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difference or don't wait! That's blueprint com such crooked blueprint, a better way to go. Welcome to a special bonus episode of POD, save America, I'm John Fabric, I'm John love it and on time if you talk thousands me thousands me he's not here it comes out here, but it is even the episode, but not for the recording of the introduction to the bonus episode. So we were at south by South West and Austin Texas on Tuesday We had a wonderful discussion with care. Swish Harris Wisher front of the pod friend of the pod has pod on record, and so we, The cross over there are laughs. There are tough questions, love it and terror fast friends. Now you opportunity roadshow. We hope you enjoy the episode and Here it is so we were just sitting stage we're talking about a variety of things of podcast and I'm so excited coming from so

on valley to be able to intervene, white man and exert reacts, a big switch for me. It's usually you know not the sausage best is happening here by, but let's get started into what you guys we're doing. When do we come on when you come on, aren't giving up we're gonna start about what you're doing exactly so? What are you explain? What you're because you ve created pod several podcast. Creating a media company left essentially left wing a media company correct yes, John Mice We we had a podcast called keepin. Sixteen hundred before the election.

You like, then Trump One, and we decided that we didn't just want to continue the package which we may have done if Hilary had one, but we wanted to get back into the game to some extent we ve all been in politics for a long time, and so we wanted to not only have continue. The political progress we were doing but expand to a network of pack has expanded to video should create a progressive media company that didn't just analyze. Politics like we did during keepin. Sixteen hundred, but also, helped inspire activism and an so we start cricket media and where the very early stages, so we have a long way to go, but we hope to be a progressive media company that informs entertains and inspires action. So progressive media companies had not the best history where and thinking. AIR America and we got Rachel Matter. L, Frank in yea,

It is out of that. But it wasn't a successful effort, sinking current others, how do you guys look at this idea of it? John? Would it? What are you thinking? Firstly, air myself to those good idea. Yeah we look. I know, I know they were approach. This thing like: how do we had we build a successful progressive company? I think we're starting from a simple idea of we want to have this. No bullshit conversation about politics is resonate with people. There is a huge appetite for a different conversation that look, but what we're figuring out as we got right when we decided to launch and build it as we go, because we just want to start talking happy parties conversation, but one thing that is for certain is that there are tens, Emily people who are deeply and satisfied with the way they get their political news me the way that we are thinking about it. Is that, like? U turn on cable news and ears like a ton of great journalists, but what you have is world class journalists, interviewing morons and

but that's not a sustainable system. It is not a sustainable system. We all fucking hate the news we turn It makes us feel bad. The content is pretty bad, the waves delivered is worse and you know two dozen. Sixteen we are living in Europe that we lose thrilling. Zircons everybody's whites were cancelled. Thank you for being here you're part of our key demographic people stuck at the airport, a group of people with which were competing with CNN. What was the question so we're gonna? Do Basically, what the fuck are you you're so look we're starting, but you know we started with this podcast Brezhnev Alot of people going to try to figure out ways to bring that kind of a voice, a younger, more authentic ways. You know All these different news outlets are struggling with how to reach with how to reach people and they so many things settled on having a serious of authority are full of voices.

Already, with none of this, with none of the actual authority behind it and- and we just want to sound like ourselves- we want to bring people who know something about politics. You have something to say who care about these issues and aren't gonna part of a stilted dead language conversation that were all very sick, imitated business authoritatively screaming it's just pretty yeah scream. Yes, right version also about soon guys we're at Bill Simmons the Ringer and serve, and that's where you got started with documents, sooner? Why don't you leave because that's about that's what he is doing so not. Why not be part of that particular media? There's a couple reasons one is you know. I think that if the Red one. We probably have kept doing this as a hobby, but when she lost, I think we all have this existential crisis that if you watch the last time, you saw happen in real time where we figured like you know we have. It, didn't feel right to wake up every day and like obsess about politics and what's happening in a country and then go to work

doing something else. For me, I needed to marry those two things up in making that my job in my life never lost that live stream by Great watches breakdown, the actually so I think like like the ringer is doing is great, but it's like sports in culture and news we're trying to make something. That's like progressive in very active as than another, unlike dedicating our lives it is. They are moving done or starting in office, were hiring team like we want to own and have flexibility of creating all the content. Making others that you were the big hit correctly or the big head on on the ringer, correct your words no way, the look I mean I've written bills. Limits for a decade by his stuff is great and it always will be great right. Wingers gonna be, were they when you were they sharing revenue with you. I understand they were not sharing revenue with you and they were paying US dollars. Ok, but dollar they're paying us. You wanted to get the contract out, just great, they are paying us and therefore, what does the part time hobby part time,

and so what I want to start your own thing. I want to do a full time, but so are when we said that, and I said to bill right after the election. We want to settle on thing because we want to not just be partisan but also activist, and I dont think you want this activism under the banner of the Ringer, which also does sports and Texas and he's like yeah. I totally understand interest. We want to do stuff with this company that will have a political benefit that may not have any financial benefit. I think explaining at this one if you're part of a broader organizational rifle. I think we can have that flexibility doing it, but you are about the business, correct them units which are growing going, and you you're one of the top ones and agents. I mean I'm in the bud. Guesses you can make some money. You can actually make some Romania so Are you raising money right now? We're not going to not raising money, know? How are you gonna do

How are you gonna, paying we're, not gonna pay ourselves any money, but when we use the revenue from adds to invest in the business and higher great team and get an opposition outgoing said at the start up route creating, and that can why does he like? The podcast is like our seed money right? another venture front terms the voters are going to know you're talking about our seed round Eddie. I want nothing to do with you. Guys are way way too eager nothing. We don't need you. People were making money hand over fist up where it is very, very against even say that making money in like the content, media game is hard and like that. It's just like not might is its honestly like a joke. It super confusing like everyone's like how are you gonna monetizing, it's easy to start talking about money rules. It can tell. I don't know what other people are doing so clearly we're not raising money. I mean why didn't you

give us money, it's terrible evaluation valuation, John! sailor Mayo priceless in your head? But what is it I mean? I'm gonna have to say: I got us billion dollar is this: how are the resistance So it's on whether resistance, because we both know you're a very tough interviewed by John. I find that ninety five, but I really do enjoy it's easy. We're gonna, have to interview Vigo, maniacs, fairly breakdowns, Garcia, forget about you do or through email. I made mark Zuckerberg, sweat, Namaste ain't, really, India, and the only reason I stopped display thought fall on the ground that I'd have to do CPR and then that picture. When do you just don't want that the options I didn't want any lip action of Mark Zuckerberg Germanic their faces. You won't believe

happened. I'm trying to build a world without doesn't happen at any time. Let's get to Trans speaking in Bavaria appropriately. This go here: Vigo, media, civic, illegal, maniacs trump, even though you know you guys, I did what you on election night. We were weeping copiously and in real time if one can say. Trump has been very, very good to you at this point, because it's a really good tying. It feels like that with us on our side and a lot of media people are suddenly actor. It is an idea use that word may does Like that, I mean the other day. George stepping up was actually got

I didn't know what to do with myself why we are asking a real question that needs an answer rather than softer stuff, so talk about what that? What would you feel the opportunity is now with with the resistance when you talk about the resistance, usually true the paragraphs on everyone we're doing for Trump, not being president right, I thought no, I think, he's very strongly silver linings at the selection, but what we have at least seen over the last couple months is that it has burned a level of activism and engagement in interest in politics ex that I haven't seen since the early days of of seven or eight when Obama started running, and even then you know me because this is this? Is people who we are talking to people and people are coming to us that never pay attention to politics before or have just sort of casually paid attention to politics before

another thing I'm scared. I want to know what to do. I want to fix it with what should I do? Where should I go and using these people showed the temples and you're seeing them show but rallies in March, and so, if, if we can, if that movement can come out of this, and you know we can survive the Trump residency and people can be engaged than you know, that's a very good thing for democracy and how and how do you feel that their? I think that's right. You know this is where the main international crisis. There is a lot of people who are scared and worried and are either people have penetrated politics. I've never been more engage or the kind of person that wasn't paying attention either way their showing up. Our protest are showing up at airports there they're trying to figure this out and there's so much coming at us. There's so much Crazy stories and an end, so it's hard to figure out what to trust that its origin, no sobbing eternal news in their so little sense of history, so you have to find out like wages. What trumps doing today is this normal? Isn't? It is? Does this just seen? Batteries would like

Firing firing. Yours attorneys. Is that something that happens every time? Well, yes, they do with a normal wait, no kind of way. This kind of not we and there's so much coming out us there's so much departs if we can play some small role in say: hey, you know, look we ve been every working in politics. We can get the people that we trust that really smart help us figure this out. I got so that's it. I am proud to be a part of it will be a small part of a small part of that an and bring on people Here's what you can do. I know you want to help and we ve never done it before. I know you'd never bring to a protest before individual town hall. Before this is great, indivisible. You know we're talking because their new, when they're trying to figure this out, you should go to their website go go, go be a part of what they're doing so when you think about this tiny that when it comes it cause if it round getting, bill, activating getting brutal doing things, a lot of commitment to the tea party that is sort of the left tea party, You see that. Do you imagine that possess super effective. They were very

they are very organised. I think their tactics that you can borrow in terms of organizing in terms of being present, in terms of just remembering how easy it is citizens and constituents to scare the shit out of Congress because of the pressure works and it works fast and they can quickly as we're seeing uneasy airfield. I think, like we are part of a group of organisations that is riding a wave of interest in in Trump, and we approach this business with him, he'll, humility, because we are aware of that, but I think what level was saying earlier, like eight there's a cathartic effects to like when everyone around you you're watching this thing happen, you feel like it's crazy and you look at the data see this too. I think hearing people who worked in the White House and then we did legacy. Helpful reminder that no you're not crazy, like what's happening as and where part of that Do you feel that you all worked in the Obama administration? Do you feel, like you're utter failures of what's happened

occurred to me. Because a lot of ways like I want to get to the idea like every morning things change in summing up. This is a reaction away and it is a failure. I don't wanna be Vashon, listen You personally feel I'm gonna be like the reflexive defensive Obama, guy and encoded in my dna, and I can't fix that. But I do think I think elections are unique events. There are about one individual verses, another individual. I dont think you can blame everything on a predecessor in any election. We should Wales we should. We should thank God that Trump took office with relative peace and prosperity and not in the middle of a crisis like when Obama took office because God help us there we're in the middle of a crisis right now, from took over, I mean, like I think, Obama accomplish quite a bit and two terms. Where would you attribute the reaction to because, even if you can say how resource candidate are she wasn't like whenever that fucking Wanna say about pilloried? In that part, it got really way to close given

for sure eight, yet the without way to demand that our who was the can measure yes things had to go wrong for Donald Trump to become. President call me emails all that stuff, but big things did make from possible big cultural, political, economic forces open the door to someone I trump. Your blog Obama, took office in the middle of a massive financial crisis. He was handed a really a bunch of messrs all around the world and at home we spent the eight years doing a lot of good work from rebuilding economy, the stimulus getting into health care Wall Street, all the different things that that that amount to an incredibly successful legislative and administrative pure time that beings like then solve every problem in the world and there are long long term.

Friends that are really difficult to address. You know one of the aims that we talk about. We talked to South Multi yesterday and we we ask sort of, like you know, look there's this anger. There's exploit the economy. Could you see talking about the new economic vision? What you Democrats be saying in the thing that he said we are, if I'm actually he's a little bit inspiring like we'll figure it out now. You know that that that it did this election does one thing. It shows us that, like when the centre left and centre right when they're not offering answers, it opens the doors to monsters and that's: what's happened to you wouldn't get bigger one in five Trump voters gave Obama positive approval, ridding job performance what they want.

Pulse sure. So this was there was a mean. It is very, very well when you ve been in office for eight years right. There is a feeling of people want change right at the end of the day, if you had a positive image of Hillary Clinton, you voted for her. If you are a positive image of trompe voted for him. If you didn't like either candidate, which was about twenty percent of voters, they voted for Trump. I about seventeen points because he was the outsider that they didn't like verses were Hillary Clinton was which the insider they didn't like right and so there's a lot of complicating factor but in the end is that simple? It was sort of a change that ended up being a change has to change things, see any is much more dramatic than that that things people didn't see. I think that but when a casual observer, I'm saying that lot, a lot of people who go to the polls it into the day do not pay attention to politics as closely as we all pay attention to politics because their busy they were busy lies, and so they sort of look at it from afar. And when you squint and look at the whole thing from afar, you say he sort of crazy, but he's an outsider. So maybe you can bring change. She don't know if I like her, but she's, been there forever

I'll, give him a chance and that that Tipp, the election close and I do- but I think I think it is really important for Democrats for liberals to ask what what weren't they getting right and what do they want to be different, like what are the economic policies that were either not describing while or not offering, and I think that's a conversation is ongoing. The important thing you know we're right now. Really much really Democrats feel united because against a terrible vow, but as we move forward and become more and more important for us to have a positive measure, what arable farming areas we want a great, great and historic villain evil rises in the east who, when it, what does that say, hey, don't go anywhere This is pod, save America and there's more on the way POD save America's brought you buy, zip recruiter. Are you hiring Do you know where to post your job, to find the best candidates posting your job and one

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it's gotta easy to play against tromp as the bill and what fresh hell is done today, right, you're. Actually, like the other day, I think someone I went to the shower and he did something I was in the shower. Like five minutes, the episode mired Sally AIDS quickly, but we get always be against the villain is always the appealing character you think about just drama you're. All your live. Thus aunt. You live in San Francisco, but must sandals? it's easy to have an appealing villain a centralized. I think what this has been turned in is another thing to have a message, and one of the things that I think was problematic for the the Clinton. The Clinton campaign is a lot of people both on the coastal leads really did make fun of make Amerika great again. I thought it was a great slope and I thought well. That is a really good to really good slogan it make. It is a very appealing, makes you feel good and bad at the same time, it makes you feel like you want to do something, and then, when I such

together? It felt like a glue commercial May I was like oh, Kay Worst honoured again didn't like get you what what? What is it message for the democratic right and then I want to get into all tromp all the time like. What? How do you guys cover this? What do you think about? How he's doing something devil? How do you we're is the message? Does you all were involved in messages like we're what a lot and estimate. I mean that this is the major politics that, for the last eight years, the message the Republican Party was Obama, sucks and we're not Obama right and that led them to victory and has the Senate did it it now? I do not agree that, we should just do the same thing and for the next eight years and say we're not trump or no time, because I do think you need a positive message and they what was tough? What was tougher Hilary suffer. That campaign is just what you were saying, which is you got that you give a big speech on the jobs in the economy and then suddenly the access Hollywood tape comes out right

and the next day she can't go, do another event on jobs in the economy, because no one's covering that because Trump just said this crazy thing ray and so everyone, the clink campaign, excluded, kept getting sucked into the vortex of tromp right. And so I think, if we looked at twenty eighteen and twenty twenty, there is going to be a temptation, because Trump is going to continue to do in crazy things and tweet crazy things every single day just make your message everyday about what he did right. But what you have to do is talk about jobs, the economy, health care and your positive vision, frolic, there's a broader part problem here, which is, if you look at the research of like how people in parties to find themselves for the first time in history Democrat

are more defined by being opposed to the other than anything they stand for, and I think we need to do a lot of work figuring out how to get to where they stand for cars. I got an ongoing message out: a new economic quality health care, social rights, meaning that, like stringing, these together into a core message, is something I don't think happened sufficiently the last round. What do you think they sound? Like? I think principle. This is one of the lessons you know Kelly Conway, who obviously huge fan of love her work especially hurt her unama morphine of early work, and, unlike the reasons that but nobody, but she said this they had actually to me tell the smartest thing. Anyone simply said about the election, which is there's a difference between what offends you want affects you and that's the way. I think we're Andrews understood. I think that's it. We instinctive

there said, but it was really hard to cut through with all the trump nonsense and which is, you know, stronger together, love trumps hate these about these are about kind of values and and how things feel and how things look. And we needed to make the next step and we need to make our next step into you know it's not just the trumpets conducting business, immoral logo and being brought to do it. It's that that's gonna, hurt you its effect. The decisions you max, I think, coming back to, on the one hand like how terms policies actually heard people or not dragged into the vortex of his bullshit can be really hard and on the other side I think we're not can have,

and what I M accredit MESSENGER Democrats. I lost elections up and down the board. We had to figure it out as a really hard problem. I also think you can start from the question of what's the message which the slogan you have to answer. The big question, the big question right now is that we stop that neither party has answered is how, in a global economy, to we live together and thrive together and make sure that everyone has a chance to succeed and where's. The next generation of jobs can come from and, as we become a more diverse nation, how do we make sure that we can live together in an you know, not always demonize each other great and so there's questions of or opportunity comes from? Was prosperity comes from? How do we ensure some basic level of decency and equality in the society, and once we come up with those answers, then you can sort of tell

story that leads to a slogan leads to a message. Re like make Amerika great again only work, because there is actually that he's told the whole story that went what that slogan yet Ray, and it was a sorry that we agree with, and I again I think, a story that in many ways wrongly miss characterizes where the country is, but there was a story to fit it ray. It's what was interesting was the reaction to that which I found interesting as any great insight. Familiar reaction really great, I mean it would seem the sort of like the irritating person at school You know I mean like that you're wrong, but you're wrong. I think a lot of left spends a lot of time being righteously indignant Kimberly these and about Romania time you're, like a fuckin said it, like you, said it that again they said it again. Well, look I think I did you. Can make an argument why make em why America is great? I think you should certainly make that argument, but you have to be fleshed out. That argues that, then you aren't, you can't just in front of it also giving fund an annual arguing you're on his agenda almost consistently almost consistently. All democrats do is react knows how the entire election

Now as I wanted, I can't believe you suddenly LISA you know you like on the far right they have. This vicious your and hate left. We have our version, which is just incredibly annoying sanctimonious, unlike highlights four sanctimonious right, Oliver Twitter on and have you known here, so you I've noticed now it's getting funny actually is getting I find, which is what you guys are dear sir, just how dare you effect, which no sir, that is not what America rather more lecture. They're gonna lose like this a load programmes, somebody tweets, are out of work, less hypocrite, So what we can to Germany, which so what Democrats do have one a few more than just gonna pile through which ones do say we're. Having look the? U like what HU? We who like? Could you like couple Harrison

with worn set molten? Who we talk to yesterday Jason Candour? Decent, cannot mean that there is an that's, not a dozen there's, a lot of bring people out there do you like it so I'm begun They are only one that doesn't feel like a non carbonated. Beverage is worn. What so very big other non carbonated that airlines I ve been on bubbly some ok, let it go up I gotta go. I don't understand I've just Ivan Non Carbonated. I get it. I know I've I've now getting it. I just wasn't. I was there not carbonate right right right, right, ok got one. I think this is going. I very big on politicians who talk like normal.

Things like, and I think we all some of the people- the people just mentioned very- had we accomplishments of MILAN yesterday and he spoke like we're speaking right now. He did not do the talking point up. My men, like he just didn't, do any that stuff right and Jason's like that and others before, and certainly like that, I'm Harris's like that. You know so I there's a good government, but I think sometimes as Democrats we think about like Razumihin, where you're from and whose the perfect person on paper and all that stuff. I think that's a mistake. I think you just need to, like I always said after the two dozen for election, when John Kerry lost them in cities to a leader, east and aloof from that kind of stuff ever and said. Well, we lost the white Working class, and so the answer is someone who has to connect with the white working class. We need a southerner. We need a populist right if you had told someone after the two dozen for election, that the answer to the democratic parties way working class problem was

black eye from the south side of Chicago Imbracus, Saint Obama? They would have told you you're fucking crazy, but, like four years later he was present sending a tramp and the same thing with Trump at exactly Enzo people like Brok about my and Donald Trump, Bernie Sanders and Michelle Obama will come from very different backgrounds. What they ve all have in common is when they speak in communicating they very comfortable in their own skin right they are not. They don't speak in a lot of bullshit. I think that's important is we're. Looking and look. I think that the person who run who wins and twenty two when the democratic nomination we might not have, we might have any idea who that is especially this gonna world, but as we're looking for leaders who rise, I'm looking for people who talk like normal human beings, what are you listening to me? I mean I think Johnson articulated believe as a show here, but I agree that you know I for John Edwards in two thousand for, and that was the per

example like a resume base candidate railing, looking southern guy that could appeal the x Y, see state and that's if you think like that, you wind up like an Evan buyer John Edwards reckoning I think he got real, interesting, quick, unimpeded push that other stuff. First, I would even like I'm down with you, and we therefore raised was pre all the worst and John Edwards ha. I gotta get turned. Do you like Look we taught by the time. I agree. We agree on this yeah. I like it our less? Do you like any in the Tec leaders or business leaders like present? mark: Zuckerberg! Isn't it? I do you know what let's talk about every second area of visiting idle, what's going on over their mark. Zuckerberg has

Great story tell he built a pretty present company and I dont understand. Why sounds like a senators? Fourth term like just talk, man, don't be so afraid, like that's a less trouble, is president say what ever you want anyone can only to everyday. I worry that people are gonna take from this. If that billionaire celebrity outside of politics can run for president. So can they all are saying they all say that, but like it is it's about the personality, it is not about the regiment and like if there is a tech leader who goes out there and just you know, this has a no bullshit conversation with the american people, but what we need to do then yeah, maybe they have a shot of an idea that has been done as I could work thing is like he is, they are so cautiously statements are cautious. Everything is calculated, it does it, so Washington. I kindly it'll change, maybe look out our will to and like the they were tongue in immigration, and they put out such a overworked. You know, and it

rightly good people, but but somehow we comes from the top and you end up with something so overworked and so precious and that didn't say anything that what you doing the is president you gotta say ethnic rights. Will it's very hard to get them to Dolly. Amazing is a good thing, though, as I also worried that there's this sense or you can apply text any problem and that's how solving the ground, I heard someone say that we're gonna hack, the refugee crisis on the loose macbook my very complicated problems involving human beings in governments like the oral questions is not that easy. You know so like that sort of way when a gardener had sent him around the fake news, tougher hoaxes, I'm caught using the term hoaxes figures word has gotten back home hoaxes. And I think one of the things has been hard is that the response of the mark as usual, with its initially started like we have no impact on anything. I don't know what you're too, where benign platform, and in certain that you know guns

kill people, people give people a kind of attitude and I might actually bullet skilled people but technically, but would you make big big news? Kills people sort of like does anybody, but it was interesting that shift of these we're just benign platforms and we're here to help the world versus the consequences to your actions, and I think they're starting the penny, is starting to drop and mark start with the six thousand word essay, which could have a lot of editing by but in that zone like ok, maybe possibly we have an impact, and rightly so, are we when it we're not immediately replied well, you're, something new and right under both an important role to play, and you can't pretend you don't yeah. So talk about tramp tramp, tramp, tramp tramp because we love talking How do you guys feel about? the care and there, the repeal and Trump CARE Obamacare light how you looking at last to be going swimming.

I think it's happening right now? Is Republicans and Donald Trump or reckoning with the fact that they told their base lies about Obama care for the last eight years and now they're the dogs who caught the car end this the congressional Budget Office a bunch of non partisan nerds who crunch numbers you know came out yesterday and said that it would leave twenty four million people uninsured and and also said that,

it'll raise premiums, and then premiums will finally start to come down, and twenty twenty six may only be as older people won't be able to afford health insurance. So because the older sicker people are uninsured and premiums might come down further, be after the debate, they, like the planets, like if you're like in your untiring, you don't go bankrupt before you get Medicare like wrapper sulphur in some like bubble rap, so they very com. Try not eat healthy, but the problem is grace they, so they tried to make a bomb care this. Oh, it's a government take over its actualized medicine death panels. All these hoaxes conspiracy theories and the truth is that about my care was a rather conservative version of Universal Healthcare, marred ideas from raw meat from the Heritage Foundation, individual mandate, all of these policies, the people on the right had been taught. For four years, and so because, because they have been branded it, as this, like government, take over thing, even though it really wasn't now that they're trying to fix it, there's no wherefore where to go on the right, except to say the government

have any responsibility to ensure people in their base. Like Donald Trump has not president, because a lot of people wanted to lose their healthcare. That's not one fact. When he ran for president, you promised he wouldn't cut medicate that promises already broken with this. He promised he would cover. Everyone have insurance that promises already broken and he's been very successful and lying to people in gas, letting people and stuff, but once people start to get these cancellation notices if this passes or ones realize that they can afford to get their healthcare anymore. Like he's not can be able to lie his way through the that's going to be felt. What do you imagine going to happen now with em in the media has been supermassive on it but right media. Does this, then it? Oh, he wins. That kind of thing it is in that way, it is like a boy has never been used. Every president right into the first thing you tried to pass over everything also announced but executive orders. The first thing is actually tried to pass through Congress, since he's been pretty amazing journey see if you commit to this right because he everyone's and while he gets up their knees like I'd, tell Paul Ryan and the gang that we should just let it all crime.

Sunburn for two years and get the political consequences of the benefits, but that's not right. So, what's pat push this bill as he reads coverage of how bad this bill is, as he sees Republicans peeling off. I wonder if they committed to pushing this through, because I dont know that it's not clear to me what the constituency is for what they're trying to deal besides Paul Ryan's, stupid, Powerpoint in a better way, yeah, so varieties are Breton, even bright bar today, Turning on the bill? Yeah? That was interesting. They publish the pall right yeah, so I don't know, what's going on there playing its like and help the bunch of idiots playing chess and our relations with like I'd like we were playing chess, but we don't really know the rules, but I'd also don't know the rules God, I was coming on each other, their larger, maybe right. Yes, we who knows easy Republicans in the Senate say this bill can ever got you Tom caught in the Senate says. Why would you? Why would the Republicans the plague on this bill can never pass the Senate and the like there's a big there's, the Van diagram of like there, the bill.

To be really. The bill needs to be evil enough to pass the house and bad enough, and and and and given up tax cuts to the region and restrict the subsidies enough to pass the house, but then needs to be reasonable and often modern. I together the Senate has meant that may they may not be an overlap, there's no, the numbers of three and twenty two, the republic, and if it was twenty, two has members that camp ass in the house there was three centres that camp ass in the Senate, so you could imagine, maybe Paul Ryan, getting enough republican congressmen to vote for the bill either the way it is now my trunk brow beating them or by making it like love. It said even further right, even if that happens, there is now eight republican senators have gone on record in the Senate, having problems with the bill right and they can only use they so tough but I do think is this: why did this happen during the campaign like it all, looks messy from the outside right now and we can all laugh at it, but like we have to be part of this fight. If we want to stop at this is now the most winnable inconsequential fight yet of this presidency, and every cent person has to stand up and speak out for it because it

only where we're going to stop. So what do you imagine something where we think we got up and then it gets out again like he somehow a couple times over the death It does not breaking bad a bit, maybe like that. I don't know. Maybe I so we have to fight it's really hard to pass legislation where protected by the intervention of our governments, but you know, is there a chance? We we think we have them in our grasp and slip through our fingers, yeah sure and then Lena I don't know, but bullock, there's also aid. If nothing passes, the Trump administration would need to shore up some of these markets, where some of these insurers have been leave

anyway, we're leaving lesser the Bamboo administration, which is a very flexible thing. You just in our view, provides more subsidies. You make sure that people by health insurance with the mandates of you can make it work. They can decide if nothing passes, we're gonna, let it not fail, but we're gonna, make sure, doesn't work and then try to blame. The Democrats like that very well could have economic, so you feel instead found. This point is this: It doesn't look too good, but I, like I said I think it's up to it- is up to and wherever the prediction business in other annually, and it is up to wiretapping. How do you feel about four What part of that autonomy, the one you put on a pair of overalls, black hat when it jumped out, open it? where do you make of ammunition got in there with the wires Tommy's at all, lot ice cream is what I said grimly honour the tv frankly, I gotta know what people so worked up about

Why? What do you mean that the broader story think of its trumps, crazy, wiretapping, tweet? is something we ve been watching for, while which is he consumes not media, but conspiracy theories weather. Bright Bart or some random guy who tweets at three minutes. People voted illegally in California, any regurgitate it to the next step right. So I don't think he understands what a fine court is. I don't think he understands what why Tapping really means there may be in may be the case that there were some collection of information regarding contact from a service to the russian Bank. Like that's something we're reading about, but the pressing I'd say: it's cannot order the wiretapping of an american citizen period. That's visa reforms after Nixon because he did that against political opponents just why we accuse ticketed just wake up Saturday morning, pissed off at the world in tweet that the former president I'd say it's wiretapped you so much

mentally insane. Where do you think you are coming from low people do think it's all calculating followed, wasn't very loving. And it together united, write anything like that struggles with a lack of self worth, so he so we in fact its own set of eager, but but at the end of the day he hates himself amounts. There's no amount of attention and praise that can fix that problem and it sort of, just circle. We get angry that that this this awful. If your guy he's waiting resell paying a homosexual in There- and I was like let's go there- I don't like myself- and I love being he has advisers around him like then in who is feeding him. This bullshit and in the most pressuring part of this, is like

He controls the entire intelligence apparatus of the United States. He hears the coolest job in the world. He could ask for any piece of infamy. Any time whenever he wanted it, he doesn't do that and intellectually carry the ancillary healthcare confide. I am certain that it is a delicate one hundred area, fifty one, the moon Lending did it actually happen. I know who killed. They know what happened at the exact either there like. Ok, to prove this claim. We're gonna ask Congress to investigate the executive branch who runs the executive branch today, their blaming and on their logo with those airports, are you on Monday in waiting about that? The reaction wanna go just, as does the most important thing to write like dropping gonna. Do a Donald Trump is he's he's in a new and strange house, but he's behaving in the exact same way like it. It's just going through the motions. What is what is so dispiriting whatsoever,

breaking what so enraging? What makes this so painful is he now had. He is a defended by people who know better on the hill refused wholesome accountable, and he has people around ten people like Sean Spice, Kelly and Conway Rights previous who have given up any semblance of their integrity to create and to create a way to make trump. Not look bad, so actions by Sir says we're in a recent statement, verdict Greece to investigate that. It's all just a way to deal with the fact that the president is jackass and and and lying and and and horrible, and they know it and their there there selling their souls to defend it, and why I don't know ambition right, not thinking it through fear barrier of the burmese people decisions, because their bases all worked up, or they think that there are public and bases all worked up because they are, you know, incited every day by the Sean handling of the world and in the bright parts, and so these people get spun up and

the politicians are like well, we can't go against the base because then we'll be attacked by bright bird. It's all fear of losing their jobs, and we will talk about this. Oh backstage I mean you see all these tech companies, Sir dipping their toe and being a part of the advisory panel. I think that's an incredibly bad idea. Whereas I think if you put your lot in with Donald Trump you're gonna own a lot of shit, he does, even if you think you can distance yourself. That specific thing that we're all in trouble University now that we want our money back, you're learning a lot like you, teachers, there. Feeling, though, that is part of a bigger master plan that it's all all the chaos and mania is doing all it can you factor

Nationalism is not that hard. It's not that hard to incite people against another. I also mean this is the heart of the Democrats. Have the chance Democrats have all the time is that we believe in governing and governance in trying to find no ground, Steve Ban in stated purposes, easel Leninist and he wants to burn the thing down, so maybe that's the master plan and that ascribing alot of in wattage behinds or of the daily execution of that plan, but they have all the levers of government, so they should be those that is the exact point. It is so much easier to burn down a barn. Then too, you know make people believe that government can work for them. That is the heart or challenge. So no matter what happens, we will always have the more difficult challenge, because governments screws up a lot of time and then it and at least people behind and so like it's not perfect and forbidden in four trump. It's not genius to say all your problems. You can blame it on this person that doesn't look like you or you can blame it on politicians who can blame it on that.

Super? Even that's why Brok Obama, maybe the maddest he ever was when Healthcare dug up didn't work, because right now I have been trying to talk about like on the campaign of seven or eight you type by making government cool again right, because all politicians run it down, criticise it, and rightly so in a lot of instances, but like there's, some basic competence in some basic need. Therefore, a lot of people and when that didn't work that infuriate him, because it undercut the faith in absolutely we're gonna build. Astonishing with astonishment tender, works every day website or actually said I now make the press and like a group of white guys and me on the numerous manner, which is very exciting. For me and I said with tender worse every day and they like you, comparing you no help guarantee tender, don't know tinder works, you can get fucked easily

David Irving over. Do you not think it was one of those guys they thanked me? Responsive America? Stick around more ratio coming away Budget America's brought here policy genius, if you dont have life insurance. What I've been financially. If something happened to the primary earner, life insurance is a good idea protect the ones around you. It so hard to me. Jokes during the policy life insurance adds. I mean it's important to have. It should say just get life insurance policy genius darkened the best online life insurance market place with the most accurate quotes from the top Waited life insurance companies they place over five in dollars and life insurance for people like you, they have a very simply user friendly website to shop and compare all the top rated life insurance companies and give me the best options while you there, check out there in other insurance offerings like health, insurance and pensions insurance pundit and here S. What is that? I want to show much thought it worth. Pundit I mean pray Mr Lamy, like health insurance for your dog go depositing, has done today to save over

represent off other praises for life Terence Wynn, life insurance, compete for your business you're, the one where's the money? That's p, o L. I see why g g and are you dot com, zero jargon, sales pressure or hassle life insurance made easy, don't wait. Gotta policies must dot com to day when you think about this demonstration. So do I use dared, or are you just like what I'm gonna Fuckin goat Rodya? This is above I'm scared. Sometimes why is that? Why is it it's nothing, out of control. I dont think right right now, the World is a relatively stable place. Right now with the United States is- and I am very worry me? It's all fun and games now we can make them for wiretapping those other kind of these crazy conspiracy theories, but when a crisis hits, I dont know how he's going to react. I don't think it's going to be well and so that that that sort of keeps that's what keeps me I mean I was in the necessary staff

I was a low level two bit spokesmen, but I sat in a lot of meetings where I saw very serious people making decisions, and I understand that, like the work that you have to do to like manage. North Korea is ongoing and constant in requires pushing the government in and bring them together in working these problems everyday. I have no sense of that's happening. You add to a John said, like when Brok Obama, when you more frugal, bluebottle web tradable up

in over Detroit or or you know, when any the various of crisis hit weather. Is it that domestic shooting, where terrorist attack he first and foremost viewed his role as were talking about the resilience had states, unlike bringing people down and making sure there wasn't hysteria, and you know turning on each other. I I do not think that will be done. Trumps instinct. I do not think that will be Stevens instinct. I think they will see a political opportunity, also robot marked into office. The gathers this economic crisis right. No one wanted to take a vote for the financial bail out. No one wanted to take a vote for the auto bail out, but oh bomber Democrats and some Republicans came together to do that. Knowing that was gonna be unpopular because they knew that if they did not do that, the economy would have collapsed and the global economy could of collapse. With that took some political courage. I could not see this Congress and, as president

in those same either any Republicans John, which ones do like. Ah events ass is really interesting and has had some integrity just an ambush yeah. I mean man, some people that I would not expect a like. It's not that hard. It's like. Are you sick, so said modern right demo, we had a monastery yesterday and he was saying that in the house she goes now. Germany works out with a bunch Republicans and when there, in the German there talking, they all know how crazy Donald Trump as they all know, what he's doing is wrong and then they put their suits on it. The podium and they lie, and it's not that hard to show intact in this moment- and there are very few who have done me- John Mccain up and running the maverick play longer than like stocks in the long run, the pic unroll Riley bids. Sign their horizontal minorities spoke out. So I mean I do think, there's an italian. What they're saying I'd love to see them like going a little harder here right, and then the grim have an act, go ahead, act in the attic and worked very well. Our ethics, as he's a cell

Waller from them up at a half hour. I hate this RO? Madam president, like there's a lot of political operatives, the Republicans who's that are spoken, I decided this is now could be, Might Vienna Weather Nicole Waller, Sittin Miller or Stuart Stevens or Mcmurphy. Allow these folks were wrongly people Bush people. So, but it's funny, when you get to elected office, he actually using fewer You don't see if you have a marble finish up on the media itself and then we'll get this, because we have a whole bunch of questions just one or two minutes on that How do you look at how the media has performed here in general, the jet, the genuine there's lots of different is print media others, but there's all pretty much the same. How do you look about him? a year and a half ago, I was meeting with some there. I was at a party and there is all of campaign reporters from the wash imposed whilst you drop and they were all treating Trump like a circus act. There really always not then- and I think he's kind of interesting though you thank like though I might make America rather earlier. You don't know what you're talking about at the powers that

We will not let Trump win and I said: are they gonna shoot him because otherwise I don't see how they can stop him, because he's really appealing and an episode of them What is missing in action? I think you think they have recovered that now. I've learned not to lump the media Owen together, Ganz when they have been trying to do. I think journalists, people who go out and do reporting, have done an outstanding job and they bear even better job and the Trump error. I think that political analysis is still as broken as it ever has been raging raging, dumpster fire filled with idiots. This campaign, rejects and valueless creeping back up because it is not easy. Hungary mania I am referring eighty coming to Johns way like I think, there were decisions made earlier on, I want more careful about. This, too, is like I could not work if we were what we're doing careful after Eric Avenant neurons. Thirteen minutes left neurons

we were very critical, the media in it's important to talk about like what the criticism was a lot of those cable news. A lot of it was business decisions made by topping all to show trump constantly, while their reporters I mean now without now. Do you think there? I think, they're a hell of a lot tougher on him now than they were before tat. You think, there's a dumpster fire! No in terms of reporters I've ever more there's a guy tapir like he's doing tough journalists mega is actually either I think that what happened in the run up to the election, I think that there was this presumption that Hilary point will be the next presidential they treated her like someone to be held accountable for being present and they treated Trump like a tv show little bit I mean I will always remember that the New York Times always what now. I remember the New York Times on the day that they had four or five email stories that blanketed the front page

and now it was about the letter. It wasn't about omens letter only let her know allegation there was. There is no proof, there's no nothing. It led the entire New York Times a week before the election and then the night before the election. When call me said no, we just kidding by the way just getting. Nothing was wrong. Here. She's fine, NBC, nightly news lead with Hillary Clinton, avoids email controversy on final day. That was, but that was which is. Why did she, but but as a bit where we talk you, don't you see my hand who need immediate, really oriented area fire, so I think that they ve been chastened. I think that one thing that is been learning? How to do is how do you deal with a fact that the present a liar and that you catches just reporters accusations? There's you know their bright spots and and and and failures, but

Yeah. I think that we have a problem of the conversation around politics is broken. The journalism is excellent, but is also like the ones. I think we think about constantly is like people getting information. Different ways. I think of your betting, on cable news being the primary way, people getting political news and ten years you're crazy right, so we're trying to figure out how to reach people entirely mobile, adding a pot cast a part of that, but I think like what this chat folks are doing good luck. America, Peter him. You like, if you're, not thinking about these people, who aren't googling Rocco Obama are going and why times I combat how to reach them where they are now, I'm not gonna be communicating with the people you need to reach and if we don't figure it later, some than our lock. The hoaxes are gonna reach. Now they're gonna get it on their facebook, so you haven't John Filter and sanction. That's body. Let's sorry about that. I as an idea. Let's get this ingress, let's see what do you think of what is happening in France

right now, what the right the rise of the far right wing, marine, the pen and berries, scurry, it's weird here the convergence of rhetoric and that you now you see like NATO for Steve Bandit Real, a pen like meeting having conversations in Europe. We should be nervous about Europe for a couple reasons. I think they are susceptible to some of the fake news. Like russian hacking things we saw, they were so for me then our election and get something. This are sounding the alarm on rightly so. I think that they have dealt with look, we're really lucky to have two big oceans on either side of our country, and we have a very safe, steady borders. They do not and what has happened in Syria. Iraq in terms of the refugee crisis, has been disruptive and its adding onto a problem of a failure to assimilate communities together and in people feeling, disaffected and unemployed. In doing that,

problems as well. I think you know it makes me very nervous about the ability of nationalism to really work to push. Someone like her with some pretty boring use. Its angle is frankly and easier cell in Europe. Then it is here, gonna happen here and in the Dutch. Her stick kings fabric, its passing that Germany is sort of the bulwark against all right. I don't think I've wrongly Merkel in Angola are what are your plans skip crooked media, more diverse boys. I would agree with that. You all somewhat look the same. Us too. I was told that being gay doesn't count, you know, doesn't count homeward This use there is like trying to get into nursery schools and San Francisco used to be easy. But now there's Germany Gaze with children terrorists with her two years, which is why, like

that's my like pens doing like an anti Galileo, the Abbe like Bittersweet, yes, exactly a little bit of we get over that buy back. Yes, we do. I know it's, I don't want them to have a pleasurable vertical. This is something we talk about and think about a lot because is important to us for a number of reasons. Important task, as we know, we have planned spots when you're, like literally same looking same age, same work, background and we're missing perspectives. We're trying to create a company, that's going to reach a whole. Verse of people. I think they were working on diversifying our team internally as we strive to hire. People knew where two months, company rights and I have been like- made a lot of decisions yet, but that's very, very, very important, more tied cast him more didn't we end. We were trying to request both people to join crooked media, that have diverse perspectives, verse voices and are coming from different backgrounds and us indifferent views, because

You know I think a year from now. I don't think this is a company that x set up for us too to talk. I think it's a set up its company that, like brought together really smart, interesting people, do have a better conversation about politics and we might not be a part of one of these countries. We don't want to be revealed just around us. Nothing here want diversity of background diversity of viewpoints, diversity of life. Experience like that is incredibly important. This company, that's what we're about as we go beyond just the three of us, which it is really time? How kind how many we started, because we're friends I drank children, that state aid rank them ass, an ear though here the left, the left wing tubers do brows or whatever dispose of due process then sets up and then I said compared to the Tec, Deuce brows compared to the right wing post. You know there's list, You said where we, unless they said oh you're at the top, but it's really low bar walter, but I'm so I miss that conversation. I know you did

that you would have shows that are to come. You look at you, dont want to just like fill in slots, but what good is the thinking behind that noise is work for one? It's like it's not feeling slots that not everything but at all, it's like bringing people to table its partners to help make every single decision and who are diverse and perspective in backer like understandings. We don't know so that's part of it, but then I mean are four show is with friends like these without Amory Coxey Chanel Subscribe, and I think it's great her show is about bringing people who disagree together and bridging divine right, since the content in the video and she's gonna call different ways like her first episode was she interviewed a pastor who both of his cabbies in Wisconsin voted for Trump, so she got that Britain, and you know she then had a great interview with a friend to the whole episode was being the black friend. That was her second episode, so

she's? Really it she's doing great thinkers. You'd want not like. I don't just want ideological, partisan differences, but differences across race and religion and having all these uncomfortable regulations which, right in saying family, Thanksgiving Dinner, essential executive has a right. U S has never been right as right for tyranny. Could it be a gift that tramples comforted people back to reality and to care as an external uniting threat? There is this all mean that you now he's going to king trunk? Do you think that to fill out, or do you think it's just being used scare people? I think that its personnel is really hard to predict. I think being afraid that he's gonna become authoritarian, a true full authoritarian. I think it's, I think, it's more more effective and more practical to think what can I do to protect institutions right now because

the other day trump leads as chump leaves office as a bitter president who undermine a bunch of institutions and change the presidency and much negative ways still terrible, and so I think and the other thing tat you mind, you know. You're Trump gives this this dangerous to Congress right in and, of course, a group of people that I've criticized lightly during this event, say: he became president is finally resident essential. Now, What does that mean? What that means is he walked. He gave the speech, he succeeded, he didn't roll down. He had the pomp and ceremony of being the present states gets those cultural institutions. He gets those norms, we have given them to him, so we have to protect the ones that aren't as well- right, the oversight and the rule of law, and I think that that has to be our focus worrying that he's gonna be on the court where he can be very, very destructive long before he's Putin. I would I do. A foreign policy should compensate

We can already hidden. All of our marks- and Oliver, like I was talking to gaining, might be followed with former EAST Bastard russian anathemas, someone question and people who are rush. Exports like Julie off use to pointing out somewhere things. There are parallels, and I think what the tale- the tape, ONS or Putin's rise is that people didn't fight hard enough early, bashfully Speck when it comes to defending the press, which is why they were pretty hard judges now that, apparently, the congressional Budget Office needs protection, industry well, I mean right every every non, partisan institution that he doesn't like he's savaging that I think it is important to fight these things early and like Ireland, that's a blessing in disguise, but a more aware and more awake population. That's prodigal!

next session to heal removes because a policy personality or putin- yes, yes, which were ass. Yet to pick one I don't know. If I can, I don't know policy should go there. I don't think there is a policy that I think look. The patenting is hard to it hard to tell what kind of effect that had its hard to measure it, but clearly, like the combination of Wiki weeks, I didn't call me probably had a bigger effect on the on the undecided quoters at the end that began as I do that again, but that said, I think that Hilary was in a position to have co me Tipp the race, because she probably was, I think, there's a can. It had been in what we do is of Washington right and that's not just stay specifically. Problem like I was on the carrier. Reason for that is my first race John Kerry had that same problem like people who have been in Washington,

very long? Time tend to be a little stiffer and a little more cautious when around in the campaign trail. It's not just specifically. Hilary Bernie was actually an exception. Burn he's been in Washington for our know. How long it exactly he didn't seem like he was long out. You know he's those sort of broke out of Missouri Luton, pressing ahead I would say you know, look on the policy front. I think one lesson I take away from from the election is there's a lot of like look at our main policy would have thickness. This policy proposal is in and you you the present a minimum wage archology took simple, elegance Bernie Sanders ideas in and it's not about left versus versus right, but just simple digestible ideas. That said like this is gonna help you it's simple it's for you and I think that there is a democratic apparatus that treated seriousness with how complicated was are. You can massage the tax credits, and I heard the deficit in a certain kind of way and I think that's the kind of thinking we to push aside because we're in the wilderness, where we're on opposition party, we just simple.

Here proposals. I think it is very frustrating fair proposal. Every type c mere proposal not about our applause line, is not very helpful. Tonia I feel buried. I go back for their friends who worked in the campaign because they sort of get called sore losers when they talk about the prudent but as like a guy's worked on a campaign com seem you can't underestimate, like the damage that did. The mood music of the election of every day, you're dealing with Putin or drop classes, emails or whatever the hell it is. You cannot get a message out, that's hard to get out anyway. So, like I don't discount that I think, will we screwed up and what I personally screwed up as a Democrat was clearly the rise of Bernie said we hate Washington, the rise of Trump said we hate washing

and we said here is a picture of Washington for thirty year, yet ripe and like remoter said: no, that's not what we want and I think that's personality under this policy, and I think it's prudent. I think it's a fundamental misery by Democrats of like what people want it in some of that was set before the election even began a few, even if you think you are the great campaign. You know the greatest satanic. Didn't you three million more votes. A hundred Let's go the other way running a very different policy up pointing out it's worth. Knowing you know when you re always pointed out that, then I don't always wondered how well I really do I forgot about learning. Is it doesn't matter? What does it matter does amount to think about the point it doesn't matter. We have to learn a lot like this. A lot like an Iphone to close this gap.

Why are you here actually almost became the almost warranted a nightmare? Go at night last question what's happening mergers and I ll ask that question, and then I want you each answer. This and then saying who, if you could pick almost any democratic anywhere in the world who intend to run in on twenty? Who would it be? It says Corey worker wasn't on your list. Promising dams. What's your thinking the last question so anyway, you could pick like who usually someone off the list. No, not at all. I forgot that I really like develop Patrick had I could see, develop coming out in category five I could all right of all Patrick that, but anyone think of someone completely out of you could just pull grab someone from anywhere business Hollywood. Anywhere living or dead yet living there. Brok, Obama. Now. You can't do it. I don't know provided they we're gonna pick. Somebody could be unhappy with the last question

Would you like the last question? No answer? My fucking question that this is a tough interview. It super hard for a lesbian debate. Again, guy are clearly yes, I did that a natural appear. He did the family. What we want from two different world where you can Mrs there's an email chain where care told love it, you didn't think use funny, so the result is a brighter. No, I thought he was passively funny that miss different right and you, which really that's my fair profile, close to home interrelate, I didn't bigger. I knew the adverb bother him so pick. One regarding our going and develop Patrick Rhetoric and one from his own Roy many thought, a devolved I now want to save all I like she was with warm run. You weren't, really Lizzie yeah yeah.

We weren't about Patrick those are my life cycle is with worn. Then I do at a regional level into let it rip and say what a regional who owe Oprah in doing I'm not into the secret thing. I'm sorry that was a dangerous nonsense. If you wish you can be a billion are like me: where are they wear opera millionaires. Are you not Oprah? Isn't one You can call somebody named. I do that that harm areas of options Mr Michel outbreak in our frightened I love out. Frankly, I have loved African forever, I'm gonna Jennifer Lawrence. Does everybody liked her goodbye an answer. Exactly is Kristen Stewart. They want it. You just

get her exact, just one or two hit us up anyway. Thank you, so much afraid and now they're represent wow wasn't their great. What a laptop incredible! We learn things. We came away differently, region embarrass ourselves too much. Please note that we sign labelling. Yeah me looking at wanting it doesn't come across in the audio, is how many people came up to us to say that they were friends. The part on my gun with you, who was good, it's great, whereas we had a good time anyway, because drive to POD save America,

France is inscribed, take their phone subscriber eyes or we need all of us remember as described right now to love it or leave it might show. John is gonna, be a gas on the first episode. That's enough reason subscriber there also subscribe to parts of the world. This great, clean, green, all interview everyone's talking about it and, of course, subscribed to Honorary Cox's podcast with friends like these thanks guys. Thank you.