The progress reported in peace talks between ukraine and russia, but with continued russian shelling and a history that shows Vladimir Putin can not be trusted moscow's pledge to scale back. It's military activity has met with major skepticism letters from the Biden white house and from the battlefield in ukraine plus the mornings. Other big stories were covering questions of whether donald trump used burner phones to hide conversations he had, while the capital was under attack and another russian If you're listening moment will have for you, each and chris rock said to take the stage first time since oscar night good morning and welcome the morning joe, it's wednesday march thirtieth Joe has the morning off willie, let's dive right in

make a good morning. You said that there is some scepticism, but more than a month into russia's invasion of ukraine, the first significant signs of progress are being reported in peace talks between the two countries. Representatives met for more than three hours in turkey. Yesterday, following weeks of fighting in those talks, ukrainian officials reportedly agreed to declare their country a permanently neutral, abandoning any hope of joining nato and agreed to discuss, possibly conceding some of their own territory, which russia already has claimed for itself. In exchange, a group of outside nations would provide quote security guarantees to ukraine in the event of a future attack. This hypo adequate group, which would could include the united states reportedly, would commit to providing ukraine with a million, parade and a no fly zone. Unclear, however, if any, outside nations have sign onto this guarantee or

ever woods and make it easier very broad, strokes. Here they had a meeting a good meeting for three hours, but obviously there is no trust at this point from ukraine. To russia, given what we ve seen over the last month During those talks, Russia also vowed to significantly scaled back military operations near keys, and the northern ukrainian city, but that announcement has been met with so much scepticism from the united states, and ukraine. They ve seen movie before a wider, official confirms a small number of russian troops are moving away from keys, but says it may be just an indication of Putin. lasting from its original plan, and that skull. Maybe simply repositioning here is what president and and members of his administration had to say. I don't read anything into until I see what their actions are. If they follow through with their suggested, we're going to continue to keep strong sanctions where we can do they provide

created military with their capacity to defend themselves and we're going to continue to keep a close eye on. What's going on. nobody should be fooling ourselves kremlin's now. Recent claim will suddenly just reduce military attacks near keys or any report. It is going to withdraw its forces Has there been some movement. By some russian units away from Keith in the last day or so yeah. We think so. Small numbers but we believe that this is a repositioning, not a real, withdraw and that we all should be prepared to watch for major offensive against other areas of ukraine. There is one russia says

Andrew is what russia does and focused on the latter, and what russia is doing is the continued brutalization of ukraine and it's people that continues as we speak. and I'm retired, four star navy, admiral and former NATO Supreme allied commander James to Rita's, he's chief international security and diplomacy, analyst for NBC news and MSNBC former us ambassador to ukraine. Bill taylor is with us and white house bureau, chief at politico, jonathan le Maire, he's the host of to early admirals to readers. I'll start with the key question here and that it is, russia has said what it said, but what would be the proof that the west, good clean out of. I don't know satellite images or other end agents ways what would be the way to find out that there might be proof that this scale back actually happening. Well,

start Mika with the tower of lies that we dealt with from the russian. So you start from a position of extreme scepticism is, as you well know, number two focus your overhead Amy tree, so that is in fact satellite capability in that optical it infrared you can see. Movements are based. Engines moving on the ground. So there are many technical means, as the intelligence community would say, number three: you talk to the ukrainians. There. On the ground dear fighting their inner mixed with many of these russian units, and they ve been doing a turk the job obviously of destroying unit. They also know where the units are so you're, also using that level of intelligence it you're getting boots on the ground eyes in front of those troop formations. So you use in all of that intelligence and then finally meagre you're, all

monitoring communications, and we don't want to get into depth on all that, but there are certainly capability there and you put all that together intelligence, you know it's not like taking photograph intelligence is like building a mosaic, you're kind of putting a piece here, a piece there you put it. Together. We have pretty good indication, I'm confident will a good site picture on what directions? Actually do? That's what's important here, and ass it or tailor. The russians are not negotiating from the position of strength. They probably thought they would be a month or so ago. Given the way this invasion has failed in so many ways given the railing at the west and the collapse of the russian economy because of those sanctions. So if you are on the ukrainian side of that negotiation for those three hours in turkey s today, why, for example, would you agree at this point to say will remain neutral? We will never join nato. We will never hosts nato forces on our soil. What

be your stance in your position. If you were in the ukrainian side of negotiation so. The ukrainians are very sceptical, but the ukrainians are also thinking how they can provide for their own security. They are thinking. How can they be sure that they won't be attacked and again in the future? They thought for a while for some time? Nato was the answer to that question that they they thought that if they joined nato, like the pause, like the lithuanians like the historians that they couldn't have kind of collective security button? now concluded that that's not in the cards in the immediate future, so they look for something else, some other way to provide for their security, they're. Looking for other models and a mile and might be like Austria. Austria is a member, european union is not about of nato, but it does security there and it was with the austrian law. Can. This is what the ukrainians are figuring out, this their own

Population is their order. Idea about, provided that they this is true neutral status which they are considering? They want guarantees, They want guarantees from other nations that, if they are in again that they will We supported that that these other guarantor nations will send troops and will send aircraft to to move in ukraine. so that's what they're looking for? That's, that's that's the way they could provide for their security, so admiral survey to see where the supreme outline commander of nato. What is your understanding of this sort of alternate collective security force that may be put in place again? We should underline this is all hypothetical right now these are early early discussions, but if it's not nato, the united states, germany and other countries to come in and protect ukraine in the event of a future attack to establish a no fly zone. What is that group of nations look like to you? I think it is

built out of the nato nations, but you might also went to consider neutral nations themselves I'll. Give you two to think about one finland in one is Sweden. Both tremendous military capability. They deployed alongside NATO but they're, not formal members of the alliance. I think you then in the mix, then you use, certainly are going to want to bring in either the british or the french. They have nuclear capability that matters and then Third and finally, I think the united states is gonna, be there the secure the blanket if you work for the ukrainians, if I were negotiating on the ukrainian side, that would be so. Quite non that, above all else, gotta have the. U s involved in those security guarantees, so that would framework that I think would be under discussion. They'll be many permutations of it, but I'd start kind of with that nix

jostle Amira? Take us three or new reporting, a great peace and political body administration, scepticism of russia's claims, and also you, officials now reviewing their own intelligence assessments to determine how they could have badly misjudge the strength of the russian military, so the russians are bad and we're trying to figure out how we didn't know how bad they were. And let me add another question too: this is there a clause in this that perhaps no one and how good the ukrainians would be others. the question of that miki? Let's start with the skepticism that we just played sound there from another top administration officials. All at this, a senior administration official told me this about not believing what russia saying quote. They have lied about everything else. Why should we start believing them now, and they do think this that that this is an effort for russia to to Tobias

in time. It could be using to resupply redeploy their troops. There is no evidence of russian forces going back to russia, the rather just shifting around within ukraine. It does seem like they're, focusing more perhaps on the the donbass region, the crimea region, if they can control that they would go into negotiations from a position of more strength than they currently have, but they, the president in a phone call with the leaders of italy. The uk, germany and france yesterday really urge allies to keep the pressure up to keep the weapons and equipment flowing to ukraine to not take their foot off the gas, because there's no reason to believe russia here and in fact they Want to see more signs of progress before president Biden would step in here, potentially with a call with president putin, which a lot of analysts believe is a step that is going to need to happen before this war comes to an end. The! U s says we're not doing that, yet they have to earn We have to see signs that russia is serious about adding this war before the president nine seats,

phone and ass for the assessment of the russian military. Vladimir Putin certainly misjudge the strength of his own forces and it seems like the united states did as well. In fact, as we report this morning, they begun a review as to how they could have gotten this wrong. They certainly thought russia was a far more fearsome foe that it turns out there We are, and certainly also underestimated, the ukrainians, as you say, that the the the level of fight, the level of spirit, the resistance that they're fighting for their homeland and, of course now fortified is allied weapons and equipment helping their cause, but certainly The russian military turn into a bit of a paper tiger. Here: u s doing its own and intelligence assessment

not another reminder why ukraine in united states, dont trust russia and some new satellite images from the besieged ukrainian see Mary opel show a shocking scale of devastation. We haven't quite seen before this is the grim reality faced by thousands of civilians who still remain in that city. The images release yesterday by u s based technology for max are show entire residential areas just wiped out. Some images show hundreds of civilians lining up outside a grocery store. Ukrainian officials have said more than one hundred thousand residents are trapped, that seaside port, food or water and still facing relentless russian bombardment. The images also show what is left of the mare pupil, drama theatre that was bombed earlier this month. Facial say at least three hundred people were killed there,

it says the city council yesterday alleged more than seventy civilians from a maternity hospital were deported to russia by force. Nbc news has not been able to independently confirm that claim. Just yet joining us. Now from western ukraine, NBC news national, corresponding gabe Gutierrez in LE vivre gave good morning there was an air raid siren in la vie where you are, but an hour ago, while you are on the air with Jonathan on way too early, obviously still on high alert at all times there. Yeah, that's right where they get morning. We ve gotten the all clear from that area siren, but it has become a way of life, even here in western ukraine, considered relatively safe compared to other parts of the country which you just mentioned, Mary opel, of course, a city that local officials say still has more than one hundred sixty thousand residency cranium president's linsky, seeing that more than ninety percent of the buildings in Mary opel have either been damaged or destroyed now willie over the past

several hours. The governor of church me his that's that city just north east of key that the russians conceded that they would be. They claim that there are pulling back some of their forces from there. The governor of that region says it shelling continued in that city overnight and that shelling continued in the outskirts of key. Of course, president skillets Zalewski saying that they, the fighting, continues in other parts of the country the show it continues in hark even the northeast and, as I mentioned in Mary opel, so that feeds into this scepticism that many ukrainians feel that this is just a repositioning of russian forces. The british minister of defence also saying that some russian forces have gone back to russia and also to Bela ruse being forced to resupply. So certainly a lot of questions about where this is going from here. In all this, really, as the fighting continues towards the east and the south. The! U, when this morning saying that the number of refugees leaving ukraine has now top four million active four million, and mrs gill boot here is in levine. Ukraine gave thanks so much. Let's get a national security analyse for me, see news and MSNBC Clint. Why tease at the big board for us again this morning? So clint help us if he would put all this together? What we just heard about mary you, bull about attacks missile attacks in the western part of the country and a repositioning as the pentagon is now calling it of russian troops with a focus on the eastern part of the country

that's right! Willie things have changed dramatically. If you just look at the first month where we saw the start, we saw lots of red advancing everywhere, then we three. We start to see the russian stall and now look here. You see lots of blue equally in the north. That's where we're talking animals have read, as others here been talking about. What are the russians really doing? We watch our actions. They say what we have seen is the ukraine and military fighting back in all three of these sectors. getting causing losses, pushing back the russian military things. question now is is russian military, which is now dug in some of these positions along here, are the he's trying to whole grounds. They can resupply or is part of what might be a retrograde type operation where they slowly send some forces back, but others to block and essentially defend. That does not me that they will leave either. As you said there going up to belarus that can be going

their resupply refitting to later bring those shoes back because they ve been an action for up to a month. The big part of this that is indicative across all of the russian efforts is they wanted to encircled, but in each one of these from chinese reversed out in this access from sue me failed to encircle kiev and if you cannot encircle keep, they cannot what they did and mary opel. I think that's where Story really goes for the russian military now battle the hot spots are in and around ism what they were to deal with their trying to do is focused more combat power. So I think one of the things we should look for and the next week to two weeks is: do they say some? These forces that are overhearing keep moving out around and then start resupply more manpower and equipment, in this region is gm. Is this key battle right here? Where you can essentially, the russians are trying to bring together. Of these axes here from the north down and head into lou hearts. Remember for russia. Lou

hans was initially the reason they possibly we're going to go in to take over this dumbass region out here. So the question might be. They had big aims in the beginning. Maybe keith problem trying to go after odessa, those seem to be lost, but can they essentially sealed this corridor here? brings us to the big picture when you to the south. This is where they initially had success again,. finding the ukrainian military fighting back a meek alive go labors where the ukrainian navy essentially went crimea was invaded there Losing ground again so instead, I think that, as we soon back out you're seeing a battle space, it looks very different. I think you're seeing russia really concentrating their combat here and there questions about manpower again. But the russian military seems did not want to jump into the plight of form flow has been very slow, really just a trickle? Some forces, maybe from hezbollah, Syria, ex they're bringing mercenaries with that's a drop in the bucket for this fight and

Scripture comes up again in russia on well first and there's some indication inside russia that units are either refusing to fire. Dont want to show up, and even the russian military leaders are saying they would not throw conscripts into hotspots. Thinking two days of that conscription level says about the same and doesn't really jump up could end that russia's going from maybe a smaller portion of cream and that what they initially thought or where they were going to try and pull off. so admirals to read this clearly. Amid these claims of scaling back I think it's universally believe that russia did not expect to be in this situation, that it is and now that blood am repute and did not expect to still be fighting so hard. Now, can you talk a little bit about the difference between the ukrainian fighters, who are still Looking for weapons and worrying Mary, a pole will fall on the mantle of day versus the russian fighters. In terms

understanding and believing in the mission how much that matter in a fight like this, it's everything in think of yourself. All of us should consider what we I feel like if we were on the front lines that this battle, if you're, ukrainian, who is behind you, your children, your spouse, Parents, your elders, your cities, your civilization, you are utterly motivated in that fight. go to the other side of the battlefield. Think that the russians any of them conscripts all of them look behind them. What a day see well first, they might see Dead, general back there, because nine generals had been killed, kind of unheard of in a conflict with this. So here seeing that coherency of chain of command. Indeed, behind you who do you see? You see the smiling face of vladimir putin, not exact

an inspirational figure that you are willing to march into battle and die for. So it's a tough, of two morales and the ukrainian score highly. Now, let's face it, weapons play in all this and that's why our job in the west harness that fighting spirit of the ukrainians by giving them the tools to finish the job the story of the next few months. I think so as a retailer. As these negotiations continue, president Zelensky continues as the united states and other countries in the west, particularly in europe, for more arms for more. He continues to ask for a no fly zone to close the sky as he puts it. So what position does that put president Biden in from your point of view as someone who has shuttled between these two countries? What is the relationship right now and what more, if anything, can the united states be doing in this moment?

the will of the united states, just as animals arena said, does have a big responsibility to provide these weapons. The spigot as wide as it can go ingredients nude ammunition? They ve been now for over a month, and they ve been fighting fiercely and that takes a lot of ammunition is also required. Additional armoured vehicles, it all requires additional stingers to go after the aircraft so. We need to provide that kind of military support and is not just swiftly. It's also our allies. It's also frank other nations that have the kind of equipment that Ukrainians know how to use and that we can help get that equipment there. I have been talking to the folks in the pentagon, who are you that work and they are working flat out to provide it why and move and provide those weapons. So that's what we really need to do. It needs to be an all out. Effort it needs be

of nato and a new to be sustained because as mad as emeralds just said. This is to be a longer grind and the ukrainians are using that equipment well, but they're using it they're using an intensely. So we need to provide this support. Right still our morning, Joe for more than seven hours, while our nations capital was under attack last year, there is no record of any calls made by then present trump how's, that well, since everyone saw him on the phone were digging. the details about that concerning gap and what form national security adviser John Bolton, is saying about burner. Phones plus, remember this moment rush. If you listening, I hope, you're. Well defined. The third thousand emails that are missing Donald trump brazenly asking.

russia to release information about Hillary Clinton. Emails now he is soliciting help again, but this time he wants dirt on the Biden family from Vladimir putin in the middle of a war, watching morning, Joe we'll, be right back

we'll keep up with the actions of russian president? Vladimir Putin's military in its war of aggression, to keep up with the insurrection was a blatant attempt to use force to destroy american democracy, and the ruled won't keep up with the supreme court is fundamentally reactionary. Institution in american life has been through most of it keep up with what matters keep up with Gris all in with Chris Hayes weeknights at eight eastern on MSNBC, and why is this happening? The Chris Hayes podcast new episodes every tuesday, wherever you get your podcasts, you may be able to help solve a mystery. Can you help bring a missing person home if anyone saw something to come forward? I'm josh musicals and I'm andrea canning, and this is dateline. The missing in america in each episode will focus on one missing person that listened closely as we tell these stories and follow the clues that could lead you to help crack a case. Dateline missing in america. Listen now wherever you get your podcasts

blood shot of the white house. A twenty seven pass. The our former president donald trump has praised vladimir putin as savvy and a genius during Russia's invasion of ukraine now asking Putin for dirt on president Biden, son hunter. one thing while I'm on your show, has long sport. Now is not exactly a fan of country Let me explain where did because Chris wallace wouldn't let me ask the question: why did The mayor of Moscow's wife The violence both of em three, five million dollars and that's a lot of money game three and a half million dollars So now I would think wouldn't would know the answer to that. I think you should really sit. I think we should know that answer now. You will get the answer from ukraine, but

Why are they giving somebody. who knows nothing about energy. One hundred and eighty seven thousand dollars a month plus a three million dollar upfront payment, well even talk about china because they haven't got into Taiwan yeah that'll, be next why did the mayor of Moscow's wife gave them family three and a half million dollars. Nobody was asked the question and Chris wallace, whose at all lightweight, unlike his father, who interviewed me for sixty minutes was actually good piece mike. What it was great, he wants to be my wireless, but he doesn't have the talent. But why is it that the mere maskos wife gave the Biden families rain has made us Putin now would be willing to probably give that answer. I'm sure he knows a factual The payments, the former president, is referring to come from my highly critical

As for republican, led senate report released just two weeks before twenty twenty election it maintains that lana but arena the widow of Moscow's former mayor wired, three point: five million dollars to affirm that was associated with hunter Biden. The report did not show that hundred Biden received any of that money. In addition your Biden. Legal team has long claim that he had no interest in the firm and was not paid any of the money in question. Trumps. Claims that knows something about the payments the russian president has previously said he was unaware of any business ties between hunter Biden and better arena. one thing trump failed to mention. According to reports, Tromp himself was seeking out this with the former mayor of moscow back in the late. Nineteen nine days he had pageants pageant there is very involved

with russia, but at this point and thus their bill taylor, since you were their dream His first debacle, where the president wanted to get on the political rival from presidents landscape, yours, and what you just heard from the former president of the united states will make We know that in the summer of two thousand and nineteen there was discussion of additional weapons for ukraine. We know that the united states had been providing these javelin missiles. The trip illustration, through its grave, have been providing these javelin missiles that were very effective. As we know, as we are now seeing how effective these javelins are, and there was, there was interest on the ukrainians. I was there at the time.

We are very interested in additional weapons, there's no javelins and there was a phone call where they have this conversation with president trump. We ask for support for the sale of vertical and, as we know at present, trump asked or vapor on the same topic of investigations into his political rival. In the end, weapons went thank goodness. They were held up for a period of time, which was troubling for the ukrainians. In the end, these weapons with theirs we see, are now putting the great use against the russians, so jai from a mere make it just said it. Lattimer Putin has already addressed this unsubstantiated claim about this payment. He did it in october, twenty twenty on the eve of the presidential election. In fact, if you look at the interview he effectively wrote about this

He waved it away and now it's it's worth stopping and taking stock in the middle of what we're watching in russia, not only to doubt from watch the horrors of what we're seeing ukraine and say. I quote. This is genius and say this is wonderful, but now Taking the side of lattimer prudent, saying, let's exploit the way lead putin, feels about the united states right now and get him to give me. This vented dirt. That came out of a report authored by RON Johnson of wisconsin. We know we're not shocked anymore by donald trump at the things he said during this work, I think rise to that level.

It is hard to be shocked by him, but this is so golly. It's just so galling. Not only are there echoes of that twenty sixteen moment where he openly asked russia for help, and we know thanks to the mueller report, it was that night that the gr you started, dumping accessing some of those hacks wiki leaks, the Clinton emails that they were seemed like they were responding to what trump asked echoes, of course, as ambassador taylor just said of two and a half years ago, and his efforts to get dirt on the biden's by extortion of ukrainian president Zelensky, and now do so during the war lot of approval is committing war crimes. United states has guaranteed that putin and the russian soldiers are committed war crimes, and yet trump is asking him for it It is truly staggering and admirals treatise. Just want to get your ears taking a step back here, just yours of how damaging this all is in terms of wait where its trump and some other voices on the right include the conservative media, who still seem sort of sympathetic

to the russian cause. Where we know those video clips are being circulated on state tv in russia, and just how does this undermine what war effort here to hear some of these, the former president I'd states openly the latter prudent, Ralph it's the wrong message at the wrong time and, particular I'm struck by president trump saying that president Britain is a genius, a genius? Why is his invasion failing so publicly so broadly? Why did he so complete? We overestimate the capabilities of his generals. Why is he mortgaging the future of his nation by cracking its economy? Why is he turning to other authoritarian nations around the world to contain trade with russia. None of them it's gonna work. It's gonna diminishes nation. He is thing, but a genius and for

senior. U s political figures to call him. A genius is shot in the extreme and he's also, as you say, Jonathan, a moral failure. He is someone who has committed war crimes throughout his career, if you will but syria to what is going on now are you need to do, is look at a photograph of mary opel. You know everything you need to know about Vladimir Putin. He is not a genius he's as far from it as I can age, a human being being for all the republicans who went on sunday, shows them and try to sort of pass by. What trump said about taking dirt from a political rival in exchange? For you know, they set out here? You won't do it again into its ok. He's learned his lesson: clearly he hasn't, and ever will return. navy, admiral james to breeders and former. U s ambassador to ukraine bill taylor thing

both very much for coming on once again this morning and coming up the other big story this morning about donald trump about burma. balance and a big gap in the former presidents call logs on a very important day were digging into the latest reporting on what tromp was doing while his sword supporters stormed the capital hey there, I'm joshua Johnson, the host of now tonight streaming show on NBC news now. That's now available as a protest now tonight takes your questions about the big issues of the day, and we share your stories about how those issues affect you know pundits, just smart conversations where everyone is welcome. Soaps

Why do the pod task now tonight with Joshua Johnson and our show, every week night at eight p m eastern on NBC, makes now August continues to head off with more pivotal primaries on MSNBC on election, tuesday's steel community will break down the races, then, the day after morning, jewel will discuss what the result could mean for november primary election coverage on MSNBC six forty in the morning in Washington DC son, just about to come up their investigators and in January six committee say they are working to account for more than seven hour gap in the phone logs of former president donald trump on the day of the capital attack internal white house phone calls obtained by the washington post and by CBS news found a chunk of time. Miss between eleven seventeen em and six the four p m, which

It's the duration, of course, of the attack, as opposed to reports. That gap contradicts extensive public reporting on phone calls the president had with allies. During that time we know he was on the phone not included in the logs calls the president made to SEN Mike Lee and to house minority leader Kevin Mccarthy. The post quotes two people with knowledge of the investigation saying the committee is looking into whether trump communicated through back channels, phone aids or by burner faults properly to stay me yesterday that claims quote I have no idea what a burner phone is. so my knowledge, I've, never even the term and quote. However, according to the watching imposed his former national security adviser john bull, speech that claim Thirdly, saying in the interview he were calls tromp using the term burner phones and several discussions

when reportedly said, he and trump have spoken about how people have used them to avoid having their calls scrutinized, joining us now, NBC news, senior, capitol hill, correspondent, garrett, hague, so Garrett we're talking about seven and a half hours of missing phone logs. Here we for example, that he was on the phone with united states senators members of congress. Why does this fit into the puzzle that the january six committee is putting together? with all due respect to the washington post me and my colleague, Lee and caldwell reported this hours long gap back in February that basically, after the rally on the ellipse, there were no phone records for donald trump. For most of the rest of the day, and the committee thought then and think now that there are essentially three possibilities, you that hurts themselves were tampered with

Or that the former president found some other way to make these calls, whether on the phones of aids on other cell phones, that we don't know about you name it now. Look donald trump is not stringer bell. I think the possibility of a burner phone here is relatively low. Anybody who is around trump or who covered trump knew he would sort of grabbed the phones of aids grabs a photo of somebody else who was in the conversation with incoming and outgoing calls kind of all flowed through him and that's viewed as perhaps the more likely possibility here. But the committee also knows at the end of the day what he wasn't doing during this time period. It's the it's the key to their whole thesis year. He wasn't doing anything to call off the attacks to stop the riot to stop the attack and that's been central to their sort of public facing messaging on this all along, but getting to the bottom of that is going to be key and they may get some help from it. This week they are expected to talk to Jared Kushner, the president's son in law and senior aide on thursday. That's the closest to the inner circle around trump on that day that the committee's gotten really and

the opposite. We know he was cheering on the attacks and was flattered by what he saw by his supporters. Stay with us, Gary Jonathan la mere want to go to you and this as well. I'm thinking back to watergate and the infamous eighteen and a half minutes that were missing from those tapes which became notorious in history. Of course, there are about seven and a half hours now of missing phone logs, where we know from, port again from what members of congress have told us that donald trump, of course was on the phone all day. Get here that in most of that day after he returned from the rally he held it, the lips in the PLO private dining area off the oval office. As it we reported he's worries, got bank of televisions and he watched the chaos the capital unfold, and we know he spoke to. He tried to call centre to reveal and end up getting senator Lee. Instead, we know he spoke to Kevin Mccarthy. That's when he told Mccarthy that clearly the writers and love their country more than he did, because he wouldn't stand up for trumps false.

election claims. We know that people going in and out of the oval office, some as close as aids and putting his daughter and senior visor avant or trump other members who is inner circle, gooding chief of staff mark meadows with going in and out, and we certainly know that meadows is receiving all sorts of text messages from Republicans and even concerted media figures and to try to get the president tromp too, then present interim to tell the riders to knock it off a garret. My question to you is Yes and let's set aside the idea of a burner phone, this isn't something that Donald trump went to the mall and picked up one of those things. But yet we know that you know he would use his aides phone sometimes, but also he would simply use his personal cell phone. He would rarely use the white house switchboard operator. He would use his personal cell phone. Can investigators get that phone? Can investigators get the call logs from Donald trump's personal cell phone? I think that's going to

enormous challenge I mean you, look at the things that the investigators have run up against legal challenges. Law suits on thus far the biggest hurdles they've had have been on questions of phone records, whether they be phone records of someone like Stephen miller, who they've tried to get and run up against the fact that he was on a family plan at the time or when they go after lawmakers, have cell phone records that might catch other conversations that aren't part of what they're. Looking for we've not been able to confirm any specific effort to go after Donald trump's personal cell phone number. It would certainly make sense in the contours of their investigation, but this is another one of those things where, if you're going to get bogged down in months and months of legal battles when the time is so short, maybe go after this information on other ways. I've thought for a long time that the meadows text messages are kind of the rosetta stone for this entire investigation. What meadows was saying on that day and to whom kind of translates for what Donald trump was up to the committee may feel like that's enough, we just don't know

making of garrett. A group of Democrats is putting pressure on the supreme court, justice, clarence, thomas too excuse himself from any cases involving the january six to insurrection. Nearly two dozen congressional democrats have sent a letter to chief justice, John Robertson, justice, thomas, quoting quote demanding answers regarding justice, Thomas s, potential violation of federal ethics law, this kind, just days after it was revealed that just as thomas s, wife, republican activist Jenny Thomas sent text messages to former chief of staff mark meadows where she said the pressure him into efforts, to change the outcome of the twenty twenty presidential election justice, Thomas was the only dissenting votes in a supreme court ruling earlier this year requiring that trump white house records be turned over to january six house select committee, the law makers, one a written explanation as to why

he did not reduce himself from the case. They also ass chief justice roberts to quote: impose a ban. Winning code of conduct on the supreme court. The only court country not currently subject subjected to age It shall code of ethics, it's a curse. does not act democratically ready to hand let themselves by cameras. Group of law makers have renewed calls for the supreme court ethics act, judicial a committee chair, a senator dick durban of illinois is a co sponsor of the bill. We've been waiting a long time. The supreme court has not been cooperative or it's one of the few areas of federal government that is not governed by an ethics code. I think that's long overdue. Karen hague. Isn't this about the credibility of the supreme court? I mean, isn't it on the line here? How is it that just thomas hasn't been subject to more scrutiny given

His wife's text, messages to mark meadows and even the allusion to him supposedly positively. In the text messages when she says that she's gonna be talking to her best friend and, of course, that's what has that husband my team call each other their best friends. I mean I don't know who else she could be talking about. Maybe she could be talking about her best girlfriend. Who knows, I doubt it isn't it worth asking some questions and ultimately is the credibility of the supreme court at stake here,

This has been one of those issues. That's been under the radar for sort of a long time. Ginni Thomas is a professional activist. She has been a conservative activist for a very long time and she's been active on any number of issues. They'd have at least tangential connections to potential supreme court cases. Here. You've got something that is absolutely connected to the supreme court. They've already ruled once on january, six related material and who knows what kind of two thousand and twenty election related cases, or god forbid, two thousand and twenty four election related cases might come before a supreme court on which justice thomas is still a member. So as virginia thomas she's, not apart a key part of the january sixth investigation, this is sort of somebody who kind of got caught up in the wash part of what was on meadows phone, but the questions about court. Credibility are real ones, and you see the senate and some democratic lawmakers trying to address it, but I have a really hard time see how any legislation gets to sixty votes right now, because republicans have not wanted to touch this issue, even some that tend to work in a more bipartisan basis. On some of these sort of things say: look. This is something for justice, thomas to decide, or perhaps it's something for the chief justice to decide, but they don't want to be caught in legislating this, particularly when it could potentially embarrass a figure like clarence thomas who, on the right, is held up very much on a pedestal. This is not the kind of thing that republican senators want to lean into doing, and so a lot of talk on this. Perhaps the pressure on the chief justice might be more productive than a legislative outline here that is going to have a really hard time getting a sixty in the senate

he's garonhia hague. Thank you very much and still ahead. We return to our coverage of the war in ukraine, where russian shelling continues this morning, despite maskos to let up attacks amid peace talks between the two sides, so where spoons war. Go from here will have reporting on how this bloody conflict could end morning he's coming right back weather the complexities of climate change. The challenge of racial injustice or the threat to american democracy, get your daily five enlightening articles at MSNBC, daily written perspectives, people, you know and trust Many hoss it Joyce bats and doktor computer patel, along with a groan, List of experts offering their insights plus fresh, takes pays brown and z. Finally, start europe: with MSNBC daily at msnbc dot, com.