Trump and his legal team argue that the president is above the law, and voters say that health care and immigration are two of the most important issues in the very close 2018 midterms. Then, Rep. Luis Gutierrez calls from Puerto Rico to talk to Jon Favreau about the devastating aftermath of Hurricane Maria.
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Welcome to pod, save America, I'm John Fabric on John Love. It I'm Tommy these or on today's part, will be talking to congressmen, Luis Gutierrez, whose importer Rico right now
will also be talking about Donald Trump
knowing the Mexican, whatever the stay,
the mid terms and how healthcare and immigration is shaping up to be to the biggest issues in twenty eight ten other parts
Tommy tell about positive the world week. I had a conversation with a excellent journalist at the intercept need many Hassan
We talked about how John Bolton
And his national security team is hiring some
the most paranoid Islamophobia lunatic fringe of discipline. I am it is worth
then you would ever imagine these are people who think there's like
you know a secret Muslim Brotherhood plot to have Sharia lie in the government and the slick seeker plants everywhere, it is its unnerving, but these people are in serious important positions. As you see here, we talk through it. Did you see at the M the ambassador to Germany?
This also rigour. Now neither were said that he's gonna, like you know, he saw his ears
he's coming out good idea of the good you're going well resource. Good returnees right now recognise that he's a twitter troll turned using Bastard Germany, who didn't interview the bright Bart London issuing support for like far right parties. That of ties to Nazis, so yeah really great Yahoo could assume that coming when he spent a long time, tacking female journalists on Twitter being awful sergeant, cystic jerk off.
Person. Anyone. Ok, we towards AIDS coming up new towards AIDS and new, but our tore in Atlanta, Nashville and Durham. Very
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vote be a voter. Be voting be avoided tomorrow that we learned
people who commanded to do something
We were we we learnt from my Adam Grant. On the conversation I just finished. There was great people, don't say: Dante. Votes may be a voter about. Ok, let's start with what,
in the Trump investigation. The president and his legal team are now making two legal arguments that basically make the case. The Donald Trump is above the law.
The first is that he can start or shut down an investigation into any one for any reason, including an investigation into his own possible crimes and seems reasonable. The second
legal argument is that Donald Trump can pardon anyone for any crime at any time, including himself these arguments,
first made in the letter, the trumps lawyers sent to the special council back in January, which was leaked to the New York Times in a story this weekend, and then they were repeated by
the president's lawyer, Rudy Giuliani on the Sunday shows, and by Donald Trump himself on Twitter
on Monday, guys I'm airports around lawyer for Giuliani. Oh yes, when will ever that guy is a tv spokesperson, tv spokesperson, I dont like. I also disagree with his argument that if you paid a tunnel on the side of brick drinking a threat, that is this
the founders intended when they when they wrote the constitution, were they thinking at the president should be able to
Darwin stop any league any investigation into anyone. Pardon anyone, including himself, never that we should say the pardon powers of the president are extremely broad. Some legal scholars think that they are almost
yeah? I mean the partner isn't limited, but the idea that the president can pardon himself is so still.
Good and wrong on its face, you know there's lots of things. The constitution is an express. They prohibit that we don't view as legal, but the idea that the President of Parliament, like there's legal experts going off and besides there is,
We were, there is a memo in nineteen. Seventy four explain why the president couldn't part himself and there can be arguments about
the Pardon power intended, but we're we're tongue.
It is not just like the law
Talking about like irreducible questions about the power of the british presidency,
and if you believe that the framers intended for
They did all this work. They worked so hard on it. You know to preserve slavery, ploy
limiting the powers of the presidency rights or two of the focuses and
either they would leave. In this whole, it really is like the hole in the dust our right
idea that, like they built this big thing where the president can we do this need
by Congress is limited by the courts, except he cannot
people in the oval office it at our homes upward, because there's nothing yet I mean I'm not aware Jack Goldsmith Harvey La Professor, oversaw the Dear Jays Offs legal counsellor in the Bush administration said the intersection between the obstruction of justice statutes and the president exercising his constitutional power to supervise and investigation it.
J is not sir, settle lots and open question. So what
right. I guess the legal skeletal debate this. What is very clear, it is
entirely political exercise- and I guess
can you that Rudy Giuliani in those clowns led the letter than York Times? That's how they had Trump tweet to complain about it to try to set the framework.
Or the story posted and they all went repeated these charges.
The Sunday shows because they're trying to set the elite
The groundwork for the argument now and unlike set this day
for other Margaret Idiots a command defend him, so that, if you know, if dollar, five
in legal terms,
in any way they can deny it. My
favorite line in the letter was quote. Having him testified,
means the office of the President before the world that vessels are today. This is a man and lends its hasn't fires. The man who demeans the office for several hours a day visa tweed during executive time like he, is neither too busy nor to dignified to do an interview, its
definitely not too busy. Now, if I want that that was the other day in the low they Seti's he's very busy and
so all of his duties as president and his busy schedule cannot pay
simply allow for him to sit down for a few hours with Robert Mahler to do it
yeah yeah. I know we all know we ve all seen how very easy he is playing golf and tweeting and watching fox
friends, they literally spite takes up. That's Molly! That's that's like eighty percent of scheduling twenty percent is meetings tenable,
and those are not real meaning of eating. So let make him feel better if you have any idea, as always, there are complicated part of this is in part there complicated legal questions about what it means to obstruct justice, how it how it relates to the president's authority
as the person in charge of law enforcement autobahn. This country, fine, there's cos
about the nature, the pardon our fine, but what's going,
here, is very simple: they are trying to make sure that their
trying to create an argument that says the present is above the law. And what will the argument there trying to make is the only recourse for presidential abuse of power lawbreaking anything the President wants to do. The only recourse is impeachment, knowing that Donald Trump has immunity by
congressional majority, and so they are trying to set up that. Like no Mean Rudy Giuliani, told the Huffington Posts, and this is different than a pardoning investigation he told having imposed on Sunday. The Donald Trump can shoot the he could
you james- call me in the oval office and still not be prosecuted for em, but but so will it right?
that that that the only remedy is impeachment. He can pardon himself for every crimes except except in peaceable crimes, so he can be impeach too
shoot swords with walk for it shoot.
Khomeini Oval Office, pardon sums
for the crime doesn't
and he sure does get impeach, but either way no jail time for Donald Trump
James colonies of that never avenged, like so good news
Judiciary. Chairman Chuck Grassley is like. If I was president, my lawyer told me I can pardon myself, I get a new lawyer, okay, so good Kevin Mccarthy,
is out there on the shows like defending anything terms as youth. He doesn't care that Trump also.
Let us ensure about to get to admit that they ve been
lately lying about who drafted a statement regarding Don Juniors meeting with russian lawyers was probably carve out for Vladimir Putin. So you know it's clean
like they're all good with all the lies, all the corruption that happen, let since European Mccarthy was just talking to him, because that was just gross degree.
Good for Dana back it yeah chauvinist. I mean it was a great example of what can Mccarthy said.
But he said if there's no collusion it's time for Malta and its investigation, and he also said there has been no collisions
Far so now can Mccarthy has taken us to the only crime that counts is collusion. This is where the but the House Republicans are now. It is a good example of you know. We have talked quite a bit about Paul Ryan on this on this programme and how little we like him, but if the Republicans keep the House Kevin Mccarthy,
Is the speaker of the house. He has a now. He caught used in line for the presidency, and
He has decided already that he is going to be easy.
And more of a kiss ass then Paul Ryan
we should know this- is the guy that picked out trumps, favorite skittles to give
and when he goes to thy he calls it. I cover those divers. I'm sorry was only pink starboard from my cabin to dawn. He calls him my Kevin and you know what you are his cabinet, that you are so his cabin, so I didn't mean it.
It's another reason why we need to take us back, because if it, if it remains and Republicans hand a republican hands, is there any doubt that the day after the election, Kevin, Mccarthy and Donald Trump are going to shut down this investigation? And we will never hear from Robert Mahler from ROD Rosen sign from any of these
So again I mean it will happen immediately when it will be the end of one of the two, no two which I think is like you, like. Oh only collusion matters. We actually quite recently had a debate as to whether or not the president can affect us,
his name was Bill Clinton and there are many, many members of Congress and senators who voted to impeach him and then remove him for office for obstruction of justice which,
the republican president does
believe is a crime. Is not a lot of free unimpeachable, not told
the fine totally cool, I utterly. Why does this matter to people it matters beyond this Russia Investigation, medical is yes it locks had just sort of a great. Very good piece is a very good piece about this. Is that if this is right of this legal argument is correct, that,
I can start and stop investigation into any one at any time and pardon anyone any time acquitting himself there be
thing wrong with trumps. Setting up a booth somewhere in DC were wealthy individuals could hand checks to Trump and in exchange terms,
could make whatever federal legal trouble there and go away and then, once you cut your check, you could
committed any crime. You want deadlines, the federal crime and then Trump would let you off the hook immediately out. That's what this meets. Look! What
The idea is a good idea. They Donald Trump document you gonna fuckin crime spree. Thank you to everyone who pay the parts if the parting powers unlimited and he is in total control. The Justice Department Dc
as a lawless down a place where
b to look out, because if, if
just tromp right get in the way of of any Republican. You see they could take
car, I mean it really is. This is authoritarian subsidies. Are that neither the confederation, it's not the have law and the legal scholars likely this. It's not like us just yelling about this right
In addition to it, I mean they're saying that he could just stop and start Deirdre investigations get anyone. He doesn't like
anytime, and so when Rudy Giuliani, says well. Trump could kill Jim Comey in the oval office and he wouldn't get indicted, like we kind of laugh at him. Cuz he's a horrible old crank, but we probably should take,
happily sear heaps of their time, that literally mortally murdering political opponents and
immunity from prosecution, it's it's. These are not it's not like what is not
the theoretical situations. Donald Trump is issuing political pardons every single day, and this is this is Donald Trump we're talking about. He talks about how he wants depressed
you Democrats. Hillary Clinton also
ever only ankle more like all of us here, you eat it
thing where their presenting a legal argument. It all feels like something that if a law professor said out loud in his constitutional law class, it will be a hypothesis
go about how what would happen if we lived under such a rule of law and it would be bad, you know,
You re about when I read that mere times during Saturday is
we are like there's going to be a reckoning in the next couple months, probably before this election, because Mueller is either going to try to issue a subpoena to Donald Trump to have him testify and then Trump Giuliani are not going to participate or
mothers, gonna issues, findings at like that this is not going to end in a happy place
It is either going to end with mauler finding something very bad and trump just deciding to like the creating a constitutional crisis as we're having one right now,
or you will all these republican centres and always republican House members, their great defences he's not going to do that. I would have
against that, and I don't think that that something the presence going to do even Giuliani, like clytie part himself, who knows, but I dont think it
likely like. All of this is now being introduced as these hypotheticals, but we're about to live in a letter, hypothetical world. What happened
He starts inter issuing patents, the closer and closer to him. What happens? I don't know, but I'm not optimistic what we in Europe, but we kind of have a sense, because what he's doing is he's laying the political groundwork to make it impossible for the Republicans to oppose him cause his base. The
This is more with Trump than any other republican president history at this point, like the other thing that was developed
slayings level. Letters really remarkable, like a lot of, is a huge challenge and call me,
but they also assert the trump couldn't intentionally impeded. The FBI investigation into full
and because he didn't know there was one at the time we any kind of like paint him some hero for actually being the guy fired Flynn.
In fact, like he sat on track,
Billing information about whether Flynn was compromise by the Russians for weeks and even before,
at Obama, told him not to hire flint in the first place or dislike problem.
Making that they are spinning in pretending that none of us remember where we were a year and a half ago to me. What happened over the weekend simplifies the stakes in this election. Better than anything else, we see the rush investigation can be complicated. Mahler can be complicated like time.
The strings together is really tough. None of red strain, the world line of reasoning the world, but this is very easy. The president believes he is above the law he has stated publicly. If you want to check on that power
if you do not believe the President's above the law, your only
recourse, which is what the Giuliani in that
You are telling us is to vote for Democratic Congress, because, if you do not
the democratic Congress and heated and in Republican
turned to power after November Donald Trump has decided, he would be able to do anything. He wants open any investigation, investigate any person in pardon anyone. That is what we are hearing. Look at Lydia tickers, take crews,
is a an ivy league. Where he's a Supreme court clerk for four renquist, he is a stubborn uncool. Dork was thought
every legal question there is and he's asked the question: can the present pardon himself, which is the kind of question lost,
who are under sex, asked each other all the time- and I am here which I imagine means he was ass, asked and answering this question pretty regularly over the weekend.
And he has asked that question and the question can the President Putin himself is really quite equal to? Is the president above federal law, and can he be protected from any federal law he wishes and he spent eighteen so
and in silence, and then he said, I have studied the issue. You felt the tension, the inside of TED Crews, the Craven Coward
person. Who knows he doesn't gain politically by attacking Trump just yet and the law,
student in him? That has talked about that fun question for thirty years and he just said Ivan studied it
You'd do anything just one last little note, and this like this thing's rigged politically, because I think points like you just made about taking
It's also a reminder that that
rod rose inside edited the calmly termination letter which
It's him really critical to the president's defence, and yet he is not refuse from all this. He still overseeing this whole things like no one.
Feel good than this.
Speaking of going to be a judge on the level are on there, he's apparently told he said that he's talked to Mueller and he told Mueller if it gets to the point where you need me as a
yes. I will reduce myself from any thing whatever, but it is very bizarre that the person overseeing the investigation now because sessions reduce himself is also a potential witness to obstruction. Since clearly
the reasons that Route Rosen's Diane wrote in that letter for firing. Jim call me were not the reasons that Jim Cook was fired, and we know that because the president has told us many times publicly also also get as part of this to its always
to remember like we're doing a lot of speculative. We have to write like what's more gonna find what's going on, why is rodents Dean Stein still in their when it seems like he's your accused? Is there a tactic? There have MILAN, but there is there a roomful of people
have all the information about mothers, investigation and words leading, and you do feel you do feel a sense that there's
logic to I rose and sign has not refused himself and why hasn't been called, and it does suggest a kind of
under girding thought or principle or idea, or on protecting the investigation that we fully under
their fingers crossed? Well, maybe you better there. If you don't you guys, but, alas, no it s really important. Breaking news update. Just in from Reuters you, a special council mauler says extra campaign manager, parliament afforded attempted to tamper with potential witness according to a new court
so that is breaking which witness literally as were recorded, I don't have a temporary with the present even louder avenant. He sent texted and send cryptic messages to two people in February to influence or testimony in otherwise conceal evidence.
The FBI, Ivy thousand, like things are gonna, go wealthy people are not already tobacco plan for their part and fear thing. They love it. It's like you you're, so right that there's so much information. We don't know that mother does know, but, as these reports are coming out, there's also things were finding out now for sure that we always speculated about.
And Tommy you alluded to this. In that letter, the lawyers Donald from floors admitted that the White House lied when they said the Trump had nothing to do with the statement about Don Juniors meeting with the Russians and Trump Tower, but they also said well liked,
to the press is not a crime and and that it has the nerve to erect. If it also think about where we are that the then president in his look, legal team has admitted that they lied to
right oppressed. Something now no daylight. The letter says the Trump dictated the statement to the press about Don Juniors meeting transfer of this russian lawyer, whose carve out probably fur prudent
Sir hug me sooner said he certainly didn't dictated J
a closer the president was not involved in the drafting. The statement show that was
on equip the president didn't sign up anything secular, told NBC. So look all these people,
who went to work for Trump new without getting into rightly deserve no sympathy for anyone, but it probably
be too hard to be his lawyer or a spokesperson, because you, I can imagine him lying to their faces and then they have to God
PETE the lie, even though they now hope Hicks dislike
revered by the press. Everything's been worse since she left much like she was on all those calls when trumpets dictating these statements about Don Junior bottom. You know he's like there's just
fire border. I would ask that question every single day until I got an answer and if I was sitting there
the rapporteur S equator and they get skipped, I would follow up or I'd Walker.
I can breathe and good she's useless he's a liar. It's not an opinion that he's a liar. It's a fact. It's not Democrat say he's a liar. He is alive.
We have it on record, they admit that they lie and now
have someone who lies all the time in your life, whose
also made a legal argument that he is above the law and can do it every once. That's where we are right now. It's also really
using that the remaining two really
like would also have to take a moment. That letter made me think that letter was back in January. I think all the ship has happened since then that they that's my letter, you right when you feel pretty confident about your case when you're
you're down to the president can probably pardon himself and open whenever investigation he wants and shudder when everyone's when you're down to that legal argument seems like you're having some trouble
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paralysed by what the midterm news
Phoebe S news. You got battleground tracker Paul found that if the elections were held today, Democrats would have two hundred and nineteen seats in the house just one more than they need for majority about a twenty five. Twenty six,
again. I think the Democrats are leading the generic ballot by five points in that pole, which is fairly close to the real clear politics average of three point two and the five. Thirty. Eight average of six points, our usual TK
we are on this pike asked poles or snapshot in time. They are better for measuring trends than they are for predicting outcomes.
But right now the trend is that the race has gotten a bit tighter over the past few months. That seem how much tighter we don't know, but all of the polls show that his gun,
tighter. Does anyone want to hazard a guess? Why,
I dont want to say that this is why? Because I don't think we now, I will say,
does consumer of the news. As some it feels as though we have not talked about policy
while at the national level, not since the tax cuts were passed
Opera is unpopularity unpopular, it's been a long time since the last Asia Fight,
Gillian popular appealing easier and those fights that you just mention matched with when the Democrats had double digit, leads in the dinner
Well, if that is true, but an- and it was also a time now, but I but the reason I dont want to be totally causes. It was also not as a time when democrats routine positions more publicly that voters light, but there also fighting like Hell,
and right now I don't. I don't really like right now, we're just in this morass of Russia and corruption and from scandal again, and we need to get by me. Look treacherous anyone or gas take
maybe that'll help, but we need to get back into a debate about the big issues facing people as part of this Congress.
About from corruption. When you think about hard is for the Democrats to break through these days, there is innocent twitter
commentary over the weekend. How there is like no demo,
that's no zero, like the Democrats on the Sunday shows you know, there's all these New York Times stories that don't have Democrat elected Democrats like on the record, responding like hard for them to break through in this environment,
I think it's yes, but it's also hard to pull these seats. Probably this economic one, there's no national democratic leader. So
there's not going to be an obvious messenger or someone filling the void
that is left when you're, not in control of everything. I also think this pole is probably a good reminder for people that
You know you see trumps approval rating and you think of it in a zero sum terms like we're gonna win, but really we
The win so many seats that it puts the odds and about fifty fifty and everyone
needs to know that and get real comfortable with this thing being
when foot that will be won or lost, based on how hard every single person listening to this show tries
was very very instructive.
When you look at some of the U
item. The demographics, like democratic women, are pumped to vote for female candidates. That is awesome that parties on
job of nominating and hopefully electing a lot of great when this time people are, they want to hear candidates talk about health care, they want you to talk about jobs and wages in that's you across the political spectrum. Now
you know that's that can be a little misleading. Like maybe Republicans, wanna hear you talking about tearing up vs IE eight,
The other thing we only be mindful of that immigration is a huge defining issue where these parties have split, and even an independent
this pool overwhelmingly think that immigration is made things worse in the area where they live. Thirteen percent better sixty one percent said
So it's reminder why Trump is out there tying everything, the Mss thirteen and doing these. Like weird events, all the time so you know,
message for candidates is: don't talk about Mahler ever because nobody wants to hear about it. I think it is important to understand the backdrop of the election and that sort of the fundamentals of election, which is one of the things I think because Trump seems likes, such a bad candidate in situ awful person we surrender got about and twenty sixteen is a twenty. Sixteen was always going to be because of the economy, because a Democrat had just serve to terms as president and it's hard for president to get a third term in office. Her for the present partied over there
when office there was always gonna be a fairly close electron. Twenty. Sixteen, no matter who the candidates were- and I think in this mid term environment because of gerrymandering that happen in twenty ten leave his pants
gerrymandering, that's right? We can. We learn that recently that it was I
he's gonna be Democrats. We can have a tough held to climb are, do have a tough he'll call to climb in the selection, and also I didn't realize, as heroin treated this out over the weekend, the largest margin in a mid term election dating back through the last hundred years or so has been eight and a half points, and so the idea that you know there's
Beat these double digit democrat wines is just not something that has a lot of historical precedent, so it it just goes to show that if
we need to win by seven or eight points to win the house back. But that's like the high end of what
party has out of power, has won in mid term elections that what we really have
get everything right here. Yeah! That's right, I think,
good, there's value, I think, to people being Jason, yeah that that you know a there can be a blue if there could be a blue, I dont know little LE ripple.
You know a little was to skip crossing across the pond controllers obligated. This was this the stones giving precedence, Democrats, winning the junior about by five percent and winning twenty five twenty six seats. That's a bit!
a blue whale. I dont only one in the house by one, but that's a lot of seats, lousy. Getting too is we're about, have primary cross country and is a lotta districts where you have Democrats treachery
is going to be the person who's going to be on the ballot. A lot of the key places on the place where the news is going to come from races where we can make up a lot of
and then those people can hit the ground running and they'll be out there campaigning
single day and they may not be in every national news story, but they'll be on the ground and, though probably be talking about trump and corruption, but they'll also be talking about healthcare in the laws. We talk about jobs and also we talked about the tax cuts. So I also think that there's just
process that we're in the middle of two that that will help us get out of this right of feeling like
don't know how to drive a message from standing there. So important thing. This positive is that health care is the top issue for mid term. Voters of both
parties. Two thirds of all voters want to hear quote a lot about health care from candidates. Only ten percent of all voters think that Republicans in Congress have helped their coverage in their cost. Twenty five percent think they made it worse and half. I guess don't think anything at all
So the question: how do we had a democratic keep health care in the news? Do we have to keep it in the news or is it enough to just
run your individual race and talk about healthcare in your ads and on the stump older I would do. I would
run on hard? I mean there's a bunch estates. Were there there are wasted.
Like Virginia just voted to expand medicate access, and I think you tar
on the ballot Utah other fighting Ford, and I oh, I dont, rather than the ballet so there's places where were they also be built into the broader Campi messaging? I do think
should beholding holding healthcare. That's all the time. What premiums go up in any chance they have its it critically important. I also think this
and we need to do both Canada's on the ground. I don't know what it
the house candidate, making news local news they're getting their vents covered, they should talk about healthcare. They do healthcare, visiting,
I'll, be right, but but it's actually wanting only helpful to those candidates is national figures, whether its
humor or Warren or Bernie, or me
Warner. When he's on talking about impeachment or whatever the hell will be talking about the fall, those people it is gonna, be up to them to help
keep the election focused on more than just the trump minutiae. You know you see all these comes healthcare. Just like that.
More people? We need to get out the further outside of people who look at politics every day who pay attention every single day, the more we get to the left, but to whatever
what people will derive his low information voters, but just people for whom participating in
politics is not an everyday event, and you know if you're not trumpet.
A lot of pain and a lot of people's lives were for a lot of people. We need to vote like Trump takes about, takes up as much spaces as you.
You know in your mind it in your world and if, for someone
who's, not allowing trunk to take up that much space. We need to be there with
more than a story that they're not totally paying attention to which has helped with which is
details in the minutiae, this investigation, which are incredibly important, but not necessarily to people who aren't watching every day of news as it involves the other thing that I thought it was interesting that I took away from this pole. Is that convincing Republicans that Trump is bad is a completely lost cause they like everything he does, and I do not think that's gonna change. Unless me,
GNP figures her on him or Fox NEWS turns on him, which basically means that the direction here
like we to move is to the right. If anywhere at all, so we should just work on getting our people out and getting those independence. Eighty three percent of Republicans and eighty four percent of conservatives say they mostly like trump policies. What's interesting hears fifty sick, just fifty six percent Republicans
like how he handles himself personally. So this is the argument with
a lot of the never tramper conservative pundits in DC because they say you know what like a lot of Republicans, that they just don't like they dont like how trump it handles himself personally, and so that's what you should go after, but it's like no, because they clearly love the policies there clearly willing to overlook his behaviour and his comments and things that they don't like as republican voters, because they love what he's doing
They love his policies. They love his agenda, they are all button and it is his fucking party. Yet there is no doubt about that anymore and I think the Republicans who just think too Donald Trump is of all and they believe in free markets and tasks of like that. They live in Washington DC and they are republican
in cities like New York and San Francisco and allay, and they do not
represent most of the republican base at all. That is not the party anymore, also be here's the thing there
I don't I know is another. You disagree with that, but put up with
then everything about a little, but lately it's just that, I think we're trying to solve
lot of thirty or problems any year like. I think there are
we write that it's important that that that it's a shameful.
Display that so many republican leaders have signed off
the quorum of this, this disgusting person.
Shameful and we should stand against that. People should campaign against it in this way,
that I think when Democrats go after the media for not using the word lie there not wrong. The media should use the word lie, but we're living that we're living
in the culture that had the weaknesses that made from possible were still in. It were still in it, and so we
first, I want to win on those terms, but we're not gonna win this election on those terms. That's an argument to have, but it's not gonna be central to what we do
If it was Donald Trump, would it be fucking? President right I mean we, but the Klingon painters, his own twenty. Sixteen. I was one of the people that thought it might work trying to peel Republicans off from the party they all came home at the end,
because they're all watch and Fox NEWS there, all in a media environment, the tells them Donald Trump, his gray, and that lies to them all the time and that's it in your right. That's a huge problem
we're not going to solve it in one of the things we got us all by looking at the hall and saying that most voters want to hear about health care and talk about healthcare
enter republic and to people that point out this issue, which is fair. Like that that that what the question isn't, why aren't you
Republicans taking a stand against the ways in which trump is
morally crass and vulgar? The question is: how broken was our culture, that people stop caring and how can we make people care again because they don't care? This pull tells us they really don't they don't the other big issue. Tommy alluded to this. The came up in the CBS Burger, impose immigration
is the top issue for republican voters. Healthcare is important to them too, but immigration, the top issue for them, and here's the two
where's the tell the whole story, sixty seven percent of Republican say
migration has made the area where they live. Worse. Sixty seven percent of Democrats say immigration has made where they live better.
But I knew independent number was almost ass, bad ass, it was. I was gonna. I dont orphan issued its more polarizing than that, but it's over
they caution, look of independent number, there's a big cautionary tale. What is interesting is that it also explains the trouble that many Republicans in Congress are facing right now. On Sunday, Huss Republican will heard said that he in a group of moderate Republicans, now have enough votes for something called a discharge petition where they would basically join with all the House Democrats to force the house to vote on a bill that would protect the dreamers, because Paul Ryan has refused to call it up. You can, if you have enough votes, you can guess and get this discharge partition and get a petition and get a vote on the floor. Obviously most has Republicans are
petrified of this, something that Paul Ryan might lose his job over it. If he can't sort of quell this uprising, which doesn't look like he's gonna, be able to win the world, will Paul Ryan be able to use always acumen to prevents this sudden out?
both of compassion and will it get fired if he fell.
To stop the compassion from taking hold, but is interesting, but that these Republicans are so terrified and the house that if this passes the house,
and voters. No republican voters know that the house, controlled by Republicans, voted for a bill that would protect the dreamers that it would depressed turn out so badly and is also interesting that some of these Republicans have joined to sign onto the discharge
petition because the clearly there, the motto Republicans who
in areas where people believe immigration,
has made their lives better, that their more democratic areas, and probably those Republicans, aren't gonna, be around in
What a pity we all do. Our jobs there, like the first ones off the list further, is most will so like. What do we think about? That's what you think about the discharge petition
and has me like that is going to matter because will go anywhere else,
I don't know I mean I'd, love to see you come out. I love to see it. I'd love to see us force, votes on this and I'd love to show the activists rather than fighting here that we may pass for decades and safe kids from getting reported that they matter to this party and reminded us. I mean, I think, another immigration, specific thing that happened wreathing recently with organs.
Jeff murkily went down to try to view this centre where children were being held, this fucking
inverted Walmart in Texas and they wouldn't let me- and they call the cops on him. Even
He told them that use EU authorities want to see where kids were being held and he tried to go through proper channels use rebuffs. We showed up, I think,
Doing an event like that, that shows the horrific condition that children are being held in that shows leadership that raises awareness and issue, really smart,
But I'd love to see a bunch of these two thousand and twenty Democrats taking similar steps to like highlight some of the worst things Trump is doing. So I think that could change impact public opinion. So I agree with that, but I'm interested in what you just said before this, which is that independent
of all these people who think that immigration has not made where they live better. Like do you, like my four cents, and when I saw the Jeff murkily thing is every fucking democratic senator should be with him and should be highlighting these awful awful inhumane policy where they're tearing Childer apart from their parents
you know see out there saying in a clearly Stephen Miller. Donald Trump agree that he's, like Republicans, will lose forty. How seats if they make the selection about how the economy is improving, but we need to do is make it about immigration
every day, very months at a time and Donald Trump in September, should shut the government down over Congress, not funding his wall. Now. What are democrats do about
do we play on that issue regarding our health nor the display. I think that a pretty there's a distinction here, though, to abandon once talk about in wooden murkily, was trying to highlight, which is broader
migration policy general like conversations but
this d or allowing and syrian refugees or building the wall to one set of sort bogeyman. Strong arguments at these republicans make real
being kids away from their families on purpose as a deterrent to prevent legal immigrants.
Inga Job Writ large and particularly because and to let people know that these are families that are being ripped apart, who are seeking asylum or not trying to come here and and sneak over the border. Here. These are people who are trying to flee violence to cover this country lawyer
silent you're, not trying to come here and and sneak over the border here, these are people who are trying to flee violence to cover this country. Lawyer,
I think we should do everything we can further dreamers and fight for any opportunity we have to make their case. I agree on highlighting the policy of ripping children and their parents. I think one thing that is
facing and as an argument for actually to talk about immigration? More and not less is this: are these pulls about just how bad than that? If issue was doing a round
dependence- and I think part of the reason is so much of armor,
quality policy right now is defined by what we're doing to stop trumpet is defined by being against what Trump is for, and we should be against what trumpets were
but you know on health care. I think I know the alt the under girding truth of what Democrats or for where for healthcare for all.
I think we're getting close to being for Medicare for all party, but we're for healthcare for on taxes. I know we want a more progressive tax
the rich pay, more and middle class people pay lasted, so we can find the things that help people have up of opportunity, whatever these are simple trees. What's the democratic position on immigration, the close
Then we can go back to his Brok Obama saying where nations
in nation of immigrants. Democrats are afraid of this issue. They are afraid to say here
but I'm for immigration, not just on pieces of it not just on Dhaka, not
just on children being ripped. We ve been apparent not just on asylum, not just on refugees, but what is
our immigration policy as a party? How many people should come in
Should we do at the border? What should we do with people who are undocumented? What should what
the policy be how long till they can get out get on the path of citizenship, all that stuff we have walked away from it basically completely,
in terms of what we talk about every single day, and it means that the only the only argument out there is the Trump argument and the anti Trump argument, but that is a fraction of the conflict
de conversation, we too have about the fact that immigration system is totally broken. Yet look, I think, the moral question of whether we should talk about this and vote on this issue is easy and yet most Democrats agree. Of course we should, but even the political question of whether it smart or not. I do not think the Democrats can just hide from this issue. We got a choice. We don't have a choice, you can, you can not talk about it forever, but Republicans are running on it and so they're gonna be out there making the argument and survey there make the argument into the
wait and have his big megaphone to talk to people about it and we say nothing or we join the argument and I think you're you're right love at that. We have a joint agreement, not just with what you are doing is bad, but here's how we would fix the immigration system like we think that ice.
A bunch of fucking maniacs right now, who were being cruel,
an inhumane to a whole bunch of people in this country. But what does do we do? We want deportations at some point when undocumented people are in this country, and we want any like how you at how many? What are the quotas? How many people do we want in this country? What's the immigration system? Look like you know,
we need? We used to have plans on immigration that we talked about a lot and now because down from has been so horrific on this policy. We don't we're just sort of out there
They're gonna beat you're, saying nothing. They are going to be as saying that you, every democratic congressperson, virtually every single one area of democratic candidate in a competitive district, is going to likely face a campaign saying that they are going
he soft and Emerson Emma's thirteen year lot of those candidates, is their position,
immigration? No, I'm not is that it I'm
soft animals. Thirteen that the extent of your dear you're convict,
on immigration you need to have
something more about what you actually care about. That seems real. That seems like some making people can latch onto so that you can talk about the other issues you care about, so you'll get sucked into an endless debate about immigration. When you need to talk about healthcare and jobs in taxes, that's it well,
We will talk more about these issues with our guest today, as well as Puerto Rico. Congressmen Louis Gutierrez
is their import, regos and making a lot of trips, and we will talk to him as positive.
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Fast as an easy way to pay people back. You downloaded on your phone, you put in the code parts a five dollars goes to you. Five dollars goes to moms demand. Action was helping reduce gun violence, and so that's it that simple. We would like you to download the south. We know it's gonna make your lies here and dumb. Look we're just gonna help you,
If you don't, we don't like you, that's also true. On applied today, congressmen from the great state of Illinois Louis Gutierrez
there's been Gutierrez. How are you
I'm doing well, I'm here importer recall be getting back tomorrow back to Washington DC. By making my night trip,
here and guns and getting ready to get back to work, and if so, what was? The purpose of
this trip to portray guy? Now you can go back and forth quite a bit in and what a things looked like on it. You know at the twenty six year I'll be leaving Congress. I know, and a great one of the biggest reasons is because I really want to dedicate more time. I dont believe that I and other
like me, who want to bring porter, we go to the twenty first century
can live in the United States
And urge the porter written community and our communities, I think we need to make Porter record base. So am I and others we're gonna move here and we're gonna live here in Puerto Rico, starting not next January, so that I can go back deplored and John. It's really simple from me. I dont believe as long as president trumpet
the name of the United States Porter Recall, is going to be completely healed and and be able to re establish itself, and the people was thankfully, so I want to be able to go to Florida, organise an order and make sure for those in the democratic and its into me. It's it's a pretty it's simple, yet it it is a very dynamic situation. How,
We get the one point, one million border region who live in Florida to see the future of their country at its border week. I'll remember,
now, New York no longer have the title as they did website story today. It would not be a man at right. He would be in our land a threat didn't because that is where the largest concentration of wondering about I'm here and sadly, I have to tell you that there are tens of thousands of people they spent the day with no electricity importer Rico. Today. Still there still tens of thousands of people living on the times there are still.
Tens of thousands of people that have no one to return to thought? It is still a pretty devastating situation here. What am I? What do you think Congress can do?
right now to help me. What what do you think that port we go needs the most right now, and can it be
through Congress. Do you think our is at all sort of private jets contribution on this point it can, but what it needs is a president who love the people here. Who cares about the people here who doesn't go around giving up
then you know I'm giving himself a grade and incomes,
then, leave and then removes look. We need a president who cares for everybody and- and we don't have one and that's gonna- be a pretty big-
that's gonna, be one hurdle that we're gonna in the interim period, look their fun but insufficient funds. I give you an example. My colleague Bishop he's the chairman of the natural resources of combating, became down the porter we go in the last month and he comes down enemies of all the electrical gritted damage, but I know a way to save money, but we have to do is change petroleum for natural gas, well, insurance, racking, yeah! That's the way! You see the solution. How can you be a tropical island on Tropical island where three hundred and thirty one days
the year that sun going to pop up for the most part all day where you have the wind coming and I visited Iowa the electricity
oh is generated through windmills, and we know how much more can be done to those in other committees. We need modern solution. We need solutions. That could be quite honest people, one on climate. The mayors are going to provide to the island of coregos.
Look, I'm gonna be here. I'm gonna work here now want to make sure the next presidency debate just like very important decisions on issues for for american, such as women's right to choice and reproductive rights. And how do we take? You write an immigrant right, though we also have the right of the people for the regal to go to work back home to their island, afford regal and to live in a in an hour.
In a society of the twenty first century yeah I saw a lot of people have been talking about the new Harvard study from last week that estimated that the actual death toll from Hurricane Maria could be more than four.
And people are. Obviously the government's official council far stands at. Sixty four would would
You think about the discrepancy here, and what do you think needs to happen to get a full accounting of the true human devils?
asian and Porter, Riga. Well, here's what happened! This is most of your radio listeners and another tonight. I'm going to remember this was president dropped. The came to the island of Puerto Rico last and for a very brief, didn't spend the night here didn't see what happens when the sun goes down
on the other, the porter regard any to paper two hours and when gave himself a tan and innate and try to quiet in silence the voices of assent which he does continuously like the voice of the mare, a fan. One government you mean who was really out there saying look, people are dying and will come into being set
A dire member wants you dead, people are dying, longtime an they wouldn't listen. What day they criticise, go, they be mean her. They did everything they could to destroy your reputation. Guess what Harvard University has confirmed what the marathon one thing people were dying, either thousands and what that our governmental- and you know what this is. I know this is on the american government because, yes, people did die John because of the wind and rain and because of flooding people did die because of that. The immediate.
Right aftermath of that. This is terrible, very strong hurt, eight hundred and forty two hundred and fifty miles an hour win unprecedented under their people die because of that. Yet, but you know what people also died, because ambulances couldn't get the people, because road were shut down. Hospitals
have generators, cause people couldn't go, get their dialysis because they were senior citizens would not oxygen. Why people weren't getting medical treatment of people with the american government didn't send the armed forces the greatest as our boys it anywhere in the world and say you know what we're not invading Iraq but we're gonna. Send an we're. Gonna send people in there to go and help the people of Puerto Rico didn't do it. We are the most powerful. We are the most when I say sophisticated technological innovation in the world and we didn't bring that technology to barrier and that's why people died. People did die because of the hurricane in the immediate impact of major your mother Nature
But it wasn't in the nature of this president to fulfil its promise and his commitment in its constitution a responsibility to the people of Porter Regal. Your colleague Reuben Guy ago tweeted over the weekend that if democratic control and
and he were to be able to exercise committee.
Site. He'd beholding feel hearings right now. Do you
We need a nine eleven commission style investigation into what happened in Porto ego. Do you think they'll be a useful exercise? Let me let me just say this John. I saw the catholic Cargo of Chicago on an airplane, I'm one of my trips of bringing food and supplies and medicine with my wife, and I saw him and I ask them. Why are you going to put a recall you? Nobody told me he said the Pope, the bulk from Rome Ass, the card, although Chicago he didn't. Remember the moon. Let's get a guard or to go down the Florida or to go down the Texas. He only adds to go down a porter Rico why things were
here. Why? Because the response with different here- and so I do think it would be wise to look at this and want to know why, because on? How would I put this done on this is going to happen again right? Motor vehicle is also that hurricane and the changing of
environmental changes on will bring war hurricanes too poor to regos we're going to suffer from global one,
here, importer Rico, they're gonna be more in that gonna be, and so let's prepare the island. So when it comes to the next time there aren't sink worse than there are wired going from one pulled the neck, they can be simply strip doubts because, as we speak tonight, I wanted to know the thousands of people- and I want to put a regal, don't have an electricity and the electricity that some of those do have right, the rest, let it fluctuated, comes and goes so. We really do need to take a really serious look otherwise known about it. You know that there are going to be pertinent coming just like the one that came up. You know that in that the global warming is causing ship in your environment, and you know what I was six hundred people died. You know that that science, you don't do anything- is possible when the next four thousand six hundred people, as you did nothing nothing
to provide sixty four, the people's. What are we going to protect them once over immigration? For a second, you been one of the strongest immigration rights advocates in Congress. You know you, even if you criticise President Obama's deportation and attention policies in the past. What
concerns you most about this administration?
new, zero tolerance policy approach to border enforcement where children are being separated from their parents. Well here, if the strategy of Donald Trump, he beat up, I'm nothing on an immigrant, but it's really a political strategy for the ball of twenty eight June elections. Right yeah, he's trying to fire up is based all this talk about Amistad, teen and border security. If a smokes smokescreen rights for politics right right, so what's happening importer, we go with rapid, lies and hidden away from the camera, with little oversight and he's doing the same thing at the border he's doing look those children, they are fleeing, their
right under the law of the United States of America right there, not a legal aliens reaching our border they're coming from Andorra, though Salvador in Guatemala and and they're coming fleeing, and I just want to say this look. We also have a responsibility because those societies are weak and the state aid, the belated because of the drugs and the drug cartels establish themselves there and we have a responsibility as American for the consumption of those drugs, because once we eliminate our consumption, they have a chance. You see how what happened on one side of the border is particularly impact, one, what happens on the other side and we each have responsibility, but what Donald Trump? Besides I'm gonna rip those children away from their mothers. These people have competence.
Hundred mile under her ended condition. They finally reach their asylum seekers. There being you know it, they got on a boat and we're leaving Fidel Castro's Cuba to Florida. Rice. You would see everybody in Miami reaching out to them and in breaking them what but their leading societies in which there are no protection for the people there and the children are born, audible, the women are vulnerable and we need to understand that they have rights of asylum seekers and it is- and it is inhumane for someone to come to your country's door and said I need your help, because that's how America, with established. That should be something that gives us right to come to your door with their children thing. I need your help. I'm endanger my life is in danger. You know what you do you proud of them under the love of the EU.
The states of America and if they qualify, you give them the asylum that they seek in the light of the baby, because that makes us stronger and better nation. You mentioned the rightly that you know. Donald Trump is using this as a pull this issue as a political weapon. He intends to do so in the fall.
Where's that you know he's gonna, maybe shut the government down again in the fall over the border wall. How do you think Democrats should respond on this?
the issue of immigration because, as you know, some of your colleagues,
especially some of your colleagues in the in the Senate, who were up and twenty eight
in some of the Rehder states have been
skittish on this issue there a little worried about setting the government down over Dhaka? How do you
Think what what's the best strategy for Democrats on this issue? While I hears what I think democratically to understand that the american people
and the border that we can rely on right. The borders it did believe in in
in common decency, job in baronet and then doing? I am our borders. We turn our back on immigrants. We turn our back on our core values, so this is really about who we are ass, a nation. We shouldn't mixed the politics
with it right once you put and then you're saying you know better than republicans you're making political calculations on the basis of people's lives. So here's what I would say, but I gotta tell ya Democrats- have come a long way
A long way I mean a hundred and ninety three members of the house find that discharge petition right so that we get about I'm a dream. I bet unanimous right. You saw what the Senate do. You really think that the Durban and that Elizabeth Warren and people, like Mr Booker, the Senator from New Jersey and an end to those senators, put twenty five billion dollars for walk away. They put the twenty five billion
for what might have been a deep and Donald Trump them walk, but they would be that they wanted to million dreamers to escape the uncertainty and the brutality that come with living in a country that being deported from the only country. So look, they demanded a huge ransom for the dreamers, so Democrats have been ready and willing to sit down, but one another me. It's never been about the wall, the wall as a pretext and an excuse they want to, and legal immigration to the United States of America. They want to say that someone like my mom and my dad. They came to the United States in the nineties, fifties with an elementary school education. They couldn't speak English, that those are the immigrants of today. When those republican congressmen look at those who came before them in their own families, they will find people.
Like my mom and dad just like the immigrants of debates. So that's what they want to do. They want to that family reunification, not the only one who believes this family should have a job, whether in the federal government at the White out or at the company back at home is Donald Trump. Well, guess what families are, what makes so many of our small businesses, the throng entities that they are today. So I will take a Democrat, those who have come here to be joined with their family members, but that's the american tradition rights desert. The discipline of the pilgrims right now they didn't come like the Spaniards has confused about is in search of gold. They came to a badly
There are no America with their families with their work ethic, with their dreams and with their new aspiration. Let's not change that ever.
Congressmen Gutierrez. Thank you so much for joining us from Porto Ego and thank you for everything that you're doing importer Rico
Are you prepared to keep up the good work guy? You doing you took on this area
can I just quickly indoors Michael corn from air of New York? I think Micro companies
here in studio. If he'd like to make, is that what you're platform
most true. Let's go
we could do to me that taxi medallions oughta be bought for a lot of money by the city as soon as humanly possible. That's my first position. It wasn't over a moral duty. A head MP, are what what they goes did to a football,
Patriot sought a good. I got lost in it
well go. This is over. Yet that's all that's offer today. Is it yeah, whereas the outer we were that we ourselves and so that we have any they any other loosens. While we didn't talk about the Eagles, which was just breaking winner,
before we got here, Trump want to talk about racially divisive issues. We get it
He has his message calendar.
This will be a nice as he is amiss. Thirteen
Here's I'm gonna, go after the
fell again if the eagles want to spend time with better Trump supporters. Maybe it would be the Patriot
you have our true nowadays it would be good if the broader press corps would just realise what he's doing, which turn a razor racially divisive issue. No
really give a shit if a fuckin sport singles await us are not sorts move on, don't give him what he wants, which is to have this be the thing we talk about for four days like Fuckin Roseanne, it's why this is in the ultra, maybe only maybe only thirty percent of Europe
thirty percent of here, if you haven't, had a cool third, I think by now it's less. I was eager to others that.
Transcript generated on 2020-04-01.