At the Hearst Tower in New York City, Oprah Winfrey and Michelle Obama sit down for a conversation about Mrs. Obama’s much-anticipated memoir “Becoming.” The two speak in front of an audience that includes a group of local, female high school students. The former first lady, mother, wife, attorney and author discusses the life experiences that have shaped her. She reminisces about her humble childhood on the South Side of Chicago with her family, which she describes as “four corners of a square:” her mother, Marian, her late father, Fraser, and her brother, Craig. Mrs. Obama explains how her parents invested everything they had into her and her brother’s futures. She discusses her years as an attorney and executive in Chicago and how she worked to balance the demands of her career and raising two daughters. Mrs. Obama candidly discusses some of the challenges she and Barack Obama faced during the early years of their marriage, including a stint in counseling. She also opens up about her years in the White House and the pressure of being the “first black family” to live there. Finally, Mrs. Obama explains her thoughts on how she believes President Trump put her family’s safety at risk.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
I'm over Winfrey welcome to supersede conversations the podcast I've, One of the most valuable gives you can give yourself is time taking time to be more fully present your journey to become more inspired and connected to the deeper the round us starts right now, I have known Michelle Obama now for fourteen years and during that time, We ve done several fascinating interviews together and let me tell you that She is everything you think she is and then some today, conversation. Our first interview since she left the White House the hearse tower in New York. We sat down with an audience that included a group of girl from a local high school you know Michel and I both love a chance to with rising young women, the world has been waiting to read her new memoir becoming, and let me tell you it's worth the weight. I loved it. So much
I chose, it is my latest book club selection, Michel rights excuse ITALY about everything we all wanted to know from her home, childhood to meeting and being called. By Barack Obama there? revelations about their marriage and her thoughts on President Trump when she, Sir our country as the forty fourth, first lady, she did it would such dignity grace and style. Not one scandal, not a misstep. She was the epitome of what a first lady could be worse, You read becoming. You also learn that cheese really like all of us and at her core she still girl on the south side of Chicago. Please welcome MS, is
My shall Rawdon maidens, you're gonna tell no one where they words. Yes,
she's your secret at are. Let me just say I, as you know, I love books. Nothing makes me happier than sitting down with a good red, and so when I started to read this and realized like in the preface what an extraordinary book was forthcoming, I was so proud of you. May I say you landed it. You landed at the book is tender, it is compelling it is powerful. It is wrong and I was struck Chile, by the beautiful cover becoming Michelle Obama, so struck that I have now made it an open book club and I'll. Have you are seventy nice but choice and Lee Haber, whose editor books I sadly I love this book so much but Michel and our friend I don't know, can I do
how's it going to leave, has it she said. What do you love the book? I go. I love the book. I love the book so much that I don't just want to choose. It is my book club. I want all the bull clubs around the it is their book club that we're all reading it at the same time so Reese and Emma and Jimmy Fallon and all of the great book clubs. Why did you choose the word becoming because when I was like eighteen nineteen, I wrote this poem bad poem on becoming because of this notion of evolving, and I know you had a choice for multiple titles. We actually had a a blooper list of titles that we won't go into but becoming just summed it all up in the preface. You will call one of the things. I say that is a question that I that adult ass kids, that I hate, I think it's the worst question in the world-
is? What do you want to be when you grow up as if growing up is finite, if you become something- and that is all there- is, and My journey is the journey of always continually evolving that there is never point where you arrive at a thing and it You do that's kind of sad. You know if you think that there is a point in your life where you stop growing and stop learning that sort of sad, because what else is left you know I never thought of it. That way before until I read that question, so I would have never asked anybody that, since what do you want to be when you grow up because we are, you grow up and you are many different things as you have been many different things and I dont know what the next step will be, and I tell young people that all the time who are trying to figure it out, because you think at some point you just know there's gonna be a light that turns off in your twenties or you know you promised me: young women here probably have some at magic gauge of what number
be when you feel like a grown up. You know, and that's generally, when think your mother will stop telling you what to do but the truth is that, for me, each decade has just uncovered something amazing that I would have never imagined and it keeps getting better and if I had stopped looking, I would have missed out on on so much so- I'm still becoming- and I hope all of us know that we are constantly evolving. So this is the story of my journey of the coming, and hopefully it will spark. Conversations among a lot of people, especially young people, about what their journeys look like. You know there are so many private revelations in this book. Have, I was surprised by- and I was wondering, was writing about your private life. Was that scary, and did you lose sleep about put that in nominating that out known for that in actually no big, because here's the thing
I realize people always ask me: why is it that you're so often to how is it that people connect to you, and I think it starts because I like me, and I like my story and all the bumps, blue bruises, the highs and lows, I'm not afraid of them. I sort of think that that's wouldn't It's me uniquely me, so I'm always been open with my staff with young people with my friends. There is a much people who know me don't know about me. Because I'm so used to sharing that part of me, because I think that even the tough spots or important four for me to examine and explore. So it was hardly other thing Oprah, that I know that, whether we, like it or not. Brok and I my husband and I we are role models and you know I hate me people who are in the public eye and even seek the public. I want to step back and say I'm not a role model, because I don't want that responsibility too late. You are
That means that young people are looking at you and I dont want young people to look. Me here and now Michelle Obama and think. Well, she never had a rough. She never had challenges. She never had feared. She never got what we're not gonna. Think that, after me, oh no you're not now we're not going think that I love the way you divide the sections into becoming becoming me becoming us and becoming more and millions of people have in wondering how you are, how you doing how the transition- and I think, in your story of becoming in the very beginning of the book- that there's no better example of how you are than the toast story. Can you share? The toes story is probably one of the first weeks that we moved into a new home after their transition and our new home in Washington, and we live in a really its neighbourhood. Let me let me just say this, but it's a couple of miles
way from the White House right down the street from the vice president's reds residents and it's a beautiful brick home and yet how you sort of realises the first home regular house with a or an egg doorbell that I have had in about eight years, so the toast story is one first nights. I was alone by myself no one there. My kids, the kids were out. Malea was on her gap here. I think the rock was traveling this alone for the first time at which first lady, you not alone much because there are people in the house, always their men standing guard. There is house full of Swat people in there you can open your windows and you can't walk outside without causing a fuss. I lived in this bubble for eight years and there are no window can open a window now without really big conversation.
Which, which Sasha actually tried to do one day with sash and Molly they both because their rooms face the north side of the White House, where all the protesters are and Billina said. I I enjoy studying to the sound of the protests, Mama been listenin to amend. Couple have few good point tat the dead, but then we got the call shut the window. So here I am in my new home and it just me and bow and sunny, and I do a simple I go downstairs and open the cabinet to my own would you don't do in the White House, because there's always somebody there go and let me get that. What do you want? What do you need, and I made myself toast and I made myself cheese, toast and then it's up Mattel? and I walked out into my backyard. I open my door and I step outside to fresh air. I sat on the stoop and there were dogs bar.
In the distance and are real this. How Bowen Sunny reacted because I realized they had really never neighbor dogs. Either so they will be only too there. I was there. Yeah, we're in the real world now fell and its neck quiet moment. Of me settling into this new life, this life means having time to think about what just happened over the last eight years, because what I came to the that there was absolutely no time to reflect on the eight years. We were White House, we moved at such a breakneck pace from the moment we walked into those. Or is until the moment we left it was in and day out, because we brok and I really felt like we Haven'T- had an obligation to get a lot done. So
would busy and we were raising kids and we were dealing with national crisis and we were trying to control and we were trying to heal and help. And you know you look up. It would happen, and I would forget, on Tuesday what happened on Monday, I forgot whole countries I visited literally whole countries, but there was no time to reflect, and so this is the moment that I had time to think about these eight years and my journey of becoming. But in reading becoming, I can see how every single thing is. Do you believe this that everything you're doing right now in your life in your classroom is preparing you for the moments and years ahead? And I guess, if you think about that way. You know- and I really want you girls, to understand this. If you view yourself as a serious person in the world, not not having fun, but the truth is
every decision that you make really does bill to who you were gonna become? Yes, and I can see that from you in the first great when you were an achiever with that. Within a plus plus plus women, my mother said I was a little extra as alleged yes, and so you right in the book how getting those little gold stars out a giggle star. Am I right now they don't, then only the book, Santa ok, everything's gonna computer uses a star on your computer that that you were those gold stars emit something to you It means, and in looking back on those stories, I realise there was something about me that understood context and others even at a young age. I think this was. I talk a lot about my parents, parenting and how they sort of gave us the freedom to have a voice
they have thoughts and ideas very early on, and I say this to parents- it's like you know giving your teaching your kids. Their voice starts the minute they can hear your voice. My parents took that risk on stability pretty seriously. So I was aware of it. We let you in Craig figure it out you home, ass. She had they did, they did sometimes painstakingly so, but you know what I realized was that achievement matter and their kids would get tracked early and then, if you didn't image great, particularly as a black kid. On the south side from working class background, people were already ready to put you in a box of under achievement, so for me even at a very early age. Now achieving what I needed to achieve. I didn't want people to think that I wasn't
working kid I didn't want them to think. I was one of those kids, because I understood that people do tend to put kids into those kids, even bad kids, these kids, that don't want to learn and what I talk about is the fact that there are no bed kids, they are bad circumcision, You mentioned this phrase that I like so much. I think it should be. It should be on a t, shirt or something failure. You say is a feeling long before it becomes an actual result, its vulnerability, the breeds with self doubt and then has escalated, often deliberately by fear, and that this this idea actually stuck with me that failure is, is a feeling long before it becomes an actual result. You knew this way. First grade. I could see my neighborhood changing around me. I grew up. When we moved to my neighborhood, which was South Shore and the south side of Chicago it was in nineteen seventys we back long time ago,
There was still tv, but only seven channels, and when we move we move there and lived with my great on in a very little apartment over home. She owned because she was a teacher and my uncle and great uncle was a pull importers who they were able to purchase a home in what was then a predominantly white community, but we came in at the period of transition which historically has been known in white flight and one of the things I tried to do My book is put context around my life, so that not just telling stories, but I want people to understand what was going on politically and socio economically, but you do that beautiful you payment. This picture. I could feel the space there's you in Craigs Room and then there's the eye. Family space Laurel. I will play area Joe. Our apartment was so small that probably what was that the room was divided up into three rooms that,
The two rooms were me and my brothers that fit like a twin bed and they lose would paneling that separated us, and there was no real wall you could top right between is Craig. I am up you up. We would throw a sock over the opening As a form of the gale, I grant you wear word it: where did the family actually meet other than the king? There was another room outside that turned into the living room, but our bed room was are today. Rooms and a little play area. That became our study.
At how seem so big when we were little, but it was teeny little space that my grandfather, who was a carpenter. My grandfather, south side, who I talk about was was a carpenter who did all the construction that you could imagine in all the houses that everybody, but the picture that you painted so beautifully and becoming? Is that you all each were part of a corner of the square and that your family was the square. The four of you together represent that yes a little, and I could feel that the peaches and the ice cream vague you got after you know a great report card, the family sitting at the little table celebrating success o. Yet we know we. Lived a humble life, but it was a full life and it we didn't require much view did well. You did well because you wanted to do
in know we got a reward. Maybe it was pizza, pizza, night or some ice cream. That was this a clue from my parents that we have done well, but in this neighborhood I was saying that wished in doing that was predominantly white. When we moved in by the time I went to high school, it was predominantly Africa. Eriksson and in the seventies there's something known as white flight, where a lot of the white families would move out into the suburbs as black families moved in and I actually grew up, seeing that transition. I put some school pictures class pictures in the book that shows my first great class and then my eighth grade class. That shows that flight happening and those What are our friends I mean I grew up when I was in kindergarten and first great I had friends of all backgrounds. That's my first kiss was a little boy teddy for
who was korean American? One of my little friends was a little red head named Susan girl across the street Rachel. All these kids were in my class and by time you in high school, but the flight happens so quickly. One one day they were there and then Today the white people were gone and an you started to feel the effects in the community and started to feel it in the school. I felt it as a first greater. I felt the deep disinvestment and when we talk about failures of feeling, this notion that kids don't know when their not being invested in this notion. When kids are unbroken schools and unbroken communities that they don't know I'm here
to tell you as a first greater. I felt it, but you don't want to the great indications of your personality to come was in the in the first great was the first greater kindergarten. When you, when you miss the word, it was kindergartens, kindergarten. You missed, you missed a word right. Tell us that story, this sort of like what are you first test? You were supposed to be the ranger colours and I came the kindergarten reading? Of course, my mother took us to the public library. I knew how to read. I was a good reader. Spelling was another thing- and I was still but the one of the first things you had to do- was do psychic readings and read your colors by Nina Red Blue to hold up a card. Mrs Burroughs, my kindergarten teacher still remember her to this day. And it was my turn to get up, and I read the cards red and blue black and then I got two white and I froze, and it was the first time I remember choking because It was a straight up choke I mean, I knew the word, but I just
the W h Sylvia. I was getting there and then it was like sit down, and I didn't get my star and I thought this. This be I know, how to read and Missis Girls is gonna, think that I'm one of the kids who can't read and my two best friends got their stars. That day and I went home and I lost sleep, When I talk to my mom, I said I don't know what happened. I can read and I mean I could. Read the word, and I know the word and I have to go back, and I have to prove myself because I felt like that would be a defining moment for me that if I was one of the kids who couldn't read the words on the first, try that I'd be labelled I'd be able. So I went back and I argued with MRS Bowles, who had no intention of rearing. The words until next week- and I was like- oh no- Miss borough. We now need to do in this today and I you know
Like I'm sorry, MRS Whirls, I know we're spells out playtime, but I need to redo my words today and she and I convince turned- and let me do it and pity the kids who had to sit there to redo my words today and she and I convince turned- and let me do it and pity the kids who had to sit there while I read those cards, but I got my star and I was like: ok, life can go on But that was very much me My mom will tell you this and would like she doesn't even know where they came from. I think She had way more to do with whom I was then she got to say also that a war, I think so too, because you say our parents invested in us. You know that. On their own hawaiian vat. They didn't vacation, they didn't go that way in my mind, breathing and you, my mom, didn't go to that. Her dress. She did around nails. I talk about one time when she turned her hair green and was like mom. Are you can't do this? can you go over the name address her? She didn't buy or sell
new clothes. She stayed home. She made sacrifices for us. My father was a shift worker. You know I could see my parents sacrificing for us was apparent gauges and all the time it was sacrifice. Maybe I wouldn't call sacrifice at the time and our parents didn't kill trip us, but I had eyes you know I I saw my father going to work in that uniform every day. You can. We do this my family, that Europe other had elected to twenty five sort of my father, reluctant to do some corners and a quarter there's a whole section on the deuce does in a quarter and driving around looking at homes. On them on the way, we have had our noble aspirational moments where we get in the deuce and a quarter, and we tried to the nicer neighbourhoods and we look at the homes that had beautifully line flowers into don't go anywhere more to come after this short break is episode the supported by hallmark cards. We say
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When we visited one of our birth, the families who fled out- and we had an experience of visiting one of our friends families in a suburb, and it wasn't a positive experience when you leaving our neighbourhood, but the deuce in the quarter from my father represents more than just a car, because my father was disabled. He had a mess. He had trouble walking for quite some time, and this is more reflective. Knowing now looking back, I could see how much this car to him, because this car was his wings it gave him the ability to take us around in a way that he couldn't walk us around. So there was power in that car that, in that car was a metaphor, for I may call it a little capsule
that money, my family, we would be in and we could see the world in a way that windows in the world. You don't think I was most in one of the things I was most impressed with, because I didn't genuinely appreciated the way you were able to reveal so much so not just what happened to your family with what's going on with all families, you know we often talk about how systemic racism impacts generations. The way you write about. Your grandfather for me, which one it was. I had a perfect way to explain and a girl put to me. I wasn't outside ok, Danny Danny you, ok, you write on page thirty, eight. I thought this was so beautiful. Gradually he downgraded
hopes letting go of the idea of college thinking. He train to become an electrician instead, but this too was quickly thwarted. If you wanted to work as an electrician or is still worker a carpenter, a plumber for that matter on any of the big job sites in check I'll go, you needed a union card and maybe were black. The overwhelming odds were that you weren't gonna, get one discrimination altered the destinies of generations of african Americans. Including many of the men in my family, limiting their income their opportunity and eventually there s patients. First of all, I don't think I've ever heard a mortgage wrenching truth explained in such simple human terms, and did your parents sit you and Craig down at some point and explained well, doesn't always fair. Oh yeah, we would have conversations all the time I mean, and in that section I talk about my maternal grandfather. We call them dandy, my
or family. By the way we lived within a five block radius- and I lived downstairs from a great on my mother's father- lived two blocks away with aunts and uncles. My father's parents live maybe five minutes away, and that's how you grew up on the south side of Chicago. You grew up with your complaint on railway area, the great and great aunt who taught me to play the piano Robbie she's, one of the first story. She was one of my first adversaries, the one and the people who kick me in the but a little bit at the age of four. When I thought I would be a great pianist and she just didn't appreciated, but but I talk about dandy, my my maternal grandfather, who again, we would go visit, dandy and grandma every Sunday that was part of the ritual we had dinner with my my father's parents house, so we
and a lot of traditions and maintains in our little poor little way they weren't grand they weren't believers we got away again. Venza lack has always called us, the cleverest without the picket fence, in the Father, with the suit and said my father had a blue uniforms but it was a very you know. It was a very tight knit situation, but dandy and I wouldn't notice was a very grumpy me. He was angry and bitter in ways that were unexplainable and a lot of times he would that anger out on my grandmother, not physical way, but just in a grumpy cranky gone away, and I always very young age? I was always amazed at how other adults kind of sad by Indian intervene. Oh, but not Michelle, It was the one who was gonna be like dandy. You need to start dont know why you're yelling and you sit down and I dont in he would let me
because I'm sure, but this big and probably Q, having somebody come up and stop yelling probably amused him at level, but my parents, what explain to us. We would leave a family gathering and they say well. Let me tell you a little bit about why dandy might be upset because dandy was a brilliant man grow. In South Carolina in the south and he was one of the the many millions of black folks who migrated north in hopes of getting jobs but couldn't get a job He was smart. He should have gone to college. She probably should have been a professor, but that was the plight of black men and still today in a culture of racism and inequality, where a lot of people don't get the opportunity, even if they have the skill and what my parents help meet a real eyes, is that there is something that happens to him a man, a person who knows deepens
that they are more than what their opportunities allowed them to be and for my four four dandy it bubbled up in a discontent that he couldn't shake, and I was to understand this about my grandfather very early on, so that I could have the compassion and the empathy for him because, as I said, what's important in this book is context- and I try to put context in this book because everybody's life has and there's context. You can't just some body or know somebody just based on their actions. You have to know the full breadth of their experiences and when I garments taught me when I got from it is whether was Robbie downstairs or dandy, or many other people that you mentioned in the book, that a lot of people are carrying their own broken dreams and when people are carrying their broken dream, You have to make room for their broken dreams, but I thought you know so often you getting conversations, particularly with white people who have said to me what
doing shows on racism like that was then what do we have to do with slavery? I wasn't there, then your explanation of why happens to a family that isn't allowed to have the opportunities, I think is you know put it in a kind of what networking opportunities, what additional information and what exposure I missed, because my grandfather's didn't have the opportunity, and still here I and this is one of the things I want to know why I want people to know the raw it's of my story, especially young girls is because I was that kid that didn't have networks didn't have grandfathers with trust funds and big fancy names, and doesn't define who you are, I didn't define them. Sadly, there no that they didn't have the the opera, unity, the love and the support that I had that's. What they bless wily word. Workings
hard to make change, had they worked so hard to change our lot and that's one thing. I understood that when I my grandparents and heard their sacrifice mine. She was a little girl. You better get that star because, We are counting on you to get that star. It's what my angel, you should say you ve been paid for yeah, you can pay. And then when you were ten years all you had this experience. Galen I've talked about this to you. Had this experience where cousin occurs in a distant relative says: How come you talk like a white girl, we tongue, like away with something that a lot of white people I. What lay me was that sound like yeah, the girls looking anybody heard that before any way sage, why you're talking like a white girl- and I talk about that incident- as is
one of the challenges that you have as a striving kid in now I grew up in a black community, but the truth is that if you grow up in a any other than the one in your striving. Moving away from that community sometimes is a pull back. Where folks don't understand like where do you think you're going? yeah, you know is illegal labour, you aren't do you think you are, and I confronted that question early and often and it was disconcerting at ten, because you try to be just regular ten year old kid. You don't want to be the kid at the family. Barbecue that's that kid talking all why? How can our white you know so in many ways when you grow up- or at least when I grew up, I had to learn how to be bilingual. I had to learn how to talk in a way that would get me the school, without get my butt kicked and I had to talk and assert
way, that would allow me to continue to striving get those gold stars into. You know push towards what my my parents and grand parents had hoped for me because also the way I talked with something that we need, open to me by Dandy DEN It was the one was like we talk, proper English in this You couldn't walk into that house. You know since slipping I'm a slur on, and you know he used such a force, intellectually, that he shaped us into who we had to be as intellectuals and later when Barack Obama entered the public stage. You say you watch the same sentiment, out with him, why you talk like there s a white man and military like that? That always comes that within a black person You see striving excelling and standing that context or any person,
when underserved experience. There is always that pull a pulling away from who you were. You know why I talk about the fact that in barracks, first congressional race, which was a sad sad disappointment to me, he was running against Bobby rest. All of these folks have known us. For quite some time and the biggest criticism they had a barrack who was estates in our data at the time that he was this Harvard tray know what all trying to come in and bloody data. I mean they're major attack was him that he was too smart. He was too educated that we couldn't trust him and that that those kind of tax, worse than anything, anybody from any other party or any other set said about me to have your own community tell you that you are in black enough that you aren't good enough, that you don't fit in is probably one of the most hurtful things you can do, especially as a young person
when, in your mine, you were doing exactly what you saw. Two community wanted you to do right, excel achieve IRAN and Sir yes, so I put that out there because it's important thing for communities of color to think about you know it's one thing to common rules are nodding their heads, because I know this is the life, and this is why I am saying I am you heard that right heard it in your own families may be in your own in your own houses. It is something that we all deal within its impact for the rest of the world to understand this, as they understand the challenges, the potential anger, the disappointment that come in this country, when you were striving against who you're supposed to be and who, where you come from, and all the identities getting mushed up together and trying to navigate
and the navigator at all and in doing it throughout your entire life. My big concern was being able to talk about everything. I wanted to write critics. Are we going to people that we are moving at a big after high school and I was sorry when it ended actually, after high school, you went to printed then Harvard LAW School, and then you joined this prestigious law firm in Chicago. Now this, when I read this, I put three circles around it to start, and I went oh, my god, you write on page one thirty, two, I hated being a lawyer. I wanted a life. Sorry
I wanted a lie. I wanted to feel hole, so I wanted to shut that from the mountain tops, because I know I thought so many people going to read this, who are in jobs that they hate, but they feel like they have to continue, and I was wondering for you. Your parents have invested every thing you ve. Let us through everything they ve given up. They sacrifice. How did you come to that decision? Did it happen all at once? You go to work or do start feeling it and then just one they say I hate being a lawyer. It took a long to get in point to be able to say that to myself, yes out loud to myself, because I still couldn't say it to the world, but in the book I take you on the journey of who that little girl, this striving star, getter, became which was what a lot of many hard driving kids become? I became a box checker
I became someone who understood that there was pay off for effort. And I enjoyed that just like you know. What do you want, you when you grow up? I want to be a lawyer. Well, that's an eye. Spawned it to the reaction that I got without thinking about who I wasn't even knowing that I had a right to think about it. I went through much of my life until I became a lawyer. Checking boxes get good grades, I can do that check, go applied in the best schools in the country, get into Princeton check. Get there. What's your major, let me do something: that's gonna get me good grades sort and get into law school. I guess. Did it check got through law school check. I was checking boxes and not thinking about who I was gonna, be it in the book. I talk about some of the things that made me wake up because I wasn't it.
Moreover, I wasn't somebody that was gonna take risks. I became risk averse and all this talent and all this opportunity I narrowed myself. To being this thing, I thought I should be added to loss. Talk about losses that I had in my life. That made me think. Have you ever stop to think about who you wanted to be and I realized that I had not. But where was I was sitting on the forty seventh floor of a high rise office, building Goin over cases in writing memos and I just landed. There was almost like- I got plucked out and I was there and I had nothing to do with it. What I love about it is, it says, to every person, reading the book and beyond that you have the right to change your mind you have the right to change your mind. Oh gosh, you have the right to change your mind. Here's the thing because, when you're becoming and you're always becoming
these will moments. This is just a part of the story, so I had to tell myself even though I had invested a lot of money and time and becoming a lawyer, that's ok. That was worth it you afraid, though, that you re scared to death. Ok, because my mother, who was- not very, she didn't comment on the choices that we made. She would just like live in live. You gotta make your choices, but I there's a scene where I'm really- struggling with him. I finally share with her that I'm not happy and passionate and for the first time, a mother's driving me from the airport after I was doing document production in Washington. These
and I believe I was like. I can't do this for the rest of my life by gets sitting room and looking documents. I won't get into what that is, for the young people, but its deadly deadly, boring document production, and I shared with her in the car. Then I'm just not happy and I don't feel my passion and my mother, my uninvolved live and let live. Mothers said make the money worry about being happy later and I was like and I like, ok, but then I and the book. I talk about how why oh, how indulgent that must have felt to my mother. Yes, to hear me talking about passion and what I cared about when she had sacrificed in my parents had sacrificed Laden put it like that. And I don't think she was thinking about it in those terms, but when she said that I thought wow, what we're did I come from without my luxury and wanting my passion
luxury to even be able to decide luxury them even be decide where my mother didn't get and go back to work and start even finding herself until after she got us into high school. She made that sacrifice, so, yes, it was hard and I guilty and I started writing a journal, and then I met this guy Barack Obama. He was also part of the shaking up my Lou check box checking world because he was the opposite of a box Checker he was swerve and all over the place, I didn't even know it's like. How did you get here Newton? What did you do that? He was doing the opposite of what I doing in my life right we're about beating him. I constructed my existence carefully talking and folding every loose and disorderly bit of it as if building some tight and airless piece of Origami Iraq was like a win that threatened to unsettle everything at first. She didn't like being so: oh god, no an unsettled. That was a lack
control, you know Brok and other people, slowly taught me to unwind a little bit that part of what you are part of this work of becoming in making the sacrifices that you can. You can try some things you can step outside the box and things won't all apart, but when you were little kid from the south side of Chicago and every die matters in you know you can be categorized and dropped in you can lose opportunities. I felt like I didn't, have the luxury our conversation will continue in the next episode. You can listen by downloading part too, I'm overwintering and you ve been listening to supersede conversations the podcast you can hello super so on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook. If you have again go to apple podcast, unsubscribe rate and review of this gas join me next week for another super soul. Conversation. Thank you for listening.
Transcript generated on 2020-01-15.