan Wellmere. That's

my question for you, after having cover Donald Trump for so long. What do you think the role is maybe that he is actually gonna wanna. Taken this I realize he's very focused on the idea of revenge, but I've also had some people suggests to me that well perhaps he doesn't have the span to actual. We focus on this and dead done in a way that a serious threat to some of these Republicans, it's not clear what the net chapter, looks like four Donald Trump. First of all, he was uncharacteristically for him. Silence and disciplined during the trials is AIDS correctly got to him and said: look, you have the votes in the bag. Anything you do here could just mess it up and obsolete. Lack of his twitter account made it easier for them to impress upon him hey you're golf right now and don't worry about this bears a trial went on as we reported wrangler angry at the defence of his attorneys, but also the took these Republicans who did break from him, and we know he

has been in a rage since election day about republican officials. He feels like were defined. Him were insufficiently moil, but what happens? Next? What that looks like is unclear. There is talk of the president appearing before cameras, the former president appearing before cameras later this week, be having some sort of media event down in Florida? Certain Does a huge swathes of the relevant parties, the loyal to him and but he has shown in the past ability to soar. Dr fund raising and remained cool has a huge banking. he met. His email list is massive leave. He. is motivated to do this, he can't him had wanted to be relevant to play GNP kingmaker, whether foster or not, remains unclear I think there should be more scepticism reaction would one again in twenty twenty or whether he has the the appetite for another camp between one. If it ended in another Watson, he recently become a true time presidential election loser. Eddie. What looked over this? I wanted to get your sense of it. You, the Republicans out there

as you have satirist roses. Microcosm disrupts the example. This of the split it seemed like most, of course, are still going to be with him. We some rakowski as the deal I won facing voters anytime soon and she can also had a brain on attitude, but that's it to her in Alaska, a lotta Republican still very afraid of him works steps produce see as we use We were so nearly two years before twenty twenty two elections could Republicans due to cut a break We need to show their independence to test the waters of trying to get away from Donald Trump, and how do you think that'll be received by the rank and file republican voters. I M actually not sure Jonathan I mean I think they're soup seems to be. There could be some actual attempts to address the scale of the problem, that the nation faces, that the Republican Party could actually join with the binding administration and oppose part posts. Partisan way to it

press the devastation of covert nineteen to address the economic ills that we face to try to put the country in some ways on on a better path, perhaps engaging in the actual governance of of America, engaging in responding to the crisis that everyday ordinary people are facing, perhaps that that may do something to change. Folks, my but you're part of I've been trying to do is to how is to shift from a kind of truck navel, gazing too, stand that he symbolizes something, but he's not the substance of something but belies at something? thanks matters right, and so it is this if he symbolizes something. What is that and how might we the standard, apart from him rights, unless we want, as my mother would say, I'm glad to see the back of Donald Trump here. but we see that he still has some influence. What is the nature of that influence? What is the nature of what he symbol and it has everything to do what I think

grievance and resentment and hatreds that art necessarily reducible to cult like following that could in fact stand or continue beyond his political presence in some part of what trying to read my mind around. Even as I listened to my good friend John Nature is what do we do with the extent with this with this that the tat feeling out their monk. Seventy plus million folk who choose after four years of evidence to support this fellow because presents something he's symbolizes, something as opposed to their mindless call, Tisch followers, and I think that distinction has to be met. If we're going to understand where we are as a country. It seems to me that's it raising point eighty, because, if you think about it, Charlie sites put together what any saying and what John is saying here about those four million people who did vote for president from what they believe what he represents to them with him.

of office, but still, in the background, still on the scene, still threatening, perhaps to run again in twenty twenty four. What happens to that core group? What happens to the maybe not the full. Seventy four million, but the true die hard trump supporters do. Are they motivated politically. Are they going out in voting for candidates that Donald Trump supports? What does it look like with Frumps in power in many ways, but not technically and office? We don't know You know, Johns question has been won the truly sort of been haunting me. What percentage of those voters are incompletely unreal unreachable young? How do you have a conversation with somebody who won't acknowledge basic facts on who is basically no so deep into the alternative reality world? I don't, I honestly, don't know the answer to that. It's not seventy four million! You know things. Italy strikes me is that the Euro

working Party has had so many easy or France from trumpets I mean they could if they could have taken off ramp after the election. The vote over the weekend was an incredibly easy off ram. evidence was overwhelming of his guilt, but also it was Time to law and as is met, Mcconnell had to say, and yet they haven't chosen to do that. Dont know where this is going. One of the easiest thing in the Republicans could do in our yet there are marginal back, is to do with them. All languages to be a reactionary party to be the non Democratic Party due to simply say where an opposition to sort of pretend they care about fiscal responsibility and all of those things in this is the one thing that really animates right and I'm really only amicable. governing philosophy any longer. But but they are united in opposing liberal democratic policies, but problem is now they're gonna get caught up in this internal debate about Trump ISM. Nor are they going to pay

You don't break the nationalism. Are we going to continue a real against free trade is going to be the immigration party- it's not it's not clear because they could have, I think, just step inside. All right. We are the alternative to what is going on right now, but unfortunately, we have this sort of from being a cloud over their heads, they're not in a hurry to get rid of it and just I hear this more assault, channel him and remind everyone that present Trump lost the White House. He lost Republicans the house and he lost. This and it is well on the way to being impeach twice as a one term, President Charlie Sites. Thank you very much, John Mitchell. Thank you as well. We didn't pick up tee dome scandal on your bingo card, this morning's, it will let for more tomorrow when you join us giant good is there was always coming up impeachment over, but the former Present legal problem certainly are not. We will speak with former. U S attorney Joyce advance about that plus

latest on the pandemic. Scientists have said the british strain of the corona virus is more contagious, but is it also more deadly doktor Vince Gupta joins us next. Hey it's crusades as we go. My pack ass wise is happening all be talking with Aaron debate about the theory and practice of the minimum wage, a minimum wage hikes. It turns out that for some employers, if you actually the forest and pr which you may end up having more workers, and that sounds kind of crazy, because why would you have more workers will have to pay higher wage? It's because if you are completely constrained by that supply of workers- that. How many workers are willing to take this really enough, maybe not such a great job. Well, I have to pay higher wage? I'm not happy about that, but I can get more workers because actually wanted to Filmore vacancies before anyway. So what I ended up doing is partly reduced seeing the number of vacancies is poised to killing jobs that this week on wisest

running search for wise is happening. Reverie listing right now and subscribe. Donald Trump was acquitted in his impeachment trial, but he still faces legal threats. The Wall Street Journal reports, the men DA's offices zeroing in on the financial dealings of the former presidents Manhattan properties. Prosecutors are examining loans, Trump took out on several properties, including the signature, Trump Tower and ART deco skies or a New York cities, financial district and a hotel in condominium building at Columbus Circle investigation is latest in Manhattan District attorney, Cyrus advances probe into the Trump organizations business dealings there. Also, could be investigations in Washington DC into the capital riot and president from could face criminal or civil charge is there in Georgia Price

Peters are investigating trumps efforts to pressure state election officials to overturn that states vote journeys now former. U S attorney for the northern district of Alabama and MSNBC Legal Analyse, Joyce Vance Joyce, it's great to see you. We heard this directly for Mitch Mcconnell after he voted to acquit. He said. Yes, I voted to acquit, but I will leave it to the court's now too with all the evidence that we just heard during this impeachment trial. So if you were Donald Trump where would you be looking first for your greatest exposure in the greatest threat? Mitch. Mcconnell was pretty quick to kick that can down the road to the Justice Department, recognising that there were two different purposes serve by impeachment in the criminal justice system, but moving past that for the minute, because we have to The former president faces a real three rang circus here, each of these districts and the press

Haitians going on poses a real threat to him intently some cases. Certainly in New York there appear to be both criminal prospects from the state and from the federal government. So let's talk a little bit about or will it because the statute down there seems tailor made for the president's conduct and, of course, its on tape, which is something that skeeters like to have when they talked injuries that charge would be something in the area of solicitation of the Georgia Secretary of State who engage in election fraud with the former president, who is very specific here. for precisely the number of votes that he would need to. When the state of Georgia to be found for him. So it's on tape. You play it the jury and then what happens the charge down, there could be a misdemeanor or it could be a felony depending on how its charge if it's a felony. The sentencing as from one to three years this would be a first time.

offences nonviolent offence, so it would be up to the state court judge. Whether he went subject, the former president to prison or do some kind probation, but that looks like a very real prospect. One cow, the on the evidence, has to be developed in the course of an investigation, sometimes exculpatory evidence that you don't expect turns up, and this is now fast process. You have to use a grand jury. You have to use subpoenas, it's not to say that process. there's are moving slowly, but the process itself is not that's designed for speed, so we're not looking. I don't think it's something in the next thirty, sixty days Some of the New York investigations look like their further along. Certainly notorious southern district of New York case involving Michael Cowan, where the former President is individual number one

State of Georgia. The president infamously asking defined eleven thousand seven hundred eight votes, which was one more votes than he would have needed swing that election in his direction, you mentioned New York, there's just so much swirling their choices and was hard to sift through it. All others. astrogation into the Trump Organization there's investigation into real estate dealings and tax fraud. Where is the big problem. Is you see it for former president Trump? York in his home city? The biggest problem is that site Vance, the Manhattan district attorney has opened a can of worms, and once you start investigating one area of the Trump organizations work you dont have to put on board, under. So if, in the course of investigation, other instances of potential criminal conduct come to light then the investigation follows the evidence. It doesn't just focus on the the crime that you identify at the outset, so it looks like

in Manhattan where they ve been out this for a few years. Now, then, something teeth and some variety of fraud, can be a real problem for the president because of Billowy get paper that backs up these of allegations No one should pretend that these cases are easy. They almost ways turn on wilfulness, are intent and that's it actually means that prosecutors have to jump into the mind of the defendant and prove that they were doing, was something that they intended to do that it wasn't simply a mistake or something that was, done inadvertently that you cheated on your taxes on purpose, not because you got that numbers wrong as the result of an accident. So these case again or not straightforward, Jonathan Le Maire. There is then, of course, the case in washing indeed see where the attorney general has signalled that that office may look into President's role into the attack on the capital

January sex and do what the Senate could not do, which is to go after president from strongly there and ass. The one will We're Donald Trump and his associates have been most keenly worried about since he left office there no that in his final days ass president, some of the half hearted measures. He took those marital videos he put out when he finally condemned the vial Those were down at least one eye on trying to reduce his legal exposure. That AIDS had told him last council told him that he could be held legally responsible for for what happened at the capitals enjoys. Let's just go there, you provided right now on the other cases would walk, is true. Then, what's the matter in Washington DC? How likely do you think it is? The present could face charges. Would they be? And if you know solvency protecting down the road a little bit here, but like how vulnerable, he is something that could actually materialise. What sort of penalty with her judgment could he face?

So I think it's extremely likely that there will be an investigation. It's always tough to prejudge the result of an investigation, but as with the White Collar some charges in New York. Again, if we're looking at something in the District of Columbia, that's in the sort of spaces of crime that involves incitement to insurrection or a conspiracy to incite insurrection. Again, you have to with this state of mind issues and what the press, the former president, intended to do, which is you Jonathan as why he made all of these sorts of exculpatory statements after that act when he realized he might have found himself in the crosshairs of law enforcement, the most compelling piece of Parents about Donald Trump State of mind is his action than the insurrection as it was unfolding reports that

he was delighted, his failure to take steps to stop it, and even when he was confronted by Kevin Mccarthy and told that they were his supporters in the capital that he was, the only person who can stop. It Didn't act in the moment. That's the sort of evidence that, when a jury hears it and the judge tells them that they can in first state of mind from Someone's reactions to events could be very compelling but again, I'm gonna hedge. My bet, because prosecutors have the obligation of proven on beyond reasonable doubt to a jury and the federal principles of prosecution. Tell price here. There is not to indict unless they have sufficient that means evidence that's admissible in court and it has to be sufficient evidence to obtain a conviction and also to sustain it on appeal. That means proof. Beyond reasonable doubt. That's

thing that really can't be subject to a different interpretation. That's exculpatory to the president, so low. I'm bullish on this case I mean I have to be honest and say that if I was in the investigation. I'd be chomping the bit, there's a lot of good evidence, but it's far from a sure thing. Thing intent is tough, dose of reality, one difference from impeachment that you'd have a jury. At least it had not pledge, many of them their allegiance to the defence. Former? U S attorney Joyce, that's great! as it is always good to see you still haven't morning Joe, we will talk to house impeachment manager, Madeline DE about the decision not to call witnesses even after the Senate voted to allow this morning just coming right back